273 entries in 0.815s
decimation: asciilifeform: yeah I think in this case it was a
z80 clone
mircea_popescu: so, why ? why did the geniuses of mit fare so very much worse than the rag tag band of idiots and imbeciles coding for
z80 in their bedrooms ?
mircea_popescu: in any case, claiming a
z80 and a pentium 6 are "99.84% identical" on the grounds of mass spectrometry is about as apt.
mircea_popescu: jurov: if it's possible to place 4 such transistors on mm2 then
z80 would fit into 20cm2 << this, basically, is my point. 20 sqcm is not really a big deal. and the number of people who might do it just to play the original Chaos on their pet rock is not negligible.
mircea_popescu: jurov: lol good discussion started from the
z80. now, what if we start with piece of germanium/galena/carborundum/whatever << si carbide prolly most promising, or maybe some particular graphite formulations.
jurov: if it's possible to place 4 such transistors on mm2 then
z80 would fit into 20cm2
jurov: lol good discussion started from the
z80. now, what if we start with piece of germanium/galena/carborundum/whatever
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> jurov:
z80 is closer to teletype than to any modern cpu << again nope. here's a suggested exercise for everyone: take the
z80 (find a die shot or whatever) and zoom it out to make the transistors discrete. how much physical space will this occupy? how many tonnes of copper wire? how many hundreds kWatt of power used? for chillers? << Sometime in 2013 on Tardstalk to celebrate advent of the "ASIC Age" I drunkenly pr
mircea_popescu: the reason
z80 era was secure was because governments, generally, COULD NOT be involved
mircea_popescu: i merely wish to point out that i had better games on the
z80 than on the ipad.
jurov:
z80 is closer to teletype than to any modern cpu
jurov: how long it takes a
z80 to make or verify ECDSA signature?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: but to somehow lay out electrical logic elements at the customary densities << you're right that it's the wrong thought, and also, "customary" - honestly even making something like a
z80, as long as it can be made at home, with equipment costing about what a
z80 cost, is well worth it.
BingoBoingo: I overclocked a couple for people who had pirate
Z80 (gameboy) games
BingoBoingo: cazalla: You and your non-
z80 based nintendos
mircea_popescu: "Is that a real program or is that something somebody wrote?" << ah yea, now this makes sense. i had the exact same notion, for exactly the same reason. a "real program" was something that didn't need to use the
z80 basic interpreter, wasn't editable for this reason, and this immutability was cool. then on the msdos system, .exe binaries exactly mapped on this same structure of cool.
assbot: An Interview With Bil Herd - Zany
Z80 Zygology | The Amp Hour Electronics Podcast
decimation: it seems like a port of minix to the
z80 kinda
X-Rob: asciilifeform: I'm a collector of old
Z80 hardware.
mircea_popescu: i'm like... dude i used to make that stuff, in basic, on a
z80 mircea_popescu: i edit everything. i actually learned to program by randomly poking and peeking in the
z80 memory.
X-Rob: BingoBoingo: It's amusing that the single 'LDIR'
Z80 opcode took until SSE2 to be duplicated. 1 clock cycle to move any 8 bit chunk of memory around.
X-Rob: BingoBoingo:
Z80 would be my favourite, as that's what I grew up with. I actually collect vintage computers.
mircea_popescu: in this spirit : my old
z80 clone had an english "codeword" instruction set printed out right on the kbd, as was fashionable at the time.
mircea_popescu: back in the day on the
z80 you could define the 8x8 bitmap of a glyph
mircea_popescu: my
z80 keyboard had plain language on it : load, merge, save etc
bounce: generating 4kbit keys takes over a minute? try validating a 1kbit signature on a
z80 (certain ti calculators with signed firmware)
Diablo-D3: yeah
z80 is the best 8bit microcontroller cpu ever
bounce: it's a good example since (I'm told, haven't investigated) various smart card type things have a
z80-type core on board
BingoBoingo: bounce: I like the
Z80 as an example to suppose.
bounce: you were talking about
z80, and I thought it was interesting enough to explore that a bit. still have a kaypro in an attic somewhere. should probably dust if off some time
BingoBoingo: bounce: Did I ever offer
Z80 as an only option? I would kill for a multicore gigahertz class Coldfire dev board rated for server use
bounce: anyway, mind sticking to the topic and present some viable engineering choices that'll work on
z80? (as distinct from your personal preferences that work plenty fine on your desktop)
bounce: too bad the
z80 doesn't do that
BingoBoingo: Still which of {C,Java} works best on
Z80?
BingoBoingo: Java programmers who merely stitch together libraries and want embeded chips capable of running Java when a
Z80 would be fine
mircea_popescu: nubbins` that korea story reminds me of playing old
z80 games
mircea_popescu: it's the
z80 calling the 386 itopathic, never the other way around
mircea_popescu: in that gaming consoles at the time were also
z80 clones)
mircea_popescu: (and the
z80 before the pc, which i suppose could be argued to be a gaming console,
mircea_popescu: i wonder if bfl next step, after tackling the android miner market, is to make
z80 miner software.
Korbman: early
Z80 was 4 micrometers
mircea_popescu: that box actually looks like the custom power unit i had for my old
z80 mircea_popescu: they literally broadcast the code. you could load it into a
z80 with a cable