log
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BingoBoingo: Anyways, got your workstation carrying setup all picked out?
Mocky: yeah, laptop in a laptop bag. has been my primary workstation for some years now. except not packing the 43in monitor!
asciilifeform: Mocky: hey, at least you dun have the pain of mircea_popescu , who left a whole trinitron behind in old world
asciilifeform: !#s trinitron
a111: 40 results for "trinitron", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=trinitron
Mocky: i haven't done trinitron in like 12 years.
Mocky: lappy screen is 4k. overkill honestly for a 15 inch
Mocky: unless ur a hunchback i suppose
asciilifeform: Mocky: trinitron was (imho) the acme of display
asciilifeform: not really equaled since ( tho supposedly the recent led panels just about reproduce the old crt phosphours -- but i cannot bring myself to buy, they suffer some 1980s-esque 'burn in' )
Mocky: great yeah if you hate desk space, lift weights and like hefty curvature
asciilifeform: how often you lift yer display.
Mocky: don't get me wrong, i loved mine back in the day
asciilifeform: ( and besides, 21 in. thing was, what , 80 pounds, nuffin to write home about mass-wise )
Mocky: and that hum, lol
asciilifeform: i actually had one of those strap belt things, for carrying the thing
Mocky: yeah, not that heavy really just awkward to move solo
asciilifeform: https://www.geargrip.com/images/crt_iso.gif << similar item
asciilifeform: made the chore quite a bit lighter
Mocky: oh nice, first time seeing anything like that
asciilifeform: Mocky: these used to be sold in comp-related shops errywhere
asciilifeform: there's one for towers also
asciilifeform: ( with tower it is much easier to dispense with this, you can bolt an ordinary desk drawer steel handle to most of'em in a few min )
asciilifeform: i traditionally have wheels on my towers, also worx great.
Mocky: i guess you don't need to stack them
asciilifeform: lol why would i stack'em.
asciilifeform: ( and if you must, you stack horizontally, wheels dun hurt )
asciilifeform brb,meat
Mocky: multiple trinitrons on the desk, multiple towers unstacked or stacked horizontally. sounds like asciilifeform has square footage to spare
BingoBoingo: To be fair to asciilifeform, when he travelled to Montevideo he kept his personal kit very compact in order to favor cargo
Mocky: i have a bag to check, but not even sure at this point if it will be half full.
BingoBoingo: That's too be expected. At this point consider looking at what will be lucrative to bring, and try to find what simply isn't available there
asciilifeform: meanwhile, in entomo-lulz: readerz will recall, the http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-18#1835666 'prophecy' bore out into http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-17#1850785 самокритика-fest. nao, for next lul in series :☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 00:10 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835536 << such a fucking injun. how, just HOW does one get so fucking stupid. "jwz" amirite, "he only wanted to". this existence is too burdensome for the likes of special cunthead.
a111: Logged on 2018-09-17 13:40 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: torvalds's thing reads like the zinoviev&kamenev 'confessions'
asciilifeform: linus formally surrendered, and nao there is, as i gather, auditions being held, for who will get to be his new bob beck politruk;
asciilifeform: and, first auditioner, apparently, none other than old judas esr :
asciilifeform: https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/9/23/212 ( http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-17#1850847 )☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-17 14:14 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: linus's kernel was the last remaining 'open sores' item that was 'usable from upstream' afaik.
asciilifeform: grr
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/40C97 << correct link
asciilifeform: tldr : d00d trying to organize some sort of peasant rebellion, to mop up what remains of the +ev contributors, under guise of 'protest'
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/qQDUD << detail re 'killswitch' lul.
asciilifeform: 'Contributors: You were promised something, you laboured for that promise, and now the promise has become a lie. You have remedies available to you now, as-well as in the close future .' etc
Mocky: 'Several users on 4chan’s technology board speculate that Theo is targeted first because he famously resisted an Intel backdoor.'
asciilifeform: i expect either a) whole thing is made to silently evaporate , via the usual means b) gpl is formally unwound by usg 'courts', so rathead et al can carry along. i dun see a c) ...
asciilifeform: ianal, but per current usg copyrasty system, copyrights in fact stay with authors, unless sold ( apriori, as in 'work for hire', or post -- if sold, or reassigned by idiot for phree, as e.g. rms demands of authors )
asciilifeform: so in principle afaik yes folx can demand to get their coad pulled from sjw.linux. nao, what practical result will be, no prizes for guessing.
asciilifeform: ( spoiler : either 0, see above, or >0, in which case microshit gets an even bigger crater than it originally paid for )
asciilifeform: it is interesting to consider diff b/w esr and linus. esr judased a thing he had 0 part in baking, and wanked for 20y on the periphery of. linus on oher hand merrily fucked not only the folx who were dumb enuff to invest 25y into baking with him, but... own life's work
asciilifeform: colour me thick, but i fully expected he'd take cyanide publicly before descending to this kind of bottom.
Mocky: i noticed blackmail conspiracy theory at that link, maybe consorted with 17.99 yo
asciilifeform: and ftr i dun buy mircea_popescu's 'was always a shit' hypothesis. d00d by any possible measure 'by the fruits' was NOT always-shit.
asciilifeform: was 'silent like partizan'. until day x.
asciilifeform: Mocky: it isnt clear to me what sort of blackmail could compare with the surrender. say they put him in electric chair, for killing kennedy, what of it. see also http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-23#1852995 .☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-23 16:17 asciilifeform: 'die not the straw death!'(tm)(r)(odin)
asciilifeform: then again, for all i know, d00d is already trooly and properly dead, and the surrender was penned for him. ( btw anybody located a signed copy ? and what's the most recent signed linus material anyway ? )
Mocky: "NOT always-shit" != "willing to go to the chair still"
asciilifeform: could argue that he already begun quisling when he permitted 'linux foundation' ( sponsor of such 'luminaries' as gavin ) to make use of his trademark
asciilifeform: !#s linux foundation
a111: 44 results for "linux foundation", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=linux%20foundation
asciilifeform: back then was still possible to explain as act of stupidity, tho
Mocky: I have nfi, never followed closely
asciilifeform: Mocky: i'm not aware of any public discussion re subj to follow, outside of the l0gz
asciilifeform: there appeared out of the usg depths, this squid, 'linux foundation', sponsored at various times erry possible scamola, prb, later gavinisms, tor, etc
asciilifeform: linus in principle had the right to sue for immediate desist of use of his trademark. did not do it.
asciilifeform: ( whether could have won, or not, whoknows, usg 'court' is approx a bank balance contest. but did not even TRY )
asciilifeform: btw upstack peanut gallery thread has coupla interesting nuggets : apparently vultures already circling, professional politruks already publishing their projected ~expenses against linux~ for their 'service' of 'administering code of conduct'
asciilifeform: delish, the smell of fresh corpse, to these, apparently.
asciilifeform: i imagine a maggot's idea of heaven, this, the fresh meat with no prev maggot crew.
Mocky: in other news, Qatar becomes First Gulf State to Offer Expat Permanent Residency http://archive.is/8BXOX
Mocky: but only if lived there for 20 years and among 100 'blessed' applicants per year
Mocky: also apparently lifting exit visa requirement
asciilifeform: 'Qatar is abolishing the exit visa required before expatriate workers are allowed to leave the country' << interesting
asciilifeform: i recall a subj thrd
asciilifeform: 'those born abroad would need to have lived there 20 years' << bit of a downer
asciilifeform: Mocky: makes e.g. ru citizenship look easy.
asciilifeform: ( 5y iirc )
Mocky: seems like a play at keeping those who are already 'lifers', but unofficially so
asciilifeform: 20y puts it in the weight category of jp, lichtenstein, swiss.
asciilifeform: Mocky: likely
Mocky: ha, "However, the new decree stipulates that if a permanent resident leaves Qatar for more than six months, the interior minister could withdraw from the residency"
BingoBoingo: They seem to have the usual "marry a qualified local get a permit" deal
mircea_popescu: o wow, logexplosion
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853417 << then people want to talk about how "you can never trust bitcoin operators, always will split and run".☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 02:11 asciilifeform: it is interesting to consider diff b/w esr and linus. esr judased a thing he had 0 part in baking, and wanked for 20y on the periphery of. linus on oher hand merrily fucked not only the folx who were dumb enuff to invest 25y into baking with him, but... own life's work
mircea_popescu: somehow i expect the linux bonfire will not be included in the list of http://trilema.com/2012/and-another-one-bites-the-dust-bitmarketeu/
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853420 << i re-read his early announcements re nascent linux (publicly, quoted here) and was not impressed. no, not always shit. always manalone. this DOES NOT work.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 02:14 asciilifeform: and ftr i dun buy mircea_popescu's 'was always a shit' hypothesis. d00d by any possible measure 'by the fruits' was NOT always-shit.
mircea_popescu: for the exact reason on display : even the most heady, hardy etc still get old and stupid eventually. and later is actually worse than early.
mircea_popescu: anyway. i comiserate, terrible days for asciilifeform ; erryone in his pre-wot just keeps turning shitty.
asciilifeform: eh not exactly sudden, this death
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853434 << importantly, did not even do the item which was all that was needed "there are some muppets out there misusing my trademark, they're scammers and do not deal with them"☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 02:25 asciilifeform: ( whether could have won, or not, whoknows, usg 'court' is approx a bank balance contest. but did not even TRY )
mircea_popescu: make it a toxic item in short order.
asciilifeform: ( i specifically foretold , e.g. http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835536 )☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 13:00 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835518 << linus is not immortal, and i expect that he will lose control of kernel -- just as he stupidly lost control of his trademark to 'linux foundation' (y'know, with gavin on staff) -- even before dies
mircea_popescu: somewhere someone (lafond maybe ?) explains the problem of "conservative" or "republican" or w/e, johnny cash style pantsuit fucktard, whereby he's "lawyering up" in his mind, and can't curbstomp nigger at first sign of potential disobedience. "oh, he just asked me the time FOR DIFFERENT REASONS ALTOGETHER, this isn't LEGITIMATE REASON to bas his skull in"
mircea_popescu: kinda the problem of freebased i-cant-believe-hes-not-republican, or in asciilifeform 's parlance "partizans" : they have some complicated nonsense about "justifiable use of force" bla bla bla, can't simply bash in heads who "did nothing to you" etc.
Mocky: BingoBoingo, yeah but even if you could find one of the ~30k marriage age females (among 3.7M pop), and convince her to endure the social downgrade and forgo citizenship for any children, MUST then convince bride's father & suiter then converts to islam!
BingoBoingo: Makes the 20 years look easier doesn't it
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i suspect, in these, simple cowardice, they aimt eager to move out of the mental universe where 'law and order' and into the lafond planet where earthly carcass actually finds itself
Mocky: lol!
mircea_popescu: and they are stubbornly stupid enough so that neither display of the correct behaviour (say in the celebrated http://trilema.com/2014/the-public-burning-of-bob-beck/ ) nor the theoretical explanation of the methodology (at leastr in http://trilema.com/2014/the-logical-impossibility-and-the-moral-untenability-of-forgiveness/ ) clicks with the shit in their heads
asciilifeform: i still dun fully grasp the process whereby a theo 'marries' a bobbeck. what's the draw, exactly
mircea_popescu: aaanyway, whatever. the wages of sin are death.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i quoted the ur item here once, i think. was schmuck on "wikipedia admin board" going to "help out" unless "anyone asks him to stop".
mircea_popescu: they just show up, you understand ? remember the item which set the moron bit on djb for me ? some "vance" moron ?
mircea_popescu: these people simply can not crush a cuntbug.
mircea_popescu: exactly for the reason described, "did nothing to me" etc.
asciilifeform: and from this, goes to have power of attourney and trademark rights? bit of a climb eh
mircea_popescu: heir projected ~expenses against linux~ for their 'service' of 'administering code of conduct' << thjis is all the us ever is anymore.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform hey, they got 20 years to slowly do it.
mircea_popescu: but -- yes. the us never had a "leader" other than this sort of scum, slowly worming itself into position. not in the past century, which is to say -- not since it stopped mattering.
asciilifeform: reminds of old-school 'grifters', the kind that marry 85yo heiress
mircea_popescu: precisely what it is.
mircea_popescu: and the principle is so very celebrated there, they even have it enshrined as the ~only basis of senate
mircea_popescu: they go so far as to say "do not vote for this guy, who is new, vote for the known-corrupt-asshole HE HAS SENIORITY"
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853437 << yes. politically speaking, linux must be utterly destroyed, now.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 02:30 asciilifeform: i imagine a maggot's idea of heaven, this, the fresh meat with no prev maggot crew.
asciilifeform: homo bigmackicus will vote for whatever tv instructs, yes
mircea_popescu: which, amusingly enough, is quite convenient for us to do, what with all of trinque's ave1 's & everyoes workl in that direction.
mircea_popescu: transforming it into a shitpyre wherein the delicious butttears of thousands of http://trilema.com/2017/the-practical-costs-of-hallucinated-freedom/ manaloning engineers flow freely is the play.
mircea_popescu: let the maggots learn the value of stolen stack is 0, and let the "independent", "anonymous" humanrightsetc imbeciles learn there is no life outside of the republic.
asciilifeform: i for one have my kernel, and dun expect to ever miss the Official 'new'
asciilifeform brb,meat
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853449 << i would seriously not worry about this paper wank.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 03:01 Mocky: ha, "However, the new decree stipulates that if a permanent resident leaves Qatar for more than six months, the interior minister could withdraw from the residency"
mircea_popescu: get in a room with the respective people, put the matter plainly to them, shake pinkies and that's that.
mircea_popescu: i never knew paperwork to be worth two shits in arab world.
mircea_popescu: and i never knew bloomberg to be a source on anything besides pop culture.
Mocky: mircea_popescu, so local sponsor must hold >50% controlling interest in any new business. local chamber of commerce apparently on the look out for profitable opportunities with foreigners. I'm not sure where else to look specifically aside from generally making a lot of friends and getting introductions.
Mocky: I'm looking at local conferences, local politics, tech and business groups / meetups. expect to chat up street market vendors on the regular if these are actually arabs and not indians
trinque: asciilifeform: hate to report that I just noticed my pizarro box (running aggression) was sitting there doing absolutely nothing for about 4k blox
trinque: kill trb, restarts, resumes eating
asciilifeform: trinque: 4k ?!
asciilifeform: trinque: not long ago noticed a 400 blox gap on mine, where interestingly restarting did not fix, had to sit for the typical n days and finally meet noads who actually have new blox and dun get malleus'd
asciilifeform: it's a network problem, not a trb one.
trinque: eh, I'm not convinced of that
asciilifeform: trinque: care to post log ?
trinque: the behavior I've seen is that this particular box gets stuck, always immediately resumes receiving blocks when trb is restarted
asciilifeform: cuz it connects to diff nodes.
asciilifeform: on restart. elementarily.
trinque: this is well known
trinque: what I don't have a model for yet is the perma-stuck state
asciilifeform: and otherwise happy to sit for 100 yrs talking to same fuckewits
asciilifeform: i've yet to see this 'stuck', aside from when actively verifying blox. if node with next block shows up, it goes.
trinque: ah, well, the fuckwittism spread, because I've cron'd killall -SIGQUIT bitcoind now
trinque: thing really needs a "everyone I know is retarded, forget them and move on"
asciilifeform: trinque: iirc ben_vulpes actually wrote an experimental this
asciilifeform: but i have not tested
asciilifeform: btw ( and this is not mega-revelation... ) 99.999..+% of noad traffic, is worse than useless -- box is speaking with noads who do not either bring it luscious next valid blox, NOR carry yer tx'en closer to miner, NOR even serve up full chain and enforce trad rulez thereon
asciilifeform: they're just plain dross.
asciilifeform: that we presently have no way to fully be rid of. is all.
asciilifeform: this is an open problem. but there are some pretty simple things that still need doin', e.g. pill for http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-23#1853265☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-23 21:49 asciilifeform: in mostly unrelated lulz, there are apparently noads who shove a couple 100 MB (!) of bastard blox into a connected trb, prior to the latter throwing the ban switch ( because of the idjit shitoshi networking routine, actual disconnect happens a good 10-20sec after ban )
trinque: heh, delayed gag reflex.
asciilifeform: lolyes
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853486 << twist : turns out linus has 'intersectional-feminist'(tm) daughter, who helped to break him☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 04:00 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853437 << yes. politically speaking, linux must be utterly destroyed, now.
asciilifeform: trinque: the crapola-gluetrap steadystate in trb is what i was trying to kill with 'wires' experiment
asciilifeform: was dead end, tho, at least in the way originally written
trinque: quick update on cuntoo before I depart. the fully machine-driven transformation from snapshotted gentoo to cuntoo genesis.vpatch works, and successfully rebuilt itself whole. I've also got the classical gentoo repo acting as a subordinate repository, such that porting ebuilds will be extremely easy (i.e. gentoo repo is now an overlay, just like musl overlay, which can be used or not as decreed by operator,
trinque: but is not required for a cuntoo base system)
asciilifeform: neato.
asciilifeform looks forward to test
trinque: what's left is to shave further weight out of the genesis (currently approx 12M, but this without purging unused versions of used ebuilds), and the accompanying post
trinque: might even get an order of magnitude out of the vpatch with the purge.
trinque: genesis will be the frozen-in-time found item, and from there I'll be looking forward to patches to add ave1 gcc (and later ave1-reproducible-build-gcc), other improvements.
trinque afk
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853499 << me either, honestly.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 04:19 Mocky: mircea_popescu, so local sponsor must hold >50% controlling interest in any new business. local chamber of commerce apparently on the look out for profitable opportunities with foreigners. I'm not sure where else to look specifically aside from generally making a lot of friends and getting introductions.
mircea_popescu: i wouldn't say that you're required/expected to actually go into some sort of "sponsor" relationship with a local fucktard.org. make-your-own sponsor, why not.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853536 << sounds pretty good.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 05:00 trinque: genesis will be the frozen-in-time found item, and from there I'll be looking forward to patches to add ave1 gcc (and later ave1-reproducible-build-gcc), other improvements.
deedbot: http://bimbo.club/?p=26 << Bimbo.Club - TMSR Log Summary - 9/17/2018
deedbot: http://ave1.org/2018/building-gnat-on-musl-no-more-usrincludex86_64-linux-gnu/ << ave1 - Building GNAT on MUSL, no more /usr/include/x86_64-linux-gnu
asciilifeform: ave1: pretty neat. curious, didja grep the whole thing for hardwired paths ?
asciilifeform: ideally in the end there will be none.
asciilifeform: !Q later tell BingoBoingo crate seems to be in customs limbo still
lobbesbot: asciilifeform: The operation succeeded.
diana_coman: hm, a first tiny pilot test of the UDP send/receive looks quite dire (4 in 20 made it, when sent in batches of 4, random lengths); however, I don't know if it's not just overflowing the out buffer to start with (since default value in /proc/sys/net/core/wmem_default is 212992 so real would be half that iirc)
asciilifeform: diana_coman: iirc max packet that linux will actually send, is 65507 byte
diana_coman: asciilifeform, yes, but if one sends a burst of 4 packets , they can overflow that buffer and get dropped, don't they?
asciilifeform: afaik not if you're using blocking send ( and my routine, does )
diana_coman: hm, you mean it's guaranteed that the package is sent and out of the buffer before you can call send again ?
asciilifeform: diana_coman: unless i misread the docs -- yes
asciilifeform: diana_coman: what was your random size range ?
diana_coman: 1-65535
asciilifeform: according to the man pg, sento() block unless one were to set MSG_DONTWAIT ( and we didn't )
asciilifeform: diana_coman: the other thing, entirely possible that yours got fragged and never unfragged, this'll be path-dependent ( as discussed in orig thread )
diana_coman: well, technically speaking 6-65535; specifically: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/b2MqA/?raw=true
asciilifeform: ( i long suspected that nothing far over 512, will reliably go )
diana_coman: yes, I'm trying to figure out mainly if I can at least make sure that it IS sent out of sender; then it can ofc get dropped anywhere on the route
asciilifeform: diana_coman: tcpdump -i eth0 udp port YOURPORT -vv -X
diana_coman: yes, will do
asciilifeform: diana_coman: do you have a list of the ones that reached the other end ?
asciilifeform: the other simple experiment, re fragging, is to set up the receiver on local host, and then on same-lan box
diana_coman: asciilifeform, yes: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/1DmdC/?raw=true (IP edited out; you can easily match them by sizesent+timeSent
diana_coman: basically one of each batch except one batch that was fully lost
asciilifeform: interesting
asciilifeform: see if looks similar when both ends on same box.
diana_coman: anyways, this is just tiny pilot, not yet worth much analysis as such
asciilifeform: diana_coman: it's consistent with what i know of the braindamaged frag reassembly mechanism on most iron
asciilifeform: diana_coman: i.e. there's a tiny reassembly buffer, and if it is occupied while new frags fall in, it drops
asciilifeform: ~nobody, afaik, actually queues all udp frags, it is impractical in light of ddosism
diana_coman: that would certainly fit this observed mess, yes
asciilifeform: so far is exactly what i expected to see, aha
asciilifeform: ( pleasant surprises are few and far between in the internet-of-shit )
diana_coman: anyway, the above examples show also current logs on both sides - if anyone has feedback on it/wants to see something else logged, talk now
asciilifeform: diana_coman: try the local variant. but i expect even across 1 router hop you will see similar picture.
asciilifeform brb,teatime
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> !Q later tell BingoBoingo crate seems to be in customs limbo still << I don't expect the locals did anything at all Saturday/Sunday. No phone calls have been recieved yet. We still have more waiting time before panic time.
lobbesbot: BingoBoingo: Sent 35 minutes ago: <asciilifeform> crate seems to be in customs limbo still
ave1: asciilifeform, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853545, I had seen the path in the specs (gcc -dumspecs) so I knew I had to look in the gcc/config directory. Next was the i386 dir (used for everything intel > i386) next simple grep for "isystem" (I worried that the path would be constructed from parts and so would never be found).☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 13:37 asciilifeform: ave1: pretty neat. curious, didja grep the whole thing for hardwired paths ?
asciilifeform: back
asciilifeform: ave1: i was speaking generally, 'are there other hardwired pathisms in there'
asciilifeform: diana_coman: https://archive.is/k6Wxb << udpism likbez ( may or may not contain anyffing new to you, but posting for the l0gz/n00bz )
asciilifeform: the 1 possibly noteworthy bit, is that fragging can take place anywhere in the route, while reassembly -- only at final receiver .
asciilifeform: ( can skip straight to section 'IP Fragmentation' )
asciilifeform: the other item of interest, not mentioned, is that quite a few infrastructural routers will simply drop frags, for the reason that all but 1 frag of a fragged packet contain no copy of the source or destination port -- and thereby impossible to ddos-filter. so they drop'em.
asciilifeform: ( this braindamaged design decision goes, as one might expect, back to the olden days when homo redditus was not yet on the net and 'arpa' designed for nukefest-related problems, not against 'ddos' )
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/ijjM3 << even moar pedantic detail re fraggism. ( can safely skip the ipv6-related crapola )
asciilifeform: in particular, 'Lost fragments represent a slightly more involved problem than lost packets. The receiver has a packet reassembly timer upon the receipt of the first fragment, and will continue to hold this reassembly state for the reassembly time. The reassembly timer is a factor in the maximal count of packets in flight, as the packet identifier cannot be recycled within the period defined by the sender-received path delay, plus th
asciilifeform: e receiver’s reassembly timer. For higher delay high capacity network paths, this limit of 65,535 packets in flight can be a potential performance bottleneck [RFC 4963].'
asciilifeform: diana_coman: traceroute --mtu destinationip will show the mtu of the 1st 'fraggable' node in the path
asciilifeform: ( i got 1500 , and at own router )
mod6: mornin'
asciilifeform: guten morgen mod6
mod6: o7
mod6: trinque: Thanks for reporting.
asciilifeform: mod6: i was thinking of trinque's idea : suppose trb closed all open pipes if it finds that $configurable hours (e.g. 3) have passed without new blox
asciilifeform: mod6: my main hesitation re the item is that it may be 'plugging wrong end of funnel', quite possibly no such gymnastics would be necessary if we simply had a http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-23#1853143 and always --addnode'd the actually useful nodes, rather than relying on pure chance☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-23 20:59 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-23#1853137 << this reminds me of an item i had on chalkboard but never had a chance to actually bake -- a running log of where/when (ip, remote ver, time) noad got each incoming candidate block .
asciilifeform: mod6: right nao, our address-getting mechanism is the ancient turdalicious one inherited from shitoshi -- where the table is blindly filled with whatever connected folx decide to throw in
asciilifeform: this presently consists 90+% of boxen that get immediately (or rather, not quite immediately.. http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-23#1853265 ) malleus'd☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-23 21:49 asciilifeform: in mostly unrelated lulz, there are apparently noads who shove a couple 100 MB (!) of bastard blox into a connected trb, prior to the latter throwing the ban switch ( because of the idjit shitoshi networking routine, actual disconnect happens a good 10-20sec after ban )
asciilifeform: imho a trb node ought to only advertise addrs that either a) part of the manual --addnode set the node was brought up with , or b) actually supplied a correct block in the recent past
asciilifeform: this will make for something like sane peer propagation, which presently we dun have.
asciilifeform: i suspect that it would lubricate both block rx and tx broadcast.
asciilifeform: arguably 1st step to properly de-sibyl-ing the network.
mod6 thinks
asciilifeform: sanely-behaving nodes (both trb and hypothetical trb-compatible heathens, which exist, or we'd see 0 blox) ought to be able to find ~and keep~ each other company
asciilifeform: whatever machine cycles ~remain~ after this, can service randos.
asciilifeform: ( nao, ideally all of the sane people would actually know one another and wot, and link their nodes via ciphered pipes, all the way to miner. but i dun expect to live to see this. )
mod6: Yeah, this might be a proper step forward to de-sibyling the thing. And as long as we can still service randos, even if in second place.
mod6: I'm gonna think on it a bit.
asciilifeform: i'd be interested to see what mircea_popescu makes of this algo. because i can see a possible fatal downside.
asciilifeform: ( potentially such network may favour 'old' miner over 'new' )
asciilifeform: or, rather, slightly increases the 'inertia'
asciilifeform: gedankenexperiment : let's suppose that all new blox presently are born in nodes A, B, C. from there, propagate to rest of planet. the immediate peers of A, B, C, will have them parked at the very top of their peer table, right below the manually-added 'meat' peers. now say a D shows up. D may have faster hash rate even than A+B+C, but his blox will still be considered only ~after~ those of A,B,C. at least, for a time.
asciilifeform: thereby any peer ranking algo that favours 'useful' peers, will give A,B,C a substantial advantage over any new D.
asciilifeform: and not merely because A,B,C reliably supply correct blox, but they also will have most reliable tx-eating. so they will get sent all new tx in preference to D.
asciilifeform: this is a potentially dangerous arse-mouth system.
asciilifeform: but on the other hand, the current system makes for pestilential sibylism.
diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853594 -> same here, 1500 at own router☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 15:11 asciilifeform: diana_coman: traceroute --mtu destinationip will show the mtu of the 1st 'fraggable' node in the path
asciilifeform: oh hey
Mocky: asciilifeform, is there a way to quantify "for a time"? Because requiring a 'tour of duty' dun necessarily seem like a bad thing. Is showing up with faster hash rate and getting full advantage on day one something to optimize for? (or day N, which is why I wonder how to quantify)
asciilifeform: Mocky: the boojum is that mining in classical btc worx in such a way as to amplify small advantages into gigantic
asciilifeform: Mocky: recall the chains of empty/near-empty blox the chinese sometimes emit
Mocky: ahh, yes I've seen but didn't know who emits
asciilifeform: 'who' is a misconceived, somewhat, q, cockroaches dun have faces
asciilifeform: but in general blox come from asiclandia.
Mocky: I presumed as much
asciilifeform: Mocky: the current algo optimizes for nuffin at all. but the puzzler is, if we were to optimize for ~something~, could it create a problem. esp if the algo worx as i predict, and the nodes using it, end up forming an optimally short link to the miners.
asciilifeform: potentially could sharpen an already dire 'ecological' problem.
asciilifeform: !#s miner cartel
a111: 34 results for "miner cartel", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=miner%20cartel
asciilifeform: ^ see also.
Mocky: seems like no node operator benefits individually from a non-optimal link to miners.
asciilifeform: superficially correct.
asciilifeform: but end result may end up being a net where even moar 'winner take all' than presently.
Mocky: but yes I see the knock on effects are not the same as superficial effects
asciilifeform: the fundamental problem is that the conditions favouring miner cartels are already baked into btc per se.
asciilifeform: and theoretically if the cartel births '9000' new sybils, it will force the use of something like my algo, whether anyone wants to or not, the layer of sibylade would become undrillable in its absence . but this is admittedly a stretch.
asciilifeform: then again we may already be in the midst of just such a thing, there's, what, ~20k distinct nodes operating, and overwhelming majority of these, are simply rubbish
asciilifeform: !#s thermodynamics proposes kinetics disposes
a111: 6 results for "thermodynamics proposes kinetics disposes", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=thermodynamics%20proposes%20kinetics%20disposes
asciilifeform: ( classical btc 'thermodynamics', predispose to cartel. but 'kinetics' of ~randomsoup (vs 'intelligent' routing) make this less apparent. )
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2018/09/discontent-in-zambia-over-chinese-investment/ << Qntra - Discontent In Zambia Over Chinese Investment
asciilifeform: '"I am not happy with the dominance of Chinese contractors. In the first place, the money that they get from these contracts is externalised and all that they return here are meagre wages," said Edgar Syakachoma, himself a contractor. "Let the government also give us the contracts so that they benefit Zambians."' << hey, recall mircea_popescu's piece with the argentine anti-bus protesters
asciilifeform: 'oh noez, bus could take moneybags to some OTHER street'
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-19#1851949 << see also.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-19 18:17 mircea_popescu: what i meant by "mercantilism" is that they do not want the locals to leak dollars back into the ubers of the world.
BingoBoingo: Which, well... by all apearances Uruguay leaks a substantial amount into Uber. Recently "Uber Eats" bicicletas have appeared in numbers that almost rival the Pedidos Ya bicicletas and motorcycles.
BingoBoingo: A third delivery service Rappi (Argentine like Pedidos Ya) arrived aroudn the time Uber Eats did and seems to be holding last place in that niche
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: as i understand, orcistani rulers are perfectly free to stop out-inflating the usd, and then can quit worrying re 'leaking hard currency' any time they want
asciilifeform: ( i dun think, e.g., lichtenstein, worries re 'leaking dollars' )
BingoBoingo: I try explaining this to the locals when they reminisce about the 2005-2015 good old days
BingoBoingo: "BCU targeting a 7% inflation rate just might be why you are all being frog boiled into increasingly deeper poverty"
BingoBoingo: But hey, everything is great and peachy for them because Starbucks is getting joined by H&M on October 6th
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i've found that it is normally impossible to explain any such thing to folx who operate in 'pig logic', i.e. 'would there be moar? or less?, slop in my trough?'
asciilifeform: cuz the answer is nearly always 'not only less slop, but butcher shop' and conversation stops there.
asciilifeform: as i understand, this is how mircea_popescu ended up setting bozo bit on argentines. 100% pig-os.
BingoBoingo: Well, the Argentines also didn't acknowledge their poverty
asciilifeform: 'samba si, trabajo no'
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: eh they 'acknowledge', in the sense of 'obummer did it'
mod6: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853622 << perhaps.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 15:55 asciilifeform: this is a potentially dangerous arse-mouth system.
BingoBoingo: Oh, they'll flat out say Uruguay is a poor country
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i've yet to meet the orc who did not say 'mine is a poor country.' after all, so far from miami.
asciilifeform: that mecca, from which in orc cosmography all wealth somehow flows.
asciilifeform: relatedly, phunphakt, all of asciilifeform's packets to/from BingoBoingostan, relay through 4.68.72.61 : nsa station in miami.
BingoBoingo: Uruguay has a petite Miami light about 90 km east of Montevideo every summer. The police there even catch the street sleepers for redistribution to other parts of the country.
BingoBoingo: There's even advertisements on the streets for events at "World Trade Center - Punta del Este"
asciilifeform: lol!
asciilifeform: what sorta 'events' ?
BingoBoingo: International marketing, networking, and the usual bread and butter. There's an advertisement station in front of the closed zoo that they seem to favor.
asciilifeform: mighty lotta cheek, for folx who torment a 300 $ crate in tariff hell, to prattle about 'international marketing'
BingoBoingo: They also have ads in the other Uruguay WTC tower lobbies advertise "Work in the best place to live"
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> mighty lotta cheek, for folx who torment a 300 $ crate in tariff hell, to prattle about 'international marketing' << They don't want buying. See they only want to do the SELLING part.
asciilifeform: selling what, exactly. ( daughters ? )
BingoBoingo: Beef, breeding cattle, soybeans, hotel nights for Punta del Este´s visually impressive jellyfish beach
BingoBoingo: And yes daughters
asciilifeform: even per this 'logic', seems like there's a loose end -- so, ok, they sell, SELL, only. bags of benjies -- go in. ~then~ wat.
BingoBoingo: Frente Amplio burns the benjies while inflating the peso and everyone frog boils into poverty.
asciilifeform: i guess disney had one possible answer re the 'wat', http://66.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lja7aorWsU1qze0z6o1_1280.jpg
asciilifeform: benjies only work because they eventually return to 'miami', sorta like yer mains socket only worx because current able to go in the neutral pin
BingoBoingo: Related: https://www.elobservador.com.uy/nota/en-octubre-comienzan-a-ensenar-chino-en-liceos--2018921194747
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853526 << illustrating the problem here : if man has a moron daugther but does not say "oh, i have a moron daugther", he is in obvious danger of "and she made me a moron too".☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 04:54 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853486 << twist : turns out linus has 'intersectional-feminist'(tm) daughter, who helped to break him
asciilifeform: ohai mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: hola!
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: fwiw i had nfi linus even had daughter. then apparently find, he does, and she's 'pavlik morozov'
asciilifeform: !#s morozov
a111: 12 results for "morozov", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=morozov
mircea_popescu: which is what i mean. "oh, my fambly business is my own" "sure, it is. until it suddenly isn't."
mircea_popescu: this'd be the counterpoint to "omfg, mp will publish anything". sure, he will. "it's exaggerate!". sure, it is.
mircea_popescu: if you don't control your women, you're stuck making public laughingstocks of them. there's no "third way".
mircea_popescu: and the punishment for "what if i don't" is... "they will".
asciilifeform: ( for folx who aint sov-entomologists : pavlik morozov was a kid who turned in own father to dekulakizers. for this, grandfather beheaded him with axe. and kid was made into an Official 'hero' )
mircea_popescu: can't help but like the soviet peons more than the usgistani zeks.
asciilifeform: as for the 'code of conduct' liquishit, apparently thing is written by some purpose-built pantsuit org in berlin, and standardized, and right after l. signing the instrument of surrender, the purges kicked off
mircea_popescu: what "purges" ? who the fuck would stay on with shitux.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: as i understand, most of what thing consisted of, was massive gaggle of iron maker sponsored driver-makin' folx
mircea_popescu: "driver"
asciilifeform: most of'em prolly not even smelled the smoke yet
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: e.g. the chinese rk people
mircea_popescu: hey, linux ~already useless for any practical purpose. you know i have a trashed hp envy sitting here because trhere's no way to run the wireless on it ?
mircea_popescu: "aethershit".
mircea_popescu: wtf, wired laptop, what sense does that make.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there's some % who actually endrivered various new iron. e.g. dulap kernel built for arm64 won't actually boot on rk, needs the little bit of chinesium ( i have it laid out, fwiw , mostly, specifically for when we pour cement )
mircea_popescu: but the point remains -- they're still ~useless (or amstan-useful, if you prefer). literally better of without 'em.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the sad-802.11 thing is endemic ( recall asciilifeform's recipe of how to terraform ibm x60 . step 1 is to pull out the wireless nic and stuff in ye olde atheros )
mircea_popescu: eh im not fucking doing soldering jobs for a fucking laptop.
asciilifeform: 0 soldering, thing had a lid
mircea_popescu: a pity, too, it's light and nice monitor.
asciilifeform: this was in the not-soldered dayz
mircea_popescu: ah
mircea_popescu: yes well.
asciilifeform: it's a pre-obummer box.
trinque: yeh most of these are separate mpcie card, though the point remains
trinque: can in theory replace with a known workable card
asciilifeform: trinque: on various newer irons, soldered (e.g. almost all 'chromebook')
mircea_popescu: ah, and i bought a dongle for it ? the linux driver "requires" gcc 4.9
trinque: asciilifeform: oh, sad indeed
mircea_popescu: i'm NOT debugging make error soup, either.
mircea_popescu: (not to even mention they ship a fucking cd with the dongle, the fucktards, on which there's autorun and windows bs. the linux stuff -- get from our website. ON A CONNECTIVITY DEVICE. then they wanna talk about "code of conduct" ? HOW THE FUCK ABOUT NOT.)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i dun think i ever got even as far as this, with a radio nic made post-'08; yer ahead of me
mircea_popescu: im trashing the whole worksheet, unless you want something from it.
mircea_popescu: wasted a slave half-day chasing the nonsense blergh.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what nic was this even
mircea_popescu: aite, ima fetch teh details.
asciilifeform: ( at least even if only to put in 'this -- pig shit' file )
mircea_popescu: model TL-WN823N(EU) v3.0
asciilifeform: oh almost forgot, another phunphakt, in orig torvalds surrender papers, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-17#1850713 : winblowz uniturd quotes .☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-17 08:05 ave1: In other news, some lulzy drama underway in the Linux kernel camp; https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/CA+55aFy+Hv9O5citAawS+mVZO+ywCKd9NQ2wxUmGsz9ZJzqgJQ@mail.gmail.com/
asciilifeform: e.g. 0xE2 0x80 0x9C
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: notoriously broken nic
asciilifeform: it dun even switch on w/out a large fw turd, which i'm guessing mircea_popescu did not have
asciilifeform: pretty much as sad as intel's
mircea_popescu: got any recommendations ?
asciilifeform: atheros
asciilifeform: realtek also worx, though not nearly as reliably
asciilifeform: e.g. RTL8187L, can be had in usb-boxes like alfa's AWUS036H ( ~20bux in ameristan )
mircea_popescu: cool.
mircea_popescu: lmao windows quotes, that's classy.
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/m4SR9 << ameristani vendor, but prolly gettable in bananistan, as 'ships from china!' anyway
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853710 << can laugh if you like, but asciilifeform uses room fulla lappies, and most of'em never leave the copper lan☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 18:54 mircea_popescu: wtf, wired laptop, what sense does that make.
mircea_popescu: yeah well... i would never. why not get a desktop, cheaper parts, better heat.
asciilifeform: space, and heat.
asciilifeform: ( i dun imagine either is problem in castle mircea_popescustein )
mircea_popescu: apparently not.
asciilifeform: asciilifeform's dwelling makes nazi uboat look spacious like stadium
mircea_popescu: oh, is this part and parcel of all the "luxuries keep me bolted down in usgistan that i could never have anywhere else" line ?
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853724 << incidentally ave1's cemented gnat is a 4.9☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 18:57 mircea_popescu: ah, and i bought a dongle for it ? the linux driver "requires" gcc 4.9
mircea_popescu: like, hard vacuum to pump you quite as neatly in sardine can not available anywhere else ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's the other end of that stick, the unspeakable salt mine crud that keeps asciilifeform's lights on
mircea_popescu: yes well, mine's a 4.4.3 ; perhaps one day it'll be ave1 's, but that day is not today and so tough luck to the shitcard.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i can't fathom why kernelism would want a 4.9 specifically
asciilifeform: ( or, rather, can... but who wants )
mircea_popescu: me either, but as i said, makepile errors out and im not debugging this
asciilifeform: dun bother
asciilifeform: there's ~0 to be gained from nursing sad iron, life is too short
mircea_popescu: i sometimes do it as learnpunishment for girls. but ample iron to punish with viz few girls need punished.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: whoknows, one day you find out that one of'em ported it
asciilifeform: ( like that legend with prof who left unsolved problem as 'homework' on board, came back to find it solved )
mircea_popescu: heh
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853549 << ouch. they made networking great again meanwhile also ?!☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 13:50 diana_coman: hm, a first tiny pilot test of the UDP send/receive looks quite dire (4 in 20 made it, when sent in batches of 4, random lengths); however, I don't know if it's not just overflowing the out buffer to start with (since default value in /proc/sys/net/core/wmem_default is 212992 so real would be half that iirc)
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853560 << ah, this is what it was huh☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 13:56 asciilifeform: ( i long suspected that nothing far over 512, will reliably go )
mircea_popescu: diana_coman it occurs to me the work might also be misspecced. anyone have serious objections to moving to 1-2048 down from 1-65536 ?
mircea_popescu: i really didn't think it through, wtf is this 28355, 52181, 2600, 7269, 16286, 47627, 36352, 53247, 24192, 63568 bullshit, no one with any sort of networking experience would expect this to go.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: lol i did say. back in the gossipd thread.
asciilifeform: fragging is massive loss.
mircea_popescu: yeah. unless anyone throws in a good reason we're dropping the far range, this is nonsense.
asciilifeform: i did have a tiny shred of 'hm maybe modern gear reassembles', but it was just that, a lark
asciilifeform: the real q is , just how far above 512, and below 1500, can go
mircea_popescu: just about. 2048 amply distant outer bound.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: out of curiosity, wouldja be willing to traceroute --mtu 161.0.121.200 and say what mtu you got
asciilifeform: (e.g. mine : F=1500 )
mircea_popescu: asec
asciilifeform: that there -- is the bottleneck
asciilifeform: i.e. where they start getting fragalicious
mircea_popescu: F=1500 here too.
asciilifeform: a ty mircea_popescu
asciilifeform: ( anybody else get different number ?? mod6 ? trinque ? et al )
asciilifeform: this # btw includes packet headers. ergo max payload , will be slightly smaller
asciilifeform: note that fragging takes place exactly 1ce, as only final destination ever unfrags. and in my case it happens right where my iron meets isp's fibertron.
trinque: asciilifeform: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/jrs5Q/?raw=true << got this, dun see a "F="
asciilifeform: trinque: i just noticed this, on dulap also, apparently some recent year's shitgnomism in gentoo mutilated traceroute
asciilifeform: trinque: fwiw i was able to measure mtu ~from~ dulap, using USE="tracepath" emerge iptools and tracepath -4 asciilifeformshouse
asciilifeform: ( result : 1500 )
asciilifeform: loox like even this basic util, will have to go in cuntoo from asciilifeform's ( or trinque's ) vintage tarballs museum, rather than from 'current'
asciilifeform: ( what did shitgnome have against mtu measurer , gotta wonder )
mircea_popescu: trinque my servers do the ~same
asciilifeform: i suspect -- similarly afflicted
mircea_popescu: 2.0.13 vs 2.0.14 problem
mircea_popescu: ie 2009 vs 2010
asciilifeform: in my set : 'version 2.0.19, Jun 28 2013' << happy ; 'version 2.0.20, Sep 24 2018' << saad
mircea_popescu: maybe it's only even versions work
asciilifeform: same , supposedly, author, one Dmitry Butskoy
mircea_popescu: odd*
asciilifeform: if somebody can be arsed to find who/what/when/why, could be interesting
asciilifeform: but prolly not worth the cycles
asciilifeform: at any rate, 1500 appears to be the ceiling.
mircea_popescu always used tracepath, nfi.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if yer using a linux that 'came with things', it's likely to have both
mircea_popescu: and it says pmtu 1500 on a half dozen servers i looked, si
asciilifeform: aha not surprise
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform actually traceroute i had to install.
asciilifeform: ha
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> F=1500 here too. << Here as well
mircea_popescu: (i really like tracepath much better tbh.)
asciilifeform: metoo
asciilifeform: fwiw ethernet mtu is 1500
asciilifeform: so not mega-surprise
asciilifeform: anyffing above, guaranteed frag
asciilifeform: what i'm curious about, is how far below also frag.
mircea_popescu: is the take home from here that 1500, rather than 2048, should be the outer bound ?
asciilifeform: ( ~inside~ some lands you can get 'jumbogram', up to coupla kB, but this is not really interesting from our pov imho )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha yer likely to get same result with 2048 as with 20000
mircea_popescu: yeah. good point.
mircea_popescu: but the ideais, ARE we interested in a sliver of data re that ?
asciilifeform: well yes : conceivably 'frags in 2' worx ~100% of time, but 'in 8' not etc
mircea_popescu: yeah.
mircea_popescu: well, this has been a productive discussion, hasn't it.
asciilifeform: ( i predict that any frag at all will give loss that cancels out the win from using heavy packets. but nobody should take my word for it, test, test )
asciilifeform: btw , esp for diana_coman , e.g. 1000 byte payload will be a 1028 byte total mass. (header)
asciilifeform: iirc.
asciilifeform: ergo payload of 1472 corresponds to mass of 1500.
mircea_popescu: aha.
asciilifeform: nao, according to the talmud, max guara-nonfrag udp is 508. but this , this oughta be seen.
asciilifeform: ( 508 payload, that is )
asciilifeform: given as i do not know a reason why it oughta be as low as 508 when going from ip stack mtu would be 1472.
mircea_popescu: i expect we'll have a nice pile of data this week.
asciilifeform: conceivably , on some really sad gsm modem somewhere, or the like, it will be 508.
asciilifeform: yea as i understand diana_coman already has the knobs, can turn'em when she wakes up
mircea_popescu: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/1DmdC/?raw=true << fucking inconceivable 20kb udp made it through.
asciilifeform: 1 per burst ( see thrd )
mircea_popescu: aha. im seeing.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-01-26#1386298 << speaking of which : 124 gram duckling recognizes the cork of a bottle of guatemalan rum with a hair tie around it as DOOM ON FUCKING WHEELS.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-01-26 17:20 ascii_butugychag: (there was a spiffy talk at shmoo, which mentioned how nn used in image recognition usually imprints on what - to a human - would be an entirely accidental cluster of pixels, and if you flip'em, it will recognize an obvious, e.g,. cat, as a refrigerator, etc)
mircea_popescu: nearly fell over itself sideways trying to GET THE FUCK OUT OMFG OMFG
mircea_popescu: who knows what ancestral terror snake it thinks it is. because pixels, right ?
BingoBoingo: Imma suspect some sort of turtle
mircea_popescu: turtles eat ducks ?!
BingoBoingo: All the time. Snapping turtles love ducklings
BingoBoingo: It's like those nature documentary nile river crossing scenes with the crocs in miniature
mircea_popescu: really ?!
mircea_popescu: interesting.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853590 << quite. what a nuke the "empowerment"'s turned out to be.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 14:58 asciilifeform: ( this braindamaged design decision goes, as one might expect, back to the olden days when homo redditus was not yet on the net and 'arpa' designed for nukefest-related problems, not against 'ddos' )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha.. the amazing thing isn't that 'x,y,z are broken' but that any part still worx..
asciilifeform: ( and i indeed suspect that no pentagon ww3 planner planned for anyffing like the current level of breakage, at that )
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853601 << this seems so to me. how about we wot the trb, rather than iptables it.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 15:25 asciilifeform: mod6: my main hesitation re the item is that it may be 'plugging wrong end of funnel', quite possibly no such gymnastics would be necessary if we simply had a http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-23#1853143 and always --addnode'd the actually useful nodes, rather than relying on pure chance
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: see thread...
mircea_popescu: iirc we had a spec discussion re how to populate nodes.
mircea_popescu: but yes, this is the other half -- need to bake trb nodes that won't get insta-banned by wot-trb on sight because they spew garbage
asciilifeform: ( $thread was specifically re puzzler of how -- and if -- to sort nodes ~not~ known to be operated by wot'd humans. rather than ' asciilifeform's wires ' and related experiment )
mircea_popescu: no, recall, was an economic solution, "if node doesn't pay its way it's kicked"
asciilifeform: right, this'd be immediately practical if the net consisted of wot'd folx an' their boxen
mircea_popescu: the idea there was to drive compliance.
mircea_popescu: but in order for it to work -- yes very much need nodes that don't misbehave.
asciilifeform: ( but as it is, we also have a wild animal, in the mix, called miner, and its immediate ecosystem )
asciilifeform: aha
mircea_popescu: let me try an' fish it out
asciilifeform: iirc was one of the moar recent 'trb-i' mircea_popescu threads
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=from%3Amircea+trb-i << interesting list, at that.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-02-27#1619483 << one item, somewhat related, not the item sought though. (this is to tightnen miner-node paths)☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-02-27 22:07 mircea_popescu: now, the historical solutionb to the problem, as well as perhaps a workable solution here, is the intrinsic oracle. if user relays txn to a node WHO MAKES A PROMISE (such as for instance "the txn will be included before block n" ?) then the nodes can be scored by their oracle value ("what he said turned out true!) and suddenly you have a more meaningful node market.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2015-08-01#1220066 / http://btcbase.org/log/2015-08-01#1220067 << possiblty this entire thread was exactly it.☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2015-08-01 00:30 mircea_popescu: (original design was to simply shutter all connecting peers that fail to provide good $$$ txn, in some sort of %)
a111: Logged on 2015-08-01 00:30 asciilifeform: thing is, this'll result in a very random selection at present
mircea_popescu: infuriatingly enough, i can't find it now. but the discussion was exactly along the same lines, "add user-configurable penalty for communicating shitblocks (any block that isn't the one you were looking for) and any other misbehaviour ; and used-configurable bonus for communicating useful things ; then user-configurable knob for lowest-tolerable-score and ban peers who fall under"
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2015-01-31#999477 << early version of the idea.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2015-01-31 03:13 mircea_popescu: something simple like, "whenever a parentless block is handed over the retaining of which would cause memory pool for holding parentless blocks to be overrun, a) drop the handed block ; b) close the connection and ban that peer for half hour ; c) discard all chains of parentless blocks longer than six items ; d) connect again"
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-01-03#1595770 << alluded to in the more specified TRB.B/TRB.N prototype design.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-01-03 20:33 mircea_popescu: otherwise it is discarded. B.T may be pruned (according to arbitrary address list, for instance). Rate limiting in TRB.N may be constructed to observe N.B items that fail to propagate to B.B and ban the originating peers.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2015-05-31#1148935 << FUUCK, found! this is what i was looking for, http://btcbase.org/log/2015-05-31#1148937 http://btcbase.org/log/2015-05-31#1148938☝︎☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2015-05-31 12:11 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=31-05-2015#1148837 << i would like to see a patch which maintains VALUED list of other nodes.
a111: Logged on 2015-05-31 12:11 mircea_popescu: with a time decay, with a penalty for sending bad blocks and a positive for sending good blocks at a good speed.
a111: Logged on 2015-05-31 12:12 mircea_popescu: say something like : every bad block received, -10 points. every minute where connection is kept at 80% of its allocated bw or over, 1 point. every hour score decays 1% towards 0, be it either positive or negative.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853635 << the universal problem with "progress" in a functional world -- it manages to turn to shit.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 16:07 asciilifeform: potentially could sharpen an already dire 'ecological' problem.
deedbot: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=2578 << Loper OS - Linux. (1991 2018)
asciilifeform: speeaaking of which.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853649 << entirely usg's desperation. they're losing preminence/getting locked out of markets at a shocking rate for a "world power" not defeated in war.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 16:42 deedbot: http://qntra.net/2018/09/discontent-in-zambia-over-chinese-investment/ << Qntra - Discontent In Zambia Over Chinese Investment
mircea_popescu: but hey, "opted" to not have wot presence, just desserts.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i take it you dun suppose the miners thing , upthread, will be serious boojum ? ( or should i wait for mircea_popescu to eat log )
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853669 << huge difference, >> http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-18#1753439 ; http://trilema.com/2015/latino-perspectives/#selection-137.0-137.45 etc☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 17:00 BingoBoingo: Oh, they'll flat out say Uruguay is a poor country
a111: Logged on 2017-12-18 16:07 BingoBoingo: Argentina's slogan is the lie "Argentina no es un pais pobre", Montevideo's is the truth "Montevideo es muy tranquilo"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i suppose it is a serious bojum that is in no way resolved by smearing shit over eyes.
asciilifeform: rright, i observed that the situation could be forced into being very inexpensively, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853644☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 16:15 asciilifeform: and theoretically if the cartel births '9000' new sybils, it will force the use of something like my algo, whether anyone wants to or not, the layer of sibylade would become undrillable in its absence . but this is admittedly a stretch.
asciilifeform: i.e. may as well gather the win to be had from firing the first rockets.
mircea_popescu: it's just....
mircea_popescu: it's just not how it works, "nobody could have seen through shitsoup!!!". really ?
asciilifeform: whether shitoshi could or not see past own bellybutton, can be debated 4evah
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853672 << doh.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 17:02 asciilifeform: relatedly, phunphakt, all of asciilifeform's packets to/from BingoBoingostan, relay through 4.68.72.61 : nsa station in miami.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853677 << = >> http://trilema.com/2012/all-politics-is-local-politics/☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 17:07 BingoBoingo: International marketing, networking, and the usual bread and butter. There's an advertisement station in front of the closed zoo that they seem to favor.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853678 << it's just the cunt signal, "what to do instead of whoring if you're a hottie teenager"☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 17:08 asciilifeform: mighty lotta cheek, for folx who torment a 300 $ crate in tariff hell, to prattle about 'international marketing'
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-24#1853684 << just because mercantilism got killed in the 1600s dun mean the sort of brains that naturally spawn mercantilism as a state-of-the-art mentality stopped being poopped.☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-09-24 17:13 asciilifeform: even per this 'logic', seems like there's a loose end -- so, ok, they sell, SELL, only. bags of benjies -- go in. ~then~ wat.
mircea_popescu: much like just because we have penicillin dun mean tb gave up and left the planet.
asciilifeform: aaha.. thinking folx, sometimes give up; vermin -- never
asciilifeform: 'stupidity has infinite health' or how did mircea_popescu's old piece formulate it.
deedbot: http://bimbo.club/?p=27 << Bimbo.Club - TMSR Log Summary - 9/18/2018
asciilifeform: trinque, mircea_popescu , et al : asciilifeform, in light of http://www.loper-os.org/?p=2578 etc , has been thinking of genesising the kernel. prolly not tonight or tomorrow, but in near fyootoor. if anyone has particular desires ( & optionally, justification ) for particular ver becoming The Last and cemented, would like to hear about it.
asciilifeform: likewise it is time for folx to go over their iron and nominate driverolade that they believe ought to live.
asciilifeform: or at least, to start.
asciilifeform: ( see also '...Я тебя не трону, а в душе зарою / И прикажу залить цементом, чтобы не разрыть.'(tm)(r)( vysotsky, https://archive.is/LXXw8 ) )
asciilifeform: ( oblig shitty engl. trans, http://samlib.ru/a/as_w/vys-chr-ru-e.shtml )
trinque: the kernel in current cuntoo is 4.9.95, by virtue solely of being when I took the snapshot
asciilifeform: 4.9.76 on dulap, and slightly earlier iirc in rk branch ( will have to maintain at least these 2 forks , i suspect )
asciilifeform: i currently dun have a strong opinion re which 4.x is cementable
asciilifeform: i wouldn't even object to cementing a 3.x, supposing i had a working one for rk
asciilifeform: ( i have a buncha pc boxen running 3.x and entirely satisfied with'em )
asciilifeform: but would like to hear from the l1 folx re subj before mixing the cement.
trinque: asciilifeform: what's the word on this "speculative execution" thing? dun matter?
asciilifeform: trinque: imho dun matter worth a sparrow's fart
asciilifeform: i.e. isolation on x86 is illusory
trinque: aite, then that'd be the only thing coming to mind to prevent pulling an older vintage
asciilifeform: any attempt to repair it simply creates a nsa.nobus imho
trinque: certainly miles more attack surface
asciilifeform: ( + a reallly slow box.. )
asciilifeform: i'll consider backports of patches that fix e.g. 'magic packet of death', but not 'spectre' etc rubbish
asciilifeform: both now and in fyootoor
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform 2.6.something ? or which are you thinking ?
asciilifeform: 3.x ~= 2.6
mircea_popescu: so what, like diseased newt ?
asciilifeform: hm?
mircea_popescu: just trying to tease out which version.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not being a debianist, i cannot immediately say which edition of it this'd correspond to
mircea_popescu: i mean which kernel version.
trinque: buzzing beedog
mircea_popescu: "diseased newt" = 3.18-rc3
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the oldest i have on currently serving box anywhere is 3.8.8
mircea_popescu: trinque i fucking grepped
trinque: lol
mircea_popescu: before noticing beedog!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i use 2.6 ~everywhere.
asciilifeform: neato
mircea_popescu: trilema eg served from 2.5.32
mircea_popescu: 2.6.32*
asciilifeform: i suppose if you dun need post-'04 irons, worx great
mircea_popescu: i see eulora server was built in 4.14.7
mircea_popescu: ftr, cpu is 2006.