log☇︎
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lobbes: !!v 86AC694AC6B7EB77DB8570DBD1566EB3A30F5D5BFCA6BF47CE01B409A968F55C
lobbes: trinque: ^ I may have been too quick on the draw when deedbot came back online. plox to lemme know if I should re-issue the above !!v
lobbes bbl
asciilifeform: ty for the timings lobbes . seems to match up with asciilifeform's and BingoBoingo's pictures
asciilifeform: ( i.e. pretty fast connection reich <-> reich ; palpably slower piz <-> reich )
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo, lobbes , et al : i'ma leave the rubbish box to run until further notice, and give it cron job that eats db from dulap erry day .
asciilifeform: ftr gets ~80kB/s avg. from dulap, there.
asciilifeform: keep in mind that bot will not echo log lines cited from rubbish mirror. it is fit strictly for timing experimentation.
asciilifeform: the 'db snapshot' link nao worx. this box will do duty as an (unauthoritative!) 'fast' mirror of db snapshot also, until someone comes up with better.
asciilifeform: for n00bz : the cron job script which powers this ; the cron job itself .
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: this remains a mystery. i gotta wonder if there's something peculiar re our routing, which gives this effect.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 13:52:44 asciilifeform: diana_alt: however, if accessed from localhost on ~public port~ (80) then yes same delay
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: from this pt i'ma follow the prescription mp gave during last 'wai slow' thrd -- leave it alone, there aint much to be done re to speed it up ( as imho conclusively showed that the pipe is to blame ). will move on to other matters ( import of historic logs ; fix of reported catastrophic bugs, incl. the resync of numeration mp asked for ; and then to get back to ffa ! )
asciilifeform: rly what we oughta have is 7+ ~active~ bots/logotrons on 7 continents, then no one will have to grumble 'wai slow'
asciilifeform: i expect at some pt mp will say to anyone in l1 who aint running a logger, 'партбилет на стол!'(tm)(r)
asciilifeform: btw for thread-completeness, heavy page loaded locally on the shitbox consumes avg. of 0.2s.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 16:38:17 asciilifeform: other folx welcome to try. e.g. the 'heavy page' : curl http://54.209.217.34/log/trilema/2018-04-18#1802801 > /dev/null
asciilifeform: (i.e. all on top of this, is transmission delay from east amerireich, where thing sits.)
asciilifeform: i.e. takes ~0.068s to travel the 50km or so to asciilifeform's chair from said pseudobox.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 16:38:26 asciilifeform: ... from here eats 0.268s.
asciilifeform: meanwhile, loox like lobbes reproduced asciilifeform's orig. observation.
asciilifeform: ^ dulap incidentally performs considerably better , unsurprisingly, than the pseudo-sadmachine, in re actual page generation on local end.
asciilifeform bbl:meat.
feedbot: http://blog.lobbesblog.com/2019/08/on-relationships-or-how-pretense-kills/ << lobbesblog -- On Relationships or How Pretense Kills
spyked quite enjoys reading lobbes' philosophical posts
spyked: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929659 <-- PM works for L1 and L2; in-channel is limited to L1.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 14:20:04 diana_alt: spyked: I don't recall and can't see at http://thetarpit.org/posts/y05/081-feedbot-manual.html - is feedbot for L1 only or does it work for anyone with positive ratings or regardless of rating or what?
mp_en_viaje waves
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-18#1929619 << nice.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-18 20:24:30 BingoBoingo: In updates, Povey says he might stop by.
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929636 << was more like "intelligent" router, ftr, but yeah.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 13:50:01 asciilifeform: diana_alt: fwiw i was not, to date, able to rule out mp's 'overworked pipe' hypothesis .
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929650 << if nothing else, will tell us some things, similar to your point before. mystery delay will de-mystify through usage.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 14:04:28 asciilifeform: diana_alt: i have plan to move the box to traditional apache, but yet not figured out how to do so w/out unacceptably long disruption of service .
mp_en_viaje would like to take the time to point this out re ye olde discussion of "is something to learn / is nothing to learn", coming up oft re gosspid but generally always there. "to learn" is insanely vague an operator. just because you don't learn anything useful [about programming] while doing, say, python, it still dun mean you don't learn anything useful about your girflriend, or the tcp infrastructure, or router hardware, or the difference be
mp_en_viaje was going to propose http://trilema.com/2015/the-four-points-of-this-morning-in-color-any-questions/ to the younghands summarization project ; then went over and checked what exactly the pinging article was doing, decided.... best not to.
mp_en_viaje: shrysr, what the heck are you doing, anyways ?
mp_en_viaje: meanwhile in ongoing cockcaged-usg lulz, http://trilema.com/2012/wikocrisy/#comment-131028
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-20#1929777 < this, obviously is the exact complement to the oft-repeated "now that i write article 2, i find article 1 useful ; there was no way to evaluate this utility at the time decision to write article 1 was to be made" re blogwriting.
mp_en_viaje: (amusingly, there was an article i ran into that made the exact point, in a list of four. meanwhile (superficially) reviewed the complete list of trilema articles i looked at this month (on this mchine), >6k lines, did not find it anymore. fuck me. and then of course there's http://trilema.com/2019/pizd-atrage-da-curu-trage-ca-n-viata-tragic/ )
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-20 07:47:16 mp_en_viaje: would like to take the time to point this out re ye olde discussion of "is something to learn / is nothing to learn", coming up oft re gosspid but generally always there. "to learn" is insanely vague an operator. just because you don't learn anything useful [about programming] while doing, say, python, it still dun mean you don't learn anything useful about your girflriend, or the tcp infrastructure, or router har
mp_en_viaje: but the important point is, METHODOLOGY. science, not as "the profession" nor as "the professional activity", but as the occupation, science as in, productive, not science as in, socially acceptable -- IS A BEHAVIOUR. that's all it is, applying a method systematically.
mp_en_viaje: meaning that all prediction as to the future is to be based on METHODOLOGICAL considerations. how well the method was applied, and how uniformly, over how homogenous a sample with how good expected coverage. that's all.
mp_en_viaje: "traditional" (no they aren't) heuristic valuations of activity imported from the practices and intellectual habits of the herd of idiots are NOT USEFUL. how "boring" or "interesting" or "sexy" or whatever things seem, truly the on;ly saviour is the method ; which is why trilema can be interesting whatever i discuss, be it defecation or obscure byzantine minutia, whereas the herd of idiots c
mp_en_viaje: an't be interesting even when discussing interesting topics.
mp_en_viaje: like for instance
mp_en_viaje: ~any woman'd rather read me write in defense of rape than watch charlie branson-sheen derp about like little bois. the reason is ~THE METHOD~, not the subject, not "oh mp is rich" -- seriously, wtf -- not anything else.
mp_en_viaje: THE. METHOD. the one thing that unites "What do you mean how ?" and the reporting "who cares who it damages" and the engineering "who cares what business models/political arrangements this renders obsolete" is [http://trilema.com/2017/is-it-still-rape-if-i-write
mp_en_viaje: -science-on-my-penis-first/?b=Third&e=date.#select][the very substance of science], BECAUSE it is ~the scientific METHOD~.
mp_en_viaje: on the first pass it appears as a complete disinterest in "feelings", but it fundamentally is a method for the valuation of human activity. and therefore complete ethics and a set of morals. co
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929705 << now that's pretty cool.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 16:52:17 asciilifeform: this experiment also reveals that asciilifeform's logotron will in fact stand up, with no modifications, on a python, flask, pg, etc. plucked out of arbitrary rubbish bin.
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929711 << this is possible if the intercontinental interchange's fucked. which...
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 17:35:50 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: hard to say for fact, but seems to add up to a picture where's there's a ~0.5s bottleneck b/w south amer. and errywhere else.
mp_en_viaje is too lazy to try and dust off ye olde netcraft toolset an' look
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929757 << certainly seems to go with historical practice
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 21:55:06 asciilifeform: i expect at some pt mp will say to anyone in l1 who aint running a logger, 'партбилет на стол!'(tm)(r)
mp_en_viaje: o look, all caught up. well, ima bbl!
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-20#1929795 << the measurements strongly suggest this.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-20 08:48:36 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929711 << this is possible if the intercontinental interchange's fucked. which...
asciilifeform: ( and, interestingly, specifically fucked re tcp. )
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929749 << today <50kB/s...
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-19 21:20:26 asciilifeform: ftr gets ~80kB/s avg. from dulap, there.
asciilifeform: in other noose, the fella who first described 'endianism' is dead.
asciilifeform: !!up diana_alt
asciilifeform: hrm no deedbot ?!
asciilifeform: trinque ^
asciilifeform: meanwhile diana_alt's measurement of mirror load in #o.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-20 14:49:59 diana_alt: asciilifeform: 4 runs of curl http://54.209.217.34/log/trilema/2018-04-18#1802801 > /dev/null give http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/1llzt/?raw=true
asciilifeform: ( spoiler : rubbish-mirror actually loads slightly faster, from europistan, than phf's orig., for 'heavy page' test )
asciilifeform: phf's item ftr lives also in usa, somewhere in nyc region
asciilifeform: atm it seems quite impossible even to say which ~generates~ the pgs faster -- the diff, if any, is entirely dwarfed by pipe effects
BingoBoingo: Meanwhile in local news, Red Bell Peppers price rises above ground beef price (green bell pepper still priced like produce) https://www.elobservador.com.uy/nota/el-morron-rojo-llega-a-250-y-el-consumidor-tiene-parte-de-la-culpa-2019816181427
asciilifeform: diana_coman, mp_en_viaje , spyked , et al : http://18.195.64.227/log << copy of 'rubbish mirror', identical (same 'dollar store' pseudo-isp) but this one in frankfurt. try the same timing w/ it.
mp_en_viaje is writing an article and then hopping on a plane, but in principle.
asciilifeform: ftr i get ~1.00s ('heavy page' test) from washingtonistan
asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje if you've 1s, time curl http://18.195.64.227/log/trilema/2018-04-18#1802801 > /dev/null
mp_en_viaje: 116 116 115 109 ms
mp_en_viaje: very reliably .1s-ish
asciilifeform: theeere we go.
asciilifeform: ty mp_en_viaje .
mp_en_viaje: my pleasyre.
mp_en_viaje: course land distance to frankfurt is ~1k km
asciilifeform: # of hops via buggered switches i suspect matters moar than km of fiber
mp_en_viaje: there IS an absolute limit. but, perhaps.
asciilifeform: planet3 is only ~43 light-millisecond in diameter, elementarily
asciilifeform: ( granted there aint a fiber through the diameter. but. )
asciilifeform: the mirrors are identical to the orig ( in re pythonism, nginx, etc ) and in fact considerably slower boxen, and laden with shitlinux ('centos') iirc . geography is the killer, imho satisfactorily proven .
asciilifeform: trinque, still no deedbot?!
bvt: hi, sorry for delay on the linux rng post, it is in fact ~ready, but i need one more day for proofreading
asciilifeform: meanwhile : BingoBoingo rk3328 seems to be back in print ! 50bux for the 4 GB, for 2 GB -- 35.
BingoBoingo: Interesting
BingoBoingo: I suppose we don't yet have an ada for it
asciilifeform: not a properly threaded one
asciilifeform: also worrisome is that http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-20#1929804 thing
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-20 11:52:47 asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-19#1929749 << today <50kB/s...
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i'm skeptical that we're already outta pipe. but if this persists we will have to actually meter folx.
asciilifeform: ( jizzus , per legend, could feed a legion with 2 fish, but even he could not , i suspect, feed legion with 1 unmetered 100M pipe... )
BingoBoingo: Well 200/20 but everything has its limits
lobbes: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-20#1929767 << tyvm
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-20 04:38:22 spyked: quite enjoys reading lobbes' philosophical posts
lobbes: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-20#1929816 << on heavy page test, I get the following: NC : 0m1.711s, Austria VPS : 0m0.379s, Piz Rkchp : 0m2.054s
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-20 18:31:09 asciilifeform: diana_coman, mp_en_viaje , spyked , et al : http://18.195.64.227/log << copy of 'rubbish mirror', identical (same 'dollar store' pseudo-isp) but this one in frankfurt. try the same timing w/ it.
asciilifeform: lobbes: ty. moar or less what i'd expect to see.
asciilifeform: interesting that there's an entire 150ms b/w austria & frankfurt