⏐︎ 19010
shinohai: http://fusion.net/story/162651/bitcoin-greece-varoufakis-blockchain/
assbot: Why Greece should befriend its bitcoin foes | Fusion ... ( http://bit.ly/1NMub4S )
BingoBoingo: shinohai: My stator testbed is lucky it is too slow to have been anywhere close in time to that having been an issue, though that is still an enduring issue.
shinohai: I have a stator build working, just waiting on my pogo to get here first. Using the 0.5.3 RELEASE on my shell
BingoBoingo: My stator is just on an awfully underpowered AMD64 machine
mod6: here's something I missed: log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-07-2015#1187292
mod6: i'll have to see when i get there i guess.
mats: it doesn't look like bitcoin is ready for prime time
shinohai: Good find mod6, I hadn't got that far back yet
BingoBoingo: <mod6> here's something I missed: log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-07-2015#1187292 << May have to increase locks limit (why it must be there idk) for reorg robustness
mod6: max_locks & max_objects were bumped from 10000 to 40000 in this patch: http://thebitcoin.foundation/ml/btc-dev/2014-December/000024.html But yeah, perhaps it needs to go higher. I'll dig in when I get wedged.
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1NMwFQK )
mod6: for those who don't remember, we used to get stuck at block 252`450 before with only 10000 locks set
shinohai: Must have been before I discovered La Serenissima
mod6: it was last december.
BingoBoingo: Yeah, it was necessary to keep up with 0.8 normal. May need a still bigger boost for reorgs though.
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 268 @ 0.00406002 = 1.0881 BTC [-] {4}
phf: BingoBoingo: have you tried making static build on openbsd? i seem to recall you were running a bunch of openbsd boxes
BingoBoingo: But the whole max locks thing is a mess
mod6: phf: i built on 5.6 but I can't seem to get mine to be be statically built :(
BingoBoingo: phf: No, not yet. On OpenBSD I'm running an 0.7.2 derivative with LibreSSL 2.0 just to see how it behaves.
phf: mod6: is that with the patch i posted to ml?
mod6: it was from a patch, but not from the email you just sent in...
phf: BingoBoingo: that's a good idea, i decided to punt on it, because i don't fully understand the reasoning behind the whole 1.0.1g freeze
BingoBoingo: <mod6> phf: i built on 5.6 but I can't seem to get mine to be be statically built :( << First thing to understand about OpenBSD is that it is a weird unix. Not as weird as Linux, but differently weird.
phf: mod6: nudge nudge wink wink
mod6: phf: maybe you posted this to the channel? anyway, this is the one I used: http://dpaste.com/28PF9DV.txt
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1LRdVAX )
BingoBoingo: phf: It sync'd and so far it hasn't forked outside of the ways other Bitcoins have
mod6: ok, so I should just use your patches just posted then
phf: mod6: yes, though they are conceptually similar to the one from dpaste
mod6: read your readme... so yeah, months and months ago I was able to build a dynamic bitcoind on openbsd, but that was the exact issue after statically linked: seg fault.
mod6: lemme try this out :]
phf: cool!
BingoBoingo: In other news http://www.indystar.com/story/news/2015/07/07/police-investigation-under-way--home--subway-pitchman-jared-fogle/29807473/ ☟︎
assbot: How will Subway pitchman Jared Fogle weather FBI investigation? ... ( http://bit.ly/1NMzYHs )
BingoBoingo: ^ expect in channel soon?
BingoBoingo: Like Shrem?
trinque: lol
BingoBoingo: Or does he walk with Brock in YCombinator
trinque: why do all the chimos have a certain look about them?
BingoBoingo: Thur Genetics?
trinque: who knows
trinque: there's a sort of pudgy, sunken-eyed, pasty-white I invariably associate with "hide yo kids"
BingoBoingo: But still, that isn't the complete type. It's the entire shape of the face: very, very Anglo
funkenstein_ is loving the discussion of time in the logs
trinque: BingoBoingo: http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/34400000/The-Queen-And-The-Duke-of-Edinburgh-Arrive-in-Slovenia-queen-elizabeth-ii-34496339-691-1024.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1LRfbUI )
BingoBoingo: trinque: Looks just like it
trinque: heh
BingoBoingo: !up Luke-Jr
williamdunne: ;;later tell gabriel_laddel was checking my rates, out of interest what is my association with gamingfurry.tumblr.com? ☟︎
gribble: The operation succeeded.
williamdunne: Morning all
mod6: Buenos Dias
mod6 has to ramp up on espanol for c4
williamdunne: I would also like to learn Spanish, on my to do list
williamdunne currently has a neck that looks like Cheetah fur, lovely patterned bruising
mod6: i used to be fairly fluent 10 years ago, now. not so much lol.
williamdunne: I had compulsory German and French lessons for 4 years in state education. Went about as well as expected. My entire vocabulary in both languages is "Bonjour", "Guten Tag", "Ich habe ein gross hose schlange", and "Ich bin zwolf jahre alt", along with a few words of no use on their own
mod6: haha, sounds familiar.
trinque: williamdunne: ich arbeit im krankenhaus
trinque: there, that about does it for my german
williamdunne: State education?
trinque: duolingo lol
trinque: took spanish in high school; I can understand more than I can say
williamdunne: I couldn't even update "Ich bin zwolf jahre alt" to make sense in my current state without the assistance from google translate.
williamdunne: In fairness, even in RO I could understand half the crap because its still latin
williamdunne: Reading French is even easier IMO
shinohai: I speak fluent Taco Bell
shinohai: j/k
williamdunne notably did qualify for a non-state school scholarship at a language school, after passing the aptitude tests. Further highlighting the failure of state education
trinque: "puedo comprender mas que puedo hablar" ??
trinque checks himself with google
trinque: google likes it I guess
shinohai: I'm ok with Spanish. Could probably carry on a convo though it has been a while/
trinque: german I've yet to get past the myriad articles
trinque: near as I can tell, there is no logic to them
shinohai: I'm always impressed with how well Germans speak English
trinque: you just grow up knowing that "*der* Tisch"
trinque: shinohai: heh maybe it's german easy-mode
shinohai: Nearly every one I have met speaks far better English than half the Americans I know.
trinque: having merely dabbled in german, there seems to be a preciseness or specificity to it
trinque: all the articles for example
trinque: "this one out of the set" vs "this one" vs "that" ... so on
asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu i'm pretty sure i... solved it!
gribble: The operation succeeded.
trinque: asciilifeform: time?
asciilifeform: it.
asciilifeform: doesn't help pogo
trinque sounds the horn
asciilifeform: the ~other~ time
shinohai passes a glass of his Absinthe to asciilifeform
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1191623 << that one ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 18:51:43; ascii_field: let's imagine, briefly, that i ~do~ find.
asciilifeform: not sure how much good this'll do anyone.
phf: that would be second famous margin note, after fermat's
asciilifeform: phf has it
asciilifeform: which is why before saying any more, i will have to model it.
trinque: fascinating
asciilifeform: other folks can perhaps work it out if i say that the solution is based on dynamic 'predator-prey' equilibrium
asciilifeform: the realization comes from the fact that you don't really need accurate time, just an oscillator that is reasonably independence of amplitude
asciilifeform: *independent
asciilifeform: that cannot be slowed or sped up at will by any given participant
asciilifeform off to eat
phf: lamport clocks?
trinque: http://www.thelocal.de/20150707/german-missiles-taken-over-by-hackers << next war will start and end in a flash
assbot: 'Hackers' give orders to German missile battery - The Local ... ( http://bit.ly/1LRh8Au )
mod6: phf: do you patches depend on anything besides stator?
mod6: ( i patched in ascii's dump/eat block as well, but got a bunch of errors I didn't get last time ): http://dpaste.com/0C67TTN.txt
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1dKPE1v )
phf: mod6: that's the last part of readme, you want to build with gmake instead of make (pkg_add gmake)
phf: ooh, wait
phf: i think that's the errors from environment variables not being set
mod6: oh nevremind.
mod6: i screwed up i don't have realpath installed.
mod6: ok rebuilding
trinque: mod6: which openbsd package provides realpath?
mod6: no idea. i just swapped that stuff out for the fullpath, but gernika reminded me that one can usese readlink -f
mod6: *use
trinque: ah k
BingoBoingo: lol hipsters http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bs-ed-city-police-20150705-story.html
assbot: Police add insult to injury after mugging - Baltimore Sun ... ( http://bit.ly/1LRi2Nj )
mircea_popescu: http://www.independent.co.uk/incoming/article10370250.ece/alternates/w620/6-Yanis-Varoufakis-AFP.jpg << wouldja look at the icons of the current adolescent.
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1dKRpMg )
mircea_popescu: fucking pizza delivery man ++
mircea_popescu: i dunno there's a sadder indictment of the decaying west.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform hm ?
mircea_popescu: and since we're on painful imagery, http://40.media.tumblr.com/e8a70299f0c5800ff75710a46e278040/tumblr_mm38px73ds1rdbtrjo2_1280.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1dKRCz2 )
BingoBoingo: http://www.counter-currents.com/2013/06/race-in-the-early-films-of-d-w-griffith/
assbot: Andrew Hamilton, "Race in the Early Films of D. W. Griffith" | Counter-Currents Publishing ... ( http://bit.ly/1dKROyb )
menahem: omg what is that photo ? insert and expand ?
BingoBoingo: menahem: You must be new here
menahem: ha, fairly. mostly read.
mircea_popescu: in that photo is a mechanical pear
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1192194 << basically holy water. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 21:00:28; pete_dushenski: not cheap !
menahem: ahh ok, used in the mouth!
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1192198 << it meant to demonstrate bitcoin doesn't work if it doesn't work on the redditards' terms. it managed to demonstrate instead redditards don't matter, even when they pay for the voice. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 21:02:02; trinque: I have no idea what they think the 'stress test' is meant to demonstrate
mircea_popescu: which is why this place (ie, bitcoin) is so fucking beautiful.
mircea_popescu: also why it's so fucking disconcerting to the welfare mass.
mircea_popescu: they truely believe it is a natural truth that their existence is all that's needed.
decimation: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1192416 < i've heard that the reason he lost so much weight at subway was because he was stalking some chick who worked there ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 00:42:05; BingoBoingo: In other news http://www.indystar.com/story/news/2015/07/07/police-investigation-under-way--home--subway-pitchman-jared-fogle/29807473/
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35907 @ 0.000557 = 20.0002 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 76993 @ 0.00056793 = 43.7266 BTC [+] {4}
mats: thats the first positive outcome to stalking i've heard of
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1192212 << because stupid and lazy. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 21:05:13; ascii_field: i still can't fathom why this wasn't sop from day 1.
mats: lose a shitload of weight, gain eight digits in your bank
mircea_popescu: mats you know all the girls i knew for the first i dunno, decade of my life i got through stalking ?
mats: define stalking
mats: hiding in the bushes, tracking movements, masturbating to her shadowy figure in the shower?
mircea_popescu: well, the most famous and i guess exemplare case is, mp stops car, tells shadow : follow that girl. guy gets an address, mp gets a phone number, talks to puzzled woman. explains that he had her stalked, would she like to have a cup of coffee
decimation: asciilifeform: I'm not sure what you are thinking, but my idea is to use the 10 minute block time as a noisy oscillator
mircea_popescu: she says sure, she's going for a cup of coffee. i ask where, she says "tell your guy to find out"
mircea_popescu: mad scramble throughout town ensues.
mircea_popescu: i would like to assure the concerned public that no flower bouquets were involved in any of this at any point.
BingoBoingo: !b 8 ✂︎
assbot: Last 8 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2Q31J0Z.txt )
williamdunne: Oh good, flowers really would have made the whole situation rather strange
mircea_popescu: williamdunne it's a reference.
decimation: pogo can keep time by comparing its clock to the block discovery interval, averaging over a long period
mircea_popescu: decimation and expect it to come to what, 9 ?
mircea_popescu: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 364334 | Current Difficulty: 4.940201493122746E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 364895 | Next Difficulty In: 561 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 4 days, 1 hour, 33 minutes, and 54 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 364334 / 6/ 24/365
gribble: 6.93177321157
decimation: it would take a few difficulty inervals
mircea_popescu: it would appear we are no less than a year into the future.
decimation: heh
decimation: what is the rate at which new blocks are found?
decimation: in seconds?
mircea_popescu: 600
mircea_popescu: ideally. irl more like 530ish
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1192251 << nope. exactly unrelated ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 21:14:04; jurov: mircea_popescu: is the ftp server in the vicinity of your bitcoin node? it went full speed for minutes, then it suddenly throttled to 6kbps
mircea_popescu: in like utah or some shit
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1192286 << this. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 21:30:21; ascii_field: likewise, the 'bubbles' ought to be sized proportional to their connectivity degree.
mircea_popescu: jurov that's a pretty weird graph considering the gaps aren't even same size o.O
williamdunne: mircea_popescu: 530 is pretty ideal, no? Sign of difficulty growth
decimation: you could fit a curve instead of line over a given interval
mircea_popescu: well ideal in what sense ? it's very unideal for his idea of timekeeping, because it proves (what we already knew) : time is meaningless and political time conventional, and all sorts of nutty fashions can endure a long time. ie, 350k blocks in this case.
funkenstein_: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-07-2015#1191982 <-- i thought she was going to jump back into jupiter's head a few days ago.. off on her merry way again ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 07-07-2015 19:54:23; decimation: maybe I should start watching venus too
mircea_popescu: decimation the problem of fitting real time to blocks is in fact going straight to the root of the world. solve it, get nobel. ☟︎
decimation: funkenstein_: lol
williamdunne: mircea_popescu: I guess. At the very least the cause of it is good though
mircea_popescu: or whatever actual respectable prize the nobel used to be
decimation: eh, it demands some modeling
mircea_popescu: noit a bad way to burn time, this assay.
williamdunne: I did a judging thing at teh loebner prize before. Was pretty lulzy
funkenstein_: i've heard tell of a distributed clock that might meet your needs
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69900 @ 0.00057271 = 40.0324 BTC [+] {4}
decimation: heh I got your entendre
funkenstein_: it's a prototype, the code might need some cleaning up
decimation: funkenstein_: what's that
funkenstein_: some financial software or other ;)
decimation: funkenstein_: were you the one studying clock intervals in bitcoin
funkenstein_: yes, i speak of bitcoin :)
funkenstein_: the quantity the a miner needs to report is the time since the last difficulty change
mircea_popescu: listen shorty, you read the log ?
funkenstein_: yes, enjoyed it.. sorry you are probably sick of this time talk already
mircea_popescu: wel lcause youre approaching it fresh
funkenstein_: other than that quantity, the rest is offset
mircea_popescu: yes, magical offset in that you don't know who's lying.
funkenstein_: genesis block tells you most of that offset
mircea_popescu: does not. looky here. block is 100, timestamp is 100, allowable max drift is 100.
mircea_popescu: block 101 arrives, at timestamp 150, advertising timestamp 101.
mircea_popescu: you set your timestamp to 101
mircea_popescu: block 102 arrives, at timestamp 200, advertising timestamp 250.
mircea_popescu: you reject it and now you're forked.
funkenstein_: the longest chain wins
mircea_popescu: no.
mircea_popescu: the longest ACCEPTABLE chain wins.
funkenstein_: right right
mircea_popescu: kneejerk the dwarf wtf!
funkenstein_: we can't know what procedure miners are using to set their own clocks
mircea_popescu: that'd be the problem.
funkenstein_: it's basically a jury duty scenario, you found a block, do your best to tell us what time it is
mircea_popescu: that's not how trustless works.
funkenstein_: well I think asciilifeform is formulating a more specific attack so that should be interesting
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> so much as opening pogo and touching inside multiplies the cost of the operation. << and yet mircea_popescu had this done
ben_vulpes: for lulz as far as i can tell
mircea_popescu: for tests.
mircea_popescu: now if i ask dpb something about it, he can answer sensibly.
ben_vulpes: well clearly. just making a joke.
ben_vulpes: now, as you say, interested parties could find a rate for diddled pogos.
ben_vulpes: and on top of that, his error rate cracking them open is probably zero. small sample size, but...
mircea_popescu: no, it's not. he said some bits got broken
ben_vulpes: ah, my mistake
ben_vulpes: !up Vexual
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1192433 << bwhahaah ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 00:56:00; williamdunne: ;;later tell gabriel_laddel was checking my rates, out of interest what is my association with gamingfurry.tumblr.com?
mircea_popescu: the .. .baby face ?
williamdunne: Furry definitely isn't something I'd label myself with
danielpbarron: it's kinda tricky getting them open. I had to scuff up a credit card and yeah some of the inner clips got cracked
danielpbarron: and it took about an hour to do 12 of them
williamdunne: I might be into some things, but anthropomorphic animals aren't one of those things
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1192570 << at the risk of 'fleischmanning', i will say a little about the concept even though i am not yet done working it out ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 02:03:34; mircea_popescu: decimation the problem of fitting real time to blocks is in fact going straight to the root of the world. solve it, get nobel.
asciilifeform: won't be earning any 'nobels', there is no way in heaven or hell that it could be retrofitted to bitcoin proper
mircea_popescu: take yer time
asciilifeform takes mircea_popescu's advice, hushes
Vexual: hehe
mircea_popescu: ands now i shall leave you with http://41.media.tumblr.com/5f930017bebc54ed7b2723594a70d5f0/tumblr_n8xsxzmnYv1r8wl2xo1_1280.jpg while i go make moar coarse frangible threads
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1DPW3BI )
menahem: ahh shit thats cray. :D
BingoBoingo: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tinder-date-woman-finds-novel-6010597
assbot: Tinder date woman finds novel way to hit back at man who told her she was too fat to fancy - Mirror Online ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZxPmc )
mod6: phf: hey it worked! sync'ing now... http://dpaste.com/1SZSGAJ.txt
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZxQXj )
funkenstein_: mod6, nice!
mod6: yes, this is fantastic really.
williamdunne: BingoBoingo: could he have been much nicer about it?
BingoBoingo: williamdunne: Not at all, bitch needs to stop being a Ham.
asciilifeform: http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/21730/how-does-the-kimoto-gravity-well-regulate-difficulty << not related either to my idea or to pogo. mechanism used in one crackpot altcoin to dispense with need for absolute clock
assbot: algorithms - How does the Kimoto Gravity Well regulate difficulty? - Bitcoin Stack Exchange ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZy3tA )
asciilifeform: (just need to time a block interval)
williamdunne: BingoBoingo: Tinder causes this issue, experienced it in RO
BingoBoingo: Really
williamdunne: Aye, which was remarkable really. Didn't see any others. She was very nice and I still talk to her, but headshots and angles are good at lying
asciilifeform: http://blog.vertcoin.org/?p=5 << critic
assbot: Development update | Vertcoin Developers Blog ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZydRx )
asciilifeform: from ~other~ crackpot alt.
asciilifeform changes gloves, gas mask filter
funkenstein_: seemingly a PID controller would be best for difficulty adjustment, however simplicity is a stronger argument
asciilifeform: this, again, isn't even related to what i was thinking of. but encountered by accident.
BingoBoingo: * asciilifeform changes gloves, gas mask filter << Shouldn't you step away from the cesium dust first?
asciilifeform has not been keeping track of crackpot 'coins' since 'litecoin'
funkenstein_: speaking thereof: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3ci25k/the_current_spam_attack_on_bitcoin_is_not/
assbot: The current spam attack on Bitcoin is not economically feasible on Litecoin : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZywvF )
BingoBoingo: williamdunne: Here the pic/reality discrepancy is so bad in a lot of cases it is like a fat person killed a normal with similar hair and started living their life.
williamdunne: BingoBoingo: Yeah, she was definitely the same person. Only the body was not what the angles would have you believe
williamdunne: Don't believe she was wearing someone else's face either
asciilifeform: https://blockchain.info/address/162TRPRZvdgLVNksMoMyGJsYBfYtB4Q8tM >> who typically gets these ?
assbot: Bitcoin Address 162TRPRZvdgLVNksMoMyGJsYBfYtB4Q8tM ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZyTGB )
williamdunne: funkenstein_: In his defence, the litecoin solution actually seemed like a pretty good way to handle it
BingoBoingo: I mean seriously here, the faces look different. Literally have to be using other people's pictures.
asciilifeform: i mean, why has nobody picked it up
asciilifeform: 0.00541 is good money
williamdunne: BingoBoingo: I don't understand how they don't think "oh, maybe they'll be confused when they see me in person?"
BingoBoingo: williamdunne: hollywood gave them broken expectations. The moral they complain about is "look good get laid" when they take the worse insane moral of "the protagonist is witty and spechial"
williamdunne: !b 5 ✂︎
assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/21AC41Z.txt )
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: like anything else that works even though 'shouldn't', this works
williamdunne: BingoBoingo: Are you suggesting that our tumblrina protagonist isn't witty, or special like the most specialist of snowflakes
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: except none of that crud is operative, it works from an elementary 'pigeonhole theorem' - many cocks, few parking spots
williamdunne: Drinking law in the UK is even more lax than I had realized
williamdunne: https://www.gov.uk/alcohol-young-people-law
assbot: Alcohol and young people - GOV.UK ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZzPe9 )
BingoBoingo: No, example. Drinking at the bar with some friends. One fire up "Tinder" girl with nice pictures takes a cab across the mississippi river and walk into the bar. Diameter more than half her height. Recognizes friend, friend has no idea who she is.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: she will get laid that day. whereas 90%+ of normal-looking blokes - won't.
asciilifeform: l337 m4rk3tz
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Note that in North America gay rights became popular as femal obesity rates spiked
decimation: lol blockchain.info is still posting 1-size blocks
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i suspect that everybody who came from the factory with that vernier not glued down, is turning it, yes
asciilifeform: decimation: link ?
decimation: https://blockchain.info/
assbot: Bitcoin Block Explorer - Blockchain.info ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZA5db )
mats: lol
decimation: 2 in the last 30 minutes
mats: such social commentary
asciilifeform: ph0rkz!!!
decimation: I guess.
asciilifeform: ph0rkr4pht!
decimation: it would be interesting to know how blockchain.info gets its data
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> BingoBoingo: she will get laid that day. whereas 90%+ of normal-looking blokes - won't. << She apparently even managed to fuck this up. Reportedly gave friend sad handjob and blackmailed for attention the next day with promise of putting out eventually. Was driven to bar in the ghetto and left (could not run to vehicle in time to stop it)
williamdunne for a while no longer has to worry about getting laid
williamdunne: decimation: carrier pigeon, although it's suffering with pattern baldness
decimation: I hope those 'bitcoin core' dumbfucks are happy with the progress they are making
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> BingoBoingo: i suspect that everybody who came from the factory with that vernier not glued down, is turning it, yes << 31337 social engineering
williamdunne: It really is remarkable how blockchain.info didn't go down the goxhole, they just consistently break
asciilifeform: because nobody really relies on it for anything
asciilifeform: hence failure - no problem
asciilifeform: https://blockchain.info/block/00000000000000000abdbee0b1c681c7bd3ebd5753af822fdaf7a6754e154b50
assbot: Bitcoin Block #364343 ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZAcW6 )
williamdunne: "MyWallet" ?
asciilifeform: https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000009ba590de2819dd4b4f7741fc4b9fc9d45c2e1e00d0ca6ec
assbot: Bitcoin Block #364339 ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZAdcG )
decimation: interesting 364343 was relayed by
BingoBoingo: williamdunne: When piuk rolled out blockchain.info it was the best block explorer. Once he stopped doing everything it swiftly went to shit and got Andreas'd
decimation: which is purported to be in canby, oregon
decimation: wasn't that where the bctc guy lived?
williamdunne: BingoBoingo: I can't tolerate any of them currently. Blockchain.info is constantly broken, and all the others have these horrible gaudy interfaces.
decimation: it appears the coinbase one agrees with blockchain.info https://bitcoin.toshi.io/#block
assbot: Toshi ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZACM6 )
BingoBoingo: williamdunne: And this is what temps me to fuck with running an electrum server. To run a private block explorer accountable only to me when it barfs
williamdunne: BingoBoingo: no bootstrap plz
BingoBoingo: WHen have I ever used bootstrap?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9000 @ 0.0005515 = 4.9635 BTC [-]
williamdunne: It seems to be a default option, not a personal accusation
williamdunne: Qntra style would be lovely <3
asciilifeform: http://nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/CEB08E08EEF3C71AEC185767B076C306E945E535BE55A8CAAAB9378A9F7CD4D1 << missed by scoopbot ?
assbot: Welcome | Phuctor ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZAQ5O )
williamdunne: asciilifeform: Scoopbot doesn't deal with phuctor, that's trinquebot
asciilifeform: and what is 'marketplace.i2p' ?
asciilifeform: ( as seen in http://nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/4FC297377727D7EDA1512181888ECF02A8A5E5BC9B8406B2BF852B84F32FD55A )
williamdunne: asciilifeform: I'd presume a marketplace on i2p
asciilifeform: well sure
asciilifeform: but ~what~
asciilifeform: anybody got a box running i2p?
asciilifeform: i can't be arsed
williamdunne: https://www.reddit.com/r/themarketplace/
assbot: The Market Place - An Anonymous Market Built To Enable Trustless Transactions. ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZB4de )
williamdunne: mabbeh that one
decimation: asciilifeform: it strikes me that your choice of location is to some degree a 'prisoner's dilemma'.
asciilifeform: ?
decimation: everyone in your meatwot could probably get a better deal if they lived somewhere cheaper
asciilifeform: like botswana
decimation: but 'cooperation' in moving together is much more expensive than 'defection' to the local area
decimation: hell, west virginia
asciilifeform: one fella did
asciilifeform: now he sits in car for 4 hours instead of 2
trinque: to be fair, west virginia is a shithole
decimation: heh well that's not very much moving
decimation: trinque: sure, but it wouldn't be if people moved there
trinque: maybe so
decimation: why do they all defect to the big city every day
asciilifeform: it would also cost what maryland costs
asciilifeform: if folks moved there
trinque: most notable thing I recall about WV is that giant teapot
asciilifeform: elementary.
asciilifeform: as soon as you start moving in folks with money, it stops 'being cheap'
asciilifeform: the rent collectors don't sleep
decimation: asciilifeform: partially because more dollars are 'created' to bid up assets
williamdunne: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-33414264
assbot: Canadian flew over Calgary in chair carried by balloons - BBC News ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZBMqN )
williamdunne: Hilarious, he's being charged for this
asciilifeform: even if dollars were conserved
decimation: I suspect that problem wouldn't be as pronounced with a hard-banking hard currency
decimation: sure, folks would bid up assets, but the vast majority of bids in the wash dc area are 'zombies'
decimation: ie usg passthroughs
asciilifeform: and our collective salaries - aren't ?
trinque: "Mr Boria has been charged with mischief causing danger to life and could face further charges." << wait... his?
decimation: heh good point
decimation: the question is: how much of the money that is 'freshly printed' by the fed or a bank part of the wash dc bid?
decimation: that's theoretically measurable
asciilifeform: at this point, i don't regard any aspect of the whole orchestra as honestly measurable
asciilifeform: other than - just possibly - by the perpetrators
williamdunne: trinque: Yes, his. Unless they're suggesting his stray garden chair could mysteriously strike someone down
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-07-2014#778096 << see also ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 30-07-2014 13:57:29; asciilifeform: g: 'show me the real budget.' a: 'you're asking too much. that's off limits to you.'
decimation: you could multiply direct gov spending by the 'print factor'
decimation: but that would only capture a portion - it would exclude the portion magicked into existance by banks
asciilifeform: what does one get from multiplying one work of fiction by another ?
decimation: heh
asciilifeform: let's multiply width of unicorn's horn at its base by the length of yeti's cock
asciilifeform: equals depth of mermaid's snatch ?
decimation: then map the yeti/uni/heat cock
decimation: I guess it would be a useful as the map that nyt ran which indicated the density of racists over usa
asciilifeform: aha
asciilifeform wonders if they recycled map of communists from '50s or bothered to make a new one
decimation: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/08/us/f-16-and-small-private-plane-collide-in-midair-over-south-carolina.html < usg cares for its people
assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZCowG )
asciilifeform: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/08/us/gun-shaped-iphone-case-is-a-terrible-idea-police-officials-warn.html << in other lulz
assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZCuEv )
asciilifeform: 'Mr. Schumer said a federal law requires toy or imitation guns to feature a highly visible orange mark at the end of the barrel to identify them as harmless. Since the phone case does not have the marker, he said, he would work with customs officials to block its import and sale.' << l0l! srsly?
asciilifeform: 1) spray orange paint on 'thompson' 2) pull out in front of police 3) ??? 4) profit!!!111!
decimation: asciilifeform: note that the police are rarely punished for shooting innocents
decimation: http://users.humboldt.edu/mstephens/hate/hate_map.html# < note that 'nigger' correlates with large black populations, similar for others
assbot: Hate Map ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZCQv1 )
asciilifeform: latest memo to police almost certainly reads 'plz shoot only white, thx'
mats: 'chink' doesn't correlate to california at all
mats: or any place with large asian populations that i'm aware of
mats: worst app ever
asciilifeform: mats is surprised to discover that unicorn's snatch depth does not correlate with mermaid's cock length ?
decimation: mats: note that the 'normalize by the number of tweets'
decimation: thus effectively discounting the liberal population centers
asciilifeform: thttp://www.hardforkcoin.org << for entomologists only!111!!1
decimation: so the self-serving bastards can come to the conclusion that those rednecks out in the sticks are the real racists
mats: so what i need an inverse contrast map
mats: and avoid everything else
decimation: heh yeah
mats: thats a lot of america
mats: but i knew that already
funkenstein_: metastudies of tweets <-- totally useless waste of time
decimation: funkenstein_: my favorite study of the issue: http://unamusementpark.com/2011/07/blacks-ruin-fourth-of-july-in-baltimore-media-censor-race/
assbot: Unamusement Park » Blog Archive » Blacks ruin Fourth of July in Baltimore; media censor race ... ( http://bit.ly/1HMCsW0 )
decimation: guy found tweets by black people in baltimore back during fourth of july 2011, when there was violence
asciilifeform: isn't that the fella who got 'beaten to death by accident' in a johannesburg police station ?
decimation: heh it might be
asciilifeform: i recall the liberast blogosphere laughing maniacally about this
asciilifeform: 'racist gets just deserts'
decimation: he seems to have posted in janurary
asciilifeform: perhaps it was the one who did 'across difficult country'
asciilifeform: i forget.
asciilifeform: don't give much of a shit any more
mats: i'm enjoying the tweets on that link, decimation
mats: ebonics has so much... variety
funkenstein_: i talk with criminal slang
funkenstein_: i read some tweets once, it was when dorian was being collected
funkenstein_: after that i vowed never again
decimation: mats: amusingly 'unamusement park' is totally blacklisted from all search engines
decimation: !up Vexual
Vexual: i think alf set his clock
funkenstein_: reminds me of Eddie Murphy's grandmother: "What time is it?"
funkenstein_: it might be an interesting simulation to see what would happen if not only all nodes but all miners had no real clock
funkenstein_: difficulty would stay constant I suppose
Vexual: can you describe celestial navigation to decimation?
funkenstein_: well the latitude is easy
funkenstein_: for longitude, i believe there is a book by sobel or something
decimation: http://asteroidoccultation.com/asteroid.htm < you can see local asteroid occulations
assbot: Asteroid Occultation Predictions (Current) ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZEfl2 )
decimation: you can calculate them yourself with winblows turdware and usg provided emphemeris data http://www.lunar-occultations.com/iota/occult4.htm
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZEigZ )
decimation: longitude requires knowledge of time
Vexual: what if your tables are from 1997?
funkenstein_: nothing under magnitude 10, makes it difficult on my canoe
funkenstein_: but I like it anyway
Vexual: what canoe?
Vexual: how far do you paddle?
funkenstein_: figure of speech
Vexual: aha
decimation: http://www.amazon.com/Long-Term-Almanac-2000-2050-Reduction/dp/0914025104 < tables to 2050
assbot: Long Term Almanac 2000-2050: For the Sun and Selected Stars With Concise Sight Reduction Tables, 2nd Edition: Geoffrey Kolbe: 9780914025108: Amazon.com: Books ... ( http://bit.ly/1HMFRnX )
Vexual: decimation: sight redution tables for nother lats are avail from .mil in pdf
Vexual: if you have a printer
Vexual: whats ur approx lat decimation?
Vexual: n/s?
decimation: around 40 n
Vexual: fuck thats a long way north
decimation: yeah, and uk is even father
decimation: farther
Vexual: really?
Vexual: i cant even geography
decimation: usg charges for their nautical almanacs
decimation: http://bookstore.gpo.gov/agency/1449
assbot: Nautical Almanac Office | U.S. Government Bookstore ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZEU67 )
Vexual: same infos free on .mil
decimation: australian?
Vexual: maybe, i dunno whats in thr almanac
Vexual: yes
decimation: yeah uk is roughly 50-60 n
decimation: london is 51 n
decimation: it's relatively warm because of the gulf stream
Vexual: 50s at aussie long is firmly in a world of shit
decimation: ottawa, canada is roughly 45 n for instance
decimation: but much colder
Vexual: theres no land to slow the wind at 50s
decimation: 50 s is well south of tasmania
decimation: that's probably why nobody lives on macquarie island
Vexual: it might be national park
Vexual: on eny given day you might meet a horny marine biologist
decimation: yeah apparently they killed all the mammals
ben_vulpes: http://people.csail.mit.edu/hofma/Assets/Thesis_12_02_2005.pdf << okay now this is cool
Vexual: yeah rats, i saw that
mats: man
mats: i set up a raid0 with two SSDs
mats: and windoze updates on this box still takes hours wtf ☟︎
mats: \o/
ben_vulpes: > windows
ben_vulpes: mk
ben_vulpes: help i am 1200 lines behind
mircea_popescu: have less sex.
ben_vulpes: do y'all eventually get to why averaging out umpteen 2016 blocks won't work in place of timekeeping?
asciilifeform: !b 3 ✂︎
assbot: Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2J2VN7A.txt )
decimation: about 80% of it: use ntp! no time itself is owned by usg and so are all servers and isps!
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: for the same reason pulling one's cock doesn't work as a means of flight
ben_vulpes: what?
asciilifeform: 'in place of timekeeping'
ben_vulpes: sorry, diff adjustments.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: they take place with wall clock as invariant
asciilifeform: i spent all morning trying to hammer this into thick headz
asciilifeform: if you plug block times into wall clock, letting the former adjust the latter, you've plugged arse into mouth
ben_vulpes: made good progress i see
asciilifeform: and are no longer using classical bitcoin
ben_vulpes: alas.
ben_vulpes: the thing is miserably bad anyways, why would anyone want to use it?
asciilifeform: still lost on me
ben_vulpes: anyways, how do you plan to handle this on pogos?
asciilifeform: no idea
asciilifeform: left it to ben_vulpes to solve
ben_vulpes: you know i'm not even convinced a node *should* be stood up without human intervention.
asciilifeform: then shouldn't have any interest in pogo
asciilifeform: because whole fucking point of it is that and only that.
ben_vulpes: well "should" is a strong word
asciilifeform: point of pogo is to allow well-meaning but illiterate or even stupid people to run therealbitcoin.
asciilifeform: (and don't forget the merely lazy)
decimation: ben_vulpes: it seemed that there was some some concensus around the idea of randomly selecting a small set of ntp servers out of a large pre-defined set
decimation: this doesn't solve the "pogo clock is shit" problem
asciilifeform: except then danielpbarron reminded us that this will have to happen regularly
asciilifeform: because the thing drifts to all hell
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 68400 @ 0.00055147 = 37.7205 BTC [-] {2}
asciilifeform: (marvell chipset ~has~ rtc, but the vendor omitted the 32kHz crystal and power source.)
ben_vulpes: i'm sure moreso under load
asciilifeform: so it uses interrupt-based timing, like msdos
asciilifeform: aha, ben_vulpes has it
decimation: which means continous correction is nearly required
ben_vulpes: myeah, i see that.
decimation: asciilifeform: as to ass-to-mouth system, it depends on your error model for thblock timestamps
asciilifeform: arse-to-mouth is a strictly fact-of thing
decimation: imagine each miner has his own cesium clock
asciilifeform: and meet in the flesh to sync it ?
asciilifeform: let's also imagine dragons.
asciilifeform: try to grasp why political time is a fiction
asciilifeform: and why rsa signatures do not make it less of one
decimation: asciilifeform: it's really hard to imagine when < 100 ns accuracy is nearly freely and reliably avaialable
asciilifeform: picture the proverbial devil in the cable. he perhaps cannot diddle your packets (because you signed them, and have traded pubkeys in person) but he can... delay them
asciilifeform: as long as he likes
asciilifeform: and also can replay.
asciilifeform: the accuracy doesn't matter because you have no way of knowing whether the above have been done to you
asciilifeform: and when
asciilifeform: much of our thought takes place in an imaginary world where communication is instantaneous, perfectly reliable, and perfectly incorruptible. but we do not actually live in that world.
asciilifeform: nor do we get the luxury of precise, predictable delta from that world.
decimation: ntp has provisions against replay and deplay attacks
asciilifeform: replay i can see
asciilifeform: but delay ?
asciilifeform: how ?
asciilifeform: let me guess, by comparing the behaviour of one node with others
asciilifeform: aka lifting yourself up by own cock.
asciilifeform: in my expected battlefield, chances are that either none of your links are sybils, or ALL OF THEM ARE
asciilifeform: comparing a subset of your field of vision with the rest does nothing against the latter.
decimation: plus the behaviour of one node over time
asciilifeform: can be perfectly consistent
asciilifeform: while leading you straight to hell
asciilifeform: all of this goes back to the 'protocol vs promises' discussion
asciilifeform: it is possible to count the pulses of a pulsar, of cesium atom, of quartz, etc
asciilifeform: but as soon as you ask another person 'what time is it' you are playing political games
decimation: http://www.eecis.udel.edu/~mills/onwire.html The symmetric modes operate using a sequence of rounds, each consisting of a transmit packet followed by a receive packet, but either of both of these packets could be lost. A round is correct if both packets are correctly received. In order to verify correctness of the protocol, it is necessary to prove a liveness assertion; that is, the protocol always yields a correct round even if after
assbot: Object not found! ... ( http://bit.ly/1NN9O7t )
asciilifeform: there is not actually a way out of this
mircea_popescu: <ben_vulpes> you know i'm not even convinced a node *should* be stood up without human intervention. << this may be true.
asciilifeform: ^ then there ought to be 100 nodes, running on 'microvax'
mircea_popescu: and the followin line does not follow. some intelligent people are poor, or more to wit : some poor people are (allegedly) intelligent. i doub this is true. but if it were, pogo is their way out.
asciilifeform: because that's how many people alive are ~actually qualified~
mircea_popescu: and if they fail to find it, or to take it, you have no case.
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> point of pogo is to allow well-meaning but illiterate or even stupid people to run therealbitcoin. << no. well meaning stupid is the LAST thing we want. i'd rather import us academia.
asciilifeform: then wtf is the point
mircea_popescu: what you want is the alleged minialfs who exist. people who supposedly could use the head, but somehow magically "not enough fuel"
asciilifeform: and if it has to be blessed with the magical breath of life of intelligence every time mains power flickers, it is a proverbial 'assembly line requiring ph.d.s' to borrow from al schwartz
asciilifeform: i.e. a sad joke
mircea_popescu: now this is true
mircea_popescu: but notice that this does not run as far as the previous
asciilifeform: that's all i was trying to say
mircea_popescu: aite.
asciilifeform: there is also cuckoldry aspect here
asciilifeform: one ought to be able to drop pogos on a dumb corp's net
asciilifeform: and have them operate
asciilifeform: no shortage of eligible cuckolds and cuckolders for this
asciilifeform: but it has to be practical
decimation: I view the firewall/nat problem as much bigger
mircea_popescu: if you can do that, comandeer a server.
mircea_popescu: less noticeable than "wtf is this new item"
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: many, many more people who can 'commandeer' a broom closet with ethernet
asciilifeform: believe.
asciilifeform: and hardly ever anyone asks 'what is this'
mircea_popescu: so no, i do not believe pogo has anything to do with http://trilema.com/open-parasitic-p2p-relay
assbot: [OPEN] Parasitic P2P Relay on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1NNaB8D )
asciilifeform: not directly.
mircea_popescu: also in the news : the well rounded education. http://41.media.tumblr.com/00c3d0c2cdb22bedb8754888b020266e/tumblr_mtfjsjpKCf1ryftdoo1_1280.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1NNaCJC )
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: you need a million tyler durdens.
ben_vulpes: and they *can* bless a pogo.
asciilifeform: i thought those just set things on fire ?
ben_vulpes: and pogo is?
decimation: http://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2015-mob-technology-consultants-help-drug-traffickers/ < "The device they built looked like a European version of a power strip. Tucked inside a 15-by-5-inch casing was a tiny Linux computer running powerful hacking software called Metasploit. The pwnie sent out data via cellular networks, which meant they could be accessed from anywhere."
assbot: The Mob's IT Department | Bloomberg Business ... ( http://bit.ly/1NNaNVl )
asciilifeform: a land mine that has to be rebooted by hand every few weeks is a sad joke.
asciilifeform: i stand by this.
decimation: maybe the land mine reboots you
asciilifeform: decimation: not only classic, but so cliche that there are 1,001 commercial copies
mircea_popescu: " running powerful hacking software called Metasploit"
decimation: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0114367/
assbot: Planète hurlante (1995) - IMDb ... ( http://bit.ly/1NNaSbF )
mircea_popescu: who the fuck still reads these things
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no, actually, it's a good idea.
mircea_popescu: i'd like land mines like that. so would every army out there.
decimation: apparently some mobster in amsterdam recruited a couple of nerds to exploit shipping companies
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: you want them on the other side, aha
asciilifeform: shoot the idiots while they crawl around rebooting.
mircea_popescu: no, the problem with landmines atm is that they can't be safely defused
mircea_popescu: if you got 100% guaranteed 2 week only mines, o boy.
asciilifeform: the 'safe defuse with key' thing already exists
mircea_popescu: you'd be rich with this. fo realz.
asciilifeform: notice, not popular
mircea_popescu: cuz not reliable.
asciilifeform: dun think thats why
asciilifeform: rather, because winblowz
mircea_popescu: a 99.999% success rate is the last thing you want.
mircea_popescu: drop 1mn mines, get killed 10 times.
asciilifeform: this is sop btw
asciilifeform: ask folks who work with frags
asciilifeform: there is a certain statistic for how many have, e.g., 1sec fuse
asciilifeform: (if rated is 5)
asciilifeform: 'get killed 10 times' is actually doing pretty well ahead of the curve!
decimation: yeah plenty of folks die trying to learn how to throw gernades
asciilifeform: the reason, afaik, why 'defuse with key' did not catch on is a ~well-founded~ distrust of computer
asciilifeform: 'computer', to an experienced commander, means 'twerp will cast a spell and enemy will walk clean across, shredding you'
asciilifeform: this is what 25 yrs of winblowz did to the mind
asciilifeform: it'll be generations after a sane computer exists that this kind of thinking even gets a chance of drawing to a close.
decimation: also 'we need soldiers who can do that'
ben_vulpes: <ascii_field> want a fucking WALL POSTER << codebase isn't that bad, should be doable by hand :P
asciilifeform: for contrast: i just finished a neat little book (ru) on early artillery
asciilifeform: early cannoneers accepted double-digit chances of being blown up by own barrel ☟︎
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: go, do
ben_vulpes: no, u
asciilifeform: then swear with your life that it's 100% covered
asciilifeform: 'isn't that bad' l0l
ben_vulpes: heh
asciilifeform: decimation: re: 'round trip' ntp - you still are at the mercy of local clock's accuracy when computing the trip time
ben_vulpes: <trinque> haha holy shit, dxr's "install" method is vagrant << see also gitlab
asciilifeform: if your local clock is shit, i can still induce you to rely on it more, more
asciilifeform: and drift.
decimation: yes, true
ben_vulpes: vast quantities of braindamage.
decimation: ultimately there's no substitute for good hardware
asciilifeform: i am trying - and apparently failing - to make the point that there is no such thing as 'good hardware' for finding out 'what time' it is on ~my~ atomic clock from across an ocean.
asciilifeform: just so happens that the universe is 'bad hardware' for that.
asciilifeform: even before you add a war
decimation: and yet, even usg manages to keep orbital rb clocks ticking
ben_vulpes: <BingoBoingo> phf: No, not yet. On OpenBSD I'm running an 0.7.2 derivative with LibreSSL 2.0 just to see how it behaves. << how's the libressl build going?
asciilifeform: decimation: timebases!
asciilifeform: not clocks
asciilifeform: try to grasp the difference
asciilifeform: and notice how easy it is to spoof'em
asciilifeform: the thing is a house of cards
decimation: if your point is that they are centrally disciplined that's probably true
asciilifeform: not only
asciilifeform: but defenseless against a kid with sdr card.
ben_vulpes: * williamdunne currently has a neck that looks like Cheetah fur, lovely patterned bruising << furries, asphyxiation... ☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: chunk of meat in the desert, that flies have not found yet
decimation: at any rate, your objection to coordinating clocks seems to boil down to "can't carry messages of a known latency over spacetime"
decimation: how is this not the case?
asciilifeform: if we were in space war, could probably carry on with something like the naive notion of clocks
asciilifeform: limited only by sr, etc
asciilifeform: but we are not in space.
asciilifeform: but in a hell, with devils
asciilifeform: on every wire.
decimation: so your objection boils down to 'enemy controls means of communication'
asciilifeform: aha.
decimation: which is a reasonable point
decimation: but is applicable to the entire bitcoin enterprise equally
asciilifeform: it is not. ☟︎
asciilifeform: because proof-of-work.
asciilifeform: i can tell a zero-diff block and so can you
asciilifeform: some things cannot be faked.
asciilifeform: rsa also exists, and this prevents certain other spurious items
asciilifeform: but these do not add up to a trustworthy clock.
decimation: this only emphasizes the point that there needs to be alternate communication media available
decimation: ionosphere will relay for free, cannot be pwned by usg ☟︎
asciilifeform: most fundamental problem is that distributed clocks are infinitely sybilable.
asciilifeform: how the fuck do i know what is on the other end of ionosphere?
asciilifeform: man, or usg gnome ?
decimation: you just said, rsa can solve that problem
asciilifeform: only if i'm personally friends with fella who owns clock
decimation: indeed.
asciilifeform: and the wall time i want to know is specifically his
decimation: or he's in your wot somehow
decimation: if 99% of miners use usg time, what's the use of wot-time?
asciilifeform: if 99% of miners use gavincoin and spv, what is the use of therealbitcoin ?
decimation: excellent question
asciilifeform: i suspect that mircea_popescu might answer that it is for the next set of miners
asciilifeform: after the current set gets ddt sprayed on them ☟︎
asciilifeform: like all locusts deserve
decimation: the idea of a crypto-radio-clock intrigues me
decimation: I have a few sketches for such a thing, but I can't get around the problem of fixed keys that need to be distributed to listeners
asciilifeform: i'm more partial to cryptocurrency that doesn't rely on clocks. ☟︎
asciilifeform: at least, clocks in the usual political sense.
decimation: that auto-scaling-difficulty thing seems crazy though
decimation: at least on a per-block basis
asciilifeform: it is clearly not the solution
asciilifeform: i linked to it to illustrate the sheer batshit
decimation: heh
asciilifeform: the solution is to force the miners themselves into behaving like a pendulum with a period from which they, collectively, deviate at their peril.
asciilifeform: i promise to explain this later.
decimation: sounds like it would involve incrementing the protocol version
asciilifeform: it absolutely cannot work with classical bitcoin
decimation: but it is an interesting idea
asciilifeform: and thus i am not entirely sure who would find it interesting here, and why
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: Still sync'd on BritneyChain
asciilifeform: basic idea involves 'left-handed' and 'right-handed' miners, with game-theoretical reward matrix of being one depending on the first derivative in the hashing power of the other.
asciilifeform: still trying to model this.
ben_vulpes: i think mircea_popescu designed something like that for eulora
asciilifeform: did he ?
asciilifeform: link ?
ben_vulpes: players vs. the game. conversation in ars.
asciilifeform: hm
asciilifeform: i suppose he can answer when reads log..
ben_vulpes: balancing of rewards for being mage/barbarian/etc over time
asciilifeform: essentially you want the entire network to have a 'resonant frequency'
asciilifeform: which can now be your timebase.
asciilifeform: why settle for little quartz crystals
asciilifeform: when you can use a planet-sized resonator.
decimation: that reminds me of schumann resonances https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schumann_resonances
assbot: Schumann resonances - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1IIq0aS )
asciilifeform: decimation: i'm still waiting to read a non-batshit explanation of schumann
asciilifeform: (was also thinking of it earlier today)
decimation: hehe
decimation: it's lightning sprites and earthquakes
decimation: actually I suspect the solar wind buffeting the magnetosphere is a factor
asciilifeform: what i meant was, i'd like to see a rational calculation of why the freq.
asciilifeform: until then, it's voodo
decimation: this crazy czech runs a vaccum-pendulum radio clock http://ok0epb.nagano.cz/index.php?page=Main+page/
assbot: Main page - OK0EPB - 7 039,4 kHz ... ( http://bit.ly/1IIqgXm )
asciilifeform: state-of-the-art till the '50s iirc
asciilifeform bbl
ag3nt_zer0: !rate trinque 1 very helpful to noob
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/c39f0df9608c7058
ag3nt_zer0: !rate shinohai 1 great help to noob ☟︎
assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/49ae2cc4cb75f970
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 84300 @ 0.00054193 = 45.6847 BTC [-] {4}
trinque: ag3nt_zer0: thanks guy
trinque: ben_vulpes: so pipelinedb turned out to be YC shitware
trinque: http://www.pipelinedb.com/
assbot: PipelineDB—The Streaming SQL Database ... ( http://bit.ly/1RjMpkj )
trinque: all they did can be done with triggers, background workers and materialized views
trinque: and they had the nerve to *RENAME POSTGRESQL TO SOMETHING ELSE*
trinque: meanwhile they did not do the one thing that might've been interesting (that I can see), which would've been to fire pg_notify events when the results of a given view change
punkman: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-07-08/china-trade-halts-hit-2-2-trillion-as-state-intervention-fails
assbot: China Stock Sellers Frozen Out of 71% of Market - Bloomberg Business ... ( http://bit.ly/1RjP4KO )
punkman: "The eurozone has given Greece until Thursday to present new proposals to secure a deal with creditors, and has called a full EU summit for Sunday."
mircea_popescu: yep, it's the end of the world.
mircea_popescu: after this unwinds 1929 will look like glbse by comparison.
punkman: I'll stock up on Tetris http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn27846-tetris-blocks-traumatic-flashbacks-even-after-the-memory-is-fixed.html
assbot: Tetris blocks traumatic flashbacks even after the memory is fixed - health - 06 July 2015 - New Scientist ... ( http://bit.ly/1RjR4mf )
punkman: lots of greek banks in the balkans, I wonder what's gonna happen with those
punkman: http://bigstory.ap.org/article/e2a57c5e809f4da3a46aa7c1ba94bf10/exposed-greek-banks-balkans-brace-trouble
assbot: Exposed to Greek banks, Balkans brace for trouble ... ( http://bit.ly/1RjRY22 )
mircea_popescu: PatentChina 1 hour ago
mircea_popescu: imagine what will happen if month later no china crash is seen? but USA has advantage that it will never feel shame. one lie does not come true, there is another one. and in the end they can still say china has hacked usa without any evidences. Repeating lies 1000 times, it becomes truth. that is how USA invaded Iraq.
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: anyway, hopefully they manage to prop it, because if they do not and people start unwinding us holdings on the grounds of the massive yuan profits to be thus made, that's that.
mircea_popescu: !up ValentinJesse
ag3nt_zer0: "But getting the game into a person's hands immediately after they have been raped, for example, won't always be practical, so the team tested whether it could still work a day later – after the memory had been consolidated and slept on." haha
jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1192874 not TRIMmed, praps? ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 04:25:37; mats: and windoze updates on this box still takes hours wtf
cazalla: good logs, good meal, no good wine to go with it but 2/3 ain't bad eh ☟︎
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45200 @ 0.00055343 = 25.015 BTC [+] {2}
gabriel_laddel: williamdunne: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=04-06-2015#1153851 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 04-06-2015 15:16:44; williamdunne: http://gamingfurry.tumblr.com/
gabriel_laddel: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193046 << bahahaha ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 05:16:27; ben_vulpes: * williamdunne currently has a neck that looks like Cheetah fur, lovely patterned bruising << furries, asphyxiation...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40748 @ 0.00055343 = 22.5512 BTC [+]
funkenstein_: <asciilifeform> i'm more partial to cryptocurrency that doesn't rely on clocks. <-- there was one called liquidcoin ☟︎
funkenstein_: the problem of what kind of clock foot soldier P needs depends on exact specification of role foot soldier P needs to play
funkenstein_: a node with no clock could still be a useful one, depending on what you had in mind ☟︎
punkman: ;;view 22382
gribble: #22382 Wed Jul 8 08:30:46 2015 punkman SELL 1.0 night @ 1.3 btc (Seaside villa in Creta, Greece. 4bdr, sleeps 8, a/c, wifi, etc. 3min walk to beach. discounts on certain dates. http://i.imgur.com/DqYiA5O.jpg)
gabriel_laddel: !up diana_coman
kakobrekla: punkman yours?
punkman: kakobrekla: no, but I've been there a few times
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8202 @ 0.00055343 = 4.5392 BTC [+]
kakobrekla: http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/07/in-russia-selfie-takes-you-prompts-official-safety-selfie-warning/
assbot: In Russia, selfie takes you, prompts official “safety selfie” warning | Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1NSgQIW )
bagels7: Hi, does anyone happen to know the title of that trilema article that explains how women are immature and basically blame men for their shortcomings
bagels7: who needs money. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjUJIziMe-4
assbot: Ten Years After - I'd Love To Change The World (lyrics) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1NShKVE )
gabriel_laddel: !rated bagels7
assbot: You have not rated bagels7.
gabriel_laddel: !gettrust bagels7
assbot: Trust relationship from user gabriel_laddel to user bagels7: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. |http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/trust/?from=gabriel_laddel&to=bagels7 | http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/user/bagels7/
asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu http://arstechnica.com/security/2015/07/days-after-hacking-team-breach-nobody-fired-no-customers-lost << mega-l0l
assbot: Days after Hacking Team breach, nobody fired, no customers lost | Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1MeFt1k )
gribble: The operation succeeded.
thestringpuller: cazalla: BingoBoingo http://www.comcastro.com/podcast-virtual-currency-bitcoin-new-world-order-stevie-frederick/ << i did a qntra shoutout there
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193160 << 'Fixed difficulty (0.05) / Block reward reduces 4% every 1000 blocks' (from tardstalk) ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 12:18:05; funkenstein_: <asciilifeform> i'm more partial to cryptocurrency that doesn't rely on clocks. <-- there was one called liquidcoin
asciilifeform: and appears to be long-dead... to nobody's great surprise
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193162 << can be very useful as a boat anchor! or balloon ballast. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 12:22:35; funkenstein_: a node with no clock could still be a useful one, depending on what you had in mind
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: when you can use a planet-sized resonator. << each planet would have a different frequency
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: was not speaking of the chunk of rock per se. see thread.
asciilifeform: '...Greece's creditors refuse to consider declaring all of this bad debt null and void—not because of anything having to do with Greece, which is small enough to be forgiven much of its bad debt without causing major damage, but because of Spain, Italy and others, which, if similarly forgiven, would blow up the finances of the entire European Union. Thus, it is rather obvious that Greece is being punished to keep other count
asciilifeform: ries in line... Add to this a double-helping of double standards. The IMF won't lend to Greece because it requires some assurance of repayment; but it will continue to lend to the Ukraine, which is in default and collapsing rapidly, without any such assurances because, you see, the decision is a political one. The European Central Bank no longer accepts Greek bonds as collateral because, you see, it considers them to be junk;
asciilifeform: but it will continue to suck in all sorts of other financial garbage and use it to spew forth Euros without comment, keeping other European countries on financial life support simply because they aren't Greece.'
asciilifeform: ( http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2015/07/financial-nonsense-overload.html )
assbot: ClubOrlov: Financial Nonsense Overload ... ( http://bit.ly/1gnSkEf )
decimation: http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2015/07/08/report-big-job-cuts-expected-microsoft/29853657/ "Microsoft's deal to acquire Nokia's handset business in 2013 -- one of the last acts of outgoing CEO Steve Ballmer -- has been a "head-scratcher" from the beginning, says FBR Capital Markets analyst Daniel Ives."
assbot: Microsoft cutting up to 7,800 jobs ... ( http://bit.ly/1gnTuzw )
asciilifeform: decimation: just how many people does the redmond beast need to collect winblowz rent and craft 'bugs' ?
asciilifeform: i doubt they need as many as 700
funkenstein_: masked gunman to clerk: "I'm here to keep you on financial life support"
asciilifeform: !b 1 ✂︎
assbot: Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/20MK5PF.txt )
mats: http://www.fpgarelated.com/showarticle/790.php
assbot: Homebrew CPUs: Messing around with a J1 - Victor Yurkovsky ... ( http://bit.ly/1gnUJir )
asciilifeform: mats: i remember that one - pretty neat! http://www.excamera.com/sphinx/fpga-j1.html << original www of it
assbot: The J1 Forth CPU — excamera ... ( http://bit.ly/1gnUVOA )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 76353 @ 0.00057177 = 43.6564 BTC [+] {3}
jurov: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 273.09, Best ask: 273.16, Bid-ask spread: 0.07000, Last trade: 273.08, 24 hour volume: 28460.65127183, 24 hour low: 263.0, 24 hour high: 274.11, 24 hour vwap: None
decimation: that forth cpu seems similar to that 'picolisp' cpu
mats: o lawd
mats: the end is nigh
funkenstein_: http://pastebin.com/EdtwCsw1 <-- just for fun i made signed 250kb TX sending 11 millies from "cat" spam address to thebitcoin.foundation treasury
assbot: 01000000fdb40402806ffd51e0b01cc9254067cd12878c9b5869d7ee30a56843c9e16590fea57b02 - Pastebin.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1NSGH3p )
funkenstein_: but i was unable to broadcast
danielpbarron: apparently transactions larger than some magic number cannot even get relayed by nodes, and only a miner can forcibly include it in a block
jurov: mircea hit that with bitbet payouts, there's vitriolic trilema piece somewhere
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: i was more imagining each planet having it's own blockchain, but I guess that's
jurov: danielpbarron: you tried to feed it to ?
mod6: thestringpuller: if they did, it'd be an altcoin aka; marscoin, uranuscoin etc
thestringpuller: mod6: lol ur-anus-coin
thestringpuller: hue hue
mod6: =]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform why would they fire anyone ?
mircea_popescu: they're lucky anyone at all wants to work for them as it is. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193020 << sure, this is a fact. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 05:09:39; asciilifeform: early cannoneers accepted double-digit chances of being blown up by own barrel
shinohai: heh: http://www.cnbc.com/id/102806720
danielpbarron: jurov> danielpbarron: you tried to feed it to << is it possible? when I type 'bitcoind help' I do not see the "send raw signed transaction" command
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193059 << myeah. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 05:19:44; asciilifeform: it is not.
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron iirc asciilifeform made a patch
mircea_popescu: o nm that was fpr whole blocks
jurov: maybe i'm mistaken, i thought it was alwas possible to submit tx
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193066 << i would not bet on that. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 05:21:24; decimation: ionosphere will relay for free, cannot be pwned by usg
mircea_popescu: nah jurov i recall people using their own tools for that throughout
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193079 << miners have no identity. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 05:24:07; asciilifeform: after the current set gets ddt sprayed on them
mircea_popescu: they are the exact equivalent of materiel. the humvees the usg lost to isis work for isis just as well.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193083 << this is rank nonsense. to be money it will have to handle time. ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 05:26:05; asciilifeform: i'm more partial to cryptocurrency that doesn't rely on clocks.
danielpbarron: > bitcoind: Argument list too long << my 0.7.2 node didn't like it
mircea_popescu: what you're saying is basically "i'm more interested in food that doesn't rely on being digested"
danielpbarron: i don't think it's even checking the validity of the tx, and is instead rejecting the hex string as being too long; I can get my 0.5.3 node to give the same error and it doesn't recognize the method
mircea_popescu: lol 0.7 implemented tx manipulation that doesn't work on 1mb sized txn ?
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193153 << better than the queen gets. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 09:00:25; cazalla: good logs, good meal, no good wine to go with it but 2/3 ain't bad eh
jurov: danielpbarron i tried electrum, it parsed tx properly
jurov: but broadcast error: {u'message': u'64: tx-size', u'code': -26}
williamdunne: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193046 << nah, I wasn't the one being asphyxiated, and the marks are not the result of it ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 05:16:27; ben_vulpes: * williamdunne currently has a neck that looks like Cheetah fur, lovely patterned bruising << furries, asphyxiation...
gabriel_laddel: it's okay, no one here will judge you :p
williamdunne pondering on confessing to my skat fetish
gabriel_laddel: ;; ud skat
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=skat | skat. taking a shit in someones mouth and having them eat it. I love getting a big load of skat in my mouth its so good. by skat eater September 20, 2003. 419 333.
mircea_popescu: o.o
mircea_popescu: ;;google scatman
gribble: THE SCATMAN - Scatman John HD1080p - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6oXW_YiV6g>; Scatman (ski-ba-bop-ba-dop-bop) Official Video HD -Scatman John ...: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hy8kmNEo1i8>; Scatman John - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scatman_John>
williamdunne: http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/07/us-usa-crime-childporn-idUSKCN0PH24C20150707
assbot: FBI seized child porn website with 215,000 users: court filing| Reuters ... ( http://bit.ly/1IJsTYO )
williamdunne: North
williamdunne: Carolina
williamdunne: Server
gabriel_laddel: what are cat cables and how do I network computers together without a web browser.
williamdunne: You've got to connect the CAT 3 BSD cable into your Universal Parallel Networking port and install the latest ApacheBSD drivers, and then BGP route your HardDrive into the global local network, repeating these steps for each computer on the network. And once this is complete you plug cables into each of your available body holes and pray for IP issuance, prior to jamming each cable into your nearest USB hub
jurov: that reads like eulora recipes
gabriel_laddel: oh, sorry, I should have made it clear I was referring to the child pornography thing
williamdunne: jurov: Well, I'm employable
gernika: mod6 I've attempted syncing on OpenBSD again and am now past block 168000 and have reached 185126. It's going very very slowly though.
gabriel_laddel: !up _biO_
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27100 @ 0.00057258 = 15.5169 BTC [+]
ben_vulpes: buenos dias
gabriel_laddel: hola
gabriel_laddel: como estas?
ben_vulpes: muy bien
ben_vulpes: ¿y tu, comrade? ☟︎
gabriel_laddel: fenomenal
ben_vulpes: ¿de veras? ¿porque?
mircea_popescu: companero ? compadre ?
ben_vulpes: 'twas a sovietism
gabriel_laddel: Aterricé un trabajo
gabriel_laddel: writing CL + mcclim
mircea_popescu: the sovietism is tovarash
gabriel_laddel: go me
ben_vulpes: oh fuck you srsly
mircea_popescu: the world is not my fault!
ben_vulpes: not you, gabriel_laddel
mircea_popescu: olol
ben_vulpes: gabriel_laddel: let me tell you of the salt mines of my homeworld...
mod6: <+gernika> mod6 I've attempted syncing on OpenBSD again and am now past block 168000 and have reached 185126. It's going very very slowly though. << good to hear though ☟︎
gabriel_laddel: ben_vulpes: go on ahead
ben_vulpes: there is a SaaS that handles users for people who for whatever reason don't want to stand up their own services and servers.
ben_vulpes: developers working with this service can alter its behavior by providing it 'node' code that it executes on login/registration events
ben_vulpes: their sandbox provides precisely one map of dummy data.
ben_vulpes: it is not configurable in any way.
ben_vulpes: the suggested way to cram code into their orifices is by pasting it into text fields.
ben_vulpes: one can configure post-commit hooks in git, but their logic importer a) only works with github and b) only works with public repositories.
gabriel_laddel: ...
ben_vulpes: now on one hand that this thing doesn't give programmers any handles to alter test data is fine, in that it forces one to either work in a js repl or you know /actually write tests/
ben_vulpes: otoh
ben_vulpes: braindamage.
ben_vulpes: anyways i don't believe you nobody gets paid to write common lisp lalala i can't hear you
gabriel_laddel: I suggest you don't contemplate the loper device.
gabriel_laddel: it might be a danger to your health
ben_vulpes: you say that as though there were an option.
jurov: i daresay loper machine depends on solved halting problem ☟︎
mod6: 359k+
gabriel_laddel: jurov: how so?
gabriel_laddel: jurov: the routing can't be that difficult
jurov: it's supposed to predict resources exhaustion at any time so that operator can be alerted
gabriel_laddel: jurov: No it isn't. It just eats all required resources and (maybe) returns.
gabriel_laddel: (I think)
gabriel_laddel: What happens if I (loop while t do ...) on a von n. arch? it just runs forever. Same thing.
gabriel_laddel: Don't do that.
gabriel_laddel: Now, I think the "language constructs" map directly to routing logic, so the AST "unrolls" onto the hardware
gabriel_laddel: but I've not sat down to work it out
williamdunne: Lol
williamdunne: One of the "lizardsquad" guys just got charged with 50,700 offences
jurov: if i learned anything from my haskell stint, it's how computer is utterly bad to manage its memory and other resources
jurov: even if you specify in most precise detail how to do stuff without side effects, you still have to hold its hand in order to not exhaust the memory
mircea_popescu: <jurov> it's supposed to predict resources exhaustion at any time so that operator can be alerted << in principle machine does not have to proceed before it wants to.
mircea_popescu: i am sure gabriel_laddel proposed "don't do that" won' cut it with alf - but i am also sure a "sometimes warn before" behaviour would be acceptable.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 7 @ 0.157 = 1.099 BTC [-] {2}
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193223 << there are not so many of these. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 15:44:41; mircea_popescu: they're lucky anyone at all wants to work for them as it is.
mircea_popescu: ahahaha wut ?
mircea_popescu: dude get out, they're the website of 2015. every two bit 20something schmuck with two friends and a girlfriend has started one, last year.
ascii_field: places for folks to write malware and get serious clean money for it
mircea_popescu: there is at least one million of them. i have stopped even trying to count past 100k last year.
ascii_field: SERIOUS money
mircea_popescu: get out
mircea_popescu: they never saw even a decent salary.
ascii_field: not 'work 12 hours to make min wage while you sleep'
mircea_popescu: this recently raped one made less than gawker.
ascii_field: cut how many ways ?
ascii_field: (i assume the truth lies somewhere in those 500 GB...)
mircea_popescu: the boys made slightly more than they'd have made working for gawker, on the grounds that they're asocial weirdos.
mircea_popescu: the girls made about the same.
ascii_field: there were girls ?!!
mircea_popescu: we're not talking enough to be middle class here.
mircea_popescu: yes.
ascii_field: where ?
mircea_popescu: guy's gf.
ascii_field: didn't see any obvious ones in the 'git' login config
mircea_popescu: right.
mircea_popescu: someone did the accounting and the sucking sudanese cock you know.
ascii_field: aha
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 9 @ 0.157 = 1.413 BTC [-] {2}
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193239 << 'handle time' != 'use customary electronic clocks' ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 15:53:13; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193083 << this is rank nonsense. to be money it will have to handle time.
mircea_popescu: granted
mircea_popescu: but you're not taking time out of it.
ascii_field: time is in.
mircea_popescu: aite.
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193275 << compadre ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 16:32:33; ben_vulpes: ¿y tu, comrade?
ascii_field buys ben_vulpes dictionary
mircea_popescu: anyway, this is what powers my disinterest in the matter. i saw in logs this pov is divergent with teh republic, so i'll entertain the alternative viewpoint, but just for the sake of records.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: which ?
scoopbot_revived: The situation of Greece http://trilema.com/2015/the-situation-of-greece/
mircea_popescu: ascii_field re the "yet another bedroom derpitude" thread just before.
ascii_field: the clocks?
ascii_field: 'hackteam' ?
ascii_field: which derpitude ?
ascii_field: jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193305 << if at some point i proposed a thing that requires 'solved halting problem' please say! ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 16:45:07; jurov: i daresay loper machine depends on solved halting problem
mircea_popescu: hackteam ☟︎
mircea_popescu: o look at teh nyse btw.
ascii_field: http://www.cnbc.com/id/102806720 << lulz
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Hh3uAu )
ascii_field: Run Moar Winblowz!!!
mod6: trades haulted, no suprise there.
mod6: *halted
williamdunne: I wonder if any sysadmins are gonna jump out of some windows
mod6: next, like .cn, selling banned
mircea_popescu: mod6 "our free market is this thing you can only buy!!1" ☟︎☟︎☟︎☟︎☟︎☟︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: bwahaha
mircea_popescu: and this is somehow ~not a scam~
mod6: right
mircea_popescu: then they want to "regulate" biutcoin
mircea_popescu: make it more like the fiat ponzi system
mircea_popescu: the gall.
mod6: srsly.
gabriel_laddel: !b 10 ✂︎
assbot: Last 10 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3263M1Y.txt )
ascii_field: i fully expected this after hearing the cn thing
decimation: they totally know it's not a 'cyber attack'
mircea_popescu: anyway, they had no choice.
mircea_popescu: chinese decided to unwind
ascii_field: raise yer hand if you thought ft meade would leave nyse switched on
mircea_popescu: nah was not possibru.
decimation: ft meade does what wall st wants, not vice versa
mircea_popescu: really a distinction without a difference
davout: so i'm trying to build the stator, getting "headers.h:21:27: fatal error: openssl/ecdsa.h: No such file or directory"
mircea_popescu: does liver do what spleen wants or spleen, liver
williamdunne: Chinese dumping US stocks now, I'm presuming. Need to pump some filthy fiat into their own markets
ascii_field: davout: your openssl did not build
ascii_field: davout: did you have the tarballs in place ?
mircea_popescu: also make sure you build the right one
ascii_field: there is a MANIFEST
davout: i have openssl-1.0.1g.tar.gz in distfiles
decimation: check the hashes plus sigs
mircea_popescu: that one yea
davout: (using mod6's build script)
ascii_field: ^^^^ ~that~'s why doesn't work
ascii_field: his scripts never worked for me
mod6: you need to use "stator.sh" that comes with the stator tarball
decimation: you probably have the 'realpath' issue
decimation: which is because debian is fucktarded
mod6: this too ^^
davout: ok, i'll do this, thank yall!
mircea_popescu: a could be
mod6: davout: what os?
davout: gentoo
mircea_popescu: tech support at its best is keeping a list of who's fucktarded.
mod6: yeah, that auto.sh has problems there.
mircea_popescu: sad state of affairs.
ascii_field: davout: for now, skip the auto.sh and use my scripts
ascii_field: very short and simple to grasp
ascii_field: and pretty much guaranteed to work on gentoo
decimation: just be sure to check the distfile hashes
mircea_popescu: in other news, http://33.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lzevzzvPKk1rovqsto1_500.gif
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CoVT6S )
decimation: don't grab the wrong ones
ascii_field: aha. this is not automated in mine
davout: ok
davout: where's the stator tarball?
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: brilliant. ought to be installed in every american gym
williamdunne: mircea_popescu: For some reason she looks like a giant
mod6: davout: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-June/000102.html
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CoW4z5 )
mircea_popescu: low camera williamdunne
williamdunne was a terrible art student
williamdunne: mircea_popescu: you're right
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: let's have the finale of http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193367 ? ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 17:07:03; mircea_popescu: hackteam
mircea_popescu: generally the difference between advertising set and porn set is that porn set cameras all set crotch height
mircea_popescu: ascii_field what's more to say ?
mod6: grab those, verify, unpack; beware that you need to drop openssl/bdb/boost in distfiles by hand. and ascii_field's script doesn't want boost.tar.gz, wants boost.tar.bz
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: no, it isn't 'greatest leak ever' - but certainly the most complete gutting of a usg contractor in history
mod6: follow this: http://thebitcoin.foundation/misc/stator-buildlog-wDumpBlockAndEatBlockApplied.txt
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1FYJMZi )
ascii_field: everything but the ashtray
mircea_popescu: no argument.
mircea_popescu: you will notice it is not actually a usg contractor. it's a sudanese contractor.
williamdunne: These "decentralize all the things" fuckwads are really pissing me off re: NYSE
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: usg was a major client
mircea_popescu: the difference between this and an "etsy shop" is color scheme.
ascii_field: and of course it was the крыша
mircea_popescu: i dunno, seems more like it was a major alleged client.
ascii_field: picture what would happen if ~i~ tried to open a 'hackteam'
mircea_popescu: dunno how much you know about how teenaged girls suck cock these days
mircea_popescu: but the way it goes, they pretend to be selling to X so Y may buy
ascii_field: about as much as i know of penguins
mircea_popescu: ascii_field nobody would even notice.
mircea_popescu: it's all in your head.
mircea_popescu: i bet half of your coworkers are "secretly" part of one.
mircea_popescu: it truely is the band of 2015.
ascii_field: l0l
mircea_popescu: i kid you not. but i do not expect anyone to take this on faith.
ascii_field: fact is, monetizing virii requires a крыша
mircea_popescu: dude...
ascii_field: no srsly
ascii_field: unlike penguin and gurlz, i know this from direct observation
mircea_popescu: are you even from this planet at ALL ? do you know how much can be passed off as work before even as much as touching a tool ?
williamdunne: mircea_popescu: Some are pretty enthusiastic about it
mircea_popescu: yes, playing in a band requires a guitar.
mircea_popescu: so ? got any sticks ?
ascii_field: music with no ears.
mircea_popescu: every kid in a barage gand in 1955 had ear ?
mircea_popescu: what ear. they're americans.
ascii_field: anybody can write turdware, yes
ascii_field: i am speaking of ~money~
mircea_popescu: also all in your head.
williamdunne: https://twitter.com/cgledhill/status/618830161144901632
williamdunne: People must care because SJWs signed a petition, wao
mircea_popescu: these particular kids would have made more scamming in eve
mircea_popescu: but hey.
williamdunne: #1 fintech influencer supposedly
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: from what i can tell, the 'hackteam' folks were paid hundreds of thousands of euros to do things that i consider a weekend's work
ascii_field: this is called 'crown concession'
mircea_popescu: start one then.
ascii_field: l0l
mircea_popescu: all you need is the girlie to suck sudan cock.
mircea_popescu: ask on craigslist
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=02-02-2015#1002367 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 02-02-2015 07:04:28; asciilifeform: dude really, it is very easy to fly. just bend your arms into an effective lift surface, right angle of attack, and fart really hard.
mircea_popescu: ask.on.craigslist.
ascii_field utterly fails to grasp what mircea_popescu is speaking of
mircea_popescu: say "Very gifted reverse engineer, looking for outgoing, persuasive, experienced slut to start hackteam together. You'll have to suck bureaucrat cock to get us contracts, I'll fill them, we split the loot."
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: guess where i'm posting from
ascii_field: it doesn't work unless you have access to the right cock
mircea_popescu: the congress library
ascii_field: and we - thus far - don't.
mircea_popescu: eh get outta here.
ascii_field: srsly
mircea_popescu: that's HER job.
ascii_field: despite, for instance, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=25-06-2015#1175261 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 25-06-2015 03:01:25; asciilifeform: i built it.
mircea_popescu: pack her off to whatever, sierra leone
ascii_field: we don't have any gurlz though
mircea_popescu: sucks to be us.
thestringpuller: i think the network just forked again
ascii_field: thing i'm beginning to suspect is that nobody gives half a shit about reversing, or 'security', or any of it
ascii_field: but only launders usg money
ascii_field: with pre-selected butt buddies
gabriel_laddel: ^
mircea_popescu: the first part is right.
ascii_field: ph0rk!
mircea_popescu: mmyeah.
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
mircea_popescu: and ima go play eulora in celebration.
ascii_field: unph0rk3d ?
ascii_field: aaaand https://blockchain.info/block/0000000000000000024d5e8b9010d61d93550bfd022a5d8f613f7daa620456f8 l0l
assbot: Bitcoin Block #364437 ... ( http://bit.ly/1Cp22jF )
williamdunne: It's okay guyz, NYSE is turning itself off and on again
jurov: nyse mining bitcoins?
williamdunne: Yeah, they've got some celerons on the job
gabriel_laddel: !up ascii_field
gabriel_laddel: http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/
assbot: Project IceStorm ... ( http://bit.ly/1BKXug8 )
gabriel_laddel: ^ some people reverse engineered an fpga's bitstream format
gabriel_laddel: *a fpga...
ascii_field: 'We have enough bits mapped that we can create a functional verilog model for almost all bitstreams generated by Lattice iCEcube2 for the iCE40 HX1K-TQ144, as long as no block memories or PLLs are used. ' << wake me up when that last part changes. and when i can get this chip from ten different chinese foundries.
ascii_field: this all happened before, with xilinx
ascii_field: and we know how it ends.
ascii_field: 'Next on the TODO list: PLLs, Timing Analysis...' << ahahahahahaha
ascii_field: try synthesizing ~anything~ of any serious complexity without exact timing data for ~every piece of shit on the die~
ascii_field: i gotta take my hat off to these folks for sheer effort, but the fact remains that they are scooping out the sea with the proverbial thimble.
gabriel_laddel: To any "hackers" reading the logs - rather than going after hackteam, try xilinx, lattice semiconductor next time?
ascii_field: ('how it ends,' for the uninitiated, is that some time around when these fine folks are about half done, the chip will go out of print. and be replaced by an entirely incompatible one.)
ascii_field: gabriel_laddel: this doesn't help either. no one can force them to keep making the 'doxxed' chip. ☟︎
ascii_field: a 'doxxed' fpga is entirely useless if you can't get it!
gabriel_laddel: ascii_field: imho this is going to be a slow process of ad-hoc reverse engineering of a design, finding chiacom manufactures...
ascii_field: it is, after all, a physical object.
gabriel_laddel: someone needs to carry the water.
ascii_field: gabriel_laddel: there is no mass market for these.
ascii_field: we had this thread before.
gabriel_laddel: !s bribery
assbot: 9 results for 'bribery' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=bribery
ascii_field: not bribery as such, just that you'd have to pay the fab up front, cash on the barrel
ascii_field: to have any made.
ascii_field: not a bribe, but straightforward commerce
ascii_field: gabriel_laddel: another detail that must be understood is that reversing for the purpose of programming is a very different animal from reversing for the purpose of rebuilding.
ascii_field: in the case of the latter, it is necessary to have a ~complete~ picture of the vital organs
ascii_field: including aspects that a programmer doesn't give a flying fuck about, like chemistry
ascii_field: and in-circuit testing
gabriel_laddel: Unrelated: Uncle Al's disqus profile. It is a treat. https://disqus.com/by/Xemist/
assbot: Disqus Profile - Xemist ... ( http://bit.ly/1Cp6BdM )
ascii_field: gabriel_laddel: good to see that he's still kicking, somewhere
gabriel_laddel: Orange County iirc?
ascii_field: gabriel_laddel: i suspected he might have 'went perelman'
williamdunne: gabriel_laddel: About 12 months ago I was tasked with checking the security of a fiat institution. Within three hours I had found two different bugs to send money from accounts that weren't mine, and two different bugs to view all account details that weren't mine, and another to see all transaction details that weren't mine.
gabriel_laddel: williamdunne: !
williamdunne: IKR, the operator was a friend of mine, but he was very concerned when I sent him the details for a large transaction from themselves to a law firm they employ
gabriel_laddel: Speaking of Uncle Al - not only did the 'gentlemen' at the eot wash group modify their URL scheme so that his links appear "dead", but Stanford has also moved the single link in qz4.html
ascii_field: williamdunne: and that was when he put out your eyes and cut out your tongue ?
ascii_field: gabriel_laddel: big fat surprise
gabriel_laddel: lol check this out
gabriel_laddel: http://www.npl.washington.edu/eotwash/sites/www.npl.washington.edu.eotwash/files/webfiles/publications/pdfs/lowfrontier2.pdf
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Cp7fb7 )
williamdunne: ascii_field: not quite, although I do regret agreeing to do it pro-bono
gabriel_laddel: ^ new url scheme vs.
gabriel_laddel: http://www.npl.washington.edu/eotwash/publications/pdf/lowfrontier2.pdf
assbot: Page not found | The Eöt-Wash Group ... ( http://bit.ly/1Cp7hj7 )
gabriel_laddel: williamdunne: so you're the guy who makes the spice flow?
gabriel_laddel: what exactly do you do?
williamdunne: Hard to pin that one down
gabriel_laddel: doya have a cv or the like?
ascii_field: https://disqus.com/home/discussion/neuroskeptic/the_strange_world_of_8220reward_deficiency_syndrome8221_part_2/#comment-2118094177
assbot: Disqus - The Strange World of &#8220;Reward Deficiency Syndrome&#8221; (Part 2) ... ( http://bit.ly/1TlSFWh )
ascii_field: many lulz
ascii_field: 'Be homicidally depressed and aim at the top. That is like voting, except the count is honest and meaningful.'
gabriel_laddel: ahahaha
williamdunne: I've never received a job by anything but reference. First job when I was 14 was a game programmer, second job when 15 was working at a military intelligence company in London doing some infosec and accounting type stuff. Lots of freelancing stuff
williamdunne: Security, programming, pretty much anything with a keyboard
williamdunne: Recently did some stuff for the BitFinex guys, that wasn't much fun but y'know. Pays for stuff. Think I'll have more with them in future
gabriel_laddel: !up ascii_field
gabriel_laddel: !up NewLiberty
williamdunne: What happened to that German socialist girl, she ever come back to continue her derping? ☟︎
ascii_field: http://polymatharchives.blogspot.in/2015/01/the-inappropriately-excluded.html << l0ltr0n1c
assbot: The Polymath Archives: The Inappropriately Excluded ... ( http://bit.ly/1TlVir1 )
gabriel_laddel: "The antidote to national social and financial collapse is war. War clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of social and economic realities. It rewards the creative, productive, and effective. It reduces redundant populations. North Korea, India, Pakistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia (paid for Paki research, repaid by Paki nukes) stare down some 1000 exceptionally well-crafted and deliverable Israeli thermonukes.
gabriel_laddel: Fukishima effluent on California's coast chews up the food chain to seals. 39 million person California, tremendously government subsidized, is collapsed. Its unsecured debt is the Saudi GNP while its $45 billion/year agriculture Central Valley has returned to desert, unemploying a million Mexican slaves with nowhere to go. Let's run the Battle of the Somme again, and soon. The jet stream dips south in autumn." (fr
gabriel_laddel: om Uncle Al)
trinque: war doesn't really reduce redundant population
trinque: bounces right back after the war, if there's a dip at all
mats: uh
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: 'If you want to end ISIS, teach it game theory and casebooks. "They['ll] get out their linear programming charts, statistical decision theories, minimax solutions, and compute the price-cost probabilities of their transactions and investments, just like we do," and lose.' (from the al schwartz link earlier) ☟︎
trinque: mats: I am not finding a good graph of the russian population per year, yet I recall ww2 being a temporary blip downward that was rapidly recovered
trinque: and they sustained huge casualties
mats: the specific claim being made is 'redundant populations'
mats: how do we evaluate this claim
trinque: there'd have to be some correlation between an indicator of this redundancy before the war and which soldiers died
trinque: "unskilled laborers died more often than ..." << maybe something like that
ascii_field: '12 years public school, 4 years undergrad, 6 years PhD, 4 years post-doc. You are now over 30, deeply in debt, and starting life. Your idiot high school classmate who held a STOP sign at a construction site has been pulling $80K/year, has a fine home, wife, three kids, and a motor boat. His eldest son rakes in $850K/year tax-free facilitating recreational pharmaceuticals and an escort service.' << schwartz ☟︎
trinque: mats: but then even if the stupid tend to die more often, it could still be so that the stupid back home fuck enough to replenish stocks
mats: ain't social science great
ascii_field: trinque: intelligence doesn't breed true. (stupidity, however, does. this confuses folks)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14900 @ 0.00057258 = 8.5314 BTC [+]
trinque: ascii_field: I don't follow
trinque: ah that intelligence is not necessarily passed down genetically?
trinque: definitely not
trinque: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: trinque: also most folks who idly ponder the subject end up conflating several distinct things under 'intelligence'
ascii_field: far more interesting is the trait hasn eysenck called 'psychoticism' ☟︎☟︎☟︎☟︎
ascii_field: which is the thing without which arbitrarily strong 'intelligence' ends up a chinese exam taker
ascii_field: interestingly, old norse, even, had a very specific word for this trait ☟︎
ascii_field does not have the link with him. if anyone recalls the answer, do chime in
trinque: old norse probably had an honorable term for the thing
trinque: ascii_field: something like the combination of dominance and being a social supernode?
ascii_field: no.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu chronically links the two, but they are entirely independent
ascii_field: one can have one coming out of ears and arse, and lack the other entirely ☟︎
ascii_field: specifically, you can have arbitrarily high 'psychoticism' in the sense of being perelman and no 'dominance' or 'social supernode' to speak of.
trinque: ascii_field: then is it a measure of the willingness to fight other people?
ascii_field: again no
ascii_field: if you must reduce it to a soundbite - it is just a measure of the quality of the rng in your head
ascii_field: nothing to do with relating to other people.
trinque: ascii_field: I am promting you to define the term instead of merely restating it
trinque: I do not follow that definition either
ascii_field: trinque: i am certain that, just like everyone else here, you have met both kinds of 'intelligence'
ascii_field: i.e. 'champion at exams' vs the other kind.
trinque: sure, and the former is deeply embedded in a group concept of what he ought to be doing
trinque: and the latter has his own idea
ascii_field: what makes the exam champ the waste of oxygen that he is ? ☟︎
trinque: general obedience is what I see
jurov: !up jborkl
trinque: ascii_field: by good RNG do you mean that they are capable of novel thoughts?
trinque: rather, that they have a greater capacity for ...
jborkl: The way it has been before, not all nodes have the same amount of txns in mempool - I never got enough of a explanation to discuss it
jborkl: mine has 32000 currently and blockchain has 21000
ascii_field: trinque: capable+inclined
trinque: then yes, I see your point
ascii_field: the 'capable' part is definitely key. who hasn't met his fair share of hack writers, for instance, poor schmucks grasping desperately for one singe original idea? and never finding it ☟︎
jurov: jborkl: maybe different antispam rules
trinque: ascii_field: haha, my former bosses for instance
jborkl: possible, there are a ton of waiting txns either way and the spike has been recently
jborkl: although I have just been watching from the sideline for a long time (not active)
trinque: ascii_field: it would make a great deal of sense to me if there were a connection between this kind of intelligence and personality traits which cause him to have a much lower default level of regard for any particular human off the street.
trinque: if he in fact has the capability, then the empathy which might cause him to accept someone else's perspective instead would only be a hindrance ☟︎
trinque: and if he doesn't, you get http://www.sfmuseum.org/hist1/norton.html
assbot: Norton I, Emperor of the UnitedStates ... ( http://bit.ly/1eGKHYw )
ascii_field: trinque: bad example. norton was popular.
ascii_field: a true social butterfly, even.
trinque: hah oh, my mistake
trinque: maybe someone that secretly collects human skin furniture then
ascii_field: do you collect dead ants ?
ascii_field: or kill ants for sport ?
trinque can see he will never earn the honorific "the Terrible"
ascii_field: true Not Giving A Fuck doesn't have a plus or minus sign. it's just a big fat zero.
trinque: ah
decimation: re: stupid breeding true < I thought 'reversion to the population mean' was the general outcome
ascii_field: aha
ascii_field: and stupidity is perfectly normal
decimation: I suppose tragically stupid parents are likely to have slightly smarter children
decimation: but not many worry about that case
ascii_field: not speaking here of extreme deformities
ascii_field: extra chromosomes, etc
decimation: right
ascii_field: just the factory-standard mind
decimation: but two iq 90 parents are likely to have children that score a little closer to 100
decimation: (for whites in the us)
decimation: who would be lost in the unwashed 1st std deviation anyway
lobbes: !up ascii_field
danielpbarron: ;;later tell mjr_ http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-08-2014#791843 << you can now ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 12-08-2014 00:44:36; mjr_: by the way, anyone gonna tell me if i can play this game where i can buy things with bitcoin?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
decimation: re: political time < it occurred to me that the far more obvious way of synchronizing a clock is to simply take note of the sunrise and/or sunset ☟︎
decimation: in fact, someone who depises 'astronomical time' in favor of cesium time is also fully in favor of 'usg time'
ascii_field: decimation: and if it rains ?
decimation: wait till tomorrow
ascii_field: and if you are in submarine ?
ascii_field: can't wait
ascii_field: you're running a node.
ascii_field: in real time
decimation: actually it would be neat to build a nutrino detector
decimation: in your submarine
ascii_field: afaik there is no useful timing info in solar neutrono flows
ascii_field: *neutrino flow
decimation: you might be able to determine the angle of the sun w.r.t. the earth's surface
ascii_field: and, considering the famous formula ('50/50 interactions when passing through light-year of lead') portable detector is a questionable affair
decimation: sure but you got water everywhere
decimation: although biologics would probably jam your signal
ascii_field: aha
ascii_field: examine the construction of a neutrino observatory.
ascii_field: (typically, abandoned mine filled with salt water and thousands of photomultiplier tubes on the walls, each the size of a man's torso)
decimation: indeed.
ascii_field: anyway, since this thread came back to life, i will point out that mircea_popescu is right re: the notion of time being necessary for a bitcoin net. but it doesn't have to come from a clock as traditionally understood
ascii_field: it just has to be a reasonably-periodic signal that all nodes can see, whose period is not affected by the aggregate hash rate, nor can be manipulated at reasonable expense by gnomes
decimation: perhaps the pogo should come with a sunlight detector
ascii_field: natural phenomena don't fit the bill
ascii_field: not only because they are not reliably detectable (rain, clouds, being in a submarine)
ascii_field: but because can be faked in various 'good enough' ways
ascii_field: and, on the other end, require specialized hardware
decimation: if usg can spam uv over a large area for hours, then you probably have bigger problems than money
ascii_field: decimation: thinking more of hacks like rf detection of sunspot cycle
ascii_field: or schumann's resonance, etc
decimation: yeah. ultimately a thinking person can observe sunrise, sunset, set own clock (calendar might be another matter)
decimation: of course 'set clock' algorithm needs your lat/lon
lobbes: plus, then you are back to 'who sets the clocks' problem
ascii_field: aha
decimation: the sun does.
ascii_field: and what of when you cannot see the sunrise ?
decimation: then you ought to have made preparations
ascii_field: such as ?
decimation: if you have a submarine, you probably ought to have high quality timekeeping equipment
ascii_field: so we're back to clock, then
ascii_field: we already know how to meet and set clocks, last i checked
decimation: you could even use a sundial
ascii_field: on submarine.
decimation: submarine needs clock, yes.
ascii_field: let's try to define the basic puzzle here
ascii_field: two (at minimum) geographically separated people, with enemies in between, wish to agree re: how much time has passed since they last spoke, 2016 blocks ago.
decimation: they don't own clocks and can't see the sunrise and don't know where they are too?
ascii_field: let's suppose they traded pgp keys and can communicate securely. however, they cannot prevent the enemy from delaying messages
ascii_field: or sometimes 'losing' them entirely
decimation: sure.
ascii_field: say they own very poor clocks, which drift by a second - or more - per minute.
decimation: heh ok
ascii_field: (pogo...)
decimation: it's not quite that bad
decimation: but not great, granted
ascii_field: for the sake of argument.
ascii_field: aha
ascii_field: and now compound the problem by supposing that it is not you and your best friend, but you and a network consisting, to an unknown degree, of devils
decimation: devils who reluctantly serve up blocksl
ascii_field: devils who do whatever it takes to camouflage as men
ascii_field: while dishing out max damage
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 92665 @ 0.00057468 = 53.2527 BTC [+] {4}
funkenstein_: consider a node that passes on valid TXs, checks new blocks for proper work and passes them on. it ignores timestamps and lets miners say what current difficulty is. useless or not?
ascii_field: vulnerable to rewinds.
ascii_field: and to other induced forkage.
ascii_field: (will accept blocks that are not, by the traditional bitcoin rules, valid. and predicate acceptance of future blocks on these turds - which is what 'accept a block' means)
ben_vulpes: what is a rewind attack?
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: being fed an alternate past
ascii_field: typically from when mining was considerably 'easier'
ascii_field: but not necessarily
ascii_field: (can be recent past)
ben_vulpes: i'm sure you've gone into this in depth, but doesn't the length of the current main chain make that ludicrously expensive?
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: why would it ?
ascii_field: certain variants of the attack are prohibitively costly, yes
ascii_field: others - no
ben_vulpes: which variants are cheap?
funkenstein_: !up ascii_field
ben_vulpes: aha the one where you simply hold difficulty constant and mine a long-ass chain.
ascii_field: aha
funkenstein_: the chain with the most work demonstrated wins ☟︎
ascii_field: or feeding a whole alternate universe to a virginal (has nothing but genesis) node
decimation: I donno, it strikes me that having a sundial and knowing how to use it (convert to universal time) is a pretty cheap counter
ascii_field: which yes, you can defend against with crude kludges like storing sums, but this is 'enumerated badness'
ben_vulpes: decimation: but then people would have to touch it !!111twelve1
ascii_field: decimation: now you have a human slave in the loop
ascii_field: straight to 'slavecoin'
ascii_field: don't even need a computer.
decimation: yeah, slave tells you time of day
ascii_field: and hashes with goose feather pen
ascii_field: as described in mircea_popescu's tale
decimation: well, if slave tells you time of day, the class of attacks you describe become much more difficult
ascii_field: except that the attacks now include having one's throat cut at night, aha
ascii_field: at any rate, we don't actually know how to do 'proof of work' thing using meat.
ascii_field: if we did, 'hawala' would have used it 2000 y ago.
decimation: yes, true.
ascii_field: in my mind, that's sorta the whole point of bitcoin.
ben_vulpes: (unrelatedly: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/15/opinion/15pubed.html?_r=1)
assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1D1BLmt )
ben_vulpes: (on the use of "torture" in the nyt)
decimation: why does the fact that your throat can be cut invalidate proof of work?
ascii_field: it doesn't
ascii_field: separate problems.
shinohai: I should say having one's throat cut invalidates a lot of things.
decimation: not for me
decimation: (your throat i mean)
ascii_field: the unfortunate thing is that the 'easy to verify, hard to produce' thing very much requires machines.
decimation: at any rate, I fully admit that bitcoin requires slaves to feed computers the right data and configure them
decimation wonders if skynet will need an 'economy' or will just directly solve the 'need things/have things' trade matrix
bagels7: i'll be your slave for a million dollars on a 5 year basis ☟︎
ascii_field: decimation: do you know the story of how the concept of 'space station' came about?
decimation: not precisely no
ascii_field: well, afaik the 'precise' is not publicly known. but the ancient rumour that was taught to me was that it was a usg military propaganda trick
ascii_field: see, somebody's gotta change the vacuum tubes
ascii_field: in spy satellites.
ascii_field: except when they don't. then, suddenly, much less talk of space stations
decimation: yeah, that's true I think. the soviets believed it anyway https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almaz
assbot: Almaz - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1RlbOKo )
decimation: su actually built 'manned spy satellites' - became 'civilian peace stations' in the 80's
ascii_field: aha.
ascii_field: just as usg turned their orbital nuke dropper into 'space shuttle'
decimation: but I do see your point, if we can make the hardware 'reliable'
ascii_field: a pogo, as i envision it, has much in common with a comm satellite
shinohai: Is there a history of the pogo somewhere?
ascii_field: shinohai: of the pogo as it comes from the vendor ?
ascii_field: or of our particular dealings with it
shinohai: Of your particular dealings. How the idea of using it came about.
shinohai: I was just curious.
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=02-07-2015#1184297 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 02-07-2015 17:52:19; ascii_field: shinohai: it all started with http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=22-01-2015#988286
ascii_field: mircea_popescu posed the question of what is the cheapest mass-produced piece of equipment that could be pressed into service to run therealbitcoin.
ascii_field: the answer turned out to be pogo.
ascii_field: by a factor of 6 or so.
ascii_field: mainly because it is (or rather was) sold far below cost by the manufacturer
ascii_field: who was pushing a weirdo 'cloud subscription' thing with it
shinohai: I am fascinated by how mircea_popescu envisioned that. I tried for well over a year to figure out how to busybox it.
shinohai: And failed.
ascii_field: shinohai: he didn't
ascii_field: just asked the question.
ascii_field: i answered it, experimentally
ascii_field: ported netbsd to the thing, too
ascii_field: which turned out to be a waste of time
ascii_field: (certain necessaries did not work correctly)
shinohai: I was hoping my pogo would arrive today, but postman has already come. :/
ascii_field: shinohai: most of what i've done re: therealbitcoin so far revolves around getting memory footprint under control
ascii_field: shinohai: pogo has 128M of ram, soldered on.
shinohai: And it is fantastic work, imho. My shell provider doesn't bitch at me about bandwidth anymore either.
ascii_field: um
williamdunne: Wait, people are successful at running bitcoin on summin with 128m of ram?
williamdunne: Wao
ascii_field: everything i did only ~increases~ bandwidth consumption
ascii_field: williamdunne: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-July/000107.html
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Rld7c9 )
ascii_field: williamdunne: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/attachments/20150701/rss_d1746f76523316edcdc82326213f8953bf6f0d09.png
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1RldaVB )
shinohai: For some reason mine has dropped, but probably because I'm not connecting to a bzillion nodes
ascii_field: (this was a node, i must remind the reader, with no mempool, on account of having no net connection and being fed blocks 'intravenously' if you will)
ascii_field: vertical axis is in kB
ascii_field: the thing here, as discussed in the past, is that 300 bytes (block header and overhead) are kept in ram at all times per ~known block~
ascii_field: now if the node is 'live' and has net connection, hears tx, suffers possible fragging (see old threads) - then even more consumption.
ascii_field: but what you see in that graph is the only 'leak' in the usual sense
ascii_field: as in, the one thing that is guaranteed to grow monotonically
ascii_field: https://blockchain.info/block/00000000000000000cf530b3346a39156f56eb9259e5d7fd97a6e9168ffaf91e << l0l
assbot: Bitcoin Block #364463 ... ( http://bit.ly/1RldQKx )
shinohai: test
shinohai: !up ascii_field
ascii_field: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3clbk6/bitcoin_xt_status_update/cswlmk4 << l0l
assbot: HostFat comments on Bitcoin XT Status Update ... ( http://bit.ly/1Rle4kR )
ascii_field: 'As you may have noticed, Bitcoin unfortunately has run out of capacity due to someone DoS attacking the network.'
ascii_field: 'run out'
ascii_field: 'someone'
ascii_field: 'bigger blocks'
ascii_field: (hearn, of course)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14762 @ 0.00056898 = 8.3993 BTC [-]
trinque: "I suspect it can be mitigated through heavier reliance on coin age priority, as coin age is not something that can be trivially bought on the spot, unlike fee priority."
trinque: same idiot argument re: spam as Luke-Jr
ascii_field: ^
ascii_field: though gotta wonder if this is still fair to say re: a gigantic sack of shit with the words 'this is spam, and fuck you' printed right on it
ascii_field: (the tx sent to brainwallet('password') etc)
trinque: sure, one can imagine some sane criteria on determining spamitude
ascii_field: but aside from that, bidding up space in blocks by blowing one's own coin is a perfectly legit thing to do
ascii_field: as per the protocol rules
trinque: it's telling that they are not even willing to consider using, you know, a fucking market for this ☟︎
ascii_field: if usg wants to spend its coin this way, it can
mats: its an ideological matter to hear Luke-Jr tell it
ascii_field: as i pointed out before, it is being done for two disjoint reasons. one is so that hearn can write the turd linked above, re: 'it is crowded and we need blocks of $maxint size'
ascii_field: the other is so that gavin & co. can try to persuade miners to use their turdball ☟︎
mats: 'i dun wanna hold gigs of "spam" on my drive, and nobody else does either'
ascii_field: by promising 'tx fee ordering' as a feature
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193852 << the fucking market is there. nobody broke it. but to redditards, 'market won't supply me with free shit' == 'market has failed' ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 21:12:24; trinque: it's telling that they are not even willing to consider using, you know, a fucking market for this
trinque: right, I said this yesterday
trinque: stress test seems to prove the system works from where I sit
ascii_field: trinque: not if you ask the tards
ascii_field: for them, 'it broke'
ascii_field: because they can't send their 0.01 btc without fee
mod6: 'don't be poor'
ascii_field: one telling mark of a tard is that he is unwilling to consider that market's job is not only to supply folks with things, but to REFUSE to supply them ☟︎☟︎
ascii_field: when they cannot pay
shinohai: my tunnel collapsed
shinohai: sorry for the flood
trinque: ascii_field: reminds me of mircea_popescu's recent comments to the effect of roughly "We've done it! I exist!"
trinque: cannot think of a more vulgar mentality
ascii_field: l0l wut
trinque: the redditard mentality
trinque: that the fact of their pulse is by itself something special and important
mats: we're all equals, man
mats: we must has equal outcomes or else fascism
ascii_field: https://blockchain.info/block/00000000000000000dd2101c3f08f3e4ad16f90c37a2780f5012358c18371642
assbot: Bitcoin Block #364467 ... ( http://bit.ly/1RlfOdZ )
thestringpuller: ascii_field: so what's the problem here?
thestringpuller: we get fee market. fuck the people who can't pay for their nice things
thestringpuller: get a fucking job already
asciilifeform: !up ascii_field
thestringpuller: stop complaining about "waah my transactions is unconfirmed waaaah"
BingoBoingo just switched own nodes to 0.001 min fee for transaction relay
ascii_field: thestringpuller: ask'em
shinohai likes how BingoBoingo thinks.
ascii_field: thestringpuller: i'm not even certain that the 'ocean of complaint' consists of real people
ascii_field: rather than philippino meat puppets for-hire
BingoBoingo: Impact of my relay policy change on the network will be near nil, but policy is policy
funkenstein_: meanwhile litecoin users enjoying "stress test" popcorn
funkenstein_: i've never understood the philippino references i see here
ascii_field: funkenstein_: it's in the log
thestringpuller: !s philippino
assbot: 1 results for 'philippino' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=philippino
shinohai: !s philippino meat puppets for-hire
assbot: 0 results for 'philippino meat puppets for-hire' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=philippino+meat+puppets+for-hire
thestringpuller: !s phillipino
assbot: 2 results for 'phillipino' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=phillipino
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=02-02-2015#1003223 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 02-02-2015 23:04:03; mircea_popescu: it was highlighted by intel about two weeks ago, and we're generally tracing it to philippines "top quality" content farms working for a number of (mostly ct and wash based) pr firms.
ascii_field: ^
fluffypony: itt: nobody can spell phillllippppinnnnooooo
shinohai: i copy-pasta'd xD
ascii_field: see whole thread
ascii_field: particularly, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=02-02-2015#1003221 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 02-02-2015 23:03:08; mircea_popescu: "I've noticed certain repeating characteristic in the writing of many members of this forum: they construct grammatically correct sentences but absolutely disregard the underlying semantics: incoming vs. outgoing, local vs. remote, source vs. destination, etc. Here in regards to TCP/IP ports, but I observed that in regards to pretty much any technical issue."
williamdunne: WTF
williamdunne: It starts with an F? What's this shit
williamdunne: filipino
trinque: who gives a shit about arbitrary distinctions such as that?
trinque: only asciilifeform's test takers
trinque: and players of dwarf fortress
funkenstein_: bad spellers of the world: untie!
williamdunne: Sorta like how dyslexic is probably pretty hard to spell if you're dyslexic
trinque: brings to mind http://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/jokes/european-commission.html
assbot: Jokes - European Commission ... ( http://bit.ly/1RlhwMq )
williamdunne: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-07-08/greece-illustrates-150-years-socialist-failure-europe
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1RlhKmF )
BingoBoingo is guessing that at some point Rubidium standards are going to become #b-a coture
BingoBoingo: Apparently Microshit is copying MP nao http://www.openbsdfoundation.org/contributors.html
assbot: Donate to the OpenBSD Foundation ... ( http://bit.ly/1Hi3NLe )
decimation: BingoBoingo: actually high quality ovenized quartz can be nearly as good as rubidium
BingoBoingo: Suffers labeling issues though. Hard to tell buy ordering if you get actual part or Chicom turd
decimation: not if you are willing to pay $$$
decimation: here's a reasonable text on celestial navigation http://www2.arnes.si/~gljsentvid10/page2.htm
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1KPIZ4W )
decimation: there is a description on how to derive time by measuring the moon's motion relative to other objects in the sky
decimation: actually better link to the book here http://www.celnav.de/page2.htm
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Hi8RPQ )
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: the fixation on physical clocks, astronomical magic, etc. is unproductive re: the original problem posed.
asciilifeform: (though by no means useless in general)
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Nah, for different, later problems
asciilifeform: we, afaik, do not have those problems yet. must still graduate to them.
BingoBoingo: At somepoint though we will have the problem on when to start decelerating the starship lest we crashland into Alpha Centurai
asciilifeform: right now we have the very different problem of how not to drown in own shit.
BingoBoingo: And the way to not drown might just be space ship
BingoBoingo: Or Space shit
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: if you have a tip re: how to make perfectly synchronized with one another rubidium clocks materialize in the existing $20 pogos, i'm all ears..
BingoBoingo: No idea about that.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: might wanna read that thread, it's pretty lulzy
asciilifeform: it's where i describe how bitcoin is not actually decentralized at all, but depends on a thoroughly usgificated network of political clocks
decimation: ^ clocks that could be, but probably are not, checked for accuracy
BingoBoingo: I read the thread. closest I have to solutions are either Noping ft. meade off the earth into the sun or Noping out and taking stator to ALpha Centurai
BingoBoingo: But I dunno. Maybe at some point radio hashes happens.
BingoBoingo: Disguise the signal as over the horizon radar
BingoBoingo: And at that point why not have competing political time broadcast on that signal, signed
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it doesn't acvtually depend on it.
mircea_popescu: owner of node may choose to depend on it ☟︎
mircea_popescu: otherwise, nothing keeps you from keeping your own time. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193532 << no one can force them to know it was doxxed, either. ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 18:06:08; ascii_field: gabriel_laddel: this doesn't help either. no one can force them to keep making the 'doxxed' chip.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193580 << no. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 18:32:24; williamdunne: What happened to that German socialist girl, she ever come back to continue her derping?
decimation: also describing it as 'political time' when the policy is 'matches easily observable astronomical phenomena' seems a bit hyperbolic ☟︎
mircea_popescu: and ftr she looked like a guy to me.
mircea_popescu: decimation time is not a natural phenomenon.
trinque: ^ found that googling as well
decimation: spacetime doesn't exist?
trinque: women in technology == technologically produced womyn
mircea_popescu: but that aside, this is conventional time.
mircea_popescu: spacetime is an artefact of the observation being carried out.
mircea_popescu: and also, it is not ~time~. it is space-time.
decimation: as opposed to what? being derived from platonic ideals?
mircea_popescu: as opposed to mass.
BingoBoingo: <decimation> spacetime doesn't exist? << It isn't space or time, merely the manifold until it is intuited by the apperception
decimation: same could be said of quarks
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193590 << he is basically saying http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=20-06-2015#1170141 and in that he is right. for the exact reason in http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-06-2015#1169850 ☝︎☝︎☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 19:02:31; ascii_field: 'If you want to end ISIS, teach it game theory and casebooks. "They['ll] get out their linear programming charts, statistical decision theories, minimax solutions, and compute the price-cost probabilities of their transactions and investments, just like we do," and lose.' (from the al schwartz link earlier)
assbot: Logged on 20-06-2015 23:17:19; asciilifeform: but no, he wants to use what the gods gave him.
assbot: Logged on 20-06-2015 19:29:12; mircea_popescu: the notion that human agency is ever "effectual" is such rank nonsense to begion with, that a pretense of "saving action for optimal effect" can only be regarded in psychogenic terms
mircea_popescu: specifically, that if you wait for the "optimal" you're waiting forever.
mircea_popescu: decimation in any case, the time bitcoin uses is a political construct.
mircea_popescu: a matter of conventional agreementr, currently overseen by exactly usg.
mircea_popescu: unless you wish to experimentally prove that ~you~ can insert leap seconds into places.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193597 exactly http://trilema.com/2009/hai-sa-facem-o-socoteala/ :D ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 19:17:10; ascii_field: '12 years public school, 4 years undergrad, 6 years PhD, 4 years post-doc. You are now over 30, deeply in debt, and starting life. Your idiot high school classmate who held a STOP sign at a construction site has been pulling $80K/year, has a fine home, wife, three kids, and a motor boat. His eldest son rakes in $850K/year tax-free facilitating recreational pharmaceuticals and an escort service.' << schw
assbot: Hai sa facem o socoteala. on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1HcsbyU )
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193615 << this is a hollywood fiction. "the strong, silent type". not found in nature. ☝︎☟︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 19:38:22; ascii_field: one can have one coming out of ears and arse, and lack the other entirely
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193627 << this is not unlike inquiring "what makes the sterile woman the waste of chocolate that she is". she only becomes that if you put her in a matronly role. otherwise, i wouldn't want a fertile catwoman. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 19:46:07; ascii_field: what makes the exam champ the waste of oxygen that he is ?
mircea_popescu: so the problem there is of management not of nature. chinese exam taker is a great asset in any sanely balanced system.
mircea_popescu: and generally, the quality of a system is to be measured by how many people it can make life meaningful for, not how many people it has to kill to survive.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193636 << consider many of the things we regularly discuss here. most people are neither willing to consider not even willing to look upon the outrage that goes on daily, hourly. be it icons of say badly beaten up women, or whatever else. plenty of people keep lists of words they won't ever say. this disinclination ~to consider~, however the subject justifies it, is the c ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 19:51:46; ascii_field: the 'capable' part is definitely key. who hasn't met his fair share of hack writers, for instance, poor schmucks grasping desperately for one singe original idea? and never finding it
mircea_popescu: ertainest macula of intellectual ineptitude.
mircea_popescu: fact is, if you're not willing to consider the things you aren't going to do, your not doing them is not any sort merit, and it certainly won't ever work in your favour.
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193642 << is this an actual perspective, or is it a knot of nonsense ? ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 19:55:54; trinque: if he in fact has the capability, then the empathy which might cause him to accept someone else's perspective instead would only be a hindrance
mircea_popescu: http://polymatharchives.blogspot.in/2015/01/the-inappropriately-excluded.html << this thing is such bs. if the intelligent need to whine on an obscure blog, and for "society" to GIVE THEM shit they're about as intelligent as a mensa chapter. which isn't all that flattering. ☟︎
assbot: The Polymath Archives: The Inappropriately Excluded ... ( http://bit.ly/1Hct624 )
trinque: that's more or less what I got from asciilifeform, that he was describing a person which, to put it in idiot's terms "does what makes sense to him"
trinque: could not find much clinical "psychopathy" in that
trinque: which leads me to suspect the term itself is stupid
mircea_popescu: not sure i follow.
trinque: I (perhaps incorrectly) take "psychopath" to be a political term, akin to "sociopath"
trinque: the former something like "does what he wants to, even if people cry" and the latter maybe "lies to his enemies, effectively"
mircea_popescu: hm
mircea_popescu: go on ?
trinque: mostly just that; I hear these terms most often used by someone who thinks someone else has been unfair, and ought to be restrained by the state
trinque: was otherwise fishing for asciilifeform's definition of the term.
punkman: mircea_popescu: does romanian have a word for sociopath?
mircea_popescu: sociopat
mircea_popescu: just like in english, it doesn't actually mean anything, unlike english it is not used by the hipstery youth.
punkman: there's an academic word for it in greek, nobody ever uses it though
mircea_popescu: there is aschilopat, which is a purely nonsense word that is use to convey roughly the same notion, "invisible gross diformity worthy of pity" but it's blue collar slang mostly.
trinque: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sluggish_schizophrenia << this one's pretty good
assbot: Sluggish schizophrenia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1KPONLJ )
trinque: !s borderline
assbot: 30 results for 'borderline' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=borderline
trinque: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2007/10/the_diagnosis_of_borderline_pe.html << found it
assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: The Diagnosis of Borderline Personality Disorder: What Does It Really Mean? ... ( http://bit.ly/1KPORuX )
mircea_popescu drops http://trilema.com/2014/the-definitive-tract-on-sociopathy/ since we're on it
assbot: The definitive tract on sociopathy on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1KPOXmf )
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193670 << the mother of all occultations yes ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 20:08:22; decimation: re: political time < it occurred to me that the far more obvious way of synchronizing a clock is to simply take note of the sunrise and/or sunset
trinque: "This is what sociopathy is : what the scum of the earth currently calls its betters." << right, soon to give way to "fagtalkers"
trinque: though one hopes it doesn't take long enough for that
trinque: I keep wanting to call that "inversion"
trinque: where something unnatural persists for so long it becomes the basis of comparison
trinque: eh unnatural is problematic
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-07-2015#1193749 << this is an important point that i don't think asciilifeform fully digested. replay attacks that rely on block count do not work. actuall superior WORK has to be shown. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 08-07-2015 20:35:49; funkenstein_: the chain with the most work demonstrated wins
BingoBoingo: https://i.imgur.com/tTqFfvF.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1KPPp3Y )
punkman: mircea_popescu: I liked the toilet analogy
mircea_popescu: trinque magic thinking is this all through
trinque: mhm
mircea_popescu: punkman how far off do you think tyhat piece is, as a local ?
mircea_popescu: !up solrodar
solrodar: hello
punkman: mircea_popescu: close enough
mircea_popescu is impressed with himself.
mircea_popescu: hello solrodar. who're you ?
punkman: maybe a good time for a translation of the older ones? gtranslate not doing them justice
solrodar: mircea_popescu: one of your blog readers
solrodar: I've made an attempt at the call graph you requested
mircea_popescu: o hey.
solrodar: http://imgh.us/bitcoin-dot.svg ☟︎
assbot: Call graph ... ( http://bit.ly/1Hcvoyr )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ^
mircea_popescu: solrodar do you know what gpg is ?