▁▁▁⏐︎ 14158
BingoBoingo: !~bcstats
jhvh1: BingoBoingo: Current Blocks: 428610 | Current Difficulty: 2.2075590833037228E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 429407 | Next Difficulty In: 797 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 5 days, 17 hours, 36 minutes, and 41 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None
shinohai: !~ticker --market all
jhvh1: shinohai: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 608.93, vol: 4038.84594708 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 608.253, vol: 4853.26157 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 615.2, vol: 3078.1683089 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 612.746414, vol: 146496.84330000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 613.318, vol: 486.39297549 | Volume-weighted last average: 612.561510532
shinohai: Notice jhvh1 doesn't require a "more"
BingoBoingo: nice
BingoBoingo: !~ty
jhvh1: You are very welcome Daddy
mircea_popescu: you know this "you are very welcome daddy" think keeps reminding me of this ... i don't recall, maybe a succession of sms captions ? where a clearly competent streetwalker (of the sort that lives on street most days, checks into motel now and again) was assuring some random dude that she doesn't mind his friend beating her up.
trinque: shinohai: nice!
mircea_popescu: ex post facto.
shinohai: trinque: thx I just always found it annoying griible required a ;;more when it all fits in 2 lines fine.
trinque: shinohai: yes but otherwise it wouldn't have had room for the ;;more
mircea_popescu: lol
Framedragger: [restarting]
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Well even with bots the patriarchy must be established
mircea_popescu: do you recall this thing ?
BingoBoingo: I am trying too
BingoBoingo: brb sobriety time!
mircea_popescu: lol
shinohai considers adding the Big Book to the scriptorium for BingoBoingo
BingoBoingo: You don't need to add the whole thing. Just the steps and the traditions.
mircea_popescu: just in case anyone's weird tank was running low, http://diaryofahollywoodstreetking.com/claudia-jordan-admits-to-abortion/
asciilifeform: Framedragger: bot dead ?
asciilifeform: or hm, nm.
shinohai: !~step1
jhvh1: 1. We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.
shinohai: bwahahahha
asciilifeform: l0l!
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/jsoCp << in other lulz
asciilifeform: 'The Data Protection Commissioner is convinced, her supervision authority also extends „to SUSLAG and its staff members“. Therefore, she wanted to inspect this core area of BND-NSA collaboration. But the BND also blocked these attempts. The Commissioner and her staff are not allowed to enter the building and not even allowed to know how many people work there...'
asciilifeform: 'While the Data Protection Commissioner was examining the BND in Bad Aibling, the secret service ramped up its equipment for 300 million Euros. And while the Commissioner waited for an answer to her report from the Chancellery, the government drafted a reform bill for the BND that not only legalizes the organization’s actions, but even increases its powers. This legislative package is scheduled to be adopted this year and will pres
asciilifeform: umably come into effect at the beginning of next year.'
mircea_popescu: heh
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2014-08-16#798881 << see also. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2014-08-16 21:39 asciilifeform: 'mr carter, you aren't cleared for this, and if you ask again there will be problems.'
mircea_popescu: a government can never be solvent ; a government can never operate legally. ☟︎
asciilifeform: noshit.jpg
asciilifeform rereading vintage golden lulzies, http://trilema.com/2014/a-complete-theory-of-economics/#comment-107389
asciilifeform: 'These aren't people assembled for an actual reason, as a result of merits. These are people whose merits are supposed to be predicated on the mere fact of having been assembled. Not quite the same thing.'
asciilifeform: from somewhere therein, moar gold,
asciilifeform: ' Anyone who doesn’t know what he knows or who doesn’t behave/speak in the conventional way these developers speak is merely a troll, not worthy to partake in a discussion among the priests. And in his view Henson is simply too big to fail, too big to be held accountable for his actions, in this or any case, because he is part of the crypto establishment. We see these same patterns in politics and banking for example – it’s e
asciilifeform: litism, simply put. The 1%. ... It’s much like politics – one wants to throw out the lot of them and start from scratch with real people. I know for a fact I don’t want either of these people working on security-related code in MY OS. Get lost, permanently!'
asciilifeform: ( https://igurublog.wordpress.com/2014/04/08/julian-assange-debian-is-owned-by-the-nsa )
asciilifeform somehow missed.
asciilifeform: same fella still shouts into the wilderness, e.g., https://igurublog.wordpress.com/2015/06/13/openwashing-and-other-deceptions-in-linux/ ,
asciilifeform: 'Remember Heartbleed? Don’t let that example escape your attention. OpenSSL is open, yet it is so large and poorly designed that it’s a dark mystery. Heartbleed was easily shown to be a deliberate hack, and was even deliberately coded to hide itself from tools that would otherwise have shown the leak. And it was sitting there in ‘open’ sight. Instead of using small, well-reviewed crypto libraries, corporate Linux developers c
asciilifeform: hoose to use corporate-maintained tools like OpenSSL, which are deeply compromised. Do you think the people responsible for HeartBleed were held accountable, and fundamental changes were made? Guess again. It’s simply ignored by most of Linux. (You’ll notice real UNIXes like OpenBSD did not ignore it and have begun serious changes. Yet even there, it took such a serious, obvious exploit for them to see the engineering problem.)'
asciilifeform: 'Really, I think it’s too late for mainstream “Linux”. It’s gone. It’s done. Geeks of the world were easily fooled by a shiny new toy and a corporate propaganda campaign to match, without considering the engineering implications. You can still use a real (systemd-free) version of Linux, or move toward the BSDs, but if you stay with the easy-to-use, polished distros, you’re no longer really using Linux. You’re just fooli
asciilifeform: ng yourself, and they’re fooling you. Nor will systemd be the end of it – it’s just the beginning, the setup for future changes.'
asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu http://wiki.tulpa.info/Official/FAQ << a (supposed) reader mailed this in. parody? or...
asciilifeform: $up alice_
asciilifeform: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
asciilifeform: there you are.
asciilifeform: ... hello ?
alice_: hi! today i'm reading {The Timeless Way of Building}. i'm curious if you've read anything by Christopher Alexander
asciilifeform: can't say that i have.
asciilifeform: maybe danielpbarron ?
alice_: mm. it's a mix of theoretical and applied architecture. generalizes nicely to all of design.
asciilifeform: 'Christopher Alexander is Emeritus Professor of Architecture at the University of California, Berkeley, best known for his seminal works on architecture including A Pattern Language, Notes on the Synthesis of Form, and The Nature of Order, Volumes I-IV. He is the father of the Pattern Language movement in computer science, and A Pattern Language was perhaps the first complete book ever written in hypertext fashion.'
alice_: that's the one
asciilifeform: i see 'design patterns' as language bug.
asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=401 << as described here.
shinohai wonders if this is the alice_ he is always reading about in gpg manuals.
alice_: if i had a dollar every time somebody made that joke
asciilifeform: http://library.uniteddiversity.coop/Ecological_Building/A_Pattern_Language.pdf << 1333337 w4r3z. but my impression is - claptrap.
shinohai: Glad I could do my part to make it economically viable for you.
asciilifeform: i'ma read the thing anyway, because i am an 'entomologist'.
asciilifeform: but cannot make guarantee of result.
alice_: i read http://www.loper-os.org/?p=401. it doesn't mention design patterns. i'm p sure i can guess correctly the bad thing it's complaining about, but i didn't get a model for how design patterns are a language bug
asciilifeform: http://www.rainmagazine.com/archive/2014/gatemaker << reads like ted nelson.
asciilifeform: which is not a bad thing.
asciilifeform: alice_: if i see a pattern, i write a macro and it vanishes.
asciilifeform: which is why we have macro.
alice_: {A Pattern Language} is a book about the specific pattern language he built for architecture; http://library.uniteddiversity.coop/Ecological_Building/The_Timeless_Way_of_Building_Complete.pdf is the theory book
alice_: right, macro is an excellent way to use patterns in code (and is itself a pattern)
asciilifeform: macro ~removes~ pattern. as in increasing the entropy (per, say, kolmogorov, or even chaitin's criterion) of the program.
asciilifeform: quite like what, elsewhere, a well-written compressor does.
alice_: list[:-1] vs (drop-last list)
asciilifeform: !!up boolcrap
deedbot: boolcrap voiced for 30 minutes.
boolcrap: yo
boolcrap: stan you got cycles?
asciilifeform: hola señor boolcrap
asciilifeform: eh?
boolcrap: sieg heil stan joseph joseph goebbels
boolcrap: sorry forgot his spelling
boolcrap: had to google, then pasted pad.
asciilifeform: Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein boolcrap .
boolcrap: ^bad
boolcrap: lol
asciilifeform: alice_: ick nonhomoiconic syntax.
boolcrap: you getting alot of work done alf?
asciilifeform: megatonnes.
boolcrap: nice
asciilifeform: and you ?
boolcrap: i finally got official access to the place i am a contractor for
alice_: afaict christopher alexander is using "pattern" to mean a basic component of language, not the thing which macros remove
boolcrap: but I have learned from you well so
boolcrap: i set the bar very low for myself
boolcrap: im going to stan the crap out of these guys in your honor!
asciilifeform: lel boolcrap , what have you even been doing all of this time.
boolcrap: they have me doing odd jobs, doing prep work for a RE course they teaching at UM
boolcrap: also ive been working not-bare-iron1.0
alice_: i feel ick about nonhomoiconic *and* never-infix
asciilifeform: what's so great about infix.
asciilifeform: i could live the rest of my life without infix, quite happily.
alice_: seems to be a lot more natural language for a lot of humans for a lot of things
alice_: maybe not you :) but me.
alice_: invertible compilers solve that problem tho pretty nicely
asciilifeform brb, meat
asciilifeform: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
asciilifeform: !!up boolcrap
deedbot: boolcrap voiced for 30 minutes.
asciilifeform: entertain one another, dear guests.
asciilifeform: i'ma meat for a spell.
alice_: i haven't figured out how to scale them up to something as syntax-complicated as javascript but i've found 80/20s pretty useful for practical infixy needs
alice_: transpilers
alice_: i seriously tried lisp, i spent hundreds of hours coding in a variety of lisps, including clojure (ugh) and arc (lovely but it was for a production web server and it was completely unsuited to the purpose)
alice_: i don't think as easy without shit like x/2 and list[:-1]
alice_: dsls i'm proud of
alice_: ┌───────────── [ ──────────────┐ ┌───────────── ⇧[ ─────────────┐
alice_: │ _ ¹ ² ³ ⁴ ⁵ ⁶ ⁷ ⁸ ⁹ ⁰ ⁻ ⁼ _ │ │ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ⁽ ⁾ _ ⁺ _ │
alice_: │ _ X ʷ ᵉ ʳ ᵗ ʸ ᵘ ⁱ ᵒ ᵖ _ _ _ │ │ _ X ᵂ ᴱ ᴿ ᵀ X ᵁ ᴵ ᴼ ᴾ _ _ _ │ ☟︎
alice_: │ _ ᵃ ˢ ᵈ ᶠ ᵍ ʰ ʲ ᵏ ˡ _ _ _ │ │ _ ᴬ ᴮ ᴰ X ᴳ ᴴ ᴶ ᴷ ᴸ _ _ _ │
alice_: │ _ ᶻ ˣ ᶜ ᵛ ᵇ ⁿ ᵐ _ _ _ _ │ │ _ X X X ⱽ X ᴺ ᴹ _ _ _ _ │
alice_: └──────────────────────────────┘ └──────────────────────────────┘
alice_: a homoiconic format for binding keyboard keys
alice_: sort of, i think i misuse homoiconic
trinque: uh
trinque: what do you think it means?
alice_: the program structure is similar to its syntax. in this case, the code for shift is ⇧ and can be typed by ⏻⇧
alice_: & the syntax is similar to a literal keyboard when possible
alice_: that's {power key}⇧ if you haven't installed any exotic fonts. it's macbook-specific.
trinque: mkay
trinque: so, what brought you here?
alice_: asciilifeform seems potentially entertaining
alice_: /interesting
trinque: can't argue with that.
mircea_popescu: what the fuck is this then
boolcrap: he is actually the most interesting man alive
trinque: mircea_popescu: somebody got out her crayons
boolcrap: at our old job we hired him just so he would come out to lunch with us
mircea_popescu: is this gabriel laddel v2.0 or ?
trinque: alice_: are you homeless by chance?
alice_: no, why
mircea_popescu: just a stray thought.
alice_: what
alice_: you give cute insults tho
alice_: i am entertained :)
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160907/from:50/to:50#50 << this much is certainly true
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [01:06:18] <asciilifeform> 'Really, I think it’s too late for mainstream “Linux”. It’s gone. It’s done. Geeks of the world were easily fooled by a shiny new toy and a corporate propaganda campaign to match, without considering the engineering implications. You can still use a real (systemd-free) version of Linux, or move toward the BSDs, but if you stay with the
scriba: easy-to-use, polished distros, you’re no longer really using Linux. You’re just fooli
mircea_popescu: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160907/from:102/to:102#102 << guy does what usians are known for, take random item from the scenery, write his name on it, strut around proudly.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [01:53:54] <alice_> afaict christopher alexander is using "pattern" to mean a basic component of language, not the thing which macros remove
alice_: so
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160907/from:111/to:111#111 << it's funny that THIS antipattern you recognize. yes, it's the macula of intellectual degeneracy ; and not coincidentally rapspeech is fulla infixen.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [01:56:09] <asciilifeform> i could live the rest of my life without infix, quite happily.
alice_: why are you so angry?
mircea_popescu: i'm merely strict.
alice_: mm, not my fetish. as long as you get off on it :)
mircea_popescu: who are you again ?
alice_: clarify
alice_: what do you mean, who am i?
mircea_popescu: that, literally. who are you.
alice_: i'm alice. i haven't interacted with this channel before. but i don't imagine that's the answer you're hoping for ☟︎
mircea_popescu is vaguely unsurprised that rando who spends his time vaguely considering "invertible compilers" for, obviously, javascript, has yet to actually produce a definition for itself.
alice_: her
alice_: i take it back, your insults are annoying
mircea_popescu: what do you think an insult is ?
alice_: your mom
mircea_popescu: mmkay.
ben_vulpes: in other news, the much-maligned littoral combat ships can't keep water out of their engine lube systems and so the surface force commander has ordered the entire 'fleet' stand down
mircea_popescu: how many were they ? a dozen yet ?
ben_vulpes: if even that
ben_vulpes: one apparently destroyed an engine ("engineering casualty") and another hosed it's combining gears?!
mircea_popescu: come to think of it, womenz also can't keep seawater out of their engine lube system, which is why surffucking is so strictly limited to teenagers.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes i recall a month or so ago when this happened and they tried to blame it on the crew.
ben_vulpes: thank goodness for perl
ben_vulpes: ofc blame it on the crew, what is lockheed to deliver serviceable machines with complete manuals all of a sudden?
mircea_popescu: but since it's invertible compiler day, http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/why-russia-china-should-fear-americas-littoral-combat-ships-17440
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535582 << what am i looking at here? ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 02:11 alice_: │ _ X ʷ ᵉ ʳ ᵗ ʸ ᵘ ⁱ ᵒ ᵖ _ _ _ │ │ _ X ᵂ ᴱ ᴿ ᵀ X ᵁ ᴵ ᴼ ᴾ _ _ _ │
alice_: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/dotfiles/.keyrc
ben_vulpes: subject of manuals, a onetime airforce honcho straigh up vetoed the delivery of f22 manuals in xml (!), as pilots couldn't take the un-sensitive stuff home without also taking the sensitive stuff home as it was delivered
asciilifeform: alice_: apl, 'j', 'k' aficionado?
ben_vulpes: and also, approximating his words "look with all the software problems they'd already delivered in the planes i wasn't about to impose more on the poor pilots during their studies. plus, opportunity to hose the suppliers."
asciilifeform: 'lucid' ?
alice_: asciilifeform: never used any of those. a fan of some of their patterns. i'm a fan of a lot of patterns i've seen in a lot of different existing programming environments.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes so they printed them ?
asciilifeform: alice_: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/regex_set.ζ << what, then, is this?
alice_: e.g. ML is a sharp, crystalline beauty, mostly useless for my direct purpose but v inspiring, 'cuz it's got several neat patterns that i don't see in most popular environments
ben_vulpes: typeset properly and segregated vault-reading from home-reading as the story goes
ben_vulpes: same guy was running ops when they took the f22s over the international date line
ben_vulpes: "hooo boy lemme tell you about the hundreds of millions of dollars wasted on *that* mission!"
ben_vulpes: "..."
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: as opposed to well-spent on other missions?
ben_vulpes: "at which point we had ready teams hot on airfields on 2 continents!"
ben_vulpes: well, what, as
ben_vulpes: ^^ disregard
alice_: asciilifeform: prints a regex character class which matches all of the code points in utf8 stdin
asciilifeform: in what?
trinque: more importantly, are you now, or have you ever been a brony
mircea_popescu: 80/20.
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: nobody's claiming the dollars are ever well spent, or that fucking is done in some new way
alice_: asciilifeform: ? like, if i paste the last several lines into it, i get \n -#'-:<>?LMX[\]-\_a-pr-zʳʷʸζᴱᴵᴼᴾ-ᵂᵉᵒᵖ-ᵘⁱ│
asciilifeform: in ~what~ ??
alice_: stdout
asciilifeform: my bash doesn't have a lambda.
mircea_popescu: this is going well.
ben_vulpes: (but hey that particular porno is worth a watch, and that particular report of wastage entertaining)
asciilifeform: dunno where you got yours, alice_ .
asciilifeform: jupiter?
asciilifeform: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
alice_: oh, are you asking what regex_set.ζ is written in? it's ζ, which is almost javascript
alice_: http://pastebin.com/raw/twiJaniQ
alice_: i can do Normal Startup Coding Style if i want to, i just hate it so i don't when i don't have to
alice_: trinque: i don't like your face
asciilifeform: !!up gabriel_laddel
deedbot: gabriel_laddel voiced for 30 minutes.
trinque: !!down alice_
asciilifeform: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
asciilifeform: trinque: let it live
trinque oinks a bit, allows
asciilifeform: trinque: how we gonna know what it is if we don't plant it in agar.
mircea_popescu: invertible agar ?
asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: meet alice_ .
asciilifeform: who had the honour of being suspected of being gabriel_laddel-in-his-cups
asciilifeform: eh.
mircea_popescu: maybe he's offended.
asciilifeform: did his modem run out of petrol or wut.
alice_: usually i run modems on vegetable oil
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: didntcha post a photo of an invertible toilet once?
asciilifeform: i cannot help but think of it now.
mircea_popescu: possibly ? what'd it invert to ?
asciilifeform: there was a box for a head at the outlet.
mircea_popescu: aw fuck.... this is vaguely familiar...
asciilifeform: manned, so to speak, on both ends.
trinque: there's a whole genre of japanese porn of this
asciilifeform: alice_: where do you keep the lambda on your physical kbd ?
trinque: http://www.nudepetgirls.com/wp-content/images/human-furniture-sdms591.jpg << check it out, all kinds of furniture
mircea_popescu: girlfurniture surely is a large fetish thing.
asciilifeform sees odd leg count, EGGOGs
asciilifeform then notices mirror.
alice_: ;l (chord of semicolon and L) , defined in https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/dotfiles/.keyrc#L10
mircea_popescu: it's not mirror, it's just girl with black shoes has right leg behind white shoe's lef
asciilifeform: or wait.
asciilifeform: lel
asciilifeform: alice_: chord?!
asciilifeform: not even shift-meta etc, but chord!?
asciilifeform: what if my right hand is tired.
asciilifeform: what then.
alice_: yes. if the keys are pressed within a small number of milliseconds.
alice_: then you are a person whose right hand gets tired and you should not use this exact system
asciilifeform: i know what is a chord.
BingoBoingo: !~step5
jhvh1: 5. Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
trinque: lol
asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=861 << proper chords are 1handed.
mircea_popescu: ^
alice_: semicolon L is one handed
alice_: all chords i use frequently are one handed
asciilifeform: lambda yes
asciilifeform: alpha no.
alice_: i don't use α frequently
alice_: i added sd as a chord for ι because i do use ι frequently
asciilifeform: for what.
alice_: it's my Standard pronoun, my It
alice_: most programmers use x or value
alice_: if they're smart enough to use a standard pronoun :P
asciilifeform: what's wrong with 'it' ?
trinque: or describing the damned value
asciilifeform: as per grahm's original anaphorics system
alice_: violates huffman coding
alice_: huffman coding is important
asciilifeform: how does it violate ?
alice_: short variables for simple common things; longer names for less common things
alice_: more complex things
mircea_popescu: god almighty, it's like a pregnant idiot delivered stupid all over the fucking logs already.
alice_: a powerful pattern
mircea_popescu: are you almost done asciilifeform ?
asciilifeform: if i have to press 2 keys, it is 2 keys long.
alice_: so use x
alice_: i don't mind pressing s and d at the same time, myself
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i think this was sent to us as gift from ze godz per this morning's thread.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu wins that one.
mircea_popescu: mk, ima go to bed. if anyone wants to talk to me send tells, i'm not gonna be reading this log.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu and alice_ hasn't told us about cultivating multiple personalities yet !!
alice_: i haven't ever interacted with this channel before :(
asciilifeform: but we know how to read...
trinque: asciilifeform: they made more than one y'know
trinque: mass produced even
asciilifeform: trinque: eh wat?
trinque: who are the other posited personalities
alice_: tell me about the thing you're confusing me with, i am curious
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/ApHv4 << ?
trinque: olol
trinque: well I already mentioned another
asciilifeform: trinque: show ?
asciilifeform: 'i showed you mine, show me yours!'
alice_: yes, that's me
alice_: do you have questions about me or
asciilifeform: alice_: describe, approximately, what is a you. (e.g., butcher, baker, oil prospector, bankrupt lisp programmer, etc) ?
trinque: https://www.google.com/images?q=alice0meta << brony ☟︎
asciilifeform: trinque: i have nfi what this is.
alice_: haha
trinque: afaik you identify as a pony or some shit ☟︎
trinque: alice_: pls explain.
alice_: that's cuz you're an asshole
alice_: i don't actually
asciilifeform: and whatever, maybe alice_ identifies as an old rusted kriegsmarine anchor in scapa flow, scotland.
alice_: asciilifeform: i am a young transhumanist-hopeful type. i've supported myself with programming before; currently i'm living off savings & spending time studying shit
BingoBoingo: <alice_> e.g. ML is a sharp, crystalline beauty, mostly useless for my direct purpose but v inspiring, 'cuz it's got several neat patterns that i don't see in most popular environments << "v inspiring" is a term of art here
alice_: i honestly can't tell if you're insulting me or complimenting me
asciilifeform: alice_: what sort of programming ?
alice_: outside view says insult
asciilifeform: vs what sort of view
alice_: mostly shitty website frontend & backend stuff
asciilifeform: salt mine, eh.
alice_: outside vs inside view; from Kahneman
asciilifeform bbl, dinner is served.
BingoBoingo: !~step9
jhvh1: 9. Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
BingoBoingo: ^ alf
BingoBoingo: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: !~step3
jhvh1: 3. Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
BingoBoingo: ^ alice_ see above line
alice_: what
BingoBoingo: work the fucking step in your everyday life, with exactly the desperation of the dying
alice_: um
alice_: i don't do christianity
BingoBoingo: Many tried to find an easier, softer way, but they could not.
BingoBoingo: alice_: Not Xtianity, bolt it onto the belief system of your choice
alice_: i'm looking for a harder, more powerful way
BingoBoingo: Whether God as you understand him is Satan, Our Noodly host, or deedbot
BingoBoingo: alice_: Then go to
BingoBoingo: !~step4
jhvh1: 4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
trinque: nb
alice_: p sure i did that
BingoBoingo: k, then
BingoBoingo: !~step5
jhvh1: 5. Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs. ☟︎
alice_: am making progress on that. say 70% done.
BingoBoingo: !~step6
jhvh1: 6. Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
alice_: god's an asshole, and it's complicated. i'm ready for anything i can understand as progress.
BingoBoingo: alice_: Well no you aren't because there's lots of logs to read that you haven't. Go back to step2.
BingoBoingo: !!down alice_
BingoBoingo: !~ty shinohai
jhvh1: You are very welcome Daddy
BingoBoingo: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: !~step2
jhvh1: 2. Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
alice_: you are horrifying
alice_: disgusting
BingoBoingo: But I have an inner peace to match my outer peace. What do you have today?
alice_: inner peace
asciilifeform: i walk out for half hour and they pull the bloody wings off, lol.
alice_: i actually only got it last saturday
alice_: it's really nice
alice_: asciilifeform: i am very confused by the social environment here :P
asciilifeform: alice_: http://btcbase.org/log << enjoy.
asciilifeform: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema << other mirror.
BingoBoingo: !~tradition2
jhvh1: BingoBoingo: Error: "tradition2" is not a valid command.
alice_: i know that's the log
alice_: $help
BingoBoingo: !~later tell shinohai pls to add 12 traditions
jhvh1: BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
asciilifeform: alice_: consider registering your pgp pubkey with deedbot.
asciilifeform: alice_: then you will have voice (unless you bore folks to tears or piss them off.)
trinque: !!help
deedbot: http://deedbot.org/help.html
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I am sorry for playing with the food.
alice_: !!register alice
deedbot: Import failed for alice.
asciilifeform: alice_: you register a pgp pubkey fingerprint.
alice_: so if i have
alice_: -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Version: Keybase OpenPGP v2.0.55 Comment: https://keybase.io/crypto xsFNBFevnesBEAC90aLfcq+wrWVKGcQWUd+NmB/0kK7OONd0Tg2OUgfHE2RtZSzG mqgsiAmyPsz+R6B3VwkMd3pBiuAZ8IN/jf0px+iikmo0vvWemsnVTUM0mtyoFecy /qyj1+mwjLrzR7UMDP8789JBwxecY+1fS6k4BQio3gGvmqzGr76sAjTZlIbkPs80 Nr502+QhvfOSjnjFTfQkXrzjrssjJp+jEH0OdkC/UT7H0lCWy957UPklwXlEPnu/ KQbcDoV2HWSEG0hW3Ig7+4qC03Bp0W9Z9lRTYZVIbTnDLJ+z4/J1fMu1EnmZkEKQ aH0SCtgI
alice_: etc
trinque: ahahaha
asciilifeform: nono
trinque: jesus christ
asciilifeform: the longfp.
asciilifeform: e.g., http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-04#1534224 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-04 21:02 Nivir: $register 4A770EFC84943B04C4001A1D7A788522C8FBE0DA
trinque: prefix changed to !!
asciilifeform: lol keybase.
asciilifeform: $s keybase
a111: 163 results for "keybase", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=keybase
asciilifeform: alice_: why did you give your private key to a buncha strangers ?
alice_: i don't know what a longfp is
asciilifeform: it looks like, e.g., 4A770EFC84943B04C4001A1D7A788522C8FBE0DA.
trinque: !~step5
jhvh1: 5. Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
trinque: damned useful, this.
asciilifeform: lel
alice_: because i never learned how it works and also i've never used that key for anything?
alice_: assholes
asciilifeform: alice_: it is not too late to learn.
alice_: also, that's not a private key
asciilifeform: alice_: if you generated it on keybase, they have your private.
alice_: sure, i wouldn't use it for anything important
alice_: i've never used a key before
BingoBoingo: <alice_> because i never learned how it works and also i've never used that key for anything? << See how it works <alice_> because i never learned how it works and also i've never used that key for anything?
asciilifeform: alice_: http://trilema.com/2014/what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works-and-how-to-use-it << some introductory material.
BingoBoingo: Sorry, page 58 http://anonpress.org/bb/Page_58.htm
trinque: There are those, too, who suffer from grave emotional and mental disorders, but many of them do recover if they have the capacity to be honest. << does seem that most psychological issues involve deep dishonesty.
BingoBoingo: Sure, then there's Gavin folk who can't be honest
BingoBoingo: !~later tell mircea_popescu alice_ log was solved with a spiritual, not a religious solution
jhvh1: BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
ben_vulpes: ahaha keybase
ben_vulpes: alice_ brings the real real
asciilifeform: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/scratch.txt << lulzy
asciilifeform: 'bekas cahlo caris cekla dedna dekik emiak eseik gazok gihza girim gumlu halbo hanka henuh kadut kagzi kakki kamor kehul kisar kizak kofur kohig lopra mesat mesip mezid motka nahso nalic nirsu omiac radil ratis repgi resra rukan siral sorzo tarak tilke zalsi zehaz zekhu zeluz zephu zifin zirez zohip zokmi zonri...'
asciilifeform: i blame mr. mold.
ben_vulpes: > comely.niad
ben_vulpes: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/scratch.txt#L54 << lol read as "o crap i service"
ben_vulpes: sublime? and braille?
asciilifeform: expert sex change!
ben_vulpes: what even is going on there
trinque: asciilifeform: that might be quite relevant
asciilifeform: lel
asciilifeform: !~google niad
jhvh1: asciilifeform: NIAD Art Center – Redefining Contemporary Art: <http://niadart.org/>; Roster Of Artists – NIAD Art Center: <http://niadart.org/artists/>; Hours + Directions + Contact – NIAD Art Center: <http://niadart.org/directions/>
asciilifeform: hm.
ben_vulpes: naiad, sorry
ben_vulpes: !~google naiad
jhvh1: ben_vulpes: Naiad - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naiad>; NAIADS (Naiades) - Fresh-Water Nymphs of Greek Mythology: <http://www.theoi.com/Nymphe/Naiades.html>; Naiad Dynamics - Yacht Stabilizers Boat Stabilizers Ship Stabilizer ...: <http://www.naiad.com/>
asciilifeform: we know what is a naiad.
asciilifeform: but not a niad.
ben_vulpes: "not interested in any dick"?
ben_vulpes: niad is a mispelling of something in that scratchpad
asciilifeform: ah
ben_vulpes: my efforts to avoid more pastepocalypsen result in typos
asciilifeform: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/.abandoned/data%20science/fimscrape.ζ << guess wat, trinque had it. ☟︎
asciilifeform takes off hat to trinque .
asciilifeform: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/.abandoned/crypto.ζ << mega-lol ☟︎
asciilifeform: 'i never used a key befoar'
ben_vulpes: aaand locked
ben_vulpes: what was that which trinque nailed? ☟︎
asciilifeform: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/tree/master/.archive/okaylang << for, apparently, ben_vulpes ...
ben_vulpes: weird!
asciilifeform: there's a ~bottomless pit in there.
ben_vulpes: yeah, being not logged into gh makes it work
asciilifeform: waiwat
ben_vulpes: encountering strange, standby one
ben_vulpes: ah
ben_vulpes: yeah fuck that url.
ben_vulpes: and fuck weechat.
ben_vulpes: nothing to see but a pile of hurr
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535908 << the 'pony' thing. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 05:30 ben_vulpes: what was that which trinque nailed?
asciilifeform: 'fim' is their forum.
ben_vulpes: mhm. eventually figured it out.
asciilifeform: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/.archive/hydrocarboner/src/main.cpp#L442 << ?! ☟︎
ben_vulpes: huffman!
asciilifeform: the sheer ~height~ of this pile, almost approaches my hdd.
asciilifeform: and if i were to post it, i'm not certain that the reaction in readers would be very different from this case.
asciilifeform bbl.
trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2015-12-03#1335900 << the difference ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2015-12-03 16:55 adlai: industrious must be got rid of, for he is too dangerous." ☟︎
deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/25735C9524851A27C6B6968F1E24B64A6E2D529B5BF16D96F922E1FF96FFEDF9 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 29 divides RSA Moduli belonging to ' (ssh-rsa key from (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <sshscan-queries+>; ' ☟︎
Framedragger: !#hello
scriba: Hello, world!
Framedragger: kk
Framedragger: phf: thanks for adding scriba btcbase log's list of bots btw ☟︎
Framedragger: to*
Framedragger: !#hello
scriba: Hello, world!
Framedragger: (sorry about log spam - i'll fork the bot into a development branch (new features and bugfix tests) which will run on a separate test channel.)
Framedragger: incidentally, how would one go about doing development across branches in V? or is that fiat fancy to be banished from all that is good? :)
Framedragger: a*
Framedragger: btw ftr i want to thank punkman for recommending sopel bot (previously willie, if anyone's heard of it) as the core irc bot to be used. it's properly maintained, has clean code and good docs. https://sopel.chat/
Framedragger: i want to try trinque's bot, too, but setting up sbcl etc and making sure things are reliable will have to wait for laters
shinohai: I used a willie bot a long time ago, was rather good
Framedragger: nice
Framedragger: log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160801/bogus
scriba: You need to give me a link to a specific IRC line so it can be quoted. Use either "from:line_number" or an anchor ("#line_number").
Framedragger: log.mkj.lt/trilema/20100801/#1
scriba: I do not have this date in my logs, I'm afraid.
mircea_popescu: what ever happened to punkman anyway ☟︎
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535949 << went kakotronic ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 12:40 mircea_popescu: what ever happened to punkman anyway
mircea_popescu: what's that even.
mircea_popescu: btw, i'm writing a mega-piece on clinical psychiatry. so save yourself an hour this evening.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i.e. 'ideological' #b-a perma-resident.
mircea_popescu: eh.
asciilifeform allocates hour.
mircea_popescu: what's the ideology.
mircea_popescu: "we hate X guy" is politics, not ideology. gotta have an idea for to ideology.
asciilifeform: then none.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: thanks for putting words into a person's mouth, i'm sure that did great justice. you call this ideological? http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=16-08-2016#1453186 << i call this just being more critical and reflective ☝︎
asciilifeform: Framedragger: this is exactly it though.
asciilifeform: kakotronic.
Framedragger: you know, i recall shitty philosophy students dissing entire philosophical works by just calling them "platonic". can't really do justice by generalizing like that, can you now
Framedragger: (in truth, not the best of analogies)
mircea_popescu: anyone mind quoting the source material ?
Framedragger: 16-08-2016
Framedragger: ‏‎asciilifeform:pankkake: the 'can't admit being wrong' thing is quite true, and whether you can afford dealing with mptronics, is very personal matter. so i do not actually disagree, as such, with pankkake.
Framedragger: "i'm more curious re kakobrekla's motivation for withholding any of the info."
Framedragger: "the only possible explanation is that not all of it contributes to the narrative he wants to build."
Framedragger: ‏‎punkman:flimflams: "oops flushed the orderbook again", "oops mispaid dividends again", "HELLO I AM THE CEO OF BITCOIN, HERE IS THE BITCOIN EXAM, oh what do you mean btc addresses don't keep a balance?" "it's not socialized losses, it's btc cartelisation research" "you were being an asshole so I banned your mpex account"
Framedragger: quotation with right-handed text is fucked
asciilifeform: it was lulzy, kako promised 'proof that mircea_popescu is really nigerian' or similar
Framedragger: ftr i haven't made up my mind and a man is more complex than just a binary state machine
mircea_popescu: i am what ?!
Framedragger: haha
mircea_popescu: anyway, so what's the problem ? guy thinks he's on to something, this is the bread and butter of a life of the mind.
asciilifeform: i've tried and failed to convince the fella to write up his 'something'
Framedragger: my frustration with kako is that he doesn't think it's worth the time to write up a coherent narrative from his point of view. i'm sure it'd be useful to have it. maybe it's because it's impossible to have one in that case; maybe not; i for one don't fucking know
mircea_popescu: yeah well, these things take a while. go have einstein write up "his something" the year prior his writing it you know ?
asciilifeform: and hey, i might learn that i also was always nigerian?
Framedragger: :D
mircea_popescu: this is fucking absurd, not like guy never saw me ? wtf.
mircea_popescu: is the idea here that "whatever, we've already fucked ourselves with anyone with a clue, might as well say things that'd perhaps persuade a fraction of anyone else" ? or what, is "nigerian" more of a state of mind than a state of pigmentation ?
asciilifeform: mind
Framedragger: totally sure it was meant with "mind". it's kinda gotten out of hand and is imho not constructive; i mean, to keep to this narrative but not put it into (coherent stream of) words
asciilifeform: as i understand, he now disbelieves in all of mircea_popescu that he had not personally seen
mircea_popescu: heh sure, anyone can be anything etc. whatevs.
mircea_popescu: to get back to it, "i am suspicious of this mp fellow" is not an ideology ; nor in itself much of a problem.
thestringpuller: ;;later tell diana_coman RE: our conversation of engines >> http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/KevinNormann/20160412/270186/Game_Engines_Past_Present_and_Future.php
asciilifeform: the really depressing bit about kako is that he floats in a vacuum now.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger it's trauma, dude. he did what he earnestly believed was right at the time ; turns out to have been entirely and unmitigatedly wrong. this is catastrophic, and especially so in poorly socialized, introverted, intelligent males. now gotta reevaluate everything, the evaluations often don't come out meaningful, the correct alternatives are frequently perceived as alf-impossible, it's a mess.
asciilifeform: i suggested various constructive lines of work to him, and (mega-unsurprise) it did not help.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: don't disagree with your characterization. but i don't think the "entirely and unmitigatedly wrong" is objectively / necessarily the case. mining konspiracy, i don't know, mircea. but at this point i'm too out of the loop for the "i" to be mean anything here.
mircea_popescu: ftr : my "fuck you, you may not be poor and be here" is not (as i'm certain oft perceived, because why the fuck not, it's easier) simply mp-superby. it is a strict and absolute necessity for one's own mental health.
Framedragger: to mean*
mircea_popescu: this is BECAUSE people who are poor often lack the specific sort of sophistication that will keep them from falling in that exact hole.
asciilifeform: eh the fella is richer than , e.g., asciilifeform
Framedragger: asciilifeform: this is prolly again one of those "mind" things
mircea_popescu: i dunno what it is ; but the risk is certainly there.
asciilifeform: Framedragger: in case you didn't know - kako sits on a tall pile of earlyadoptronium (and also bbetronium)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform as a model, i propose to you that there's no substantial difference between this and say your bizarro position re llvm yest.
mircea_popescu: not in its substance, MIND YOU
mircea_popescu: in its expression.
asciilifeform: he doesn't work for money and doesn't, as i understand, ever intend to.
mircea_popescu: i have slaves who also don't ; so has the welfare state. this doesn't makethem "richer than x". they are the 0 of poor.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: my position came from a substantial stint of actual study and experiment with llvm.
mircea_popescu: so yes, in this sense, it IS a "mind thing"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes, but your expression of that position came from five minutes of being a teenage boy alone.
Framedragger: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160907/from:569/to:569#569 << interesting - but i agree with mircea_popescu here that it's not entirely relevant, as it's not meant in that sense. but, interesting ☟︎
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [13:28:09] <asciilifeform> Framedragger: in case you didn't know - kako sits on a tall pile of earlyadoptronium (and also bbetronium)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu is invited to write article where llvm is described eloquently ..
mircea_popescu: yeah sure, soon as apple's check clears.
jurov: https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/comments/51gjs3/hillary_just_vomited_snot_into_a_glass_then_drank/
asciilifeform: but i have nfi how to fit it in 1 line as other than 'elaborate work of evil, baited mousetrap.'
mircea_popescu: i'm not trying to repress you! i'm just using things.
mircea_popescu: it's not "x was wrong, bad alfie!" it's "well review how x worked and it'll offer a model for how y works"
asciilifeform: lel
asciilifeform: jurov: mega-disappoint! where is the vomit?
mircea_popescu: Framedragger the miner conspiracy is in no way related to any of this ; however. if you recall, that disagreement as such resulted in entirely no friction.
Framedragger: oh really? interesting. but in http://trilema.com/2016/the-greatly-anticipated-bitbet-sbbet-february-2016-statement/ there is that "Cost of doing business in Bitcoin : 17.94766149 BTC"
mircea_popescu: if someone shouts "down with the government" and then tries to grab a policeman's gun, he will be prosecuted ; and he will obviously claim "it's political". nevertheless...
mircea_popescu: Framedragger sure. businesses will on occasion run into unexpected costs. this is a fact of [business] life.
asciilifeform: his position was, and afaik remains, ' mircea_popescu's misconfiguted btctron blew away 17+, he should pay ' etc.
asciilifeform: *configured
mircea_popescu: and this is, as you notice, entirely divorced from that.
asciilifeform: i do not yet notice?
Framedragger: wasn't the whole point of it that kako disagreed of you attempting to charge bbet money for spending money twice (ironically, zero fee tx will be more difficult with no block size increase - which i'm against, too). that this was not in the gpg contract. so he did not sign bbet statement. and then bbet proceeded to be liquidated. you also disabled his mpex account for an unsigned comment on qntra or wherever which did not breach any clau
Framedragger: se of the gpg contract, but that's separate, too, i guess
mircea_popescu: that it's a smoothly working machinery, where escalation was tried and failed and then tried and failed and then and failed AND THEN TRIED!!! and failed does not excuse one from pretending "the last step" is "because the first step".
mircea_popescu: there bowls of "fuck me, i'm stupid" to be eaten at every juncture. perhaps of increasing size, it is true, but there nevertheless.
mircea_popescu: the anal child's "you didn't buy me my toy so it's your fault i'm a junkie" only works in the mind of the anal child.
asciilifeform: i happen to think that kako was a bloody fool for signing up for '0 asset corp'
asciilifeform: it is like that no-fat lab mouse
asciilifeform: if you forget to feed it just once...
asciilifeform: or it gets excited and runs a little too long
mircea_popescu: Framedragger not only separate, but entirely nobody's concern. i can ban anyone for any reason or for no reason and i offer no explanations. this is how, you know, your bank works, also.
asciilifeform: i did point this to him.
mircea_popescu: aaaanyway.
mircea_popescu goes back to his article.
asciilifeform goes back to his unspeakable horrors.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: absolutely. and at the same time you can understand why a bunch of people do not intend to hold any money with you ("these people have money?!" - mp laughs), because even if the "ban" is legit, it doesn't exactly inspire things.
Framedragger goes back to $job :(
trinque: are we back to opining on a man's private business decisions like it's reddit or what
Framedragger: that's a ridiculous slippery slope; street thieves also run private business enterprises in that respect, i suppose
asciilifeform: oh but in other noose, https://sourceforge.net/p/pupnp/bugs/133
Framedragger stops fruitless antagonising
asciilifeform: (upnp) 'There is a heap buffer overflow vulnerability in the create_url_list function in upnp/src/gena/gena_device.c. I first discovered this vulnerability when working with version 1.6.19 and have confirmed that it also exists in the latest code on the master branch.'
asciilifeform: ^ asciilifeform knew the fella reporting subj bug in meatspace
trinque: Framedragger: your mouth runs a bit, you know.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: ah...fuck. lol. RCE possible. good times
Framedragger: trinque: it happens
asciilifeform: this ain't the first upnpism either
asciilifeform: we burned it out of trb with hot irons, first thing, for a reason.
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/bqIzy << cached copy for mircea_popescu et al.
pete_dushenski: http://archive.is/W1LdS << $1.3bn airdropped by bahamas in tehran. there's your inflation, folks. there too is your 'no one cancelled cash' (tm)(r)
pete_dushenski: in other news, my best tenants of all time are leaving at the end of the month. a sadness is me. i give chances of equally quiet, punctual, respectful couple 2:1 against
pete_dushenski: that alice_ was a character. much log skipping. ☟︎
pete_dushenski: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535808 << heh. first xtian bible, then alkie's bible, spinoza's ethics next ? ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 03:46 jhvh1: 5. Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
pete_dushenski: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/3800/3800-h/3800-h.htm#chap04 << having the propositions from part iv in jhvh1 's repertoire would be mega-lulzy
mircea_popescu: while doing research, http://trilema.com/2014/on-periphery-and-the-peripheral-ephemerides-are-also-mentioned/#selection-71.0-77.0
mircea_popescu: nothing quite like old articles i swears.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger eh, right. they'll go to coinbase instead. like before, there's a reason for that "these people have money?!" - mp laughs ; and the reason is that people who have money either do better research than this or else soon enough don't have money.
mircea_popescu: which has been, of course, a point throughout these many many years.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i thought gena was a test suite.
mircea_popescu: ah nm, it's just an enumerator etc for "internet of things" nonsense.
pete_dushenski: "Firstly, you see ? Firstly, how you convince the girls you're a Casanova riding two stallions. Then, how you lose your virginity. In that order.
pete_dushenski: " << lelz
pete_dushenski back to researching moving co's
mircea_popescu: ). ))).
mircea_popescu: god damned. only on trilema ;/
trinque: getting lispy over there mp?
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: (fair enough, i understand your viewpoint here)
mircea_popescu: these damned notes!
mircea_popescu: they're a buggy implementation of half of common lisp!
Framedragger: in other news, znc took more time to reconnect upon connection failure than i want it to take. gonna improve things.
trinque: Framedragger: I'll be writing up the whole deployment and hosting side of things sometime today.
trinque: and an example command service
trinque: choosing the stack I did was born of experience
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1536057 << the git link was a brainmelter tho. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 13:57 pete_dushenski: that alice_ was a character. much log skipping.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535905 << even had own bignumatron. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 05:23 asciilifeform: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/.abandoned/crypto.ζ << mega-lol
asciilifeform: oops
asciilifeform: wrong link
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535923 . ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 05:45 asciilifeform: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/.archive/hydrocarboner/src/main.cpp#L442 << ?!
asciilifeform: i can picture some nut in a jail cell, to whom they gave a computer. for 20 years. and we get this.
asciilifeform: bool fucks(i64 p) ...
trinque: brony davis
asciilifeform: davis is a respectable man !11111
asciilifeform: wrote actual os that runs on actual iron
asciilifeform: not jsolade.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535929 << cable modem. arizona. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 06:09 a111: Logged on 2015-12-03 16:55 adlai: industrious must be got rid of, for he is too dangerous."
asciilifeform: argh, http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535930 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 09:31 deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/25735C9524851A27C6B6968F1E24B64A6E2D529B5BF16D96F922E1FF96FFEDF9 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 29 divides RSA Moduli belonging to ' (ssh-rsa key from (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <sshscan-queries+>; '
asciilifeform: << for extra lulz.
asciilifeform: http://creative-manager.com << subj ?
asciilifeform: 'WELCOME TO The #1 Project Management Software for the Creative Industry Introducing Workamajig Platinum, the all-in-one solution for your creative team.'
asciilifeform: https://www.gta.com << who made his firewall thing.
asciilifeform: 'Introducing our most powerful firewall UTM appliance - the GB-2600 UTM firewall. The new firewall appliance is powered by a 3.5 Ghz Intel i3 Dual Core CPU, with 4GB of RAM, 8GB static memory storage and provides 6 fully configurable gigabit network interfaces with the option of adding multiple 10G network interfaces. Enhanced Virtual Private Networking with hardware acceleration is standard on the GB-2600.' << but apparently 29 divi
asciilifeform: des its rsa key...
asciilifeform: 'GB-OS has standard UTM features which can be augmented with subscription options that enhance the firewall capabilities. ' << can chump buy a working rng??
asciilifeform: http://www.cvedetails.com/product/2275/Global-Technology-Associates-Gnat-Box-Firmware.html?vendor_id=1304 ( https://archive.is/HoCmE ) << nadia heninger NOT mentioned...
asciilifeform: i guess she only does bad-rng, and not absent-primality-test...
asciilifeform: or wat.
asciilifeform: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/700B8BCB736ABB90FBD44CF67F97D08BC607249723DCD55DBC2A7CD36C495D4E << earlier pop with IDENTICAL KEY
asciilifeform: (the latter box is sadly now dead)
trinque: dhcp?
asciilifeform: nfi
asciilifeform: is running openssh 6.6 btw.
mod6: <+asciilifeform> we burned it out of trb with hot irons, first thing, for a reason. << werd. thx.
asciilifeform: in other lulz, https://archive.is/TnGrv -- 'For a while it looked as if the situation could escalate. A Justice Department lawyer representing the NSA demanded that Gilmore surrender his illegal copies and threatened that the NSA might send its own operatives, or FBI agents, to seize Friedman’s proofs from Gilmore. The cypherpunks were worried — especially Gilmore’s lawyer, Lee Tien. They were worried not just for their own per
asciilifeform: sonal freedom, but for the freedom of the country. At academic crypto conferences, rumors were making the rounds that the NSA had already raided the New York Public Library and reclassified documents that used to be public, and that in 1983 they had already removed Friedman’s personal correspondence from public access...'
asciilifeform: or lulzy sealandisms, 'One of HavenCo’s main investors, Avi Friedman, was worried about the Y2K problem, so he withdrew about $2 million in cash, in $100 bills, and kept the cash at home. He doled out $1,500 at a time, to make minimum payments. Lackey started using his own credit cards, spending ever more money that he didn’t have.'
asciilifeform wonders whether this actually happened
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535934 << i also added your links to crossref ( for example the little hand here, http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1536009 ) ☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 09:34 Framedragger: phf: thanks for adding scriba btcbase log's list of bots btw
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 13:30 Framedragger: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160907/from:569/to:569#569 << interesting - but i agree with mircea_popescu here that it's not entirely relevant, as it's not meant in that sense. but, interesting
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [13:28:09] <asciilifeform> Framedragger: in case you didn't know - kako sits on a tall pile of earlyadoptronium (and also bbetronium)
phf: kek
mircea_popescu: lol. phf let each bot do its own.
phf: mircea_popescu: well, i want the arrows to still work, so i explicitly ignore his for quoting
shinohai still prefers readability of phf's logs, no offense to Framedragger
asciilifeform also
mircea_popescu: well ok but you can't have each bot read each line in chat what is this.
phf: but there's a nifty way to bring down both bots, which i think i should fix asap
trinque: ehehe
asciilifeform: phf: i did think about this.
trinque: also
asciilifeform: mutually-recursive barf
mircea_popescu: if people reference your thing, let your bot read it ; if people reference his let his bot read it.
mircea_popescu: you can count references any way you please, that's an unrelated matter
phf: mircea_popescu: that's not the problem above though
mircea_popescu: oh it recursed ?
phf: a111 quoted the two btcbase urls. one of the urls contained mkj url, so scriba quoted that
mircea_popescu: this is actually not bad.
asciilifeform: phf: neato
phf: unless you post a mutually recursive url (one that contains both links at the same time and references another one that contains both)
mircea_popescu: if you do that i'll ban you, how about that.
mircea_popescu: the problem is that as discussion progresses, there will be genuine references that are very long./
mircea_popescu: i think best would be if phf Framedragger and everyone ever running a log bot limits the number of lines the bot will read without interruption from human to three.
mircea_popescu: for the needs of this, however, we'd have to keep a list of bots, which is mildly obnoxious.
mircea_popescu: #trilema, at the forefront of ai research.
shinohai: All jhvh1 wants is to be sure you have a working copy of trb when X-Day comes
phf: actually looking at code i'm already using my bot list to ignore bot messages when annotating, which is not the best behavior
phf: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160907/from:680/to:680#680
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [15:18:47] <phf> http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535934 << i also added your links to crossref ( for example the little hand here, http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1536009 )
phf: ftr ("assbot" "gribble" "lobbesbot" "deedbot" "a111" "a111``" "scriba" "jhvh1")
asciilifeform: what's a111`` ?
asciilifeform: and assbot dun live here, and neither, afaik, lobbesbot
phf: the list is also used to grey out messages from bots on btcbase, so it should contain all the historic bots too
mircea_popescu: lobbesbot lives in #eulora ; lobbes- did it.
mircea_popescu: but yes, we cameto a crossroad, where ai denizens are actually a significant enough portion of the republic's cohorts.
shinohai: Is tb0t not included in list?
phf: shinohai: it is now
shinohai: o7
mircea_popescu: "all ais are subject to registration. any ai found without proper registration will be destroyed."
shinohai chisels this into republic law stones
Framedragger: ah! lol. in relation to mutual recursion, scriba won't repeat same line forever, fwiw; it will switch to "..."; but mutual destruction hasn't been empirically tested, so heh.
Framedragger: i'm not sure regarding explicit list of bots for each bot for good citizenry / collaboration purposes, but as phf said his bot already does that, kinda.
Framedragger: (if same irc nick invokes same line multiple lines that line won't be repeated foreva; so there's that)
Framedragger: believe it or not bot writers (scriba just piggybacks on a general bot) think about these things, sometimes :p
Framedragger: of course a mutual recursive *chain* could maybe be constructed....
Framedragger: regarding readability, yah /me prefers phf's html too, i think :D i'll see about it after more important things are taken care of; but it's prolly good to have different designs, too.
Framedragger: and yeah cool stuff phf
Framedragger: only question right now, is this http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160907/from:698/to:700#698 a good thing - i think that it's not bad, too
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [1/3] [15:21:52] <mircea_popescu> oh it recursed ?
scriba: [2/3] [15:22:03] <phf> a111 quoted the two btcbase urls. one of the urls contained mkj url, so scriba quoted that
scriba: [3/3] [15:22:14] <mircea_popescu> this is actually not bad.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger i think it should only work in pm.
Framedragger: hmm good point, there's pm, too
mircea_popescu: or maybe i should have a way to direct it, i guess, http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160907/from:698/to:700#698 > alf then he pms that to alf.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [1/3] [15:21:52] <mircea_popescu> oh it recursed ?
scriba: [2/3] [15:22:03] <phf> a111 quoted the two btcbase urls. one of the urls contained mkj url, so scriba quoted that
scriba: [3/3] [15:22:14] <mircea_popescu> this is actually not bad.
mircea_popescu: whoops.
Framedragger: yah.
mircea_popescu: though honestly, i'm not sure why it's useful, other than you liking it. people routinely read around linked items.
Framedragger: makes sense to me
mircea_popescu: or at least they'd god damned better.
Framedragger: i guess it has a socialist bent to it - i thought - noobs won't read actual logs so might as well quote what's actually needed; and, it is useful for when it's just a couple of lines. but it does add to the thickness of logz.
phf: Framedragger: also i did notice that utc+3 to utc shift midday ;)
mircea_popescu: Framedragger we don't cater to stupid.
Framedragger: phf: ...yeah. i wanted to switch to utc so changed environment settings for when it next restarted and then it restarted sooner than expected. SUCH ENGINEERING :/
Framedragger: i'll have to re-do the whole dates/times thing anyway once i move to postgres, which i want to do anyway
Framedragger: it's the proper way.
Framedragger: btw this is such $s il n'y a pas de hors-texte
Framedragger: !!s il n'y a pas de hors-texte
Framedragger: and a bit of simulacra&simulation vibe, too
Framedragger: !!s s il n'y a pas de hors-texte
Framedragger: "i recall this being mentioned before" (tm)
mircea_popescu: !!search hors-texte
mircea_popescu: da fuck anymore.
Framedragger: there should be a bot which gives help about bots
phf: clippybot
Framedragger: Would you like help?
Framedragger: * Get help slaughtering the mafia states
Framedragger: * Proofread your declaration of independence
shinohai: LOL
shinohai: !~bash 5 ✂︎
jhvh1: Last 5 lines bashed and pending publication
mircea_popescu: jhvh1 i mean shinohai : is there a web for your bash ?
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: Error: "i" is not a valid command.
mircea_popescu likes to lol.
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-06#1535083 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-06 16:31 mircea_popescu: lol! review the history. the bar in 2016 is "make a bot" ; the bar in 2014 was "get a gpg key".
shinohai: There will be soon on bit-box, got to add one more thing to make it update properly.
mircea_popescu: kk
trinque: Framedragger: ftr I don't subscribe to the "bot checks to make sure it doesn't resend lines" party
trinque: wtf is telling it to?
trinque: fix that
trinque: pretty soon you've got a onanismd
Framedragger: trinque: you mean, it's okay for bot to keep repeating same line requested by same person in quick succession? hm maybe
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-19#1525010 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-19 09:25 Framedragger: "butt sex, too"
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-19#1525010 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-19 09:25 Framedragger: "butt sex, too"
trinque: beat the idiot
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-19#1525010 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-19 09:25 Framedragger: "butt sex, too"
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-19#1525010 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-19 09:25 Framedragger: "butt sex, too"
trinque: what, you need me to negrate you to make the point? calm down
Framedragger: i was just testing
Framedragger: trinque: ok maybe. but the restriction is an easy way of trapping some non-halting scenarions
Framedragger off for now, sorry for pollution; good day for the logs
trinque: cheers
asciilifeform: in other noose, (yes, 1 box) has been ddosing trb nodes, in particular zoolag. ☟︎
asciilifeform: 1000s of connections /sec.
asciilifeform: https://cancoin.co << owner.
asciilifeform: well, dosing.
asciilifeform: no 'd'.
shinohai: "mulit-sig sekooooority!"
asciilifeform: at one time i considered adding, e.g., rate limiter, to trb, but decided that it is not the Right Thing.
trinque echoed asciilifeform's nothing for showing up sentiment just above
asciilifeform: trinque: 'nothing for showing up' is quite physically impossible with tcp.
asciilifeform: and with nonwotronic net.
trinque: aha
asciilifeform: the correct way to - while we still must - run traditional bitcoin, is with a wotronic net having 1,001 'tendrils' into heathendom (conventional nodes).
asciilifeform: conventional in the 'trb as we now have it' sense.
asciilifeform: the kind that accepts tcp conns from all-comers.
phf: can also implement some kind of nerfing with iptables, using -m limit --limit n/s. there's also a stateful --seconds m --hitcount n
phf: !~bible matthew 22:21
jhvh1: phf: [KJV] Matthew 22:21 :: They say unto him, Caesar's. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's.
asciilifeform: !~bible matthew 10:34
jhvh1: asciilifeform: [KJV] Matthew 10:34 :: Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
phf: :D
asciilifeform: !~fortune
jhvh1: asciilifeform: Error: "fortune" is not a valid command.
asciilifeform: eh.
phf: also need shakespeare and imdb quotes database
phf: !~joke #15
jhvh1: phf: Error: "joke" is not a valid command.
mircea_popescu: imdb quotes ?! srsly ?!
asciilifeform would rather not
asciilifeform: phf: ip ban is also problematic in the sense that enemy can easily spoof any number of faux SYNs from, e.g., my box, to yours
phf: that was an efnet joke
asciilifeform: plaintext 'all-comers' net is not a thing long for this world.
shinohai: asciilifeform !~bible matthew 10:34 <<< this is why I said alf is a vengeful god, no better than Jehovah
phf: sort of how back in eggdrop days people would load tons of 3rd party plugins into their bot making it both unstable and exploitable. there was always some buffer overflow in !fart or somesuch
shinohai: eggdrop had a *telnet* server ffs
mircea_popescu: o hey, exactly how wordpress is intended to work!
phf: i
phf: err, my memory doesn't go further out, but i suspect eggdrop was first case of wordpress plugin ecosystem with similar implications
trinque: nah, windows was released earlier
trinque: zing!
trinque: they apparently jammed JS into eggdrop in 2002. ahead of its time.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: https://archive.is/wPpuN << in other amerilulz
trinque: anarchists protesting lenient govt sentencing, lul
asciilifeform: quite the circus.
asciilifeform: esp. considering that if you show up with so much as a slingshot in public, but for some non-usg-approved reason, you will at the very least be relieved of your valuables (incl. slingshot) by police.
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2016/superficial-ustardian-onanism-suto/ << Trilema - Superficial UsTardian Onanism (SUTO)
hanbot: (from mircea_popescu's latest) "A: A tulpa can think independantly from its creator, can have different opinions, views, tastes, etc. from its creator, provide companionship, talk directly to anyone inside the same body (including its creator and other tulpas), control and manipulate the physical body like you, recall the memories that you have if you give them the permission and more, but basically a tulpa is a conscious mind like you and can do the
hanbot: same things like you can." desperately need moar accounts stupidity
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/M3Q7D << from fishwrap linked earlier. 'Denmark pays up to £1m for documents from anonymous source and plans to investigate up to 600 Danes who may have evaded tax.'
asciilifeform: 'Denmark has become the first country in the world to apparently buy data from the Panama Papers leak, and now plans to investigate whether 500-600 Danes who feature in the offshore archive may have evaded tax. Denmark’s tax minister, Karsten Lauritzen, said he will pay up to DKK9m (£1m) for the information, which comes from the Panamanian law firm Mossack Fonseca. He said an anonymous source approached the Danish government over
asciilifeform: the summer.'
asciilifeform digs in to 'suto' piece
mircea_popescu grins
asciilifeform: the 'tulpa' thing inescapably reminds me of zweig's 'schachnovelle'
mircea_popescu: it inescapably reminds me of the insane asylum.
asciilifeform: noshit.jpg
mircea_popescu: loads of folks there with various "tulpae"
asciilifeform: but in the past not so many folks wanted to enter that state voluntarily.
mircea_popescu: in the past many folks also had better options.
asciilifeform: and the 'tulpists' do not ?
asciilifeform: btw, 'alice_' (reddit) -- 'I am a tulpa created by a roughly similar process. Except in this case I took over from my creator and she died.' ( https://archive.is/AVQbD )
trinque: http://trilema.com/2015/peripateticists-kinda-except-girls-not-boys-bare-cunt-instead-of-toga-and-walking-around-the-house-not-the-garden-but-otherwise-exactly-the-same/ << y'know they'll say all this then drown the kids in the bathtub
trinque: funny creatures
asciilifeform: waiwat
trinque: being a killer is not absent in women, though they'll deny it with fuzzy bunnies all day long
asciilifeform: killing per se is a normal and healthy thing.
trinque: ofc
asciilifeform: and there are millions now walking who ought to have drowned in tub.
asciilifeform: not mega-seekrit.
trinque: also in mp's article there; teh culture is broken
trinque: http://archive.is/VK3FS << this is too much
shinohai: I never realized such level of retardation existed.
asciilifeform: shinohai: it ~doesn't.
asciilifeform: these are folk who got bored with the usual retardation (because it is deadly boring, even to practitioners) and tried to invent 'new' types.
hanbot: heh, seems mircea_popescu and diana_coman co-own the term "pluriously", as per google
asciilifeform: e plurious unum !11111
asciilifeform: 'His attitude towards Andresen, the public, the poor and the residents of Mali is despicable. ... Because most of us likely have hosted wallets somewhere, the decision will be largely out of the general public's hands, though.' << gold. how did i miss this.
asciilifeform: 'Bitcoin's marketing is predicated on poor "third world country" people adopting it for remittances. A high transaction fee network will come across as a betrayal. It is not something the powers that be will risk.' << didjaknow.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no fucking way ?!
asciilifeform: which
mircea_popescu: alice reddit.
asciilifeform: it was where i found it!
mircea_popescu: these were, believe it or not, unrelated strands.
asciilifeform: it wrote to me (reddit has a pm thing)
asciilifeform: and i reflexively mailed it back phuctor 'contact' link (~all of my 'fan mail' is phuctor-related these days)
mircea_popescu: aaanyway.
mircea_popescu very much welcomes criticism / improvement / further research of teh suto.
asciilifeform: i ended up, to my woe, looking up the 'pony' thing trinque mentioned, there are ~0 actual females there btw.
asciilifeform: which is lulzy because the thing at its root is some american cartoon about (all-female!) unicorns.
asciilifeform: who were originally a plastic toy, and the maker commissioned a 'toyetic' (actual term of art) tv show to market it with.
asciilifeform: sorta how 'adventures of gummi bears' happened in 1980s.
asciilifeform: (there was a ru translation! and no one had any fucking notion that there ever existed the candy, much less that it preceded that children's cartoon.)
mircea_popescu: what pony thing ?
mircea_popescu: oh, i thought you meant ponygirls. iirc "brony" was for a while years ago a pedo rally cry.
mircea_popescu: much like habbo hotel worked a decade prior.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535770 , http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535767 , http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1535903 . ☝︎☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 03:27 trinque: afaik you identify as a pony or some shit
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 03:27 trinque: https://www.google.com/images?q=alice0meta << brony
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 05:21 asciilifeform: https://github.com/alice0meta/scratch/blob/master/.abandoned/data%20science/fimscrape.ζ << guess wat, trinque had it.
thestringpuller: spells of genesis joins the hype train: https://news.bitcoin.com/spells-genesis-mainstream-success/
mircea_popescu: no, you don't "identify as a pony". you pretend to be interested in a preteen cartoon show because a) trying to talk with preteens online and b) if you do it enough maybe it normalizes.
trinque: the cover theory makes a great deal of sense.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller because totally skinning a product is innovation now.
thestringpuller: at least its pretty
asciilifeform: ζζζζζζ!111111
mircea_popescu: remarkably enough, the don't mention the ~only bitcoin game worth the mention other than eulora, that being a tale in the desert.
mircea_popescu: aaanwyay, roger ver and friends, doomed by stupidity.
thestringpuller: well tale of the desert isn't bitcoin based. that's a knights tale by the same guy
mircea_popescu: a right right.
thestringpuller: also a tale in the desert gets REALLY boring
mircea_popescu: same engine.
thestringpuller: but it's crafting system is unprecedented.
thestringpuller: but who am i to judge "boring" the countless hours watching tv to kill time while waitng to get in an FFXI party to play for like maybe 30 minutes of combat
mircea_popescu finds magic the gathering and clones boring, for that matter.
thestringpuller: anyhow. the srs MTG crowd actually think SoG is a joke, it may pull some player, but there's no point.
shinohai: Wasn't "Spells of Genesis" another Voorhees enterprise?
thestringpuller: i think that's why it pivoted to arcade game with "card battle system"
mircea_popescu: which is exactly what i meant above. really, they skinned someone else's thing ?
asciilifeform: ftr, the ζ thing almost led me to wonder if 'alice' wasn't an educational experiment created by mircea_popescu .
asciilifeform: punishment, for my sins.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i had no hand in any of this!
asciilifeform: (per the 'orc symbols' and 'cheap sybils' threads!111)
asciilifeform: aite.
mircea_popescu: and i'm still reeling from the tulpa coincidence.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: skinned someone else's thing << Just cause facebook lined up a billion idiots. And WoW poached MTG pkayers for "Hearthstone", kinda just biomass going from time waster to time waster
mircea_popescu: it is strictly possible that ~all the facebook/reddit/etc "profiles" belong to a single person.
asciilifeform: it is apparently a fad in yudkowskian 'rationalist' (yes) circles.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller i actually checked out hearthstone. it's fucking boring i dunno how they 15yo manages
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what is ?
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: imagine you're a millennial raised on an ipad and your attention span lasts maybe 1 page of a normal novel.
mircea_popescu: how am i going to imagine that
thestringpuller: Imagine you're the ipad!
thestringpuller: XD
mircea_popescu: lol
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the massive stash in the git, of 'this program is written in 'vrelta', which is written in 'ukuku, resting in all its pride and glory' is not shannonized. i am satisfied that it is the multi-year product of genuine madness.
mircea_popescu: how did you achieve this satisfaction ?
thestringpuller: this imo is why the state of gaming is where it is. Games have become "babysitters", rather than quality toys.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: largely by familiarity with the process. i personally grew up doing it. and this is 3rd example i run into publicly to date (others being mr mold and terry davis.)
ben_vulpes: subject of ipad, apple is picking a fight with the 3.5mm audio jack
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: old noose.
thestringpuller: ben_vulpes: They trynna to patent it cause "Square" et. al?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: ever since koreans came out with the watertight pnoje , demonstratively shipped in a jar of water, crapple threatened same
mircea_popescu: ah this finally happened ?
asciilifeform: the korean one happened years ago
asciilifeform: but iirc it still had a jack, with a rubber stopper
asciilifeform: !!s ampoule phone
mircea_popescu: for anyone who spent childhood around kids comparing the "waterproofness" of their watches, by meter depth - esp kids who never went into water
asciilifeform: $s ampoule phone
a111: 1 result for "ampoule phone", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=ampoule%20phone
mircea_popescu: that the same will occur to "smart" phones was expected.
thestringpuller: ben_vulpes: from what it sounds like they can't make money on the 3.5mm jack, so they gonna make a USB lightning adapter?!?!?
thestringpuller: "If you have a favourite pair of older earphones or headphones, you can plug them into the Lightning or USB-C jack with a little adapter. Some will have splitters so that you can charge your phone and plug in headphones simultaneously." << what the actual fuck
ben_vulpes: "why ditch analog stereo headphone jacks? well, we're still smarting from losing the firewire/usb format war, so we're going to pick a fight with a defacto industry standard."
asciilifeform: ah so no ampoule phone yet.
mircea_popescu: "older" being the keyword. what happened to you know, "better".
asciilifeform: just a 'let's make proprietary jack' thing.
asciilifeform: so 1990s.
trinque: they're gonna beam microwaves through your skull moar now
thestringpuller: I don't understand it, cause bluetooth traditionally sucks for audio fidelity
asciilifeform: bluetooth sucked from the 'pairing' thing.
thestringpuller: this is why as an audiophile, I have a vinyl player at work.
asciilifeform: (srsly, multi-second delays?!)
asciilifeform: which is why the logitech mouse proprietary-radio thing still sells so well
asciilifeform: 0 delay.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller here's a little understood bit of corporate insanity : if a dying company dies normally, it is assumed the ceo & co were idiots ; if it dies as a result of doing something large and monunemtally stupid, it is assumed the ceo & team were brave souls who caught a bad break.
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: you ever try watching a movie on early bluetooth headphones?
mircea_popescu: this stimulates a lot of outright insane behaviour in large companies.
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: early bluetooth was ~unusable entirely.
mircea_popescu: stupidity on an epic scale not only didn't end carly fiorina's career among her own kind - but actually made her hillary's best friend
mircea_popescu: a hillary who is also known for similar approach.
thestringpuller: from all my ventures into being an audiophile at some point the analog tech produces sounds your ears can't even hear
thestringpuller: hence why flac files are like gigs large
trinque: one song flac is ~40MB
thestringpuller: trinque: sorry: meant vinyl rips of albums.
thestringpuller: Like the rip my friend did of one of my 70's Stevie Wonder albums was like ~2 gb
jurov: vinyl has its own artifacts, no?
mircea_popescu: this seems altogether a dubious proposition seeing how for all the wankery now surrounding them, vinyl records are industrial mass products ; from a time when 8kbps was a lot.
asciilifeform: what bps, analogue.
asciilifeform: snr, in db.
jurov: the studio mastering has to shoehorn the record into vinyl's deficiencies (so that the tracks don't touch etc)
mircea_popescu: yes they weren't originally digitized. if you think 1960s microphones and buzzy electronics make for a better quality...
trinque: aha, they rip them in say 24bit/96kHz so they can hear the crackles and pops in ultra high def
asciilifeform: 'audiophilia' is a psychiatric condition.
asciilifeform: we had thread.
thestringpuller: personal prefernce. i tend to like vocals on non condenser mic's cause they sound more "warm"
mircea_popescu recently found out why ~all the casters in 1920/1930s sound the fucking same.
mircea_popescu: the fucking mics!
asciilifeform: noshit.jpg
mircea_popescu: i thought they're just doing that weird voice deliberately
asciilifeform: i had this mike, and a modern one, as a boy, and compared.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well some of us have to do that as adults.
asciilifeform: on 1960s-era sov. tape deck.
asciilifeform: lel
mircea_popescu: i just assumed it's a matter of fashion.
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/sC8F2 << in other lulz, 'Ferguson, Missouri, protest leader found shot dead in burning car: police'
mircea_popescu: anyone seen that great hoffa movie ?
mircea_popescu: seems pertinent, if compressed into just a coupla years.
asciilifeform not familiar
mircea_popescu: !~google hoffa by danny devito
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: Hoffa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoffa>; Hoffa (1992) - IMDb: <http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0104427/>; Reel history | Hoffa : DeVito shouldn't have hassled the Hoff? | Film ...: <https://www.theguardian.com/film/2010/mar/11/jimmy-hoffa-jack-nicholson>
mircea_popescu: guy's a pretty good director/
asciilifeform: meanwhile, 'orcs want to be #trilema', https://archive.is/dHnYS
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: in other news, good god how can these idiots be so fucking tedious.
asciilifeform: which
mircea_popescu: uh... SUTOs
mircea_popescu: why the fuck bother looking for a work. redditards, lesswrongians, you name it.
asciilifeform: still working with butterfly collection or wat.
mircea_popescu: apparently the yudkowsky fellow pod' his atrocious fanfic.
asciilifeform: waiwat
mircea_popescu: http://i.imgur.com/XGCg8Dm.jpg
asciilifeform: http://hpmor.com << ?
asciilifeform: ah
asciilifeform: eh, 'print on demand' is ultra-cheap, i once-off code and other materials to take to the beach.
asciilifeform: and so do many folks.
mircea_popescu: yes.
asciilifeform: it is literally cheaper, even in qty==1 (!) than using own printer.
mircea_popescu: yep.
mircea_popescu: esp if you want the shit bound. but even looseleaf.
asciilifeform: well yes.
asciilifeform: hm, isn't that 'harry potter' logo trademarked in usa ?
mircea_popescu: prolly.
mircea_popescu: !!key <is3nn>
mircea_popescu: !!key is3nn
mircea_popescu: hm
mircea_popescu: !!key mircea_popescu
trinque looks
mircea_popescu: ty
deedbot hands you a broomstick.
trinque: it barfed a "no address associated with name" trying to talk to wotpaste
mircea_popescu: dns ?
trinque: mircea_popescu: yes, but will now change that.
trinque: ben_vulpes: pls to sign current wotpaste IP
trinque: also this just got an error message:
trinque: !!key is3nn
deedbot: No such key.
trinque: !!key trinque
mircea_popescu: aha
deedbot: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/r/010kf/?raw=true
asciilifeform: in lulz elsewhere, 'The new iPhones will be more durable than any that have come before, at least when it comes to serious corruption from water and dust. The next-gen models meet the IP67 protection standard, which is good enough to briefly drop it in a pool (or, more likely, a toilet) but not good enough to shower with regularly.'
asciilifeform: the toilet thing is, iirc, an actually common failure mode.
asciilifeform: (dun ask me how.)
asciilifeform: and, best of all,
asciilifeform: 'AirPods will use Infrared sensors to detect when they’re in your ears, playing only when they’re in your ears. The setup process is super easy — connect the AirPods once to your iPhone, and the AirPods instantly sync over iCloud to your other devices. From there, you never worry about them again.' >> oblig. >> http://www.loper-os.org/?p=752 ☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: coming soon to a pnoje near yoo: 'ЕГГОГ: UNAUTHORIZED EAR'
asciilifeform: Closing The Analogue Hole!11111 (tm) (r)
asciilifeform: (or what, analogue jack abolished 'for no reason' ?)
thestringpuller: omg 160 bucks for a pair of headphones that will accumulate in earwax
thestringpuller: fucking shit. man.
asciilifeform: there is also the 'accessory license' thing, 'The 3.5mm jack is robust, familiar, secure, well-documented, and so on — we’ve seen the argument play out over the last year. You know why it’s good: because it works, reliably, worldwide, with millions of devices. Without Apple’s permission. See, it’s that last part that must bother them. The idea that someone, somewhere, is doing something with an iPhone that they haven’t an
asciilifeform: ticipated, like making a thermometer or payment system or 3D scanner. Someone who hasn’t paid for a license to attach that thing to their phone.' ( https://archive.is/WLf7L )
shinohai: !!key is3nn
deedbot: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/r/k8p95/?raw=true
mircea_popescu: !!key is3nn
deedbot: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/r/tmggk/?raw=true
mircea_popescu: yeah well... if only the original authors of the us had a way to prevent the current fucktards from using it in a way they hadn't anticipated.
mircea_popescu: btw, was someone asking for http://trilema.com/2012/fucking-a-guide ?
ben_vulpes: !!deed http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/ukwks/?raw=true
deedbot: accepted: 1
ben_vulpes: should probably have a block number in it, eh?
ben_vulpes: anyways, trinque will that suffice for now?
mircea_popescu: it gets the block number through deeding anyway
trinque: ^
ben_vulpes: ah
trinque: ty
trinque: and de-dns'd
deedbot: http://deedbot.org/bundle-428745.txt
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/09/black-man-shot-in-north-saint-louis-county/ << Qntra - Black Man Shot In North Saint Louis County
mircea_popescu: in other random, anyone play a game called "wyvern" ?
mircea_popescu: (apparently a badly balanced something or the other by steve yegge - you know, the supposedly notable derp behind http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com2006/04/lisp-is-not-acceptable-lisp.html and a whole load of java, ruby etc) ☟︎
asciilifeform: yegge appears to be a thing much beloved by alice_ .
mircea_popescu: it's mildly shocking to see the whole pile of supposed lisp experts who are actually not known to have written, let alone run, any lisp.
asciilifeform: how any stranger than sexprerts who have no sex, 'chemists' who never touched glass, the lot.
mircea_popescu: anyway, it's rather evident that there's a mutually-reinforcing ring of idiots. check out yegge's wikipedia article, for instance. curated with love.
asciilifeform: 'Yegge accidentally made an internal Google memo public on Google+ in October 2011. His 3,700-word comment garnered major media and blogger attention for Yegge's pointed commentary criticizing the leanings of the company's technological culture (such as labeling Google+'s minimalist and, in his view, lackluster public platform "a pathetic afterthought") as well as for his comments about his former employer, Amazon (such as calling Am
asciilifeform: azon CEO Jeff Bezos "Dread Pirate Bezos"). Google co-founder Sergey Brin stated that he would still have his job.'
asciilifeform: lel.
mircea_popescu: you prolly recall this, iirc was in the logs.
asciilifeform: 'notable' !11111111
asciilifeform: '...some observations that I think are relevant to anyone who writes programs (start reading from “the dubious future of emacs“). It's hard to argue with the value of self-hosting. It's even harder to argue with the momentum of the browser and dynamic environments.' << gold.
BingoBoingo: lol http://qntra.net/2016/09/bahamas-g20-landing-brouhaha/#comment-69505
BingoBoingo: !!up Lightsword
deedbot: Lightsword voiced for 30 minutes.
shinohai: "i lost the passphrase for the gpg key i created yesterday and i can't decrypt the msg mircea_popescu sent me...is it ok if a create another key and register with this?"
shinohai: lulz
mircea_popescu: sigh
shinohai: Rocket science
mircea_popescu: honestly, he had his shot. next.
mircea_popescu: this isn't no kids left behind club ; but on the contrary.
mircea_popescu: and in other lulz, "The GNU Hurd is under active development. Because of that, there is no stable version." << cca may 2016
mircea_popescu: "It's time [to] explain the meaning of "Hurd". "Hurd" stands for "Hird of Unix-Replacing Daemons". And, then, "Hird" stands for "Hurd of Interfaces Representing Depth". We have here, to my knowledge, the first software to be named by a pair of mutually recursive acronyms." << arguably its most notable accomplishment to date.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: did i fall into a parallel universe some time recently where linus lifting the hurd userland never happened ?
asciilifeform: or wat.
mircea_popescu: what, you think that made them admit they suck ?
mircea_popescu: this is a communist government ; the only cure is grave.
asciilifeform: forget 'admit'
asciilifeform: but it was achievement
asciilifeform: rather than the acronym thing
mircea_popescu: i'm sorry, t
mircea_popescu: i'm sorry, torvalds is achievement of hurd ? wut ?
asciilifeform: and dead folk dun admit things
asciilifeform: afaik.
mircea_popescu: wait wait, stallman died ?
asciilifeform: torvalds lifted the userland utils
mircea_popescu: i prefer "liberated".
asciilifeform: liberated, lifted, pillaged, whichever.
asciilifeform: bsd, recall, in modern sense, was not yet a thing.
asciilifeform: it was gnu's or 'write own'.
mircea_popescu: no, actually, actually architect wanted to just adapt a bsd
mircea_popescu: but stallman wanted to wait n years for some ivy league product.
mircea_popescu: which sucked.
asciilifeform: kernel, mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: yes ?
asciilifeform: bsd userland iirc was not yet available for linuxization.
asciilifeform: (was stuck in copyrast limbo)
mircea_popescu: you meant above the bsd userland didn't exist ?
asciilifeform: existed, payware.
asciilifeform brb - meat
mircea_popescu: so it was, steal from gnu, steal from mit, write own.
mircea_popescu: they stole from the losers. logical.
mircea_popescu: anyway, the original linked lisp verbiage was funny to me mostly because it's all written from the perspective of "object oriented is god". which was very much groupthink cca 2006. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: a ~certain~ groupthink, of a certain sort of people.
mircea_popescu: "At the risk of predicting future fashion trends, which is rarely a good idea, I'll venture that objects are going to continue to be trendy for at least a few more decades. So I think Lisp needs some form of "seamless" OOP." and all that.
BingoBoingo: !~bcstats
jhvh1: BingoBoingo: Current Blocks: 428752 | Current Difficulty: 2.2075590833037228E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 429407 | Next Difficulty In: 655 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 4 days, 10 hours, 56 minutes, and 19 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None
ben_vulpes: lisp has had seamless oop since what the seventies? ☟︎
ben_vulpes: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
shinohai pops popcorn
alice_: hi
mircea_popescu: "So XEmacs has never been a particularly good tool for serious Emacs users because even though it's written in C, it crashes like a mature C++ application." mwahahaha ☟︎
BingoBoingo: re: tulpas, when I first saw the word in use I assumed based on phonetics that hamplanets were ascirbing personalities to their FUPAS
alice_: so does mircea_popescu fool around with tulpas or
shinohai snickers
BingoBoingo recently saw a transmay get winded moving from their scootypuff to a riding lawnmower to see if the small tractors would "fit"
BingoBoingo: Spoiler alert: it didn't fit
BingoBoingo: panniculus spread their legs in a seated position too far to reach the pedals
asciilifeform: hey hey ho ho lbjhasgottogo^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H my inductive probes are here.
asciilifeform: and they actually work, somewhat surprisingly. at least for now. LJ12A3.
asciilifeform: sorta like miniature ww2 minesweepers.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I finally acquired a pair of needlenose pliers that don't seem to suck
asciilifeform: bring within 0.5cm or so of conductive object, and it conducts.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: they're all great when new.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Cutting screws with them at the moment
asciilifeform: alice_: what were vrelta and ukuku ?
alice_: asciilifeform: tell me more about why you're asking. this channel is assholes, which is a communication style i'm not used to, so i'd like more details :)
alice_: i don't mind, just saying ;)
asciilifeform: alice_: think of it as a kind of boot camp.
asciilifeform: n00bz are slowly disassembled into component atoms and - on occasion - reassemble themselves into something that is interesting to have conversation with.
asciilifeform: typically happens ~6 mo. later.
alice_: this _is_ related to why you are assholes
BingoBoingo: See again
BingoBoingo: !~step2
jhvh1: 2. Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: that thing is a snore.
asciilifeform: ftr.
alice_: does mircea_popescu fool around with tulpas
asciilifeform: reminds me of the keychain i spend my first u.s. dollar on, BingoBoingo
BingoBoingo: But it does pull the wings off
asciilifeform: it had 8 buttons, for 8 types of bleep/bloop/etc.
BingoBoingo: AHA
asciilifeform: i traded a hefty shoebox of rubles for it.
asciilifeform: (the dollar, that is.)
asciilifeform: 'echo killer'.
asciilifeform: https://assets.listia.com/photos/1142334/original.jpg?s=320x320m&sig=350ef03a9f127f58&ts=1285207571 << it !
asciilifeform: https://lh4.ggpht.com/nCL4JvwNDPYRV8H_zpxGxVJ57XPfjAK7N1EhW2nE35XF7S3FUqTrzmYRNlQj2vEfeA=h310 << emulator !
BingoBoingo: SWEET!
shinohai: ty asciilifeform
asciilifeform: !!up alice_
deedbot: alice_ voiced for 30 minutes.
asciilifeform: sooo alice_ iirc i was the one you were originally looking for. what do you wish to know..?
jurov: she wanted to know more about assholes
asciilifeform: alice_: mircea_popescu dedicated an entire article to you.
shinohai: Best trilema article I have read all week too
alice_: adorable
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1536560 << emacs, like unix earlier, or much later - bitcoin, was a shitprototype that got stuck in battlefield use ~forever. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 23:10 mircea_popescu: "So XEmacs has never been a particularly good tool for serious Emacs users because even though it's written in C, it crashes like a mature C++ application." mwahahaha
asciilifeform: xemacs was a kind of gavinatronic clone.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1536550 << java/cpp-style oop is not actually oop, but a kind of u.s. mba-endorsed mental bonsaikittenation . ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 22:31 mircea_popescu: anyway, the original linked lisp verbiage was funny to me mostly because it's all written from the perspective of "object oriented is god". which was very much groupthink cca 2006.
asciilifeform: (missing metaobject protocol - no introspection; lack of even such a basic thing as the mix-in)
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1536555 << 'flavours', as seen in zetalisp. released circa '79 iirc. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-09-07 22:45 ben_vulpes: lisp has had seamless oop since what the seventies?
asciilifeform: various larval forms thereof - prior.
asciilifeform: was slow to catch on, because if your language isn't braindamaged, the ~actual~ domain for oopism is quite small.
alice_: asciilifeform: you make up bs insults because {you find it entertaining} and {boot camp narrative} ?
asciilifeform: (largely limited to extremely large system with numerous ~independently functioning modules)
alice_: (not judging, i don't mind)
asciilifeform: alice_: do you know expression 'в чужой монастырь со своим уставом не ходят' ? ☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: i recommend to look it up
asciilifeform: alice_: presumably you are here because you heard that there were interesting folk around, and wished to learn something.
asciilifeform: this happens, just like at your university, in the manner the elders decide. and not the manner the novice prefers. ☟︎
asciilifeform: there are people who do not like this. the exit hatch is to your left, pull the red lever.
alice_: nice, sounds very respectable
alice_: i'm glad you're happy with your life :)
asciilifeform: this here place is full of merry merry folk.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> this happens, just like at your university, in the manner the elders decide. and not the manner the novice prefers. << Unless your university is new Social Justice Mizzou that wants to tear down the original Thomas Jefferson grave marker,
asciilifeform: !!up nacci
deedbot: nacci voiced for 30 minutes.
shinohai: !~translate ru to en в чужой монастырь со своим уставом не ходят
jhvh1: shinohai: in a strange monastery with its regulations do not go
asciilifeform: meh jhvh1
trinque: !!up gabriel_laddel
deedbot: gabriel_laddel voiced for 30 minutes.
asciilifeform: !!up gabriel_laddel
deedbot: gabriel_laddel voiced for 30 minutes.
gabriel_laddel: alice_: what is your ethnicity / where are you from?
asciilifeform: shinohai: approx. 'do not try to slip in with your own set of vows into another's monastery' ☟︎
asciilifeform: somebody oughta buy that fella a new set of pistons for his modem.
trinque: lol
trinque: somewhere a pull-starter clacks
asciilifeform: or was it carburetor.
alice_: i'm p sure there aren't interesting folk around tho
BingoBoingo: Prolly all the ethanol varnished his carbuerator
alice_: i am still entertained by your antics
mircea_popescu: still with this ?
mircea_popescu: !!down alice_
asciilifeform: popped by ze snr police!1111
mircea_popescu: long past its use-by date.