⏐︎ 17024
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16150 @ 0.00099361 = 16.0468 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.04260302 = 0.1704 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06695 = 0.1339 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0686799 = 0.1374 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12650 @ 0.00099475 = 12.5836 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04489993 = 0.1347 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: hey BingoBoingo
BingoBoingo: hey thestringpuller
thestringpuller: you should see it. you'd love it
BingoBoingo: I guess I have to now
thestringpuller: makes me secretly root for the Athletics
thestringpuller: Go Oakland
thestringpuller: along with the Braves lol
BingoBoingo: Yeah, Oakland seems to be a lot of people's "other favorite"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06612 = 0.1984 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.4900012 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10350 @ 0.00099533 = 10.3017 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.49 = 1.96 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 33 @ 0.06784682 = 2.2389 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14781 @ 0.00099384 = 14.6899 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.00491234 = 0.4912 BTC [-] {8}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.0671 = 0.671 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.NSA] 27190 @ 0.00016371 = 4.4513 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 14 @ 0.06546913 = 0.9166 BTC [-] {13}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.03408166 = 0.2045 BTC [+] {4}
thestringpuller: BingoBoingo: who is your team?
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Cardinals.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.03749999 = 0.1125 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 12 @ 0.03781332 = 0.4538 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11904 @ 0.00099357 = 11.8275 BTC [-]
thestringpuller: haha that was one of the best series' last season
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Yeah, I always like our series with the braves, because it is always two solid high performing teams.
BingoBoingo: None of this Marlins bullshit where everything is predicated on Fernandez pitching and Stanton hitting.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04256766 = 0.1277 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0672 = 0.1344 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: well
benkay: what does q2 have in store for us?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14100 @ 0.00099357 = 14.0093 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: benkay: Is there an emoticon for the awkward turtle?
benkay: not that i'd know, BingoBoingo
benkay: the depth of my emoticon language is like >.>
BingoBoingo: benkay: Well my prediction for the US 2014 Q2 - 2015 Q3 is plenty of awkwardness.
benkay: whaddaya mean by awkwardness though? derpy 'founder's of more tender years than i?
benkay: or just this dancing-around-trying-to-grab-each-others-nuts that is the price finding game in the absence of a clear price signal
BingoBoingo: benkay: I'm just thinking of what Putin is doing in Ukraine vs. Bush-Obama in the US. It's going to force a lot of soul searching at the top of the US about the essence of being a super power when mapped onto results.
BingoBoingo: I doubt action of the favoritism that promotes golden toilet worship, this tension has been around awhile (see the late Col Hackworth)
BingoBoingo: I'd be on the lookout for quiet, coded realizations in print that the US fell out of Superpower status without the fanfare of other's who have left the club in the past.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15800 @ 0.00099515 = 15.7234 BTC [+] {3}
BingoBoingo: benkay: The economic grabass in the US will probably follow from this and the already documented economic malstructuring
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4172 @ 0.00099548 = 4.1531 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5834 @ 0.0009955 = 5.8077 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 25 @ 0.02984668 = 0.7462 BTC [-] {10}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7700 @ 0.00099357 = 7.6505 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.4999999 = 1 BTC [+]
bitcoinpete: ;;later tell benkay i'll work on that :D
gribble: The operation succeeded.
bitcoinpete: in case anyone missed this:
bitcoinpete: http://bitcoinpete.com/2014/the-brokenness-of-maidsafe/
ozbot: The Brokenness of MaidSafe | When Bitcoin Met Pete
bitcoinpete: maidsafe probably isn't going to gain much traction anyways, but i thought i'd call it out just to be sure.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11393 @ 0.00099357 = 11.3197 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: bitcoinpete: Doing so is always a good exercise
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.06601051 = 0.6601 BTC [-]
bitcoinpete: BingoBoingo: gotta flex those muscles, touch those toes once in a while
BingoBoingo: bitcoinpete: Yeah
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5215 @ 0.00099521 = 5.19 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9534 @ 0.0009966 = 9.5016 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: bitcoinpete: As a great man once said "No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. You won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."
BingoBoingo: bitcoinpete: The same person also said "When I want my men to remember something important, to really make it stick, I give it to them double dirty. It may not sound nice to a bunch of little old ladies, at an afternoon tea party, but it helps my soldiers to remember. You can't run an army without profanity, and it has to be eloquent profanity. An army without profanity couldn't fight its way out of a piss-soaked paper bag."
bitcoinpete: i'd love to hear some of the chinese profanity
bitcoinpete: was just watching videos of f-15s taking off the Liaoning
BingoBoingo: bitcoinpete: Really?
BingoBoingo: I was kind of just bringing up these quotes in the context of addressing scammers. It isn't enough to merely be better than the scammers through knowing. You have to make them answer for their purpose, and in doing so you have to use language that sticks
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 9 @ 0.5 = 4.5 BTC [+]
bitcoinpete: greater good and good sport
bitcoinpete: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIuK28hmicY
ozbot: Liaoning Carrier A Symbol of National Power - YouTube
bitcoinpete: it also turns out that in arabic "happy easter" means "happy passover"
bitcoinpete: http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/notebook.htm
BingoBoingo: bitcoinpete: You know... Those planes aren't F-15's...
BingoBoingo: J-15's
bitcoinpete: j, yes...
BingoBoingo: In the big picture the differance is probably irrelevant
BingoBoingo: (The choice of differance over difference was intentional)
fluffypony: bitcoinpete: making a fuzz, lol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06601051 = 0.3301 BTC [-]
bitcoinpete: fluffypony: always ;)
fluffypony: "DavidT: i guess yes you are making a fuzz unnecessarily. and asking nicely and calmly or doing more research may get you more info i reckon."
fluffypony: making a fuzz is going to be my new phrase
fluffypony: "The SAFEst thing for Bitcoiners to do is keep their coins, back-up their hard drives, and encrypt their important files using PGP/GPG. The SAFEst thing for you to do is to find a VC or go back to the drawing board." <- best line in the article
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19300 @ 0.00099456 = 19.195 BTC [-] {2}
bitcoinpete: fluffypony: ya the comments sections is getting better. it's fun to watch the flailers flail in there
bitcoinpete: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pj4L7C2twI#t=219
ozbot: Poo2Loo: Poo Party - YouTube
bitcoinpete: UNICEF poopy music video. there's gotta be a cryptocoin crowdsourcing idea in there somewhere. maybe asciilifeform's shitcoin?
Apocalyptic: asciilifeform doesn't strike me as the kind of person that would release a shitcoin
jurov: Apocalyptic he had another kind of shitcoin in mind
jurov: look it up on loper-os
bitcoinpete: ;;google loper-os shitcoin
gribble: Loper OS » Shitcoin: a Modest Proposal.: <http://www.loper-os.org/?p=988>; Loper OS » On the fact that Bitcoin has a Kill Switch; and how to ...: <http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1009>; Loper OS » Idea: <http://www.loper-os.org/?cat=9>
bitcoinpete: .d
ozbot: 6.979 billion | Next Diff in 1434 blocks | Estimated Change: 14.3216% in 8d 12h 33m 24s
bitcoinpete: damn those govs can mine
jurov: i think he won't go throught with it, we convinced him that having to check every coin for encumbrances is impractical
BingoBoingo: I also think he came around to an objection to shitcoin on first principles eventually.
jurov: i see he added himself "they will be worth less"
jurov: but i can't imagine being a merchant to weigh every customer's reputation how much less are his coins worth
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15948 @ 0.00099302 = 15.8367 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: Well, worth less is far from worthless
jurov: but how much less? that's completely handwaved over
BingoBoingo: Well, how much is Litecoin worth? These things have to be handwaved, because such matters are indeterminate until practice forces them
BingoBoingo: reeses: Last week's panic over taking National Guard Attack helicopters: There is still a nuclear armed National Guard Unit.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 62 @ 0.00485 = 0.3007 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/131st_Fighter_Wing
ozbot: 131st Bomb Wing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
BingoBoingo: Damn auto correct highlighting reeses instead of allowing RE:
jurov: BingoBoingo: litecoins don't expire on a whim of investors
jurov: and their value does not depends on who is offering them
BingoBoingo: Are you sure litecoins don't expire on the whims of investors/speculators? 1 LTC = 1 LTC, but beyond that... Who pumps them at a particular time seems to affect their value quite a bit.
jurov: so you see no difference between them and ascii's shitcoins?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.51375488 = 3.0825 BTC [+] {3}
fluffypony: reeses pieces
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.51375489 BTC [+]
jurov: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/23g30d/dear_regulated_exchanges_if_you_hold_coins/cgwp8jp interesting tidbit about cavirtex
ozbot: justusranvier comments on Dear REGULATED Exchanges if you hold coins hostage until people are verifi
jurov: https://i.imgur.com/yi9hscm.png and this..lmao
BingoBoingo: jurov: I see differences, the primary one being that at least shitcoins represent BTC denominated balances
fluffypony: jurov: yeah, there's lots of fuss about Cavirtex allowing deposits without the person being approved, and then they can't withdraw their deposit
jurov: but "bitcoin deposits from utside canada are prohibited"?
fluffypony: yes, they're obviously a bit retarded or very, very sneaky
fluffypony: they have a regulatory requirement to only deal with Canadians, so I don't understand why they even show the deposit screen/address for unverified customers
fluffypony: surely it's one line of PHP/Ruby/whatever they use
fluffypony: if (isverified == true) { }
BingoBoingo: Well, they are the fuckers who ran with the money they raised on Havelock aren't they?
jurov: BingoBoingo indeed
fluffypony: yep
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: PHP and Ruby are the wrong tools for an "exchange"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 83 @ 0.00485 = 0.4026 BTC [-]
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: agreed
fluffypony: well, they're fine for the front-end bits, as long as they don't do any actual work
jurov: throw dude.js on that list
BingoBoingo: PHP ======= MagicalFux, Ruby ===== {Kumala}
fluffypony: heh
BingoBoingo: I dunno why otherwise reasonable seeming people take to liking shit.js
fluffypony: I hate it
fluffypony: I do have an unbridled love for php for front-end work (Laravel for structure, Blade for templating), but business logic/actual work should never be done in the front-end
fluffypony: separation of liabilities
BingoBoingo: Well, A lot of things on the internet are better not existing on the web level at all.
fluffypony: true
fluffypony: it seems that everything is http services layered on top of or replacing other protocols nowadays
fluffypony: "Bitcoin's a great protocol! Here's a web wallet."
BingoBoingo: Not even that. The You Can Message Someone on Facebook, as a replacement for email is a catalyst of suck.
fluffypony: eugh
fluffypony: so glad I'm not on Facebook
BingoBoingo: Webmail as a substitute for Pine is another.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56057 @ 0.00099551 = 55.8053 BTC [+] {3}
BingoBoingo: 3D printing propaganda: http://3dprint.com/2438/50-prosthetic-3d-printed-hand/
BingoBoingo: http://science.slashdot.org/story/14/04/21/0017239/42000-prosthetic-hand-outperformed-by-50-3d-printed-hand#
ozbot: $42,000 Prosthetic Hand Outperformed By $50 3D Printed Hand - Slashdot
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8509 @ 0.00099669 = 8.4808 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: "This drives me crazy when people don't include the costs of labor. It would be like someone getting a car donated to them and saying "Wow cars only cost $200 for a title and registration! Why do people pay thousands of dollars for a car!?" Because someone gave you one for free!"
BingoBoingo: I like how all of these discussions ignore the proper use of a hand which is satisfying a girl, so that you can use the girl to satisfy yourself.
BingoBoingo: !up Diablo-D3
assbot: Voicing Diablo-D3 for 30 minutes.
Diablo-D3: meh.
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: It's something
Diablo-D3: Trying to figure out how to identify with gribble
BingoBoingo: Well, you GPG or BC addy register?
BingoBoingo: ;;gettrust assbot Diablo-D3
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user Diablo-D3: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 3 via 3 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=Diablo-D3 | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=Diablo-D3 | Rated since: Mon Apr 25 13:54:20 2011
Diablo-D3: my gpg is registered, but I dont keep the key on my laptop for obvious reasons
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Looks like you can self up if you auth
Diablo-D3: oh, so I just need an account on wot?
BingoBoingo: Yeah
Diablo-D3: and I dont have to actually authenticate?
BingoBoingo: Well, you authenticate to gribble
BingoBoingo: Key management is and ought to be a personal thing
Diablo-D3: last time I had to authenticate on gribble I needed to sign a message with my pgp key
Diablo-D3: which is absurd
BingoBoingo: Better and worse solutions existing
BingoBoingo: I honestly usually use the decrypt option.
Diablo-D3: er, right, that thing
Diablo-D3: its been awhile since Ive given a shit about it
Diablo-D3: the bot should just be set to autovoice me
BingoBoingo: it is truly amazing how much text you can pass on a printed page
Diablo-D3: [03:17:34] <BingoBoingo> I like how all of these discussions ignore the proper use of a hand which is satisfying a girl, so that you can use the girl to satisfy yourself.
Diablo-D3: I have satisfied a girl with my hands before
Diablo-D3: its not what I'm known for, however.
BingoBoingo: Well, hand (clean) explores vagina to determine if clean or not, Mouth (clean) explores dick to determine if clean or not
BingoBoingo: These customs arise for reasons.
BingoBoingo: !up HeySteve
assbot: Voicing HeySteve for 30 minutes.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12100 @ 0.00099684 = 12.0618 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: My biggest criticism of "paleo" is that practitioners emphasize dietary bullshit over actual factors contributing to human success like hygeine.
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: not at all
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: like, I use fluoride free toothpaste and detergent free soap
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Honestly I really dun give a shit about that anyways, detergents are just surfactants that aren't derived from fatty acids, as a class detergent is a meaningless designation
BingoBoingo: !up punkman1
assbot: Voicing punkman1 for 30 minutes.
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: this is true, but what Im saying is, I use dr bronner's.
BingoBoingo: Eh, I'm the sort that instead of using gold bond powders the nuts with zeasorb, because it offers moar power
Diablo-D3: yeah, and Ive never actually had that problem
BingoBoingo: I've never had a problem either beyond nuts sticking to thighs, because moist. The aim though is not merely to survive, but to make the worst case impossible.
BingoBoingo: Better living through knowledge of chemistry and all of that
Diablo-D3: I agree
Diablo-D3: but the problem is, you have to find what works
Diablo-D3: paleo is about using products that dont cause some sort of immune response or arent otherwise toxic
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: some people DO get this wrong and get weirdly hippy about it
Diablo-D3: they arent doing paleo, they're just being hippies
BingoBoingo: Eh, I mix poison ivy into salad at least once a year.
BingoBoingo: I try to keep my immune system in a state as close to total war as possible
Diablo-D3: yes, and thats a thing
Diablo-D3: I prefer removing as many irritants as possible
Diablo-D3: so my body CAN have an immune response
BingoBoingo: Immune response is important, but it has to point the right direction
Diablo-D3: like, grains/sugars/etc really fuck up your immune response
BingoBoingo: Nah, that shit's fuel. If that is your definition of an irritant...
BingoBoingo: I mean denying the monder human body that shit is asking for portal vein hypertension
BingoBoingo: Onto another topic, Diablo-D3 what would be your ideal computer for offline signing and decryption?
fluffypony: !up Diablo-D3
assbot: Voicing Diablo-D3 for 30 minutes.
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: isnt one.
Diablo-D3: [03:44:49] <BingoBoingo> Nah, that shit's fuel. If that is your definition of an irritant...
Diablo-D3: it can be a fuel but its not the most efficient
fluffypony: this just sounds like it's going to go into the "make your own silicon, write your own OS" territory
Diablo-D3: the only carbs I intake are naturally in vegs
Diablo-D3: fluffypony: it basically is BUT
Diablo-D3: you cant
fluffypony: exactly
Diablo-D3: because shit is only secure when everyone on the planet has audited it and said so
BingoBoingo: My favorite veggie is maize
Diablo-D3: I will say though, and Ive been saying this for awhile
Diablo-D3: dont use openssl, use nss
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4870 @ 0.00099801 = 4.8603 BTC [+] {2}
fluffypony: so taking a step back from that ideal, Raspberry Pi/BeagleBone Black?
BingoBoingo: Nah, rolling your own silicon should be possible by nao
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: neither. Pick beast from the 80's and write it to a cheap FPGA dev board
fluffypony: mebbe
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2294 @ 0.00099948 = 2.2928 BTC [+]
fluffypony: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open-source_computing_hardware
ozbot: Open-source computing hardware - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
fluffypony: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milkymist <- interesting
ozbot: M-Labs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: If BFL taught us anything it is that it takes little to make dedicated silicon for a dream architecture.
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: sure, in quantity, but if you're rolling it yourself for your own purposes?
Diablo-D3: fluffypony: something like the rpi works
Diablo-D3: its unlikely theres any major problems with it
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: Why advertise it as that? Posit the thing as a student architecture.
Diablo-D3: although all nics ARE backdoored and can DMA anywhere in ram
BingoBoingo: An actual top down version of what RPi wants to be
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Yeah, ethernet is the big problem
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: someone needs to fab the silicon, and are you going to get an electron microscope to check that its to-spec?
Diablo-D3: you could strip the ethernet out and use usb to serial or w/e
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: RS-232
fluffypony: Diablo-D3: if we're going air-gapped for offline signing/decryption ethernet shouldn't be a concern
Diablo-D3: like I said, serial
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: niggers.txt
Diablo-D3: fluffypony: you have to update the software either way
fluffypony: Diablo-D3: true
Diablo-D3: fluffypony: and airgapped doesnt work with bitcoin
BingoBoingo: No, updating the software defeats an actual air gap
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: then hell
fluffypony: Diablo-D3: you can sign transactions offline
Diablo-D3: just use gpg on dos.
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Air gap on Dos can work
Diablo-D3: (yes, theres a gpg build out there somewhere for dos)
BingoBoingo: C is a more portable language than Java
fluffypony: http://s3.computerhistory.org/source/msdos.zip
Diablo-D3: claiming java isnt portable, however, is a bad argument
Diablo-D3: because, sadly, it really does work on tons of shit
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Not at all. I am jsut claiming C is more portable.
Diablo-D3: why? I dont know
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: C is portable to shit that should not be running C
Diablo-D3: anything written in modern C simply will not work on them without a lot of help
Diablo-D3: 99.9% of shit will break if char is not 8 bit, short is not 16 bit, and int is not 32 bit
fluffypony: "You should be also be cautioned that the MSDOS stack is not deep. You should not count on more than one or two pushes of the registers."
Diablo-D3: even though it is within the C specification for them not to be
Diablo-D3: (and yes, int cant be 64 bit either, some OS got this wrong and broke shit, long is the only one that should be native)
BingoBoingo: Still which of {C,Java} works best on Z80?
Diablo-D3: neither.
fluffypony: so someone needs to write GPG for BASIC?
Diablo-D3: C on 8 bit machines is horrid
fluffypony: 20 GOTO 10
Diablo-D3: the gpg for dos thing is obviously a 32 bit binary
BingoBoingo: The point of C is to be horrid, to be the last resort.
Diablo-D3: not really
Diablo-D3: Ive coded C for over 15 years
Diablo-D3: if you know how to use it, its a nice language
BingoBoingo: C is a nice language. I am not disputing that.
Diablo-D3: C is an absolutely fucking horrid language
Diablo-D3: I said "if you know how to use it"
Diablo-D3: it takes the better part of a decade to get there.
bounce: so what do you prefer? haskell? ruby?
Diablo-D3: bounce: I had a love affair with erlang for awhile
BingoBoingo: bounce: 68K assembly.
Diablo-D3: ruby is a fucking shit pile
bounce: too bad the z80 doesn't do that
BingoBoingo: TI-89 and classic Mac FTW
Diablo-D3: its like the guys who created it had no clue what the fuck a language was
Diablo-D3: and cargo culted it together
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: yay I have a ti-89
Diablo-D3: I need to take it apart though
bounce: anyway, mind sticking to the topic and present some viable engineering choices that'll work on z80? (as distinct from your personal preferences that work plenty fine on your desktop)
Diablo-D3: it hasnt been cleaned since I got it at the start of high school
Diablo-D3: and Im now 30.
Diablo-D3: I wipe the keys off sometimes, but theres shit just ground into it
BingoBoingo: bounce: Did I ever offer Z80 as an only option? I would kill for a multicore gigahertz class Coldfire dev board rated for server use
Diablo-D3: bounce: Im considering learning scala though
Diablo-D3: I dont hate the jvm. I dont even hate java all that much anymore.
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: I actually sold my TI-89 for money to buy weed
Diablo-D3: java 8 fixed a lot of the long standing issues java has
bounce: you were talking about z80, and I thought it was interesting enough to explore that a bit. still have a kaypro in an attic somewhere. should probably dust if off some time
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: I never use my ti-89
Diablo-D3: which is kind of sad
BingoBoingo: bounce: I like the Z80 as an example to suppose.
bounce: it's a good example since (I'm told, haven't investigated) various smart card type things have a z80-type core on board
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: My TI-89 met it's end in my usefulness when I realized the cheaper Mac Classic was basically the same thing.
Diablo-D3: yeah z80 is the best 8bit microcontroller cpu ever
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: I just needed a ti calc because it was mandatory for math classes in high school
Diablo-D3: best $150 I spent
BingoBoingo: I think asciilifeform is right about the Lisps being the future though
bounce: relevant for this channel is the gpg-card thingies. problem with those is that the source isn't available, though a spec is. an open source implementation would be nice, and perhaps cheaper than sourcing the closed-source thing.
Diablo-D3: loaded up video games on it
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: all languages are slowly becoming lisp, including lisp
Diablo-D3: lisp really is the best language ever created
BingoBoingo: Not really, clojure becomes less LISP every release
Diablo-D3: clojure never really was a lisp
bounce: so if you're looking for an embedded type project, that's as a good an angle as anything
fluffypony: Clojure thinks it's a lisp
fluffypony: so does Scheme
bounce: so which is more acceptably lisp-y, ruby or clojure? </troll>
BingoBoingo: Scheme is a LISP though
BingoBoingo: bounce: Python is probably more LISPy than Ruby or Clojure
fluffypony: python is definitely more lispy than both
bounce: how so?
BingoBoingo: bounce: The bedrock abstractions are more solid
Diablo-D3: the only lisps Im interested in is chicken and racket
Diablo-D3: bounce: ruby is just a mistake imo
Diablo-D3: like php is
fluffypony: ok breakfast time, bbl
Diablo-D3: it was written by people who clearly were not veteran programmers and understood no good patterns
BingoBoingo: Ruby is basically a python fork that broke the underlying interpreter
bounce: did they get around to plug the resource leaks in the reference interpreter?
BingoBoingo: PHP was a nobel but flawed attempt to make HTML a scriptable server language
bounce: lovely how it attracts nothing but n00bs and how even the core devs reflect that sad fact. a fractal of bad design, indeed.
Diablo-D3: BingoBoingo: I will agree ruby is very python inspired
BingoBoingo: In this way PHP was at least born with a purpose. Where as Ruby was born with "lol, suck cocks"
Diablo-D3: but all the bad parts
Diablo-D3: although Im not sure python has good parts
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Python is great as a modern alternative to BASIC
Diablo-D3: I dont understand how people can handle a language that successfully resists static analysis
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Well, they handle it because they don't have pubes yet.
BingoBoingo: It is a learnign language
Diablo-D3: thats a non-argument
Diablo-D3: I learned C when I was 14.
Diablo-D3: anything younger than 14 should be started on lisp.
BingoBoingo: That isn't how schools have been capable of thinking though. I learned turtle graphics at 11 on an Apple II with software written in 1995. Schools make the worst decisions.
Diablo-D3: yes, I could care less what schools do
Diablo-D3: you do not learn how to program at a school
Diablo-D3: programming is an art form
bounce: so you could care less. well, time to show some love and caring, eh.
BingoBoingo: !up sunshyne
assbot: Voicing sunshyne for 30 minutes.
Diablo-D3: you learn programming by programming
Diablo-D3: anyhow who says otherwise is confusing programming with computer science
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17600 @ 0.00099948 = 17.5908 BTC [+] {2}
Diablo-D3: nif you want computer science
Diablo-D3: just read through TAoCP
Diablo-D3: dont need a school for that
BingoBoingo: need can be a tricky work
BingoBoingo: !up Diablo-D3
assbot: Voicing Diablo-D3 for 30 minutes.
Diablo-D3: TAoCP is rather straight forward imo
Diablo-D3: and once you learn how to program, any language works really
Diablo-D3: programming is about learning patterns and when to use them
BingoBoingo: Someone can probably be a gentleman without reading Clausewitz much like someone can program without school.
Diablo-D3: its no different than learning how to play chess
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Would you be up for a game of chess?
Diablo-D3: I havent played chess in long long time
Diablo-D3: and Im too distracted to enjoy it right now anyhow
BingoBoingo: Eh, I've imbibed quite a bit of ETOH since this conversation started
BingoBoingo: I'll even offer the four possible opening lines I'd play
bounce: I need a shower and to find me a board, but I could be up after.
BingoBoingo: As white I'd play the queen's gambit. As black responding to E4, the pirc, to d4 the slav, and to anything else a spanking.
BingoBoingo: This is pretty much the mode I've offered to any players approaching me in this channel
Diablo-D3: iirc there are no good online chess things anyhow
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: If you have algebraic notation IRC works fine
Diablo-D3: I hate doing that
BingoBoingo: Chess is a great game in that precise notation exists for every possible move
Diablo-D3: I dont think I even own a chess board anymore.
BingoBoingo: I no longer have nickel cadmium batteries
BingoBoingo: I'd like to no longer have LI-ION batteries
mircea_popescu: goood morning everyone!
BingoBoingo: ;;later tell bitcoinpete When you asked about a line betting operation did the tweet I offered convey enough info?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Morning
BingoBoingo: How was the conference?
mircea_popescu: pretty great!
mircea_popescu: gonna put some pix up once i go through my mail and stuff
BingoBoingo: Nice.
mircea_popescu: how was the chan meanwhile ?
BingoBoingo: Slow
BingoBoingo: I ended up travelling just a little bit this weekend.
Diablo-D3: [04:31:43] <BingoBoingo> I no longer have nickel cadmium batteries
Diablo-D3: [04:32:16] <BingoBoingo> I'd like to no longer have LI-ION batteries
Diablo-D3: eventually we wont
Diablo-D3: graphene supercaps
mircea_popescu: o look who's here. didja find france alright davout ?
mircea_popescu: Diablo-D3 afaik graphene is still a ways off.
BingoBoingo: Diablo-D3: Actually I am hoping for a revival and enhancement of Silver-Zinc batteries
mircea_popescu: did that byrne kid ever manage to find his way here ?
BingoBoingo: ?
BingoBoingo: The logs are sparse the past couple days, so I doubt many newcomers...
Diablo-D3: mircea_popescu: in the next five years, graphene supercaps will become a commercial reality
Diablo-D3: they already have semi-functioning prototypes
Diablo-D3: their big problem right now is that they're so energy dense, they're hard to handle
mircea_popescu: Diablo-D3 i bet you that i won't be able to buy a graphene supercap battery at a convenience store in 2019.
Diablo-D3: mircea_popescu: well, no, you wouldnt
Diablo-D3: that'd be nonsensical
mircea_popescu: ...
BingoBoingo: If they were there I dunno that I would want to buy them
mircea_popescu: well whatever, radioshack
Diablo-D3: that'd be like buying a li-ion battery at a store
Diablo-D3: you dont
Diablo-D3: you need the safety mechanism so you dont kill yourself
mircea_popescu: some sort of consumer accessible outlet
Diablo-D3: Im surprised, btw, alkalines are even made anymore
Diablo-D3: they're old hat
BingoBoingo: ... Usually I buy lithium batteries at the store, Li-ion, LI-polymer and otherwise
mircea_popescu: ^
Diablo-D3: I put lithiums in anything that a regchargable is inappropriate for
Diablo-D3: like, devices that stay continuously powered more than 2 years, or go outside, or are clocks, etc
BingoBoingo: I have yet to see a Lithium 364 button cell
fluffypony: alkalines are still available here - just yesterday I had to buy some AAs and got to choose between alkalines, lithiums, and nimh rechargeables
Diablo-D3: I use lsd nimhs in all.... two devices that need batteries
Diablo-D3: well, that arent clocks or continuous long term shit
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform needed some batteries for his demo yest, i had the maitre d' scare up some batteries, he came back with two alkalines
Diablo-D3: my harmony remote, and my ti-89
Diablo-D3: thats _it_
Diablo-D3: I have nothing that uses batteries anymore
Diablo-D3: the two clocks and the temp sensors use lithiums for obvious reasons
BingoBoingo: I own more watches than other battery powered devices, but of the ones that don't operate on mechanical energy, solver oxide cells are the most prevalent.
bounce: what, no automatics?
Diablo-D3: bounce: nope
BingoBoingo: bounce: Automatics use mechanical energy
BingoBoingo: The rotor winds the spring
bounce: right. what was the electrical equivalent, 'kinetic' or something?
fluffypony: davout: bonjour
fluffypony: bounce: yeah, Seiko had "kinetic"
fluffypony: Citizen has solar
BingoBoingo: bounce: Kinetic is the seiko term, other manufacterers use different names because trademarks. That is for electrical charging by those means though.
BingoBoingo: Seiko still makes proper mechanical automatic movements though.
bounce: kid in school had a solar, very sparse design. just even matte background for the face, which also was the solar panel only you'd not notice.
fluffypony: bounce: I have 3 Citizen solars
fluffypony: lemme take photo
BingoBoingo: The sun's overrated. I'd kind of prefer an all tritium powered watch
bounce: used to have a... citizen? automatic. need fixing though, in the end it was off by half an hour a day. should've gotten it fixed while still in warranty. silly me.
BingoBoingo: Oh http://prestonbyrne.com/2014/04/21/that-didnt-take-long/
BingoBoingo: bounce: It really depends on the particular watch whether it is worth saving or not.
mircea_popescu: quartzes rarely are.
BingoBoingo: bounce: Even in the worst case you want to keep them stored well in case everyone else with them decides they aren't worth saving and you end up with something rate
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I have yet to actually see a quartz automatic outisde of a few questionable seiko examples
mircea_popescu: what do you mean ?
mircea_popescu: ;;google quartz clock
gribble: Quartz clock - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quartz_clock>; HowStuffWorks "How Quartz Watches Work": <http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/gadgets/clocks-watches/quartz-watch.htm>; Quartz Time Only Clock Movements | Klockit: <http://www.klockit.com/depts/QuartzTimeOnlyClockMovements/dept-157.html>
mircea_popescu: that thing ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Seiko has a mechanical powered quartz regulated movement they call "Spring Drive"
BingoBoingo: Seiko also has a mechanically recharged all electric quarts they call kinetic
mircea_popescu: oh oh. yeah some swiss makers actually tried using quartz oscialltors as an error limiter at some point
BingoBoingo: The couple I've seen inherited the worst parts of quartz and mechanical movements.
fluffypony: bounce: http://i.imgur.com/ppkGOKj.jpg
fluffypony: you wouldn't be able to tell any of those are solar panels at a glance
mircea_popescu: exactly.
BingoBoingo: ANd the only I've known of were all made by Japs
mircea_popescu: perhaps resolvable, but i think people just gave up
BingoBoingo: Probably. It is hard to compete with a CR 2032 at anything.
BingoBoingo: I'd like to see more accutron like tuning fork movements though.
BingoBoingo: mechanicaly charged mass regulated would be nearly perfect.
mircea_popescu: judging by the excellent results electrostatic speakers show it's a wonder they've not tried that yet actually.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9500 @ 0.00099729 = 9.4743 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: It probably goes back to flawed fiat assumptions about costs.
BingoBoingo: I have yet to see anything as beautiful as the original accutron movements.
BingoBoingo: The few I've worked on take 357 batteries though, and that is a lot of silver for a year and a half of function.
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: http://www.watchalyzer.com/wp-content/gallery/bulova-accutron/bulova-accutron-214-movement.jpg
fluffypony: I love the exposed resistor
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: That is literally the most boring part of the thing.
bounce: wonder how they do white solar panels.
bounce: on IIRC my watch is a casio instead. hm. doesn't really matter.
fluffypony: bounce: no clue, it's quite impressive that they make it look like a regular watch face
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: Those two sections wrapped in wire are a tuning fork.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15500 @ 0.00099253 = 15.3842 BTC [-] {3}
BingoBoingo: The tuning fork both keeps time and moves the hands
fluffypony: nice
fluffypony: are the batteries hard to come by?
BingoBoingo: Quartz coming later keeps time better, but only keeps time.
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: Here batteries are easy to find, standard 357s
BingoBoingo: Just, don't try the other kind of 357
fluffypony: they're not badly priced in decent condition
BingoBoingo: Well, decent doesn't say too much... How many people alive can make them sing (I actually, literally mean sing)
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: sing by striking the tuning fork?
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: Not striking, resonating. That's what the coils of copper wire do. It's a fucking watch, not a rail gun.
fluffypony: although a pocket rail gun would be amazing
fluffypony: a:-P
BingoBoingo: A silver oxide cell would offer the worst possible discharge curve for that purpose though.
BingoBoingo: !up Diablo-D3
assbot: Voicing Diablo-D3 for 30 minutes.
Diablo-D3: thx
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: I know people rip on Wikipedia in this chan, but it wouldn't be the worst place to start in understanding how 1950's tech works
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: cool will give it a squizzle
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: Did I ever mention how your presence makes me miss truffles?
fluffypony: hah hah
fluffypony: no you haven't
BingoBoingo: That wasn't an endorsement...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2900 @ 0.00099848 = 2.8956 BTC [+]
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: this is interesting - http://www.ablogtowatch.com/top-ten-technically-important-watches-from-1950/
fluffypony: "The movement was, however, used in spacecraft instrument clocks and other time-keeping mechanisms, partly also because NASA was still unsure how gravity would affect mechanical movements."
BingoBoingo: It is amazing how personal timekeeping hasn't had any advancements since 1970, much like how you still seem fluffypony to be the sort that would borrow bitcoin for cheap polyester couches.
fluffypony: why on earth would I borrow money to buy a couch?
BingoBoingo drinks hatorade, goes to bed
Diablo-D3: lol
fluffypony: bounce: 1972, first solar watch - http://70swatchesgallery.wordpress.com/2011/03/19/synchronar/
fluffypony: actually looks kinda awesome
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/ca-tot-s-a-tras-tot-s-a-fumat-tot-s-a-baut-tot-cum-e-peste-tot-la-fel-ca-peste-tot/
ozbot: Ca tot… s-a tras tot s-a fumat tot s-a baut tot cum e peste tot ? La fel ca peste tot. pe Trilema
mircea_popescu: conference pix etc.
fluffypony: looks like fun - rumour has it next year will be in Argentina?
fluffypony: then South Africa 2016, we can have a Halvening Party and I'll arrange a safari
mircea_popescu: and we halven the lion population ?
fluffypony: that can be arranged, like all things, for a price :-P
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11800 @ 0.00099862 = 11.7837 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: Adam Penenberg is such an idiot. o herp, please help along with the grandiose effort of making usg snooping more user-acceptable.
mircea_popescu: turbo_ac100 why me ?!
mircea_popescu: bounce "the odd dos-only application that's critical to the business and irreplacable" << this should be ridiculous but isn't. most "tools" of today aren't actally as good as the tools of the 90s.
mircea_popescu: bounce:
mircea_popescu: on that note, often manufacturers explicitly forbid to install updates and servicepacks since it might well break the app. << since heartbleed i'm going to forbid any upgrades as part of the contract in all cases, always and forever.
mircea_popescu: from what i hear i'm by no means of a minority oppinion (even if i no longer to that sort of thing on any sort of scale)
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell cgcardona lol is it the first best largest wot ?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6549 @ 0.0009935 = 6.5064 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: ;;rate jurov 5 Years of promises kept.
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user jurov has changed from 4 to 5.
mircea_popescu: ;;rate wao 1 Sold me a large bitcoin.
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user wao has been recorded.
mircea_popescu: ;;rate thickasthieves 3 Vegetarian.
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user thickasthieves has changed from 1 to 3.
mircea_popescu: http://www.fastcompany.com/3029119/most-innovative-companies/tencent-the-secretive-chinese-tech-giant-that-can-rival-facebook-a
ozbot: Tencent: The Secretive, Chinese Tech Giant That Can Rival Facebook and Amazon | Fast Company | Busin
mircea_popescu: le derp.
fluffypony: the CEO's name is Pony?
fluffypony: I like him already.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony: in which /r/Bitcoin can't decide whether to spend its ten cents on supersizing the coke or the fries. it's really unfair anyway because if they supersize one they should get the other for free. << FTFY
fluffypony: touché
mircea_popescu: lol coinet srsly ? ALL THESE THINGS nobody ever heard of being the biggest ever in their obscure corner onoes!
mircea_popescu: ;;seen mike_c
gribble: mike_c was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 5 days, 6 hours, 35 minutes, and 47 seconds ago: <mike_c> plus hard work is its own reward
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: that was a typo, was meant to be coinbet
mircea_popescu: i think i typoed it
mircea_popescu: anyway, was reading the article. pretty lulzy
fluffypony: I did too in the log
fluffypony: yeah
fluffypony: the scary thing is that they DID get a shitton of media coverage
fluffypony: and gamblers (of all people) trust some random site with no track record
fluffypony: domain registered in fucking December, we're now in April, they barely lasted 4 months of scamming
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4000 @ 0.0009913 = 3.9652 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: the way this shit works is, fucktard of the ilk of that byrne fellow figures he knows shit, gets some investors together, anywhere between a few 10s of k's to maybe a million,
mircea_popescu: then blows the whole wad on advertising and freerolls.
mircea_popescu: then discovers his ROI is about 3 to 5%
mircea_popescu: then decides to scam the few legit customers he has to return a 1/5 to 1/3 equity to his invesotrs, and story ends there.
fluffypony: messed up
mircea_popescu: https://twitter.com/Mircea_Popescu/status/458187310480494593
ozbot: Twitter / Mircea_Popescu: @ryancharleston Stop being ...
mircea_popescu: a fine example, that idiot.
fluffypony: hah hah
mircea_popescu: "You asked a serious article ? A real investigation ? Here I am here I am!"
mircea_popescu: "Their common ? They both worked at Orange / France Telecom , the first from 2007 to 2011, the second from 2005 to 2011 . They are logically met through this company that pushes people into suicide."
mircea_popescu: ole!
mircea_popescu: "Out of nowhere like a UFO website beegcoin edited by BEEG CORPORATION LIMITED, registered in London and created by young French to be, I think, a huge slap to the ego -centric bitcoin.
mircea_popescu: ok this shit's pretty good.
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell thickasthieves http://gigaom.com/2014/01/19/on-free-speech-and-blogging-the-first-amendment-applies-to-everyone-not-just-journalists/
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony:
mircea_popescu: cgcardona_: just told that to my wife (she's vegetarian), now she's walking around doing her Plants vs. Zombies impersonation << this woman sounds like she needs a daily vlog.
fluffypony: hah hah
fluffypony: only if we can monetise it
mircea_popescu: what do you care, she's going around doing "grainzzzz" anyway.
mircea_popescu: do that for a year, audience builts, then she can prolly start her own eyeliner line
fluffypony: lol
fluffypony: I'll suggest it:)
mircea_popescu: or w/e, make every woman in south africa wear uncomfortable bras just fore the hell of it
bounce: "journalists not so speshul". funny how that needs a court to tell them journos.
mircea_popescu: indeed.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22086 @ 0.0009913 = 21.8939 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: artifexd: Put that ink in your printer and make a super sekrit paper wallet. << plain white wallpaper with floral designs that morphs into japanese girls and octopuses once you shine a black light in the dark.
mircea_popescu: jurov: mircea will certainly come soon, maybe after a lil fuck << my fucks are not little.
mircea_popescu: experientia docet.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: dammit. << that's right rainscamboy! and now it's fucking sunny, chicks be tanning nude in my yard.
mircea_popescu: jurov: Apocalyptic: imagine world directors talking about important topics whole days wrapped in clouds of smoke << this is shockingly true, i think we smoked a small dog's weight of tobacco
fluffypony: experientia docet? I thought we were against that? :-P
mircea_popescu: fluffypony: I love foosball << davout is fucking criminal at that thing. he beat everyone, single against teams, everything.
fluffypony: docendo discitur, on the other hand...
mircea_popescu: no, fucking is exempt
mircea_popescu: o which reminds me! if any of the esteemed VIPs can repeat either of my two little latin fables, there's a prize!
mircea_popescu: !up keonne
assbot: Voicing keonne for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: who was asking about china's political influence a few days ago ? here it is :
mircea_popescu: https://twitter.com/Edourdoo/status/458160399964061696
ozbot: Twitter / Edourdoo: Obama unlikely to win over ...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10800 @ 0.0009913 = 10.706 BTC [-]
bounce: one of things with investor/state extortion thingies in it, innit?
mircea_popescu: bounce hm ?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=15-04-2014#625895 ☝︎
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
mircea_popescu: thats the reference.
bounce: ayup, it does.
bounce: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Investor-state_dispute_settlement
ozbot: Investor-state dispute settlement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
mircea_popescu: aha yea
mircea_popescu: Diablo-D3: the bot should just be set to autovoice me < nope.
mircea_popescu: you should have long by now learned that you're not really worth two shits as you are, and until and unless you change to be more useful.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9300 @ 0.0009913 = 9.2191 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: whoa done with three days' logs! a hero is me.
mircea_popescu: ty dear ppls for not having made it TOO difficult >D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2450 @ 0.0009916 = 2.4294 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: !t m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00098037 / 0.0009918 / 0.00099972 (1033439 shares, 1,024.97 BTC), 7D: 0.00095214 / 0.00097861 / 0.00101 (3821859 shares, 3,740.13 BTC), 30D: 0.00092844 / 0.000959 / 0.00101 (20718626 shares, 19,869.30 BTC)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25300 @ 0.00099055 = 25.0609 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 40 @ 0.00600538 = 0.2402 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 3 @ 0.0735 = 0.2205 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18350 @ 0.00099192 = 18.2017 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.03 = 0.18 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3546 @ 0.00098862 = 3.5056 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25200 @ 0.00099132 = 24.9813 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04250066 = 0.1275 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.0742218 = 0.2227 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16588 @ 0.00099614 = 16.524 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8700 @ 0.00099989 = 8.699 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15454 @ 0.00099653 = 15.4004 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 66 @ 0.0048201 = 0.3181 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5800 @ 0.00099604 = 5.777 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13108 @ 0.00099604 = 13.0561 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10008 @ 0.00100002 = 10.0082 BTC [+]
FabianB: Tencent's CEO: "In America, when you bring an idea to market you usually have several months before competition pops up, allowing you to capture significant market share. In China, you can have hundreds of competitors within the first hours of going live. Ideas are not important in China--execution is."
mircea_popescu: i heard that before
mircea_popescu: "Marketers have created a profile for young urban millennial males with money to burn, but it's hard to believe this creature exists"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.5 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: justusranvier can i pay you to get off that accursed blogspot thing ?
mircea_popescu: and also pankkake http://bitcoinism.blogspot.ro/2013/12/lex-cryptographia.html b-a material ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 8 @ 0.0425 = 0.34 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 8 @ 0.0742218 = 0.5938 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.04201018 = 0.2521 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 6 @ 0.0742218 = 0.4453 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.0416111 = 0.2497 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 6 @ 0.0742218 = 0.4453 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BlvuyjFIEAA6mBb.jpg:large
mircea_popescu: uk men be insecure
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: wrt making Sybil attacks harder, isn't there/couldn't there be a GPG-like system that uses a common private key for a single owner, but also hash some sort of easily identifiable GUID as part of the pubkey/signature to indicate which machine it is on? that way an attacker's work becomes slightly more complex, as they need to not only create profiles but have a fresh VM/install/whatever for them ☟︎
mircea_popescu: how are fresh vms difficult ?
fluffypony: they're more difficult
mircea_popescu: they're more difficult for the wrong demographic.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.04153174 = 0.2907 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 7 @ 0.0742218 = 0.5196 BTC [-]
fluffypony: I suppose
fluffypony: have there been any identified Sybil attacks on the WoT?
mircea_popescu: all the time. i recall stomping one [\\\] spotted in like... 2012 ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 500 @ 0.14 = 70 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04100001 = 0.123 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.0742218 = 0.2227 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: http://www.shtfplan.com/headline-news/report-ebola-suspected-in-europe-broken-through-all-containment-efforts_04202014
ozbot: Report: Ebola Suspected In Europe: "Broken Through All Containment Efforts"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 25 @ 0.0742218 = 1.8555 BTC [-]
fluffypony: http://www.tedunangst.com/flak/post/reop
ozbot: reop - reasonable expectation of privacy
mircea_popescu: "reop is clearly influenced by signify (What can I say? I like my own designs.), but it’s not a clone." done reading there.
fluffypony: skip down to the GPG complaints at the bottom
mircea_popescu: "Holy shit! What kind of toy random number generator is GPG using? Never mind that the message is printed twice. Never mind that both messages flick by before I have half a chance to read them, let alone do anything to entropize my system. “Wiggle the mouse for moar entropies.” I wouldn’t trust a program that prints messages like this to protect my middle school slambook."
mircea_popescu: so guy is an imbecile.
mircea_popescu: how's this different from the previous conclusion
fluffypony: yep
mircea_popescu: !up exchange01
assbot: Voicing exchange01 for 30 minutes.
fluffypony: "[00:20:08] <~spacenerf> lot of people made PGP'alikes using this shniz, most of which are difficult to deal with/possibly broken on some platforms etc"
fluffypony: that's it in a nutshell
mircea_popescu: here's to hoping that this is the first, biggest and largest exchange
exchange01: can i speak to you in private i am not familar with irc
mircea_popescu: fluffypony the guy is derping about what "gpg does in 2014" forgetting to even mention what version he's using. because everything in his head was born this year, so obviously...
mircea_popescu: exchange01 you can just say here.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: agreed
mircea_popescu: to not even get in the advanced topics of how 50%+1 of crypto-related specs are broken by design anyway. what sort of argument is this, that package x is bad because it allows user to do something some rfc says should not be done ? blergh.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: but he likes it because it's "his design" and so therefore infallible
mircea_popescu: so who is this guy ? doing an ipo or anything ?
mircea_popescu: insufficiently beaten millenials.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5850 @ 0.0010003 = 5.8518 BTC [+] {2}
fluffypony: exchange01: crash course on IRC - you type the words, you press the enter, they come out on the screen
fluffypony: majik
exchange01: fluffypony thank you very much for this introduction, but i am wondering are you certified to say that ? :)
mircea_popescu: lol
exchange01: mircea_popescu are you receiving what im sending u using /msg ?
fluffypony: exchange01: I have a BIRC from the University of the Internet-pre-1995
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo why is this byrne kid so fixated on the entire personal attack angle ? he told thickashtieves the same thing, yet how the heck would his being clueless a personal attack on me. wtf, i'm not his mother.
mircea_popescu: exchange01 i don't hold private conversations with people i don't know. this is kinda the basis of private conversations : the parties must be acquainted.
mircea_popescu: speak your business publicly, what is it ?
exchange01: yes
exchange01: its a small exchanger, we are thinking about making an IPO on havelocks
exchange01: and being listed, but I am looking for other options and I've been told about Mpex
mircea_popescu: what's small exchanger mean ?
exchange01: low volume
mircea_popescu: this is still exceedingly vague.
exchange01: I know, well, i am wondering if you guys have any suggestions as you know finding financing for that kind of business is impossible
mircea_popescu: well i dunno man, so far there's not much here to go on. what suggestions are you looking for ?
exchange01: Well, is it possible to get listed on Mpex like dice ?
exchange01: what would be the requirements for that ?
mircea_popescu: it is possible, in principle.
mircea_popescu: ;;google requirements to list on mpex
gribble: MPEx - Bitcoin: <https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/MPEx>; How does one list on MPEx ? pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/how-does-one-list-on-mpex>; MPEX Data Access: <http://data.eol.ucar.edu/master_list/?project=MPEX>
exchange01: i can send you our business plan mircea if you want
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.041 = 0.205 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 20 @ 0.03275 = 0.655 BTC [+] {4}
exchange01: business model
fluffypony: ;;ident exchange01
gribble: Nick 'exchange01', with hostmask 'exchange01!43cc18ae@gateway/web/freenode/ip.', is not identified.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 20 @ 0.03075 = 0.615 BTC [-] {4}
fluffypony: "Credible WOT presence."
fluffypony: exchange01: you need that ^^
exchange01: i need to register ?
exchange01: on irc
fluffypony: exchange01: http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/Beginners_Guide
fluffypony: start there
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.06500102 = 0.65 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 50 @ 0.00481065 = 0.2405 BTC [-] {3}
fluffypony: register with the WoT, and then build your WoT profile over time
exchange01: ;;calc 1 + 1
gribble: 2
mircea_popescu: .d
ozbot: 6.979 billion | Next Diff in 1369 blocks | Estimated Change: 14.8229% in 8d 2h 11m 44s
mircea_popescu: "Likewise, today when a Westerner tells a Lebanese Shiite that he has a separate "ethnicity", he is baffled. Mazhab is not ethnicity, no more than being a democrat in the US would be a different race (although it should be)."
mircea_popescu: lmap
exchange01: ok i will start with that, thank you @mircea and @fluffy
fluffypony: any time :)
mircea_popescu: "Having spent more than two decades, as an option trader and book-runner (~ 650,000 trades), I have always been leery of inexperienced academics talking about "prediction markets" when we have organic, spontaneously formed markets, and have had them since civilization started --my reaction is that of an old plane engineer and pilot being lectured by a high school English student who never flew a plane. You can't tell t
mircea_popescu: hem what they don't know. "
mircea_popescu: ok, that's me reading all the derpage. ethereum, smart contracts, bla bla.
mircea_popescu: http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2284964
ozbot: On the Difference between Binary Prediction and True Exposure with Implications for Forecasting Tour
fluffypony: hah hah - failed attempts at legitimacy 101: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Autonomous_Corporation
fluffypony: they can't even decide what the D stands for
fluffypony: there they say Digital, but in one of the references it says "Distributed Autonomous Corporations (DACs), or Decentralized Autonomous Companies"
mircea_popescu: http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/notebook.htm
mircea_popescu: this bit (taleb) is actually pretty good.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform o check what has a wikipedia article!
mircea_popescu: some obscure shit that was never mentioned anywhere is notable! eleven
fluffypony: "This article includes a list of references, related reading or external links, but its sources remain unclear because it lacks inline citations."
fluffypony: heh heh
fluffypony: "Bitcoin itself can be viewed as an early form of DAC. We are generalizing the concept for use in the open source community, building on Bitcoin's proven technology. Bitcoin could be reimplemented as a full open standards-compliant DAC. Perhaps someday it will."
mircea_popescu: i'll borrow the expression from taleb, since i just read it : this shit's not even wrong.
benkay: generalizing concepts. sounds like someone heard about 'general solutions' from someone else with a lil bit o programmery experience and decided it was important to do for their ideas as well.
benkay: "it's not enough that this is specifically stupid, i'm going to generalize this idiocy to the general case."
mircea_popescu: benkay that's exactly what happens. someone who was taught in primary school to "guess what words meran in context" instead of being beaten every time he failed to look up new words in the dictionary
FabianB: hmm.. Google can't find Jerusalina
mircea_popescu: grew up into an adult that proceeds on the basis of word recognition
mircea_popescu: that shit makes for excellent consumers and appaling "thinkers"
mircea_popescu: FabianB gotta admit it has a ring to it neh ?
bounce: I think the "jews make up a race according to western languages" premise mostly means the writer is still stuck in wwII-era propaganda.
mircea_popescu: bounce the part where early judaism was not tribal, but more akin to today's jehova witnesses is accurate
mircea_popescu: the middle part... that becomes complex
FabianB: mircea_popescu: does it exist or will it be built by you?
bounce: isn't it their creation story that groups them in various tribes, about 12 or so? though to call that a "race" is maybe a bit overly ambitious.
fluffypony: well jews in ancient israel were bound by a common belief, but it was also by birth
mircea_popescu: FabianB it's a play on how would a feminine jerusalem sound like
fluffypony: if you decided to follow the belief but you weren't born of the 12 tribes you weren't a jew
mircea_popescu: bounce we're talking actual history rather than orginal mythology tho
mircea_popescu: otherwise everyone was spawned by the fucking sun god.
bounce: what, you're saying their holy book can possibly be wrong? what malarky is this? :-p
mircea_popescu: lol
FabianB: mircea_popescu: hahaha, was already looking in argentinas pampas for tiny villages :)
fluffypony: bounce is right, though - they self-identified based on the son they were descended from
mircea_popescu: let me put it this way : once judaism became large enough they +m'd the channel.
bounce: this is true. you can get in, but it's not easy.
mircea_popescu: FabianB you know the expression, "next year in jerusalem". i just.. well... sexchanged it.
FabianB: hehe
mircea_popescu: but before it was large enough, there was no tribalism. most being... self made jooz.
bounce: better than islam, where getting in is relatively easy (just learn a book by rote and loud repetition), getting out... carries the death penalty. (literally)
mircea_popescu: islamob.
benkay: ;;later tell DiabloD3 lisp > scala.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
bounce: curious tidbit: there's a reason it's the mother, not the father, that conveys jewishness to the kid. figuring out why should be just a bit of thought.
mircea_popescu: isn't this obvious ?
mircea_popescu: redheaded chicks named khannah' being the world's premiere sluts and all ?
bounce: not everyone notices and puts the puzzle together
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.065001 = 0.13 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: he who does not puts ze puzzle together is known as... a putz.
fluffypony: oy vey
fluffypony: (sp?)
benkay: ;;later tell BingoBoingo Where as Ruby was born with "lol, suck cocks" << it's more like "lol i suck cocks" but yeah right idea
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: !up Anon29486307
assbot: Voicing Anon29486307 for 30 minutes.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2500 @ 0.00100055 = 2.5014 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.501 = 2.004 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23398 @ 0.00099772 = 23.3447 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 550 @ 0.14 = 77 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 2.51669550 BTC to 6`985 shares, 36030 satoshi per share
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12200 @ 0.00099964 = 12.1956 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4600 @ 0.00099964 = 4.5983 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: !up Oleanie
assbot: Voicing Oleanie for 30 minutes.
Oleanie: hello
fluffypony: ¡Ola!
benkay: good morning, Oleanie
thestringpuller: https://keybase.io/ - anyone know about this?
kakobrekla: ;;google keybase.io site:http://log.bitcoin-assets.com
gribble: NEXT: 17-02-2014 - #bitcoin-assets log: <http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2014&bots=true>; PREV: 28-03-2014 - #bitcoin-assets log: <http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-03-2014&bots=true>; NEXT: 01-03-2014 - #bitcoin-assets log: <http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=01-03-2014&bots=true>
cgcardona_: top of tha mornin
benkay: thestringpuller: they want your private key. what else do you need to know?
thestringpuller: Wow kakobrekla I just learned something new
thestringpuller: hahahahahahahahahaha
thestringpuller: wow
thestringpuller: i love this channel
cgcardona_: fwiw I asked Manu Sporny (lead of the W3C Payments Working Group) what he thinks of bitcoin. Q: https://twitter.com/cgcardona/status/457225541284687872 A1: https://twitter.com/manusporny/status/458264859055247360 A2: https://twitter.com/manusporny/status/458265043860455424
benkay: cgcardona_: repeat that line to anyone seeking to 'bring bitcoin to the masses'
benkay: shit's not even worth 500 per.
benkay: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 498.4, Best ask: 498.72, Bid-ask spread: 0.32000, Last trade: 498.25, 24 hour volume: 8609.15956762, 24 hour low: 490.0, 24 hour high: 515.0, 24 hour vwap: 501.43322806
benkay: see? market agrees.
jurov: 'cept for vwap
fluffypony: cgcardona_: I'm reading his name as Manus Porny from now on
benkay: enjoy the con, jurov?
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 498.02, Best ask: 498.47, Bid-ask spread: 0.45000, Last trade: 498.02, 24 hour volume: 8569.74616032, 24 hour low: 490.0, 24 hour high: 515.0, 24 hour vwap: 501.43322806
mircea_popescu: !up fordlincoln
assbot: Voicing fordlincoln for 30 minutes.
cgcardona_: fluffypony: i figured that we all were :)
cgcardona_: actually i thought it might be M. Anus Porny
cgcardona_: </making fun of someone's name>
mircea_popescu: cgcardona_ well... gotta love people who say shit like "it's fundamentals"
cgcardona_: MP - yea I'm *never* surprised when the leader of a working group predicts something will 'take years'
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 55 @ 0.00580682 = 0.3194 BTC [+] {6}
jurov: ..and sweat and bood and tears and bile and urine and...
jurov: *blood
cgcardona_: "There will be bood"
jurov: benkay yup... kinda "mini-con", though :D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17336 @ 0.0009929 = 17.2129 BTC [-] {2}
cgcardona_: I still remember when Hixie was leader of the HTML5 working group and he said it was gonna take till 2019!
cgcardona_: actually he said 2022
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 13 @ 0.03038461 = 0.395 BTC [+] {3}
cgcardona_: I think that (with regards to the W3C) bitcoin's biggest lacking fundimental is that it's not a W3C tech.
benkay: best clubs are small clubs, jurov. i wonder what attendance will be like next year.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 20 @ 0.00599999 = 0.12 BTC [+] {2}
cgcardona_: ;;rate mircea_popescu 1 Regular in (creator of?) #btc-assets
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user mircea_popescu has been recorded.
fluffypony: cgcardona_: kakobrekla is the channel owner
fluffypony: founder
bounce: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0749597814000223
cgcardona_: ah ok - I'll uddate
mircea_popescu: yeah i'm just squatting here.
cgcardona_: ;;rate mircea_popescu 1 Regular in #btc-assets and bitlord
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user mircea_popescu has changed from 1 to 1.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla just so you know, bitlord is better than world's #1 dad.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06458 = 0.3229 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6743 @ 0.00099584 = 6.7149 BTC [+]
cgcardona_: who is Anduck ? they gave me a -10 on the wot. wot a dick
cgcardona_: that gives me a -6 total. that sucks
mircea_popescu: ;;seen Anduck
gribble: Anduck was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 5 days, 19 hours, 51 minutes, and 13 seconds ago: <Anduck> :)
cgcardona_: ;;gettrust Anduck
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user cgcardona_ to user Anduck: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 2 via 2 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=cgcardona_&dest=Anduck | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=Anduck | Rated since: Tue May 8 11:28:43 2012
bounce: why don't you ask him? op on -otc. could be someone nicksquatted you and he was a little too enthousiastic
cgcardona_: ok
cgcardona_: don't see how someone nicksquatted me - i have it registered w/ nickserv
bounce: you don't have it set to enforce it, too
bounce: why didn't you get the nick without _ released and use that? you can still do that, by the by.
cgcardona_: you mean that I don't have nickserv set to enforce my nick registration?
fluffypony: nope
fluffypony: you need to /nickserv set enforce on
fluffypony: although WHY that isn't the default on Freenode is beyond me
cgcardona_: so someone has potentially be impersonating me on here?
cgcardona_: that's no good.
cgcardona_: i should check the logs.
bounce: because we're not all -otc lurkers, you know
fluffypony: http://otcdb.us.to/otc/?cgcardona_&&&&&
ozbot: OTC cgcardona_
cgcardona_: holy shit you're right
cgcardona_: someone joining btc-otc as me on 2014-04-20 07:34:38 CDT and 2014-04-20 07:34:24 CDT
fluffypony: adsl-74-177-71-233.gsp.bellsouth.net
cgcardona_: geez that's unbelievable
fluffypony: from there
fluffypony: yeah
cgcardona_: holy shit. fucking people.
fluffypony: looks like they scammed someone too
cgcardona_: so now that I have it set to enforce it will make someone enter my nickserv each time and if not kick them off of my nick?
bounce views nickserv as rather fascist already, nevermind nick enforcing. it's the thing to do on here, but, you know. can also argue that with only gribble it'd give more incentive to check with gribble first and foremost, and to accept no substitutes.
fluffypony: yes
fluffypony: well not kick them off, I think it forces a nick change to GuestXXXXX
cgcardona_: fluffypony: thanks for the help. that totally blows.
cgcardona_: but i guess its good that I found out now
fluffypony: yeah, Anduck will remove the negrating once you get hold of him
cgcardona_: hopefully i can work something out w/ Anduck to find out what happened.
kanzure: you can ghost kill someone squatting on your nick
fluffypony: kanzure: yes, but not if you're not online
bounce: not if you're not on, silly kanzure
fluffypony: heh
kanzure: does this mean i'm dreaming
fluffypony: kanzure: try ghosting yourself as a test :-P
cgcardona_: damn that totally sucks. sheesh
cgcardona_: gotta find the logs for btc-otc and see what the hell happened on those days.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.5098 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/an-hero-is-he/
ozbot: An hero is he… pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 5000 @ 0.00013188 = 0.6594 BTC [-] {4}
mircea_popescu: meh it's not done.
mircea_popescu: redoing.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.067127 = 0.2014 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 7 @ 0.50085714 = 3.506 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 1122 @ 0.00016989 = 0.1906 BTC [+] {6}
jurov: !up daybyter
assbot: Voicing daybyter for 30 minutes.
daybyter: Hi!
jurov: hello
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 600 @ 0.00018578 = 0.1115 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 531 @ 0.0001938 = 0.1029 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 2248 @ 0.00025253 = 0.5677 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: hey
mircea_popescu: !up turbo_ac1001
assbot: Voicing turbo_ac1001 for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: turbo_ac1001 you just commented on trilema ?
fluffypony: well now he's distracted reading Persion Folklore
mircea_popescu: lol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 45 @ 0.0075 = 0.3375 BTC [+]
turbo_ac1001: I did
fluffypony: lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40900 @ 0.00099566 = 40.7225 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: MTGOX recovery imminent!
mircea_popescu: da fuck
mircea_popescu: !up turbo_ac100
assbot: Voicing turbo_ac100 for 30 minutes.
turbo_ac100: thanks
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: where'd ya see that?
thestringpuller: ah mircea_popescu returns
thestringpuller: rested i see from the exciting conference
mircea_popescu: you may be having a client issue because you got kicked by chanserv.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller was great.
turbo_ac100: authed with gribble but assbot doesn't let me !up
mircea_popescu: fluffypony google drug it up, https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=11&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCQQFjAAOAo&url=https%3A%2F%2Fbitcointa.lk%2Fthreads%2Fmtgox-recovery-imminent.262429%2Fpage-2&ei=lUNVU87oN8_y7AbTwIH4Ag&usg=AFQjCNGHHKEJtFolkPKq5bnZP0kHSJ_rRA&bvm=bv.65058239,d.ZGU
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust assbot turbo_ac100
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user turbo_ac100: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 1 via 1 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=turbo_ac100 | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=turbo_ac100 | Rated since: Thu Apr 3 11:09:50 2014
mircea_popescu: turbo_ac100 it should. pm it !up
turbo_ac100: trying again (i know right now I'm not authed). There is a flood message I'm gonna reproduce now
fluffypony: "Sure, but a new CEO would suffice to reestablish trust."
fluffypony: l.o.l.
mircea_popescu: i vote for danny.
fluffypony: underwritten by Ken Slaughter?
mircea_popescu: or shakaru
turbo_ac100: OF COURSE it works without the flood issues... *sigh*
mircea_popescu: herp
thestringpuller: ;;ident
gribble: Nick 'thestringpuller', with hostmask 'thestringpuller!~leflor@99-39-97-12.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net', is identified as user 'thestringpuller', with GPG key id 0FF2943DA179E169, key fingerprint 6ACE36E786F39A4ADC4506DE0FF2943DA179E169, and bitcoin address None
thestringpuller: man gribble hasn't gotten knocked for several days
turbo_ac100: The manticore still is a lion though.
mircea_popescu: ;;google "with a vicious streak a mile wide"
gribble: Rabbit of Caerbannog - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbit_of_Caerbannog>; Tim the Enchanter (Character) - Quotes - IMDb: <http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0032565/quotes>; Faced With a Killer Rabbit - Monty Python Page: <http://montypython.50webs.com/scripts/Holy_Grail/Scene20.htm>
mircea_popescu: ye noob of little memeledge.
turbo_ac100: ooooh
mircea_popescu: "when mp is wrong, you've probably misunderstood or neglected something"
thestringpuller: when mp is wrong it's usually on something that doesn't matter
thestringpuller: or he knows when he's wrong and doesn't perpetuate it like da scammaz
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 9 @ 0.49078984 = 4.4171 BTC [-] {7}
mircea_popescu: or he's just plain old wrong
thestringpuller: lolol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 38 @ 0.00481 = 0.1828 BTC [-]
turbo_ac100: So why not the manticore then? #justargumentumecontrariothings
mircea_popescu: i dunno dood, she was wearing a corset so it kinda looked to me like a playboy bunny of yore
mircea_popescu: it's supposed to be a soft joke
thestringpuller: corsets are fancy tho
turbo_ac100: Romanian soft?
thestringpuller: lol
mircea_popescu: howssat ?
thestringpuller: mp doesn't go to many nerd conventions where the girls cosplay in steampunk with corsets galore
mircea_popescu: btw, i kinda have a bet with mpoe-pr as to who shows up here first, asciilifeform or thickasthieves.
mircea_popescu: anyone wanna take sides ?
thestringpuller: i dunno corsets are expensive, classy and sexy all at the sametime
thestringpuller: asciilifeform will be first
mircea_popescu: i think so too.
thestringpuller: did TaT go to MP-Con '14 ?
mircea_popescu: ya
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13811 @ 0.00099298 = 13.714 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: lol i wonder if there exists a secret underground ScamCon
bounce: yes?
mircea_popescu: where do they hold it ? little italy ? nigeria ?
bounce: well, not so secret. was another "discovery" from some security blogging company or other; buncha roossians had started their own coin
thestringpuller: LOL in nigeria...
fluffypony: turbo_ac100: maybe we can get #justmanticorethings trending?
bounce: what was that picture again, of some narco guy's mansion with on the order of 18bn in usd and assorted further currencies in various places, down to simply stacked in a room. one'd think that's enough to buy an underground bunker to store the stuff.
bounce: oh, apparently misremembered, only 207mn usd. still, what's an underground bunker or two cost these days?
bounce wonders where the 18bn figure came from.
mircea_popescu: bounce 18bn in usd is something like
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 22 * 18000
gribble: 396000
mircea_popescu: 4mn lbs.
bounce: lbs? what are you, a merkin?
mircea_popescu: fine, 2k tons
turbo_ac100: fluffypony: will try :)
bounce: or about 2 gigagram. give or take.
bounce: https://imgur.com/a/DYU2e says it's 22bn
ozbot: Mexican Drug Lord home after being raided - Imgur
mircea_popescu: bs
mircea_popescu: that's not "billionz"
fluffypony: there's no way
fluffypony: that is 22bn
mircea_popescu: 10 x 34 on the surface, like 60 or so deep
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 10 * 34 * 60000
gribble: 20400000
mircea_popescu: like 200ish mn there.
fluffypony: 207 mil to be exact
fluffypony: nicely calculated
fluffypony: http://www.businessinsider.com/zhenli-ye-gon-causes-trouble-for-las-vegas-sands-2012-8
ozbot: Zhenli Ye Gon Causes Trouble For Las Vegas Sands - Business Insider
fluffypony: "A raid of his home in the wealthy neighborhood of Mexico City produced what police described as "the largest single drug cash seizure the world has ever seen." Almost $207 million sat in the house in cash. Seven high-powered firearms were also in the house, the New York Times reported."
bounce: apt, though. consider what happens to reported prices, the so called "street value"
fluffypony: also the third picture is an actual museum
fluffypony: http://internacional.elpais.com/internacional/2013/06/18/album/1371516659_231755.html#1371516659_231755_1371517565
fluffypony: so that's just embellishment
fluffypony: also that bit at the end is way wrong
bounce: curiously, a load of stolen garlic got recovered (border agents smelled something), and the value reported sounded like they used wholesale prices, not "supermarket prices".
fluffypony: "$22 billion/[(310 million people)(12 years)(~$5,000/person/year)]=0.0012. $22 billion would meet about 0.12% of the health insurance costs for 12 years. Actual cost would be $18.6 trillion. Health insurance would have to cost $5.91 per person per year for $22 billion to cover everyone for 12 years."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4132 @ 0.00099584 = 4.1148 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: shit mpoe-pr wins
mircea_popescu: !up Shakespeare
assbot: Voicing Shakespeare for 30 minutes.
Shakespeare: I signed on just to beat stan
mircea_popescu: ahahaha
Shakespeare: I'm in NJ airport :)
mircea_popescu: lmao
mircea_popescu: nj has an airport ?!
Shakespeare: surprised me too
Shakespeare: it has a retarded ticker too
Shakespeare: ear
Shakespeare: ewr
Shakespeare: for Newark
mircea_popescu: hello sir, here are your ear-wax tickets
Shakespeare: ewr not ear though
Shakespeare: just my tablet autocorrect...
mircea_popescu: !up _aeon
assbot: Voicing _aeon for 30 minutes.
Shakespeare: so for 9 hours over the ocean guess who I get seated with
mircea_popescu: this bombshell redhead
Shakespeare: poor young tourettes girl
mircea_popescu: no fucking way ?!
Shakespeare: barking and such
Shakespeare: yeah
mircea_popescu: i never met anyone with actual tourettes.
Shakespeare: it didn't bother me other than sadden me
Shakespeare: she was embarrassed when it got bad, putting blanket over her face
Duffer1: poor kid
fluffypony: shame man
mircea_popescu: o look who's here. quick someone call teh bitcoin police
davout: :D
mircea_popescu: Shakespeare i still have trouble wrapping my head around the notion.
mircea_popescu: i mean, i don't actually think that w/e, they're faking it. but it just fails to compute on the intuitive level.
davout: i found france
Shakespeare: for the record, davout lost at least 1.5 games
davout: Shakespeare: i beg your pardon
Shakespeare: its true!
Shakespeare: remember the rules argument?
mircea_popescu: what sort of scam french invincibility is this
Shakespeare: and then later me and someone else won for deals
Shakespeare: realz
davout: Shakespeare: i'm not sure i follow
Shakespeare: that's OK
Shakespeare: this is tat btw
davout: mircea_popescu: i wish to apologize for my rudeness in marking my territory in timisoara repeatedly
mircea_popescu: lol
davout: Shakespeare: was your trip back ok ?
Shakespeare: meh
Shakespeare: see logs
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 150 @ 0.00461215 = 0.6918 BTC [-] {10}
Shakespeare: I still in NJ too
Shakespeare: I had to go thru security 3 times once I got to US
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13500 @ 0.00099058 = 13.3728 BTC [-] {3}
Shakespeare: and check my bags all over again
Shakespeare: good times
Shakespeare: I did get to hang with ASCII at two airports though
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 58 @ 0.00220865 = 0.1281 BTC [-] {9}
davout: !up Oleanie
assbot: Voicing Oleanie for 30 minutes.
davout: Shakespeare: gotta love the cavity searches
davout: ftr Oleanie == Fanny
Shakespeare: ah cool
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 28 @ 0.04488566 = 1.2568 BTC [+] {4}
davout: mircea_popescu: the rosé is very nice
Shakespeare: customs let me keep my champagne btw
mircea_popescu: ;;rate Oleanie 1 She rides.
gribble: Error: User doesn't exist in the Rating or GPG databases. User must be GPG-registered to receive ratings.
davout: Shakespeare: cabin luggage ?
mircea_popescu: davout nao you tell her how to gpg yes ?
davout: mircea_popescu: imma explain it all to her a bit later
Shakespeare: I wrapped it in my clothesline my checked baggage
Oleanie: we are drinking ours
mircea_popescu: !b 2 ✂︎
assbot: Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. (http://dpaste.com/1789955/plain/)
Shakespeare: lol not clothesline
mircea_popescu: clothesline srsly ?
Shakespeare: autocorrect...
davout: Shakespeare: that's the only way you can get it through
mircea_popescu: davout after you drink it i'll tell you what it cost.
davout: mircea_popescu: it has been drinked
davout: drank/drunk, what is the correct one ?
mircea_popescu: Shakespeare it's hysterical because well... wine fermented in the bottle can well explode.
davout: mircea_popescu: Oleanie still has some in her glass
mircea_popescu: but they won't let you take i dunno, lotion. i nevere heard of lotion exploding
Shakespeare: ASCII gave your cabbie a bunch $20 bills this morning. I couldn't tell which of them enjoyed it more
mircea_popescu: davout drunk
mircea_popescu: Shakespeare haha
mircea_popescu: guy definitely enjoys a lot of stuff huh.
davout: Shakespeare mircea_popescu our cab driver started the ride by yelling "Shumacher shumacher!"
mircea_popescu: lmao
mircea_popescu: davout was like... hey, i know you set it up for us to be there in time, but could you cancel it so we go on foot 7 1/2 hours later ?
mircea_popescu: we're from france and so we like to wait uncomfortably in airports
mircea_popescu: it's like... when you come out from under sea, you gotta re-aclimatize to the suck.
mircea_popescu: 7 1/2 hours earlier i mean.
jurov: lmao my cabbie (when i got lost a bit on arrival) refused to accept 10 euro bill
jurov: eventually he gave me change in lei
davout: mircea_popescu: naaah, we met mike_c there
mircea_popescu: o dude.
davout: we were just 30 min early
davout: i really hate being in a rush
mircea_popescu: mike_c threw me for a fucking loop. cause afaik he was leaving tomorrow, right ? so i had secretary call hotel front desk to sert up lunch, cause i figured... we can do lunch
mircea_popescu: she calls me in a total panic, cause well... he's gone ?! and she suspects the idiot receptionist kicked him out maybne ?
davout: LOL
Shakespeare: lol
mircea_popescu: so you know, i go there like a fucking ride of valkiries screaming all the way from like outside, WHO DUN IT!
Shakespeare: he had some trouble with the time zones :)
mircea_popescu: the girl, bring me the girl
mircea_popescu: so they fetch her and she's completely dumbfounded... guy came, witgh his bags, checked out and left. how is she to know he's not to be allowed to leave ?!
mircea_popescu: but eventually they checked the airline and he was there so. disaster averte
mircea_popescu: d
Shakespeare: dude a pigeon just flew by me
Shakespeare: in the airport
mircea_popescu: did it whistle correctly ?
Shakespeare: fucking NJ
Shakespeare: it was silent
fluffypony: like a bat?
mircea_popescu: bats aren't silent
mircea_popescu: i can fucking hear them.
fluffypony: thatsthejoke.gif
Shakespeare: like a silent dove but not
mircea_popescu: nojokesallowed.pdf
fluffypony: didyougpgencryptthat.questionmark
mircea_popescu: yes, which is why its spelled questionlark
Shakespeare: karpelesceosuite.exe
fluffypony: Shakespeare: wouldn't it be .php3 ?
mircea_popescu: it would be ===php4
Shakespeare: no cuz its a scam
davout: fluffypony: you'd click it in doubt, and that's the whole point :-)
Shakespeare: csstml 5
fluffypony: lawl
fluffypony: node.js!
mircea_popescu: i gotta get taleb to write about bitcoin.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2000 @ 0.00013091 = 0.2618 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 25 @ 0.02951683 = 0.7379 BTC [-] {8}
mircea_popescu: quoting for stan's own pleasure :
mircea_popescu: I would like to record here (so people get off my back) that I do not belong to the so-called "Austrian School" of economics, in spite of a few similar positions on bailouts and bottom-up systems. I believe in mathematical statements. But if I were to belong to a school of thought designated by a nationality, the {NATIONALITY} SCHOOL of {DISCIPLINE} it would be the Russian school of probability.
mircea_popescu: Members across three generations: P.L. Chebyshev, A.A. Markov, A.M. Lyapunov, S.N. Bernshtein (ie. Bernstein), E.E. Slutskii, N.V. Smirnov, L.N. Bol'shev, V.I. Romanovskii, A.N. Kolmogorov,Yu.V. Linnik, and the new generation: V Petrov, S.V. Nagaev, A.V. Nagaev, A. Shyrayev, etc.
davout: mircea_popescu: he's already tweeted stuff iirc
mircea_popescu: davout i mean specifically. or to quote again,
mircea_popescu: "Margo I have lived in the theatre as a Trappist monk lives in his faith"
fluffypony: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/23l56v/qr_codes_are_dead/
ozbot: QR codes are dead : Bitcoin
mircea_popescu: "I have no other world, no other life."
fluffypony: so apparently the way we *should* be using Bitcoin
fluffypony: is through Bluetooth LE
fluffypony: and we'll just keep our phones in our pocket
fluffypony: and walk up to the counter
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 11 @ 0.02913635 = 0.3205 BTC [-] {5}
mircea_popescu: " QR codes have been around and hyped for years, but they were never used as much as developers and marketing people hoped." << truth.
fluffypony: and the cashier will say "PayPal or Bitcoin, sir?"
fluffypony: and we'll say "Bitcoin"
fluffypony: and the money will just magically come off without us needing to authorise it
mircea_popescu: here's a funny story : bar where we watered saturday night, had an advertising above the urinal. on that advertising, aqr code.
mircea_popescu: it was unreadable, because the frame covered it.
fluffypony: "No ugly smartphone unlocking, app starting, camera pointing at a fancy QR code. No, all handsfree, how it needs to work."
cgcardona_: i actually think bitcoin is QR code's killer app
mircea_popescu: !up Shakespeare
assbot: Voicing Shakespeare for 30 minutes.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: besides, who's sober enough to scan a QR code?
mircea_popescu: fluffypony ikr ?
davout: mircea_popescu: right hand is for the dick, left for the smartphone
mircea_popescu: cgcardona_ could be, but somehow i doubt it.
mircea_popescu: !up JoshG
assbot: Voicing JoshG for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: davout and the balls ?!
davout: mircea_popescu: teh girl
cgcardona_: also, my 5 year old son is obsessed w/ qr codes. He askes me to scan everyone that we see (yes this could backfire one day). I think people of his generation will find QR codes quite intuitive
mircea_popescu: "my prediction is". da fguck is this shit, "cluster4" is now making "my prediction" ?
davout: nah, in all seriousness, i don't know about you, but i don't piss with my balls
mircea_popescu: people have a lot of difficulty groking that if you're anonymous... there is no property.
mircea_popescu: there's no "my" in anonimity.
mircea_popescu: davout no idea how you can piss with teh girl handling your balls.
davout: mircea_popescu: being anonymous doesn't mean there is no idnentity
davout: mircea_popescu: years of training
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 25 @ 0.00600001 = 0.15 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: davout ne confondre pas anonimite e pseudonimite, i say!
davout: anonymous, absence of name, not of identity
mircea_popescu: anonymous is absence of identity.
mircea_popescu: like, joe schmuck on reddit. is not a person.
mircea_popescu: it's not even a thing. it's gas.
mircea_popescu: "as it's use is very limited"
davout: mircea_popescu: i'd say fungibility is the absence of identity, anonymity is the absence of name, but i'm too tipsy on that delicious rosé champagne to even imagine arguing the point properly
mircea_popescu: stupid enough to not realise he can't have a "my" as nobody, clueless enough to fail to distinguish a verb from a possessive. this is reddit.
mircea_popescu: davout so argue it tomorrow.
mircea_popescu: curious to see how you'll argue cluster4 is not fungible with cluster3 or derpymcherp or w/e.
mircea_popescu: this entire shit is backwards. views, which are not fungible, people pretend are in fact fungible. then anons, which are absolutely fungible, people pretend like are not. apparently the web is quite counterintuitive.
davout: mircea_popescu: derps might be fungible as anonymous entities, entities we couldn't care to name, it doesn't really impede their ability to each own a bitcent
davout: brb
mircea_popescu: but that's irrelevant for this discussion innit.
mircea_popescu: the opinion of derp1 is exactly equal to the opinion of derp2 inasmuch as we don't know anything about 'em.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18993 @ 0.00099071 = 18.8166 BTC [+] {2}
davout: mircea_popescu: yes, but fungibility and anonymity lie in the observer, property lies with the things themselves
bounce: yeah, no. with davout on this one, "anonymity" is lack of a label, not necessarily lack of an underlying identity. on the flip side, you already know what jehova's witnesses will try and tell you without you needing their name, regardless of whether they offer their name. if they do, they're no longer anonymous. it doesn't affect your esteem for what they're trying to tell you.
mircea_popescu: http://www.lambiek.net/artists/image/m/mas_r/mas_pifou_pg6904.jpg
mircea_popescu: davout the fact that the person "deep down" "twu wuvs" you is immaterial.
mircea_popescu: for all you know pet rocks have distinct personalities.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: looks like I lost the bet
mircea_popescu: aye.
thestringpuller: :(
mircea_popescu: bounce anon jehova's witnesses are not people.
mircea_popescu: to personalize they need to de-jehova-witnessize for you, before you.
davout: derp1 and derp2 might be fungible from our pov, but derp1 can still own 1 btc while derp2 owns 2
mircea_popescu: so ?
bounce: not to you. inside their own circles their worth is measured by their zeal.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: there's an H on end
mircea_popescu: but what happens inside the pet rock is uninteresting in this discussion.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony yeah k.
davout: mircea_popescu: it is, because knowledge of different informations translates directly to ownership, or non-ownership of bitcoins for example
mircea_popescu: unless and untill this becomes transpared to you it is immaterial.
mircea_popescu: after it becomes transparent to you, it already broke that anonimity.
bounce: soldiers are cannon fodder to you, individuals to themselves and their bosses. look, they even wear name tags.
mircea_popescu: but what they are, for as long as they DON
thestringpuller: ;;seen mod6
gribble: mod6 was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 day, 16 hours, 49 minutes, and 15 seconds ago: <mod6> $vwap s.mpoe
mircea_popescu: T wear dogtags, is fungible gas.
mircea_popescu: "A 43-year-old programmer who helped set in motion a class-action lawsuit against the companies and became one of its five class representatives will not be present in the San Jose courtroom. He was shot and killed by the police last December."
mircea_popescu: funny how accidents work.
bounce: very funny indeed
davout: i don't think that my ability to distinguish derps is really related to their ability to own stuff, it is not necessary for me to be able to know they are able to destroy a bitcoin for them to actually be able to destroy a bitcoin
mircea_popescu: davout your ability to distinguish derps is however central to their ability to exist.
mircea_popescu: you can be bios, but you can not be zoon unrecognised.
mircea_popescu: so yes, animals they can be. people however, they can not be, unless recognised.
bounce: there's this conflation of "person" to mean "someone who matters (to me)", which is highly viewpoint-dependent. your basic definition appears to be "someone who matters in the bitcoin sphere and can be trusted not to fsck up (too badly)". might need a suitable word for that.
mircea_popescu: bounce it merely means "someone who can be distinguished from the others"
davout: what you're saying is pretty much that derps exist in a quantum superposition of owning, and not-owning stuff, and that their actual ownership resolves when i actually observe, aka measure them
mircea_popescu: which reduces to "someone who could, in principle, matter"
davout: right?
mircea_popescu: because the undistinguishable can't ever matter, by definition.
mircea_popescu: davout pretty good approach yeah
mircea_popescu: speaking of "different" derps is like speaking of photons as billiard balls.
davout: that is true if you consider that everything that matters is only what you have knowledge of
mircea_popescu: perhaps an excusable approximation in some narrow cases, but wrong in principle.
mircea_popescu: davout everythint that matters is only what COULD BE HAD knowledge of.
bounce: ``In ancient Rome, the word "persona" (Latin) or "prosopon" ([...]: Greek) originally referred to the masks worn by actors on stage.'' --wikipedia
mircea_popescu: bounce fun fact... that yielded romanian prosop, which means... towel.
bounce: those come in handy hitchhiking
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.0671117 = 0.6711 BTC [-] {5}
bounce: anyway that doesn't help much, since "distinguishing from the others" implies a yardstick, that in turn is a choice bound by context
mircea_popescu: not so.
mircea_popescu: yardstick is a matter of measuring, and thus relegated to quantitative discussions. we're discussing qualitative matters here.
bounce: we're measuring the quality. when is someone a person? whether the scale is actually countable is immaterial.
bounce: s/is countable/has countable subdivisions/
mircea_popescu: nah.
bounce: you still end up with two ends of a stick. "person", "not a person"
mircea_popescu: how are these ends of a stick ? there's no continuum
bounce: or sides. you can discern both states, even if the distance between them is infinitesmal and only exists as an idea to boot
bounce: when's the liquour strong enough? well, if it's over $strength. something like that.
mircea_popescu: let's try a different tack. you know what a cog is. you also know what a sphere is.
mircea_popescu: good anonimity, just like good sphericity, relies on not being a cog. at all.
mircea_popescu: conversely, good cogicity, just like good personhood, relies on not being a sphere. at all.
davout: bounce: the way i understand the argument is that ownership is akin to the state of an electron, until you observe it exists in a superposition of states, it can only have a state when you observe it
mircea_popescu: now, this does not reduce to "liquor being strong ENOUGH"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 19 @ 0.02838964 = 0.5394 BTC [-] {10}
mircea_popescu: it reduces to being liquour or oil.
mircea_popescu: good oil is not alcohol. good alcohol is not oil.
davout: speaking of which i'm on way to pop the second bottle, please disregard all my further comments
mircea_popescu: there's no serious consideration of an oil-alcohol mixture being "storng enough", as you won't drink vodka-canoia oil cocktails
bounce: disagree. it'd mean that the only good person be a totally non-anonymous person, so, real personhood is only open to, say, obama. or dubya.
mircea_popescu: bounce actually, misplaced shards of anonimity ruin personhood. which is why i keep having to ask derps posing as ceos here "who's we".
mircea_popescu: conversely, misplaced shards of personhood ruin anonimity. such as w/e, silk road guy.
mircea_popescu: "Now academics learn to take a paper or a class of papers, imitate the style, the organization; copy the phraseology, discuss the historical literature and find some wrinkle on the problem that makes it look like a contribution. This is what tends to be published, and this is what seems to be "original". And these works never survive the author."
mircea_popescu: because someone somewhere in a bureaucracy figured it's a good idea to fucking industrialise research.
mircea_popescu: may he never rest.
bounce: guy posing as "CEO" claiming to have lots of minions needs a good team. since claim made, up to him to back it up. that's not quite the same as requiring to know his every move or his every thought.
bounce: s/back it up/&, show he has such a team/ etc. bit forgetful with the details today
mircea_popescu: nobody requires to know his every move or thought in any sense.
bounce: that's be implied through "total non-anonymity" though
mircea_popescu: only iyo.
bounce: no. hence the conflation.
mircea_popescu: the criteria is good wot relations, not "knowing their every thought"
bounce: I'm not disagreeing with what you're trying to say, just that the terminology could stand improvement.
mircea_popescu: the devil himself knows not the thought of man ☟︎
bounce: (yet god knows every thought of the devil's, and being a good little god... lets him be?)
mircea_popescu: if god actually knew every thought of the devil, he'd have not been surprised.
mircea_popescu: god'd like to. but tis impossible, inasmuch as the devil is human, and god is not that good.
bounce: you're saying the poor devil is unoriginal?
mircea_popescu: i am saying that the poor god is incapable.
bounce: oh well. AIUI paradise lost would beg to differ. haven't gotten around to actually reading the thing.
mircea_popescu: how's it differ ?
bounce: anyway, "good wot relations" means that you've met and dealt with a number of other people, and gathered their esteem, and in doing so gathered a total esteem enough to be deemed worthy of the community as a whole.
bounce: "liqour strong enough" if you will
mircea_popescu: understanding rather than esteem. the people you've dealt with are marks you may be recognised by.
mircea_popescu: in no sense is this a numeric problem,
mircea_popescu: which is why no numeric methods work for this task.
bounce: and every user has a differend yardstick, making the whole thing subjective to use.
mircea_popescu: two hours ago i said i suspect i'm weeks away from a major breakthrough in economics.
mircea_popescu: i think this discussion shaved a week off.
mircea_popescu: bounce im not sure you have a usable definition of subjective in mind.
bounce: also more or less saved me having to do a write-up
mircea_popescu: if it's the kneejerk "not usg diddled" then might as well discard it.
bounce: "subjective" as every user of the wot looking to form an opinion on some other user of the wot does so as he deems good, mayhaps taking into account that raters will also use their own criteria to rate with.
bounce: s/as /as in /
mircea_popescu: so inasmuch as good is done, this is optimal not subjective.
mircea_popescu: if he looked to do what he felt like it could have been subjective, as a proxy for aesthetic i guess.
bounce: what I mean is that even if the outcome is roughly the same for different onlookers, their conclusions are (supposedly) their own; like how you notice that there's no intl. standard of interpreting ratings. nor should there be.
mircea_popescu: which is ultimately why no numerical approach.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.03099869 = 0.186 BTC [+] {5}
bounce: you could still try and throw statistics at it, but that doesn't change the underlying subjectivity
mircea_popescu: are you using "subjectivity" merely to note the fact that the numeric method does not apply ?
bounce: hmno.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 20 @ 0.063133 = 1.2627 BTC [-] {10}
bounce: WOT ratings can well mean different things to you and me. they're not even ment to be used "objectively", ie in a manner independent of people's opinions.
mircea_popescu: give me an example of such an objectively.
bounce: an objective measure? a metre, standard the world over.
mircea_popescu: enacted by ?
mircea_popescu: worst possible fucking example.
bounce: whether I take a tape measure to $derp or you do it, when done correctly we both will conclude the guy's length to be $whatever. that'd be objective. we both look at his WOT ratings, we might well draw different conclusions on the same data.
bounce: we could devise a "standard" scoring test for WOT ratings and still draw differing conclusions based on what we see
mircea_popescu: this is more akin to you using inches and me using cm.
mircea_popescu: both of these "objectively" examples you provide strictly adhere to your definition of subjectivity,
mircea_popescu: they exist as a result of people's opinions.
bounce: er? I gave one objective and one subjective example?
mircea_popescu: <bounce> an objective measure? a metre, standard the world over. < 1 ; <bounce> whether I take a tape measure to $derp or you do it, when done correctly we both will conclude the guy's length to be $whatever. < 2
mircea_popescu: your "done corectly" is there precisely because you too know this :
mircea_popescu: god help us if our opinions of these subjectives do not agree.
bounce: both're objective; I don't need a judgement call here, I look at the tape measure.
mircea_popescu: but you need a judgement call for the tape measure to exist in the first place.
mircea_popescu: you seem to be roughly in the position of the slave who says his master's will is divine in nature, because it's outside of his reach.
bounce: eh, I think we're past that. I can put three lava lamps on a table and count them. you'll count three too. no feels or beliefs involved. even if our counting system is ultimately arbitrary in it existence
mircea_popescu: while outside of his reach it may well be, his master's just another guy.
mircea_popescu: so numbers are your standard of objectivity, but then when i ask you <mircea_popescu> are you using "subjectivity" merely to note the fact that the numeric method does not apply ? you say no.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 50 @ 0.00600001 = 0.3 BTC [+]
bounce: well, what is "the numeric method"? I can devise and use a system of numeric scales based on how much I feel I know about someone else.
bounce: the end result to that would still be subjective. someone else might well feel a different way.
davout: meanwhile, in timisoara : http://i.imgur.com/kBnMktn.jpg ☟︎
mircea_popescu: lol
davout: !up Oleanie
assbot: Voicing Oleanie for 30 minutes.
Oleanie: i love this one ^^
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8350 @ 0.0009891 = 8.259 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: hello kitty
bounce: curious how that thing is such a stayer. as an antidote: http://web.archive.org/web/20010221014629/http://www.gci-net.com/users/w/wildeman/Sanrio.txt
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.066108 = 0.6611 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: !up lamosty
assbot: Voicing lamosty for 30 minutes.
davout: bounce: stopped after chapter one
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35050 @ 0.00099321 = 34.812 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: mkay, so i'm writing a seminal, major and epic work called "a complete theory of economics".
mircea_popescu: sadly this has to start by my translating three older romanian articles, but c'est la vie.
bounce: so, google translate work better straight to english or via french or/and latin first?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15300 @ 0.00099521 = 15.2267 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: it doesn't work at sall unless you're after humor.
jborkl: hehe you said semen
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13502 @ 0.00099521 = 13.4373 BTC [+] {2}
fluffypony: jborkl: semen-all
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8650 @ 0.00099707 = 8.6247 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I dunno why the dude reverts to assuming personal attacks other than maybe the one sided blindess impressed upon the legal profession.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7200 @ 0.0009945 = 7.1604 BTC [-] {2}
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: when do we get _Trilema: The Book_
fluffypony: http://imgur.com/a/NEHRT
ozbot: 13 Hilarious and Sexist Dating Tips From 1938. - Imgur
fluffypony: oh the 30s
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4720 @ 0.00099439 = 4.6935 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: rithm lol
mircea_popescu: wait wut! cheating of voice!
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: !up rithm
assbot: Voicing rithm for 30 minutes.
rithm: be vewwwwy kwiet. im hunting wabbits
rithm: but this though: http://imgur.com/VTBX0dg
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8973 @ 0.00099425 = 8.9214 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.49000005 = 0.98 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5791 @ 0.00098861 = 5.725 BTC [-]
cgcardona_: ;;rate danielpbarron 1 #bitcoin-assets regular and defended me when a scammer squatted on my nick in #bitcoin-otc
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user danielpbarron has changed from 1 to 1.
cgcardona_: thanks btw ^
artifexd: cgcardona_: I wouldn't worry about total wot rating since it is a meaningless number.
artifexd: Sometimes a negative rating would be a good thing depending on who it came from.
fluffypony: like from Supa
artifexd: Imagine you had a negative rating from mtgox with the comment "TROLL!!!!!!"
cgcardona_: haha.
artifexd: I would see such a rating as reflecting positively on the ratee.
cgcardona_: interesting way to look at it.
rithm: i'd almost pay for a negrate from mgicaltux
rithm: *magicaltux
rithm: negrate from a scammer is a badge of honor
artifexd: Exactly. So you can't just look at the sum of the ratings and learn anything useful.
artifexd: Does anyone know of any wot visualization tools? I imagine something like bubbles with names and the lines connecting those bubbles are colored/weighted according to the rating.
bounce: sure you can. "person has been rated N times, some positive, some negative." -- negative ratings might well be the more interesting to read.
artifexd: When I said "look at the sum", I meant look at the single number which is the sum of all ratings.
bounce: the fact that it exists at all is an interesting datum, inasmuch it doesn't say "not rated yet"
bounce: if it's well over 10 or -10 that's a clear indication it wasn't by just one rating either
artifexd: I would argue that the fact that it exists at all encourages the improper use of the wot.
bounce: no railroading powertools
mircea_popescu: artifexd actually the controlling example is... anduck himself has a total negaitve
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 57 @ 0.06269212 = 3.5735 BTC [-] {5}
mircea_popescu: also :
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust artifexd
gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask artifexd!sid28611@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zasykpxnqiqgtbip. Trust relationship from user mircea_popescu to user artifexd: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 2 via 2 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=mircea_popescu&dest=artifexd | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=artifexd | Rated since: Wed Mar 5 02:06:14 2014
mircea_popescu: first one.
mircea_popescu: !up rithm
assbot: Voicing rithm for 30 minutes.
rithm: why must we voice me
rithm: the bot is dumb
artifexd: mircea_popescu: When asking about the visual tool, I meant for the whole wot. Specifically to identify islands, groups, etc.
mircea_popescu: dexX7 published one recently iirc. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: rithm because you have no wot.
rithm: can't someone just run a normal eggdrop bot and auto voice people
kakobrekla: rithm up yourself on pm
rithm: gaH
kakobrekla: or that.
rithm: and my caps getsd stuck
mircea_popescu: so stop sucking
kakobrekla: i think not anymore
rithm: lemme try
artifexd: Interestingly, wrt anduck, he has a total of -69. There are 7 -10 ratings that are CLEARLY from the same person.
rithm: b-o-r-i-n-g
rithm: ;;ident
gribble: CAUTION: irc nick differs from otc registered nick. Nick 'rithm', with hostmask 'rithm!~rithm@unaffiliated/rithm', is identified as user 'jcpham', with GPG key id C71FB5ED6ACE04AF, key fingerprint F7299BD73879E866613EAB24C71FB5ED6ACE04AF, and bitcoin address 157CrafPv8oGC7f5vVFuLnE1BgDYUND4hq
rithm: ;;unauth
gribble: Your GPG session has been terminated.
artifexd: dexX7: Did you visualize the entire wot?
dexX7: no :)
dexX7: only the assbot/#ba users
artifexd: But... http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-04-2014#633726 ☝︎
artifexd: Ah
dexX7: sec
dexX7: http://i.imgur.com/xfGIozu.png
rithm: omg gold titans
rithm: incoming supposedly
dexX7: bounce posted a list of all users who may be voiced here
rithm: much excite
dexX7: the tool used was https://gephi.org/ which allows to import simple csvs but it's really slow for large datasets (or i simply don't know how to use it properly which is not unlikely :)
artifexd: That's hot.
kakobrekla: rithm, yeah, although i fixed the parsing side, its not gonna work because it would break the simplicity of the design, so nick around if you wanna dick around
rithm dagger to the heart
fluffypony: dexX7: very cool
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4232 @ 0.00098871 = 4.1842 BTC [+]
bounce: probably should re-run that listing thing; the math was a bit borked.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 650 @ 0.14 = 91 BTC
bounce: oh foo, need to re-do the via thing. hm.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10400 @ 0.00098871 = 10.2826 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 1 @ 0.14 BTC
dignork: dexX7: try this one instead of Gephi: http://tulip.labri.fr/TulipDrupal/ , on my graphs Gephi just crashed, but this one survived
dexX7: ah ty
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 11 @ 0.00994845 = 0.1094 BTC [-] {2}
dexX7: does anyone know since when blockchain.info is offline?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10347 @ 0.00098849 = 10.2279 BTC [-] {2}
dexX7: ah nvm. i found the blogpost
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13000 @ 0.00098373 = 12.7885 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 600 @ 0.14 = 84 BTC
jurov: http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/shortcuts/2014/apr/21/palcohol-powder-alcohol-vodka-rum-cocktail-snorting?CMP=fb_gu
ozbot: Palcohol: the powderised alcohol that turns water into rum | Life and style | The Guardian
jurov: sth for BingoBoingo
jurov: i have seen our future. soylent and palcohol.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11753 @ 0.00098483 = 11.5747 BTC [+]
bounce: how does that work, powdering a liquid?
bounce: ``If you have $100 million or more to invest, we'll be happy to talk to you. :) Otherwise we are not taking on investors.'' -- totally legit
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 50 @ 0.00750001 = 0.375 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: bounce da fuck is that ?
jurov: either it's powderware or they figured out a compound that produces ethanol in contact with water
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06611965 = 0.1984 BTC [+] {2}
jurov: !up benkay`
assbot: Voicing benkay` for 30 minutes.
benkay`: thanks jurov
benkay`: bounce, jurov: it's a crystalline thing that absorbs alcohol.
benkay`: and then (i think) dissolves in water.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30350 @ 0.00098321 = 29.8404 BTC [-] {3}
jurov: why ChanServ did it?
jurov: !up benkay`
assbot: Voice for benkay` extended to 30 minutes.
benkay: figured it out
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.480234 = 2.4012 BTC [-] {4}
thestringpuller: ;;later tell mod6 yo mod6 mon, you dead?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
dexX7: asicminer: "What is the status, size, and expected delivery of the next batch of chips? What about the one after that? -> This month: 850k, next month: 3.35m (order size), June: 6.7m (order size), assuming each chip is 10G." soo.. that's 8.5 - 67 petahash x_x
dexX7: source https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.msg6329377#msg6329377
asciilifeform: loltronicly - just got home to the Lande of teh Phree (tm)
asciilifeform: spend almost as long arse-sniffed by inspector dogs, standing in line, as on airplane
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.48001 BTC [-]
mrstickball: 107 PH.... nice
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.48000066 = 1.44 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 470 @ 0.00448406 = 2.1075 BTC [-] {12}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23400 @ 0.00098994 = 23.1646 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12300 @ 0.00099131 = 12.1931 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04010312 = 0.1203 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06611999 = 0.1322 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: yo can we trade ATC in here?
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: you live in the states?
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: sadly, yes. i was brought there as a boy and haven't accumulated fuel for orbital escape velocity as of this moment.
thestringpuller: you know that's what I spend most of my time doing in kerbal space program
thestringpuller: i just shoot fuel into orbit
thestringpuller: like 90% of my time is spent doing that
thestringpuller: fucking gravity man
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1300 @ 0.00099227 = 1.29 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8524 @ 0.00099227 = 8.4581 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform 12 hours ?!
asciilifeform: aye
mircea_popescu: what ?!
asciilifeform: some of it, to be fair, spend puttering around in munchen
mircea_popescu: nuts.
diametric: Fancy
asciilifeform: takes almost as long to get out of washington's airport as to do a great circle loop across atlantic.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18510 @ 0.00099173 = 18.3569 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 49 @ 0.00475992 = 0.2332 BTC [+]
dexX7: did you do anything "suspicious" or is this the regular waiting time?
davout: ;;rate asciilifeform 1 this nick maps to a real person i have met IRL
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user asciilifeform has been recorded.
davout: ;;rate mike_c 1 this nick maps to a real person i have met IRL
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user mike_c has been recorded.
davout: ;;rate ThickAsThieves 1 this nick maps to a real person i have met IRL
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user ThickAsThieves has been recorded.
davout: ;;rate ThickAsThieves 1 this nick maps to a real person i have met IRL, also CoinBR
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user ThickAsThieves has changed from 1 to 1.
davout: ;;rate kakobrekla 1 this nick maps to a real person i have met IRL, also Bit4x
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user kakobrekla has been recorded.
davout: dexX7: i'm kind of surprised asciilifeform got through the customs at all with all the gear he was carrying :D
thestringpuller: lol rate away
dexX7: sounds like a nice party you guys had
davout: gribble will tell you if you overwrite a previous rating, right?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5488 @ 0.000986 = 5.4112 BTC [-]
davout: dexX7: it was very interesting indeed
diametric: I've been promised to hear some good stories about it tomorrow
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.49917942 = 2.4959 BTC [+] {3}
thestringpuller: davout: if you met them IRL wouldn't you give them at least a 5
davout: diametric: pictures speak a thousand words : http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-04-2014#633655 ☝︎
diametric: davout: incredible
davout: thestringpuller: you reckon?
thestringpuller: 5 was arbritrary
thestringpuller: lets say 2
thestringpuller: or 3
thestringpuller: being conservative and shit
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/an-hero-is-he/#comment-99191
ozbot: An hero is he… pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: nao im almost as good as stan, i have my own derp.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 144 @ 0.00430214 = 0.6195 BTC [-] {8}
mircea_popescu: my 500th, but anyway.
diametric: That picture of Stan by the o-scope is amazing
davout: mircea_popescu: mazeltov
davout: i took a few pictures, mircea_popescu if you want to compile them lemme me know
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 498 @ 0.00392797 = 1.9561 BTC [-] {18}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 394 @ 0.0032169 = 1.2675 BTC [-] {20}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 54 @ 0.004201 = 0.2269 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: davout jus' publish em
mircea_popescu: diametric pretty cool huh.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.48131543 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 74 @ 0.00423376 = 0.3133 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 31 @ 0.00424997 = 0.1317 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.4811317 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 92 @ 0.00424996 = 0.391 BTC [+] {2}