500+ entries in 0.171s
asciilifeform: ideally would want also not merely 'all 0' and 'all 1' but rng, and then to plot time vs hammingweight, and look for correlation
mod6: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/IKJAK/?raw=true << ok with feeding it in with '<' it seems to do somthing here... had some trouble trying to read it directly said 'Could not read from RNG!'
mircea_popescu: The exact micro-chip carries a great impact if perhaps you will be a winner or perhaps a non-winner throughout texas holdem video. The method locations you within the fretting hand will be of value, even now, content material micro-chip commonly known as all of the RNG (Occasional Total Traffic generator) which gives the necessary steps for a professional to manipulate the exact cunning participate in and even botch the possi
asciilifeform: technically it wants ~three~ ttys, one for normal i/o, one for eggogs, one for rng
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the orig prototype rng
asciilifeform: the difference b/w http://btcbase.org/log/2018-01-26#1776941 and e.g. koch-rng remains apparent to anybody with half a brain☝︎
asciilifeform: or a defective rng. or hell knows just about every broken-but-running mechanism.
a111: Logged on 2018-01-19 02:22 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no, he's evidently not useful. but he's not a logic gate, either. he's certainly not human. the fundamental identification/classification of "i will deliver result X through randomly chosen path each time" is... rng. at least to my mind.
asciilifeform: in the sense where my chair is rng.
mircea_popescu: you ~use it~ as a clock crystal. but what it is... well... it's actually a rng.
asciilifeform: i meant in the sense where e.g. the clock crystal on the fg, is not itself an rng. even tho it has jitter.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no, he's evidently not useful. but he's not a logic gate, either. he's certainly not human. the fundamental identification/classification of "i will deliver result X through randomly chosen path each time" is... rng. at least to my mind.
asciilifeform: not one that you'd want to use as an rng, at any rate.
asciilifeform: it ain't an rng if i can compress the output .
asciilifeform: if you like, rng with clearly visible spectral peak.
mircea_popescu: but any implemented oscillator is a... rng ?
mircea_popescu: so this definitionally makes him a meat rng then ?
mircea_popescu: when you say "not meat rng", how do you base this ?
asciilifeform: motl is not a meat rng tho. d00d suffers from a clearly identifiable fixation, 'the west' (tm)(r) where there is a 'capitalism' (tm)(r)
asciilifeform: incidentally the 'pull out rng 'a', then 'b', then 'both', then...' test is a low-tech preventer of 'enemy intercepts parcel and reflashes the cpld to shit marsaglia prng'.
mircea_popescu: alright, i will now proceed to "rng" your lines. starting with above : 21ec922676d4145fbcbc4e1d05436e31ffc45b0b6b30c38f3397840a2111282640ab321b906a9d911af757a3a6b550e8fc9aaffc9089a1ca881d980f60617c9b
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-01-12#1769493 << very basic specificity-of-diddling lemma. i.e. if i put today's trilema through it, it isn't as if it knows in advance that it ain't an analogue-rng-board plugged in, and what to shit out in response to a trilema that ain't yet been written☝︎
mircea_popescu: rng is not a resonance magic pill, just a resonance de-debugable-izers.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform definitionally, if your rng is any good, it will type out shakespeare every so often.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: almost definitionally, if yer rng is any good, it won't be pumping any resonance anywhere
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: plugging prng in the place of the rng != deterministic algo in the civilized sense
asciilifeform: good rng in fact lubricates convergence in all kinds of sims
asciilifeform: in that case rng. in fact this is almost definition of what trng is for.
asciilifeform: 'what if running on toaster, with no rng'
asciilifeform: ( 'fixed' rng also.. )
asciilifeform: ^ boatload of funstuff concerning , e.g., rng testing methodology; rigorous approach to stego; novel attacks on symmetriccipherolade; various other interesting ( and quite compact ) items.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: actually frag is very capricious item, 'good rng' , 100+ yrs of credible reports of folx within 'guaranteed corpse' radius, surviving with minor injury
mircea_popescu: insanity === broken rng.
mircea_popescu: much simpler than that : if your rng is broken someone somewhere will exploit it.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: maybe at some point we auction prototype rng ( asciilifeform has a few , mircea_popescu also, and somebody else i think )
mircea_popescu: (nothing in crypto is useful, either, which severely limits the rng uptake apparently -- if your crypto dun work anyway what need is rng item or somesuch)
mircea_popescu: evidently nothing in crypto is useful without rng ; what's this to do with anything ?
asciilifeform: ( what's the use, incidentally, of a cramershouptron, without sane rng ? )
asciilifeform: and instead sat around uselessly , and wasted time making and selling rng in the meantime also, lol
asciilifeform: ( i for instance have some approximate notion of how many people have an actual rng. the number is not large. )
asciilifeform: ( for n00bz : ~one~ failure of rng leaks entire privkey, in dsa. )
asciilifeform: if server generates all keys, client dun need an rng at all.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: now let's split 1 byte into ~four~, A,B,C,D. we take same transform and do it to X and Y in turn. in total, we've used 4 bytes from rng device, to cut 1 byte into 4 otpfrags.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: lemme give specific example. start with splitting 1 byte. to split byte B into X and Y, you take byte R from rng, and compute B xor R = X. then Y = R . X xor Y = B .
asciilifeform: ( your encipherment speed is limited to 1/S of your rng's bit rate, where S is the splitness )
asciilifeform: to expand a K-bit (block and key, we'll assume, are each K-bit) voodoocipher to J bitness, xor split ( on rng ); having generated J / K independent keys; each incoming plaintext block of J bits, is cut into J / K blocks, and each enciphered with the corresponding key. decipher -- same.
asciilifeform for some reason unable to turn up the thread in the l0gz where we did the 'rng design is not a technical problem , but a political problem' thing
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so what do i get from divide by 0 ? rng ?
apeloyee: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-11-14#1737571 << if k MSBs of N are 1s, then k MSBs of p and q both are 1s, ie it only leaks sometimes. the leak itself is small, but since slightly biased RNG wouldn't be acceptable, then why this is?☝︎
asciilifeform: afaik even the shoddiest 1980s hash algo, produce ~perfect 'white noise'. hence the popularity of faux-rng via hashwhitener etc.
asciilifeform: and is as balanced as your rng is honest
asciilifeform: dun need periodicity for rng diddle, necessarily
asciilifeform: generally there are cheaper ways to make use of 'key' to chump rng
mircea_popescu: "all you need to know is where the signature 1blocks come in the "rng", as they will be preserved by binary mult, can be seen in modulus."
mircea_popescu: kinda why faux rng calibration is done on 1blocks in the first place.
mircea_popescu: (on proper rng. on bs prng / kochgpg etc, they don't.)
asciilifeform: in an honest rng
diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-11-14#1737414 <- confirmed; I do NOT use any nextprime or other "rng"-parts from gpg; current rsatron prototype simply grabs nbits from fg, flips the 2 top bits and 1 bottom bit as per previous discussion and then checks if result is prime; if prime then keep, otherwise discard and try again; no "add 2 until prime" or other such thing☝︎
asciilifeform: afaik the only remaining, and most obvious 'loss' is the one implicit in prime number theorem ( where , wat, ~10k possible rng outputs correspond to same prime output )
asciilifeform: ( she is using my sanitized gpg bignum. but i did not preserve koch's faux-rng atrocity ; so anything pertaining to entropy, is new )
mircea_popescu: the reason is that (in a translation of what koch-gpg does into sanity) you take 2045 bits of rng for each possible prime, stick 11 in front and 1 in the tail and THAT is your 2048 bit prime candidate.
a111: Logged on 2017-11-10 14:12 asciilifeform: when i sit to play a game, it feels like dereliction of duty, with, e.g., ffa yet undone, dulap not yet replaces, scintollator rng not complete, 9000 other processes
asciilifeform: when i sit to play a game, it feels like dereliction of duty, with, e.g., ffa yet undone, dulap not yet replaces, scintollator rng not complete, 9000 other processes
asciilifeform: and since i built the rng, i can also be quite certain that there is not such a prime that it will forever avoid generating.
apeloyee: can't. I was sarcastic, because I don't see how CRT construction can amplify, assuming not obviously broken/backdoored RNG. why won't long-range correlations kill mthe "pick random prime" method as well?
apeloyee: perharps running rabin-miller "amplifies small/temporary imperfections in the rng, into fatal"
asciilifeform: the use of constructed primes, potentially amplifies small/temporary imperfections in the rng, into fatal
asciilifeform: 1 problem is that perfect uniform distrib and perfectly independent rng bits, cannot be shown to exist physically.
asciilifeform: and i will NOT make a rng that doesn't work with msdos box
asciilifeform: i dun like having rng that is physically capable of putting out nonrandom.
asciilifeform: ( a shit rng that fools ent is much easier to build, even by accident, than same vs dieharder )
asciilifeform: really it is good for finding catastrophically broken rng, and no moar
shinohai: In other faulty rng's http://archive.is/Wm4e7
asciilifeform: no actual detail of rng diddle, shown.
a111: Logged on 2016-02-10 19:29 asciilifeform: (incidentally, the problem of an inner cipher introducing known-plaintextisms is solved routinely by splitting the payload into xor-able halves, using rng, and enciphering each ~half~ with different cipher, rather than box-in-box composition)
asciilifeform: unbiased -- in this case -- would mean that it eats ANY bitstring from rng, R, and maps it to UNIQUE prime , P
mircea_popescu: famously, maple misidentified the guy's number. not because of rng, eiher.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: chance of these without sabotaged rng is < chance of meteorite
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: all that means is that one of the inputs comes from rng.
asciilifeform: because all you do is get NEXT N bits from rng, they have ( if rng is proper ) 0 relation to previous N
asciilifeform: rejecting rng result that doesn't pass the gcd sieve -- leaks nothing
mircea_popescu: leaking rng quality is more of a concern for debian/prngs.
asciilifeform: apeloyee: no contradiction. the variability of time is in the ~test~, not the output result , which naturally will vary depending on what rng gave you
mircea_popescu: incidentally, if looking for 4096 bit prime wouldn't the correct approach be to take 4094 bits of rng and glue 1 on either end ?
a111: Logged on 2017-08-14 16:14 asciilifeform: ( tldr : superiority of the FUCKGOATS-enabled approach, of get-new-N-bits-from-rng-then-primalitytest-until-done, vs the kochian get-N-bits-then-increment-until-passes-millerrabin )
asciilifeform: phun phakt, this calculation is taken from the gpg autopsies last summer, when asciilifeform was chasing imaginary rng boojum after somebody found a real one
asciilifeform: i actually considered own variant of this for 'chemical rng' , but realized that it is screamingly impractical
asciilifeform: you will notice that koch's rng atrocity ain't in there.
a111: 21 results for "gpg rng", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=gpg%20rng
asciilifeform: !#s gpg rng
cruciform: asciilifeform: I want auditable RNG, and rolling dice is putting me on tilt
asciilifeform: cruciform: if you 'just want' 'an rng, dun matter what kind' -- the cost is 0, your cpu maker already supplied you with a liquishit rng
mod6: asciilifeform: so far, i've only gone to the extent of unplugging both RNG-TWs and ensuring that the SAD lamp does what it should.
asciilifeform: FG-II rng will prolly have 4 pins, 1 for shifter pulse, to make yoking ultra-easy at ~0 cost.
asciilifeform: i'm partial to well-made electric rng
asciilifeform: it is my policy not to ask FG buyers any questions, i have nfi why bought, whether to use as rng or fishing lure, and don't really care
asciilifeform: i would ask 'what's to keep some unrelated d00d from making walletrons that simply talk over rs232..' but then remembered that it is probably same thing that keeps'em from making rng where ditto despite how OMFG WE PUBLISHED DESIGN
asciilifeform: i ran into it when trying to replicate the classical 'dead rng' debian setup
mircea_popescu: and besides there's already a rng.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform consider something like : 1. split item to sign into 512 byte blocks. create block 0 from rng. sign hash(block 0), hash(block 1 + hash(block 0)), hash(block 2 + hash(block 1 + hash(block 0))), and so following.