asciilifeform: i still dun get m. begin's pov. ordered his men to surrender and join idf! and had the auctoritas that... they did

asciilifeform: and so the british pest was permitted to continue to live, and infest the continent

asciilifeform: to this day.

asciilifeform: and this was the d00d who ran irgun ! supposedly, tough motherfucker who killed brits with bare hands etc.

asciilifeform: there is a pov that irgun was british-infested even earlier, though, and 'lehi' was the tru-fork. but i do not have a deep enough picture of the period events to say if.

asciilifeform: my current understanding is that this is only half-correct -- brits also helped folx pick up the aids.

asciilifeform: ( most famously -- opium in cn. but similar elsewhere. )

asciilifeform: this thread a little too thin for asciilifeform's naked eye.

asciilifeform: 'When a terrorist group such as the Irgun Zvai Leumi sees their key objective completed, what do they do? In the case of their use of terrorism, the Irgun came to an end not because the funds died out or support waned, but because the leadership recognized the need to move to a more democratic and non-violent strategy. In order to continue pushing for additional change, no longer would the Irgun act under overt auspices of violence.

asciilifeform: Their primary purpose fulfilled, they had no agenda supportable with violence anymore due to the creation of the state of Israel’s presence. Instead of disbanding after their success, the Irgun continued to remain active, shifting into a productive political role. ' -- random usg derp

asciilifeform: pretty typical 'parliamentarian' rot ^ example

asciilifeform: 'violence is hard, let's go shopping'

asciilifeform: iirc the irish folx went into this same /dev/null of history, quite recently

asciilifeform: it boggles my mind that none of these folx ( at least afaik ) ever grasped that 'nonviolence', 'rule of law', 'parliamentarianism' were tentacles of the enemy, rather than a victory

asciilifeform: the infamous 'sausage emigres' of su, ditto

asciilifeform: ( 'left motherland for 100 sorts of sausage' )

asciilifeform: sorta why ben gurion had the boat shelled and the survivors - machine-gunned. had 0 to do with the cargo, but with the 900+ irgun recruits on board, who didn't yet 'want to go shopping'

asciilifeform: apparently not all were oven fodder

asciilifeform: some -- formed irgun, lehi, etc

asciilifeform: and went to multiply some brits by 0

asciilifeform: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTF5gr_nOMc << not wholly unrelated.

asciilifeform: ( in re 'go shopping' )

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha, is why i posted it

asciilifeform: the altalena thing still , i'm told, smoulders, there are folx who have not forgotten the replacement of terrorist-republic-israel with usg-alt-israel

asciilifeform: ( hey adlai !! whaddayathink )

asciilifeform: dunno, but he's marched under the colours, and asciilifeform has not, so automatically 'gotta ask'

asciilifeform: wassat

asciilifeform: where's the cut between 'worked cycle' and 'turned traitor' ?

asciilifeform: 'worked' seems to imply cynical fraud from t=0

asciilifeform: aah

asciilifeform: rms afaik is not a serial anything, had exactly 1 thing

asciilifeform: lolno

asciilifeform: ( emacs pre-dates rms )

asciilifeform: hurd.

asciilifeform: not sure if that one can be pinned on rms per se -- he was already in his ambulatory mushroom phase at that point

asciilifeform: meanwhile, in other excavations, https://www.security.nl/posting/505769/Random+Bit+Generator+voor+zelfbouw >> 'Het ontwerp is volledig open source, het geleverde product is te verifiëren zodat je kunt zien dat er niets is toegevoegd of weggelaten, de randomization is wiskundig verifieerbaar. Er zijn drivers voor eigenlijk alle gangbare operating systems, zelfs voor OpenBSD, en dat voor een prijs van USD 40. Die onderbouwing zie ik n

asciilifeform: iet bij nosuchlabs. En nee, er is totaal geen sprake van meer spreekwoordelijk alufolie, integendeel. Geen drivers, aansluiting via een niet meer aanwezig medium (seriele poort), beperkte hoeveelheid random data en ga zo maar door.'

asciilifeform: ^ d00d pushing 'onerng' over FUCKGOATS, with argument that the former 'is open source, mathematically verifiable, ...drivers for all current os, even openbsd...' while the latter 'no drivers, connection using obsolete medium - serial port, limited entropy'

asciilifeform: one of'em yes

asciilifeform: nfi

asciilifeform: linked mainly for the 'drivers' lul

asciilifeform: aah yes.

asciilifeform: gotta luvvv all the nitwits who think that pc has any business being able to talk TO an rng box

asciilifeform: ( which is what connecting via non-unidirectional interface entails )

asciilifeform: better still, to read the docs and think for 30sec and realize that THING USES NO DRIVER

asciilifeform: wassat

asciilifeform: managerclass

asciilifeform: aaah a burbulator

asciilifeform: ( http://btcbase.org/log/2016-06-19#1485129 ) ☝︎

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: iirc we had a thread even here where somebody whined that FG doesn't work as a 'totem' where you 'plug in and forget and it just becomes your /dev/random' and that it has to be actively ~used~ ☟︎

asciilifeform: it isn't that it is necessarily bad move

asciilifeform: but that the ~correct~ move is proggy that takes a /dev/foo1,/dev/foo2... as command line params and eats rng from ~there~

asciilifeform: 'need to know principle', if you will -- kernel has no business having centralized 'and these here are rngs'

asciilifeform: not to mention a proggy that eats rng oughta be periodically tested using ~known~ bits

asciilifeform: to see if the expected output results

asciilifeform: ( known-and-previously-untried )

asciilifeform: cat /dev/yourfg > /dev/random &

asciilifeform: ( incidentally astute students of FUCKGOATSology will notice that the principle is applied INSIDE the device as well - FG has nfi what is plugged into rng jacks, actual analogue rng boards or tester jig )

asciilifeform: relatedly, at one point i considered a FG add-on that'd turn it into a ps/2 'keyboard' eternally pissing out, e.g., d0bc05f466024f14... which, e.g., xxd will happily eat & turn into binariola

asciilifeform: keyboardization gives even greater 'nonspecificity of diddling', at the cost of 'can't have it plugged in 24/7, must use in bursts' ( as most os don't work with >1 kbd correctly )

asciilifeform: shinohai: add to the loooong list of 'tardanos'

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the koch episode was actually illustrative of the futility of 'just fix /dev/random'. it'd have done ~zero~ against the koch rng poisoning thing.

asciilifeform: if you can't recompile ( or better still, use sane proggy ) you're fucked, there is no pill.

asciilifeform: mod6: elementarily, 'limited entropy', 'respectable mainstream' turd can put out whatever it wants, GB/s, of prng

asciilifeform: 'whitening'

asciilifeform: ( why to bother with hardware, if resorting to prng , remains a mystery )

asciilifeform: whereas harvesting actual entropy is painful, esp. if you want an engineering margin ( e.g. 2x in FG )

asciilifeform: 2x temporal, that is. on top of 4x spatial.

asciilifeform: ( each analogue board has 2 independent subunits, see schematic )

asciilifeform: mod6: you will notice that no fg hits >8kB/s at room temp, while the theoretical max is 14.4kB

asciilifeform: there simply ain't moar to be had ( safely, that is -- you can use a faster-slewing op amp, in this collection scheme, but you will be harvesting power supply artifacts, 'voice of america', switching transients.. )

asciilifeform: all 'electric' schemes for trng have the basic problem of 'breathing own fumes'.

asciilifeform: von neumann's debias algo, and xor fold, are the two legit methods of dealing with this, but they have considerable cost ( each application of either , burns away 50% of incoming bits )

asciilifeform: ( part of the appeal of 'atomic' trng is that the 'fumes' concern evaporates. )

asciilifeform: !$ssh 94.156.19.254

asciilifeform: aw

asciilifeform: which it

asciilifeform: mod6: spits out the banner that Framedragger forgot to put in the original conversions

asciilifeform: lol!

asciilifeform: motherfucking kochs.

asciilifeform: in other 3-years-and-continuing lulz, https://archive.is/kGc6w >> '...I've been trying to build these style tools for around 10 years, on and off, and they have never built correctly for these targets and any attempt to put in a bug report about it is a waste of time as someone comes along states it works and closes it, even though it doesn't.'

asciilifeform: it will have to be confiscated from the monkeys, like trb was.

asciilifeform: asciilifeform has stabbed on and off at the problem, for a very long time.

asciilifeform: end result is to be a vaguely msdos-like thing that understands how to configure x64 page table, put/get blocks of disk, and speak over rs232 port. and on top of this, a self-building gnat. ☟︎☟︎☟︎

asciilifeform: but this is yet far.

asciilifeform: single-tasking, grim wartime thing.

asciilifeform: nothing like what asciilifeform wanted, decade ago, to spend his life making.

asciilifeform: but it will have to be made.

asciilifeform: lispm

asciilifeform: inadequate iron.

asciilifeform: which interop

asciilifeform: ah

asciilifeform: problem is that a language with nonhardrealtime gc is unsuitable for cryptography.

asciilifeform: 0 way to guarantee constant-time-anything

asciilifeform: or to police branch-on-secrets

asciilifeform: on c-machine -- yes.

asciilifeform: sorta why asciilifeform has written 0 lisp for 3+ yrs

asciilifeform: well, ~0

asciilifeform: at any rate at this point imho it is obvious that the confiscation of computing from the enemy cannot proceed on linux.

asciilifeform: or bsd.

asciilifeform: aaaha.

asciilifeform: the reasons, at this point, are not a mega-secret to anyone here.

asciilifeform: for the 'helpers' -- the sharp end of a trench shovel.

asciilifeform: re os : i've observed before , that the only peripheral that unconditionally ~must~ work, is rs232 port.

asciilifeform: everything else, even disk, is optional frill.

asciilifeform: it is possible to accomplish useful work on a box where only cpu, memory, and serial ports, work.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it'd even not be wholly ludicrous to have 1 doslike thing per cpu core, and a standardized means whereby master (of which there is to be ONE) can drive the slaves

asciilifeform: but beyond this - nothing.

asciilifeform: no need for any such thing, conventional pc arch is quite enough.

asciilifeform: ( to carry on N independent instruction streams )

asciilifeform: the other bit, is that we are picturing a box without a nic. ( it may come equipped with one, but it dun get plugged in )

asciilifeform: strictly serial. if you want to speak via a nic, that goes on 2nd box

asciilifeform: the 'nic can dma, haha' thing evaporates.

asciilifeform: nic sits on 2nd box, and if it gets 'magic packet', the most that enemy gains is the contents of the buffer kept there.

asciilifeform: at any rate this is a pretty obvious scheme.

asciilifeform: merely cumbersome. but if contemplating a return to 'msdos with bigger addr space', it is also fitting to discuss other cumbersomes.

asciilifeform: ( and any such return entails a 'from whence the drivers', for which the magic pill is... we haven't any. rs232, motherfuckers. )

asciilifeform: mauser first, questions later!111

asciilifeform: lol

asciilifeform: incidentally, a dick^H^Hsk-less pc makes for another interesting feature, a known-starting-state.

asciilifeform: ( i had a pogo going like this for a while )

asciilifeform: it asks 'gimme a running state plox' via the talking port on warmup. and then runs.

asciilifeform: ( i.e. disk can be a tele-operated item in exactly same way as nic. )

asciilifeform: >> http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/lBzDS/?raw=true << from the archives of asciilifeform : simple c example of The Only Driver ☟︎

asciilifeform: ( worx on all known pc chipsets, incl. mircea_popescu's 286. )

asciilifeform: tested on, e.g., 'pcengines apu1'

asciilifeform: a number of other opterons also.

asciilifeform: ancient intel boxes from scrapyard.

asciilifeform: and many, many boat anchors.

asciilifeform: ^ n00bs : don't try to build an' run on a unix, it won't wurk.

asciilifeform: rom kernel.

asciilifeform: ( nao if only one could actually execute anything at all from rom on modern x86 !! )

asciilifeform: but can still write ~as if for~ rom.