⏐︎ 18837
mircea_popescu: .
mircea_popescu: yaty gribble. lol.
mircea_popescu: http://security.stackexchange.com/questions/89787/choose-your-own-exponents-in-rsa
mircea_popescu: apparently some people are following.
mircea_popescu: the fact that someone would spend the time to type in a 12 paragraph, 500 word reply made out of pure banal WITHOUT BOTHERING TO READ THE ARTICLE
mircea_popescu: or to understand specifically what's being said or anything whatsoever... people must be real lonely.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: l0l, my comment is gone
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 109300 @ 0.00028099 = 30.7122 BTC [+] {3}
asciilifeform: or hm, nm
asciilifeform: different stackexchange
mircea_popescu: he quotes "Note that it is not said nor implied here that there's any sort of theoretical vulnerability related to using 65537 as an exponent for RSA.". the full quote is "Note that it is not said nor implied here that there's any sort of theoretical vulnerability related to using 65537 as an exponent for RSA. The point is that you don't know what exact implementation flaws the NSA is or may be relying on, and for this
mircea_popescu: reason giving as little quarter as possible is the correct policy."
mircea_popescu: why even.
jurov: mike_c this looks weird: http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/user/nubsy/
jurov: "top kek"
mircea_popescu: it's a legit user.
jurov: yes, i meant the graph mostly
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142070 << it's a different sort of thing to do, hence the art discussion in the original. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 18:12:46; ascii_field: trinque: i dare say that -no one- can make money doing -this-
mike_c: I'll put on the list: "make 1-1 trust graph look better" :)
mircea_popescu: mike_c incidentally it could just be a xckd-ish cartoon/joke
mircea_popescu: if you have the energy.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142075 << haha, isn't THAT the age old question. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 18:16:30; jurov: can one go to mars by carefully cultivating their mind?
mircea_popescu: and by the way, have any of the young eager minds here a la pete_d actually read dali's LIFE ? orwell reminds us it is certainly on the list.
BingoBoingo: Also apparently medchem has its own Unix problem http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2015/05/21/crappy_antibodies_available_now_and_for_the_foreseeable_future.php
mircea_popescu: it does. it would. it sucks more than bad unix.
BingoBoingo: The problem of how many of the marketed moving parts work as advertised and only as advertised.
BingoBoingo: No need to imagine if there were a dozen different versions of 'cat' because that's our situation
mircea_popescu: problem is deeper than that, and scales exponentially.
mircea_popescu: if you wish to make sure your salt is salt, spectrometric assay is cheap and purity is a matter of weighing.
mircea_popescu: if you wish to verify an -usually unstable- 28k molecule compound, spectrometric assay is impractical and purity can in principle not even be established.
Hasimir: wow, I never thought I'd discover paypal's kryptonite so quickly ...
mircea_popescu: you had ?
BingoBoingo: Indeed. All of a sudden you've got to put the stuff in a controlled solution and break out the X-Rays and magnification
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo and by the time you're done... you know it WOULD HAVE BEEN USEFUL. but you used it up.
mircea_popescu: like the little girl that got sent to buy matches and make sure threy burn! so she came home with no matches
BingoBoingo: Of course
mircea_popescu: because she had burned them.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 133250 @ 0.00027205 = 36.2507 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: sooo... http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/patches.html finally looks like it's getting somewhere
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142104 << i'm aware, and i think it's amusing, just how varied this cult is, or in other words http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-05-2015#1138869 ☝︎☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 18:38:05; ascii_field: trinque: laugh if you like, but my issue with gabriel_laddel is precisely that he is willing to compromise -too much- rather than not enough.
assbot: Logged on 19-05-2015 10:15:46; justJanne: The largest issue is that many people discussed with me, each having different opinions.
mircea_popescu: jurov sweet. but could the repeated string Author be replaced with the nick ?
jurov: yes, it's planned
mircea_popescu: coolness
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142114 << apparently he doesn't think so, which is strange. i do. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 18:44:12; trinque: ascii_field: in your mind is cardano not this kind of pragmatic first step towards future hardware production?
mircea_popescu: not terribru concerning, this disagreement.
jurov: mod6, ben_vulpes, everyone: http://bluesky/ml/test/patches.html needs to manually fill data for "Released in/Based on" columns - just version strings for every patch, help appreciated
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142132 << they "could have" so they "might as well have had!!1". the all-consuming four points of the book are at work in the belly of hte beast itself, disgesting its own limbs. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 19:03:42; trinque: https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/05/21/nsa-plan-find-osama-bin-laden-infiltrating-medical-supply-chain/ << subtext, NSA caught Bin Laden
mircea_popescu: because... if you can you must.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 116950 @ 0.0002841 = 33.2255 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform incidentally, that reddit suggests to me we shall soon have reddit/hn/twitter/facebook/everything accounts, each and every last one of us. and we won't even have to man them :D
mircea_popescu: !s enigmail
assbot: 9 results for 'enigmail' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=enigmail
mircea_popescu: mmmmkay.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: wai wat
asciilifeform: ah that.
mircea_popescu: AsciilifeformOfficial sez : plox use enigmail kthx bai
asciilifeform: wai where
mircea_popescu: in the future.
asciilifeform: aha.
asciilifeform: surely.
BingoBoingo: !b 5 ✂︎
assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/168S2P8.txt )
asciilifeform: signed with twiddled key no less.
mircea_popescu: lol srsly.
asciilifeform: by cosmic ray (TM)
mircea_popescu: "nsa's pgp keyservers not responsible for fraud - there is a history of cosmic rays having done this before"
jurov: yes, there are atempts to use an AI to continue online activity of the deceased
asciilifeform: !s dead souls
assbot: 7 results for 'dead souls' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=dead+souls
jurov: when done, will be surely extended to living
mircea_popescu: i think the point here is more along the lines of AD not AI
mircea_popescu: no further research needed.
asciilifeform: btw, all keys on sks having pub-e of 281479271743489 are 'magical.'
asciilifeform: tested today.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that's the cosmic ray magic number.
asciilifeform: surely.
mircea_popescu: you see chitlin, cosmic rays don't often interfere with digital computers. but when they do, they always stamp in 281479271743489.
BingoBoingo: It's God's righteous number
BingoBoingo: You jsut hafta bereave
mircea_popescu: cosmic rays come from Social Justice not from god you heathen
asciilifeform: from HumanRights (TM)
asciilifeform: phun phakt: ukrs officially rescinded HumanRights (TM) (R) in ua! just the other day
mircea_popescu: orly ?
mircea_popescu: they can do that ?
asciilifeform: aha
asciilifeform: poor orcs
BingoBoingo: Ur prolly right, Any benevolent cosmic ray god would not allow this http://i.imgur.com/i0sbSYb.jpg
asciilifeform: http://rt.com/news/205919-ukraine-bockade-rebel-areas << jurov can enjoy the rt
mircea_popescu: bockade ? did they send pedos at the protestors ?
asciilifeform: http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/266980.html
asciilifeform: ^ from horse's mouth
mircea_popescu: lol!
mircea_popescu: eagerly awaiting the kerrys of this world going "the atrocities in ukraine are due to russia!!1 the ukr govt clearly said they would break geneva convention unless russia buys them a popsicle and russia didn't!!11"
asciilifeform: the whole idiot 'international komyoonity' edifice can digest any contradiction, likely
asciilifeform: but the lulz!
jurov: ;;merkel already did
gribble: Error: "merkel" is not a valid command.
jurov: ;;google 281479271743489
gribble: Dealing with ext3 and sparse_super - Lists - Gnu: <http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-parted/2005-05/msg00070.html>
asciilifeform: this comes a day after the ua parliament voted to stop paying debt
jurov: that numer appears in many places
asciilifeform: which is somehow not a default, because... ???
asciilifeform: jurov: 0x1000100010001
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142175 << for them sacking is pointless, they don't have a qual programme so they'd just get the same muppets in a diff hat and have to remake the political arrangements. cost, no benefit. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 20:40:55; ascii_field: betcha - no one.
mircea_popescu: jurov i don't often cosmic ray, but when i cosmic ray i always every fourth bit.
BingoBoingo: Nordic System http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/11347454/Mother-and-daughter-weigh-a-total-of-43-stone-and-get-34k-a-year-handouts-but-refuse-to-diet.html
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform incidentally, we have now experimentally found the wavelength of cosmic rays.
mircea_popescu: they're four bits long.
asciilifeform: turns out!
asciilifeform: and are strongly attracted to start of pub-exponent.
asciilifeform: we now know how to deflect cosmic rays from spacecraft!
mircea_popescu: see, the way this works is, if the ray is going across the wire, then nothing happens. but if the ray goes through the wire, as it can happen rarely (random rotational positioning), then it hits every 4th bit.
mircea_popescu: fiat physics!
mircea_popescu: o yeah, let's patent this!
asciilifeform: but only for 49 bits.
asciilifeform: therewego.
mircea_popescu: A Method To Insulate Aircraft From Cosmic Rays Digitally. "just carry a large bunch of e's in a pile outside hte ship"
BingoBoingo should have done law school, or at least more Science classes so could at least become "patent agent"
mircea_popescu: you can still become nerve agent :D
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it is not a default BECAUSE THEY VOTES.
mircea_popescu: jeez you don't know anything.
asciilifeform: aha.
BingoBoingo: Imma be a something
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "Because the PGP Global Directory allows users to manage lost keys, it cannot use cryptographic mechanisms for verification. Instead, like mailing list servers and other public Internet services, the PGP Global Directory verifies a key by requiring a response to a verification email sent to each email address specified on the key. It also requires periodic re-confirmation for each advertised email address
mircea_popescu: by soliciting a response to a re-verification email."
mircea_popescu: am i slow or something ? wut ?
asciilifeform: a few of the faux keys are labeled 'pgp corp. global directory'
mircea_popescu: o nm
mircea_popescu: reading on the log...
BingoBoingo thinks asciilifeform would make excellent motivational speaker
asciilifeform: which is how i found the lolzatron
jurov: http://blog.easydns.org/2015/05/20/unfortunately-we-have-renewed-our-icann-accreditation/ << related, compulsory domain email re-verification
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142195 << the list of people who died of starvation ? ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 21:22:14; *: ascii_field found this by looking at The List, of course
asciilifeform: l0l
asciilifeform: the other one.
jurov: is the former public?
asciilifeform: jurov: aha. posted on mircea_popescu's www
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64650 @ 0.00028515 = 18.4349 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: jurov: http://trilema.com/2015/more-factored-rsa-keys-and-assorted-other-considerations
mircea_popescu: Endnotes [1] It's since been pointed out to me that renewals don't trigger WAPs. Renewals were in the original specification but the Registrars Stakeholder Group managed to get it taken out.
mircea_popescu: heh it explains why im not getting flooded.
mircea_popescu: anyway, i guess we'll be moving to our own internet sooner than anyone anticipated.
mircea_popescu: "One of the commenters on your other linked post (from when the policy was announced last year) mentioned having to create a Gmail account just to resolve the problem. Sure, that's a hardship after the fact, but there's little harm in proactively creating a Gmail account solely for the purpose of WHOIS contact."
mircea_popescu: oh fuck you in the head already
mircea_popescu: jesus christ these people.
mircea_popescu: "you can not have an independent domain without a facebook account! internet OF THINGS, bitch!"
asciilifeform: why spam drop has to be in 'gmail' ? (not that this isn't one of the few remaining uses of it)
asciilifeform: or is it the tls idiocy
asciilifeform: where 'plebe' domains can't actually receive mail from 'brahmin' domains
mircea_popescu: it's a plain "don't use your own server/domain for your email" thing. which is not the only thing that's wrong with this, but in light of the recent humiliation clinton delivered upon them...
mircea_popescu: (you recall, she used her own set-up in her own office, the nsa couldn't get her emails aha)
mircea_popescu: so now a contrived icann policy that, no doubt atr some point in the retarded comissions, had "it'll prevent private webservers" as a +
asciilifeform: they were pissed after having to spend fiddybux bribing server monkey, aha
mircea_popescu: myeah.
mircea_popescu: anywa, whaty about this spaf dude ?
mircea_popescu: it's just a link under a page of cv-derp
asciilifeform: claims to be 'professor of xyz', blog on spambler appeared from nowhere, sole post is reprint of the idiot crud
mircea_popescu: all i see is a link to it.
asciilifeform: aha link
asciilifeform: to the word salad version
mircea_popescu: Hasimir you should probably look into gossipd while at it, to understand why we think very little indeed of all these "solutions" or w/e they are, colored sugar beads.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform weird.
asciilifeform: aha
asciilifeform: http://spaf.cerias.purdue.edu/usgov/index.html << also l0l
asciilifeform not convinced that the earlier link has anything to do with the fella featured in above
mircea_popescu: "They found 30 keys with a subkey having one of the
mircea_popescu: first 1000 primes as a factor." <<< aha. somebody's not really done their reading
mircea_popescu: seeing how 10 digit factors and more keys are actually on display in published fucking articles.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> it's a plain "don't use your own server/domain for your email" thing. which is not the only thing that's wrong with this, but in light of the recent humiliation clinton delivered upon them... << She used exchange, prolly pissed they had to risk a zero day
BingoBoingo: !up gavmatic
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: all the 10-digiters i found so far were, iirc, composite
gavmatic: thanks
asciilifeform: so the small-primes thing isn't nonsense off the bat
BingoBoingo: gavmatic: I saw you've done some bitcoin news sort of posts on your blog
asciilifeform: but the 'yeah we knew all this' is a typical crock'o'shit, yes
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how composite ? i clearly recall there being primes longer
mircea_popescu: brb
gavmatic: yes i've submitted some stuff
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i only got a chance to test the first 9 or so
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: will need to automate this, yes
gavmatic: it's more a hobby at the moment, writing i think is over valued in our culture :)
gavmatic: err under valued
mircea_popescu: 73014444049 = 17 * 641 * 6700417
mircea_popescu: first one i looked at
asciilifeform: aha
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: none of it surprises, random n will normally have many small primefactors
mircea_popescu: now, 7 digit thing is prime. eminently not in the first 1k
BingoBoingo: gavmatic: Seriously consider submitting some pieces to qntra
mircea_popescu: actuallky not even in the first 1mn, obviously.
BingoBoingo: !gettrust gavmatic
assbot: Trust relationship from user BingoBoingo to user gavmatic: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 1 via 1 connections. |http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/trust/?from=BingoBoingo&to=gavmatic | http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/user/gavmatic/
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha, but folks normally speak of the smallest prime factor
gavmatic: thank you for the suggestion
asciilifeform: (why? ask'em)
BingoBoingo: gavmatic: It's a way for you to write and accumulate shares which may have value eventually. Also qntra can always use moar text
gavmatic: I understand, thank you very much for the offer, I will keep this in mind.
BingoBoingo: !rate gavmatic 1 prospect in textfarm system
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/f1bda7d6d3a631e8
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the implication i read in the quoted line was along the lines of Apocalyptic s http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=20-05-2015#1140786 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-05-2015 20:54:58; Apocalyptic: I multiply then the modulus N by 3 (or any other small prime, the value doesn't matter)
mircea_popescu: but perhaps i misread.
BingoBoingo: !v assbot:BingoBoingo.rate.gavmatic.1:0bae20ad25ba58bc558f2be25839dd89ce2b9d14a02fc037319734fe92bbf8e9
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for gavmatic with note: prospect in textfarm system
jurov: mircea_popescu: pls to mpex queue. and there's a lulzy bug, CANCEL|1 responds the order is mangled despite i do have this order
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142235 << so wait, we have actual experimental confirmation for the fabled http://trilema.com/2015/on-how-the-factored-4096-rsa-keys-story-was-handled-and-what-it-means-to-you/#selection-383.0-383.773 ?! ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 21:54:53; ascii_field: LinuxCon and he told me that some folks complained that they can't encrypt to him. For other this was no problem, though.' << this part should surprise no one. the boobytrap works on -someone-.
mircea_popescu: can they actually SAY WHO ?
mircea_popescu: jurov on it.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic started out by suggesting - correctly - that having, e.g., 3 - as factor - was not proof of weakness by itself, because one could take mircea_popescu's modulus, multiply by 3
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes. and the implication i read was "a small prime AND ONLY THAT SMALL PRIME"
asciilifeform: but this was, presumably, before he finished reading and learned -why- 3 was a factor
mircea_popescu: otherwise i have nfi why what the guy said is worth saying
asciilifeform: iirc he 'shot first before asking questions'
mircea_popescu: (the guy = on the email list linked above we're discussing)
asciilifeform: ah -that- one
asciilifeform: i haven't a clue on whom the trap sprung
asciilifeform: all the private meangurlz whispering, srsly, l0l
BingoBoingo has been meaning to watch that film
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: mega-recommended
BingoBoingo may or may not be putting it on a certain que
BingoBoingo has watched 'Milliona Dollar Baby' too many times this month
BingoBoingo finds most confusing about gabriel_laddel that he would suppose people pay for *nix'en
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: the way i understand, he thinks he has some kind of divine exception from the shit-wine-mixture-theorem
asciilifeform: where the shit gets to turn into wine rather than vice-versa (what it does on -our- planet)
BingoBoingo: Perhaps he aspires to master C machine?
asciilifeform: not seeing this intention in his works thus far
asciilifeform: but i'll let the man himself explain
asciilifeform: when he feels like it
BingoBoingo: To be fair odd idea people find their way here and he wants a Lispy Unix. You tried to break Opterons into Lisp-Machiners.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: but he is even more broadly mistaken in imagining that market will pay enough for -any- operating system to support a moiety, much less a grown man
BingoBoingo: Sometimes one needs to ride the rail before finding a train
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i tried many things
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i didn't get the impression his expectation is being directly paid.
BingoBoingo: My impression is he want's those support contracts Redhat failed and was cannabilized upon
asciilifeform: how he planned to turn it into food&rent, i have no clue, but he implied knowing of a way.
BingoBoingo still works on polishing his portfolio yards polishing his mexican credentials
mod6: <+jurov> mod6, ben_vulpes, everyone: http://bluesky/ml/test/patches.html needs to manually fill data for "Released in/Based on" columns - just version strings for every patch, help appreciated << this is 404 for me.
asciilifeform: wai wat
mircea_popescu: bluesky ?!
mircea_popescu: mod6 baby what happened there ?
mircea_popescu: you forgot to click the confirm link in your icann email ? :D
asciilifeform: forget for two weeks and it's the dulap !
BingoBoingo: http://www.reddit.com/r/fatpeopleenvy/comments/33bqni/i_envy_beach_hams/cqndpya
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142238 << dude check out the retarded children of today. "hi would you talk to me privately seeing how i'm too autistic to engage in the proper channels, of which i have a bevy at my disposal from www to irc ?" "no. and get your head out of your ass." "oh you know what ? I AM GOING TO PUBLISH YOUR EMAIL NAO BECAUSE MY HEAD WORKS FINE INSIDE MY ASS" ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 21:56:03; Hasimir: but has since said he's not interested (the follow up by DKG has that)
mircea_popescu: what exactly is happening in the us ? is it a post-apocalyptic nuclear wasteland where children are brought up mostly by wolves and weevils ?
asciilifeform: weevils.
mircea_popescu: have you people no families, no fathers, do you not spend any time with your parents, is there no school, are there no books, nothing ?
asciilifeform: last wolf at his luger long ago
asciilifeform: *ate
mircea_popescu: sometimes it looks like a separate planet.
mircea_popescu: in what world is this sort of behaviour tolerated even of seven year olds, in their first year of schooling ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there is a loose network of people who had fathers, went to school, read the occasional book even. for the bulk of the rest of the schmucks - above applies, yes
decimation: lul > " one count of "operating as an airman without an airman's certificate"" < so if he did not practice and prepare for his flight, and rampantly disregarded safety, would he not have 'operated as an airman'
asciilifeform: decimation: and i bet that thing is under weight limit
mircea_popescu: lol. mmmyeah.
asciilifeform: below which - no license needed
asciilifeform: official usg law, no less
asciilifeform: he will have to sit down in the jail for trespassing
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> mod6 baby what happened there ? << not sure. anyway, even if I add in ".com" or w/e to that link jurov posted, still nada.
mod6: not sure what jurov was referring to.
decimation: "premeditated disregard for usg's rules"
asciilifeform: the hilarious part is the signed confession, apparently, -before- the flight
asciilifeform: (was not believed)
asciilifeform: ianal, but in usa, a machine below ~100kg is not considered an 'aircraft' and is not required to have items such as radio, lights, or a licensed flyer
Hasimir: I was pinged?
Hasimir: oh, quoted, nvm
mircea_popescu: mod6 im sure he meant http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/patches.html
mircea_popescu: Hasimir well since you're here...
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142245 << you got to be kidding right / ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:00:35; Hasimir: didn't spare all the boring folks
Hasimir: yo
mircea_popescu: what sort of argument is this supposed to be even, "it didn't spare all the boring folks".
mircea_popescu: i came here for an argument! this is just contradiction, an automated gainsaying of everything the op says!
BingoBoingo: So in case of Illinois vs. Bingo... Evidentiary hearing which was finally scheduled... continued again because St Clair County's State's Attourney has more asses than heads
mircea_popescu: lol how long has that thing been going nao ?
Hasimir: well, I'm not here for argument, I'm here to try and find out what the cause is
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Since May 2013
Hasimir: even if it is not directed by a malevolent actor
mircea_popescu: aite.
Hasimir: obviously if it is it'll be more interesting, but that's not enough to make it so ...
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo you know there is redress for it taking too long, but i dun think iut's taken too long enough yet.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: And I object to calling the case It's proper title because as and Illinois people I reject consensus on the people of Illinois vs. me title
mircea_popescu: Hasimir i dun see how it'd make it more interesting, but ok.
asciilifeform: i, for instance, will find it more interesting if we learn that it was caused by displeasure of the gods
asciilifeform: like earthquakes!
asciilifeform: (modern gods fire cosmic rays at sinners. earthquake - passe)
Hasimir: it'd be more interesting because then you get to pursue them to find out what they're up to, like in any good detective story
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142263 << which workload he conveniently DOES NOT present. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:04:45; Hasimir: proving or disproving it would require merging multiple keys across a broad range of openpgp implementations and operating systems
mircea_popescu: do you understand what dismissal with prejudice is ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: That redress is if they wait too long to file in the first place. But if hearing that takes 2 years to schedule has to be blown off because prosecutor whales aren't ready... Maybe I have a disposition by $5000/BTC
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> mod6 im sure he meant http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/patches.html << ahhh! ok. was soooo confused. was wondering if he bought a new domain ;)
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142266 << he is not attacking them "for doing so". he, and i, and ~the rest of the world~ is pointing and laughing at them for their hallucinogenic subjective positioning where they seem to regard themselves as some sort of authority to whjich things are proven. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:06:44; Hasimir: no one on that list has said, "this is the answer" - they're discussing theories and you're attacking them for doing so, it seems a bit odd
mircea_popescu: b-a is the sitting authority, not some random twerps on the mailing list of some random usg-mandated security theatre "product"
Hasimir: mircea_popescu, I'm happy to test on the systems I've got here or have access to, but that's not a broad range
mircea_popescu: and THEY are the ones who are NOT at liberty to make claims other than humbly and with a lot of proof.
Hasimir: for example, there's no windows boxes here
mircea_popescu: because THEY are the inferiors in this social encounter.
BingoBoingo: http://imgur.com/a/ShoCV
mircea_popescu: none of this having anything whatsoever to do with the actual math involved.
mod6: jurov: ahh, ok, so let's talk about the best way to do this when we get a chance.
asciilifeform: funny how the -only-, afaik, place where the maths have come up... is here.
asciilifeform: (and trilema)
Hasimir: so you want peer review, fine, who do you consider your peers?
mircea_popescu: !gettrust Hasimir
assbot: Trust relationship from user mircea_popescu to user Hasimir: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 4 via 4 connections. |http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/trust/?from=mircea_popescu&to=Hasimir | http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/user/Hasimir/
mircea_popescu: ^ in there.
Hasimir: hrm ...
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I enthralled by assertions that "you can't get whole key package from factoring subkey" and yet... niggers.txt
asciilifeform: waiwat
mircea_popescu: Hasimir see http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/ and http://trilema.com/2014/what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works-and-how-to-use-it/ and http://trilema.com/2015/the-definitive-sovereign/ and so on.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: It's what some derps quoted seems to suggest. Factoring dat subkey doesn't really give priv key
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: depends which subkey, of who
asciilifeform: some of these folks have only one subkey; others - two; etc
mircea_popescu: but on its face, the notion that someone would even be vaguely relevant for crypto and NOT be in the wot at all is so ridiculous as to defy the mind.
BingoBoingo: Suggestion: For every broken moduli Phuctor signs a message "lol, I suck cocks" from factored keys
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo the thing is, some keys consist entirely of two moduli, both of which were factored.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Which is the value of Phuctor signing a sucks cocks message
mircea_popescu: and the problem with that suggestion is that well, much more interesting to spend computational resources to enlarge the breach atm, than to go in depth.
mircea_popescu: time enough to do that once the whole keyset's been combed
Hasimir: depends on which wot really, I can think of one or two that would know the math well enough, but are not involved in bitcoin at all (the pgp wot, however, is another matter)
Hasimir: oh, not counting people on any of the gpg mailing lists
mircea_popescu: of course, any of these twerps peanut-gallery-ing around COULD use their time to do any of the useful things obviously allowed by phuctor having, generously and very uncharacteristically for THEIR FIELD published a lot of raw results
mircea_popescu: but they're not doing that, because idiots.
mircea_popescu: Hasimir if it can't interoperate with assbot's it doesn't matter.
BingoBoingo: Well with factors message signing shouldn't be too much CPU mathing, but I guess if at this rate ~98 keys sign "lol I suck cocks" at the end of sks dump processing makes better Trilema post
mircea_popescu: let those people fix their broken implementation.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: nah it appears to be because 'mircea_popescu is hitler and asciilifeform is mengele'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform okay.jpg
mircea_popescu: for all the difference it's gonna make.
mircea_popescu: Hasimir what's LR incidentally ?
Hasimir: LR?
mircea_popescu: "My go-to guy for LR-to-BTC conversions at non-exorbitant rates!"
Hasimir: oh
Hasimir: Liberty Reserve
Hasimir: now dead
mircea_popescu: oh oh
Hasimir: yeah, that didn't last ...
Hasimir: apparently non-exorbitant was anything between 5 and 10% over spot
mircea_popescu: o.O
Hasimir: I'd found some site that let me turn the lrusd into mtgox coupon code things, so I just churned through it
mircea_popescu: yah i think lots of people doing that 2012ish
Hasimir: sounds about right
Hasimir: I can't complain, my initial stake came from a one night coding effort and then I traded on that and built it a little bit
Hasimir: given my laptop was bought with btc on -otc, I'm *way* ahead :)
mircea_popescu: works.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 121042 @ 0.00026846 = 32.4949 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 172258 @ 0.00026577 = 45.781 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142287 << logically, if they're german it wouldnb't be the german FOREIGN intelligence ag would it now. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:09:57; ascii_field: suggests to me - BND.
mircea_popescu: but the density of german ppls on that list is, as janna observed, significant enough to raise an eyebrow.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's the one sucking nsa cok
mircea_popescu: as opposed to what, bfv or w/e ?
asciilifeform: i suppose the cock is long enough to shishkebob them all
mircea_popescu: hey, free money.
mod6: danielpbarron: might be a good time to quick retest your key before the next batch
asciilifeform: aha. presently it's spinning wheels burning through the already tested material resubmitted (script lost place when box was powercycled by unknown hands)
asciilifeform: this might take most of night
asciilifeform: if you submit key now, it'll go in head of queue.
mircea_popescu: as it should. cool.
asciilifeform: i will point out, for the record, that i do not expect a proper key to break.
asciilifeform: but one of you fellas might be the lucky one.
mod6: i threw mine in there again, it's 2nd in line or something "(queued, 2 moduli remaining...)"
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142297 << o hey. care to enter a summary of that drama into the record ? i've always been vaguely curious but too lazy to actually put it on the intel list. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:13:28; Hasimir: oh, did I forget to mention, I'm the treasurer of pirate party australia
asciilifeform: mod6: cruncher is presently off
mod6: is see what you're saying, i did it about ~5 mins ago. no worries.
mircea_popescu: Vexual patel very common name in india so prolly not.
mircea_popescu: !up Vexual
Hasimir: you mean the ppi thing?
mircea_popescu: yes
Hasimir: pretty sure it got published on piratetimes.net already
Hasimir: there's a few links, I'll dig them out
mod6: this new vaporizer tank i got is blowing my mind.
mod6: just thought i'd share that :]
asciilifeform: mod6: how's this
asciilifeform: (what is unusual about it)
mircea_popescu: !rate Hasimir 1 Rodney Serkowski, Pirate Party Australia
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/6bf447a8c6c1193a
mod6: it's so much better than old one. i'll find a link...
mircea_popescu: !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.Hasimir.1:b81063ad8ebbe75386e6515c03fc2fa43965115006ee19ce8462d99372379307
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for Hasimir with note: Rodney Serkowski, Pirate Party Australia
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform he put his mind in the vaporizer :D
asciilifeform: that'd do it.
mircea_popescu: Click here ( 153701009 digits). yum.
mod6: it's "sub ohm" 0.5ohm / Range 15-30W kangeronline.com/products/kanger-subtank-plus-clearomizer ☟︎
mod6: mircea_popescu: hahah
BingoBoingo: mod6: What are you vaporizing?
Hasimir: oh, you know Rodney?
asciilifeform: mod6: beautiful lathe work
trinque: mod6: damn that thing looks nice
mircea_popescu: Hasimir apparently you do, seeing how he's the treasurer ?
mod6: BingoBoingo: 15mg nic
Hasimir: he was treasurer
mircea_popescu: o.O
Hasimir: now he's backpacking through europe
Hasimir: last I heard, somewhere near russia
mod6: the airflow on this thing is beatutiful
asciilifeform: mod6: what does it plug into? i see no power source
mircea_popescu: when did this happen then ?
Hasimir: well, I became treasurer in 2013, when he decided not to run again
mod6: asciilifeform: that's just the tank, there is a 30W battery that it screws into from the bottom.
mod6: mine is like: eleafworld.com/product/detail.php/eleaf-istick.html -- the one with the digital display i had with me in b-a.
Hasimir: everyone else seemed afraid of the job, but it's not hard
mircea_popescu: Hasimir intel says 2013, Ben McGinnes.
Hasimir: that's me
mircea_popescu: learn a new thing erryday
mod6: didn't i see Ben McGinnes just post something to the thread about MP & the keys on the gnupg list or w/e?
Hasimir: just like it says on my gpg key ;)
mircea_popescu: !rate Hasimir 1 Ben McGinnes, aparently the new treasurer of Pirate Party Australia
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/8ff9ad7747daedca
mod6 looks back
mircea_popescu: !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.Hasimir.1:bf7f710965a166083dd04a45ca06e05d82edae78c00b64c6adc73075db7ee508
assbot: Successfully updated the rating for Hasimir from 1 to 1 with note: Ben McGinnes, aparently the new treasurer of Pirate Party Australia
Hasimir: mod6, yep the silly question about the keyserver
Hasimir: mangling thingy
mod6: that was you?!
Hasimir: heheh
Hasimir: and a certain someone didn't twig ...
asciilifeform: mod6: http://www.eleafworld.com/product/detail.php/ipipe-ii-kit.html << lulzy
Hasimir: mircea_popescu, my other hats include co-founding cryptoparty, also in 2012, and writing the bulk of the ppau submission to the national security inquiry
mircea_popescu: which got ignored.
Hasimir: well of course it got ignored, we were in favour of a logical response
Hasimir: and they cried, "Because Terrorism!"
mircea_popescu: but anyway, if you're looking for work to do, there's http://trilema.com/2013/so-whos-running-the-courts-circus/ which has a 25+btc pouch attached and most of the work done by mats an nubbins already, so cap it off and the lot of ya can then be paid
mod6: asciilifeform: hahhah i never knew!
cazalla: Hasimir, did you run that with asherwolf?
Vexual: Hasimir, any thought on the suggested shipping reforms?
Hasimir: cazalla, yep
Vexual: right answer
mod6: i used to smoke a pipe a long time ago.. not sure if I could get used to e-pipe. pipe tobacco has a nice smell, etc.
mircea_popescu: cazalla i hope you're all weirded out and inception-ed to fuck seeing how all your friends keep showing up in here.
cazalla: Hasimir, can't say i'm a fan.. and look it's Vexual! lol
Hasimir: cazalla, I do tend to describe that thing as my crypto problem child ... but, probably worth it
cazalla: Hasimir, it or her?
cazalla: mircea_popescu, what friends? i know Vexual from here!
mircea_popescu: aok
BingoBoingo: !up Vexual
cazalla: and given Hasimir is from Melbourne, odds are he's a lefty and i'm hitler to those sorts down here
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142321 << not exactly impossible, tho such bugs are so often weaponized it's not worth making the distinction ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:18:20; ascii_field: and why would a 'bug' affect ONLY (!!!) 1) moduli 2) m^d mod n 3) exponent, which is ALWAYS 281479271743489 after the transformation, regardless of what it originally was 3) ALL FIELDS ARE CORRECTLY SIZED
mircea_popescu: cazalla what, you're impugning a whole city now ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the original suggestion, as i read it, was bug in -sks-
asciilifeform: creating, among other things, the valid sig
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yeah, that's not happening.
asciilifeform: which is preposterous.
asciilifeform: aha.
mircea_popescu: now a bug in [some] gpg... who the fuck knows.
asciilifeform: 2 bugs
mircea_popescu: 3 secret bugs
asciilifeform: one to crap'em out, another - to swallow
mircea_popescu: and a fanatical devotion to the pope.
Hasimir: cazalla, it, not her and I'm more libertarian, but not the crazy american kind
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142330 << the difference is subtle, but it is present. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:21:33; Hasimir: I never claimed to have answers, but you guys are locked into the "it must be a conspiracy" mindset and assuming any criticism is part of the conspiracy
mircea_popescu: Hasimir how's the crazy american kind ?
cazalla: mircea_popescu, seen enough of it to know the place serves as a magnet for sjw types
trinque: mircea_popescu: probably me
trinque: lol
asciilifeform: Hasimir: we have exacting standards for the criticism, is mostly it. you'd find the same treatment in, e.g., physics community circa 1890.
Hasimir: guns above all else, absolutely zero taxes, involvement in society, even if social security is what stops revolutions and blood in the streets, etc.
mircea_popescu: ic.
trinque: Hasimir: how bout yes to 1, voluntary 2, fuck 3
cazalla: Hasimir, not a fan of packing heat?
Hasimir: viewing foreign aid as a handout (instead of the bribery it is)
mircea_popescu: Hasimir the difference between handout and bribery appears as you switch context.
Vexual: ill bet he can make a hot espresso
mircea_popescu: they are the same text.
Hasimir: cazalla, I probably would if I could, but it seems to almost be a religion for some and I've never seen any religion avoid going to a bad place
mircea_popescu: haha that's a point.
mircea_popescu: except he doesn't wanna go to melbourne
Hasimir: it is a little cold, but the coffee is good
Vexual: 2 days on the train to melb, i don't sleep untill i get home
trinque: easy to grant that *any* political group in the states is packed with morons
trinque: the benefits of being armed stand on their own
Hasimir: Vexual, sleep is for the weak, during the week
Vexual: lol
mircea_popescu: trinque a lot more dubious than all that.
trinque: mircea_popescu: how so
mircea_popescu: being armed is like carrying a large 1980s laptop everywhere that can't be turned on
trinque: mircea_popescu: what would better protect my property or own life?
Hasimir: mind you, I live in a place where it's illegal to carry something as relatively tame as pepper spray
Hasimir: as I well know ...
trinque: mircea_popescu: though you and I have vastly different contexts within which to consider those problems
mircea_popescu: you know, just because there isn't a better solution of the same strength doesn't mean it's terribru good.
trinque: haha
trinque: I can grant that
cazalla: Hasimir, not much point calling the cops or ambos if a couple Refugee australis of the somalian kind rock up to your place, i'd much rather put 2 in their chest and compost em
trinque: I'm surrounded by orcs
trinque: meth-fueled even
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> cazalla what, you're impugning a whole city now ? << Not like I don't indict whole cities for eventual Bingo Justice
mircea_popescu: trinque mind, i have lived like that, and for extended periods. contrary to what the outsiders think, nobody inside is really all that keen about having to drag the damned things around everywhere.
trinque: ah, yeah I don't carry
trinque: just keep some at home
mircea_popescu: and everyone that does eventually settles for equipment much exactly opposite of what the arms fans favour.
cazalla: Hasimir, what's the pirate party position on weaponry btw?
mircea_popescu: ie, light.
mircea_popescu: and no TaCtIcAl ScOpEz
trinque: lol, certainly not
trinque: a humble handgun and a rifle for sport
Hasimir: cazalla, we don't have a formal position on firearms, but we generally favour individual freedom
mircea_popescu: so the "nuts with guns" angle does have some merit to it fo sho.
mircea_popescu: actually...
mircea_popescu: !s crazy shit stick
assbot: 8 results for 'crazy shit stick' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=crazy+shit+stick
Hasimir: have a look at the bill of rights policy and draw your own conclusions ...
Hasimir: I suspect that if it came to a party vote I'd be in the minority and voting in favour
Hasimir: but we have more important policies to complete first
cazalla: yeah, it's a shame Australians are so fearful of guns
mircea_popescu: ah, the dirty work of politics. which to do first.
Hasimir: blame that fuckwit in tasmania
Hasimir: martin bryant
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: some of the 'crazy shit stick' thing is a result of u.s. folks -forbidden- to carry. the stick grows 'tumours' from being kept in safe anyway
asciilifeform: it's like a soviet tank on a pedestal in cemetary
asciilifeform: might as well weld little flowers to it
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform /me knows but what shall i say of it anymore, it's an opaque topic on the basis of erryday experience.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> mircea_popescu: some of the 'crazy shit stick' thing is a result of u.s. folks -forbidden- to carry. the stick grows 'tumours' from being kept in safe anyway << Fading fast, apparently even I with paper work could carry "crazy shit stick"
asciilifeform: u.s. small arms enthusiasts have separate category in their literature called 'carry'
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: ianal, but in u.s. locales rich in orcs, 'carry' is normally forbidden
Vexual: when i read carry i imagine a kei truck
BingoBoingo: <trinque> a humble handgun and a rifle for sport << FLip that Rifle for carry and pistol for sport
cazalla: Hasimir, not convinced it was him or that he at least acted alone.. what sort of guy autistic retard like him could kill 35 people with such precision
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: even in 'carry states', the list of public locations where such is forbidden, is quite long.
mircea_popescu: cazalla> i'd much rather put 2 in their chest and compost em << why ? you're supposed to shoot out the knees/shoulders, and why wouldn't you ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Really only holds when locales in question are california and "New York"
Hasimir: remember that those ppl weren't used to a world where guns were common enough to worry about
cazalla: mircea_popescu, how would i know what to put what where when we can't have weapons here to begin with :\
mircea_popescu: and now we come full circle to the problem
mircea_popescu: yes, tumours.
mircea_popescu: not only on the gun. on the world too.
Hasimir: and I imagine it's much like the more recent massacre in Norway
Vexual: guns were very much more common here before howards decree
Hasimir: with that other retard ... what was his name?
cazalla: batman?
Hasimir: the one who shot all those kids
cazalla: anakin?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Illinois was compelled by courts to offer "carry" on a basis where basically al non-felon comers are welcome ☟︎☟︎
Hasimir: heheh
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142347 << it's by no means certain the keys being publicly visible is intentional. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:26:00; Hasimir: alright, assume you're right then, what do they gain by doing this in a way that can be found by regular(-ish) geeks?
Hasimir: fair point
mircea_popescu: that's one theory (published as such in an article iirc). another theory hanbot came up with earlier in log, and i've been thinking about.
BingoBoingo: So the Celosia already challenging the yellow heirloom rose for fastest boner in the front garden.
Hasimir: Breivik, Anders Breivik, that fuckwit
mircea_popescu: indeed, for all we know these keys were used in some sort of process, and a few accidentally leaked.
mircea_popescu: we don't know enough atm to call on this
Hasimir: that we definitely agree on ...
mircea_popescu: moreover, it's not even terribly clear HOW to correctly classify these keys.
BingoBoingo: <Hasimir> that we definitely agree on ... << Is punative sodomy
mircea_popescu: there seem to be 2-3 different categories but they can be reconstructed in multiple approaches with different elements.
mircea_popescu: which is why running the whole shebang is important - we need more members to attempt a classification
Hasimir: has anyone tried deliberately making/breaking a key like this?
mircea_popescu: which imo is the only sane way to proceed here.
Hasimir: them
mircea_popescu: Hasimir Apocalyptic was doing some work on this.
mircea_popescu: more work always welcome.
Hasimir: cool
Vexual: yep, the cops went and took every registered repeater
Hasimir: if they're encryption subkey bits then maybe it's from backfired attempts to segregate the cert key from the subkeys ...
Hasimir: maybe
mircea_popescu: so far the only seriously excluded hypothesis is "bit rot".
mircea_popescu: anything else, pretty much may be.
Hasimir: bits don't rot, they flip
mircea_popescu: for all we know this is a not yet documented numeric field breakthrough
mircea_popescu: Hasimir bitrot = "changes in data due to the substrate rather than activity"
Hasimir: I know, I was being facetious
BingoBoingo: Math breakthrough/phd thesis seems most likely atm
Hasimir: been awake for a while ...
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo no fucking way srsly.
mircea_popescu: i have had enough shockers for a year
mircea_popescu: and it's barely may.
Hasimir: BingoBoingo, no, they'd've published by now
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Looking at there being a pattern at all... Moar shockers!!!
Hasimir: unless it's on jstor ...
mircea_popescu: Hasimir he doesn't mean [i take it] that someone was doing research which involved these keys. he was responding to me saying that for all we know, this is a property OF NUMBERS somehow ☟︎
BingoBoingo: Hasimir: Nah, some poor motherfucker could be Dr. Motherfucker if only they didn't sign with an "Intelligence" agency
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> Hasimir he doesn't mean [i take it] that someone was doing research which involved these keys. he was responding to me saying that for all we know, this is a property OF NUMBERS somehow << Yes
Hasimir: ah ... kk
mircea_popescu: the odds of which... gimme a break.
BingoBoingo: I think someone stuck their dick in numbers and made this pattern possibru ☟︎
decimation: 281479271743489 (the common exponent) = 65537*641*6700417
BingoBoingo: !up AdrianoOliveira
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142379 << and you've not published this ?! ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:38:32; Hasimir: BingoBoingo, somewhere I have a log of a PM with that guy who we later learned was the undercover agent going after silk road v1
BingoBoingo puclished front yart encounter with two sweaty feds
mircea_popescu: decimation yes. and notice 641 was a factor in the modulus i quoited above
decimation: yeah. interesting.
Hasimir: having trouble with deedbot atm
mircea_popescu: !up deedbot-
mircea_popescu: just say deedbot- url
trinque: how so
Hasimir: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/3QDH2V3.txt
deedbot-: accepted: 1
Hasimir: woohoo
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142381<< the other half being that ancient training of us politicians where "every question is an opportunity to rehash your agenda". and so... even if nothing else is said, repeating the "Erryone must upgrade" mantra is like buying ibm. won't get you fired. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 22:38:46; ascii_field: mod6: they are so accustomed to the illiteracy of the general public, that they are entirely unprepared for folks with half a clue.
mircea_popescu: Hasimir wd.
Hasimir: does it only work in channel or via pm too?
decimation: https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2015/05/20/2015-11642/wassenaar-arrangement-2013-plenary-agreements-implementation-intrusion-and-surveillance-items#h-18 < "
decimation: The WA-agreed definition for ?intrusion software? is proposed to be added to § 772.1 of the EAR. The definition also includes a Note that describes some items not included as ?intrusion software,?e.g., hypervisors, debuggers or Software Reverse Engineering (SRE).
trinque: Hasimir: doing it here is nice for the logs, but it works both places.
BingoBoingo: Someone understand wassenar to do a qntra piece?
Hasimir: cool
Hasimir: wassenar, god, I still want to bury that fucking thing
decimation: ^ usg is proposing to implement a treaty (purely via executive fiat) to ban the export of 'intrusion software'
decimation: (unless you get a license and permission from usg of course)
Hasimir: decimation, they've been at it through wassenar for nearly 2 decades now
Hasimir: I first wrote about it in '97 or '98
mircea_popescu: eh, who cares about the us anymore, not like they have the edge in crypto
decimation: not even crypto related
mircea_popescu: what's next, somalia won't export laptops ?
mircea_popescu: decimation foss is fundamentally immune to this bs, and who uses ms hypervisor
mircea_popescu: !up Panasonic
Hasimir: mircea_popescu, but individuals aren't
mircea_popescu: hey asc, there comes your fab.
mircea_popescu: Hasimir individuals are mobile.
decimation: it all comes down to "get a note from stalin"
Hasimir: some are, hopefully enough
Hasimir: or do a satoshi
mircea_popescu: Hasimir you see how your position here contradicts your earlier stated position re guns ? :)
BingoBoingo seriously wants some fresh wassenar news for the qntra
mircea_popescu: apparently everyone holds the same beliefs when it comes to things they care about, and the other set for everything else.
mircea_popescu: which... is fine :)
decimation: wanna build an aircraft? fly an r/c plane? put 'intrusion software' on your website? get a note from stalin.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9000 @ 0.00028614 = 2.5753 BTC [+]
Hasimir: ah, but I'm not against guns, just against them being the prime motivator for whatever
Hasimir: they're a tool, like any other
Hasimir: unfortunately often wielded by tools too
BingoBoingo: http://www.reddit.com/r/kinkyshitlords/comments/33roxc/just_joined_fetlife/
Hasimir: with a high percentage of said tools also having badges
BingoBoingo: Guns need no badges, just oil
Hasimir: case in point, that url posted here earlier of the cops who lobbed a flash-bang at a baby
BingoBoingo: C&R Yugo SKS has a lot of pluses
decimation: mircea_popescu: " foss is fundamentally immune to this bs" < not clear. however I suspect usg would not want to try to stick someone posting foss - because the courts would likely find that this kind of regulation would contradict the first amendment
BingoBoingo: WHatever all *nix are US legal by 2nd amendment
decimation: and note this is a regulation, not a law
Hasimir: BingoBoingo, that was Bernstein's argument
decimation: Hasimir: yes and it was successful as I recall
Hasimir: I thought it settled before it got far enough to set precedent
decimation: right, which is why usg isn't going to test it again
Hasimir: except for defcad
decimation: https://www.eff.org/press/archives/2008/04/21-29 < and they did rule
Hasimir: oh cool
decimation: eh those defcad guys are just attention whores
decimation: what has usg done against them?
Hasimir: true, but the case might be interesting
decimation: http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/05/09/state-department-demands-takedown-of-3d-printable-gun-for-possible-export-control-violation/ < the state dept sent him a letter
BingoBoingo: Cody and Clitler have a back and forth
decimation: "Pursuant to 127.1 of the ITAR, it is unlawful to export any defense article or technical data for which a license or written approval is required without first obtaining the required authorization from the DDTC. Please note that disclosing (including oral or visual disclosure) or tranferring technical data to a foreign person, whether in the United States or abroad, is considered an export under 120.17 of the ITAR."
decimation: I'm not sure whatever came of this
mircea_popescu: <Hasimir> ah, but I'm not against guns, just against them being the prime motivator for whatever << not the point. earlier when guns were being discussed you said " I've never seen any religion avoid going to a bad place", which yes is a valid point. but when it comes to something you actually know/care about, suddenly it';s not nearly as appealing, as good a point as it may be.
mircea_popescu: decimation moreover, you can just pgp me the code and i'll publish it.
mircea_popescu: now it's been exported, samizdat style.
decimation: ah it's in court http://www.scribd.com/doc/264435890/Defense-Distributed-et-al-v-U-S-Dept-of-State
BingoBoingo: !s shovel ak
assbot: 5 results for 'shovel ak' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=shovel+ak
decimation: they are trying the same argument as bernstein
decimation: "Defendants? censorship of Plaintiffs?speech, and the ad hoc, informal and arbitrary manner in which that scheme is applied, violate theFirst, Second, and Fifth Amendments to the United States Constitution."
Hasimir: decimation, yeah, I thought that was what you were talking about ...
Hasimir: mircea_popescu, it's always a fine line to walk between being passionate and religiously devoted ...
mircea_popescu: and the line a lot more visible in topics you care about enough to study in detail..
decimation: mircea_popescu: of course, but that would give ground for usg to attempt to throw you in jail
mircea_popescu: decimation how would they ever know ?
mircea_popescu: they don't even know whom to jail for the most recent leak on trilema. ☟︎
decimation: someone has the privkey
Hasimir: well, yes, because you're looking more closely
mircea_popescu: decimation sure. so ?
mircea_popescu: Hasimir exactly.
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --buttchina
gribble: (ticker [--bid|--ask|--last|--high|--low|--avg|--vol] [--currency XXX] [--market <market>|all]) -- Return pretty-printed ticker. Default market is Bitfinex. If one of the result options is given, returns only that numeric result (useful for nesting in calculations). If '--currency XXX' option is given, returns ticker for that three-letter currency code. It is up to you to make sure (1 more message)
decimation: it will be interesting to see what the court rules on this
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market buttchina
mircea_popescu: jurov: heh seems there will be leaks.b-a.link soon << nb, nb
gribble: BTCChina BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 236.32941, Best ask: 236.334255, Bid-ask spread: 0.00484, Last trade: 236.327795, 24 hour volume: 16115.88970000, 24 hour low: 234.748325, 24 hour high: 237.342015, 24 hour vwap: 235.934384743
mircea_popescu: i like cryptome but they have too much shit
decimation: I suspect usg will withdraw because they don't want the court to rule that thier little export regulation house of cards is unconstitutional
decimation: it provides jobs, see
BingoBoingo watching asciilifeform's suggested movie
mircea_popescu: depends. they didn't withdraw the obamacare taxnontax
decimation: yeah but that's because obama would have personally lost face
decimation: obama can pretend he doesn't even know what these people are talking about
mircea_popescu: Hasimir: cool, will do << for the record, this non-readable dump of text stuff is annoying.
decimation: at any rate, the pro-gun lobby in the us is quite strong and well funded, it generally levels political opposition
mircea_popescu: if you must include blobs, include them apart from whatever it is you're deed-ing
Hasimir: ah
BingoBoingo: Also in USia Nagant, SKS, and other curios with bayonets already mounted ++
BingoBoingo: !up Vexual
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142468 << wait, wut ?! mandatory voting ? ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 23:31:13; cazalla: trinque, at least you have the option not to vote.. i usually find myself rediscovering my religious roots on election day which exempts me from wasting my time.. why Hasimir would volunteer to waste even more of his time though, i can't figure that one
mircea_popescu: what is this, iran ?
Hasimir: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/0FG4ZMK.txt
Hasimir: !up deedbot-
Hasimir: guess not
BingoBoingo: OMG asciilifeform movie night
mircea_popescu: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/0FG4ZMK.txt
Hasimir: mircea_popescu, yeah, aus has mandatory enrolment for voting and fines if you don't show up to vote (or postal vote)
mircea_popescu: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/0FG4ZMK.txt
Hasimir: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/0FG4ZMK.txt
Hasimir: snap
mircea_popescu: lol poor bot
mircea_popescu: i gues next bot is gangbot
BingoBoingo: motorcycle gangbot?
Hasimir: oh, you didn't ...
mircea_popescu: o check me out, i have the day's first line in log. yay.
Hasimir: anyway, no doubt you can giggle at the content of the paste and at least the first submission is included for future reference
Hasimir: does anyone remember which LEA he was with?
mircea_popescu: http://sixdemonbag.org/yomu.html << the sad story about how some schmuck got scammed by the schmuck he was doing drm for. ☟︎
trinque: Hasimir: try that again
Hasimir: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/0FG4ZMK.txt
mircea_popescu: somehow the obvious "Don't do drm, you'll be involved with the sort of people who do drm" doesn't occur to his mind. ☟︎
trinque: Hasimir: weird, your last one went in
Hasimir: go figure
Hasimir: maybe it just hates me
trinque: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/0FG4ZMK.txt
trinque: nope, encoding blowup
Hasimir: it doesn't like utf-8?
Hasimir: or something else?
mircea_popescu: in other news, http://33.media.tumblr.com/f39a00565b6bc90bc830a013627759d7/tumblr_mvn1sbt4hi1s1mfkzo1_400.gif
cazalla: Hasimir, is the enrollment actually mandatory? i know of people that never enrolled so they never actually had to vote or become religious on the day of it
trinque: Hasimir: python needs its tits kicked in regards to eating a u2026
Vexual: ;;ud tits kicked in
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Scorp+Tits | "We were all having a good time at the lake until ole fatass Tungette's Scorp Tits kicked in again. Damn I thought Jeff was gonna try and find a blowtorch to burn ...
Hasimir: trinque, python 3 ftw!
trinque: eh, incrementally better
scoopbot_revived: Social Engineering Attack Takes Bitcoin Talk Offline http://qntra.net/2015/05/social-engineering-attack-takes-bitcoin-talk-offline/
mircea_popescu: lolwut ?
Hasimir: cazalla, it's supposed to be, but if you avoid it then there's nothing they can do
Hasimir: trinque, it does handle utf-8 much better then 2 ever could
Hasimir: but if you're sticking with 2.7, use: from __future__ import unicode_literals
decimation: why bother with unicode at all?
mircea_popescu: ^
trinque: Hasimir: yup, it's exploding deep within python gnupg though.
Hasimir: decimation, I like to print people's names correctly, to do otherwise when it is possible is just unnecessarily rude
mircea_popescu: they should be thankful the names don't get translated!
decimation: do you realize what kind of black hole python is being forced into ... to be polite?
mircea_popescu: ye hear that, phteven ?
decimation: and if someone has a name that can't be romanized? fuck'em - they can romanize or have no identity
Hasimir: decimation, I prefer to view it as a new (event) horizon
mircea_popescu: a new what ?
BingoBoingo: So watching 'Mean Girls' (2004) seems asciilifeform likes authentic Maoism in his films
mircea_popescu: decimation we're not enforcing that policy re irc handles tho
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143160 << l0l, not even sure what counts as the most recent ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 03:47:14; mircea_popescu: they don't even know whom to jail for the most recent leak on trilema.
decimation: are we using utf or extended ascii
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform :)
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo after mean girls see http://trilema.com/2012/mean-streets/
mircea_popescu: should be an interesting study in contrasts.
mircea_popescu: (pretty much exactly same story, separated by two decades and a gender gap_
mircea_popescu: decimation i dunno anyone gave a shit, just, whatever freenode takes.
decimation: irc handles aren't an identity, gpg keys are
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143206 << i bet he just wanted to eat, pay rent. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 04:05:08; mircea_popescu: somehow the obvious "Don't do drm, you'll be involved with the sort of people who do drm" doesn't occur to his mind.
mircea_popescu: so your deedbot is going to break over someone citing a nick ?
mircea_popescu: "I walked out of the back office in a state of absolute shock. I’d just become a twenty–first century sharecropper. I couldn’t find outside work without winding up homeless — and I couldn’t leave the state because three bucks of gas money won’t get you past Walnut Creek — and I couldn’t get paid because there was no money to pay anyone with."
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ^
mircea_popescu: drm.
Vexual: nrm
trinque: mircea_popescu: over non-latin1 characters, for now
trinque: though that's something I'll fix.
trinque: will involve dropping a dependency and writing something in its place
mircea_popescu: what you mean by deep in gpg py bowels ? is it exploitable even ?
mircea_popescu: looks like he gave you your weekend's entertainment
trinque: nah, the python thing diddling gpg is just trying to
trinque: whoops
decimation: just turn 8-bit ascii characters into tildes
trinque: trying to encode some bits as latin1, and there are characters in this outside that set
asciilifeform recalls mr mold's attempt at squaring zooko's tri. - speakable keys
trinque: so it barfs
decimation: does deedbot need to be 8-bit clean?
asciilifeform recalls own implementation of it, http://dpaste.com/2E0CYZQ
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55363 @ 0.00028614 = 15.8416 BTC [+]
trinque: decimation: I don't see why it can't handle utf8; the sqlite db it munches on is
trinque: just a python annoyance
mircea_popescu: decimation tilde wont sign
Hasimir: trinque, oh, is this the python-gnupg gpg.encoding thing?
decimation: eh, it's you code, do what you will.
Hasimir: yeah, setting that to latin-1 just works with everything ...
trinque: Hasimir: yeah
Hasimir: well, mostly
Hasimir: I think I might've submitted the bug report on that one ...
trinque: heh!
trinque: found the mention of it in the docs
trinque: is there a workaround?
decimation: yeah, 7 bit ascii
trinque: ah I see how you can set it
Hasimir: that is the work around
trinque: decimation: I'm fine with requiring ascii too; what's the argument behind that?
decimation: I don't trust 8-bit character handling code
trinque: ah, well at least with this thing the output's able to be checked, neh?
Hasimir: that's one of the reasons I started looking at pyme ...
trinque: if there are messages out there that are interesting to deedbot in other encodings, they'd otherwise be excluded
Hasimir: well, that and having to explain to the python-gnupg dev why people might want to sign something with 2 keys ☟︎
Vexual: !up thestringpuller
Vexual: really?
Hasimir: yep
Vexual: no shit
Hasimir: it's in one of the bitbucket t=issues
Hasimir: *issues
trinque: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/0FG4ZMK.txt
deedbot-: accepted: 1
Hasimir: yay
trinque: Hasimir: thanks!
Hasimir: np
Hasimir: I believe that falls into the category of enlightened self-interest ;)
mircea_popescu: pretty cool.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6735 @ 0.0002827 = 1.904 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: "Everyone in Africa can read Swedish"
BingoBoingo: OMG the CRT iMAcs in this film
danielpbarron: i have 2 of those
asciilifeform: wtf was difference b/w 'imac' and 'emacs'
asciilifeform: emac
asciilifeform: l0l
asciilifeform: that 's' just came out for no reason
asciilifeform: point being, i have always wanted to see an 'm-mac'
asciilifeform: that is - mechanical.
asciilifeform: ('e' in 'emac' clearly is 'electric')
asciilifeform: !up Vexual
Vexual: seven spanish angles. a rap verse. vexual
Vexual: notrlly
Vexual: bb is right tho, where swedish is the swhahili of western europe
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143033 << iirc there was similar thing in maryland. the state gov. simply pissed on the court, andrewjackson-style. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 03:01:48; BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Illinois was compelled by courts to offer "carry" on a basis where basically al non-felon comers are welcome
asciilifeform: because, well, they could.
Vexual: maryland kinda close to dc no?
asciilifeform: that'd be why.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143071 << now curious, which 'this' ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 03:10:09; mircea_popescu: Hasimir he doesn't mean [i take it] that someone was doing research which involved these keys. he was responding to me saying that for all we know, this is a property OF NUMBERS somehow
asciilifeform: because there are several 'this'es
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41300 @ 0.00029161 = 12.0435 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143076 << obligatory mega-classic >> http://bookre.org/reader?file=223021 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 03:11:31; BingoBoingo: I think someone stuck their dick in numbers and made this pattern possibru
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform we were idly discussing the "what could have causes weak keys", i pointed out that so far it could be a lotta things
mircea_popescu: all the way up to an afore-unknown property of the mathematical structures involved.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> wtf was difference b/w 'imac' and 'emacs' << Generally eMac was previous year's "iMac"
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143033 << iirc there was similar thing in maryland. the state gov. simply pissed on the court, andrewjackson-style. << Court Pissed all over Chicago on this matter ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 03:01:48; BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Illinois was compelled by courts to offer "carry" on a basis where basically al non-felon comers are welcome
cazalla: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CgQITcfJd0
BingoBoingo: Surprisingly educational film, do reccomend
BingoBoingo: OMG asciilifeform Regina George is 8 years older than Cady!!!
Hasimir: mircea_popescu, asciilifeform, I was looking in gpg's import source code for an unrelated thing and noticed something, it won't give you the answer, but it might help narrow the search - read through the code and code comments in g10/import.c of the current master repo, it goes through the specific key error types and subkey fragment types that gpg won't import (which also happens to be most of the keys on The List)
BingoBoingo finally giving Missouri wine a chance tonight. WOrks for endrunkening
Hasimir: also, see if you can test this key ID: 0xCC61ADFF159B44ED (another one missing a UID, but in this case it was made in '94, by a certain expat aussie residing in an Ecuadorian embassy in London ...)
Hasimir: the other way to find that one, even without the uid is with his old email address: proff@suburbia.apana.org.au
cazalla: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3091370/Recent-Berkeley-grad-waited-parking-lot-gun-manager-N-forced-work-fast-food-couldn-t-job-degree.html
BingoBoingo: WTF is wrong with pissing in the freezer and then quitting
Hasimir: BingoBoingo, if it's too far below zero it might freeze inside your urethra ... breaking the ice would not be a good thing then
BingoBoingo: Hasimir: As much as I drink, not sure my piss would freeze at zero
BingoBoingo: !up Landgull
mircea_popescu: Hasimir minus the fact that it imports unsigned keys (badly signed it rejects, but unsigned at all seem an exception ?), gpg generally doesn't import the diddled exponent keys yeah
Hasimir: and it usually gives different errors for those it rejects, which you can match to specific symptoms in the code
mircea_popescu: much more interesting would be an assay of the various windows and perhaps mac implementations
mircea_popescu: as very few here actually have either.
Hasimir: I've got os x
Hasimir: and I'm running 1.4.19 and 2.1.4
Hasimir: though 1.4.19 has been adjusted to generate large keys
mircea_popescu: yeah thinking more of 1.4.x
mircea_popescu: single digit
mircea_popescu: these keys come from 2009 at earliest iirc
Hasimir: I can always recompile an older version ...
mircea_popescu: even just reading the code is worthwhile.
Hasimir: ah-ha! finally!
Hasimir: now 2.1.4 is modded to make stupidly large keys too ...
BingoBoingo threw in a bunch of fucking 1990's 512 an 76X keys...
BingoBoingo: Apparently ye olde keys perfectly factorable in a targeted manner... stronger than turd keys
Hasimir: v2 keys are pretty simple, though
BingoBoingo: v2 is beneath justifying effort
Hasimir: and 512-bit, are you surprised?
BingoBoingo: Hasimir: No, I am surprised all of this other shit is getting Fucktored 1stest
Hasimir: heh, fair point
Hasimir: though chances are No Such Agency have already broken the old ones out of habit
mircea_popescu: lmao
BingoBoingo: Almost inevitabru
Hasimir: no doubt they've also trawled archives of alt.anon.messages
BingoBoingo: Oh shit, Marvel did somewhat not stupid depiction of tactical nukes in a Disney movie
BingoBoingo: !up gabriel_laddel
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: engineers suck at management is the long and the short of it. << I see no reason that this must be the case, but yes, fiat-land tends to breed engineers who are terrible with money (bill gosper, stallman, richard gabriel). It also tends to make idiot managers. IMHO much of this is because of all the inane nonsense involved in runnin
gabriel_laddel: g a business. EG: from what I can tell, it consists of fill out paperwork, go to point (lat,long), fill out more paperwork, if you fill out enough paperwork, you'll get special moron coins that you can spend at select hotels or trade in for airline credits. Fucking idiot nonsense to fill the lives of shmucks whose time isn't worth anything and aspi
gabriel_laddel: re to (at most) become a "high powered businessman" (whatever that means, idk).
gabriel_laddel: ty BingoBoingo
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: and often blamed for killing'em. but this is not entirely unlike a boozer blaming a particular bottle of rotgut 20 yrs ago for his death. << lol
BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: I am sorry, you are doomed to suffer hetrogyny
mircea_popescu: "tin women"
gabriel_laddel: ^ yep.
gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: sorta like the only other outfit of that period, thinking machines corp. << unlike smbx, I've heard that their producs were never competitive, in spite of having all the brains and lisp machines they could possibly want. Related to the whole "they burned a pile of money" I've also been told they bought a firetruck to play with (wtf,
gabriel_laddel: why?).
BingoBoingo is horribru with money x-cept when I am awesome
gabriel_laddel: trinque: you may at best go work for the guy who can << hey, lemme know when you find him - I'm still searching.
gabriel_laddel: trinque: after he beats the word "waste" into your skull << ?
gabriel_laddel: trinque: but the guy was dead set on building this whole relational coding environment for... I don't know, your grandmother, anyone, "the people"! << idk wtf he was smoking - sounds like you should have packaged and sold it.
gabriel_laddel: trinque: guy's never sold a thing in his life << lol
gabriel_laddel: ascii_field: trinque: laugh if you like, but my issue with gabriel_laddel is precisely that he is willing to compromise -too much- rather than not enough. << ...
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-05-2015#1142114 << apparently he doesn't think so, which is strange. i do. << ftr, I see this as progress. Knowing macrofab exists and having a working relationship is useful. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 21-05-2015 18:44:12; trinque: ascii_field: in your mind is cardano not this kind of pragmatic first step towards future hardware production?
gabriel_laddel: *: BingoBoingo finds most confusing about gabriel_laddel that he would suppose people pay for *nix'en + asciilifeform: i must confess that i personally would not pay -anything- for a unix of any description whatsoever. + mircea_popescu: i still don't see the money part. this is art, at best. + asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: the way i understand, he t
gabriel_laddel: hinks he has some kind of divine exception from the shit-wine-mixture-theorem
BingoBoingo: BESERKER!!!
gabriel_laddel: ^ It appears that I should properly make the business case. If the unix in question had a sane substitute for portage (clearly specified set of systems guaranteed to build for a specified set of versions, no cyclic dependencies when you try to enable the USE flag for docs globally, sane CLOS structuring of the systems, `build' builds, `test' tests
gabriel_laddel: etc), you wouldn't shell over $100 for it? You've already advertised spending a week(!) setting up a gentoo. ben_vulpes wasted at least an hour trying to figure out what the hell portage overlays do even. mod6 burnt god knows how long writing an (unfinished) gentoo install guide. How little is everyone's time worth? My point is not that Masamune wi
gabriel_laddel: ll solve these exact problems and cost $100 dollars - it won't. My point /is/ that the notion there couldn't possibly be a unix worth paying for is absurd.
gabriel_laddel: I'm not planning on selling Masamune. It will be free and stocked with niceties. Where I do plan to make money is on (source-included) extensions, which amounts to contracting gigs setting up intricate lessons for large companies, militaries, private schools and homeschoolers. Aside from this, various products I'd like to make and sell: a CL only I
gabriel_laddel: DE (with all the goodies MP and I discussed previously - !s paper clip), 3D CLIM (actually a rather involved project - selecting the correct hardware, reverse engineered opengl drivers etc is expensive and how exactly this gets split off into various products is complicated), a program that does run-time analysis on your CL code and optimizes it in
gabriel_laddel: real time, a plug-and-play solution for doing research for chemists, physicists and mathematicians. Some people are asking the right questions (http://chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/27246/in-which-country-is-it-allowed-to-practice-non-clandestine-amateur-chemistry, http://chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/18791/why-isnt-organic-chemistr
gabriel_laddel: y-taught-in-3d) and no one is catering to their needs. System76 exists, they sell linux computers but their machines suck because they're stupid. I see no reason I can't sell computers pre-loaded with Masamune. Frankly, the marketing for all these companies sucks and I don't think it'll be terribly difficult to do far better.
gabriel_laddel: To those who would say "Oh you can't possibly sell a 3D CLIM, no one needs that" I will note that we *know* the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory (Weapons and Complex Integration) built VisIt on top of OpenGL. They accept it as a given. USG doesn't want to win wars, but I'm willing to bet that someone on Earth does. One easy way to free up eng
gabriel_laddel: ineers is to remove idiotic nonsense (OpenGL, Gentoo, Portage) from their lives. If you think OpenGL isn't a huge time sink, think again: http://gabriel-laddel.github.io/arsttep.html#sec-5-2
mircea_popescu: omg wall fo text man
BingoBoingo: *nix simply doesn't cost
mircea_popescu: you gotta blog.
gabriel_laddel: I've got a blog
BingoBoingo: A/UX, Solaris 8, AIX, *BSD, no cost dude
gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: try reading the message pl0x
BingoBoingo: Will get to, drinking Missery wine
BingoBoingo dunno how you pronounce that state
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel portage already exists. not only would i not pay for it, i'd pay to have whoever packages gentoo atm whipped.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: portage doesn't work
gabriel_laddel: sure, it exists
mircea_popescu: mkay. lemme explain something about markets to you. the sun is infinitely valuable, to the exclusion of all else. nobody (tm) would consider paying for it, and in no case would they pay anything close to fair value (why this is so should be thermodynamically obvious). meanwhile, ipads have no utility and go for hundreds by the million. on top of them, jackpot machine simulations sell for more $$$. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: the idea here being that people wouldn't pay for a sane os for the same reason they won't payfor the sun. ☟︎☟︎
gabriel_laddel: holy fucking god almighty
gabriel_laddel: "I'm not planning on selling Masamune. It will be free and stocked with niceties. Where I do plan to make money..."
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel i was replying to " you wouldn't shell over $100 for it?" strictly.
mircea_popescu: i don't believe that's the only approach, nor did i think it actually was yours, before encountering that line.
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: okay
gabriel_laddel: people buy industrial chemicals, do they not?
gabriel_laddel: how is buying an actually working package manager any different?
gabriel_laddel: "I need to do my job, can't reasonably do it without XYZ, so I'll buy it"
mircea_popescu: as discussed in my example.
mircea_popescu: people do buy chemicals, but they don't buy "chemistry" ☟︎
mircea_popescu: if th efield had needed such a thing, it wouldn't exist at all. ☟︎
BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: Reagents have mass... *nix lax mass
gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: so does sublime text, and yet people fork over $70USD for it
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo ironically, if it's any good it does lack it. if it actually sells then it has it, which is what windows is, basically.
mircea_popescu: ;;google sublime text
gribble: Sublime Text: The text editor you'll fall in love with: <http://www.sublimetext.com/>; Sublime Text - Download: <http://www.sublimetext.com/2>; Sublime Text 3: <http://www.sublimetext.com/3>
mircea_popescu: ...
gabriel_laddel: It's moronic fyi
mircea_popescu: this would be in the category of ipad jackpot simulators i guess.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: But the mass Windows sell for is its scleroisis
mircea_popescu: ayup
BingoBoingo: Seriously A/UX, Solaris 8/9, FreeBSD(ANY) all massless and free
gabriel_laddel: people do buy chemicals, but they don't buy "chemistry" << see hyperchem lite
gabriel_laddel: also, people buy chemistry classes
mircea_popescu: yes, they buy classes, and no hyperchem lite is not Chemistry.
mircea_popescu: but if your thing needs classes you conceivably failed by your own criteria.
BingoBoingo: H2F, H2S04, and Urushiol are all very different very dangerous problems
gabriel_laddel: I don't understand your argument here - you're saying that no one would pay for a working portage because people don't buy "chemistry"?
mircea_popescu: among other things, i am saying that people only move to america if it's free. if it's not free they stay home.
BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: Nah, because people do pay for chemistry. Just the paid parts f chemistry have no portage analogues
BingoBoingo: !up Vexual
gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: Hrm. Interesting argument.
mircea_popescu: not saying that money can't be made out of america, obviously.
BingoBoingo: So, local missouri/illinois wines... not so bad if they are white
gabriel_laddel: one just has to be selling shovels and pickaxes
mircea_popescu: but, essentially, hard to guess by whom.
mircea_popescu: the first railroad company didn't make money, tho railroad was a money maker eventually.
mircea_popescu: symbolics died. the original apple died.
mircea_popescu: the spanish invented the new world mostly to make the dutch (and their later english colony) richer for it. etc.
gabriel_laddel: well that's the game isn't it?
BingoBoingo: Punch trees, get wood
mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel that is a game for much older and richer folk than you, to create a new world.
mircea_popescu: which is exactly the full blown version of my original doubts.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23494 @ 0.000286 = 6.7193 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: So, Illinois moscato... WOuld make great salad dressing
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 136594 @ 0.00029002 = 39.615 BTC [+] {4}
mircea_popescu: http://www.gca.org/ wouldja look at that!
cazalla: BingoBoingo drinking wine? never!
mircea_popescu: and at some point not so long ago this was supposedly a big fucking deal.
mircea_popescu: now that they buried the world under their xml crapolade, they can just go away. nobody's going to go "hey, the shit sucked!111" NOW.
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Purging all the local shit from the premises
mircea_popescu: and back then it was all "nowai it rocks!111 time will show!!1"
BingoBoingo: !up gabriel_laddel
BingoBoingo: !up williamdunne
BingoBoingo: williamdunne: Name some free *nix you may have paid for ☟︎
mircea_popescu: in other news, http://www.joereiss.net/geek/geek.html
BingoBoingo: Vexual: I'll be your mision to the end of the line
BingoBoingo: !up Vexual
BingoBoingo: There is nothing more whorifying than 'Murica
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Present teen movie in binge is "bring it on"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://bookre.org/reader?file=223021&pg=7 << kudos for sf that while outrageous, is at least entertainingly non-retarded.
BingoBoingo: Any volunteer who can put the mass in ass???
BingoBoingo: OMG asciilifeform has me watching all the teen movies
BingoBoingo: Ah asciilifeform films, Missy is the poo so take a big wiff
BingoBoingo: !up goregrind
Vexual: wht mission?
Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtPk5IUbdH0
Vexual: if you're tlking about the kid on the honda, he hit the redline eraly
BingoBoingo: Eliza Dushku, the Jews, and the hard problems
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell asciilifeform here's a thought : we had 15 broken keys when phuctor had seen 159k keys ; and we have 19 now, it's just a shade under 200k. curious if the 1 in 10k thing keeps throughout the 4mn
gribble: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: "bring it on" not bad ascii knows his subject and its tropes
BingoBoingo: !up Vexual We throw people in the air and...
BingoBoingo: Fat people don't go as high
cazalla: http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/05/teen-pleads-guilty-to-23-charges-of-swatting-harassing-online-game-rivals/
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Eliza Dushku is a teen, that storie concerns a nigger
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20800 @ 0.00028425 = 5.9124 BTC [-]
davout: !rated fluffypony
assbot: You have not rated fluffypony.
davout: !rate williamdunne
assbot: Need a name to rate and a rating, optionally comment.
davout: !rated williamdunne
assbot: You have not rated williamdunne.
Vexual: whilliamdune rate seems like an effect sunter
davout: ^does not compute
Vexual: i forgot to put ive
davout: !rate williamdunne 2 met this gentleman IRL
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/729cff644bb3ebe3
Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_QLx2EeJWY
davout: !rate fluffypony 2 met this gentleman IRL, monero
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/d59e319808e4676f
davout: !v assbot:davout.rate.williamdunne.2:a5af029fc769c689cf42e6e4fc7b94bb8817235720bb42c4d85b28f842b0475f
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 2 for williamdunne with note: met this gentleman IRL
davout: !v assbot:davout.rate.fluffypony.2:f4ad7f8067213b71bdaae68b37db05105ff7d876bf942fcfe3290e64a21d2d32
assbot: Successfully added a rating of 2 for fluffypony with note: met this gentleman IRL, monero
fluffypony: !rated davout
assbot: You rated user davout on 20-May-2014, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: Also parlevouses the Francaise and, you know, bitcoin-central and paymium..
fluffypony: !rate davout 3 Has soft, golden locks of hair and a bike. I know this because I've met him irl. 10/10 for style
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/9ec20866f6ffcbfa
davout: :3
Vexual: such meat
fluffypony: !v assbot:fluffypony.rate.davout.3:55f273f8129cdff0147c0443a3a0bfceff23d5f76d8efb6bedb145c6c4753af9
assbot: Successfully updated the rating for davout from 1 to 3 with note: Has soft, golden locks of hair and a bike. I know this because I've met him irl. 10/10 for style
BingoBoingo: Jungle love OEOEOH
BingoBoingo: otherfucker and the Time!!!!
BingoBoingo: Oe Oe Oh
cazalla: that wine must be nice
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Jungle lovw
cazalla: not so sure i'm a fan (not that we have any black women down under)
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Dun you got dem abbos
cazalla: not many around and even fewer full bloods
cazalla: most of em are 1/8 abo at this point
BingoBoingo: Massah if you got dem abbos you can get werk dun
BingoBoingo: OEOEOh Jungle love
cazalla: pink pussy contrasted with the black skin doesn't really do it for me either
cazalla: not that i'd pass up the opportunity to try
BingoBoingo: I dun see why not. Black girls got the best smell on their pinks.
cazalla: i'll have to take your word for it at this point
cazalla: i think i've met.. 3 african women down under
cazalla: all 3 were hambeasts no less
BingoBoingo: Australasia sucks
cazalla: it can.. on the plus side, it's far the fuck away from the rest of hte world and their shit
BingoBoingo: I CHALLENGE THE WELTERWeight NIGGER OF THE WORLD FLOYD MAYWEAther for a bit of freindly sparring
cazalla: lol buttfinex
BingoBoingo: As posessor of a GPG signature in L2 of Assbot's web of trust...I challenge anyone in my L3 trust to contest my in face punching for the real world welterweight championship of face punching
BingoBoingo: ^ ;;later tell gabriel_ladell That is how you break a cartell
cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/05/bitfinex-hot-wallet-possibly-compromised/
scoopbot_revived: Bitfinex Hot Wallet Possibly Compromised http://qntra.net/2015/05/bitfinex-hot-wallet-possibly-compromised/ ☟︎
BingoBoingo: cazalla: ++
BingoBoingo hates
cazalla: that wine?
cazalla: must be some strong shit
BingoBoingo: cazalla: I started with normall cheapo vodka. Watched an alf movie and drank missouri wine over "Mean Girls". Was in a mood drank Illinois white over "Bring it on"
BingoBoingo not disappoint because Eliza Dushku makes Pete Dushenski countable people
cazalla: can't say i've seen mean girls before
BingoBoingo: I've only seen it tonight
BingoBoingo: Bitches were mean
cazalla: i think the last all girl movie i watched was something like the craft
cazalla: buttfinex supposedly got ganked for 500 btc
kakobrekla: details?
cazalla: none yet really, just a notice on their site https://www.bitfinex.com/pages/announcements/?id=35
kakobrekla: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1u6bx3/barclays_charged_me_15_for_a_transfer_from_uk_to/
kakobrekla: lol buttfuckex
kakobrekla: btw i dunno how i got that 1 year reddit in my ircs
davout: "buttfuckex" <<< kekobrekla
kakobrekla: also, you weirdos, if anyone has a 'usaf 596' tube laying around per chance, wtb.
jurov: mod6 sorry, that disadvantage of having staging evironment, posting dev links right and left...shoulda abolish that
jurov: :)
williamdunne: Ey? http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143469 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 07:25:43; BingoBoingo: williamdunne: Name some free *nix you may have paid for
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 65600 @ 0.00028751 = 18.8607 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11035 @ 0.00028425 = 3.1367 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53043 @ 0.00028097 = 14.9035 BTC [-]
jurov: the day of reckoning...buttfinex haxed, trolltalk haxed
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 7000 @ 0.00043275 = 3.0293 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 65500 @ 0.00028023 = 18.3551 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1142882 lol looks like hydrothermal fire reactor ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 02:31:08; mod6: it's "sub ohm" 0.5ohm / Range 15-30W kangeronline.com/products/kanger-subtank-plus-clearomizer
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73916 @ 0.00027815 = 20.5597 BTC [-]
Naphex: so.. bitfinex hacked. just as they switched to AlphaPoint and Microsoft servers
Naphex: how sweet
Naphex: who would've tought
davout: Naphex: "microsoft servers" <<< ???
Apocalyptic: Naphex, that would be hilarious
Naphex: davout: didn't they switch to AlphaPoint Trading Engine?
Naphex: davout: as far as I know its written in c# and runs on wind0s
Adlai: ... which is a giant blob of .net
Adlai: yes
Adlai: https://alphapoint.com/jobs_se.html
Adlai: "We are looking for an individual who can take a leadership role in architecting and developing our core C# platform."
davout: http://new2.fjcdn.com/thumbnails/comments/5532541+_e3c969d7a379937835aaef6c95110b8f.jpg
Adlai: in their defense, they request "Strong capabilities in: C#, .NET; Xamarin, Mono" so maybe they run production trading engines on emulators
Naphex: Adlai: that'd be probably more dumb :P ☟︎
Adlai is glad that he no longer runs scalpl on buttfixen
Adlai: twas sometime between the seventh and eleventh book crossing that we screamed fuckit and drained the account ☟︎
Adlai: the decreasing returns were not worth the increasing derpage
jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143288 yep i ran into it, too. and it also got incompatibly forked, without proper renaming, which "improved" the situation markedly ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 04:21:37; Hasimir: well, that and having to explain to the python-gnupg dev why people might want to sign something with 2 keys
mod6: <+jurov> mod6 sorry, that disadvantage of having staging evironment, posting dev links right and left...shoulda abolish that << no worries :]
mod6: <+kakobrekla> lol buttfuckex << haha
jurov: yo mod6. so either you'll work with the /srv/mailman/.../turds.sqlite directly or supply me at least partial list
jurov: what went into -RELEASE
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 74950 @ 0.00028215 = 21.1471 BTC [+]
mod6: Ok, I can certainly manage coming up with a list of everything that went into -RELEASE. And probably a handfull of others that didn't.
mod6: for instance, 'auto' is in there a bunch of times, but only one version obv. made it in.
jurov: well, you can post it right to the list
mod6: Anyway, np. I'll work on it.
mod6: so with "based on" ... am i undstanding that correctly that column is a link (pointer) to it's previous version?
mike_c: "Excitement!!! Excellence! Launching ahead to better humanity! Ethereum!!! Congratulations!
mike_c: EXCITING :-)" speaking of cults..
jurov: mod6 i was thinking just a version name for both columns
jurov: links can be generated but imo they are not needed
mod6: ok.
jurov: do we have a link for '0.5.3-chicken' anyway?
jurov: that's what most of the patches would be based on
mod6: yeah, the url is: http://thebitcoin.foundation/chicken.tar.gz
jurov: heh ok
jurov: or to the lxr source browser
mod6: oh, now... no we don't have a link to that thing. what is it anyway, i can't recall.
jurov: http://btc.yt/lxr/source/
jurov: lol the phoundation released 5 versions (incl. rc) since feb?
jurov: inb4 next major version "Bitcoin Core 10"
mod6: nothing seems to come up at that link?
jurov: it should redirect to http://btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/
mod6: 5 versions? lol
mod6: oh maybe i didn't wait long enough re redirect
jurov: you can use the latter link
jurov: should be always our newest release
mod6: heheh, redirect works fine with lynx, seems to not work well with FF. ☟︎
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27350 @ 0.00028754 = 7.8642 BTC [+] {2}
mod6: ok cool. i'll add a link up there in just a bit.
asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu thing is still largely loading moduli missed (due to db locking idiocy) the first time around.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mod6: think i'll just add a "links" section
mod6: asciilifeform: haha, yeha, mine is now queued with 5419 in front of it. haha, oh well. :]
asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu aaaand somehow '19' turned into '18' !?! (i do have a db backup, so if this is enemy action they can go fuck themselves.)
gribble: The operation succeeded.
asciilifeform: incidentally, now more than ever is the time to set up an sks server under our control. because sks is our ultimate 'backup' ☟︎
asciilifeform: and the pressure on sks server keepers to start removing things will be turned on, yes.
mod6: jurov: ok added link to that under "Links". That ok with you?
jurov: yes
asciilifeform: aaaactually my understanding is that one of the 19 got requeued, which 'un-broke' it. say hello to our first annoying bug.
asciilifeform: (which will not be an issue once werker runs continuously)
asciilifeform: http://nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/602BCEE3339AE47E388CA9A5472A563CFB8F73F66CCB3E69553B41BF6261ACBE << it was, of course, anvin's
jurov: you haven't used the hyperadvanced lisp runtime that can be snapshottet and restarted?
jurov: if they cycle you once in a week
asciilifeform: jurov: the thing has no lisp or anything else interesting in it
jurov: dunno where i got the notion from
asciilifeform: jurov: and i will point out that it is quite impossible to build a guaranteed power-cycle-immune anything on a standard x86 pc, which doesn't even have a powerfail interrupt
jurov: i'm not talking about immunity. only restartability
asciilifeform: (just getting atomic writes (sort-of) on such a box requires disk controller with battery compartment)
asciilifeform: jurov: the submission thing is a hastily-written script.
asciilifeform: (the sks mass-submit, that is)
decimation: asciilifeform: not to mention the nmi
jurov: incidentally, this appeared on hn today: https://www.tindie.com/products/ubldit/truerng-hardware-random-number-generator/
jurov: "Internal Whitening" ftw ☟︎
asciilifeform: jurov: realize that folks have been selling rng since at least late '70s
asciilifeform: jurov: and yes, they are typically 'best practices' retarded - e.g., 'whitening' etc
decimation: part of the problem is as ascii has identified - you really want every part to be inspectible by the end user
decimation: the only other method I can think that is reasonably acceptable in this way is radiactive decay
asciilifeform: apparently i can discuss my designs all i want without fear of being 'scooped' because 'everybody' thinks i'm entirely batshit.
asciilifeform: no one - certainly not 'hackernews' imbeciles who ship their hardware with winblows drivers because 'consumer has come to expect' - give a flying fuck about auditability, etc.
asciilifeform: in other news,
asciilifeform: http://trilema.com/2015/more-factored-rsa-keys-and-assorted-other-considerations/#comment-114308
decimation: if someone is interested in the radioactive decay, I would look at herr walker's hotbits > http://www.fourmilab.ch/hotbits/
asciilifeform: decimation: there are some 'gotchas' to using geigers
decimation: asciilifeform: your earlier analogy of the deer kneeling before the hunter is apt
decimation: soon the hunter 'comes to expect'
asciilifeform: for one thing, the material, well... decays. at predictable rate.
decimation: heh yeah.
asciilifeform: for another, the process of geiger tube going off is rf-noisy
decimation: that's true, it is
asciilifeform: tube also wears out very quickly ☟︎
decimation: that I didn't know
asciilifeform: that is really the main reason i do not use geiger for rng personally
decimation: oh yeah that sucks
asciilifeform: it wears out in the same way as a fluorescent light bulb does
asciilifeform: filament 'sputters' onto the walls
asciilifeform: in the case of geiger tube, the fill gas is also 'poisoned' by said process, iirc
decimation: yeah that makes sense
asciilifeform: phun phakt: virtually no one is still making geiger tubes commercially
decimation: tubes just don't do well with gaseous filling
decimation: no my understanding is that folks are 'recycling' old soviet tubes mainly
asciilifeform: almost entire world is relying on the - finite and mostly russian - cold war supplies
asciilifeform: aha
decimation: which probably have some variation themselves
asciilifeform: geiger tubes are no more difficult to make than light bulbs, but someone has to -do- it
Apocalyptic: "Similarly, the modulus of Peter Anvin's key is also divisible by 19 and 7704959, in addition to 3, 7 and 11 as" // I have found these two additional primes as well, and only those 2
decimation: yeah I suspect that most nuclear facilities have golden toilet budgets for fancier stuff
asciilifeform: (incidentally, strong's 'experimental physics' (see logs) describes how to make one)
asciilifeform: Apocalyptic: care to comment on the 'is transformation same as picking random N for modulus' thing ?
Apocalyptic: "2) The public exponent is changed to 281479271743489" for which key ?
asciilifeform: Apocalyptic: all of the ones discussed thus far.
asciilifeform: why - remains unknown
Apocalyptic: asciilifeform, If I get some time I will, it requires a more carefull analysis that it may seem
Apocalyptic: asciilifeform, even the HPA's invalid subkey ? I thought pgpdump showed me e = 65537
asciilifeform: Apocalyptic: at present, we have sufficient info to birth these on demand from legit keys. but we do not know the magic trick which yields decryption (it does not necessarily take the shape of a private key! and may not even -exist- for every possible starting legit key)
Apocalyptic: "RSA e(17 bits) - 01 00 01" on the last two Public Subkey Packet
asciilifeform: Apocalyptic: you are correct. only applies to -every key in The List-
Apocalyptic: aha
asciilifeform: notice it does not include the faux-anvin
asciilifeform: how that one was made - remains unknown
Apocalyptic: asciilifeform, by the way do you have any explanation as to why pgpdump skips the KeyID field on invalid subkeys ?
asciilifeform: Apocalyptic: not at present. will probably end up spending some quality time with the sourc
asciilifeform: e
asciilifeform: incidentally, now is a good time to mention the fact that sks also contains a great many keys which were too malformed to even attempt phuctoring
asciilifeform: (and they make pgpdump unhappy, in various ways, yes.)
Apocalyptic: quite amusing that 281479271743489 has 65537 as one of its 3 prime factors, those cosmic rays have a sense of humour ☟︎
asciilifeform: aha.
asciilifeform: they sure do.
asciilifeform: i still regard it as not entirely unlikely that the attack is a pure 'dos'
asciilifeform: and that no one attempted to actually derive the corresponding privates
chetty: http://money.cnn.com/2015/05/22/technology/adult-friendfinder-hacked/index.html ☟︎
asciilifeform: l0l! that thing actually existed as something other than spam ads ?! ☟︎
asciilifeform: and people -paid- for it?!
asciilifeform: and pwned by no less than weev himself? l0l
asciilifeform: or nm
chetty: someone getting ideas from fetlife :D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39250 @ 0.00028103 = 11.0304 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62246 @ 0.00028103 = 17.493 BTC [-]
ben_vulpes: http://dpaste.com/1SJBXB5.txt << previous experience lead me to expect `make install` to, well, install all of the relevant things. trinque, asciilifeform: any obvious mistakes or bad thoughts on my part you'd care to rectify?
trinque: ben_vulpes: I bet process_rpower_integration(order,
trinque: payment_info
trinque: if method and method.processor == 'rpower'
trinque: else None)
trinque: ah fuck
trinque: hahahaha
trinque: ben_vulpes: I BET LD_LIBRARY_PATH IS WEIRD ON OS X
ben_vulpes: nah this is gentoo
ben_vulpes: thanks for the python bro
trinque: now everybody knows lisp has weirded up the way I do my parenthesis
trinque: ben_vulpes: lemme fix a thing and then I'll see how that compares to my build of dieharder
ben_vulpes: i'm in no rush
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22604 @ 0.00027831 = 6.2909 BTC [-]
jurov: ben_vulpes: check if you have /usr/local/lib in /etc/ld.so.conf
jurov: and run ldconfig
jurov: any time libraries are installed, ldconfig should be ran
ben_vulpes: <jurov> and run ldconfig << that was it
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23646 @ 0.00028474 = 6.733 BTC [+]
ben_vulpes: "use libtool" << so as to speak "just type libtool at the prompt"
ben_vulpes: `curl log.bitcoin-assets.com | sudo sh`
ben_vulpes: WCGW™
ben_vulpes: thanks jurov
jurov: how did you hook up the rng in the end?
jurov: since i have rpi, i'd have just used gpio pin.. you have no hw with gpio?
ben_vulpes: no hw with gpio, but now that you mention rpi mebbe i should try that
ben_vulpes: was going to wire it up to a microphone
ben_vulpes: but now mebbe raspi!
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: microphone probably won't work, it being ac-coupled
asciilifeform: you'd have to use intervals between spikes as the entropy
jurov: yes i'm curious what will be the best sampling method.. timing the pulses with some fast counter? ☟︎
ben_vulpes: i was anticipating some really lame dsp-by-hand
asciilifeform will be out in meatspace for weekend, with sporadic connectivity
jurov: https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=4715 not very encouraging
jurov: ;;seen assbot
gribble: assbot was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 22 minutes and 34 seconds ago: <assbot> [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23646 @ 0.00028474 = 6.733 BTC [+]
jurov: kakobrekla: ^
jurov: or maybe it's just slow, is there some attack?
kakobrekla: !s test
assbot: 1302 results for 'test' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=test
kakobrekla: hm?
jurov: it did not fetch the title
kakobrekla: thats cause mp/cp fucked up one of his servers ☟︎
jurov: hooray for bisp
kakobrekla: that was pre bisp
kakobrekla: log1 server
kakobrekla: anyway someone else can run proxy title parser and ill use that
kakobrekla: shit even i can run it.
jurov: lol
jurov: glad to be helpful
kakobrekla: lesson learned; never talk.
jurov: you can always !down yourself
kakobrekla: cant, still have my lower pair of ribs
jurov: lampelina can !down you then
kakobrekla: only if assbot allows
jurov: quite an arrangement, this ☟︎
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25253 @ 0.00028573 = 7.2155 BTC [+] {2}
kakobrekla: ba comes with all sorts of implications
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49147 @ 0.00028975 = 14.2403 BTC [+] {2}
ben_vulpes: weirdos
jurov: !up Kalki
Kalki: Greetings
jurov: Hello, what brings you around?
kakobrekla bets on rsa
Kalki: Not much just seeing if anything interesting is being discussed
jurov: yes, check out our logs
Kalki: Pretty newb around these parts but find it quite refreshing as I have been swimming in the shallow btc waters looking for honesty
kakobrekla: !gettrust Kalki
assbot: Kalki is not registered in WoT.
kakobrekla: any honest to be found is there
jurov: !h
assbot: http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/irc_bots/assbot
jurov: um.. i wanted the "first steps"
jurov: anyway it's linked from there
kakobrekla: somebody actually fixed that so it does not include gribble anymore
Kalki: Kakobrekla - do you mean get it together with a wot setup? Or what does !gettrust mean?
jurov: yes, set up the wot
Kalki: Yeah been meaning to... Still reading and catching up -
jurov: better sooner than later... before the new account fee rises again
kakobrekla: lol
jurov: jkjk
Kalki: Wait - it's not the same as the fee for mpex is it?
kakobrekla: wot is free
Kalki: Nm I will look later
Kalki: Oh ok
Kalki: Yeah thought so
mircea_popescu: unless gabriel_laddel finds a way to charge for it...
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform lol did a key become unfactored ?
mircea_popescu: by the way, for the putative folk with a rediscovered number theory fondness among the readers : https://primes.utm.edu/notes/conjectures/ is not bad.
mircea_popescu: especially seeing how plenty of the conjectures that are still open problems are around a century old.
ben_vulpes: is gabriel_laddel's business model really that bad?
ben_vulpes: professional services and licenses for the custom ware the software so produced run on?
trinque: ben_vulpes: he's apparently going to help me install his masamune this weekend
ben_vulpes: oooh
ben_vulpes: can i come
trinque: sure
trinque: I found his repo, built it and bitched that it didn't work :D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60700 @ 0.00029268 = 17.7657 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: WIP, no shame in that
trinque: and no, I personally don't think anyone will ever pay for such a thing enough to sustain its development
trinque: gotta bolt it to some service he'd provide with the thing that's desirable on its own
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes in particular it's unclear to me how wise the "licenses" angle is for a serenissima derivative. while i declined to anull IP when diametric asked earlier, i am very very far from any sort of belief that the current model of that stack of stupidity has any sort of hope for survival.
mircea_popescu: the notion that one'll make money from "licenses" in the future... heh. not such a great plan.
trinque: mircea_popescu: I take that as "we'll figure out the business model later" when I hear it
mircea_popescu: he did seem of the "i feel like hacking on this so fu" persuasion.
mircea_popescu: nttawwt, especially at his age
trinque: "people pay for me; I have value"
trinque: ok
trinque: :D
trinque: yeah my mother has no problem with me living on her couch either; doesn't mean I do it
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2010/literara-este-grea/#selection-67.314-67.436
mircea_popescu: sadly, in romanian.
trinque: also the selection thing is scrolling to the paragraph involved, but not selecting
mircea_popescu: so much weird in the browsers....
trinque: Chrome 42.0.2311.152 (64-bit) Gentoo
trinque: yup, errata everywhere
mircea_popescu: if any of you ever getting unexpected behaviour feel for some unknown reason a compulsion to debug the whys and wherefores, i would certainly listen
mircea_popescu: but i can't be sending people on this snipe expedition because i am a poorfag.
mircea_popescu: hiring interview "mr X we will need you to debug all the browsers." "that's fine, but i will need all the moneys" "we only have a fraction of the moneys" "then i can debug a fraction of the browsers" "well... that isn't useful is it now."
trinque: heh, I was just mentioning elsewhere that the only right way to write browser JS is in the mode of a schizoid paranoiac, suspecting all but the most basic features of it of trying to steal your precious bodily fluids
trinque: mircea_popescu: Uncaught IndexSizeError: Failed to execute 'setEnd' on 'Range': The offset 419 is larger than or equal to the node's length (0).
mircea_popescu: o.O
trinque: the line which is 623 on trilema.com/2010/literara-este-grea/
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2010/literara-este-grea/#selection-67.316-67.434 ?
trinque: Uncaught IndexSizeError: Failed to execute 'setEnd' on 'Range': The offset 118 is larger than or equal to the node's length (0).
trinque: borken maffs?
mircea_popescu: for chrome only ?!
trinque: that JS does have the human hair, glue and googly eyes look to it
trinque: mircea_popescu: if I call scrollToHash in the console myself, it works
trinque: smells like a race condition
mircea_popescu: weird.
jurov: any such stuff must be done delayed, not immediately
jurov: in onLoad/onDOMReady handler
jurov: (maybe it is i haven't looked)
mircea_popescu: jurov well it is at the end of the page.
jurov: i'd expect such problems still
jurov: one of these "schizoid paranoiac" things i rather always follow
trinque: jurov: he's got a delay in there of 500ms
jurov: ah. just my 2 satoshi
trinque: all this checking for null shit... beatings
trinque: when you JS, you must resist the temptation to think like JS, haha
trinque: no prototype chains, no "new", no nothing
mircea_popescu: nothing is a js thing ?
jurov: different kinds of
trinque: mircea_popescu: I'd use something like this to fire it off https://github.com/dperini/ContentLoaded/blob/master/src/contentloaded.js
trinque: "are your really, really, really ready browser?"
mircea_popescu: obviously i read dperini as derperini
trinque: lol
mircea_popescu: no fucking way am i adding 50 lines of code to deal with chrome's speshul.
trinque: window.onload = initScrollToHash;
trinque: setTimeout(initScrollToHash, 500);
trinque: ^ looks like hax trying to deal with it
trinque: he's saying run it at whatever the browser thinks load is, and also 500ms later because reasons
trinque: classic JS programmer tic
mircea_popescu: heh
trinque: and also, it works for me on certain pages, not others
mircea_popescu: win.
trinque: so 500ms is likely not enough... sometimes
mircea_popescu: does it work on same page if reload ?
trinque: mircea_popescu: jquery literally spin-checks to work around this
jurov: a clue: i get delayed errors for avatars in chrome console. maybe it's related
trinque: mircea_popescu: no, does not work on the original page in question
trinque: after refresh
jurov: if it won't work till all avatars load, that would explain why it works on some pages
mircea_popescu: so what, doesn't make dom available until the missing linked images timeout ?
mircea_popescu: that's classy.
jurov: yeah that's sooo derpy
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143542 << aaaannnd here we go. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 09:42:10; scoopbot_revived: Bitfinex Hot Wallet Possibly Compromised http://qntra.net/2015/05/bitfinex-hot-wallet-possibly-compromised/
trinque: ah!
trinque: yeah, looks to be "page with comments == borken"
trinque: that holds after a bit of spot checking
trinque: yup, I thought at first it was "long page", but newp, works fine on long pages long as there aren't comments
mircea_popescu: yeah tis missing avatars.
mircea_popescu: i'm not fixing this.
jurov pours himself some wine
trinque: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74dJMT75csk
mircea_popescu: jurov better hurry up with that wine, bingo's asleep and cazalla not up yet.
mircea_popescu: b-a is trying to keep one guy drunk at all times, a sort of olympic... flame.
trinque: this browser thing needs a look someday, has to go
jurov: obsolete all browsers!
trinque: n+1 standards!
trinque: haha
trinque: but come on, gimme a sandboxed lisp-ish thing, let it grab text over sockets, draw pretty pictures on a rectangle, done
scoopbot_revived: The Bed Sitting Room http://trilema.com/2015/the-bed-sitting-room/
jurov: trinque: are you aware what was ecmascript inspired by?
trinque: I sure am
trinque: "inspired"
trinque: jurov: eich even said it shoulda been a scheme later
trinque: but forget the whole dom braindamage; that probably would've remained if he had
trinque: just gimme drawing in a rectangle, and let people write higher level widgetry things atop that
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143587 << yeah i dun see how that's in their defense. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 13:41:19; Naphex: Adlai: that'd be probably more dumb :P
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143589 << wait, srsly ?! ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 13:42:24; Adlai: twas sometime between the seventh and eleventh book crossing that we screamed fuckit and drained the account
Adlai: ya srsly
Adlai currently has negative net bitcoin debt
mircea_popescu: sigh.
jurov: bitcoinica forever
mircea_popescu: then "everyone" (of the idiots) is simply copying their "price" and then the world derps abouit how "capitalism creates economic cycles"
mircea_popescu: no dude. capitalism is not involved. stop being a herd of idiots wtf.
mircea_popescu: this is like "decentralization doesn't work becasue we all used the same copy of decentralized software and got ownered"
Adlai: who's copying what price?
Adlai: last i checked 1 DOGE = 1 DOGE
mircea_popescu: Adlai isn't buttfinex the one of the web exchanges with the largest random number published under "volume" ?
Adlai: they at least charge their customers for helping them boost that number
mircea_popescu: allegedly.
Adlai: either way, their order book has been crossing at an increasingly frequent rate
Adlai: screenshots all over the reddits, for the curious
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143625 x.x ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 14:24:52; mod6: heheh, redirect works fine with lynx, seems to not work well with FF.
mircea_popescu: Adlai it's actually in my reports, too. the part i hadn't read thereof.
mircea_popescu has been skipping the web exchanges header for... months, now.
Adlai has brought scalpl for some drydock, next voyage planned for the cross-chain seas
jurov: any stats how much it made?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143634 << yeah fo sho. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 14:29:20; asciilifeform: incidentally, now more than ever is the time to set up an sks server under our control. because sks is our ultimate 'backup'
Adlai: no
mircea_popescu: how goes mats ?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143652 "the path to truth is correctly hiding all the places we're lying to ourselves!" ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 14:57:39; jurov: "Internal Whitening" ftw
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143669 << this is a largest concern. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 15:03:03; asciilifeform: tube also wears out very quickly
mircea_popescu: it's not only that it wears off quickly, it wears off as a function of... HOW MUCH IT DETECTED
Adlai: jurov: there's lots of data, but motivation to do anything scalpl-related is currently at all-time lows
jurov: where were we with S.MPOE?
jurov: it was not feasible or?
Adlai wanted to build a simulator to check feasibility
mircea_popescu: tandem arrangements can to some degree help, but it gets rapidly iffy (tandem arrangements of radiation detectors are fundamentally looking at the same event, at least some of the time - not so with electronic noise like cardano measures, where tandem detectors are actually looking at distinct events)
jurov: ohno... this mpex simulator stuff again
Adlai: it's not necessary, but the alternative is to not simulate, which requires an account
jurov: i can give you access to mpexagent
Adlai: !s mpexagent
assbot: 7 results for 'mpexagent' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=mpexagent
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143704 << the problem with multiplication in these ethereal numeric bodies is that it has about as many gotchas as memory allocation in c. and most of them plenty unintuitive. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 15:23:45; Apocalyptic: quite amusing that 281479271743489 has 65537 as one of its 3 prime factors, those cosmic rays have a sense of humour
mircea_popescu: who the fuck knows what exactly multiplying the exponent by a factor in the key does.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143709 << lmao! ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 15:28:17; chetty: http://money.cnn.com/2015/05/22/technology/adult-friendfinder-hacked/index.html
mircea_popescu: mp does fetlife, weev does aff. i guess i lose out huh.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143748 << golden standard is what alf presented, oscilloscope coupling ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 17:49:51; jurov: yes i'm curious what will be the best sampling method.. timing the pulses with some fast counter?
jurov: so ben_vulpes will then use camera to get the random bits off osciloscope?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143773 << lol ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 18:19:06; jurov: quite an arrangement, this
mircea_popescu: jurov i just meant the type of coupling!
mircea_popescu: hateur
mircea_popescu: incidentally, asciilifeform & all : is b-a pgp going to use vsh for hashing ?
Adlai: (... but this requires customized JSON parser at the receiving side, that isn't always practical.) << pffffff (setf json:*real-handler* (lambda (string) (parse-float string :type 'rational)))
mircea_popescu: apparently it goes with cramer-shoup
mircea_popescu: !s cramer-shoup
assbot: 6 results for 'cramer-shoup' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=cramer-shoup
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49941 @ 0.00027815 = 13.8911 BTC [-]
cazalla: mircea_popescu, jurov's wine is safe, i prefer a half dozen cup of teas in the morning, not wine
mircea_popescu: !up ascii_modem
ascii_modem: vsh << good but we want it in tandem with, e.g., whirlpool
mircea_popescu: yes
ascii_modem: hash with each, concat, sign
mircea_popescu: well not sure abotu concat
ascii_modem: rng sampling << shift register , external clock, optocouplers
ascii_modem: not hard (tm)
ascii_modem: unfactored ?! << see log
mircea_popescu: yeh i saw. awell
trinque: ;;later tell gabriel_laddel "I see no reason I can't sell computers pre-loaded with Masamune." be careful, you're underestimating the colossal difficulty of this and there are old skeletons on old battlefields that thought the same. *do you have the connections to make these sales to big businesses, militaries, private schools, and so on?* ☟︎
gribble: The operation succeeded.
trinque: gabriel_laddel | trinque: guy's never sold a thing in his life << lol << ftr this is exactly why I said this
trinque: "yeah I could see people buying this" is not a sales strategy
trinque: what I'd do is try to land a client that gives no shits about masamune, but needs something it can do
trinque: and try to land the client first, don't just assume it'll happen when you're ready
trinque: I've had deals that took two years to close
trinque: strike that, four on one
trinque: then you set up your contract with them such that they're paying for the specific tool, and establish with them that the license for that is distinct from the one for Masamune
trinque: and the above is by no means saying that'd be easy
cazalla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-05-2015#1143710 <<< that site got me laid quite a few times ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 22-05-2015 15:29:17; asciilifeform: l0l! that thing actually existed as something other than spam ads ?!
cazalla: was sorta like tinder for people like me in their 20's 10 years ago
mircea_popescu: http://bookre.org/reader?file=223021&pg=11 << and sadly, it died.
mircea_popescu: seriously, you "can't spy on military" because magic ? srsly, "time is his for the asking" for being FAMOUS ? gtfo.
kakobrekla: http://qntra.net/2015/05/bitfinex-hot-wallet-possibly-compromised/ < something is off with the link to bc.info ?
scoopbot_revived: The 787 experience. http://www.contravex.com/2015/05/22/the-787-experience/
cazalla: kakobrekla, should work now, https://blockchain.info/address/17owg8RWb73qfE5HeQk6gg6RAgEUfxPXks is the address anyway
kakobrekla: more buttcoin dripping in
mircea_popescu: lulzy
funkenstein_: ah man I wish I were in Zurri now too
trinque: http://www.theverge.com/2015/5/21/8634437/google-internet-of-things-software-report << coupla companies releasing "internet of things" operating systems. I've said a few times that this is a good market entrypoint for a small lisp machine
trinque: right alongside a bunch of competitors that are going to get brutalized by hackers
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform check it out, all the nontrivial factors found have very interesting binary symmetries.
mircea_popescu: key 4.1 : 17742509903907 = 1000000100011 0000000000000000000 1000000100011
mircea_popescu: key 4.2 : 4294967297 = 100000000000000000000000000000001
mircea_popescu: key 5.1 : 7301444404 = 1101100 11001100 11001100 1100110100
mircea_popescu: key 5.2 : 270582939711 = 111111 00000000000000000000000000 111111
mircea_popescu: key 6.1 : like key 4.2.
mircea_popescu: key 6.1 : absent
mircea_popescu: key 7.1 : 98784247831 = 1011100000000000000000000000000010111
mircea_popescu: key 7.2 : 30064771079 = 11100000000000000000000000000000111
mircea_popescu: key 8.1 : 12884901891 = 1100000000000000000000000000000011
mircea_popescu: key 8.2 : 21474836485 = 10100000000000000000000000000000101
mircea_popescu: key 9.1 : like key 4.2.
mircea_popescu: key 9.2 : absent
mircea_popescu: key 10.1 : 4294967297 = like key 4.2.
mircea_popescu: key 10.2 : 12884901891 = 1100000000000000000000000000000011
kakobrekla: looks like comic ray to me.
mircea_popescu: let's try and count the types. first, there's two types with key 4.2. type T1.1 like 4.x and 10.x, which include a central symmetry factor 2nd key ; type T1.2 like 6.x and 9.x which does not
mircea_popescu: then there's central symmetry like in 7.1 or 4.2, but there's also simple repeating like in 4.1
mircea_popescu: and some keys are made of modules with two central symmetry factors, whereas some other keys only include one
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla verily.
hanbot: 5.1 and 7.1 better example of repeating, 101 could be just like 100000100011. 11/101/111 are all symmetric to so you don't know.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58697 @ 0.0002805 = 16.4645 BTC [+] {2}
funkenstein_: whoa palindromic primes
hanbot: looks like a good heuristic of what factors to try first
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53561 @ 0.00028575 = 15.3051 BTC [+] {2}
scoopbot_revived: Six Months In, OKCoin Relinquish Control Of Bitcoin.com http://qntra.net/2015/05/six-months-in-okcoin-relinquish-control-of-bitcoin-com/
funkenstein_: big congrats go out to phuctor team from dwarven contingency
funkenstein_: is there a story to go with the triangle on the middle finger?
funkenstein_: the diode?
jurov: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/patches.html propped up...but it looks no one signed someone's other patch yet?
ben_vulpes: mmm i have
jurov: can you tell where/when?
ben_vulpes: right before the release
ben_vulpes: xmitted a *mess* of resigned patches
ben_vulpes: probably fucked it up some way
jurov: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000070.html this, i guess
jurov: looks like you haven't used the patch IDs
mircea_popescu: funkenstein_ the what now ?
mircea_popescu: hanbot yeah actually, not bad heuristic.
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> ben_vulpes in particular it's unclear to me how wise the "licenses" angle is for a serenissima derivative. while i declined to anull IP when diametric asked earlier, i am very very far from any sort of belief that the current model of that stack of stupidity has any sort of hope for survival. << i figured (perhaps stupidly) that IP would take the form of gpg signatures on "i will not
ben_vulpes: send this code around to anyone
mircea_popescu: if anyone feels like downloading phuctor's P and trying all these types of divisors on it see if we already contain one
ben_vulpes: else", unenforceable just like the rest of the gpg contracts
mircea_popescu: seeing how it wouldn't trigger unless we find two
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes and how do you distinguish who squelched ?
ben_vulpes: y'can't, i know.
ben_vulpes: but for a bezzleplay, it ain't bad.
mircea_popescu: i don't get how it'd work.