mircea_popescu: if the signed thing is not a thing, or if the signed thing is not available fgor my eyes, no problem has in fact been solved.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31350 @ 0.00068843 = 21.5823 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: deep restructuring of the pgp implementation is required anyway.
assbot: Logged on 21-08-2015 23:09:56; mircea_popescu: fucking abcnews. the defense didn't "decline to do so". the defense DECLINED TO RECOGNISE THE COURT!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47150 @ 0.00066787 = 31.4901 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: 1. full rsa. 2. proper signature encapsulation. 3. sane structuring of the keys. 4. etfc.
mircea_popescu: i guess the next top priority in making cardano which was making bitcoin which was making vdiff is now making gpg.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i guess by being spurred by my recent statement and going into a "let's verify this" mode ?
punkman: "The concatenation of the data being signed and the signature data from the version number through the hashed subpacket data (inclusive) is hashed. The resulting hash value is what is signed. The left 16 bits of the hash are included in the Signature packet to provide a quick test to reject some invalid signatures."
mircea_popescu: The concatenation of the data being signed and the signature data from the version number through the hashed subpacket data (inclusive) is hashed. The resulting hash value is what is signed. The left 16 bits of the hash are included in the Signature packet to provide a quick test to reject some invalid signatures.
punkman: asciilifeform: so... no, it's not THAT bad.
mircea_popescu expects to live in a world where everything is done EXACTLY as he would do it. failure of perceptible world to conform to this expectation is a crime, more serious than any other, and to be punished by destruction.
mircea_popescu: competent thieves should be convicted to jail. incompetent thieves should be broken apart with a small hammer.
mats: Fun fact: the first Minuteman missiles ran off a hard disk as the only available memory. Reads/writes/jumps had to be scheduled to avoid pipeline stalling for a full rotation.
mats: If subroutines were used, they were implemented by writing the return address to their end then jumping.
mats: asciilifeform: I didn't know that. cool.
mircea_popescu: but still, the situation is not equivalent to "singatures are trivially defeated in the field"
punkman: you'll have to spell it out for me
mircea_popescu: anyway, there's no question left that a usable extant pgp implementaton exists. this should be redone.
phf: asciilifeform: maybe hash size is variable where's they wanted to go with fixed size headers. so no matter size of hash you only store first two octets
punkman: phf, it is variable indeed
punkman: and what does collision get you
phf: mircea_popescu: i ~assume~ the intent is to speed up failure
mircea_popescu: i do not wish to eat in the restaurant where they piss in the beer, irrespective of any other consideration.
mircea_popescu: the intent is to rape and pillage, for all orcs, by virtue of being orcs.
phf: if the first two octets don't match you don't have to go through the rest of the signature verification process, since at that point you already know that the signature is invalid
mircea_popescu: and why is it that all the phuctor bad sigs we see are two octet mirrors.
mircea_popescu: ;;google "N-ai fost acolo s-auzi tot ce-am auzit. N-ai fost acolo sa vezi tot ce am vazut. N-ai fost acolo sa vezi tot ce am facut. N-ai fost acolo sa vezi prin tot ce am trecut."
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform is thgat the most likely to be quoted snippet ?
punkman: plenty of success with that "Scallion was used to find collisions for every 32bit key id in the Web of Trust's strong set demonstrating how insecure 32bit key ids are."
mircea_popescu: basically we're uncovering a decade old, very fragile rube goldberg machine
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43800 @ 0.00070518 = 30.8869 BTC [+] {3}
punkman: "# Use a real encryption algorithm to protect the secret keyring, rather than CAST5." << relevant to certain folks that didn't mind posting their encrypted keyrings to keybase.io
mircea_popescu: in principle, i will say "block cipher" is exactly, EXACTLY, provably as retarded as "reusable otp via prng".,
mircea_popescu: it helps in precisely the same way as multiple surgical interventions.
mircea_popescu: no dude, spare me. either this problem is solved or woirked on.
phf: could it also increases known-plaintext attack possibilities?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform either you make me an infinitely rigid girder or i don;'t want anything to do with you.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform do not ask me "how". this question is pointedly forbidden in this context.
phf: should start mailing each other cloned harddrives with random bits on them
phf: conversation really an excuse for asciilifeform to build a subversive analogue circuit
phf: (that's the last point in asciilifeform's list)
mircea_popescu: look, im not going to give back the major advantage of asym crypto keys just because nsa sponsored implementation and useful rms-ian idiots made a mess of things.
mircea_popescu: "it was already announced by some researches without a name in a paper without a back copy"
mircea_popescu: the holy grail is this situation where nothing's demonstrated at all.
mircea_popescu: the field of unknown unknowns always favours the people against the state.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8755 @ 0.00070779 = 6.1967 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: if anyone had the proof, i'd ask them to not publish it, for that matter.
mircea_popescu: it is ACTUALLY preferable for teh republic that whether rsa is or is not np-complete is not known.
mircea_popescu: hitler had reports re the fucking wtc bombings on his own desk.
mircea_popescu: how does "not clear what bitcoin is" beat "bitcoin is IT" ?
mircea_popescu: i lived my entire life cloaked in a shadow of "nobody saw him coming". i like it.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24945 @ 0.0007078 = 17.6561 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: your notion that hitler's ahead of the curve is spurious.
mircea_popescu: never, inb the entire history of reichs, was this the case. not once.
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 209273 @ 0.00066783 = 139.7588 BTC [-] {8}
mircea_popescu: i dunno dood. but once i figure it out i'll make the computer do what you mean.
mircea_popescu: it "had" it. suppose there's madonna burried in your back yard
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75627 @ 0.00065566 = 49.5856 BTC [-] {5}
mircea_popescu: you "have" a horse. your dad bought youy it, except you may not ride it. what "have" ?
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 01:11:30; mircea_popescu: never, inb the entire history of reichs, was this the case. not once.
phf: so for the curious it doesn't look like 1.4.19 uses the two-byte hash value anyway. it reads it from disk, it populates it during sign and it can write it to disk, but no actual logic done using it
phf: (grep for digest_start)
mircea_popescu: phf yeah it's not actually as bad as it seemed on the basis of the snippet. still crud.
phf: asciilifeform: i'm failing to see the clusterfuck part
phf: i'm mostly curious if my guess about the purpose of the field was correct, but no insight from gpg
phf: logic looks like "read a bunch of things", "hash data", "put relevant bits into an in memory copy of the header", "hash in memory copy", "compare"
phf: asciilifeform: ah, you caught my hand wave :>
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20400 @ 0.00070727 = 14.4283 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: actually. is there a 4096 bit hash function of any merit ?
mircea_popescu: make the damned thing match throughout. bapg = 4096 rsa, 4096 hash, etc.
mircea_popescu: no. rsa encryption = a succession of individually encrypted blocks.
mircea_popescu: i wasn't at any point contemplating "rsa encryption = rsa run once over the message herp"
mircea_popescu: (and i maintain that in all context hybrid encryption is retarde dwithout exception. either fuck or get off the woman.)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2100 @ 0.00070787 = 1.4865 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: yes. but none of these actually requires a hybrid scheme
mircea_popescu: and if youy for some incomprehensible reason MUST use a hybrid scheme, use the following : 1. generate random 4096 hash ; 2. cut your message up into N chunks of size up to 2048 ; 3. xor the chunks with 1; encrypt each chunk via rsa
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35050 @ 0.00070835 = 24.8277 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12132 @ 0.0007095 = 8.6077 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: ;;google "pentru ca esti o vita spastica si te uraste soarta"
phf: (so it's not compare. they run a digest on payload while reading (or separately if detached), then they run digest on own reconstruction of header, then they finalize the digest and do sig verification of provided signature against the digest that they calculated)
phf: incidentally after bitcoind gnupg source is pleasure to read
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18800 @ 0.00070727 = 13.2967 BTC [-]
phf: one can buy "PGP Source Code and Internals." from amazon for $289
phf: yes, trying to see what he was doing with signatures there
phf: surprisingly hard to get a copy
phf: oh? i missed that, i think that's before i started to read closely
phf: i actually forgot that you were working on gnupg source for cardano
thestringpuller: dunno if asciilifeform is talking about human female, or some random puppy he has.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42108 @ 0.00069951 = 29.455 BTC [-] {3}
mod6: asciilifeform: ... if you regenerate the 'orchestra' patches with new vdiff, i will sign'em. otherwise might have to wait a while << hey, no problem. I'll start in on this sometime tomorrow probably.
mod6: thanks for all your work on V, ascii
mod6: and yah, signing on 16 bits (2 bytes) of hashs is retarded
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62400 @ 0.00065325 = 40.7628 BTC [-]
mod6: yah, gotta re-read here.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54492 @ 0.0006754 = 36.8039 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45641 @ 0.00067461 = 30.7899 BTC [-]
phf: so to continue this archaeological dig, GPG 2.6 clarifies the usage of 2 octets. reads the header, reads the rsa ciphertext, decrypts rsa. rsa contains a digest of some fields from header and the body of message. so first thing he does next is check the first 2-octets of digest againts the 2-octets in header. if the two don't match program bails with "Error: RSA-decrypted block is corrupted. This may be caused either by corrupted data or by usin
phf: g the wrong RSA key." message format spec explains "First 2 bytes of the Message Digest inside the RSA-encrypted integer, to help us figure out if we used the right RSA key to check the signature."
mircea_popescu is tempted to deed a list of key,values of names of various people and start referring to people as "Primitive Man AFMrikO2o3Ka2pcpZ" instead of "Obama" or "Jean Jacques Rousseau" or whatever.
mircea_popescu: because it's where it's headed anyway, and why the fuck wait.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41389 @ 0.00064734 = 26.7928 BTC [-] {5}
mircea_popescu: cuz i might want to be able to distinguish orwell from orlov
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10000 @ 0.00064515 = 6.4515 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: "The reappearance of HELEN'S BABIES, in its day one of the most popular books in the world–within the British Empire alone it was pirated by twenty different publishing firms, the author receiving a total profit of £40 from a sale of some hundreds of thousands or millions of copies–will ring a bell in any literate person over thirty-five."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20600 @ 0.00065643 = 13.5225 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19500 @ 0.00068335 = 13.3253 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: you know, they speak casually of how the bitches they know're gonna introduce the new ones. except... all this is a work of feverish imagination.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45600 @ 0.00068754 = 31.3518 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9846 @ 0.00066909 = 6.5879 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43300 @ 0.00066816 = 28.9313 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86108 @ 0.00064807 = 55.804 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27850 @ 0.00067939 = 18.921 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: "A totalitarian society which succeeded in perpetuating itself would probably set up a schizophrenic system of thought, in which the laws of common sense held good in everyday life and in certain exact sciences, but could be disregarded by the politician, the historian, and the sociologist."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31600 @ 0.00065793 = 20.7906 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41200 @ 0.00067953 = 27.9966 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21013 @ 0.000658 = 13.8266 BTC [-]
punkman: mircea_popescu: is that trolling ? << chinese problems
punkman: shadowsocks makes your tunnels look like traffic that's not blocked
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 82640 @ 0.00066914 = 55.2977 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43594 @ 0.000691 = 30.1235 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52628 @ 0.00069123 = 36.3781 BTC [+] {2}
shinohai: I hope that somewhere in the AM data, it is revealed Josh Duggar snorted coke off of a tranny's cock.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62700 @ 0.00069586 = 43.6304 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21000 @ 0.00070115 = 14.7242 BTC [+]
assbot: Sprout Pharmaceuticals CEO Talks 'Female Viagra' Controversy, Additional Alcohol Studies, Addyi's U.S. Roll-Out And Global Ambitions ... (
http://bit.ly/1Eba5By )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16605 @ 0.00070554 = 11.7155 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 66099 @ 0.00002287 = 1.5117 BTC [-] {11}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21950 @ 0.00070064 = 15.379 BTC [-] {2}
shinohai: * I want a blockchain!* *Us too!*
mircea_popescu: all us tinfoil hats with our crazy notions about how shit that doesn't exist doesn't exist.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile how did that quote go, i really liked that thing, with social biddings and shit
assbot: Logged on 21-08-2015 23:21:00; mircea_popescu: "Welcome, kiddo, to how the real world works. You go ahead and place your crazy protest bids way off in the bottom of the sociological order book and scream that someday, SOMEDAY, the market will come down to meet you, and you will be vindicated.
assbot: Logged on 21-08-2015 23:21:00; mircea_popescu: The rest of us who actually make shit happen in the front lines of consensus back on planet earth will continue to be unaffected by your efforts apart from their modest value as chuckle fuel over beers and sushi."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20000 @ 0.00069891 = 13.9782 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48600 @ 0.00069891 = 33.967 BTC [-]
punkman: "1/3 of pictures are dick pictures and we won't dump."
mircea_popescu is not reading a vice regurgitation of anything. got the actual link ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15450 @ 0.00067398 = 10.413 BTC [-]
punkman: "Motherboard was given a contact email address for The Impact Team by an intermediary. After reaching out, the hackers replied with a message signed with the same PGP key posted with the Ashley Madison dumps. " << of course they couldn't provide the signed replies
mircea_popescu: either they stole someone's shit, in which case i want the original ; or else they made it up, in which case i dun want to hear it.
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35500 @ 0.00067023 = 23.7932 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34574 @ 0.00070623 = 24.4172 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: ThePiachu comments on Because most people are idiots, in spite of never manning up and admitting to it ... (
http://bit.ly/1TZkSpq )
cazalla: anyone else read his name as thepikachu?
shinohai: yes he is mod of r/cryptocurrency too?
shinohai: phd or something important hur durr
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9149 @ 0.00067023 = 6.1319 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: anyway, turns out trilema's linked from tons of various reddits in all sorts of topics, from recovering tlp old posts he apparently deleted to whatever random other thing.
mircea_popescu: s just they don't amount to much traffic wise, even when piled together, which is how i've never noticed before.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14189 @ 0.00070831 = 10.0502 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42650 @ 0.00071281 = 30.4013 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56982 @ 0.00066857 = 38.0965 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29633 @ 0.00065761 = 19.487 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2767 @ 0.00065406 = 1.8098 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21300 @ 0.00065406 = 13.9315 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44000 @ 0.00065713 = 28.9137 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12735 @ 0.0006774 = 8.6267 BTC [+]
punkman: "before he resigned from the library he realized that his trick had occurred to someone else. Several of the paintings he made had been replaced, his copies stolen. So the Academy was exhibiting fakes of fakes and someone was selling, or trying to sell, art by Xiao."
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14116 @ 0.00071014 = 10.0243 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25066 @ 0.0007159 = 17.9447 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21774 @ 0.00070074 = 15.2579 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9629 @ 0.00070074 = 6.7474 BTC [-]
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 09:49:19; mircea_popescu: either they stole someone's shit, in which case i want the original ; or else they made it up, in which case i dun want to hear it.
mats: asciilifeform has seen the movie 'American Hustle'?
mats: is about art forgery.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12000 @ 0.00069837 = 8.3804 BTC [-]
fluffypony: so 6 hours till North Korea says they'll retaliate
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69627 @ 0.00069837 = 48.6254 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 116000 @ 0.00069837 = 81.0109 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 131804 @ 0.00069903 = 92.135 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10350 @ 0.00070151 = 7.2606 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27000 @ 0.00070504 = 19.0361 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19050 @ 0.00069572 = 13.2535 BTC [-] {2}
trinque: asciilifeform: I've produced a genesis.vpatch with your instructions which is only different from yours in terms of timestamps. expected result?
☟︎ trinque: I recall discussion of removing the timestamps, but didn't find a conclusion there
☟︎ trinque: result of patch -p1 < genesis.vpatch is a tree which matches the manifest.
trinque: diff with your genesis.vpatch is now of course the timestamps
trinque: I thought this was the exercise
trinque: yeah, I made the LC_ALL=C change
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [BTR] 2500 @ 0.000755 = 1.8875 BTC [+]
trinque: yep, that seems perfect, and I don't know how it could be simpler.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27400 @ 0.00071869 = 19.6921 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: seems the most honest representation of that
trinque: otherwise you get the insane operations possible in git
trinque: that points out perfectly why "commit" is usually too big a wad of information
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> this is a 'release'. << ultra nifty
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54700 @ 0.00069408 = 37.9662 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57891 @ 0.00071365 = 41.3139 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50640 @ 0.00071817 = 36.3681 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13944 @ 0.00071914 = 10.0277 BTC [+]
mats: Fun fact: early ICBM computers had individually serial numbered resistors.
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21950 @ 0.00070837 = 15.5487 BTC [-]
ben_vulpes: for those following the macos travails, cp does not have a --parents, instead has a -p
fluffypony: ben_vulpes: why would that have anything to do with Steve Jobs?
kakobrekla: speaking on toy oses - i had a good build on deb8
fluffypony: it's crazy that *anyone* thinks standard command line tools in OS X have anything to do with Apple
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 17:25:55; mats: Fun fact: early ICBM computers had individually serial numbered resistors.
fluffypony: oh look, the cp man in 1991 looks the same as it does on OS X today
fluffypony: This is perl 5, version 18, subversion 2 (v5.18.2) built for darwin-thread-multi-2level
fluffypony: seems fairly innocuous, asciilifeform?
fluffypony: but I agree with you on it not using init
mod6: asciilifeform: ok I regenerated all of the rel1 & rel2-pre patches with the new vdiff -- you want to review 'em?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24850 @ 0.00071914 = 17.8706 BTC [+]
fluffypony: asciilifeform: pip install <package name>
mod6: <+asciilifeform> mod6: diff with the old set, and see that nothing but timestamps is at variance << can post this here in a bit for your review
mod6: <+asciilifeform> can either do this yourself, or wait several days until i get around to it. << i might get some more time to play around tonight. we'll see
mod6: eek! in the signed one?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 98180 @ 0.00070808 = 69.5193 BTC [-] {2}
mod6: <+asciilifeform> but also in all earlier patches << ah yea yeah, ok gotcha.
mod6: that way too im not doing the '-d' gymnastics
mod6: yeah, well, i agree, if somehow they end up restoring something back to its original sha512 something is wrong. or something needed to be rolled back for some reason.
mod6: makes sense. this is a tree. and if we suddenly make the root a leaf, then screwed.
mod6: "in the beginning there was false..."
mod6: yeah. you know... was just looking at these closer. i think i screwed something up
mod6: the hashes don't match.
mod6: i did something wrong here.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform say, you keep sending me these carets, what are they supposed to do ? add to my collection ?
mod6: lemme blow these away
mircea_popescu: incidentally, why the fuck is ^ called a caret. a caret is supposed to go below the line.
mircea_popescu: oh i guess they were using it historicaly for the line above huh
mircea_popescu: that weird feeling when you wake up at 4pm, everyone's gone to do useful stuffs and you have a pile of explanatory notes, aggregated foodstuffs and so forth.
mod6: ok i think i see what I did wrong here... just a minute.
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 13:02:32; assbot: How a Chinese librarian made $6 million in forged art over two years | National Post ... (
http://bit.ly/1MEGQZh )
mircea_popescu: at the mental level where us adults are, $500 mn for soccer trading cards would not be amiss.
mircea_popescu: he'll be voted, if that's what keeps millions from raining.
mircea_popescu: this is like, "it doesn't work if i come back home and there's TWO almost dressed blondies waiting for me"
mircea_popescu: what part of doublethink you think got cancelled ? the man with two maja desnudas simply is twice as happy.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: this would be true if there existed a usg agency of authenticity.
mircea_popescu: anyway, pretty much your idea : a wanna-be rockefeller (except fraudster-y) hires an eccentric copyer to make an intermediate maja
mircea_popescu: (goya has a dressed maja and a nude one, they were goin to make "la maja en chemise")
mircea_popescu: fine art is either fine for its fine-ness or then not even art at all.
mircea_popescu: much like a good performance of a march does not get anulled through having been "not the original" and nobody sticks around to compare the brass instruments used
mircea_popescu: ("oh this march is from 1722 and then they put antimony in the brass. this march was a fake!)
mircea_popescu: which is how 99% of these "fake fine art" arguments are settled - no eggyolk in the pigment or shit
mircea_popescu: also, the thing is, it's perfectly legal to order and own, and trade etc COPIES
mircea_popescu would not feel particularly better for owning the "actual" copy of a painting he likes rather than a very good one. actually i'd feel like a total fool.
mircea_popescu: besides, the modern copy can be fix. i much prefer my own rewrites of classical poems to the originals anwyay.
mircea_popescu: and the historical master's taste in women shows they never met any for crying out loud.
mircea_popescu: i don't remember any classical nude i like the face of.
mircea_popescu: but anyway, this suggests a fine exercise for the esteemed lordship and beyond. not everything in this life is code, and a gentleman needs to study and know a loit more than rubies. so therefore : which classical nude do you like the face of ?
mircea_popescu: but i don't mean copacetically like. i mean like like one's supposed to like art : un coup fumant. if she came off the toille you'd have no choice but to drop everything and marry her.
mircea_popescu: i dunno, what you like is what you like. to me she seems dumb.
mircea_popescu: much like maja has the face of a sly thirteen year old.
mircea_popescu: anyway. people like alma-tadema, godward etc do women that look more like adults
mircea_popescu: it literally sayz, za taste and za color, comrades not.
mircea_popescu: anyway, upon consideration venus does have to some degree the sharp features of the ideal fox. at least moreso than all the piefaces everyone wants to paint for some reason
☟︎ mircea_popescu: great idea, great painting, why does the woman's face look like it was peeled off asphalt pizza
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24700 @ 0.00070309 = 17.3663 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: Authenticating a work of art is often difficult, and more difficult when the art is four or five hundred years old, and at least one tool for the expert, to wit, provenance, is often limited or non-existent. And, science (materials analysis) does not get us very far since many of the problems for Old Masters come right out of the artist's studio (think Rembrandt). Thus, for Old Masters at least, the expert is left to r
mircea_popescu: ely almost entirely on expert opinion concerning the quality of the art, that is to say, is the quality of the art being examined of the quality expected of a painting by the artist—in this case, Caravaggio.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: And then, when the experts have come to their conclusion, and that conclusion is challenged in court, (as opposed to the marketplace or in critical writing), a judge must decide that the experts were right or wrong.
mircea_popescu: rank fucking nonsense. it should be clearly obvious this is not something the court can do.
mircea_popescu: "oh, but we already do guilt and innocence, which are ALSO transcendents"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i have nfi why you think 'in savour or hue, no comrades have you' better than "in color or taste there's no comrades"
mircea_popescu: (it rhymes in russian because it's russian. a language from 1700! it needn't rhyme in english, unless we're going for faux-peasant wisdom)
mircea_popescu: incidentally, isn't this also strictly wrong ? wasn't it the case that the whole village ate ~the exact same dish~ every day forever ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34100 @ 0.00072009 = 24.5551 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: "no, i dont think they were townpeople [ie idiots] because when sitting to repast they took out mamaliga cu brinza like normal pewople]
mircea_popescu: no i mean, the common, standard foodl. regarded as ideal by the village prisoners.
mircea_popescu: perhaps the only time romania's ww1 peculiar dish was eaten here this millenium
mircea_popescu: it's not really hard to make, need pot with water and coarse ground corn. and a woman that knows how long to boil it and what proportions.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11168 @ 0.00072036 = 8.045 BTC [+] {2}
mod6: yup yup, i recall. just trying to make sure i'm on the right track so i don't waste everyones time :]
mod6: good deal. i'll see what I can do about the mechanical checking and rebasing maybe later tonight, or tomorrow for sure.
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 13:05:58; punkman: "before he resigned from the library he realized that his trick had occurred to someone else. Several of the paintings he made had been replaced, his copies stolen. So the Academy was exhibiting fakes of fakes and someone was selling, or trying to sell, art by Xiao."
mircea_popescu: For every auction sale, a catalogue is produced describing each painting to be sold. Every entry indicates the certainty with which Sotheby's is prepared to attribute it to a particular artist. The catalogue entry may describe a painting in the following ways: i) Simply putting the name of the artist, for example, ‘Giovanni Bellini,' means that, in Sotheby's opinion, the work is by Bellini. ii) Attributed to Giovanni
mircea_popescu: Bellini means that, in Sotheby's opinion, this is probably a work by Bellini, but there is less certainty expressed as to authorship than in the preceding category. iii) Studio of Giovanni Bellini means that, in their opinion, this is a work by an unknown hand in the studio of Bellini, and it may or may not have been executed under his direction. iv) Circle of Giovanni Bellini means that, in their opinion, it is a wor
mircea_popescu: k by an as yet unidentified but distinct hand, closely associated with Bellini but not necessarily his pupil. v) Style/Follower of Giovanni Bellini means that, in their opinion, this is a work by a painter working in Bellini's style, contemporary or nearly contemporary, but not necessarily his pupil. ‘Contemporary or nearly contemporary' means that it was painted within about 50 years of Bellini's work. vi) Manner of
mircea_popescu: Giovanni Bellini means that in their opinion, this is a work in the style of Bellini and of a later date. vii) After Giovanni Bellini means that in their opinion, this is a copy of a known work of Bellini.
mircea_popescu: check these people out, they have fine art authorship grading down to a fine art!
mircea_popescu: the merit of a pgp signature is that it delivers them from having to do this.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: do not think that the intelligent people caught like bubbles in the fiat mire are happy to be there.
mircea_popescu: nonono. there is such a thing as "identify typewriter"
ag3nt_zer0: "The final directorial project the legendary Orson Welles completed during his lifetime, F for Fake is less a documentary than an example of cinematic free association on the topic of trickery. Much of the film is in fact drawn from other sources, most notably an unfinished documentary by Francois Reichenbach on the notorious Elmyr de Hory, whose extremely skillful forgeries of famous paintings caused scandals amongst art
ag3nt_zer0: of irony, de Hory's interviewer is author Clifford Irving, who became infamous due to a forgery of his own: a falsified autobiography of Howard Hughes. Welles openly re-edits and manipulates this footage, using it as a spine for his own commentary, arguing that there is an extremely close relationship between art and lying, and citing instances from his own career to prove the point."
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 19:30:03; mircea_popescu: the merit of a pgp signature is that it delivers them from having to do this.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57650 @ 0.0007213 = 41.5829 BTC [+] {4}
ag3nt_zer0: ok, don't really have an opinion on him myself, but I thought that film was quite entertaining... like a cinematic hall of mirrors or something
assbot: Logged on 06-03-2015 03:29:02; mircea_popescu: making money is a purely ~political~ function. if you are among the favoured elite of the respublica veneta, you then may invest in the ships, and make a profit. if not, not.
ag3nt_zer0: and Irving and Elmyr are quite the characters haha
mircea_popescu: you have a strange equivocation of power an' legitimacy going on there, asciilifeform
mircea_popescu: or how shall i put this, there are two types of question justice answers.
ag3nt_zer0: mircea_popescu: who do you hold in high esteem as a director?
mircea_popescu: but honestly, Visconti is probably the best dirctor that ever lived.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes. vaguely speaking, one's a contest among the crowd of boys. "everyone wants to be the one at the wheel, so who shall ?"
mircea_popescu: the other's a more fundamental type of dispute, you could stilisize as "between man and god".
mircea_popescu: roman practice suffered the tension, but also made it amply abundant
mircea_popescu: you do this because you don't recognise the fundamental tension, and so examples in one line cloud your estimation of the other.
mircea_popescu: but you're familiar with the roman, and originally greek notions of "broke the laws of men and gods" yes ?
mircea_popescu: this does not at all translate into civil and criminal
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 81159 @ 0.00070855 = 57.5052 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: well look, you agree with the broad idea that no man made thing may endure without a place the buck stops ?
mircea_popescu: wheresoever that place is, whosoever sits in it, has the same twin problem no matter what.
mircea_popescu: ag3nt_zer0 see "la terra trema". think that the film was made in the 1950s by using RANDOM LOCALS
mircea_popescu: for one thing, no opium smoker bangs 30 women a day even for two days straight,
mircea_popescu: they're both equally ridiculous things, for the same exact reason : made "as best we could" by the russians of the time, who were peasants not lawmakers or tank makers. they have all the qualities of chinese farm steel.
mircea_popescu: on the practical side, they both WORKED, if one's tolerant with the concept. soviet law maintained order in a larger thing than the us, better than the us managed.
mircea_popescu: and whjen they gave up their random approach, they came up with the kv, an overengineered useless pos.
mircea_popescu: yes, they were on my feet. they have cells descuamated off me even.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57104 @ 0.00069548 = 39.7147 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: 325 views ? "obligatory" ? is this like... made by your gf's younger brother or something ? howdja find it
mircea_popescu: see, these kids is the fundamental reason a) ru young women are well fucked (well means more than just a lot) and b) the chechens aren't isis.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99133 @ 0.00069167 = 68.5673 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: does not even agree with "tards" to any degree. yes they sound like monkeys. this is not retarded for their age, healthy 17 yo boys sound like that.
mircea_popescu: it means this 27 yo man that is indistinguishable from an 11 yo girl.
mircea_popescu: incidentally, even though modern pigments and computers and what have you, we're not being deluged in fine art, as "you'd expect" (if you were say orwell or some other dumb schmuck with the If a man cannot enjoy the return of spring, why should he be happy in a labour-saving Utopia? What will he do with the leisure that the machine will give him? I have always suspected that if our economic and political problems are e
mircea_popescu: ver really solved, life will become simpler instead of more complex, and that the sort of pleasure one gets from finding the first primrose will loom larger than the sort of pleasure one gets from eating an ice to the tune of a Wurlitzer." thing)
mircea_popescu: why ? why, because the redditar of 1600 thought himself blessed to "waste his life away" being a "from X's circle" at the very best. whereas the redditard of 2000 thinks his life too valuable to invest in anything. he is now a thinking man, don't you know, an intellectual - everyone's an intellectual that has computers, suddenly - and a tiny little Kitschhochadel in his own right!
mircea_popescu: yes. because he was a socialist, which is to say an idiot, and expected socialism, which always is "externalise costs" to be able to do so forever.
mircea_popescu: what, you can't just print more money and the expectation to the contrary sinks early sopcialism ?
mircea_popescu: no matter! we "learn from mistakes", ie, claim that "socialism wasn't actually tried" and try again. the same thing. this time, we're printing people.,
mircea_popescu: what, still doesn't work ? NO MATTER!!!1 for we "learn from mistakes"
mircea_popescu: the thief also learns from the dubious mistake of having been caught.
mircea_popescu: down with the shackles of this evil british empire of the blips which nevertheless creates the sort of people i like, even if i'm not actuaslly good enough to do anything in support. let's build utopia.
mircea_popescu: i did not say orwell was ineffectuial. i said he was stupid.
mircea_popescu: yes the bridge is falling whether 5yo cheers it on or not.
mircea_popescu: a) never was this nailed, anymore than the sun rising is "nailed".
mircea_popescu: and the poor array of the marbles in his head's his problem.
mircea_popescu: "So perverse is mankind that every nationality prefers to be misgoverned by its own people than to be well ruled by another."
mircea_popescu: so it can. except the individual has the valid excuse of the sexual imperative
mircea_popescu: which is why i say socialism is for stupid people and the mark of their stupidity.
mircea_popescu: every fucking year you get at least one of the imbecile "why should i have to take an exam".
mircea_popescu: that part i wasnt even discussing, the "economic" side so to speak. yes, moist people are dumb and industry has no need of them, so from their perspertive industry's run by aliens. fine.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and btw, thinking about it - i now realise visconti, the son of the duke visconti no less, actually is the one example of resistence through culture known. his terra trema was paid for by the communist party. and in it he delivers such a trashing to the pious frauds of the communists as has never before seen.
mircea_popescu: the most important film in support of sanity is a story of poor but stupid sicilian fishermen paid for by fucking stalin.
mircea_popescu: and i meant in the more homely sense, socialist-books and socialist-philosophy and what have you. not socialist-economy.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 82850 @ 0.00071101 = 58.9072 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: the "Worker's party" of stupid people and lazy people who figure hey, if worker's in the title above the door work does itself somehow
mircea_popescu: everyone in this country got nothing but "trabajador" in his mouth, and no one's done an honest stitch of work since 1924
mircea_popescu: two-and-sixpence intellectuals of "newspaper columnist:
mircea_popescu: (for the younger log reader, "two-and-sixpence" is not random, but a century ago made half a crown. it is used in a sense similar to "too clever by half", because that's really what half a crown is. worse than either a whole crown or no crown at all. at least in the context of this discussion)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform come to think of it - he has a deeply unwarranted sense of superiority over shaw. easily the most important thinker of the period in all the english speaking lands.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50559 @ 0.00068366 = 34.5652 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: anyway, the main problem with that art ruling thing, getting back to it, is that revisionism in inflation is a bitch. specifically, that sale was in 2006, before the first bout of "quantitative easing". most art of all description sells today for 10x to 100x what it did two decades ago, simply because dollars today, and euros today, are scarcely worth 10 cents. (no, this does not mean nothing to the slaves that spend "
mircea_popescu: their" "dollars" to buy from mcdonalds and zara. money only means money in the hands of the people who can use it independently, and what someone with tens of millions to his name was in 1995, is what someone wit ha billion to his name today. i'd know.)
mircea_popescu: so in plain point of fact "the guy would have gotten more in the alternative world" bla bla bla.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99050 @ 0.0006842 = 67.77 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: not by the enemy, but by the kulaks behind enemy lines.
mircea_popescu: hitler could have took a stand in 1940 against antisemitism!
mircea_popescu: only i have the privilege to stand up here and say something of the kind. because i'm part of a fucking republic.
mircea_popescu: who went by the "why should something be a standard if what it says is, we don't get any and stfu"
mircea_popescu: exactly like they go "oh, why should i read trilema if trilema says i'm broken"
mircea_popescu: they are punishing me, see, like they punished the gold standard. in their own heads.
mircea_popescu: haha, someone took them off the leash. ww2 took them off the leash./
mircea_popescu: and the german uprisings during calvin before that. and so on.
phf: (was it in the logs, guy brings authentic X "passed through family", gets accused of stealing, because "you're poor, so can't possibly have X")
mircea_popescu: understand : we have the liberty to decide tomorrow that gavin was right. or that bitcoin is stupid. or that whatever else. all this because liberty AT ALL.
mircea_popescu: and they are responsible and shall hang for the decisions they didn't make.
mircea_popescu: phf "passed through family" in that context is always a miserable cop out.
mircea_popescu: somehow never is anyone in that family someone with a registered key.
mircea_popescu: so i do not credit it nearly as much as you two seem to.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you understand what i mean by "in the wot" in that context ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9747 @ 0.000722 = 7.0373 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: suppose i have a work picasso himself signed with the title "stanislav's teapot shaped head"
mircea_popescu: except this "through family" claim is documented through five different testations, and it so happens that my uncle was a picasso expert who wrote extensively of this picasso work his brother owned.
mircea_popescu: now suppose i "own" the same, "in the family", but my family is a bunch of poor peasants from honduras.
☟︎ ag3nt_zer0: Coomaraswamy is fascinating "art historian"
assbot: Logged on 03-02-2015 22:35:01; asciilifeform: 'mr x, you're a registered pauper, but is that a first class air ticket you're holding? where'dyagetthat'
assbot: Logged on 20-08-2015 23:05:51; ahmed_bodi: Occasional trader. remember trading with a few people here. lost my PGP? key so i cant auth with assbot myself anymore
mircea_popescu: guy's obviously a scammer fishing for soft support, decimation style.
mircea_popescu: here's the litmus : "what part of this alleged family HAPPENED IN THE FORUM ?"
mircea_popescu: not anymore than there's a way for him to own plutonium.
mircea_popescu: "i owned it since forever" "who ever saw it ?" "only mute people"
mircea_popescu: if you claim that "hilary clinton is my wife" on the grounds of "she was always in my family" should your claim stand ?
mircea_popescu: against the nonsensical vacuum of anyone ever having seen this ?
mircea_popescu: yes, people will consider you're abject, after this claim. but the claim was disposed not on the grounds of who you are, but on the grounds of what proof was had.
mircea_popescu: you'll notice however that the debasement is very well controlled in the same manner fed controlls the dollar.
mircea_popescu: they keep pumping more kids in as they need to keep the denominations low enough.
mircea_popescu knows random romanian kid that sold for ~1.5mn last year
hanbot: which condenses to "who among you has/d the intelligence to get in the wot", neh?
assbot: Part 2: Looking at the art world over Adrian Ghenie’s shoulder and why I hate it or love it. Not sure. ... (
http://bit.ly/1WLEk84 )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's fucking trivial to get in said wot.
mircea_popescu: a) go to classical/art college ; b) go to auction house intern position ; c) write for whoever will publish about art and do a good job.
mircea_popescu: won't take 10 years, at how condensed timeframes are now. used to be 35-50.
phf: "You? Impossible! A mason?" "A mason," I replied. "A sign," he said, "a sign." "It is this," I answered, producing from beneath the folds of my roquelaire a trowel.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: but your argument is flawed, which i know personally, and ill tell you why
mircea_popescu: one of my dearest teachers in college, at the time a respected doctor, retired
mircea_popescu: and started a career in art, specifically painting scholarship
mircea_popescu: (his field was 1800s ro painting, which incidentally is pretty rich.)
mircea_popescu: well, it is an atrocity, because bills were itnended to be carrier notes.
mircea_popescu: but they re-defined them, apparently, to be a sort of cheques.
mircea_popescu: the part where they seem to also have forgotten to tell anyone is also atrrocious
mircea_popescu: but in principle a parliament is not required to allow carrier notes in its realm.
mircea_popescu: i don't know that ever in the history of civilisation was fine art a bearer document.
mircea_popescu: now, this was true of money, or more specifically, of currency
mircea_popescu: it used to be a regular occurence in the usa that some cowboy owned some land, got it taken off his hands, buyer became oil baron
mircea_popescu: but one is not required to sell, be your own oil baron.
mircea_popescu: anyway, this expectation that some sort of nativism trumps wot is not unlike that swanson's fellow's expectation to tell me "how debates are done".
mircea_popescu: can you say something more substantial of this than plain if third hand echos of 1970s soviet postcards ?
mircea_popescu: so. b-a is the irc channel where vampires of mankind gather, to discuss how to lower into pederasty the teenaged daughters of hard working social media wokers.
mircea_popescu: special pleading is a category of pleading, which is a category of speech, which happens in the forum, where the speaker proposes that one member of a category be different from the others on no grounds.
mircea_popescu: the class at issue is the class which includes that "they" and that other "they" and also "us".
mircea_popescu: so you say "they came as locusts" ? so did we. ask the power rangers.
mircea_popescu: sure, and exact same could be argued (and has been argued, by people arguing from your same chari) about trhe evil capitalists which "do not even see the common people they vampirize"
mircea_popescu: debate that teh peoples involved have little juice left in the ballsac.
mircea_popescu: well the entire contention was the strange notion that peasant who "finds" vermeer and "has always had it in family" should get to keep it.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: perhaps by this notion same peasant who finds young dutchess and "always had her in family" should ALSO keep her
mircea_popescu: which is quite contradictory with all the soaps the peasant women watch, which all reduce to
mircea_popescu: "pretty miss dutchess found by peasants - they didn't get to keep her"
mircea_popescu: technically money, in its circulatory form (ie, currency - to distinguish from the money as unit of account, for instance) was coins and bank-notes. coins are now disused, for entirely practical reasons ; and bank-notes come in those two flavours. moving from one to the other isn't THAT big a leap.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59300 @ 0.00070964 = 42.0817 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: for the record, it's not even clear moving from bearer to certified insturment is anti-liberty. for insmtance - hansa used the certifierd instrument greatly, because as a merchant, giving your son a plain "pay the bearer so much silver upon presentation of this note in such town" was merely an invitation to any highwayman on route to "please fuck this young man in the ass and here's the pay for your trouble"
☟︎☟︎ mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it did prevail in the justice of the time, did it not.
mircea_popescu: "how do you propose to make diff work ?" "above my pay grade chief, but here's a website with code snippets"
mircea_popescu: that's the thing. technology is intellectually sterile.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform your no shortage of "sane examples" refers to an abundance of "convenient retelliungs"
mircea_popescu: (can you actually read stuff like that or should i provide a summary instead ?)
antonosika: !register 101F52A1B302AB64E82BC090E813577509B35230
assbot: Nick antonosika is already taken.
mircea_popescu: "i am taking this from you because you're too stupid to have it". and they knew this is true, and SIGHED THEIR RELIEF.
antonosika: If I do not have access to my backup key, and have a new comp - what proof would work to claim the long party as antonosika?
phf: "found nick, has been in generation for years"
punkman: asciilifeform: and it wasn't?
mats: ;;gpg info antonosika
gribble: User 'antonosika', with keyid 86AC5789F93ED2E7, fingerprint 71A1EC4E1B6C7DD853FD856C86AC5789F93ED2E7, and bitcoin address None, registered on Sat Aug 9 17:27:20 2014, last authed on Tue Aug 26 10:21:38 2014.
http://b-otc.com/vg?nick=antonosika . Currently not authenticated.
punkman: asciilifeform: I don't see it
mats: no bitcoin address, think you're fucked, mate
antonosika: I am antonosika fingerprint 71A1EC4E1B6C7DD853FD856C86AC5789F93ED2E7. I'll do anything to prove it. I'm looking forward to claim a future contract. But I do not have access to my secret key.
punkman: maybe because it already had the file
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 15:59:15; asciilifeform: creating the antipatch is likely to require some manual manipulation.
mats: antonosika: this is related to X.EUR yes? see section 2.3b
mats: you can talk to davout, but i doubt he will deliver to someone that cannot prove control of that fingerprint
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i've gotten the diff of your and my genesis down to the timestamps
ben_vulpes: yessir, but i don't think i implemented it correctly in my vdiff
antonosika: hypothetically, as long as there is only one suggestion for what account to make a payment to and the contract finiliz
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: didja post a genesis.vpatch without timestamps?
mircea_popescu: i'd seriously consider ending davout's contract if he pays without signature.
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 15:41:10; trinque: asciilifeform: I've produced a genesis.vpatch with your instructions which is only different from yours in terms of timestamps. expected result?
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 15:41:34; trinque: I recall discussion of removing the timestamps, but didn't find a conclusion there
antonosika: asciilifeform: hypothetically - as long as there is only one suggestion, from an impostor or not, for what account to make a payment to AND the contract finalises, wouldn't a future delivery contract state that a payment should take place?
mats: how does that make sense? you may merely be the first to make the claim, and the genuine article did not yet get around to taking delivery
mircea_popescu: antonosika no, that's not what it says. the contract creates no nude obligation to pay, which may be satisfied, and then a separate and ulterior consideration as to whom.
punkman: antonosika: did you buy X.EUR on coinbr?
antonosika: mircea_popescu: I hope you take a good ulterior consideration until then.
mats: [2014-08-12 03:34:05] → antonosika joined (uid31762@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dhamorrkxglbonxi)
antonosika: take the action that you deem plausible
mats: poor guy does look like he may be the real thing. but, no private key, no futures :/
mats: an expensive lesson...
mircea_popescu: well, it's denominated in one euro increments, and i don't think he ever had outstanding enough to payu for even one year of college
mats: utilitarian is also misspelled
antonosika: That the contract aims at the antonosika that you are talking to.
punkman: antonosika: was the lost key also registered at mpex?
mircea_popescu: lmao twitter now sucks uisers phone number as a "security" thijg too ?
mircea_popescu: anyway, i can't be arsed to, but it takes anyone five minutes to create a twitter accouint, link it to a dead website and say "dear mircea popoescu" on it
antonosika: for arguments sake, it says when it's registered.
mircea_popescu: a) twitter is a piece of shit web 2.0 item. they are probably hacked by 4 different teams as we speak and they don't even known
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30003 @ 0.0007021 = 21.0651 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: b) you farm these and let them age, what's the big deal. 99% of all social media accounts are registered for the purpose of aging and then be used in a scam exactly like is contemplated here.
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 14:31:53; fluffypony: so 6 hours till North Korea says they'll retaliate
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 15:51:32; asciilifeform: this makes it possible to mechanically trace a 'patchchain'
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 15:53:24; asciilifeform: 'v' will recursively walk the hashes in the release and apply the necessary vpatches to produce the tree.
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 16:05:39; asciilifeform: it is important that everyone who works on therealbitcoin sign 'genesis' and distribute said signature.
mircea_popescu: which is exactly a) what should be favoured (make it easy for the DEPLOYERS to sign, let the writers have to do all the hard work) and b) maximally economical.
mircea_popescu: maybe mike'd consider making it a subthing of his excellent wot graph
mircea_popescu: because really - they much belong together, and i expect synergy to be productive
mircea_popescu: (really, V chiefly exists because we put other thibngs together a while back, and we didn't at the time know yet this is how it'll come out.
mircea_popescu: and this exact scenario has played out a dozen or more times in the history of b-a
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell mike_c hey, would you make the v graph alongside the wot graph ?
punkman: no synergy plz, v will likely be used for other projects, without b-a wot, etc
mircea_popescu: b-a is not a fucking gift "to humanity" as that "humanity" chooses to understand itself. b-a is a gift to humanity as defined by b-a.
mircea_popescu: humanity as it chooses to understand itself is the chief enemy, actually, and also the author of shit like the gnu diff. and everything else.
mircea_popescu: if it burns to the ground tomorrow it's about fifty million years too late.
punkman: sure, but why can't punkman use v for non-b-a project?
mircea_popescu: but in being non-ba project, it misses out on all those things a ba project gets.
mircea_popescu: just like you can go make yourself a house on the prarie. it won't have running water. and all the whitegoods will work poorly fed from canister.
mircea_popescu: because the whitegoods are fucking made for a house with running water by people who have running water and intend to continue having it.
mircea_popescu: "There remains after today no alternative manner to deploy Bitcoin software, or indeed any software that is not a toy intended to be used by children playing, outside of this paradigm. May the switchover be bloody and painful in all the right places." is not some sort of a joke, and in no case can it be waved aside.
mircea_popescu: it is a central tenant of computer science, henceforth.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39800 @ 0.00070509 = 28.0626 BTC [+]
ben_vulpes: i'm rather enamored of how bitcoin defines computers now.
ben_vulpes: it's a good and simple definition. "it must build bitcoin with V, it must sync a full chain verifying each block, and it must keep up with the main chain."
mircea_popescu: first time the equivalent of turing's definition was constructed in practice.
ben_vulpes: by the by, does anyone know the zfx individual?
ben_vulpes: pm'd me on the topic of --parents vs. -p and os x
ben_vulpes: which, more idle experiment than an attempt to build a bitcoin on a macos box
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 18:04:17; asciilifeform: is winblows next ?
phf: ben_vulpes: -p doesn't seem to do the same thing on os x as --parents does in gnu cp
mircea_popescu: "for fucks sake, is it necessary to invade every last god forsaken swamp ? is burma next ???"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45571 @ 0.00070509 = 32.1317 BTC [+]
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i was not reading messages at the time
mod6: oh this is pretty neat. so I got the mechanics tested & rebased for rel1 -- off of classic patches & genesis.vpatch to be sure. created a "rel1.vpatch" from that. then tested it, worked good on top of extracted genesis.vpatch. then did one of these numbers "cat genesis.vpatch >> rel1-fromair.vpatch ; cat rel1.vpatch >> rel1-fromair.vpatch ; patch -p1 < rel1-fromair.vpatch"
mod6: it's a one shot, straight to rel1 source.
mod6: now just gotta do it for rel2-pre and clean it up a bit and i think i'll have something for you guys to look at.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 95700 @ 0.00071163 = 68.103 BTC [+] {4}
ben_vulpes: new theory: mpex price correlates with stans work on foundation client
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 18:26:16; asciilifeform: my present understanding is that the only solution to this is that i intend to negrate anyone who EVER does this.
mircea_popescu: should we need a salt, in the shape of a #sigline for all authors ? something like
assbot: Logged on 22-08-2015 18:32:55; asciilifeform: but it is a handy means of mechanically computing whom to negrate.