trinque: asciilifeform: that was actually my reaction when learning of genera and other such systems
trinque: "holy shit, stallman was trying to cram a version of this environment into unix"
trinque: in my historical wanderings, I learned of zmacs
trinque: I guess there's a whole lineage of things which ended up being called emacs
trinque: asciilifeform: the thought actually was... "so emacs is a sort of masamune... lol!"
☟︎ trinque: well, there are plenty of wads o' elisp that try to do that very thing
trinque: not that I use any of them
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23700 @ 0.0005079 = 12.0372 BTC [+]
trinque: seems damned javascript-y, though I know it preceded that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61000 @ 0.00051884 = 31.6492 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 500 @ 0.0025 = 1.25 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50231 @ 0.00051398 = 25.8177 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27000 @ 0.00051347 = 13.8637 BTC [-]
shinohai: but your bitcoind shall decimate correct asciilifeform
shinohai: it must make XT a distant memory
shinohai: is there a node list i should consider?
shinohai: so -connect flag is sufficient?
shinohai: Such rich and mysterious history
assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 02:59:50; mircea_popescu: i dun think i ever said anything about that.
assbot: Logged on 23-10-2014 05:07:32; mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> connected with serial cable << this from reading up on old mpex material ?
decimation: asciilifeform: what is electrum other than 'wallet split from node'?
shinohai: mircea_popescu has already provided an ample amount of reading between logs and trilema xD
decimation: it uses a tcp connection with a special block server I think
decimation: what would an 'electrum replacement' need?
decimation: okay, you have serial line connected to bitcoind
decimation: how do I find txns for accounting in my wallet
decimation: essentially, querying the blockchain for my txns
shinohai: I can't get electrum right for shit. I did a test tx using pywallet to import a privkey
decimation: this goes to the ancient thread about what bitcoind should do
decimation: okay, well that's essentially what electrum server does I guess
decimation: except this feature could be integrated into bitcoind
decimation:
http://www.bbc.com/news/health-33362472 < "She told the BBC that "Children with autism didn't show this modulation at all - they took the same sniff for the smell of shampoo as they did for rotten fish." "They also showed that the more severe the symptoms of autism the longer the children inhaled the unpleasant smells. "
decimation: why not build physical source of entropy
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20350 @ 0.00052155 = 10.6135 BTC [+]
decimation: if house always wins, people will realized and move on
☟︎ decimation: yeah, me neither, but sending the server seed seems like you are putting your balls on the chopping block
decimation: I would think it would require examining the outcome of every player's bet
decimation: asciilifeform: did you see the cache telegraphy escape?
trinque: decimation: docker's a piece of shit for its own reasons
trinque: yet another "lets try to layer tape upon the turd and hope that solves the underlying derp of the system"
trinque: whereas xen is a hypervisor, docker uses the linux containers thing, which effectively gives you multiple userspaces
trinque: the docker daemon itself is this vast wad o' golang that runs as root
☟︎ decimation: people have emphasized docker's security benefits
trinque: assuming the hardware, kernel, distro, docker, distro, and your proggy are perfect, sure!
decimation: asciilifeform: maybe you can use systemd to boot it
trinque: I would expect (as admittedly a casual in the kernel space) to find the same kinds of break-out flaws in docker and linux containers as are found all the time in xen
trinque: and also, docker sets up and manages its own fancy virtual network between your containers
trinque: so probably loads to be done to that thing too
shinohai: i use docker on hashbang, but it is like a Rube Goldberg cartoon
trinque: shinohai: yeah I used it on deedbot to make a final judgment
decimation: does docker actually emulate a hardware nic like qemu
trinque: decimation: I believe so; inside your container you have your own network device
trinque: shinohai: not byzantine enough
mats: no, it doesn't do device emulation
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14032 @ 0.00052155 = 7.3184 BTC [+]
mats: slide 7 reads neither HVM nor PV
decimation: asciilifeform: how are they gonna get an injunction against bookfi?
decimation: what about the days when su judge would consult telephone to moscow before ruling
decimation: mats: it seems to be chroot with some device/pid/ipc space sharing
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29150 @ 0.00052155 = 15.2032 BTC [+]
decimation: apparently if you commit a felony involving violence, the police can summarily execute you if the 'feel you pose a threat'
decimation: asciilifeform: this is terrible news, now all learning algorithms are going to need 'political filters'
decimation: like a party political officer in every server
decimation: maybe if we end up in the same sharishka we can work on identifying the voice of traitors together
decimation: note that scamarkets were generally the only market for most of history
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42700 @ 0.00051347 = 21.9252 BTC [-]
mod6: how long have you been sync'ing for now? 2 days?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16849 @ 0.00051347 = 8.6515 BTC [-]
mod6: typical sync via irc seeding took me ~6 days
mod6: seems like this is going faster, but we'll see how long it takes to go from 300k-350k
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2115 @ 0.00051347 = 1.086 BTC [-]
trinque: Since Facebook's 2012 IPO, it has needed a compelling "story" to tell corporate investors, says IBRS analyst Guy Cranswick. << btw the new meaning of the quotation mark in english is herein lie lies
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4175 @ 0.00052027 = 2.1721 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43050 @ 0.00052161 = 22.4553 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 101950 @ 0.00052295 = 53.3148 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: something suitable for the human-like creatures eating food-like matter on a couch-like object in a home-like hovel they quasi-own
assbot: Logged on 30-06-2015 04:33:53; asciilifeform:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-06-2015#1181553 << yes, there will be plenty of 'work' to be had there, re-converting the island back into a u.s. bordello as it was in batista's time; 'privatizing' and demolishing the spiffiest pharama plants in the western hemisphere; shipping the best doctors to drive cabs in nyc; etc
trinque: in that case I'd like to claim my family's pre-mussolini wealth from italy
trinque: adjusted for inflation, please.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54550 @ 0.00052718 = 28.7577 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22600 @ 0.00052728 = 11.9165 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53699 @ 0.00051251 = 27.5213 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61800 @ 0.00052728 = 32.5859 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24527 @ 0.00052728 = 12.9326 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 80800 @ 0.00052893 = 42.7375 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19056 @ 0.00052919 = 10.0842 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32253 @ 0.00051169 = 16.5035 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 248 @ 0.00429723 = 1.0657 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35248 @ 0.00051161 = 18.0332 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54000 @ 0.00051147 = 27.6194 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 65650 @ 0.00051469 = 33.7894 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28445 @ 0.00052969 = 15.067 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10150 @ 0.00053093 = 5.3889 BTC [+]
davout: jurov: if you want a couple pogos i can send them to you
jurov: davout yes, 2 pcs?
davout: pm me a postal address and i'll send them
jurov: <Vexual> how come u get free shit?
jurov: whaddaya know, maybe davout owes me some ...er... favors?
jurov: Vexual btw, if you have played eulora, you could have 1337 satoshi per day... for free
jurov: plus some utterly vexing and hapless dreams gratis
☟︎ Vexual: you're dreaming eulora?
Vexual: that usually means its good
Vexual: i must say im more than a little intigued, even discounting the favours you mentioned
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34250 @ 0.00053093 = 18.1844 BTC [+]
Vexual: is it as you nod off, or during rem?
jurov: i only remember morning dreams, so rem perhaps
HeySteve: only other game I can remember dreaming about is original Doom
HeySteve: probably does mean it's good or compelling in some way
HeySteve: once I'm done with Witcher 3, I want to see if I can make some progress in figuring it out
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16450 @ 0.00053093 = 8.7338 BTC [+]
jurov: HeySteve: there's mining delay in eulora now, so you can multitask :D
HeySteve: the thing about Witcher 3 is you can amass a huge inventory of weird parts, like monster tongues and bits of string
HeySteve: but there's no experimenting in what you can make from them
Vexual: is it multiplayer witcher?
Vexual: "whats it all about?" "just try it" <when did games become like lsd?
Vexual: yeah i googled it, i felt a bit silly typing "is witcher multiplayer"
Vexual: i spilled some doritos for effect
Vexual: oooh, screenshots, thanks
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64200 @ 0.00052465 = 33.6825 BTC [-]
Vexual discovers Foxy's Useful Items shop
Vexual: chairs for the head is a pillow?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16100 @ 0.00052568 = 8.4634 BTC [+]
Vexual: ok i read backwards, but i wont read day 1
Vexual: faark theres a cookbook (tm)
Vexual: i'll take two cruddy hos and a clump of fat slag please
jurov: we have only ordinary slags
Vexual: its an actual head chair
Vexual: oh flat, sorry, i misread
jurov: yes. you must take a photo with a chair on the head to receive it ingame
jurov: and don't ask me about demeaning urabihs harness
jurov: very advanced stuff
jurov: as diana_coman can testify
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32271 @ 0.00052558 = 16.961 BTC [-] {2}
Vexual: thanks for the insight conman
jurov got pms both from vexual and diana :DDD
jurov: not gonna answer them, come out there
jurov: diana_coman: do you still have the harness pic somewhere?
diana_coman: and lol, I actually did not manage to wear out even one of those
diana_coman: but Vexual, why not just come in game and have a look?
jurov: !gettrust assbot muxne
assbot: muxne is not registered in WoT.
jurov: !gettrust assbot Vexual
assbot: Vexual is not registered in WoT.
Vexual: what kinda machine is reqd?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35600 @ 0.00053093 = 18.9011 BTC [+]
diana_coman: uhm, nothing special real, just a decent (not even very new or anything video card
diana_coman: there was some concrete info on this in the last post on trilema I think
diana_coman: btw Vexual, once you get it, you might want to come by to me as I can give you some stuff to get started
Vexual: yeah, i might need to find some flotsam before i find some flotsam
Vexual: is it bandwidth heavy?
diana_coman: I did not really check it, but if it works even in this neck of the woods, it can't really be
Vexual: lol, u run on tin cans too?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6836 @ 0.00052465 = 3.5865 BTC [-]
jurov: "Survey says: 35 percent of Americans would expatriate"
Vexual: yeah they wash up here like flotsam
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24273 @ 0.00052136 = 12.655 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3774 @ 0.00051917 = 1.9593 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 90392 @ 0.00050635 = 45.77 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 101008 @ 0.00049542 = 50.0414 BTC [-] {4}
decimation: lul "As much as Victoria is loved, this reaction is not all a result of her departure: there is a feeling among many of the moderators of reddit that the admins do not respect the work that is put in by the thousands of unpaid volunteers who maintain the communities of the 9,656 active subreddits, which they feel is expressed by, among other things, the lack of communication between them and the admins, and their disregard of the thou
decimation: oh no the reddit owners treat the tens of thousands of people that work for them for free as slaves!
☟︎ assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 20:44:30; ascii_field: 'getdata is used in response to inv... ...t can be used to retrieve transactions, but only if they are in the memory pool or relay set - arbitrary access to transactions in the chain is not allowed to avoid having clients start to depend on nodes having full transaction indexes (which modern nodes do not).'
decimation: wait why don't they have the transactions?
decimation: or is it just saying that they aren't databased efficiently?
decimation: such a thing would be needed for the 'private wallet query service' that ascii and I discussed last night
ben_vulpes: decimation: now is when i confess to a quarter-implemented blockchain->relational db importer
☟︎ ben_vulpes: if you had the whole blockchain querieable in postgres, you could infer account balances in the usual fashion and sell reads over a pg connection
ben_vulpes: has anyone verified the full chain as puked out from asciilifeform's `shitblock`?
shinohai: I just now got connected to mp's node so i guess i got to start over
ben_vulpes: i was under the impression that it was either not relational or was only being used in bitcoind as a kv store
ben_vulpes: p. sure the transaction indices were tossed for space saving reasons aka shitgnomery
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37900 @ 0.00050923 = 19.2998 BTC [+]
decimation: ah you are right, it isn't relational, it's just a key value hash
decimation: I can see 'saving space' for the transactional table, but why also keep the blockchain in binary form?
ben_vulpes: i've lost weeks, months of my life to the unqueriability of mongo and phriendz
decimation: I suspect satoshi intended on making a transactional database using the block .dat files at a later date
ben_vulpes: the whole thing should be in sqlite at the very least
decimation: shitgnome bitcoin devs never bothered apparently
ben_vulpes: but perhaps there's a good reason for writing the blocks directly to disk that i'm not grasping
ben_vulpes does not see the problem with hashing values queried directly out of the db
decimation: or using it to feed another tool, like has been accomplished
ben_vulpes: if you're storing as the appropriate ints, floats, doubles, strings etc
ben_vulpes: you can even derp the raw binary into pg if you're so inclined
ben_vulpes: decimation: i'm finally seeing the tide receed from mongo's highwater
decimation: yeah, there are situations where 'nosql' is appropriate, but plenty of situations where you want structured queries too
ben_vulpes: i've yet to see the real world problem that a nosql db was actually the right solution to that wasn't actually a cacheing/cdn problem
ben_vulpes: (and even that can be handled by mother postgres at rather high efficiencies these days)
decimation: the only situation I can imagine is if you have a gigantic pile of disorganized data, that probably has a structure
decimation: nosql can be used to sort through your shit into a proper db
ben_vulpes: dude if it has a hint of structure it belongs in a relational db
ben_vulpes: otherwise you're going to start running the kind of braindamaged queries your 'nosql' layer support and then glomming it all together into something representing a query in application code
decimation: well, yeah that's the real-world situation.
ben_vulpes: much like any c project eventually grows a miserable half-assed implementation of an eighth of common lisp any nosql project eventually tries to implement relational alggebra
decimation: I'm suggesting an intermediate step where you query your nosql db properly and place the results into a structured relational db
decimation: but yeah I bet most people using 'nosql' just want caches
ben_vulpes: and because none of them were designed for that in the first place because a) it's hard and b) fucking retards write nosql stores for hackernooz points the algebraic layer turns out to never actually work. or it locks everything up while running queries that a real db would plan handle like a boss
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 21:36:09; phf: maze of twisty little passages, all alike
decimation: ^ also note most people are unwilling to pay for something who knows how to db
ben_vulpes: man you can get a sql user (not an expert, mind you, but someone who understands it has used it and can avoid common retardations) at half time for approximately half the cost of some hotshit "full stack developer" who thinks mongo's a good idea
ben_vulpes: you'll spend less, they'll work less, and your systems will be vastly better for not having mongo in them
decimation: I would pay more for someone who didn't know how to program 'front-end'
ben_vulpes: more later, i have 2 hours of ferry ride coming up
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44050 @ 0.00051648 = 22.7509 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28150 @ 0.00052134 = 14.6757 BTC [+]
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 22:19:21; ascii_field: it was screamingly stupid from day 1.
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 22:27:27; mircea_popescu:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=02-07-2015#1184001 << well, look it up. there's a present risk of suffocation, and most sudden infant death correlates with shared sleeping arrangements. baby should have a cot, something. even if it's just a sling hanging off a hook by side of your bed.
shinohai: LTC:USD sell = 4.08, buy = 4.11, last = 4.08; high = 4.13, low = 4.00, avg = 4.07 || via BTC-e on 2015-Jul-03 15:06:03 Z
kakobrekla:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33378778 << The Catholic Church wrote in comments submitted after the bill was proposed: "Should freedom of expression go so far as to mean that the identity of a person of faith can be freely insulted, then personal freedom - as individuals or groups - is undermined."
shinohai: resyncing to the mp node only, I am impressed with the speed at which I am syncing.
mats: thesis: maybe porn should be regulated so 18 year old girls can't do torture porn because maybe they're being exploited
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14500 @ 0.00051648 = 7.489 BTC [-]
shinohai: I also like that it doesn't use up a fuckton of memory and bandwidth during sync xD
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34400 @ 0.00051671 = 17.7748 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52754 @ 0.0005188 = 27.3688 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Logged on 03-07-2015 13:47:19; ben_vulpes: decimation: now is when i confess to a quarter-implemented blockchain->relational db importer
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51346 @ 0.00050632 = 25.9975 BTC [-] {2}
ascii_field: ;;later tell ben_vulpes have you considered a blockchain to... s-expression ! tool
ascii_field: (persist to disk with something like 'elephant')
funkenstein_: eric michael johnson is good blogger, thanks for link :)
BingoBoingo: <mats> thesis: maybe porn should be regulated so 18 year old girls can't do torture porn because maybe they're being exploited << Honestly the documentary's content doesn't seem to support that point even though it advocates that point.
BingoBoingo: mats: The actual evidence filmed supports the thesis that given the opportunity no one wants to work in fast food.
pete_dushenski: "As there seems to be a political consensus in the U.S. around raising minimum wage to $12-15/hour, if we assume that Americans as a whole will respond to economic incentives in the same way as those who live in Puerto Rico, presumably the 50 states in 10 years will look like Puerto Rico today"
pete_dushenski: ^greenspun rehashing the 'usa becomes africa just like it always wanted' thing from the logs
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37000 @ 0.0005095 = 18.8515 BTC [+]
pete_dushenski: "We have 50 million people getting food stamps. What if, for at least one meal per day, those 50 million people were invited to come to a social meal? The same deal with SSDI. We could offer enhanced SSDI benefits for those who move to an “SSDI party village” where at least half of the neighbors are also on SSDI."
ascii_field: 'What if, for at least one meal per day, those 50 million people were invited to come to a social meal?' << kolhoz !!
pete_dushenski: this 'ssdi party village' sounds like a soviet full moon party
ascii_field: 'straight dole' only works if coolies are breaking their backs somewhere
pete_dushenski: which, i suppose, only works when those bezzlars are being traded to back breaking labour across the pond somewheres
assbot: Apple Working on new Apple Pay Wallet service for Person-to-Person Financial Transactions - Patently Apple ... (
http://bit.ly/1Iz7DoE )
pete_dushenski: ^usg tries to make p2p bitcoin transactions only legal using x in y place
pete_dushenski: not gonna fly, obviously, but hey, rat always tries to swim before sinking
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: written from jail. mega-recommended
pete_dushenski: i knew of his two auto-biographies from his youth and early middle age
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3200 @ 0.00051722 = 1.6551 BTC [+]
pete_dushenski: ascii_field: will add to roster of your mega-recommendations
pete_dushenski: other b-a books include mp-advised 'secret life of dali'
ascii_field: i dare say mr k's thing is a bit more... current
ascii_field: in the sense of applicability to pete_dushenski's favourite subjects
pete_dushenski: then a huntin' i shall go, a huntin' i shall go, hi ho the marry-o, a huntin' i shall go.
ascii_field: now, plenty of folks predicted 'computer tyranny' - e.g, weizenbaum (of 'eliza' !) in his '70s 'computer power and human reason' - but,
ascii_field: afaik nobody predicted that ~dysfunctional~ computing would be the mechanism
pete_dushenski: well, 'dysfuntional' is a matter of perspective, isn't it
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: in the sense of 'sorry, wasn't us, it was this bug'
pete_dushenski: computers aren't rakes nor tractors, but they're fantastic noise machines.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 78900 @ 0.00051722 = 40.8087 BTC [+]
ascii_field: in other nyooz, apparently 'reddit' has imploded and replaced with a very similar service, 'voat.co'
assbot: Logged on 22-06-2015 13:43:47; punkman: "Poole said that one neighbor using self-driving technology downloaded a software update that disabled his tractor for a week in the middle of planting season this spring. If a system is working, farmers will often hold off on updates rather than risk complications"
BingoBoingo: ascii_field: It's a workalike. Apparently had a few previous names it burned through before they decided to just wait for reddit to kill itself.
pete_dushenski: punkman: ah yes, how farmers don't own the tools of their trade. sad story, that.
☟︎ ascii_field: can't wait for the first famine directly traceable to winblowz
decimation: yeah, I was talking with a farmer once, apparently john deere etc are investing heavily in fully autonomous tractors
decimation: because 1/1000 is too many working on the farms
decimation: maybe in the future all farms will be owned by ADM, dept of usg agriculture
decimation: actually I would pay good money for a robot that could wonder through a yard and pull weeds
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38200 @ 0.00051016 = 19.4881 BTC [-] {2}
decimation: why doesn't vice/roshida jones cover actual abridgement of freedom of expression
decimation: like, why can't I communicate the blockchain to anyone I wish, in any way I wish
phf: i was exploring block storage format, so i wrote some lisp code to read blocks out of .dat in sequence or directly from dumpblock'ed file
http://paste.lisp.org/+38JG. i'm not sure where i'm going with it, so i'm leaving it here for interested parties.
☟︎☟︎ pete_dushenski: decimation: well, it's a robot, not that bright y'know
decimation: it would be neat if bitcoind could generate the same kinds of stats as blockchain.info
ascii_field: punkman: is there one that isn't in a shitlang ?
punkman: ascii_field, probably a few of those
pete_dushenski: decimation: besides, not like usafricanz are expensive labour. at least not within a decade
shinohai: someone should write that in perl
decimation: pete_dushenski: the problem is that usg bids up the price of otherwise servant labor
decimation: usg wisely punishes you for working and rewards you for not
pete_dushenski: decimation: ascii_field until people will take 'room and board' as compensation
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: not sure this will show any symptoms of happening any time prior to the die-off
decimation: why would they when they can make $30-60k for being 'poor'
ascii_field: anyway, 99+% of usa ALREADY works for room & board !
decimation: well, I was thinking of when all value passes through the bitcoin hole
decimation: ascii they give a little walking-around money too
ascii_field: in that case, even in auschwitz folks didn't work for 'only room and board'
ascii_field: (at one point, a variant of paper reichsmark, but at all times - smokes)
ascii_field: (access to 'posh' jobs, fewer beatings, etc)
pete_dushenski: still covered under 'room & board' and still circumvents minimum wage fucktardery as presented
pete_dushenski: so yes, auschwitzians lived under room & board arrangement, and no, you do not, ascii_field
trinque: pete_dushenski: I had this notion regarding the bums all over portland, that someone should take them to nearby farms for day labor in exchange for meals, showers, and somewhere to be warehoused at night.
☟︎ trinque: it'd be a vast improvement for their lives
ascii_field: if i'm not paid enough to 'reallocate capital' - to borrow mircea's terminology - than i am in same category as the 'room & board' folks
pete_dushenski: trinque: most certainly. sounds like a swell idea to me.
funkenstein_: Room and board are limited resources. Dorrars, not so much. Countereiters don't control food and bedding.
pete_dushenski: ascii_field: you buying a case of z80s or pogos is reallocating capital
☟︎ ascii_field: pete_dushenski: capital in the sense of machine-that-lets-you-eat-without-working
pete_dushenski: ascii_field: this comes back again to the amount of $$$ you imagine is needed to 'eat like king'
pete_dushenski: funkenstein_: to the extent that the federal reserve is a counterfeiter, they most certainly control food (monsanto) and bedding (housing bubble)
funkenstein_: only in so much as farmers and homeowners accept their counterfeits
☟︎ ascii_field: pete_dushenski: if you believe that i'm overpaying for something, i'd like to hear - for what
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: and where ~you~ buy it, that wouldn't cost me the price of a fleet of 'boeings' to get to...
mats: BingoBoingo: 'There's no regulation', '... and it's really difficult to believe that the girls who were crying when they're being "raped" are always acting and performing'
☟︎ pete_dushenski: ascii_field: i guess i'll wait until i see a monthly budget breakdown on loper-os.com before i submit my analysis :)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52150 @ 0.00051722 = 26.973 BTC [+]
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: i'll give you something to chew on. for instance: i pay ~700+ usd / mo just to have the possibility of accessing basic medical care if i need it
mats: clever manipulation, this. imply women are being preyed on, that they haven't any agency, and that teens should be protected from themselves because she had no idea she was doing torture porn until she got to the set, and didn't resist at the critical moment
funkenstein_: even assuming retarded farmers and homeowners accepting fiat, this is still not "control" in the sense of being able to issues a billion tons of rice. The stuff still has to exist and is limited.
ascii_field: ~2k usd to have reasonably spacious dwelling (90 sq m.)
pete_dushenski: ascii_field: with health and living costs like that, how can you claim you're not overpaying for -anything- ??
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 105609 @ 0.0005028 = 53.1002 BTC [-] {3}
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: because i'm not in a market.
mats: rashida jones knows exactly what she's doing, and she believes she's manipulating folks into doing the right thing by preying on the viewer's instinct to protect women and children
ascii_field would like to the eleven or so threads where he described this, but won't bother, probably everyone reading this recalls
mats: goering would be proud.
pete_dushenski: just the way the cookie crumbles for some (includes physical and mental outcomes)
funkenstein_: ascii_field, have you considered that anything costing 700 USD per month is far more likely to be a detriment to health than a basic medical care?
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: as a pathological example: just about anybody's living costs could be lowered by moving to africa, but for some reason very few takers
mats: oops, yes, goebbels
pete_dushenski: ascii_field: u.s. is a big place. not all are so afflicted.
ascii_field: funkenstein_: i pay the 700 in order ~not to wake up with a bill for 500,000~
ascii_field: (can still wake up with a bill for 10,000!)
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: for me, usa is this roughly 200 km. sq. spot where i can get to my meatwot
pete_dushenski: ascii_field: well did you ever think that if maybe you weren't so darned talented, you'd have more options ?
ascii_field: a corpse, buried at sea, has the most options:
ascii_field: (though ashes-scattered-in-orbit, from what i hear, is even better)
mats: on yesterday's subject of poker: the concept of revealing 'hole cards' as transparency to enable auditing and prevent cheating seems to keep coming up in my discussions about WoT poker with online poker players
mats: is there some way of computing some function of the cards that reveals certain properties of the aggregate of the table without revealing people's particular cards
mats: homomorphic properties of some crypto-system perhaps
mats: oh, doh, this was mentioned
mod6: well! crusing right along.
mod6: oh wow, your nearly there. great!
mod6: might be just over 48hrs or something for direct sync
ascii_field: incidentally, anybody ever try parallelizing sigchecking ?
mats: got a link/name to paillier paper(s)?
mod6: <+ascii_field> incidentally, anybody ever try parallelizing sigchecking ? << this would be interesting to try & do some perf testing with.
trinque: pete_dushenski | ascii_field: well did you ever think that if maybe you weren't so darned talented, you'd have more options ? << if you want to make money in the US economy, don't swim against the bezzle
trinque: trying to do something requiring talent? that's swimming against the bezzle!
pete_dushenski: i know, i used to work for the largest employer in the province, 5th largest in country
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: well-paid ~per minute of actual work~ ?
ascii_field: because 'mortally dull' sounds like they actually made you work
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70551 @ 0.00049859 = 35.176 BTC [-] {3}
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: might not be making myself clear here. you ~sat in chair~ for x hours, or ~worked~
pete_dushenski: when i sat in chair, about 7-10 hrs per week, i worked
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21150 @ 0.00049171 = 10.3997 BTC [-] {2}
ascii_field: pete_dushenski: what was your profession in those days ?
ascii_field: so got to see the secret rat-sized cockroaches in restaurants, etc ?
ascii_field wonders now if pete_dushenski is physically able to eat in a restaurant now
pete_dushenski: even the lowest of the low restaurants here, outside chinatown at least, are quite good
pete_dushenski: 'always room for improvement' was what keeps inspectors busy
pete_dushenski: while in food program, i only ever issued one executive officer's order on the spot
pete_dushenski: fines in alberta can be upwards of $100k for continual violations, plus court costs
pete_dushenski: public health act in alberta has paramouncy over everything except human rights act.
mats: thanks, ascii_field
gribble: dignork was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 9 weeks, 3 days, 1 hour, 16 minutes, and 45 seconds ago: <dignork> mircea_popescu: you wouldn't believe amount of horribly broken code which blows up in ipv6 environment, anything from integer overflows,crashes,malfunctions to firewalls leaving your machine exposed
assbot: Logged on 20-02-2015 14:56:37; dignork: mircea_popescu: I can't currently handle it myself, but I can bring a friend and we'll split the work, would you be interested to cooperate?
mats: oh, probably better to just ping mp about it.
shinohai: ;;later tell mod6 tried the new patches, failed utterly xD
dignork: mats: it's still in dev, but yeah
dignork: not solid, but beta in 2 weeks or so
dignork: ascii_field: it's less cooler than i wished :) For example there is an interesting problem with blind shuffling.
dignork: but no such things in my project :)
ascii_field: well i haven't 'eatblock'ified anything past 217335 yet
mircea_popescu: anyway i'll feel a lot better about this world and my life once this has been actually reviewed by third parties. ie , you.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: at present, i doubt that we'll turn up any oddities in the blocks per se
ascii_field: what i did learn is that mapBlockIndex grows linearly (300 bt) for every block ever seen.
ascii_field: that that in order to change this, it'd have to live on disk
mod6: shinohai: ok let's work through it
mats: dignork: i'm looking forward to a test drive
shinohai: @ mod6 I think I should start with a bare build. the other one is fine, son't want to touch it xD
mircea_popescu: ascii_field in practice this may not be a problem. the gavincoin insanities aside, growing by 300 bytes every ten minutes may well be sustainable indefinitely into the future.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: i suspek computing is moving towards joint ram/disk anyway.
mod6: yeah, that's what i was saying before: leave your v0.5.3.1-RELEASE as-is. Then setup a new environment to give the "stator" build a try -- is pre-patched, so should be able to compile and run, or if your slightly more daring, just run the included pre-compiled (by alf) binary (ensure to check sigs first!)
shinohai: kk but the whole reason I want to do this is so I can try the new patches by ascii_field, the blockdump
mod6: sure, ok. so what we'll need to do (and even I haven't tried patching those in myself yet) is to extract the stator, then apply the patches.
mats: that'll be interesting when the dichotomy vanishes. linux has been adding support for persistent memory afaik
mats: 'pramfs' looked furthest along when i last checked
☟︎ mod6: lemme give it a shot on my end first, see what happens so I can give you valid help
mod6: just a minute here.
mats: nothing merged so far though
trinque: jurov: could the btc-dev mailing list send mail via tls? requiring that on my mailserver's end has drastically cut down on spam, but I think that's causing me to miss mailing list messages
trinque: it it's too much trouble, don't worry about it
trinque: for some odd reason spam botnets don't seem to bother at all with tls being required
trinque: I went from 100s of spamz a day to 0 with this one weird trick.
punkman: mod6, let me know if you want me to rebase/resubmit cpuminer-snip or guicruft-snip before the next release
☟︎ shinohai: There should be a super-secret #b-a mining pool.
trinque: shinohai: isn't the idea that you want your pool as big as possible?
trinque: (not that I don't like secret clubs)
shinohai: stratum mining proxy already forked to accept larger blocksize :/
trinque: meh, dunno why any miner would want that
mod6: one of the things that pains me with the SHA1s re-written into the filenames, is if you pull these files with curl, you have to rename them to their original names before you can verify the signatures.
mod6: punkman: ok. i thought we had decided to leave the miner in there for now. but yeah, thanks I'll let ya know.
mod6: we've got quite a lot to do before we're there anyway.
trinque: is this stator archive meant to be untarred overtop 0.5.3-RELEASE ?
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86283 @ 0.00049137 = 42.3969 BTC [-] {3}
mats: BingoBoingo: this must be a hoax
punkman: because they fired some chick
punkman: no, reddit fired a chick, moderators closed down subreddits in protest
mircea_popescu: goies nicely with the discussion of that time when they fucked up deleting a qntra article iirc.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Reddit death already had a big one. This one's getting a quick note
phf: mod6: it would be nice to have an mbox or maildir tgz for the mailing list with all the attachments still included. took me couple of hours to reconstruct and verify patch list, while could've been done in matter of minutes with procmail and mimetools
trinque: phf: you could crawl that patches page maybe
trinque: I didn't know the patches page existed til today
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13883 @ 0.00048994 = 6.8018 BTC [-]
phf: trinque: tbh i thought it was broken, since it's missing chicken, gui, etc. only once i went through the exercise of making my own did i realize that those are not part of mailing list history
mod6: So a bunch have patches have been submitted in the last month. A read through each of the emails is kindof required at this point because they all have specific instructions and dependantcies.
mod6: I will work on a patch list and maybe a script later this month. It is a bit hard to follow.
☟︎ mod6: I'll work on something for that within the next week probably.
BingoBoingo: On that note, I'll brb in a few units of time.
mod6: phf: anyway, what exactly is it that you're trying to achieve?
shinohai: The same thing we do every night, Pinky. Try and take over the world!
mod6: ex: are you trying to patch v0.5.3 to get to v0.5.3.1? (You can just download the release tarball). Are you trying to patch v0.5.3.1-RELEASE with alf's patches? (must read emails to figure out the deps, OR you can just build the stator which includes all of alf's patches with exception of dumpblock & eatblock), those must be patched post extraction of the stator tarball -- of which im actually testing now.
trinque puts the laptop in the freezer while it builds boost
mod6: which, btw, they hvae patched in just fine... building the whole thing now.
mod6: (with openssl/bdb/boost)
mod6: I'm creating a log of this, and will post for everyone to look at once complete.
mod6: heh, this boost compile is taking a while, because i'm also syncing at the same time haha
shinohai: Then when I get this new build up, I can sync up to the correct nodes, and .torrent dat chain.
phf: mod6: i don't necessarily have problems, i have a bitcoind with all the patches up to eatblock (haven't looked at stator yet, but then i'm building with enemy tools). the way i assembled patches is by reading through web archive and saving/verifying each patch as i saw it
mod6: can you point me to the web-archive you're using? just curious.
phf: the process was needlessly complicated since my mail client lets me do a bunch of those steps (patching, gpg verifying, etc) with a single key, so if i had an mbox, i could just import it, and then use a more familiar interface
mod6: ahh. im not sure i remember mbox. and yeah, the whole thing is a bit... unwieldly
mod6: so wait, you're just going through each email and pulling out patches? or are you on that part of jurov's website with the signed patches?
phf: mod6: no no each email. i thought that was the whole point of ascii's approach, i.e. linux kernel style "read email, think, apply the patch"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6600 @ 0.00048928 = 3.2292 BTC [-] {2}
mod6: <+phf> the process was needlessly complicated since my mail client lets me do a bunch of those steps (patching, gpg verifying, etc) with a single key, so if i had an mbox, i could just import it, and then use a more familiar interface << so, what I've done in the past was; create a perl script that pulls down and verifies all the patches and applies them to a common baseline.
mod6: plus, create a How-To guide. Both of which need updating for the flurry of recent patches that have been submitted. Just haven't had a chance yet.
mod6: <+phf> mod6: no no each email. i thought that was the whole point of ascii's approach, i.e. linux kernel style "read email, think, apply the patch" << im not sure what their process is.
funkenstein_: "southern pride" spamming qntra in an effort to discredit the site methinks
☟︎ phf: mod6: well, lets say you have something like mutt open with the current email. it's pretty easy to write a script that takes current email and feeds it to an external script, that splits out patch, verifies it with the provided sig, and then applies it to the codebase (or pushes it into some queue of patches as a case may be). i.e. you read the email, push "p" to do everything for you, and then move on to the next email
☟︎ mod6: are you asking me to write an email client script?
mod6: basically, instead of me making a whole bunch of different one-off scripts for peoples seperate clients and whatever stack they've got, I just create one script that will patch in & verify all the scripts at once. usually after I've tried and tested them all myself, peronsally.
mod6: But I've only started scratching the surface with alf's latest, so this hasn't been done yet. All of these are still in my "Highly Experemental" category. AKA: use at your own risk.
mod6: But as I get through more of these and test more of these, I'll put something together to make this process easier.
shinohai: mod6: if you want another auto.sh, I'll try and help you when I understand this new build xD
☟︎☟︎ mod6: phf: there are specific reasons why the attachments are split into separate files.
assbot: Logged on 03-07-2015 18:49:20; mircea_popescu: ascii_field in practice this may not be a problem. the gavincoin insanities aside, growing by 300 bytes every ten minutes may well be sustainable indefinitely into the future.
ascii_field: and because infinitely growing data structures is what gods made disk for
phf: mod6: sorry, i wasn't really prepared to explain what i mean, i thought you would just grok the request as an obvious one. we probably just have very different workflows
☟︎ ascii_field: ('disk' in the broad sense of relatively slow, inexpensive place to park bits)
mod6: phf: yeah, im not sure what you're asking for
mod6: jurov: can you parse this and understand what he's talking about?? ^^^
assbot: Logged on 03-07-2015 18:52:21; mats: 'pramfs' looked furthest along when i last checked
mod6: [jurov run's the mailman stuff, so he'd be probably more apt to grok whatever your asking for ]
trinque: what are you guys building stator on?
assbot: Logged on 03-07-2015 18:54:52; punkman: mod6, let me know if you want me to rebase/resubmit cpuminer-snip or guicruft-snip before the next release
ascii_field: ~reference client~ MUST have some example of working miner.
ascii_field: put it this way, if tomorrow you are shipped to alpha centauri with just the reference client, you must be able to set up bitcoin there.
jurov: um...er... if you want whole emails..then just receive them?
jurov: i don't understand, either
shinohai: ikr, I get it all in the mailing list, no confusion there.
assbot: Logged on 03-07-2015 19:44:53; phf: mod6: well, lets say you have something like mutt open with the current email. it's pretty easy to write a script that takes current email and feeds it to an external script, that splits out patch, verifies it with the provided sig, and then applies it to the codebase (or pushes it into some queue of patches as a case may be). i.e. you read the email, push "p" to do everything for you, and then move on to the n
trinque: could refine that to "and then presents me a buffer of the diff"
☟︎ trinque: which you can apply or not
ascii_field: the point, which i've been trying and apparently failing to make for ages, is that if you are thinking about automating this, you are 'doing things wrong'
ascii_field: the manual gymnastics on command line should be a ~VANISHINGLY~ small fraction of your efforts
ascii_field: if they loom large, it is because you are not spending the requisite effort
phf: jurov: i only joined the conversation recently, so i don't have a complete history of emails. of course i'm getting complete emails now, but not the past ones
shinohai: I don't think I would want an automatic solution in that regard.
ascii_field: my point is that this is Not Like Other Projects
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 138950 @ 0.00048433 = 67.2977 BTC [-] {4}
jurov: i have nothing against publishing the mailbox
☟︎ trinque respects the various buttons he's created for himself to do all kinds of destructive things
trinque: but I see the point clearly
phf: ascii_field: having a turnkey solution is not the intent behind my request (though i prefer tools in my mail client to messing around with lynx/wget.) i'm interested in having a "take to mars" copy of bitcoind history. right now it's a bit all over the place. patches here, email text there, etc.
jurov: and info for columns "released in"/"based on" must be done manually anyway
jurov: (donations welcome)
ascii_field: probably the most dire omission is any 'family tree' for the patches
mats: no takers for 0.1BTC to pick up a pogo so far huh
mats: ill bump it up to 0.25 to subsidize purchase of 1tb spinning disk or a SSD
ascii_field: mats: iirc danielpbarron established that it ~has~ to use ssd
☟︎☟︎ shinohai: @ mats O.o 0.1 to buy pogo wid ?
assbot: Logged on 29-06-2015 04:05:44; *: BingoBoingo will likely attempt stator build on OpenBSD soon
mats: 0.25 to buy pogo for purpose of setting up node, if you are L1/L2
assbot: Logged on 03-07-2015 19:03:32; trinque: is this stator archive meant to be untarred overtop 0.5.3-RELEASE ?
ascii_field: it was meant to be a picture of my (at the time) set
Jautenim: I coaxed it to compile the turd but segfaults straight away
trinque: ascii_field: got a barf about fPIC in boost, which iirc is already known
☟︎ trinque: no glibc and gentoo hardened
trinque: I'll restart from the beginning and paste the whole thing
mats: !gettrust shinohai assbot
ascii_field: presently i suspect that 'musl' is the only glibc replacement that has any promise
phf: jurov: i'm not in a position to make suggestions to the way things are done in the republic :) i used patches.html, i found some issues with it from the perspective of figuring out what transpired before i started paying attention, so i did extra work on top. cura te ipsum. i figured having mailbox available will make the works of others after me easier
ascii_field: (author explicitly subscribes to the 'short, readable, and compatible' thing)
mod6: i saw that comment yesterday, I briefly looked at it's page ascii_field, I'll take a deeper look at musl soon. hopefully that'll get us further?
ascii_field: last night i looked into doing a 'buildroot' with it
ascii_field: but presently haven't the time to do a proper job of it
assbot: Logged on 03-07-2015 19:12:49; mircea_popescu: check it out alfie, us agitprop dept actuallky admits.
jurov: phf why you're not in such and such position?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45850 @ 0.00048783 = 22.367 BTC [+]
mod6: that btw, was built on x86-64 deb6/glibc env.
mod6: it should allow you to sync off of mp's blockchain w/the appropriate cmdline params and then do dumpblock/eatblock when it's finished or whatever you like.
jurov: <trinque> jurov: could the btc-dev mailing list send mail via tls? ok, considered
jurov: <mod6> one of the things that pains me with the SHA1s re-written into the filenames, is if you pull these files with curl, you have to rename them to their original names before you can verify the signatures. << good point
assbot: Logged on 03-07-2015 20:09:32; trinque: ascii_field: got a barf about fPIC in boost, which iirc is already known
mod6: ascii_field: i did have a problem with it a number of days ago when I first tried it, but it was just an environment related issue. this build, I literally just did it, worked fine.
trinque: I wanna do some gcov work this weekend
mod6: and trinque, did you hvae that -fPIC issue on gentoo with uClibC? that's the same error I was talking about all last month and in the SoBA
mod6: so phf brings to light a good point, reading through the email list, especially if you haven't read the b-a logs from oct-14 on is probably more than a bit hard to follow. ascii_field brings up a good point about having a 'family tree'
mod6: there are a number of different directions these emails go in; patching for v0.5.3.1, pogotronic, gentoo, etc, etc. so I'll try my best to make this apparent when I write up a patch list, etc.
mod6: i'm not sure what to do about this as far as the email list is concerened, yet.
ascii_field: mod6: i kinda assumed you and ben_vulpes would roll the patch sequence docs into releases
ascii_field: (iirc this was the case in 5.3.1 actually)
mod6: yah. we would certainly put all the patches applied to a specific baseline into RELEASE_NOTES.txt as it was for v0.5.3.1
jurov: phf, if you can make better patchlist, are you willing to contribute your script?
shinohai: That would be the easiest, releases
mod6: but pre-milestone release, it does get hard to follow. and since I do believe it'll still be some time before we get the next milestone cut, I should prepare some sort of document so individuals can help test. (we very much appreciate the enthusiasm and the help!)
shinohai: I have little better that piques the imagination
mod6: anyway, we'll get there.
mod6: a wise man told me once: life is short and art is long.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34700 @ 0.00048783 = 16.9277 BTC [+]
phf: jurov: i don't think there's complete understanding as to what should go into patchlist yet. the one we have now is fine, and i'm sure it will be improved
phf: i was actually taking a harder position, if somebody wants to follow along they should read the mailing list from the beginning, and having it all accessible in one place for offline reading helps
mod6: and really, if you wanna follow along, it helps to have the historical timeline 'in head' as well by reading the logs since last October.
mod6: it can't hurt anyway
mod6: oh yeah, now that page was the one i was referring to; i find it pretty unhelpful at all unless you're looking for just who submitted/signed & the sig.
mod6: not that I have any better ideas at this point.
mod6: phf: was this the page you were trying to follow?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59750 @ 0.00049972 = 29.8583 BTC [+] {2}
jurov: not auto updated, url subject to change
mod6: !rate shinohai 1 Helping to test the bitcoin Reference Implementation
mod6: !rate trinque 2 Provided much assistance with Gentoo
mod6: !assbot:mod6.rate.shinohai.1:166411dcdc19e0619447eec6756b67e99dd3dd7c8ac794832a8fdf651173e770
mod6: !v assbot:mod6.rate.shinohai.1:166411dcdc19e0619447eec6756b67e99dd3dd7c8ac794832a8fdf651173e770
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for shinohai with note: Helping to test the bitcoin Reference Implementation
mod6: !v assbot:mod6.rate.trinque.2:169cd6f50f90268d762985db26d2684aae73f0608210b216475944c337511014
assbot: Successfully updated the rating for trinque from 1 to 2 with note: Provided much assistance with Gentoo
mircea_popescu: ascii_field what is "the very important business" a reddit chapter seeded and mostly fed by usg's own something awful crew would conceivably be doing iyo ?
mircea_popescu: ah. just a buncha stupid kids "trying" like the entire world were a kindergarten and "best effort" were a thing and really, we're just playing here.
mod6: thanks for your help shinohai
assbot: You have not rated shinohai.
shinohai: glad to be of at least some minuscule service
mircea_popescu: !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.shinohai.1:69e4bc8a9153033824d3eb9343ba203c5b7eedd3510b7067e202e06cf4531194
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for shinohai with note: New blood.
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 09:30:01; assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47300 @ 0.00049435 = 23.3828 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 12:44:57; punkman: just go wih it
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 13:01:45; ronaz: on brokering side we have over 30 000 clients
mircea_popescu: oh nm, 30k of which some actually did 20 euro alrighty.
mircea_popescu: she's even better than that fucktardina chick that sunk hp
mats: she may even be ready for a presidential run in 2020
mircea_popescu: i gotta say i absolutely am loving the choices of women to put "in tech" the enema's makin'.
mats: the first asian woman!!1
mats: i mean, she's yellow. kinda asian.
mats: first-generation chinese-american
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 96300 @ 0.00050808 = 48.9281 BTC [+] {4}
mats: well, further you get from immigrant parents, more retarded you usually get
mircea_popescu: mats i mean i could see it in usage like "e transilvanean de-ai nostri", ie, "he's one of ours". but that's for a minuscule and very culturally coherent ethnic group.
mircea_popescu: "asian" is about as descriptive as "the country of earth"./
mircea_popescu: i guess she does look distinctive enough, and since presidents are more about looks than actors... myeah ok
mats: welp, she does speak mandarin fluently, so she has that going for her
shinohai: The WH lineup for 2016 is a circus already.
decimation: note that obama is not 'black' in the sense of being ethnically like most black africans who live in the us
shinohai: * Herbert Hoover and his wife also spoke Mandarin, so what?
decimation: they generally come from wester africa
mircea_popescu: decimation i am broadly unconvinced the concept of ethnicity makes any sense in africa.
mircea_popescu: the french just started using it cca 1800 as if, and nobody really discussed the matter.
mats: i speak mandarin influently. my cantonese is pretty good, though.
mats: this makes literacy... tricky
mircea_popescu: for one thing, it's not clear what "ethnicity" without a written culture would be.
mircea_popescu: this isn't a lego car where all the pieces match shinohai
mircea_popescu: decimation gotta bear in mind that "ethnicity" is not a thing, just a word we use for the thing. it's a map. that a map is flat and a place is round does not mean the round place has no geography
mircea_popescu: but it may mean the map doesnt work for describing it./
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 77250 @ 0.00050067 = 38.6768 BTC [-] {2}
decimation: so there's 'no meaningful difference' between igbo in nigeria and a majang in ethiopia?
mircea_popescu: i do know it is upon the proponent to ~prove~ rather than just assert that the tools we developed to discuss and analyse the "terra irredenta" movements in italy cca 1800 are also applicable or meaningful in black africa.
decimation: well, my point is that obama is from the Luo people
mircea_popescu never bothered with it, but is this luo people an internal or an external identity ?
mircea_popescu: ie, is it equivalent to saying "one of the terrorist people" or to "one of the lordship" ?
decimation: "The main Luo livelihoods are fishing, farming and pastoral herding. Outside Luoland, the Luo comprise a significant fraction of East Africa's intellectual and skilled labour force in various professions. Others members work in eastern Africa as tenant fishermen, small scale farmers, and urban workers."
mircea_popescu: impossible to discern how much is a case of "the missionary used a word to best describe what he saw" and "we have created a structure through normal function". anyway, minor point.
decimation: anyway, my earlier meta-point was that I theorize that many voted for obama because he was black but 'not that kind of black'
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: trying to recall - was it you who tried to parallel-process the signature checks ?
ascii_field: notice that sync above block 200k or so is cpu-bound
mircea_popescu: decimation prolly. who the hell knoiws why people vote
shinohai: @ mircea_popescu yes your node is my sole connection.
mircea_popescu: i think i said this before, but in any case bears repeating insistently : larger blocks are a complex discussion that will involve many and numerous benchmarking. it's not the simple matter idiots make it out.
mircea_popescu: shinohai aha cool then. no spurts or weird disconnects or anything ?
ascii_field believes that we already have pretty large blocks
decimation: go to blockchain.info and watch the waterfall of txns
mircea_popescu: ascii_field get a load of this : three days of random, odd internet behaviour, discussed here publicly, which then went away by itself. i did nothing to the server, i asssume neither did you.
shinohai: No, mircea_popescu it has actually been faster than when I previously synced, less memory footprint ramwise
mircea_popescu: i would expect a stuttering engine to go on stuttering until discarded.
kakobrekla: the truth be this or that, if the majority of miners takes up big blocks pogos and company is phucked
decimation: maybe it was the work of the volunteer diggers in san francisco
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla i welcome the verification of this theory in the field.
decimation: kakobrekla: that's why the reference implementation ought to be written to appeal to miners
mats: yes, a model with 8mb and 20mb blocks would be interesting
mircea_popescu: i imagine so would you : a bankrupt field of miners best chance to buy cheap mining rigs for a long time
mircea_popescu: but in any case : money talks. not "power rangers" and not the 0.3% ROI miners. and if moneys says fuck you everyone goes home and tries something else for next year's costume party.
decimation: kakobrekla: it's not as stupid as it sounds
decimation: what miners want to deal with bitcoind correctness
shinohai: What amazes me is it has synced this far in < 1 day
shinohai: It amazes me because it took 4-5 days before
kakobrekla: but 'miners' are zombies, will eat whatever comes their way and cant count on them thinking about anything
☟︎ punkman: ascii_field, does this sequence look right? >> 0.5.3.1-release + orphanage nuke + tx-orphanage + dnsseed_snipsnip + zap_hardcoded_seeds + zap_showmyip + dns thermonuke + irc nuke
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla that's fine. they also have to make money somehow.
decimation: kakobrekla: exactly, which is why they would use whatever other people say is good
mircea_popescu: so yes, zombies. just, make sure you identify the necromancer driving them correctly
kakobrekla: they are getting spammed with 'bitcoin upgrades' as we speak
kakobrekla: my guess is most wont have a second thought.
decimation: exactly, so if they have brains this will wake them up to 'wtf is going on with bitcoind'
mircea_popescu: and the same people will be selling the farm three to six months down the road.
decimation: those withouth brains will be trying to sell used asics
mircea_popescu: as eulora tips say, "a willingness to learn is not mandatory. neither is survival."
mircea_popescu: anyway, i am very excited about this actually happening.
mod6: <+punkman> ascii_field, does this sequence look right? >> 0.5.3.1-release + orphanage nuke + tx-orphanage + dnsseed_snipsnip + zap_hardcoded_seeds + zap_showmyip + dns thermonuke + irc nuke << looks right to me.
mircea_popescu: the mass slaughter of a large contingent of people who act as if "doing what everyone else does is safe", and who lose millions at it is the best thing that can happen.
kakobrekla: i cant have blockchain dead for a month
mircea_popescu: a shining moment of "buying ibm gets you killed" is more valuable than asia.
kakobrekla: thinking of who else is such case here, davout ?
mod6: punkman: you may want the kills_integer_retardation in there, as well as nubs`'s gentoo sanity, at least the part with the copying over of the headers & libs in auto.sh check those out here:
mircea_popescu: last i heard davout was looking for ways to programatically exploit the shitcoin
decimation: kakobrekla: what do you mean about 'having blockchain dead'
kakobrekla: having a chain with a gazillion difficulty and no to little miners on it
decimation: I find the probability of that happening to be very low
kakobrekla: the switch happens when there is 90% of miners on the new chain (determined by checking last n blocks rolling window)
☟︎ kakobrekla: when this happens there already is such condition as i described give or take
kakobrekla: and the even bringing that percentage even higher as some give up.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26900 @ 0.0004959 = 13.3397 BTC [-]
trinque: cannot paste the whole boost build log
mod6: weird. that's basically the same problem i had with uClibC [ libpthread.a(pthread_cond_wait.o): relocation R_X86_64_32 against `__gcc_personali
mod6: ty_v0' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC ]
mod6: except this is with glibc huh
trinque: suggests it's maybe a matter of the hardened toolchain eh?
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla a loss of 90% mining power relates to blocks taking a little over an hour, not a month.
mircea_popescu: in other words, they can go hang, won't be noticed, won't be missed.
mircea_popescu: this is why miners are NOT actually seated at the table.
mod6: <+trinque> suggests it's maybe a matter of the hardened toolchain eh? << yeah, i think this is a clue
mircea_popescu: their job begins and ends with rejecting bad blocks. they are in no way involved in deciding what that means.
kakobrekla: 90% < thats just the breaking point. once they figure out they have no wehre to send those coins short of mpex, those will be gone too.
mod6: trinque: sometime this month I'll try to pay with 'default/linux/uclibc/amd64' instead.
mircea_popescu: looky here : a) mpex makes more money than the entire faux & pretend ecosyustem of coinbases and whatnot. those COST, a shitton of money, for the services they fail to provide.
decimation: zooming out, the game theory is definitely against someone trying to make bigger blocks
mircea_popescu: if you think bitcoin is currently supported by people using bitpay to buy coffee, that is squarely your problem
trinque: mod6: I'm going to re-run it with the "vanilla" gcc now
mircea_popescu: well of course. problems down the road is what we signed up for.
mod6: and if that doesn't work, maybe I can give 'hardened/linux/musl/amd64' (i don't see a non-hardened one available atm)
mircea_popescu: otherwise we'd be working accounting on excel spreadsheets.
mod6: trinque: aight, thanks!
mod6: sometimes a hair gets stuck in mine, and I have to pull it out.
mod6: ah, ps2. maybe just try disconnecting it and re-connecting it?
mod6: otherwise, it could be something with the surface that you're using it on... like if its some how refracting in some strange way
trinque: ah yeah, I've had mine move suddenly if I lifted the mouse while using it for that reason
trinque: which I do habitually, as if trying to climb across the desk with the mouse
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51750 @ 0.00050759 = 26.2678 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 16:16:04; decimation:
https://devinhelton.com/2015-06-25/meme-theory < "Thus, outsiders discredit themselves when they make accusations of conscious conspiracy. Any person of even mid-level status knows that the statement is flatly false. They know that the accused elites genuinely do seem to care about helping people. They know there is no conspiracy. Thus they discount the self-interest theory and pay no further attention."
mircea_popescu: who the fuck wants to "credit himself" with the retarded ?
mircea_popescu: to "discredit yourself" in the estimation of boring old aunties and so forth is exactly what cool is all about.
mircea_popescu: god help whosoever is held in high regard by "persons of even mid-level status".
trinque: mod6: switching to vanilla gcc got past the fPIC barf
trinque: and now I've got one boost barf left
mircea_popescu: decimation it is pretty lulzy in its self-referential dementia.
trinque: will document what I ended up having to do to build it at the end
gribble: Current Blocks: 363701 | Current Difficulty: 4.940201493122746E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 364895 | Next Difficulty In: 1194 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 11 hours, 6 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None
trinque is astounded at the amount types wiggle platform to platform
punkman: "I can't use ::int64_t as it not defined on all compilers for example on some platforms (Windows) we do not have stdint.h so we do not have int64_t in the global namespace. "
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 16:19:40; decimation: I'm sure that if you met the leaders of the average usg institution they would strike you as nice people trying to do the right thing. they are just imprisoned by their choices, making them into figureheads
mircea_popescu: heck, the way usg is going, this is actually becoming more and more true each decade.
mircea_popescu: "Should the outsiders gain authority, they have no real power, because they do not know how to work the levers to operate the machine."
mircea_popescu: omfg fuck this shit. outsiders do not wish a lever or care for one.
mircea_popescu: i hope your machinery is built out of hammer resistant materials,
mircea_popescu: because that means i'll have to bring forth the tracked 800kton one.
trinque: and hey, I got a static bitcoind
trinque: bout to give it a run with gcov
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 16:21:44; ben_vulpes: only solution is to burn everything in sight that pisses one off.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59000 @ 0.00049923 = 29.4546 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 17:49:50; jurov: anyone'd like to bounce-mail some to europe?
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 18:14:13; mod6: ascii_field, mircea_popescu: am now pulling blocks from mp's seed with stator
DanyAlos: What do you mean with "who are you"?
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 18:18:22; ascii_field: (though, comically, it can still decide that said ip 'misbehaves' and is then left dead in the water)
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 18:19:46; ascii_field: trinque: this is more of a 'reader' than 'writer' affair anyway
mod6: <+trinque> and hey, I got a static bitcoind << nice!! i'll give this a shot here tonight yet
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 20:44:30; ascii_field: 'getdata is used in response to inv... ...t can be used to retrieve transactions, but only if they are in the memory pool or relay set - arbitrary access to transactions in the chain is not allowed to avoid having clients start to depend on nodes having full transaction indexes (which modern nodes do not).'
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> jitter actually fixed by plug-unplug. da fuck. << good deal. maybe just needed reinitialization for whatever reason
DanyAlos: mircea_popescu: Sorry if I misunderstand somthing. My english is not so fluid.
mircea_popescu: DanyAlos in general english wouldn't have much to do with one's identity, does it ? unl;ess you'd be shakespeare or something.
DanyAlos: Haha. It english almost have nothing to do with me.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86700 @ 0.00049147 = 42.6104 BTC [-] {3}
DanyAlos: But I supousse that if I speak spanish here nobody would get a thing.
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 20:44:49; ascii_field: (speaking of 'getdata' here)
DanyAlos: Pensé que solo inglés y rumano.
DanyAlos: El "más o menos" es muy argentino!
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 21:01:47; ascii_field: isn't BoA infamous for being, approx., the microshit of u.s. banks ?
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 21:01:51; kakobrekla: unless you are registered terrorist
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 21:04:00; ascii_field: usgicity is infectious - no one wants to be the first fella to stop clapping when it's clap-for-stalin time
mircea_popescu: in its own perverse way, it's a leadership function. provides means for people to agree.
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 21:09:51; ascii_field: 'let's break semantics of everything because it isn't like anyone still expects anything to work as printed on the tin'
mircea_popescu: the obvious approach would be to protest these uppity kindergartners feel too special for their own good. but that's merely sympthom imo.
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 22:46:19; decimation: yeah, it might be visible, but the effort going into turning a bomb into an 'aerosol delivery system' is probably wasted. Like ascii's point about chemical EMP bombs
mircea_popescu: someone recently managed to close down a 12 block section of wash dc by literally saying "i think i heard gunshots".
mircea_popescu: the cost to the enemy of any device is made out of a real and a perceived factor. these sometimes diverge. all radiation things diverge in the sense of perception overwhelming reality.
assbot: [MPEX] [D.BSTP] 11 @ 0.099 = 1.089 BTC [+]
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 22:49:55; danielpbarron: they're all into this whole "polyamory" thing which is a just ephemism for mysandry
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 22:51:33; trinque: danielpbarron: I don't recall ever encountering a "polyamorist" who was not female\
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 22:56:37; danielpbarron: at least this time around everyone knew who i was (that mean Bible guy who's also affilated with that mean exchange operator) and got very few culty "why haven't you signed yet" lectures
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 23:04:05; danielpbarron: you'd think, but they are more of the socialist nature than they'd like to admit to themselves which becomes quite apparent when someone like me starts advocating feudalism and slavery
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 23:11:35; mats: who is this popescu guy that's constantly talking about enslaving people and why is this mpex page so ugly
trinque: mircea_popescu: referring to the particular euphemism used around these parts to refer to the lifestyle where you get fucked up and fuck other dudes, and call it a sexual orientation
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 23:14:35; mats: being difficult is not something i'm interested in doing
trinque: not various other multiple-partner arrangements
mircea_popescu: trinque okay, but you know, the term both preexists and actually has genuine usage outside of whatever hipster subculture.
trinque: ^ euphemism for "I'm wrong" lol
mircea_popescu: otherwise, women drinking themselves into beds has been a mainstay of post-colonial british empire.
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 23:15:29; danielpbarron: i told him that I don't trust
https in general and he completely flipped out to where he was yelling accusations like "you're going to get exposed for the fraud you are! we use
https here!" or something like that
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 23:16:17; mats: regular folk need
https mircea_popescu: what exactly about this chick or that dude is making them be "regular folks", which is to say chattel rather than persons ?
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 23:57:40; asciilifeform:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=02-07-2015#1184666 << as i understand, this is an example of 'smv' (sexual market value) as described by mocsny and kokkarinen at work. it takes the form of 'man: what can i afford' 'woman: with your bid, you can afford to be my driver and pay two-thirds of my rent. in return, you get every 47th fuck, if good behaviour.'
mircea_popescu: this is rank nonsense if you think any about it. the only part of sex that's in short supply is the erect penis. everything else is overabundant. how exactly would the owners of the only rare part be paying anyone for anything whatsoever ?
☟︎