log☇︎
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diana_coman: asciilifeform: they have a Why Python 2.8 post if you care.
asciilifeform: meanwhile, in 'wildmen attempt to tmsr' strange : 'Tauthon is a backwards-compatible fork of the Python 2.7.16 interpreter with new syntax, builtins, and libraries backported from Python 3.x. Python code and C-extensions targeting Python 2.7 or below are expected to run unmodified on Tauthon and produce the same output.'
asciilifeform would like another pie or 2
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-08 20:35:48 lobbes: holy shit. it filled up nsabot.log too (2.4GB!!)
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-08 20:35:48 lobbes: holy shit. it filled up nsabot.log too (2.4GB!!)
lobbes: holy shit. it filled up nsabot.log too (2.4GB!!)
snsabot: Logged on 2017-07-15 12:48:59 asciilifeform: they wanna say 妓 -- let'em be stuck saying 32 bytes (16x16 bit matrix, more than enough for any hierohorror) rather than 2 bytes !!!
asciilifeform: i recall when 1st time picked up a 30kg sledge hammer. 'uhh how do people work with this.' after day or 2 of driving in stakes, felt entirely ordinary.
asciilifeform: ( 'peh', fwiw, is NOT a standard-compliant forth, i committed quite deliberately war crimes against the classical standard in order to make the parser as simple as physically possible, to make all operators weigh 1 or 2 chars )
billymg: though perhaps some of 2 can be done, then 3, then back to more 2
billymg: without going into too much detail my current mp-wp roadmap is: 1) finish writing tests, 2) mass delete cruft/unnecessary "features", 3) formalize a republican theme (or a few themes)
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-07 08:36:48 mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-06#1934382 << practical network rates are more in the 1k/s or threabouts, certainly if sustained. 2*18 is not seen even in dedicated interchanges.
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-07#1934477 << archaeological find. manufacturer was 1 of the 2 castles where sovok built nukes , accelerators, related hardware.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu: there are 2 aspects: 1. whether you want to apply for bezzle 2. whether you want "recognised status"
mircea_popescu: the idea is to exploit the socialism poverty hole. all sorta community colleges / 2 year technical colleges in ruralia would take ~anyone, including ~any soccer mom with a degree as a teacher.
mircea_popescu: peering cages see maybe 2**15, and that's the very core of the internet.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-06 22:33:53 asciilifeform: a gb nic can theoretically swallow 2**18 512b packets / sec .
mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-06#1934382 << practical network rates are more in the 1k/s or threabouts, certainly if sustained. 2*18 is not seen even in dedicated interchanges.
mircea_popescu: thing 1 is like http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-02#1933212 ; thing 2 is like http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log-search?q=%23select&chan=trilema
asciilifeform: ( fleanode apparently surrounds 'action' msgs with 2 spurious 0x01, one on ea. side )
mircea_popescu: that is part one. part two, is that for further reductions of P, W scales superlinearily. in my practice to date, P=e/2 drives W = q^5 approx, like air fucking friction.
asciilifeform: a gb nic can theoretically swallow 2**18 512b packets / sec .
BingoBoingo: 2. Last night police stopped an anti-papermill march that had gone hooligan with the rubber bullets
BingoBoingo: So local news. In the past 24 hours the local cops have been involved in 2 incidents which are very oppressive by Uruguay standards and unremarkable in most other parts of the world.
lobbes: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-06#1933985 << ugh, looks like I lost ~2 hours of logs
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-05 18:08:22 mircea_popescu: 2. re lisp, i do believe finishing the hutch story is very useful.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-05 18:09:18 mircea_popescu: but imo it's folly to try and marry 1 to 2 because of what's, ultimately, merely a name coincidence.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-05 18:08:22 mircea_popescu: 2. re lisp, i do believe finishing the hutch story is very useful.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-05 18:09:18 mircea_popescu: but imo it's folly to try and marry 1 to 2 because of what's, ultimately, merely a name coincidence.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-05 18:08:22 mircea_popescu: 2. re lisp, i do believe finishing the hutch story is very useful.
ossabot: Logged on 2019-09-05 18:09:18 mircea_popescu: but imo it's folly to try and marry 1 to 2 because of what's, ultimately, merely a name coincidence.
mircea_popescu: but imo it's folly to try and marry 1 to 2 because of what's, ultimately, merely a name coincidence.
mircea_popescu: 2. re lisp, i do believe finishing the hutch story is very useful.
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of bvt from 1 to 2 << knows where things are in the logs! + useful work towards a republican kernel; writes at http://bvt-trace.net
snsabot: Logged on 2018-11-10 19:40:02 mircea_popescu: so to summarize : 1. one hour (!?) wrangling with auctionbot on the 4th (the result still wrong) ; 2. 2 hours handling three conflated processes (why do you keep notes as an intermediate step ?) on the 5th ; 3. 1 hour reading logs on the 6th ; 4. half hour reading logs on the 7th ; 5. 1.3 h mostly brainstorming on the 8th ? ; 6. half hour doing... i don't know what on the 9th ; 7. 4 (four ?!) hours doing i stil
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-05 12:25:58 asciilifeform: ( to take trivial example : at one time i designed a 'fg 2' that uses scintillator crystal . background radiation is moar than enuff to make this go. however also need a reverse-biased large surface diode for detecting pulses. these need a clean (i.e. not from oscillating converter) ~60 volt. then thought : 'this is simple, all would need is 20 x 3v photocells in series, in epoxy. surely someone sells this !! gu
asciilifeform: ( to take trivial example : at one time i designed a 'fg 2' that uses scintillator crystal . background radiation is moar than enuff to make this go. however also need a reverse-biased large surface diode for detecting pulses. these need a clean (i.e. not from oscillating converter) ~60 volt. then thought : 'this is simple, all would need is 20 x 3v photocells in series, in epoxy. surely someone sells this !! guess wat. )
asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-05#1933819 << i know 2 in meatspace ( one -- i taught ; other -- learned from ) but yes there are prolly not so many people still using actual emacs ( vs the 'modernized' horror that auto-downloads 9000 crapolas )
asciilifeform: mikec has been dead for the entirety of 'era 2' .
asciilifeform: davout went awol 2+ y ago iirc. (though his site, like e.g that of esthlos , still up )
diana_coman: I suppose in time there'll be plenty more similar stuff that I should have written about but what can I do *now* about it - there's still plenty waiting in the queue to be done, yet more to be written and both queues seem to get only longer, a bit balaur-style, cut one head and 2 pop out
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: fwiw i've never succeeded in detecting a performance diff b/w the 2 (in the use scenario where they can be interchanged)
snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-03 13:06:19 asciilifeform: re 'postgres' vs 'mysql' -- afaik they're entirely compatible, such as they are used in my item, with the exceptions of: 1) table indices 2) dump format.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-05-02 09:56:16 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-02#1910633 << there's actually not 1 but 2 'standard os' available in piz ( 'rk' and 'dulap' tarballs ) but both are stone age gentoos, they are obsoleted by cuntoo (when the latter is pronounced baked, but really even nao, it is impossible to e.g. 'emerge' packages on the vintage gentoo, the upstream package repos went full tard year ago )
asciilifeform: ( a surprisingly well-populated штрафбат . and asciilifeform makes an effort to read its log and reply 2-3x / daily )
asciilifeform: re 'postgres' vs 'mysql' -- afaik they're entirely compatible, such as they are used in my item, with the exceptions of: 1) table indices 2) dump format.
asciilifeform: 2 different qt's ('3' and '4') even
ossabot: Logged on 2019-08-23 05:37:59 spyked: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930228 <-- until I get proper patches published, here's an idea: 1. abolish "ping-thread" from ircbot; 2. instead, set up a ping handler for the bot, and have it respond with pong; this has the disadvantage that there's no more lag tracking, but it's simpler. proof-of-concept patch: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/LohMF/?raw=true
feedbot: http://ossasepia.com/2019/09/02/ossabot-and-its-flask-of-python-27-on-centos-6/ << Ossa Sepia -- Ossabot and Its Flask of Python 2.7 on CentOS 6
ossabot: Logged on 2019-08-23 05:37:59 spyked: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-22#1930228 <-- until I get proper patches published, here's an idea: 1. abolish "ping-thread" from ircbot; 2. instead, set up a ping handler for the bot, and have it respond with pong; this has the disadvantage that there's no more lag tracking, but it's simpler. proof-of-concept patch: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/LohMF/?raw=true
diana_coman: i.e. if anything I have 2 lines more??
lobbes: still need to: 1) test a bit more 2) import data dumps 3) get bot in all of the chans
asciilifeform: #4 place winner is BingoBoingo at piz ; #2 i think is BingoBoingo's old box in usa, if i'm not mistaken
mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-30#1932542 << let him focus on that one thing and get it done. doing 1-2 hour of sweat here and there little things is for when time is flowing to your advantage.
asciilifeform: and 2 2.5" ssd
BingoBoingo: Very nice. is there going to be space in the case for FUCKGOATS, 2.5" SSD's etc
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: item will actually slide, given as will have only 2 wires going to it (mains & 1 ethernet) and not 15
girlattorney: there are two cables: one from 2000 that afaik carries only phone calls and govt activities (atlantis 2) and the 2nd that is still not operational (ella link)
girlattorney: (atlantis 2)
asciilifeform: girlattorney: re colo -- talk with diana_coman , who has been surveying various colos. ( piz is pretty packed in re trb, has no fewer than 3 operating nodes . and really these benefit from being dispersed geographically, rather than concentrated in 1-2 cages ! )
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-30 09:53:41 BingoBoingo: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-30#1932174 << VW type 2, recently taken out of cosmoline pit?
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-29 22:51:04 lobbes: For clarity, on testbed I got the eater.py and the reader.py working fine. Was able to view loglines and search with no issue (on localhost only, didn't test port forwarding). Did *not* test the bot.py, however. For reference, my version info: Flask 0.12.2; psycopg2 2.7.4; Python 2.7.15
BingoBoingo: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-30#1932174 << VW type 2, recently taken out of cosmoline pit?
mp_en_viaje: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-29#1932021 << she has a point i nthat "version numbers" are utterly meaningless (which is why one's 2 something, the other 0 sometiing, yet used in same pile). all that matters is vintage, like in wines, DOC for code.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-29 18:27:23 diana_coman: to cite from flask's description, for full allergy-triggers: A micro-framework for Python based on Werkzeug, Jinja 2 and good intentions
diana_coman: re logger atm I am undecided as my options so far seem to be: 1. do another round of madness with flask until it works on this old (but stable at least) centos 2. replicate environment aka burn down centos and have fun installing remotely on the machine cuntoo 3. simply run irssi (as I'm otherwise running this code anyway as my client) with logging to db into an mp-wp database and be done with it (possibly each line a one comment - will end
lobbes: For clarity, on testbed I got the eater.py and the reader.py working fine. Was able to view loglines and search with no issue (on localhost only, didn't test port forwarding). Did *not* test the bot.py, however. For reference, my version info: Flask 0.12.2; psycopg2 2.7.4; Python 2.7.15
asciilifeform: if owner of argentina wants someone to buy it, could start whenever he wants by sending in the wood chippers and mulching the 'samba si, trabajo no' aboriginals 24/7 until leaves the 2% or what who were the reasonable auto mechanics etc .
asciilifeform: they already went through... 2 ? 3 ? 'default' 'refinance' 'rinse & repeat' cycles ?
diana_coman: because of 2.7 etc
asciilifeform: psycopg2's is 2.6.1
asciilifeform: diana_coman: on testbed , print flask.__version__ >> 0.10.1 ; python --version >> 2.7.5 ;
diana_coman: I have python 2.7.16 flask 1.1.1 and werkzeug 0.15.5 from what I see and the reader.py fails complaining that there is no flask.ext.cache , which seems to be again some version-shenanigans
asciilifeform: to be utterly pedantic : the log sys consists of 2 separate py proggies that share a db (normally expected on same box, but can in principle be elsewhere). bot.py and reader.py
diana_coman: well, I have at least fully explored the 1-strand spittoon: psycopg2 on python 2.7 wants postgresql 9 or greater and so it goes.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: for 2.6 need whole set of vintage liquishits that went with that specific py
diana_coman: to cite from flask's description, for full allergy-triggers: A micro-framework for Python based on Werkzeug, Jinja 2 and good intentions
diana_coman: for clarity re python 2.6 it's quite clear that it's not worth it - all sorts of breakings in flask & co really.
asciilifeform: diana_coman: if you decide to fiddle with the proggy so it goes on 2.6, prolly can be done ; but keep in mind that i will not be able to run yours anywhere, there's no 2.6 on any known gentoo of past decade or so.
asciilifeform: no one yet asked how asciilifeform ended up on 2.7. answr: it's where gentoo stopped when died and i put it in waxworks.
diana_coman: ah, yes, I'm sure 2.6ism would break 2.7, it's more this "fun" of code reuse; and I can ofc install python 2.7 on top; I seriously wonder though what's really the fastest route; because also, above it doesn't even seem to be print, it barfs when importing flask, a few layers deep in werkzeug and whatever
asciilifeform: to make life even more 'interesting', there aint a magical version that can pick and 'will work on all of'em' . 2.6isms break on 2.7 just same.
asciilifeform: ( there's quite a few, turns out; e.g. http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2017-03-12#1626258 . all 2.7 )
asciilifeform: all of asciilifeform's published pythonisms are tested under 2.7. ( some ~may~ work on older; generally none will ever work on 3+ )
asciilifeform: diana_coman: where didja get a box with 2.6 even
asciilifeform: diana_coman: 2.6 has diff print() syntax from 2.7
diana_coman: ahahaha, python 2.6 -> barf http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/ZzZjn/?raw=true
lobbes: well maybe not THAT simple. But it is nice to be able to look in my masks and remember "oh yeah, I gotta remember to pick PYTHON target = 2.7" for e.g.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-09 04:01:43 mp_en_viaje: 2) i never made money, i always made power. the money was coincidental. i never made all the money there was to make or could. nor did i ever give much of a shit, i'm utterly not constructive, a world of nothing but mp will burn down.
asciilifeform: hieroglyphs -- to the annoyance of white devils -- ea. have at least 2 pronunciations, dep. on context
asciilifeform: lobbes: afaik, that'll make 2, of us
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-28 15:00:36 mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-28#1931651 << now that's just plain silly. why not talk to a 50yo slave with 2-3 decades' experience instead ? she's much more likely to can be bothered with you in the first place, and much more likely to have what for you to learn if she does. even her owner might be more tolerant.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-28 15:00:36 mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-28#1931651 << now that's just plain silly. why not talk to a 50yo slave with 2-3 decades' experience instead ? she's much more likely to can be bothered with you in the first place, and much more likely to have what for you to learn if she does. even her owner might be more tolerant.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: asciilifeform was 1 time 'lucky' enuff to find an edge case where gimp barfed and had to resort to a heathen photo editor on toilet box . ( stitching segments of photos that weighed GB+ , in the lispm reversing series. on very similar irons, the heathen proggy ran, gimp -- ground to halt. i suspect gimp has some o(n^2)-isms in it. )
mircea_popescu: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-08-28#1931651 << now that's just plain silly. why not talk to a 50yo slave with 2-3 decades' experience instead ? she's much more likely to can be bothered with you in the first place, and much more likely to have what for you to learn if she does. even her owner might be more tolerant.
snsabot: Logged on 2019-08-25 18:53:47 asciilifeform: diana_coman: to add a few brush strokes to the picture of usa -- and perhaps already you knew -- 1) most folx get ~0 'vacation'. they nominally get '2 wks' but is reserved in practice for illness ; 2) are paid just enuff to stay alive (and locate themselves within vicinity of the mines) , 2-3 missed weeks of pay means destitution .
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: dun matter how many day ordeal, cost will still be 2+x of otherwise.
asciilifeform: so far all i got is 2 experimental data points re expeditions, ben's and mine.
asciilifeform: supposing there aint orc-generated bureaucratic problem in re BingoBoingo going into usa for day or 2, may be workable.
asciilifeform: funnily enuff i did. ( in fact was uncertain until last moment that the actual 2 crates would fly, the co's www is retarded)