log☇︎
295 entries in 0.678s
BingoBoingo wonders if Yarvin will revise the Urbit metaphor again when Bitcoin becomes a Naval power...
assbot: The Failure of Urbit and Bitcoin's Future of Computing | Bingo Blog
BingoBoingo: Vexual: Not even on that scale yet, but... of my blogs that didn't go viral http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2013/12/14/the-failure-of-urbit-and-the-bitcoins-future-of-computing/ was probably the most popular for a reason.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Yeah, I've been rereading early loper and looking back at the urbit groups.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: urbit is actually a great example of what happens when some bozo thinks he can substitute mathematical trickery for understandability
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: urbit is drowning in its own shit, just like every other software project which clings to the ubiquitous 1970s conceptual crapola. nothing exotic/godelian about it.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: "I have a suspicion that the entire scheme is vulnerable to Gödelization." << I like how you raised this in 2010 and the problem of this in Urbit has only grown...
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, no, as in, without having made a specific appointment to discuss bitcoin and urbit
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: random person i ran into today had actually heard of bitcoin, AND of urbit << random, as in, on the streets of ar ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, funny, because speaking of jets, random person i ran into today had actually heard of bitcoin, AND of urbit
asciilifeform: benkay: and this reply to a reader asking about urbit (author of urbit was labouring under the same ill-conceived notions that produced haskell) - http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1390
asciilifeform: afaik urbit achieved its actual goal (refill mr. yarvin's money bag)
asciilifeform: urbit is the ultimate example of a tentacle of a problem masquerading as solution to said problem.
asciilifeform: re: urbit: people still putter about on the mailing list; occasional giblets get checked into the repo; can't bring myself to give a damn re: the details.
mircea_popescu: talking of urbit, i don't suppose it stopped leaking yet, but i expect development all but ceased ?
mircea_popescu: fluffypony: afaik, no. but, interestingly, i first heard of him when he came to buy my urbit 'dukedom' << so invite the guy over and rate him ?
asciilifeform: Mats_cd03: re: urbit - http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1390
asciilifeform: Mats_cd03: long story. might want to read 'urbit' documentation. but they are not called 'dukedoms' any more - now they are called 'aircraft carriers.'
asciilifeform: fluffypony: afaik, no. but, interestingly, i first heard of him when he came to buy my urbit 'dukedom' - http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1352
asciilifeform: at any rate, the hilariously funny bit about urbit is that mr. m wrote volumes condemning american academia, pseudo-mathematics in algorithmics, etc. - and then proceeded to crap out a widget emblematic of same.
bounce: did urbit make it to the bbc, boing boing, something I can't decipher, wired, el grauniad, AND tech radar?
mircea_popescu: urbit there we go
asciilifeform: the fellow who bought my 'urbit dukedom' for 4.5btc publicly burned his u.s. passport.
mircea_popescu: navhul-lacsup wait, so is this actually an urbit powered irc bouncer ?!
asciilifeform: navhul-lacsup << urbit syllablegen? !
herbijudlestoids: iv got "So this urbit thing" and "People have made blogs" saved in my list, as well as "The stuff all good conspiracy theories start with" because i wanna see the photo of MPOE-PR :P
mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids http://trilema.com/2013/so-this-urbit-thing/
herbijudlestoids: has anyone come up with any useful use cases for urbit? all i could think of was a mutt clone lol ☟︎
mircea_popescu: actually, did moldbug&co ever manage to stop urbit from crashing ?
herbijudlestoids: except the difference is both urbit and tornet actually have some code committed somewhere
herbijudlestoids: approx the same idea as urbit or tornet, rehyped and the tech media are cum guzzling it hard ☟︎
asciilifeform: they're funding.... urbit.
mircea_popescu: makes the recently failed urbit thing kinda tame by comparison
asciilifeform: for anybody who still gives a damn re: the urbit wars: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1390&cpage=1#comment-8475
asciilifeform: unrelated: crypto-auction! https://groups.google.com/d/msg/urbit-dev/KNkFS_34P_I/RQmpPTkP2tcJ
asciilifeform: re: urbit: anyone curious about my answer to the quandary 'so, how the hell /should/ we build a computer' is invited to read:
benkay: ah so you object to urbit's low-level immutability
asciilifeform: author of urbit wrote some pretty good screeds on why he quit academic cs: (http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2007/07/my-navrozov-moments.html and http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2007/08/whats-wrong-with-cs-research.html) and then proceeded to... well, do what he did.
asciilifeform: urbit (or any other graph-reduction machine with 'immutable data') is exquisitely unsuited to hardware. at least in this universe.
BingoBoingo: ng to Urbit and the thing that highlights its futility is Clojure.
BingoBoingo: benkay: Well You can spec a Turing complete language on a napkin in the bar. What takes time is building an implementation that runs on something. For most applications now, the various *nix's are going to be the best things available. If you want to write a new future of computing though instead of inventing Urbit someone could have just as well made a *nix that only offered as a Userland GNU Guile. It seems to me the Closest thi
benkay: BingoBoingo: i don't know that i buy asciilifeform's ball-o-mud argument on urbit yet. given enough traction wouldn't it make sense to rewrite the important bits for fpgas or what have we?
BingoBoingo: I hope I did well asciilifeform et al: http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2013/12/14/the-failure-of-urbit-and-the-bitcoins-future-of-computing/
Apocalyptic: urbit is dead I heard
jurov: oh, and will it run urbit?
asciilifeform: high-quality flamefest: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/urbit-dev/PvXo1t7uNrY/RL7DLpg1v9QJ
jurov: Lol so mike gogulski is onto urbit? Will prod him for you,sure.
BingoBoingo: Lol, and he'd rather have the Urbit than the BTC?
asciilifeform: the 'dukedom' / KYC thread: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/urbit-dev/PvXo1t7uNrY/ik5e-9b-cNwJ
asciilifeform: and also https://groups.google.com/d/msg/urbit-dev/4B12WpF1rL0/hYF3YPuqvR8J (rest of thread)
asciilifeform: see also: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/urbit-dev/utp3H7F78so/Dt24fpiT3xcJ
asciilifeform: and he put me on the urbit-dukes mailing list back in '10.
BingoBoingo: Sure, urbit was from scratch, but it can't find anyone capable of actually building anything from scratch. Minix is that ancient thing, couldn't sell textbooks anymore and then they just ripped NetBSD and people still don't care about it.
mircea_popescu: not really related tho, from what i gather urbit was actually a from-scratch thing
BingoBoingo: Anyone actually make anything with Urbit?
nubbins`: urbit, i dunno
mike_c: you know, i tried urbit and asked for destroyers. never got an answer.
benkay: and urbit will be your reputation
asciilifeform: Ademan: http://www.urbit.org/
Ademan: the hell is urbit?
asciilifeform: the idea of implementing something on urbit would be more interesting if the thing actually worked.
mod6: are you still into urbit?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Isn't neoreactionary an #Urbit thing?
mircea_popescu: mod6 how's urbit these days btw ? you been keeping any track ?
mircea_popescu: seems like a sort of urbit ?
mod6: omg now they want to integrate xrp with urbit lol
asciilifeform: KRS1: nah, that's at #urbit
mod6: i think i started a flame war in #urbit btw
mod6: talking to #urbit guys now..
benkay_: urbit is the greatest time sink ever
mod6: HEH. been here all night talkin about urbit :]
mod6: i suppose that something like urbit could actually live inside of other software eventually as some sort of embedded system. or if it ever took the leap to native hardware, it could run on some sort of FPGA or pre-set asic chip.
mod6: for instance, in current form, urbit does key-gen right off the start. i'd hesitate to launch an instance with that software thats native (unless rooted and running something like cyanogen -- even then do we trust that either?)
mircea_popescu: that funny moment when you realise urbit is discussed in 500 lines on #bitcoin-assets and in 5 lines on #urbit
mod6: this page is pretty lulzy, whomever wrote it was just guessing at a lot of the stuff: https://github.com/urbit/urbit/wiki/Decoding-Hoon
mircea_popescu: mod6 http://trilema.com/2013/so-this-urbit-thing/#comment-95448 << average people have trouble FINDING IT
mod6: the guy says, "urbit will always run on top of unix." but d00d also wants this to surpass *nix at some point...
mod6: this urbit thing is wacky
mod6: i figure, maybe they can help my urbit n00bness until i get my sealegs.
mod6: CY said he didn't want to do an irc channel because urbit can be sort of like IRC in and of itself. but in the mean time he'll set one up until it gets further along.
mircea_popescu: which from what i gather is NOT run on urbit ?
mircea_popescu: "<mircea_popescu> hi all." < i said something on #urbit.
jurov: but afaik urbit has everything versioned
mircea_popescu: mod6 in other news, http://trilema.com/2013/so-this-urbit-thing/#comment-95441 haskelites hate it.
mircea_popescu: (TLDR: to keep using Urbit, delete all your pre-10/6 data, git pull the source again, make clean, make, and start over. Your destroyers and tickets will keep working. No, this will not keep happening, though it may happen once or twice again.) << preserved for futurosity.
mod6: I rebuild my sub just a bit ago because of this (http://www.urbit.org/2013/10/06/nicu.html), seems to be a bit more responsive.. but not what i would expect.
mod6: has anyone had trouble with the urbit terminal being like really slow?
mod6: benkay_: Ahh, I've read more now on the urbit. I see what you mean by the 9-times thing as temporary. And after reading Datskovskiy's comments it's interesting that it was put in to begin with.
mod6: i kinda think the idea of the urbit ship being virtual real estate. Can only be transfered 9 times before it has no value.
mircea_popescu: mod6 http://trilema.com/2013/so-this-urbit-thing/ might interest you then
mod6: this urbit thing is neato
ozbot: Urbit - Tea at the Palaz of Hoon
mircea_popescu: http://www.urbit.org/2013/09/26/palaz.html < loller.
mircea_popescu: it was from the urbit thing benkay keeps spamming for some obscure reason
benkay: also mircea_popescu: http://www.urbit.org/2013/08/22/Chapter-6-security.html