asciilifeform: 1) paste into emacs 2) indent-region 3) profit!111!!!
asciilifeform: trinque: linux (at least a reasonably well-cultivated linux) is ispo facto 'fitter' on account of having the ability to build emacs sans dbus.
asciilifeform: because whatever prevents a sane emacs build, is likely to interfere with other work
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: understand, if i can't build and run emacs and its dependencies, the os is fit for 'bury in concrete' only - e.g., router
asciilifeform: which is about on par with emacs lisp in terms of 'it is FOREVER 1972 and not in any good sense'
asciilifeform: e.g., to walk the blockchain, verify a raid array 24/7 in a loop, handle six parallel compiles; store and play the correct bach fugue depending on what emacs modeline is set; etc.
asciilifeform: but afaik nobody uses it, most folks run emacs+slime even there.
asciilifeform: (emacs will tell me where a string occurs, sure, but this is pointedly NOT what i want)
asciilifeform: emacs in a recognizable form long pre-dated rms.
asciilifeform: rms, interestingly, did to emacs something much like esr tried to do to the things he sprayed his piss on
asciilifeform: i suspect that 99% of folks who think they 'hate lisp!111!!111' were created by the harmful delusion that any meaningful work can be done without emacs+slime or the exact equivalent
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i typically compose in emacs but do not use it as a 'client'
asciilifeform: now all of this probably plays into mircea_popescu's thesis, because it turns out that the main use of graphical bitmaps in a 'symbolics' box or in my emacs is to better shovel text around
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: no dice. spent as little time as did with box because a good chunk of it is replicated in my modern 'emacs' - with which i've made just about everything in my adult life
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: if you're unfamiliar with it - autolisp is a 1970s style lisp (complete with unsolved 'funarg problem' !) similar to emacs elisp
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: fortunately, should you wish to see emacs, there is no need to cross the equator and make your way through the jaguars to the ocelots
asciilifeform: emacs is unbeatable on account of the customizations - not only of appearance (i've a different highlighting mode for every type of animal, and most are not the stock included ones) but mechanics - how do folks get along on other editors without 'hungry arrow keys', for example ?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i enjoy colours, good fonts, etc. and so will not use emacs in a term if there's any choice about it
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i presume the second item on this list was a build of traditional emacs for apple ?
asciilifeform: mostly trad emacs but with gui hooks for the os
asciilifeform: iirc the canonical emacs on apple is 'aquamacs'
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: there's an emacs-23 port, iirc
asciilifeform: 'Other Emacs stakeholders responded with confusion how this could be "a systematic effort to attack GNU packages" and also raised points on how Emacs has support for Microsoft Windows and OS X but wouldn't consider a basic patch for enabling the LLDB debugger to be used. Stallman followed up to say, "These are not similar cases. Neither Windows nor MacOS was intended to push major GNU packages out of use. What I see here appea
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: everything off by default << not quite true. try building 'xorg' followed by 'emacs' and see end up with dbus, other horrors
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the cl rewrite of emacs, 'climacs', was almost usable
asciilifeform: most folks who lack the mental flexibility to relearn five or six key commands, would not benefit from emacs, and (if they are aware of its existence at all) - know it. and avoid.
asciilifeform: yes, it is possible to bolt them onto emacs. but few people do.
asciilifeform: emacs aficionados! turns out, openbsd has a separate 'emacs21' port, of that version, sans all of the retardation and shitgnomery
asciilifeform furious that the emacs in that box's ports tree cannot easily build without dbus
asciilifeform: generally i never notice anything about new emacs except that one or more of my many elisps pointlessly breaks
asciilifeform: i own computers that do not run emacs,slime,cl.
asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: i'm afraid not. you will have to investigate personally. i built my emacs some years ago, and thoroughly forgot.
asciilifeform: what do gentoo and emacs to do with it ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i have not actually pressed any F key in... uh. months ? << 'midnight commander' naturally. and i have f1-f12 mapped to useful things in 'emacs' as well. unlike (apparently) many emacs users, i don't treat my hands as an object of religious sacrifice.
asciilifeform: where'll i see motion blur, in 'emacs', lol
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: text editor experiment << when you build 'emacs', you can select 'use mmap for buffers' as a compile flag.☟︎
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aside from examples like 'emacs', most of what is actually useful in 'open source' was written in other times, other walls, pre-dating it
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes, mircea_popescu, others involved with deturdification - unless you prefer emacs for this, see tools like 'xxdiff' for illuminated patches.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: you're more than welcome to boot straight into emacs even now.
asciilifeform: as if emacs lisp had anything whatsoever to do with common lisp other than using s-expressios.
asciilifeform: all he had left was his embarrassing 'emacs lisp' erzats.
asciilifeform: switching caps lock and ctrl << 'Emacs actually comes with a builting Emacs Aptitude Test. Do you remap your keyboard or the Emacs keybindings before the chords and sequences it comes with by default have wreaked havoc with your hands? If you do not do anything to make Emacs more convenient for yourself, you may not have the prerequisite aptitude to use it productive.' (naggum, who else. http://www.xach.com/na☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: punkman: and i'm afraid that i cannot in good conscience recommend ide that isn't emacs. because only emacs runs 'SLIME.'
asciilifeform: (in approximately the same way emacs does)
asciilifeform: benkay: think emacs but for all x11 progs
asciilifeform: mike_c: lisp (of whatever variety) without emacs (or quite similar auto-indenting editor) is unthinkable.
asciilifeform: 'Emacs actually comes with a builting Emacs Aptitude Test. Do you remap your keyboard or the Emacs keybindings before the chords and sequences it comes with by default have wreaked havoc with your hands? If you do not do anything to make Emacs more convenient for yourself, you may not have the prerequisite aptitude to use it productive.'
asciilifeform: you can use 'vi' instead of 'emacs' if you were to buy a parenthesis-counting slavegurl ?
asciilifeform: this leaves... emacs+slime (and an obscure, experimental variant of 'vi')
asciilifeform: lisp, of whatever kind, without emacs, is quite like trying to do international business without knowing a word of english
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i use emacs and 'slime', personally. 'f1' key wired to 'eval sexpr in current cursor'
asciilifeform: used to just piss thing out into emacs orgmode but it helps when people harangue you to remember shit.
