▁⏐︎▁▁ 14021
mircea_popescu: "the greatest peacock i ever saw!" "that's a human from rockefeller center" "but i see no penis ?!?!"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24750 @ 0.00054426 = 13.4704 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/images/nyt%20obama%20altered.jpg << bwahahaha
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/205hBFJ )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ^ check it out
deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jan 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1216/bitcoin-to-top-600-before-jan-2016/#b3
mircea_popescu: o.O
mircea_popescu: ;;market
gribble: Error: "market" is not a valid command.
mircea_popescu: da fuck was it
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 285.63, Best ask: 285.96, Bid-ask spread: 0.33000, Last trade: 285.56, 24 hour volume: 15452.3532551, 24 hour low: 279.7, 24 hour high: 286.22, 24 hour vwap: None
mircea_popescu: dumbass vc "losing interest" is the best thing that ever happened to bitcoin huh.
shinohai: Helping a friend in Brasil set up realbitcoin, trying to get him up to speed on gpg so he can come here.
mircea_popescu: cool
mircea_popescu: are you from brasil ?
shinohai: I'm not, just a guy I have known since I started bitcoin a few years ago.
mircea_popescu: a ok
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40621 @ 0.00054427 = 22.1088 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17683 @ 0.0005393 = 9.5364 BTC [-] {2}
gabriel_laddel: !s Wouter Basson
assbot: 0 results for 'Wouter Basson' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=Wouter+Basson
gabriel_laddel: !s Lothar Neethling
assbot: 0 results for 'Lothar Neethling' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=Lothar+Neethling
gabriel_laddel: !s Lothar's potion
assbot: 0 results for 'Lothar's potion' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=Lothar%27s+potion
mircea_popescu: "There is absolutely no way that anyone who reads The Economist can have concluded that Europe has surpassed America in anything not involving riots, in the way that no one who reads Maxim can conclude that acne is in vogue."
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: have you, or will you be emailing any of the gentoo mirror maintainers asking around for backups?
gabriel_laddel: I was shocked to find out that they only keep the couple most recent versions of everything in the master repository.
gabriel_laddel: wtf is the *point* if I can't go back in time to something stable.
mircea_popescu: the point is appearing to do a job.
asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: no. see thread.
asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: i will be publishing my personal stash.
mircea_popescu: q : is there a way to actually publish this as a discrete item ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what would this mean ?
mircea_popescu: or is it an utter and impredictable mess in the manner of everything else foss ?
asciilifeform: it's a gigantic dir full of tar.gz
mircea_popescu: that by doing [this thing to do] i now have _everything_.
asciilifeform: it is not everything. merely everything asciilifeform's cockpit has.
asciilifeform: at least such that was 'emerge'-d
mircea_popescu: so "no using any videocards ascii never used" ?
asciilifeform: nope.
asciilifeform: however, this doesn't leave many
asciilifeform: pretty sure i even had a 'tseng' at some point.
mircea_popescu: so it technically is just another bad mirror ?
asciilifeform: and a (pci!) 'hercules.'
asciilifeform: 'there are many bad mirrors, this one is mine'
mircea_popescu: right.
asciilifeform: but it is guaranteed to add up to a civilized box.
mircea_popescu: i don't mean to impugn, btw.
mircea_popescu: just... this is a structural fucking problem.
asciilifeform: that's sorta what i was trying to explain to shinohai.
mircea_popescu: yeah i guess, coming at same from diff path
mircea_popescu: "They are better educated than previous generations and they were raised by baby boomers who lavished a lot of attention on their children," said Andrew Kohut [the director of the Pew Research Center.]
mircea_popescu: WRONGALONGADINGDONG. They're not better educated, they just have more degrees.
mircea_popescu: heh.
mircea_popescu: one day i'll meet the usian who is better educated than people in the 50s.
mircea_popescu: and it'll be a russian/irani/whatever.
asciilifeform: pew?! what next, we quote völkischer beobachter ?
asciilifeform: 'the secret strange hole in his dubious pew' (tm) (r) (mircea_popescu's www)
mircea_popescu: i am quoting tlp who quoted him!
asciilifeform: ah!
asciilifeform: l0l
mircea_popescu: that makes it ok!
mircea_popescu: lol.
mircea_popescu: shit, i wrote that didn't i. pretty cool.
gabriel_laddel: Does any commercial Lisp IDE have a fast autocomplete that works like "apropos at point" ie, across all packages?
asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: afaik there is precisely 1 commercial common lisp ide
asciilifeform: lispworks
asciilifeform: but afaik nobody uses it, most folks run emacs+slime even there.
asciilifeform: but iirc it does have apropos.
asciilifeform: if you must... grap the eval version from their www, see for yourself.
mircea_popescu: http://38.media.tumblr.com/1b298dbb6a9a973d3f32d678cba08957/tumblr_ns4sg8CQ7T1uc86zfo1_500.gif << how about sporty chicks ?
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1PO8Mf1 )
mats: at least its not a tranny this time
mircea_popescu: tough crowd eh
mircea_popescu: fine, how about sluts in heels ? http://38.media.tumblr.com/277cea03b111a9664d3a3d2b7334ee24/tumblr_nspl9lFAKl1tvjjruo1_400.gif
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1PO9N6F )
gabriel_laddel: How about a working linux?!
gabriel_laddel: O wait
asciilifeform: ^
gabriel_laddel: http://imgur.com/NK8gdQd
assbot: Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet ... ( http://bit.ly/1PO9Say )
gabriel_laddel: All that CLIM, all that desktop.
mats: i miss summer already
asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: spiffy
mats: laying in bed, naked, listening to 'Channel Orange', that was nice
asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: how laggy is it ?
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: the debugger works too!
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: not at all
asciilifeform: the other thing is that i always fucking hated athena
gabriel_laddel: If I get like 30 views in climacs, that slows
asciilifeform: can't stand it
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel sluts are way easier.
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: athena?
mircea_popescu: <mats> laying in bed, naked, listening to 'Channel Orange', that was nice << you know ba weather is nude indoors weather throughout the year.
asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: the ancient mit project from which those gui elements (e.g. the scroll bar) came
asciilifeform: the 'default ghastly gui of x11'
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: ah. Well at some point I'll have someone fix it up all nice and minimalist.
asciilifeform: afaik with clim it's athena or nothing.
deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 4.82672004 BTC on 'No' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jan 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1216/bitcoin-to-top-600-before-jan-2016/#b4
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: nah, there is one other.
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: pixie or something like that
gabriel_laddel: (the pixie "look and feel" doesn't work with tabs though)
asciilifeform: so it's garbage.
mats: mircea_popescu: i'm envious. boston is under siege during the winter... i believe last year was the snowiest on record, ~110in
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: fixing only the tabs is easy
mircea_popescu: yeah, i lived there.
gabriel_laddel: how to geometry
mircea_popescu: brutal. practically sweden.
mircea_popescu: pronounced snowed-in
mats: hue.
mircea_popescu: http://36.media.tumblr.com/c80020b1c225b7fc5d20c5d95f8e0128/tumblr_mlzz0fq9bd1s9ngl0o1_1280.jpg << this is known in french as "l'embarras du choix", which means "the shame of the cauliflower".
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1POapcv )
mircea_popescu: because the french are that weird.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62767 @ 0.00053485 = 33.5709 BTC [-] {2}
gabriel_laddel: apropos of nothing: if anyone here is addicted to coffee, and finds that caffine pills don't cut it, I've found that brand EasyUp works WONDERS.
mats: i'm seeing a lot of results for tents with the 'easyup' search query
mats: and something known as a 'paramotor', which is kinda cool.
gabriel_laddel: ;; google easy up wake up aid - take tonight. wake up easier & alert tomorrow morning amazon
gribble: Easy Up - Wake Up Aid - Facebook: <https://www.facebook.com/TryEasyUp>; Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: ZzzQuil Nighttime Sleep-Aid ...: <http://www.amazon.com/Zzzquil-Nighttime-Sleep-aid-Liquid-Warming/product-reviews/B007OSBYRY>; Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: The Sleepeasy Solution: The ...: <http://www.amazon.com/The-Sleepeasy-Solution-Exhausted-Parents/product- (1 more message)
gabriel_laddel: useless google
mircea_popescu: !up btc
mircea_popescu: srsly, that nick's not taken ?
gabriel_laddel: http://www.amazon.com/Easy-Up%C2%AE-Wake-Up-Aid/dp/B0081UVHPI
assbot: Amazon.com: Easy Up® Wake Up Aid - Take Tonight. Wake Up Easier & Alert Tomorrow Morning - 36 Night Supply: Health & Personal Care ... ( http://bit.ly/1POb4uH )
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel why not just have some coffee ?
btc: hi
deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 5.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jan 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1216/bitcoin-to-top-600-before-jan-2016/#b5
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: I drink about 2 pots a day without it sometimes.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: the amout of liquid is irritating.
mircea_popescu: ...
mircea_popescu: a) you should drink about a gallon of water a day ; b) if you don't like how much coffee you drink just make a point of drinking a little less each day for a while ?
mircea_popescu: who're you btc ?
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: I try to make a point of drinking less, and it works. for a while. then I'm back to a pot or two a day.
mircea_popescu: so make a point of paying attention for longer ?
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: I need it to think.
gabriel_laddel: (IMHO, I actually need some sort of medication, but have not really looked into it)
mircea_popescu: yesyes.
mircea_popescu: it is taken.
gabriel_laddel: Does anyone have some "grey goo pipe dreams" re mechanical program optimization?
gabriel_laddel: If you do, I'd love to hear them.
mats: modafinil is p great.
gabriel_laddel: mats: doesn't work for me...
gabriel_laddel: my thoughts get all disjointed, but then again, I've only tried the racemic stuff
mircea_popescu: honestly, if i actually needed some substance to think i would probably drop everything and go shoot bears for a while.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: you have that option.
asciilifeform: ^^
asciilifeform: cue 'everyone has that option', here have a broomstick
gabriel_laddel: furthermore, I have actually quit coffee now, twice.
mircea_popescu: omg teh haet.
gabriel_laddel: but I dislike being 'sober'.
gabriel_laddel: or uncaffinated, or whatever you want to call it.
gabriel_laddel: It's boring.
mats: well, if you'd like to try non racemics, guess I'll shill mymodafinil.com and its armodafinil
mircea_popescu: problem is - drunkedness is strictly for people who don't dislike being sober.
mats: discount if invoice paid with buttcoins
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: pardon?
asciilifeform: mats: did you personally analyze it ?
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel it's a paradoxical thing, what can i say.
mats: whaddya mean? lab test?
asciilifeform: yes
asciilifeform: as in, wtf is actually in that spam pill.
asciilifeform: last i checked, every spamarmacy is actually shipping indian adrafinil, which rots the liver.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: I simply don't understand what you're saying.
mircea_popescu: this is probab le.
danielpbarron: asciilifeform> cue 'everyone has that option', here have a broomstick << or a Bible
mats: no. but my understanding is that the operators buy the generics from indian rx mfgs and resell the stuff
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel that not liking being sober is a very poor reason to be drunk. or whatever you call it.
mats: well nao...
mats: guess it's a good thing I've only consumed a few dozen of em
asciilifeform: mats: recrystallize a few pills and find the melting point (it isn't hard.) you might be in for a surprise.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: I agree with you, but the *amount of work* I get done when caffinated, and the amount of fun I have doing it makes it simply impossible to do otherwise.
gabriel_laddel: I'm an addict, what can I say.
mats: I know next to nothing about chemistry
asciilifeform: mats: this experiment does not require a first class education in it.
mats: what if there's filler besides the moda? etc.
asciilifeform: hence you recrystallize
asciilifeform: (find what the active substance dissolves in which the fillers do not.)
asciilifeform: rinse, repeat (literally)
mircea_popescu: etoh ?
mats: the most experience I've had with testing chemicals is using various reagents to ensure I was consuming actual mdma
mats: but I'll give it a go, soon as I acquire a hot plate
mircea_popescu: can make out of wire and battery.
mircea_popescu: depending on wire thickness, either the wire or the battery shall be the hot plate.
mats: for folks curious about moda, gwern had written extensively on the subject
asciilifeform: interestingly, if mircea_popescu were to take a dose of modafinil (racemic or isomeric, pick whichever) he would notice NOTHING AT ALL
asciilifeform: guaranteed.
mats: has*
asciilifeform: and i bet mats knows why.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's probable. i have a poor reaction to many of these.
asciilifeform: no i mean literally NOTHING
asciilifeform: no side effect either.
mircea_popescu: whyssat ?
asciilifeform: because it is a very peculiar kind of dope, which does (as far as most folks notice, or - for the most part - across a few million eaters / a few decades of sales) precisely one thing.
asciilifeform: simulates a full night of sleep.
mircea_popescu: lol that's fucking useless.
asciilifeform: for mircea_popescu - guaranteed useless.
mircea_popescu: "take this pill, it simulates taking a piss" "or i could... take a piss ?" "yes, of course".
asciilifeform: countdown to broomstick...
mats: I mostly used it to retain cognitive power and wakefulness for studying binges and v late nights
mircea_popescu never binge studied either. wtf, if it's not worth reading normally it's not worth reading.
mircea_popescu also started his final thesis in college 5 months early, and was done with it about a month and a half before it was supposed to be turned in.
mats: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2654794/
assbot: Mechanisms of modafinil: A review of current research ... ( http://bit.ly/1POdbhS )
mats: topical
mats: curious about BBs opinion on the subject of moda, and more broadly, 'nootropics' ☟︎
mats: ;;later tell bingoboingo haro, ^
gribble: The operation succeeded.
gabriel_laddel: mats: I'm curious as to why you're curious as to BB's opinion?
mircea_popescu: other than peterl, bb is like the resident chemist huh
gabriel_laddel: ?!
gabriel_laddel: since when?
mats: did a stint in pharmacy school, rite? ☟︎
mircea_popescu: since when he keeps ranting about chem topics ? dunno.
mircea_popescu: alf too, but alf only took a kindergarten level chemistry class
mircea_popescu: so he doesn't count.
gabriel_laddel: riiiigt
mod6: haha
gabriel_laddel: *riiight.
mats: I liked moda because it was, for me, an adderall without the negative effects,
mircea_popescu: you lot could just as well have a glass of water and go takle a nap.
asciilifeform: aaaaaha sure.
asciilifeform: on dirigible.
asciilifeform: in the magical room where you only do things you want to do.
mircea_popescu: this shit isn't free. in the time you took to research it and the time it takes you to earn what it costs you coulda caught up on sleep.
trinque: I would wager this is more to do with "wow, this is what a smart person must feel like" and thereby actually doing some work than the effect of the chemical.
mats: e.g. distracting euphoria, I could still sleep while on the tail end of a 100mg dosage 7-8hrs in
mircea_popescu: trinque you know that AWESOME tlp article on placebo ?
trinque: no but I will now want to search it out
mircea_popescu: lemme feed it to you.
trinque: ty
mircea_popescu: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/08/no_one_likes_a_sure_thing.html
assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: No One Likes A Sure Thing ... ( http://bit.ly/1McBmRx )
asciilifeform: mats: you can actually sleep ~immediately~ after eating whatever dosage.
asciilifeform: mats: try it if you don't believe.
mircea_popescu: i just had the girls lined up with their mouths open while i swore as to the various aspects
gabriel_laddel: I'm rather envious of the 50s. You could get benzedrine otc, and it was widely used by e.g., Norbert Wiener
mats: asciilifeform: I believe, have done so on a few occasions
mircea_popescu: "no, parkinson, this is a legitimately defined disease with a biological backing. no, he is actually measuring the chemistry involved, dopamine. no, actually." etc
mats: when I was apparently too exhausted, or perhaps took an insubstantial dosage
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel i got benzadrine otc here. asked for cyclobenzapyrine, derp showed up with benzos.
gabriel_laddel: benzos != benzadrine
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not the muscle relaxant!!
mircea_popescu: yes.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in 1950s usa, 'benzo' meant benzoamphetamine.
mircea_popescu: oh, he actually meant amphetamine ? mkay.
gabriel_laddel: yep.
asciilifeform: (not, say, benzodiazepine)
gabriel_laddel: widely used in the war effort.
mircea_popescu: icnow.
asciilifeform: in every country there was a separate name for it, for some odd reason
gabriel_laddel: I asked someone who was around, he claims that he "couldn't distinguish it from coffee"
asciilifeform: germany and anything warsaw pact say 'pervitin' (nazi brand) - folks will recognize.
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel you have any idea whbat the tolerance to benzo-* is like ?
mircea_popescu: after a few years you can take it by the gram.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: not really.
asciilifeform: actually the relevant piece here is mircea_popescu's own 'how to smoke' article.
asciilifeform: (don't be an idiot and eat $dope every day)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that is the article about how to feed whores caviar.
asciilifeform: hm. perhaps was thinking of another.
asciilifeform: there was one about how to smoke, i distincly recally.
asciilifeform: *distinctly
mircea_popescu: i sometimes repeat myself.
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2011/caviarul-si-fata/ < one i was thinking of.
assbot: Caviarul si fata on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1McBCja )
mircea_popescu: "I. Ersteklasse. Crema a ceea ce poate oferi natura, icrele cele mai bune, din care in principiu un cetatean, oricit de bogat s-ar gasi, are totusi a consuma cantitati limitate, dintr-un motiv foarte simplu : daca nu alternezi cu produse inferioare te vei obisnui, si-apoi te vei deprima. Oamenii inteligenti le gusta lunar si traiesc fericiti pina la adinci batrineti."
mircea_popescu: "the cream of what nature can offer, best roe, of which in principle a person no matter how rich still should only consume limited amounts for a very simple reason : if you do not alternate with inferior product you wiull become used to it, and then depressed. intelligent people eat it once a month and live happilly ever after."
asciilifeform: ^^^^
asciilifeform: entirely pertinent, even if the wrong article.
mircea_popescu: thinking about it, i do recall i also said about smoking.
asciilifeform: 'used to it, then depressed' followed by 'can't quit usa because that's where they serve up $x'
mircea_popescu: lol. you are not at all far off.
mircea_popescu: perhaps travelling by bus is now much more obviously comprehensible.
asciilifeform speaks with the studded and corpulent anal pineapple of experience
asciilifeform: ;;later tell BingoBoingo https://cryptome.org/dodi/2015/dodd-5205-14.pdf >>>>>> http://dpaste.com/32ACSQ3.txt << lulzy, possibly qntra material ?
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1McBVe4 )
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1McBXCJ )
gribble: The operation succeeded.
asciilifeform: 'The Department of Defense shall work with other U.S. Government (USG) departments and agencies and with partner nations to deny, disrupt, or defeat and degrade adversaries’ ability to use global licit and illicit financial networks to negatively affect U.S. interests.'
asciilifeform: (followed by a few kb of mostly generic usg claptrap)
mircea_popescu: and this is remarkable why ?
mircea_popescu: they got a stretched asshole the size of the gulf, and they're gonna work towards stitching it back together ?
mircea_popescu: da fuck else would it say.
asciilifeform did not read whole thing
asciilifeform: hence feeding it to connoisseurs
mircea_popescu: the problem here is that dod is uniquely unequipped to do this. this is a job for the ss, which is WHY they handlwe counterfitting in the first place.
mircea_popescu: except ss knows enough about this to not want to touch it, so the aspirational down kids over at dod get a chance to shine.
asciilifeform: there is not a meaningful separation between various seekrit skvirrels in usa today
asciilifeform: (if there ever once was.)
mircea_popescu: oh but there is.
mircea_popescu: the only kind that counts : by intellect.
asciilifeform: quite a bit of lateral motion and unclear separation of concern between the spetzagencies
asciilifeform: e.g., nsa is civilian-staffed but managed largely by active or retired dod folk
mircea_popescu: sure. but it still works exactly like it worked in the other soviet union.
mircea_popescu: ie, the real-special guys despise the wanna-be-special guys
mircea_popescu: which is why nsa is the internet forum pisspot.
asciilifeform: iirc ss handled the known/public aspects of the mtgox dekulakization ?
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assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23899 @ 0.00053911 = 12.8842 BTC [+] {3}
deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 3.26772084 BTC on 'No' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jan 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1216/bitcoin-to-top-600-before-jan-2016/#b8
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mats: ho ho ho
mats: someone hasn't read mp's thing about address reuse
deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 4.23308806 BTC on 'No' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jan 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1216/bitcoin-to-top-600-before-jan-2016/#b11
trinque: mircea_popescu | http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/08/no_one_likes_a_sure_thing.html << I've been chewing on this for the last few hours. There's a lot here. gabriel_laddel, it would seem that not only could you will yourself focus, but *generally* will yourself anything from the possible mental states.
assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: No One Likes A Sure Thing ... ( http://bit.ly/1McBmRx )
trinque: that is, as long as you can convince yourself you have a good chance at being in the state you want to be in ;)
trinque: perhaps this anticipation thing is will.
trinque: !up gabriel_laddel
gabriel_laddel: ty
trinque: yw
gabriel_laddel: This is fucking nonsense. I *cannot* will myself to get up in the morning after 23 years of never having to.
trinque: taking anxiety as an example; the worst thing you can do is try to avoid it.
gabriel_laddel: most people wake up at 8am. Me: 4pm
trinque: you asserting "fucking nonsense" with no reason is fucking nonsense
trinque: when you have perfect health aside from this you can cry health problem
gabriel_laddel: trinque: you're right. I've not even read the article yet.
trinque: as it stands you've got a massive addiction to caffeine
trinque: one of my favorite drugs, I'll have you know
trinque: but it affects goddamn everything all over the body
gabriel_laddel: trinque: do you have the effect of almost fainting sometimes?
gabriel_laddel: like, you're just standing and then the stray thought "hey, it'd be nice to fall into bed, except there isn't a bed her" flies through your mind?
trinque: sounds like extreme exhaustion
trinque: have you ever done cocaine?
trinque: for a few days?
gabriel_laddel: trinque: yeah
trinque: sounds about like that
gabriel_laddel: nah, the caffine effect is different.
mircea_popescu: !up archStanton
mircea_popescu: trinque the caution being that it's a single study and they might be insane.
mircea_popescu: but otherwise, the fact that placebo is nothing short of crazy is an open secret in clinician circles.
gabriel_laddel: with coffee there are all sorts of weird things: like whenever I have a bike pass me by, I sort of envision it running into me.
trinque: sure, this is very interesting though
gabriel_laddel: same with cars.
trinque: sounds suicidal.
trinque: or at least paranoid
gabriel_laddel: and this goes away completely when I don't drink a lot of coffee
gabriel_laddel: it's sort of like a phantom limb effect.
gabriel_laddel: and is very odd.
trinque: yeah I've been fucked up on drugs before too bud
trinque: lol
trinque: why are you surprised your body's freaking out over your treatment of it?
gabriel_laddel: I'm not. It's just... odd.
gabriel_laddel: and it *only* happens with coffee.
mircea_popescu: the serious problem for coffee drinkers is the caffeine headache. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: absent that... should be fine really.
gabriel_laddel: I've been burnt out on coke and hating life, but never have had this effect.
trinque: my only point is I wouldn't self diagnose "I need meds" before dropping your caffeine to zero, seeing where you're at
gabriel_laddel: trinque: to be clear, I've done this.
trinque: I've quit it entirely before, feels like shit, but a lot of the "stress" I was feeling back then was the several cups of coffee per day I was drinking.
gabriel_laddel: trinque: and have not done hard drugs in years
mircea_popescu: how about a cup a day or every coupla days or something. like sane people.
trinque: I'm at a cup a day now, fine
mircea_popescu: o wow that $600 bet is on fire huh
gabriel_laddel: trinque: the problem I have with being coffee-free isn't the stress, but rather that I miss having my thoughts race around
gabriel_laddel: and the multiple day reading binges
gabriel_laddel: (of code or english, take your pick)
trinque: so read all day anyway
trinque: this notion of making oneself do a thing is bizarre
gabriel_laddel: yeah, but it's more fun when "high".
trinque: like you're a guy at the bridge of yourself directing things rather than being the thing
gabriel_laddel: trinque: so wait, you don't get more absorbed in whatever you're doing when drinking coffee?
trinque: is it that you have trouble clearing your head to consider one thing at a time?
trinque: I drink coffee yes, for the high, but this does not prevent me from reading otherwise
gabriel_laddel: trinque: in part. It's also that I'm just not interested or excited about life without coffee.
gabriel_laddel: I don't have ideas that I would consider interesting.
gabriel_laddel: it's a horrid slog through boring nonsense, depression, the works.
trinque: well hell, death soon approaches.
trinque: for me that's plenty to get to work
gabriel_laddel: oh, and without coffee I get distracted.
trinque: have you ever really considered the fact that you will soon die?
gabriel_laddel: trinque: what, via coffee, or in general?
gabriel_laddel: trinque: "for me that's plenty to get to work" ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59000 @ 0.00053743 = 31.7084 BTC [-]
trinque: plenty of motivation to
gabriel_laddel: trinque: it seems to me that the other thing missing from this discussion is that we've all very different chemistry.
trinque: yes but your statements imply certain beliefs
trinque: those may be different chemistry; I'm still chewing on the article as I said!
gabriel_laddel: trinque: for example, the modafinil that I've taken works great for other people.
trinque: what do you mean it works great?
gabriel_laddel: they stay awake for 40 ish hours with no issues.
gabriel_laddel: it does *nothing* for my sleep cycle
gabriel_laddel: and makes my thoughts disjointed.
trinque: this is an odd notion of being better; note that it is mostly about you being some kind of machine you run for x hours and produce y per hour
gabriel_laddel: wrt coffee or modafinil?
gabriel_laddel: or both?
trinque: both I'd say
trinque: what is the goal? so you stay awake for 40 hrs
trinque: and then what happens?
gabriel_laddel: and then I spend more time hacking apart portage than I would have otherwise
trinque: "I am the guy that coded for 40 hrs."
gabriel_laddel: lol, I'm not doing it for other people
trinque: fascinating, I didn't say it was for that
gabriel_laddel: "I am the guy who coded for 40 hrs" < ?
gabriel_laddel: isn't that what you were implying?
trinque: my statement is right there, no secret other meanings
mircea_popescu: <gabriel_laddel> and then I spend more time hacking apart portage than I would have otherwise << no you don't. this is like the ridiculous notion of teenagers that they'll make a car "better".
mircea_popescu: tell you what, if your mods were actually improvements THEY WOULD BE IN THE CAR. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: it's an industrial fucking product, you think they don't know what you know ?
mircea_popescu: the only reason it's not included in the series version is that it's a stupid idea.
gabriel_laddel: actually, with respect to portage / gentoo / funtoo - yeah
trinque: ahaha, this is excellent due to the gentoo-as-ricer-car mockery
gabriel_laddel: I know more than they do.
mircea_popescu: no. with respect to "improving" your body.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: look, there are some things that I *know* make my body work better
gabriel_laddel: for example, taking the EasyUp before going to sleep
mircea_popescu: you have no idea.
gabriel_laddel: othewise I wake up and hate myself, am unable to open my eyes etc ☟︎
mircea_popescu: there's somewhere in the log this observation, you can't learn medicine on yourself.
gabriel_laddel: and the whole process of brushing teeth takes like 1 hour
gabriel_laddel: with easyup: 20 minutes and I'm chipper
mircea_popescu: i had an uncle.
mircea_popescu: he's dead. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: he had diabethes. according to him, he could not take the medicine. except with honey.
mircea_popescu: this is known as fatlogic.
gabriel_laddel: I would lol if it wasn't your uncle.
trinque: you're doing the same thing.
mircea_popescu: you would also lol if it wasn't yourself.
gabriel_laddel: I understand the point you're making, but simply don't find that it applies to my situation.
gabriel_laddel: I've tried setting alarms, getting enough sleep etc.
mircea_popescu: this is fine :)
trinque: this is where he gets dumped in the ocean on mushrooms
gabriel_laddel: none of it works.
trinque: did wonders for my good friend
gabriel_laddel: trinque: !?!?
mircea_popescu: did he end up in france ?
trinque: lol
mircea_popescu: (from west coast, obviously)
gabriel_laddel: trinque: how would this help anything?
gabriel_laddel: trinque: and why would you do this to someone?
trinque: he did it to himself
trinque: no one forced him
gabriel_laddel: ...
gabriel_laddel: what
trinque: he was disoriented and lost track of the beach and ended up rather far out
gabriel_laddel: trinque: could you please tell this story.
gabriel_laddel: oh.
trinque: lol no pun intended
gabriel_laddel: yeah, I'm not really sure how this relates to me.
mircea_popescu: lol
trinque: accepted he might die, then found it within himself to be a man and swim his ass back to what felt like shore, and he did
trinque: !up gabriel_laddel
trinque: the reason I mentioned it is that you are so sure of your model of yourself
gabriel_laddel: yeah, I don't know what this "being a man" stuff is about
trinque: these types of experiences (and they're probably the cheapest version) will rid you of that nonsense in a moment ☟︎
gabriel_laddel: trinque: I've lived with myself for 23 years, and have at no point been able to wake up sanely. I try it with these caffine pills and et viola! I wake up like a normal human!
gabriel_laddel: how else would you read that?
trinque: the fuck; you'd wake up if it meant an enemy bullet otherwise
trinque: or maybe *you* wouldn't but the normal human mind can decide it can do all kinds of things when it must
trinque: if you're bitching about waking up in the morning I think you haven't suffered enough
gabriel_laddel: trinque: you'd think that. but I've missed events I *really* wanted to attend because I wouldn't wake
gabriel_laddel: trinque: people have screamed things of this nature at me when I would miss the little school I went to
trinque: yeah I "never could wake up" as a teenager either
trinque: except I didn't give a fuck to, and my mother woke me up with breakfast and all my shit ready to go
trinque: and I went to a few pretend military camps in the summer and woke up myself every morning while there
trinque: to be grinning with a "fuck you" to the sergeant that'd come busting into my room screaming hoping I was still asleep
trinque: gabriel_laddel: this sounds like "I should've given a fuck" not "I gave a fuck"
gabriel_laddel: trinque: you're missing my point, or I'm not stating it correctly. I've missed things I care deeply about because of sleep
gabriel_laddel: and even with people screaming at me, I still missed things
gabriel_laddel: and all of this is solved by taking a pill before I go to sleep
trinque: the sergeant's screaming had nothing to do with my waking up
trinque: I enjoyed the fuck out of winning at that game so I did
trinque: mircea_popescu: I see your point about education 100% at this moment.
gabriel_laddel: trinque: I enjoyed the fuck out of going to buy $CENSORED and was really excited about it, but ended up sleeping through the allotted time.
gabriel_laddel: but all of this is solved when I take a pill - not just a caffine pill - but a coffee extract?
gabriel_laddel: how on *earth* am I supposed to read this?
gabriel_laddel: that I should take the broomstick approach?
mircea_popescu: you do whatevs you feel like. if you're happy with it carry on, eventually you'll either die or have enough of it.
gabriel_laddel: (for the record, taking a regular caffine pill before sleep doesn't wok)
mircea_popescu: wait, you were gonna go weaboo all over the xbox line but then slept through the opening ? ☟︎
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: something akin to that, yes.
gabriel_laddel: multiple times.
mircea_popescu: i slept through it too.
gabriel_laddel: yeah, but were you excited about it?
mircea_popescu: depends on your definition of excited.
mircea_popescu: in operational terms, i was as excited as you were, apparently.
punkman: gabriel_laddel: doesn't the coffee pill make your sleep weird?
gabriel_laddel: punkman: nah
punkman: I've taken modafinil before sleep a couple times, to make sure I'd wake up for a flight
punkman: was quite tired, had the strangest dreams
mircea_popescu: ew
gabriel_laddel: And this is sort of what I'm getting at - people differ greatly. Modafinil doesn't work for me, some people can't take caffine before bed, some people can't drink and have sex (MP's eugenics article) and some can.
mircea_popescu: that's an age thing.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: what, drinking and sex?
mircea_popescu: myeah
trinque: gabriel_laddel: and how healthy are you
gabriel_laddel: riiight.
punkman: mircea_popescu: dunno, I remember being too drunk to fuck at 17 or whatever
mircea_popescu: well, alcohol is a downer. kids are overexcitable. it's a toss-up.
gabriel_laddel: trinque: I don't know.
gabriel_laddel glances to the side, sees 10 orange crush cans. ☟︎
gabriel_laddel: I'll go with "I treat my body like shit, and do pretty well "
trinque: but you like so totally have this very unique sleep disorder
gabriel_laddel: trinque: ?
trinque: again, the statement is right there.
trinque: might try operating the thing better first
gabriel_laddel: well, that is a fair point, but I don't want to e.g., lose weight.
trinque: what does reality care about what you want
trinque: although, maybe if you can convince yourself that some of your orange crush cans are sleep aids...
trinque: but only some!
gabriel_laddel: oh this is nonsense
gabriel_laddel: look, there are tradeoffs to be made
gabriel_laddel: I've been healthy before, but it sucks
trinque: it was a joke, dingus
gabriel_laddel: oh, derp
gabriel_laddel: trinque: so what is your top 3 favorite substances of abuse?
trinque: so this whole thing is mainly about what you want, which is orange crush and other things, but not being healthy
trinque: I don't tend to "abuse" substances
gabriel_laddel: the problem with being healthy is that I get too turned on by everything.
trinque: though I'm 28; I'm not saying I never did
punkman: lolwut
gabriel_laddel: so yeah, I'm optimizing for something specific.
trinque: not that I'm ancient, but I'm not trying to wreck the thing either
gabriel_laddel: trinque: so what /were/ your top 3.
trinque: I was never one to habitually wreck myself
trinque: if I say "booze" that's saying I got very drunk that month
trinque: weed I smoked daily for a long time
gabriel_laddel: fine, trinque, what are your top 3 favorite substances to use in moderation, with a trip sitter, etc etc
gabriel_laddel: like a responsible adult
trinque: so coffee weed booze by volume
gabriel_laddel: and by preference?
trinque: !up gabriel_laddel
trinque: gabriel_laddel: actually I will admit to using cigs in precisely the same way you were talking about coffee
gabriel_laddel: trinque: ah, so nicotine is one of my favorite as well
trinque: coding, getting the nicotine going and thinking I was "so much more focused"
trinque: it's a bunch of horse shit
gabriel_laddel: !?
trinque: the fucking oxygen you're not getting for one
gabriel_laddel: I no longer smoke, but programming while smoking was always nice.
trinque: your feelings about the thing do not matter
gabriel_laddel: then what the fuck is the point!?
trinque: of what?
gabriel_laddel: anything!
trinque: what point
gabriel_laddel: why are we here if not to have fun
gabriel_laddel: why not program JS for a living
trinque: you're here because some things happened
trinque: why not program JS for a living?
gabriel_laddel: right, but I'm here to have a good time in spite of that
trinque: or suck dick?
gabriel_laddel: hence why cl etc etc
trinque: so do that
gabriel_laddel: omg
trinque: being here to have a good time sounds great
gabriel_laddel: dawwww I'm so curious as to your thoughts on MDMA, cocaine, LSD
gabriel_laddel: mushrooms
gabriel_laddel: do tell, please
trinque: lovely fun all
trinque: what's to tell?
gabriel_laddel: have you done anything really out there, like DMT?
trinque: salvia is pretty out there.
trinque: but not dmt
trinque: *haven't
mircea_popescu: for some reason b-a now reads like reddit. ☟︎
trinque: the thing I'm moderately curious about is what question gabriel_laddel is asking
trinque: but it's certainly getting nowhere and can be left at that.
mircea_popescu: looks like a scoring model.
punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CSIVwAwWIAAlFXH.png ☟︎
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1WbEGae )
mircea_popescu: what the fuck is this "ethicists".
punkman: old women that can't afford motorized dildo?
mircea_popescu: women may speak of ethics now ?!
mircea_popescu: what's next, rabis ?
thestringpuller: https://magnr.com/ << the ponzis continue
deedbot-: [Trilema] The Great Gatsby - http://trilema.com/2015/the-great-gatsby/
mircea_popescu: ;;ud idgi
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=idgi | As two friends chuckled about how fake the scene looked one seemingly naive friend commented "I don't get it", "what's so funny?". At last the IDGI was re-born.
mircea_popescu: !up referredbyloper
referredbyloper: Thanks. I just read the post about phuctor breaking an rsa key.
mircea_popescu: cool.
mircea_popescu: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/08/love_the_way_you_lie_with_me.html << in which tlp understands why castrated pencildicks can't compete.
assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: Love The Way You Lie (With Me) ... ( http://bit.ly/1POwc3Q )
mircea_popescu: way to go. ps : it isn't abuse just because it leaves you outside, feeling inadequate.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25625 @ 0.00053682 = 13.756 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 129300 @ 0.00054382 = 70.3159 BTC [+] {6}
jurov: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 292.32, Best ask: 292.55, Bid-ask spread: 0.23000, Last trade: 292.7, 24 hour volume: 25634.88479045, 24 hour low: 279.7, 24 hour high: 292.98, 24 hour vwap: None
jurov: !up Zuardi
jurov: !t m x.eur
assbot: [MPEX:X.EUR] 1D: 0.00405789 / 0.00406095 / 0.0040661 (264 shares, 1.07 BTC), 7D: 0.00405633 / 0.00416233 / 0.00430867 (2925 shares, 12.17 BTC), 30D: 0.00405633 / 0.00446616 / 0.00478652 (7786 shares, 34.77 BTC)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30463 @ 0.00053682 = 16.3531 BTC [-] {2}
punkman: 14 years ago http://forums.macrumors.com/threads/apples-new-thing-ipod.500/
assbot: Apple's New Thing (iPod) | MacRumors Forums ... ( http://bit.ly/1N0K2PP )
VariaVarietatis: sup mircea_popescu
punkman: "By the grace if Allah upon His faithful servants, your brothers in the Technical Department of GIMF as well as the brothers in Al-Fajr Media Center have developed encryption software to protect your communications on your personal computers and mobile phones."
punkman: "These software packages - Asrar al-Mujahideen, Asrar al-Dardashah, Mobile Encryption and Amn al-Mujahid - are the arrows in your quiver to pierce the eyes of the spies."
punkman: (from al-qaeda magazine)
deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - Bitcoin to top $400 before January 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1170/bitcoin-to-top-400-before-january-2016/#b30
asciilifeform: punkman: rot13.
asciilifeform: punkman: gotta remember that those folks are - for all intents and purposes - retarded.
asciilifeform: ;;later tell gabriel_laddel: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307560 << i could tell much the same tale as you. eventually i discovered that i have a 26-hour circadian cycle and no amount of punishments, risks, dope, lost money, etc. will do A FUCKING THING about it. the only cure is to break out of workschwitz so that to sleep ad libitum. ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 06:26:09; gabriel_laddel: othewise I wake up and hate myself, am unable to open my eyes etc
gribble: The operation succeeded.
punkman: asciilifeform: I thought the language amusing
asciilifeform: punkman: likely, it reads entirely normal in the original
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307497 << actually the most serious problem is that eventually it stops doing anything at all. ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 06:08:24; mircea_popescu: the serious problem for coffee drinkers is the caffeine headache.
asciilifeform: and you can't take a holiday from the dope because then the cheques stop coming.
asciilifeform: (in usa it is rare for any worker type to have serious paid leave)
asciilifeform: 2 wk/yr is considered princely.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307550 << this is nonsense and mircea_popescu knows it. do your gurlz take bc pill ? iron supplement? BUT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE CAR111!!1 ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 06:24:45; mircea_popescu: tell you what, if your mods were actually improvements THEY WOULD BE IN THE CAR.
asciilifeform: perhaps the gods meant them to be anemic and nonstop pregnant..
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307565 << in the end, everybody gets to be equally dead. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 06:26:56; mircea_popescu: he's dead.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307597 << WITHOUT EXCEPTION this kind of thing is said by people who, if you were to wire them to the mains to get the truth, will admit that they see any disease that doesn't show up on a blood test or xray as 'in your mind' ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 06:32:53; trinque: these types of experiences (and they're probably the cheapest version) will rid you of that nonsense in a moment
asciilifeform: tlp et al are right in a sense: depression, weird circadian rhythms, etc. are not diseases in the sense that leukemia is. all of these people would happily live without dope, on some different planet. the problem is that they cannot move to this planet.
asciilifeform: if gabriel_laddel actually could sleep ad libitum - that is, WHENEVER he wants, FOR AS LONG AS he wants - i suspect that he wouldn't ask for dope of any kind.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307622 << i never grasped this custom: why is it necessary to buy $item the day it comes out? let the other schmucks test...? ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 06:44:47; mircea_popescu: wait, you were gonna go weaboo all over the xbox line but then slept through the opening ?
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307706 << l0l, why? because dope? ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 07:07:19; mircea_popescu: for some reason b-a now reads like reddit.
asciilifeform: imho smart-people-talking-about-dope doesn't read quite the same as stupid-people-talking-about-dope.
asciilifeform: because smart-people-talking-about-$item doesn't read quite the same as stupid-people-talking-about-$item. for any possible $item.
asciilifeform: see also:
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-08-2014#808005 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-08-2014 03:08:03; asciilifeform: busy as a bee << funny that they show an idiot sow scrubbing, and not, e.g, paul erdos crapping out theorems
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307710 << see also: ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 07:14:09; punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CSIVwAwWIAAlFXH.png
asciilifeform: !s mocsny
assbot: 35 results for 'mocsny' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=mocsny
asciilifeform: who predicted that, if realistic sex robot is ever thought to be possible (and it is intrinsically a for-men item, as there is not likely to appear a dominance-robot and certainly not a wealth-robot) , there will be mass upheaval. ☟︎☟︎
diametric: asciilifeform: check it out http://www.thermaltronics.com/products.php
assbot: Thermaltronics Soldering: Products ... ( http://bit.ly/1RvxgrQ )
diametric: asciilifeform: look familiar?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18000 @ 0.00053668 = 9.6602 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: diametric: metcal?!
asciilifeform reads specs, discovers that indeed it claims to be a metcal clone
asciilifeform: diametric: they have tweezers, even.
mircea_popescu: hhhhola!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform must be bought same day because poor impulse control (must have) and poor social skills (this is the only time you'll meet people you can talk to this year)
asciilifeform: buenos dias señor popescu
mircea_popescu: que tal ?
mats: https://pax.grsecurity.net/docs/PaXTeam-H2HC15-RAP-RIP-ROP.pdf ☟︎
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1LVp5Fj )
asciilifeform: viva la revolución por siempre y para siempre
asciilifeform: or somethinglikethat.
asciilifeform: mats: again with the 'let's seeeekk00000r3 the c-machine with magic pixie dust'
asciilifeform: dontcha ever tire of it ?
mats: you know grsec subtracts more from kernel than it adds?
diametric: asciilifeform: its not a clone.
diametric: asciilifeform: the engineers that created metcal left metcal, and formed thermaltronics when the patent expired
mats: if you find the time, it is far more readable than selinux
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 294.52, Best ask: 294.64, Bid-ask spread: 0.12000, Last trade: 294.52, 24 hour volume: 33147.35330584, 24 hour low: 280.35, 24 hour high: 295.99, 24 hour vwap: None
diametric: so technically, the thermaltronics is more metcal than metcal is now.
mircea_popescu: o look at that. resistences evaporating.
asciilifeform: diametric: nifty, we oughta buy one of these.
mircea_popescu: let's dust off some old quote.
diametric: asciilifeform: was thinking about it
asciilifeform: mats: take, for instance: 'encrypt/decrypt return address by a random key.' this is TYPICAL microshitism. the only actual result of this kind of thinking is that shit gets ever harder to debug, and new hidey-holes for exploitation are born.
asciilifeform: mats: try to understand what i am objecting to - you might learn something.
asciilifeform: there was an old comic where a schoolteacher says 'i always wear a condom when conducting lessons'
mircea_popescu: well... looking for where i said teh poor usg is between rock and hard place, if it misses but once it's fucked, i instead found http://trilema.com/2012/why-smpoe-is-worth-more-than-mtgox/
assbot: Why S.MPOE is worth more than MtGox on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1MMSgXx )
asciilifeform: this is what all the various 'stack canaries', 'encrypted return addresses', etc. sounds like to me.
mircea_popescu: ima call it good.
mircea_popescu: lest i get lost in a pile of awesome and do no work but grin for the rest of the sunday.
asciilifeform: https://xkcd.com/463 << found it
assbot: xkcd: Voting Machines ... ( http://bit.ly/1MMSkGD )
mircea_popescu: "Asrar al-Mujahideen, Asrar al-Dardashah" aaaahahahah.
mircea_popescu: next time, stick to el-zip-ibn-lzw, brothers.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: recall your 'homebrew crypto' article ?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307743 << it sounded to me like the same. in fact, it is likely that boys have a non-24 hour rythm with significant incidence (if you think about it - how do you design the male to maximize its fucjing and hunting opportunities ?) ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 16:04:16; asciilifeform: ;;later tell gabriel_laddel: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307560 << i could tell much the same tale as you. eventually i discovered that i have a 26-hour circadian cycle and no amount of punishments, risks, dope, lost money, etc. will do A FUCKING THING about it. the only cure is to break out of workschwitz so that to sleep ad libitum.
mircea_popescu: i do.
asciilifeform: aha. when left to my own devices, i'll cycle through the whole face of the clock.
mircea_popescu: right ?
mircea_popescu: so you'll find all the animals asleep at some time.
asciilifeform: THIS is why i covet 'sleep ad libitum' more than anything else.
asciilifeform: more than dirigibles, harems, etc.
mircea_popescu: i am currently waking 2pm, fancy that.
mircea_popescu: and to grok the true sign of luxury : i have an auction in eulora in 20 minutes. which i woke naturally for.
asciilifeform: this is also why i do not piss on 'one day my real life will begin!' fantasy with the same abandon as tlp and mircea_popescu
asciilifeform: because i can easily see a rational mechanism for 'i am not now really alive but if $condition then i will be.'
mircea_popescu: your parents aren't supposed to understand YOU. they're supposed to understand the world.
mircea_popescu: you is your job.
asciilifeform: parents?
mircea_popescu: well tlp in this case. but the mechanism of pissing on X myth is parenting.
mircea_popescu: in fact, THIS is what parenting is. pissing on myths.
asciilifeform: i was conjecturing that this particular myth has a kernel of truth in it, just as the stories of 'great flood' are said to
mircea_popescu: all myths have a kernel of truth in em. the idea is to select a set that works.
mircea_popescu: kinda the point of that entire thing with trinque yest. "oh, 100% placebo works for me when i tihnk it's 75% drug". good for you, continue.
asciilifeform: !s placebocin
assbot: 5 results for 'placebocin' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=placebocin
asciilifeform: (from uncle al's works)
mircea_popescu: aha. the effect is not exactly unknown, in all its batshit crazy splendour.
mircea_popescu: or should i say "unmodelable" ? obscurantist perhaps ? :D
asciilifeform: most brightly illustrated by the savages who could be 'prayed to death'
asciilifeform: there are, incidentally, promising models for it. but the thing went nowhere because science died.
mircea_popescu: no. they are promising for the same reason 15yo hos "are" promising.
mircea_popescu: they're not models. and once they try to become models they quit promising.
asciilifeform: prolly ought have said 'were promising.'
asciilifeform: it is a past-tense thing.
mats: asciilifeform: grsec, afaik, has had _exactly one_ publicly disclosed vuln, to my knowledge
mircea_popescu: but not because of any sort of co-incidence.
asciilifeform: mats: my objection is ecological rather than immediate, understand.
mats: results speak for themselves, despite hand waving as to 'pixie dust', which is outright misleading imo
asciilifeform: mats: i object to the entire pattern of thought on display there.
mats: noted
mircea_popescu: mats but what do you know of the unknown ones ?
asciilifeform: the result FROM MY CHAIR is that the code is MORE COMPLEX
mircea_popescu: i mean, your data is your data, ok, but what does it say ?
asciilifeform: this is ipso facto a bad thing.
mircea_popescu: "grsec has had much lower burn rate than the other packages because there has been less independent research put into it"
mircea_popescu: vs "grsec is actually better code"
asciilifeform: and the PREMISES are retarded. they take it as a GIVEN that there WILL be overflows, stack smashes, etc.
asciilifeform: that these are thing we OUGHT to live with.
asciilifeform: as concepts.
mats: 13:28:25 <+mats> you know grsec subtracts more from kernel than it adds?
asciilifeform: mats: if you'd like to link to, e.g., diffs, to demonstrate this, i'll read.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307748 << well yeah but i meant in withdrawal. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 16:07:26; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307497 << actually the most serious problem is that eventually it stops doing anything at all.
asciilifeform: ah yes.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307753 << jesus fuck he fucking butchered me. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 16:09:55; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307550 << this is nonsense and mircea_popescu knows it. do your gurlz take bc pill ? iron supplement? BUT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE CAR111!!1
asciilifeform: mats: also we ought to try to agree on some notion of 'results'. for me, 'results' includes not only 'how many 0days published' but also 'what the code i MUST READ TO GRASP THE SYSTEM actually looks like'
mircea_popescu: i will now attempt to mout a defense with my disembodied, bloody remains!
asciilifeform: l0l
asciilifeform: take some reconstitutory dopez!
mircea_popescu: so asciilifeform : a) the iron because they're broken (ie, not equal to the design) ; the bc is, TECHNICALLY, part of the car. aftermarket shocks.
asciilifeform: aha. dope, as correctly used, is aftermarket shocks.
mircea_popescu: fu!
asciilifeform: or jets. or parachute. take your pick.
mircea_popescu: i got nothing!
asciilifeform: where was that rhyme...
asciilifeform: 'my candle burns at both ends, / it will not last the night, / but ah, my foes! / and oh, my friends! / it gives a lovely light.'
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: nb.
asciilifeform: and yes, for every meth-taking erdos or wiener, there are ten million nobodies who think that their sulfurous rancid turd burning at both ends is a candle with lovely light, yes.
mircea_popescu: no. the irony is, they think "there was nothing [else] i could do."
mircea_popescu: because this is how "think" goes.
mircea_popescu: "nobloody could have predictits!"
mats: well, offhand, disables read/writes to /dev/kmem, /dev/mem, /dev/port, model specific registers, kexec, module loading, privileged io (ioperm and iopl calls), unprivileged PERF_EVENTS usage, restricts /proc, sysfs, and debugfs, ...
mats: if i find diffs, ill let you know
asciilifeform: mats: disables how? and for whom ?
asciilifeform: on an ordinary linux box you already need root for these
asciilifeform: (with the possible exception of /proc - but i gotta run strace! what, i have to sudo to strace now?!)
mats: many of these protects kernel from root
mats: i haven't read through all the patchsets, so can't say exhaustively which does what, etc
asciilifeform: 'protects from root' what a crock of shit
asciilifeform: yes, i get that this is the fashion, 'box with no root'
asciilifeform: it is a crock of shit, because the pretense is trivially shattered in 1,001 ways
asciilifeform: (can i talk to the nic? does it have dma?)
mats: https://lkml.org/lkml/2015/3/13/774 ?
assbot: LKML: Matthew Garrett: [PATCH 04/12] x86: Lock down IO port access when trusted_kernel is true ... ( http://bit.ly/1GAWd4H )
asciilifeform: mats: only thing is, i can do arbitrary dma on just about any box where i can access ~any~ pci device's standard mmio space - no need to screw with the pci config regs
asciilifeform: (e.g., most nics have a - documented or not - provision for dma)
asciilifeform: and yes, you can fandango over ~all~ of physical ram, typically the thing does not care where you put its ring buffer - and you don't need to access pci config to move it
asciilifeform: but if you enjoy putting a steel door on a drywall room - who am i to say no.
asciilifeform: also - as mats knows - or ought to know - 'trusted' is a usg shibboleth for 'resists attempts at understanding or modification by putative owner'
asciilifeform: as in 'trusted platform module'
asciilifeform: or microshit's 'trusted computing.'
asciilifeform: ;;google treacherous computing
gribble: Can You Trust Your Computer? - GNU Project - Free Software ...: <http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/can-you-trust.en.html>; Microsoft's Treacherous Computing — Free Software Foundation ...: <https://www.fsf.org/news/treacherous.html>; Digital Restrictions Management and Treacherous Computing ...: <http://www.fsf.org/campaigns/drm.html>
asciilifeform: ^ see also rms on subj.
BingoBoingo: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307364 << I babysat the classroom while the lectures came in over the projector. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 03:11:07; mats: did a stint in pharmacy school, rite?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: you missed a long and mighty dope thread
BingoBoingo: reading through it nao
BingoBoingo: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307357 << Caffeine, vitamin B, and sleep are fine. Changing the "set point" of the dopamine and norephedrine pathways seems shitty ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 03:10:08; mats: curious about BBs opinion on the subject of moda, and more broadly, 'nootropics'
mats: i can't say i know enough to address your claims
asciilifeform: this is not a bad time to point out that dope tolerance is not a magical punishment straight from god, but a physical mechanism. which could, conceivably, be dealt with.
asciilifeform: there was some work in this direction, but for reasons which are quite clear (politics of u.s. pharma business) it never went anywhere.
mats: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307775 << relatedly, https://vimeo.com/79173606 lol ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 16:29:35; asciilifeform: who predicted that, if realistic sex robot is ever thought to be possible (and it is intrinsically a for-men item, as there is not likely to appear a dominance-robot and certainly not a wealth-robot) , there will be mass upheaval.
assbot: VR TENGA DEMO (2): Oculus Rift+Novint Falcon+TENGA on Vimeo ... ( http://bit.ly/1WcAAtm )
asciilifeform: mats: l0l! what is that
mats: demo of 'novint falcon' game controller
mats: we r p close to rendition of virtual fuckbot through e.g. oculus rift+fleshlight+'novint falcon'
jurov: "there will be mass upheaval" << sauce?
jurov: and why there was no similar upheaval when free porn became available?
deedbot-: [Trilema] And there was another auction, and there was another record, and so on. - http://trilema.com/2015/and-there-was-another-auction-and-there-was-another-record-and-so-on/
mats: ben_vulpes has briefly mentioned before, but: window system in haskell in 1200 lines https://github.com/xmonad/xmonad ☟︎
assbot: xmonad/xmonad · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1R6Qggs )
jurov: misread as widget system, got excited for a moment
mats: =[
ben_vulpes: xmonad sucks as much as haskell sucks, for the simple reason that one must load haskell's horseshit into head to use it.
ben_vulpes: stumpwm is marginally better, and...
ben_vulpes: granted, 18kloc.
deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.66000000 BTC on 'No' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jan 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1216/bitcoin-to-top-600-before-jan-2016/#b13
mircea_popescu: "|hey - heres an idea Apple - rather than enter the world of gimmicks and toys, why dont you spend a little more time sorting out your pathetically expensive and crap server line up?
mircea_popescu: or are you really aiming to become a glorified consumer gimmicks firm?"
mircea_popescu: ahaha that thread's gold.
mircea_popescu: Oct 23, 2001
mircea_popescu: "I still can't believe this! All this hype for something so ridiculous! Who cares about an MP3 player? I want something new! I want them to think differently!
mircea_popescu: Why oh why would they do this?! It's so wrong! It's so stupid!"
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307758 << what is this obscurantist claptrap! if i can't model it adequately and measure it experimentaly it's in your mind! ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 16:14:41; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307597 << WITHOUT EXCEPTION this kind of thing is said by people who, if you were to wire them to the mains to get the truth, will admit that they see any disease that doesn't show up on a blood test or xray as 'in your mind'
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307764 << no, not because dope. because substanceless (ha!) lines of five words each delineating vague posturing of no further interest. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 16:22:46; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307706 << l0l, why? because dope?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307775 << 0 upheaval. what fucking upheaval ? ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 16:29:35; asciilifeform: who predicted that, if realistic sex robot is ever thought to be possible (and it is intrinsically a for-men item, as there is not likely to appear a dominance-robot and certainly not a wealth-robot) , there will be mass upheaval.
mircea_popescu: hey, where did everyone go! let's argue about things!
mircea_popescu: Wot Rank15 / 7,591 << ha-HA!
ben_vulpes: today i learned about the ongoing lng conversions in the shipping industry
mircea_popescu: aha ?
mircea_popescu: did you get to the entire crazy that is "oil quality", how it relates to its density, and what "a barrle" ACTUALLY means ?
mircea_popescu: guaranteed entertainment for a year's time in smart go-getter types.
ben_vulpes: no i have not!
ben_vulpes: is "oil quality" something other than j/g? ☟︎
mircea_popescu: myeah.
mircea_popescu: oil quality is, i daresay, something like beauty in adolescent human females.
mircea_popescu: for sure more male time / money went into the former to date.
mircea_popescu: it is certainly a valid, heavy duty phd. "1915-2015, a century of "oil quality"". THAT is something i'd respect.
ben_vulpes: i have never successfully run down what heresy chevron puts into their techron
ben_vulpes: makes me fear for my 35 year old engine.
mircea_popescu: your car is older than you ?
ben_vulpes: i actually drive out to the rural areas to find low ethanol fuels.
ben_vulpes: significantly!
mircea_popescu: a few %s isn't significant anymore :D
ben_vulpes: 's more than a few.
ben_vulpes: dunno that people here realize how young i actually am.
mircea_popescu: weren't you like 28 or something ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49649 @ 0.00053483 = 26.5538 BTC [-] {2}
mod6: So a new version of my V (version 99999 K) has been posted to the website and the ML.
mod6: http://thebitcoin.foundation/v/V-20151025.tar.gz && http://thebitcoin.foundation/v/V-20151025.tar.gz.mod6.sig
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Mkqpn9 )
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Mkqpnd )
mod6: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-October/000173.html
assbot: [BTC-dev] mod6's V [in perl] version 99999 K ... ( http://bit.ly/1Mkqqre )
mod6: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-October/000174.html ☟︎
assbot: [BTC-dev] mod6's V [in perl] version 99999 K with Cucumber Tests & Testing Guide Included ... ( http://bit.ly/1Mkqrv9 )
mod6: Enjoy! Let me know if you have questions or run into any problems. Thanks!
mircea_popescu: cool bans
ben_vulpes: intel always remembers :P
ben_vulpes: tasting guido included!
mircea_popescu: kik
mircea_popescu: "There is a terrible, terrible, ugly truth underlying all of this, and that is that taxes don't matter to a government that can print money. The government collected $2.4T and spent $3.6T. They'll take what they get, of course, but if they had collected $2T or $3T you/they would not have noticed. The country isn't a household, it is a bank, and as long as the rest of the world believes "we're good for it," then we a
mircea_popescu: re. When it decides otherwise, look out. The US will go Lehman Brothers faster than you can say Bear Stearns."
mircea_popescu: heh.
ben_vulpes: mod6: decided to leave auto-seal-retrieval in there?
mod6: yeah, seals, and patches, but not wots. ☟︎
ben_vulpes: ah
mod6: as discussed before
ben_vulpes: i saw stan barking about autoprocurement of things and must've misremembered
mircea_popescu: so check!
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307928 << how many lines is ~haskell itself~ ? and of what. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 19:22:13; mats: ben_vulpes has briefly mentioned before, but: window system in haskell in 1200 lines https://github.com/xmonad/xmonad
asciilifeform: THIS MATTERS for fuck's sake
asciilifeform: is it so hard to grasp..?
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i did! http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-10-2015#1303531 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-10-2015 17:04:18; mircea_popescu: well, i got my link about 500x faster than if i searched for it. somehow.
mod6: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-10-2015#1296530 && http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-10-2015#1296543 ☝︎☝︎
assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 23:47:42; mod6: ah. ok. i see. so let the user populate the wots on their own, other stuff, no prob.
assbot: Logged on 12-10-2015 00:20:41; assbot: Logged on 11-10-2015 23:39:50; mod6: One can do this for sure. The idea was, if the user just has the scrpit, and nothing else, they could sync all the latest wots/seals/vpatches from a mirror.
jurov: "the Glasgow Haskell compiler is written in Haskell: a 100,000-line application. "
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: sure and how many lines is sbcl, and what is it written in?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: sbcl is an interesting beast. there are really two compilers (and before anyone asks, their semantic idempotence is neither proven nor provable) - a bootstrapper, in c, and a battlefield variant, in itself.
mircea_popescu: it is written in unmovable half ton steel cabinets, which makes it ok.
asciilifeform: mno that was zetalisp.
mircea_popescu: aok
mircea_popescu: so i could wipe this thinkpad and put lispos on it ?
asciilifeform: in principle! some schmuck actually ported sbcl to x86 'bare arse'
ben_vulpes: nah you'll have to buy the same computer that gabriel_laddel has
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes so it's not really half ton unmovable cabinets.
mircea_popescu: they're movable in that they don't exiswt.
asciilifeform: but you would actually have to buy the same computer he had
asciilifeform: (1990s)
asciilifeform: this is a result of the tower of babel situation re: pc hardware, rather than anything else.
ben_vulpes: iirc he's targeting something you can buy from dell today.
asciilifeform: dell today, gone tomorrow
mircea_popescu: ^
asciilifeform: sop.
ben_vulpes: and with your combined mirrors...
mircea_popescu: one carly fiorina away from falling in the shitter./
ben_vulpes: "w0nder twin powers, activate!"
asciilifeform: i have opteron boxes from dell. afaik even this is out of print.
ben_vulpes eagerly awaits mslinux
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307946 << no upheaval because there is not the vaguest inkling of a threat of anything like a robotic replacement for chix ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 19:38:45; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307775 << 0 upheaval. what fucking upheaval ?
mircea_popescu: are you kidding ? "chix" in the sense of "out of the street human female" were replaced cca 2005.
mircea_popescu: who wants "a woman" ? nobody.
asciilifeform: plenty of folks
mircea_popescu: not so.
mircea_popescu: the poor arab beta boys want a RICH woman.
asciilifeform: they just 'aren't people' on mircea_popescu's planet
mircea_popescu: but the woman is an unwelcome addition to the resources.
mircea_popescu: and otherwise, people want a teenager.
asciilifeform: homo redditicus would kill worlds for one, no ?
mircea_popescu: "woman" as in, overweight, with college debt, with bad habits, with the entire baggage of having watched as much as 5 mionutes of for-women tv is worth less than a pig.
mircea_popescu: no.
mircea_popescu: if homo redditicus would pay as much as five borrowed dollars for "a woman" the us would look like argentina.
asciilifeform: for the bloke with bad-habits, baggage, debt, tv - what other thing is possible ?
mircea_popescu: but this is what "a woman" means.
mircea_popescu: she literally can't add.
jurov: reddit dudes are fighting to get women? that's new for me
jurov: asciilifeform: for any example?
jurov: *got any example
asciilifeform: jurov: they are not, strictly speaking
mircea_popescu: jurov the only example i can think of is bingoboingo's fake story
asciilifeform: any more than the ants in your cellar are 'fighting to take your house'
mircea_popescu: and notice that it was interestinfg to them PRECISELY because a) he did what they don't do (go for a woman) and b) it blew up in a way threy like.
mircea_popescu: the only marketable xx item in the us is, "15 yo runaway".
mircea_popescu: otherwise, no.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307955 << it isn't a pure matter of joules, on account of envirowhinerism being a thing. also gotta have 'sufficiently low sulfur' etc. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 19:56:22; ben_vulpes: is "oil quality" something other than j/g?
asciilifeform: at least for usa/eu markets
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it is on account of refineries being pipes, with turns.
asciilifeform: this also.
mircea_popescu: that's all there is. now you gotta know an infinity about the fluid.
mircea_popescu: so there's epicly many layers to it.
asciilifeform: this is even (especially?) a problem for coal. if you have noncombustibles in there (and, increasingly, you do) you get ruined furnace, downtime, outages.
mircea_popescu: they actually have a liquefaction process (in the civilised world, not in the us) that significantly reduces the intellectual relevancy of this
asciilifeform: fischer-tropsch is back in fashion ?!
mircea_popescu: but one thing people DO NOT appreciate is that if i had to find the "lost meta-engineers" alf wants to have been in software\
mircea_popescu: they are probably mostly oenologizing oil.
asciilifeform: as they were in 1944.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform muchly improved.
mircea_popescu: as they were ever since 1885 or so
asciilifeform: aha, catalysts have come a long way.
jurov: asciilifeform: stuff like hydrocracking
asciilifeform admits to quietly following this subject
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307976 << this looks spiffy but what is a cucumber test ? ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 20:03:56; mod6: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-October/000174.html
mircea_popescu: incidentally, THIS is where good math would show before biotech
mircea_popescu: and they mostly don't have it even here.
mod6: asciilifeform: Cucumber tests are automated tests that will run specified scenarios against v.pl and assert various outcomes. [cucumber.io]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha. new catalyst takes perhaps a day to try.
asciilifeform: (vs a protein-diddler)
mircea_popescu: more importantly : have you tried it ?
mircea_popescu: how do you know when you've tried it ? what shape was it ? etc.
mod6: For instance, I assert all of the appropriate antecedents and decendants for each vpatch, etc.
asciilifeform: aha.
mircea_popescu: much easier to approach, and still hanging.
asciilifeform: mod6: neato
mircea_popescu: it's certainly impressive how that part works mod6
mircea_popescu: i've been learning a lot watching :D
asciilifeform: mod6: one aspect which i never fully fleshed out imho needs some thought: when the thing is hooked to a live wwwtron, what is to stop idiots from tossing in arbitrary signed crud from #b-a logs into it ?
mircea_popescu: i thought we had a header
mod6: i like it a lot. its sort of too bad that the step definitions behind the "gherkin" or cucumber scenarios are written in Perl, python may have been easier for people to digest. But I'm not as up too par on that.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what header
asciilifeform: diff's header ?
mircea_popescu: omg have i hallucinated yes
mod6: Ruby or others can be used as well...and I've only just started using Ruby as well. (which makes me feel dirty lol)
asciilifeform: plenty of things that don't belong (e.g., nonvdiffs, vdiffs that were not meant for use in anger) have same header.
punkman: asciilifeform: well for deedbot I hashed and checked for dupes
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how would that be in "random signed crud" ?
asciilifeform: 'random' is overstatement.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> it's certainly impressive how that part works mod6 << thx!
mircea_popescu: so then no, this is policy.
mircea_popescu: do not sign in the manner of v stuff you don't intend to be in v
mircea_popescu: or else it's your ass.
asciilifeform: point is that a malefactor could probably find something public with which to create headache if the mechanism 'takes anything signed like-so'
mircea_popescu: why, because things are signed by rabid yaks ?
asciilifeform: ideally not.
mircea_popescu: so do not do that!
asciilifeform: but my current thought is that antipatches will have to be a thing, yes.
mircea_popescu: huh ?
asciilifeform: e.g. funkenstein's latest patch will need an antipatch
mircea_popescu: no it won't. his branch will be ignored.
asciilifeform: (if his key remains in play)
asciilifeform: ^
mircea_popescu: this is why mod6's leafing is important.
asciilifeform: but if funkenstein learns the ropes and remains a contributor, he will need to antipatch himself.
mircea_popescu: "you can fuck up at most once per trb release"
mod6: yeah. that patch won't be added into the mirror. now if someone wants to try out his patch locally, they'll have to pull his vpatch, and add his key to the wot manually and then see what happens if they want to press out a branch that includes that vpatch.
mircea_popescu: ^
mircea_popescu: splendid design like that, what's wrong with it.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-10-2015#1307987 << this is the right thing. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-10-2015 20:18:43; mod6: yeah, seals, and patches, but not wots.
mircea_popescu: right.
asciilifeform: the only item that requires manual handling in a correct vtron is keys.
mircea_popescu: you must also be able to describe which "version" you aim.
asciilifeform: naturally
mircea_popescu: well that solves it then.
asciilifeform: (considering that there is not a meaningful default for it, even in principle)
mircea_popescu: exactly. more importantly considering what this gives us :
mircea_popescu: 99c53387aa14a176190880cb00c97fc950133f5af10f3ac is "gimp-v1.0" whereas 9cfb1fc045b401102d02b4ddf581efc7d84e810df28bf80 is "bitcoin v 1.8"
mircea_popescu: and i can even use the same trusted set of keys.
mircea_popescu: and it will know what to pull from either chain
mircea_popescu: ye ken ?
asciilifeform: naturally
mircea_popescu: and if key X took a fart in gimp-v-0.9 big deal, this won't see it anyway.
asciilifeform: it'll be more of a thing once we get the sha1 out of the loop though.
mircea_popescu: yes.
mircea_popescu: the huge problem tho, and im sure you have also been thinking on this on the quiet
mircea_popescu: is that if you set it to what ? sha512 ? little alf v2.0 will come in here and fuck your skull in 20 years
mircea_popescu: "oh how could you pick sha256!!1"
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i solved this.
mircea_popescu: "simmer down wildman, it was GREAT in 2015!"
mircea_popescu: "it's 2035 gramps!"
asciilifeform: you will see how, and laugh, i predict.
mircea_popescu: aha ?
mircea_popescu: cool.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-10-2015#1298917 << thread where i sorta spilled the beans on this. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 14-10-2015 20:12:02; asciilifeform: i suppose i spoiled 'v' a month before publishing, and no one noticed it, so perhaps i ought to 'spoil' this one
mircea_popescu: aha you want it scriptable
asciilifeform: yes.
asciilifeform: no hardcoded algos, other than arithmetical. period.
mircea_popescu: perhaps. i dun see it yet, but this is mostly because i am not a coder myself.
mod6 thinks ont his
asciilifeform: prototype is essentially an 'rpn calculator' where you can push bignums on the stack and instruction 0x01 --> 'pop two, multiply, push back' or 0x70 --> modular-exponentiate, etc.
asciilifeform: the beauty is that with a few hundred bytes of overhead, it can eat standard gpg messages
asciilifeform: (working on reducing this)
mircea_popescu: if you are going to do this, you nut
mircea_popescu: why the fuck not make the machine ternary.
asciilifeform: gnarly on existing iron. doable
asciilifeform experimented.
mircea_popescu: who cares
mircea_popescu: so you mean my p4 will take 0.03 seconds instead of the 0.00007 ?
asciilifeform: cause all of a sudden a shr or shl is O(N) !
mircea_popescu: omaigerd.
asciilifeform: you wanne live with that?
mircea_popescu: what bytes ? i have 2jiggabits free
asciilifeform: time dimension.
mircea_popescu: you do not use shr or shl. you use proper algos.
asciilifeform: and they are made of what?
mircea_popescu: does trinary suck ?
asciilifeform: on a binary machine? yes
mircea_popescu: why is this a binary machine ?
asciilifeform: to be clear, i was speaking of emulated computer, not a physical one
mircea_popescu: i understand that. why is this machine of mine binary!
asciilifeform: given that i presently lack a fab
mircea_popescu: if i put two registers together, have i now made a trinary register ?
asciilifeform: take a sharp pencil and work out how base-n arithmetic is done on a base-m box.
mircea_popescu: leaving aside the technical talk, understand the high level strategic considerations.
asciilifeform: and what this costs.
mircea_popescu: IF we are ever going to do this, THIS is the place to test it.
mircea_popescu: the value is relatively small - oh noes, enemy is gonna mess up our code ? so yoy mean like on github ?!
mircea_popescu: the damage is immense - imagine, now they gotta learn ternary to even approach this!
mircea_popescu: find a way to do it in ternary you won a major engagement.
asciilifeform admits that he was very tempted to do precisely this. but went in for 'absolute minimum of moving parts' for the current experimental item, for reasons which are not difficult to understand
mircea_popescu: i can see the logic, yes
mircea_popescu: but this logic is better!
asciilifeform: aha but now can't use bignum stack from pgp 1.4, etc.
mircea_popescu: why not ?
mircea_popescu: stop telling me "can't" you'll get yourself fired
asciilifeform: because this is no longer emulating an ideal ternary box
mircea_popescu: what sort of job reversal is this!
asciilifeform: it'd be 'cheating'
mircea_popescu: so cheat.
asciilifeform: then in what sense is the result 'emulated ternary box' ?
asciilifeform: simply that we're encoding constants as ternaries ?
mircea_popescu: ideally that the algos are written for a ternary box
mircea_popescu: which is then WELL emulated on binary box.
asciilifeform: my understanding was that mircea_popescu is asking for a virtual version of something that could later be siliconized.
mircea_popescu: yup
jurov: why not just use urbit, gotta stand on shoulder of giants :D
mircea_popescu: word :D
asciilifeform: anyway it is inevitable that there will be multiple generations of this. it is a very thick mental cock that folks will have to slowly and methodically dilate for before it can fully park.
mircea_popescu: yep.
mircea_popescu: just gotta get clear where it's headed and what we want.
asciilifeform: i can already picture the reaction folks will have to my sha512 that takes 10,001 times longer than the customary one
mircea_popescu: fuck them
mircea_popescu: i can already picture the reaction "folks" will have to anything, from you going naked in the street to you making chirality engine.
mircea_popescu: forget about that.
mircea_popescu: and stop spamming wikipedia or what was it.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37630 @ 0.00053988 = 20.3157 BTC [+] {3}
asciilifeform: lolwat
mircea_popescu: didn't you get banned for spamming something or the other
mircea_popescu: stackoverflow ?
asciilifeform: bunchaplaces. but it was always 'we oughta ban' vs. proper ban
asciilifeform: (perhaps tlp could ascertain exactly why)
asciilifeform: i suppose even this gets 'meta'-d
mircea_popescu: i rcall one ridiculous instance was something about i dunno, b-a related somehow
asciilifeform: it was when some schmuck made a page on mircea_popescu at pediwikia
mircea_popescu: the specifics escape me. burt anyway
mircea_popescu: oh! that it was!
mircea_popescu: see ?
asciilifeform bbl, off to do some maths
mircea_popescu: for bonus points : shoots all possible intel "optimization" in the head
mircea_popescu: with a caterpillar combine.
mircea_popescu: this, even if only prototyped, is well in excess of a billion dollars in nsa budget costs. which is, and will for a while be, quite sufficident.
mircea_popescu: or as usgavin_fucktardessen would say, "i always advocated engagement".
mircea_popescu: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/09/hot_sports_reporter_ines_sainz.html << daily tlp win.
assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: Hot Sports Reporter Ines Sainz Was Sexually Harassed ... ( http://bit.ly/1MkAiBg )
mircea_popescu: "What you want is to be able to behave sexy, or rude, or ridiculous, or offensive-- and still demand to be seen the way you want to be seen.
mircea_popescu: It may be unfair, but it is the most important fact of human existence: people exist independently of you."
mircea_popescu: Note the power set up. All you fools think that female reporters are in the locker rooms because it is some sort of measure of equality, "why should the males get the best interviews?" that this is somehow a success for equality, something that women had to struggle to earn, and you think that because you were told that.
mircea_popescu: Women didn't earn this over the resistance of an old boy network; the media conglomerates decided it would be awesome to televise a hyperfemale in a locker room with a nearly naked hypermale and pretend there's no sexuality implied. So anything that goes wrong is between individuals, nothing to do with the Machine.
mircea_popescu: CFNM, right there on ESPN.
mircea_popescu: mmmmyeah.
jurov: http://arstechnica.com/business/2015/10/this-11-year-old-is-selling-cryptographically-secure-passwords-for-2-each/
assbot: This 11-year-old is selling cryptographically secure passwords for $2 each | Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1Xse2r3 )
jurov: now that's business
trinque: As of now, she said she's sold "around 30" in total, including in-person sales. << Thanks, grandma!
mircea_popescu: younger than usagi
mircea_popescu: anyone recall that idiot's business idea ?
trinque: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-05-2013#58527 << this thing? ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 28-05-2013 04:34:42; usagi: Everything TU.SILVER does is better than any other similar business in the community, and I guarantee it will be that way forever, because, I have my legacy to consider
mod6: <+trinque> As of now, she said she's sold "around 30" in total, including in-person sales. << Thanks, grandma! << haha
mircea_popescu: nono
mircea_popescu: he had a "business" to make 8kb or larger rsa keys for "Cusomers" ☟︎
mircea_popescu: "And you need not go further than one of our stores on midnight at the end of the month. And it's real interesting to watch, about 11 p.m., customers start to come in and shop, fill their grocery basket with basic items, baby formula, milk, bread, eggs,and continue to shop and mill about the store until midnight, when electronic -- government electronic benefits cards get activated and then the checkout starts and occu
mircea_popescu: rs. And our sales for those first few hours on the first of the month are substantially and significantly higher."
mircea_popescu: ^ walmart ceo
mircea_popescu: bwahaha
mircea_popescu: "The global capitalist system is approaching an apocalyptic zero point... comprised by an ecological crisis, the consequences of a biogenetic revolution, imbalances within the system itself, and the explosive growth of social divisions and exclusions."
mircea_popescu: gotta hand it to the socialist mind. after having spent 50 years explaining how the predictable, obvious and necessary failures of both socialist systems seen to date "aren't really failures of socialism - because the nazis were evil and stalin was wrong),
mircea_popescu: now they move on to pretending like the failure of the third attempt as socialism was really called for no reason "capitalism" and lo and behold, socialism failing EVEN WHEN IT MASQUERADES AS CAPITALISM proves ~capitalism~ doesn't work.
mircea_popescu: there's a reason socialism is the ideology of the stupid, and it's this sorta fatlogic
mircea_popescu: "hey, i didn't lose any weight on that mcdonalds diet - because corporations are evil ; nor when i went to that magical fairy wicca woman, because she was a scammer. but it didn't even work while i was PRETENDING to be working out while watching chicks work out on tv! clearly dieting doesn' work! certainly being fat is the natural state of stupid people!"
mircea_popescu: yey, certainly.
mircea_popescu: capitalims got you from where your president couldn't afford to pay the bill to stay in a hotel in Europe, so he had to stay in the stable section of a cheap inn, to where you could derp about how things should be. it works.
mircea_popescu: what doesn't work is you derping about how things shiould be. never has. never will.
mircea_popescu: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/09/the_legend_of_steven_colbert.html << incidentally, this colbert incident should be studied - STUDIED, like i studied fucking seinfeld - by anyone aspiring to any sort of political (as opposed to technical) involvement in bitcoin.
assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: The Legend Of Steven Colbert ... ( http://bit.ly/1LPQvbZ )
mircea_popescu: the tv personality went there AS A TV PERSONALITY, to confront the other tv personalities. because that's what everyone in congress is : a b lister, of dubious talent, coming not from central casting but from ballot casting.
mircea_popescu: and he told them exactly what you'd expect : my magic is more powerful than your magic, notwithstanding that your magic contains a statement of its own all-powerfullness and my magic doies not. this is not the criteria.
mircea_popescu: the fact that i get a seat at the table and you have to wait for the reporters to invite you in, that's the criteria.
mircea_popescu: butthurt the hell out of the "system", too.
mircea_popescu: "I think his testimony was not appropriate,"
mircea_popescu: but what difference does it make what a senator [says he] thinks ?
mircea_popescu: (and, note, colber's power has EXACTLY NOTHING to do with "TV" in the sense of "system". the franchises use actors in masks now, because they want to keep the copyrights, it's their "Character"| and why should an actor get to own the face of their character. but colbert is not that. so, no, it's not the system.) ☟︎
mircea_popescu: "From this very clear description of the problem comes the most terrible solution imaginable: let's go back to the authoritarian approach." << exactly. there is a reason the schelling points of failing socialism are always PERSONS. you don't like colbert, pick another Dear Leader. what you can not do is go all "country of laws not men", that's dead.
mircea_popescu: and so you know, there's a b lister that's kinda half-black or whatever, from kenya. nobody cares. get all agitated when carson v2.0 turns out to be black.
mircea_popescu: that's why chris rock / chapelle were so important. they didn't make it tho.
pete_dushenski: greetings and salutations !
pete_dushenski: i see that there's a modest pile of logs and quite a bit more trilema to catch up on.
pete_dushenski: j'espere que vous avez tous passez une belle fin de semaine
jurov: plus #eulora. plus btc-dev mailing list. plus tlp. plus....
pete_dushenski: i spent the who weekend speaking french so i'm still thinking in it lol
pete_dushenski: whole*
pete_dushenski: jurov: it never ends !
mircea_popescu: jurov ikr ? i've been spamming the shit out of tlp, but the truth is it's a much more convenient format than trying to make all thgese half and quarter articles into trilema items.
pete_dushenski: not that i'm looking for it to end, mind oyu
mircea_popescu: for that matter - im almost done with 2010, there's only ~4 years left, i should hope im done this month.
mircea_popescu: i do however hold all these as conversation openers, if anyone ever feels like delving into one of the articles etc i'll be happy to hear the conversations. truth is digesting tlp will take more than just this.
mircea_popescu: this incident aside, the cultural production of b-a/b,tmsr~/the cult/however you wish to call it is both scary and exploding on an exponential. i dunno how we'll cope.
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: going through tlp that methodically and chronologically is sure to yield an interesting unfolding of intellectual development. it'd be pretty well impossible to do with with trilema unless one also spoke ro, but even just the last three years of reading would be a hell of a journey/mindtrip
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski unlike in the case of tlp, i'm also here to scream back.
mircea_popescu: imagine how the past two weeks would have looked like if ballas was actually up there in the wot.
pete_dushenski: too true
pete_dushenski: you think it'd be that different ? he doesn't seem like much of a boxer
pete_dushenski: would prolly read comments and say "yup, point taken
pete_dushenski: "
mircea_popescu: how wopuld one know.
pete_dushenski: based on comments on tlp.com ?
mircea_popescu: mebbe so huh.
mircea_popescu: i confess i almost never read the comments.
mircea_popescu: for the random pile of asciilifeform's aftermarket shocks : http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/09/fanapt_deconstructing_a_promot.html
assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: Fanapt: Deconstructing A Promotional Slide Deck ... ( http://bit.ly/1GrjOVw )
pete_dushenski: ballas isn't even fiesty nor viligent enough to block spam from coming through. "hermes bags! cheap jeans!" abound.
mircea_popescu: turns out fanapt has 5ht7 activity, afaik tlp is right : unique to this drug
pete_dushenski: and then there's the plain bizarre comments such as "Am the happiest woman on earth,, my husband just called me this mornings after divorcing for another woman going to 6Months with the help of this man i met on this site please help me to thank him and the author of this site his name is Dr Aida Wedo His phone number is +2348115436578 his email is africanvoodoorituals@gmail.com my name is William Sarah am from
pete_dushenski: Ohio Thank you very much for your help"
pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-10-2015#1307034 << sounds about right for a man this comfortable with his alcoholism and at the age where he'd have the perspective to recognise it as such ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 24-10-2015 19:40:09; mircea_popescu: in other news, intel finally teased out tlp's email. if anyone cares, he's 52. etc.
pete_dushenski: much younger and he's just 'enjoying life', much older and he wouldn't be blogging.
mircea_popescu: guess so.
pete_dushenski: convenient ex post narrative but hey, why not
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: didja drop tlp an email then ?
mircea_popescu: yea
pete_dushenski: just invite him here or... ?
mircea_popescu: !up pf2k