mircea_popescu: in other news, the new merchant of venice is actually 40% done!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9000 @ 0.00051687 = 4.6518 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15150 @ 0.00051279 = 7.7688 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I haven't seen any other commands in debug.log yet. Perhaps leave a comment on post?
BingoBoingo: I mean before using the patch. I've only seen bloom filter from multibit/Shildebach et al hit my node.
BingoBoingo: Other commands may emerge, but bloom filter request is the only one I have seen in the wild.
mircea_popescu: anyway, maybe all this "soft-fork" bullshit is really a good opportunity to start a #b-a mining pool.
☟︎ BingoBoingo: Who says public pool? Or single point of failure? Why not fork p2pool?
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 00:59:53; mircea_popescu: anyway, maybe all this "soft-fork" bullshit is really a good opportunity to start a #b-a mining pool.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: shinohai a few people have asked, which is why i said.
shinohai: It would be handy to mine own tx's but would require considerable hashpower, no?
gribble: Current Blocks: 392907 | Current Difficulty: 1.0388034081545589E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 393119 | Next Difficulty In: 212 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 5 hours, 45 minutes, and 15 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None
mircea_popescu: not really. to guarantee same-day inclusion, you'd need 1/10/24 * 10^11 = 0.5% of the current hash rate. to guarantee the usual thing wires guarantee (2-3 days) proportionally less.
☟︎ gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 446.27, vol: 7498.99347541 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 444.001, vol: 6295.41647 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 446.8, vol: 14550.86099406 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 447.226002, vol: 37121.74600000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 447.37, vol: 112.39650116 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 454.453760989, vol: 15.66709175 | Volume-weighted last average: 446.714667061
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7300 @ 0.00051688 = 3.7732 BTC [+]
mod6: ftr: im still laughing about kako's buddy who needed the condoms in thailand
shinohai: Good to have friends that will ship you rubbers just like that when necessary.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33732 @ 0.00050901 = 17.1699 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 01:13:37; mircea_popescu: not really. to guarantee same-day inclusion, you'd need 1/10/24 * 10^11 = 0.5% of the current hash rate. to guarantee the usual thing wires guarantee (2-3 days) proportionally less.
mircea_popescu: and it being a random process, "guarantee" is necessarily an average sort of concept.
ben_vulpes: i caught snippets over the oar, looking forward to it.
assbot: Logged on 11-01-2016 13:56:49; mircea_popescu: yes, naming can work like that, if 8chan.co and 94875984375983.jksldak are the same to you.
gribble: You have not yet rated user gernika
mircea_popescu: if you think i'm about to load my head with random strings...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11200 @ 0.00051688 = 5.7891 BTC [+]
assbot: Logged on 11-01-2016 15:21:54; copypaste: i very much love the concept of a 3d game with a bitcoin economy. i've played a few, but all poorly done.
mircea_popescu: nah, eve has an inflation problem larger than the usg's.
ben_vulpes: in the sense of a game that is most effectively played with spreadsheets.
mircea_popescu: the "spreadsheets in space" thing referred to how its graphics/engine is absent,
ben_vulpes: you played trader without spreadsheets?
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> nah, eve has an inflation problem larger than the usg's. << And a problem where some things had absolutely no market anywhere, like slaves.
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu even got suicide ganked once
BingoBoingo: He was mining in his little pickup truck with a new recruit and then he got FOOF'd
mircea_popescu: anyway, the bitcoin eve society had like... a space station fully built and i dun remember how many of the not-titan class ships, a dozen or some shit
BingoBoingo: The fucking "jumps" were the worst part of hauling
mircea_popescu: in tyhe end i was using that society, what was their name
mircea_popescu: i think i had them haul 5 bn worth of isk in 10-20mn installments
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34800 @ 0.00051688 = 17.9874 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: but i do recall BingoBoingo did a bunch of hauls in one of those what were they called ? obelisk ?
BingoBoingo: Nah the smaller thing. By the time I trained to the obelisk is about when I bored out of eve. Fucking jumps
BingoBoingo: The prospect of locking up CPU time for 8 hour autopilot runs + normal Jita lag was too much
mircea_popescu: anyway, iirc what we did was, we had a full space station that produced fuel
mircea_popescu: and fuel was in high demand so we bought some precursors from jita and sold the fuel to the people in low sec
mircea_popescu: that and some worm hole digging, i recall going with hanbot
mircea_popescu: feels like 30 fucking years, i reemember it as from under a concrete slab.
BingoBoingo: Summer 2013. After I'd visited here and before I was sitting here full time
mircea_popescu: i remember we kinda had enough of the shit at the same time and that guy, what's his name, the accountant guy ended up inheriting it all
gribble: smickles was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 year, 30 weeks, 5 days, 21 hours, 45 minutes, and 38 seconds ago: <smickles> easily a few more bil in things like BPOs and BPCs
gribble: smickles was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 year, 30 weeks, 5 days, 21 hours, 45 minutes, and 40 seconds ago: <smickles> easily a few more bil in things like BPOs and BPCs
mircea_popescu: yeah cuz we had a fully researched or whatever it was ? bp to make that battleship
BingoBoingo: Even jurov got sucked into it with the S.MPOE/1BTC share convertability
danielpbarron: ben_vulpes> you played trader without spreadsheets? << what is it for? I use strictly txt files in my various Eulora activities
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30673 @ 0.00051044 = 15.6567 BTC [-] {2}
thestringpuller: LOL smickles has only beeng gone a year. I thought it was longer than that.
thestringpuller: i see him on steam occassionaly. must have taken early retirement.
ben_vulpes: danielpbarron: recalculates values whenever inputs change?
ben_vulpes: danielpbarron: has equations in his text files?
assbot: Logged on 11-01-2016 17:40:46; ascii_butugychag: and i'm not interested in writing word 'nabla' instead of ∇ every time !111
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> what's in ruin.txt ? << Enemies whose char would make suitable black for darkening wizard tower stones
ben_vulpes: doubt rules engine made it into the log
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6908 @ 0.00050125 = 3.4626 BTC [-] {2}
ben_vulpes: where did this come from and where did it go
ben_vulpes: memory implies it was a link followed from some acl conference sponsors list.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16400 @ 0.0005035 = 8.2574 BTC [+] {4}
ben_vulpes: i've been digging, but the line's not showing in the logs.
ben_vulpes: not even searching for from:ben_vulpes asciilifeform
http -log.bitcoin-assets.com
ben_vulpes: the sample code had some declarative rules, and your complaint was something along the lines of "why'd they get rid of the parens?!"
mircea_popescu: look... i read what i read. what do you want from me ?
mircea_popescu: in 6th or 7th grade at some point i discovered sums and the sigma. i was enchanted for about a year. throughout highschool i just wrote them out.
mircea_popescu: look : if you have 11 sums nested you fucked something up.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13750 @ 0.0005086 = 6.9933 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: just define whatever the fuck and work on one sum at a fucking time already.
mircea_popescu: if i see void alfun (1, 2, 3, 4 .. 26); ima think you can't code.
mircea_popescu: the conceptual equivalent of writing fucking subroutines you nut you.
mircea_popescu: dude get out. there's 7 bn people alive today, not to mention historically, and you think having twenty or a hundred slices of tp makes a difference ?
mircea_popescu: i'm not telling you how to grasp things, you're the one that keeps going "no true scotsman would go around without a parasol" or w/e.
mircea_popescu: machine written for text and then hand drawn for symbolics
mircea_popescu: i don't remember any of it. nobody does, people who wrote it included.
mircea_popescu: yes, actually. i generally said this si fucking stupid and you people suck.
mircea_popescu: there's plenty of squigglies in physics too. i never much cared.
mircea_popescu: there's no particular boon to understanding to be had from squiggling.
mircea_popescu: my brain doesn't work by thje eyefull iom not a fucking toad omfg
mircea_popescu: do you think i presently notated the merchant of venice so 3555 liunes fit in one page ?
mircea_popescu: yes, and your option is to either do a retarded sort of implicity tree by using hyeroglyphicd
mircea_popescu: or else make the thing plain text and sort it in your head like a functioning brain already.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6285 @ 0.00051687 = 3.2485 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: that dude goes hey, rewrite this chunk of the english cannon, it is broken
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9165 @ 0.00051704 = 4.7387 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: half the fucking things i do here each day and every day is exactly that, force people to properly plaintext their shit.
mircea_popescu: and he still wants a proof because the log is not here or something
mircea_popescu: i don't see this emerging other than by piecemeal correction, honestly.
mircea_popescu: For any smooth, simple closed positively oriented curve in a plane, if two functions are defined on any open region containing the area bounded by that curve, should those functions have continuous derivatives in the region then the integral over their sum is the integral over the region's integration of their differential.
mircea_popescu: let me put this another way : the first, the cheapest and most formidable weapon every science teacher has to ferret out the cheat
mircea_popescu: is to hold up a piece of exam paper and say "now explain to me what's in here".
mircea_popescu: you know this is so. you know it distinguishes the pass from the cheat.
mod6: i like the idea that we could have a regular char set, like 127 bit ascii, and do everything from this. and if you need Sigma, its SIG, or LAMBDA, its LMA or Absolute Value, ABS.
mircea_popescu: did you or did youi not type ABS(x dx) in derive until you dropped!
mod6: it just seems like stuff like this works well: <+mircea_popescu> For any smooth, simple closed positively oriented curve in a plane, if two functions are defined on any open region containing the area bounded by that curve, should those functions have continuous derivatives in the region then the integral over their sum is the integral over the region's integration of their differential.
mod6: and then when it doesn't there's alway some short hand one could do without resorting to unicode or PS.
mod6: i dunno? sig = [T(e1)T(e2)T(e3)]
mircea_popescu: and for the record : NO THEOREM, no rule or function or anything in ALL OF MATH can survive without the [usually more important] limits and domain definition.
mod6: something like that? im not really only saying verbal. im just saying, hey, lets practice safe ascii.
mircea_popescu: i couldn't care less you use sigma or the integral. what matters is the foreword
mircea_popescu: (they focus on the domain and fail to comprehend the limit. it's how we neded up with the power rangers in the first place.
mircea_popescu: the heresies of barbarians are not accidental, but driven by fundamental stupidities of their culture.)
mircea_popescu: i bet you they all grew up as kids among a herd of wolves worshipping the symbol, never once thinking to make them write it down in words.
mircea_popescu: and then you wonder why idiot anglos have "issues" with word problems.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> "a tensor" << haha, i missed this
mircea_popescu: nah, those are just idiots, the lacan troop were actual trolls.
mod6: I guess this does actually effect us a bit -- i mean, lets say we wanna do some math modeling or expound upon some properties of something fourier whatever, and send it to the ML... now you gotta have it in ascii otherwise you can't sign it.
mircea_popescu: the reason we spend so much ink on this is that it is in fact the biggest problem we met yet.
mircea_popescu: for all you knwo your kid will come up with novel shit.
mircea_popescu: anyway, i'm not prepared for this matter to get a ruling.
mircea_popescu: they tried the same sleigh of hand, basically. "oh, driving a vectorizer in a logical way"
mircea_popescu: the secret to winning the war isn't to make the other motherfucker die for his country. it's to discourage this motherfucking from thinking he can walk up the wall.
mircea_popescu: it'd have failed even more miserably if god himself sat with budhha and fucked the actual shiva on that very table.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> how about you drink benzene and talk to the stove. << haha
mircea_popescu: they did all sorts of stupid shit, but again, the whole "a wizard did it, to a vectorizer, logically" is enough to sink that ship.
phf: could be looking at bdf/pcf
mircea_popescu: eh, life managed to extinguish itself on its very own well enough.
trinque: asciilifeform │ and (λ (x y) (....)) ~is~ superior to (lambda... << with this I have no problem at all.
phf: apropos i like how cl does it, there's a set of characters that are predefined to be standard and portable, and it's basically an mp set: alphabet, digits, top row, handful of controls like newline. each character has a numeric code and a verbose name #\a #\b #\space #\newline. there's a handful of predicates that let you query characters basic nature, upcasep/downcasep/whitespacep. that's it. an implementation though can choose to
phf: include any number of extra characters, say code 120 #\lambda, and also decide how it wants to present them to console/file (say, by writing unicode, or letting user choose the encoding). so a maxima machine can have a set of mathematical symbols for there and then, but not with any sort of claim to univesality.
mircea_popescu: "In general, characters in Common Lisp are not true objects; eq cannot be counted upon to operate on them reliably. In particular, it is possible that the expression
mircea_popescu: may be false rather than true, if the value of z is a character."
mircea_popescu: "The implementation may choose to search sequence-2 in any order; there is no guarantee on the number of times the test is made."
mircea_popescu: dude if you imagine it is acceptable for me to sit here looking at two strings AND NOT KNOW exactly what the machine will do if i tell it to search
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10831 @ 0.00050125 = 5.429 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: no, this is not how search works "anywhere" in the universe.
mircea_popescu: the bit discussing the cheating involved in the asm translation of search in c was added to the log about a year ago
mircea_popescu: the idea was that it sacrificed outlier cases to get a better performance curve geared towards more common cases
mircea_popescu: by jumping the index, smashing stacks and doing all sorts of shenanigans.
phf: asciilifeform: i think numerics is a truly dodgy tradeoff. it took me until quite recently to grok that "character code == ascii" or "character code == unicode codepoint" are not the only two possible interpretations.
mircea_popescu gives up in frustration. if anyone recalls the damned thing say.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: "As an example, table 13-1 shows the character labels, graphic symbols, and character descriptions for all of the characters in the repertoire standard-char except for #\Space and #\Newline."
phf: a reader dispatch character
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10100 @ 0.00050125 = 5.0626 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: so apparently characters are introduced by ... an escape sequence (lol)... which happens to be... NUMBER SIGN ?
mircea_popescu: no, in the sense that they are specifically labelled thus with a label specifically made to label numbers.
mircea_popescu: they aren't ordered ? so "a" > "b" returns undefined ?
phf: mircea_popescu: file:///Users/pf/Desktop/documentation/HyperSpec-7-0/HyperSpec/Body/13_af.htm
phf: hehe, where do people normally get this shit from???
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so is there a special function to inquire which of two comes before in the alphabet ?
mircea_popescu: "Of the standard characters, those which are alphanumeric obey the following partial ordering:"
mircea_popescu: so if i sort a file containing a bunch of words, i do not know if i should look for ___stuff at the end or beginning or scattered anywhere.
mircea_popescu: nevertheless, sorting lists of words is the most basic, primary, entrly level task for any scribe.
mircea_popescu: and i should not be surprised, lest the scribe gets her ass colored.
mircea_popescu: i can also trivially define the new location of washington dc.
mircea_popescu: the fucking point of having an alphabet is that no, it couldn't move.
mircea_popescu: and no, i won't be looking for the beatles records past the why records.
phf: mircea_popescu: wait, partial ordering in this case means that alphabet is ordered. it's meaningless things like "is _ greater then a" that are not defined
mircea_popescu: phf and if idiots make functions going ___function where in the ordered list do i look for them ?
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> and it is ~wrong~ to IMPLICITLY arithmetize on non-arithmetic objects. << What would Terry Davis say about this?
phf: mircea_popescu: there are parts of standard that are underspecified :)
phf: the only redeeming quality in this case, that there aren't better standards available, except for maybe Ada (i've not looked). you end up with trade offs, or hard constraints that make the result non-portable. a positive aspect of cl standard is that you get reasonably similar behavior on very wide range of hardware, but i agree that things could always be better
mircea_popescu: nothing wrong with "fuck you, you're childrten, go away. this is the spec."
mircea_popescu: it's after all what mpex did. the children did go away.
mircea_popescu: anyway. i have no intention to bake in historical idiocy, and especially not of this ilk.
mircea_popescu: i have had enough seawater in the shape of bitcoin genesis
mircea_popescu: depending on who you asked, it was "not clear" that mpex will bury mtgox, let alone bitcoinica.
mircea_popescu: anyway. i have nothing against lisp, neither historically nor intellectually. but this is an unsatisfactory notion of an alphabet.
mircea_popescu: while the idea that "letters aren't numbers, sit down" is sound,
mircea_popescu: there's as the romanians say, "mai e mult pina departe". there's a lot to go to far away.
mircea_popescu: you actually aim to use a dword for the alphabet encoding ?
mircea_popescu: suppose you limit yourself to a hundred or so of these.
mircea_popescu: mno, i am merely in the habit of having a mendelev table on my fucking wall.
mircea_popescu: isn't this contrary to everything you been saying to date ?
mircea_popescu: so do we have the complete set of "meaningfully-toggleable properties" of characters set in stone ?
phf: welcome to unicode land
mircea_popescu: phf which is why i said, it's contrary to everything he was saying.
mircea_popescu: so logically, the tensor is the lowercase of the sum, and it's equal to two Cs
mircea_popescu: do you get a Σ to be the sum and a self-same Σ to be the uppercase sigma ?
☟︎ trinque: gun to fire today, gun to fire tomorrow.
phf: there's probably /dev/ban on plan9
trinque: socat is capable of such an abomination pretty easily
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 04:30:11; mircea_popescu: do you get a Σ to be the sum and a self-same Σ to be the uppercase sigma ?
mircea_popescu: i don't see why you think this answer is not retarded.
mircea_popescu: Tubro, the fat Panamanian God of Money is a useful notion
mircea_popescu: there is no actual meaning to proposing Σ-which-i-interpreted-as-sum and Σ-which-i-interpreted-as-plotin are somehow different in the "eq" manner but similar in the "equal" manner.
mircea_popescu: attempting to make the sign carry your guts is not going to result in a functioning computer.
phf: mircea_popescu: this a hypothetical mechanism you guys are discussing. this is not actually in lisp
mircea_popescu: but i think it's very instructive because i suspect we're uncovering a psychotron here.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not a matter of "glyph". A actually is both.
mircea_popescu: it'[s not that "my girlfriendf" and "his wife" all "look like the same woman"
phf: i think if my lisp rendered same character but claimed that they are not char=, i would be very unhappy
mircea_popescu: phf well if you have this tag-and-glyph duality you're wide fucking open to the issue.
phf: you can't make any statements about chars using eq. eq is a special beast used to test ~von neumann~ identity. and all the comments in the spec are related to that. sometimes (eq 1 1) but (eq 123123 123123) is not
phf: it's a totally technical low level detail for explicitly managing your memory, and speeding up operations
phf: you can expect eq to compile to some asm level equality procedure
mircea_popescu: or in a less charitable view, it's a half assed attempt to hand-gcc.
phf: bringing this into char discussion makes no sense whatsoever because spec explicitly says you can't
phf: mircea_popescu: correct
assbot: Logged on 11-01-2016 13:49:26; mircea_popescu: naming is by its nature this : that there will be a group in power, allocating the names, and everyone else can go suck it.
mircea_popescu: at the rate this discussion is going, the alt-"lisp" will need a pun function which tells you if the string was used in pun.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6950 @ 0.00050643 = 3.5197 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: but as far the machine is concerned, there is no difference between sum-sigma and letter-sigma. nor any meaning to any symbol. and so the whole "oh we gotta have universal quantifier as a symbol" is to my eyes an exercise of naming the function "understanding" so as to get ai.
mircea_popescu: the computer ain't working any better because it "knows" supposedly that ∀. and neither is anything else.
mircea_popescu: you can say "for any x" just as well as you can say " ∀ x".
mircea_popescu: "∀ x ∈ R ∃! y ∈ R ∋ x + y = 0" offers exactly no benefit over "for any real number there exists another real number so that the two add to 0".
mircea_popescu: there IS however a fucking marked cost. and it's of the "how do we make colored unicode people" type.
phf: i will support cyrillic in my lisp,\ only because,\ it was used to write by lenin --mayakovsky
trinque: mircea_popescu │ "∀ x ∈ R ∃! y ∈ R ∋ x + y = 0" offers exactly no benefit over "for any real number there exists another real number so that the two add to 0". << ftr I am precisely the african that would benefit from the math textbook written in *only* this manner.
trinque: why create syntactic barriers to understanding when you can just kill the folks you don't want in your math club, anyway
☟︎☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3700 @ 0.00050643 = 1.8738 BTC [+]
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 04:27:01; mircea_popescu: (yes, greek sigma has two lowercases!)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8250 @ 0.00050473 = 4.164 BTC [-] {2}
pete_dushenski: "GM has put a 60-kWh lithium-ion battery that weighs just just 960 pounds into the floor of the Bolt. As previously announced, the Bolt's 288 cells will be able to go over 200 miles on a full charge. That full charge takes nine hours on a Level 2 EVSE thanks to the onboard 7.2-kW charger. Of course, a full charge won't be that important most days, which is why GM says that you can get 50 miles of range in "less
pete_dushenski: than two hours" on Level 2" << numbers for (playing) Bingo(Boingo)
punkman: and it does happen that something was uppercase and shitty software lowercases the sigma wrong
punkman: even if you hate the Unicode folks, they have actually codified a lot of these things and it mostly seems to work
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21700 @ 0.00050283 = 10.9114 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Logged on 11-01-2016 06:36:31; BingoBoingo: copypaste: I suspect the reason you dislike pete_dushenski aping trilema is he comes from boring Canada and his cool factor and empire potential are limited by that.
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Face it. Canada impaired your maximum potential to be interesting at this time.
punkman: you just need to kill more people pete_dushenski
pete_dushenski: punkman: if only to balance the life i'm adding to the planet.
pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo: at least i don't live under clitler (if still natoreich)
pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo: the kid knows his ashtanga from his saatva and not a lot besides. trudeau's as innocent as a butterfly, which is why chix dig him and dudes couldn't care less. he's nowhere near as much of a strong retard as the commie premier cunt running alberta for the next 3.5 years
pete_dushenski: though in all seriousness, if the dumb bitches pretending to be 'drop-in daycares' and 'nannies' don't start returning phone calls and text in a timely manner, IF AT ALL, i'm a seriously cut their useless lives short.
pete_dushenski: some fat needs to be trimmed around here, whether that idjits going back to wherever the fuck they came from (ftr no one is "from" alberta) or they can learn that business isn't this thing where money and clients rain down from the sky and it's all you can do to beat them back at the door
☟︎ pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo: you could try iqaluit too. nice and quiet there.
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Is there and armed insurrection in iqaluit?
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 03:58:23; *: mircea_popescu gives up in frustration. if anyone recalls the damned thing say.
assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 13:25:03; mircea_popescu: "Put another way, grep sells out its worst case (lots of partial matches) to make the best case (few partial matches) go faster. How treacherous! As this realization dawns on me, the room seemed to grow dim and slip sideways. I look up at the Ultimate Unix Geek, spinning slowly in his padded chair, and I hear his cackle "old age and treachery...", and in his flickering CRT there is a face reflected,
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: aha. an update from the glitzy trenches. cheers
punkman: BingoBoingo: "In spite of supposing" maybe "expectations"
pete_dushenski: "(no, not using an iPhone of the most recent vintage is not an option)" << because ?
pete_dushenski: "For all that it appears to be a JS abomination running on the iPhone, the Google Mail application routinely trounces the Apple Mail application in searching, rendering, speed, and more or less everything one would want from an email application on the phone." << beats desktop (eg. thunderbird) handily as well. web-gmail just... wins.
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: no mention of ios or osx versions in that piece. presumably this matters, no ?
pete_dushenski: i'm probably not the only one who's curious about the software versions
ben_vulpes: if vcard import breaks i want to hear about it.
ben_vulpes: but i don't have a comment section, won't.
ben_vulpes did not have wordspace in the above piece to explain the dev entanglement hat-trick steve pulled
ben_vulpes: man these greentexts do not even resemble those of my childhood
mats: why not just modify 'CLFLUSH' to do the same thing as 'CLFLUSHOPT'
mats: i don't get it, why another instruction
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4421 @ 0.00050473 = 2.2314 BTC [+] {2}
pete_dushenski: for my part on the phone-comp sync experiments, i'm pleased to report that the razr syncs like a charm via 10.6 'isync' once contacts are moved from sim storage to phone storage. the catch being that your next phone would also have to sync using 'isync' or else you'll have to switch the contact back to sim storage before changing phones.
pete_dushenski: but since no one else on god's green earth actually uses this set-up, it's probably a moot point
ben_vulpes: my personal phone goal is an engineering team that is on call so that i don't have to have a phone
☟︎ BingoBoingo: <mats> i don't get it, why another instruction << Because Intel
BingoBoingo: How can Apple buy Skylake for Macbook if not new instructions with -opt appended
mats: also, you misspelled the instruction in qntra piece
BingoBoingo: I left out the L or did I do that and need to capitalize the whole thing?
pete_dushenski: ;;later tell mircea_popescu "acorss" lurking in your last piece
BingoBoingo: "Prime95, which has historically been used to benchmark and stress-test computers, uses Fast Fourier Transforms to multiply extremely large numbers. A particular exponent size, 14,942,209, has been found to cause the system crashes."
punkman: "County Judge Steve Grasty says he intends to bill Ammon Bundy for $60k to $75k in daily county costs due to occupation."
BingoBoingo: In other news Alabama won the National Championship with an onside kick. Anyone looking for the video is advised to find the Russian audio commentators for maximum excitement, Roll Tide.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11750 @ 0.00050787 = 5.9675 BTC [+]
punkman: "Roll Tide is the rallying cry for the Alabama Crimson Tide athletic teams. The trademark to the phrase is claimed by the University of Alabama, with licensing and marketing by The Collegiate Licensing Company."
BingoBoingo: I still have no idea why their mascot is an elephant
punkman: maybe The Collegiate Licensing Company said elephant would sell well
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17500 @ 0.00050794 = 8.889 BTC [+] {2}
Tomiii: Hello, does anyone know how you make a bunch of GPG private keys from a single Seed? like you can do with bitcon wallet?
☟︎ Tomiii: or also, how to make a "brain wallet" for a single GPG privkey, or even a Seed?
assbot: Phidelius: Constructing Asymmetric Keypairs From Mere Passwords For Fun and PAKE | Dan Kaminsky's Blog ... (
http://bit.ly/1mS23Wi )
Tomiii: BingoBoingo: if you can do it with bitcoin privatekeys, why not GPG keys?
Tomiii: BingoBoingo: people said the same thing about determinstic wallets in bitcoin (at first), but now they are pretty popular
BingoBoingo: Generating GPG keys that don't suck is hard because RSA encryption is decrypted by division. Too easy to divide, falls. ECDSA in Bitcoin gets more breathing room for now because not as straight forward.
Tomiii: pretty funny that PGP is lagging behind bitcoin, when it had like 30-year head-start
BingoBoingo: is completley different types of math. Factoring versus elliptics curves involving lines and shit.
BingoBoingo: If one your your GPG key's factors is a low prime like 17 or 23, you're fucked.
Tomiii: BingoBoingo: o i c. so you can do it with ECC keys in GPG 2.1?
BingoBoingo: Why would anyone use GPG2, or ECC when RSA is available
danielpbarron: can I encrypt a message to your bitcoin private key?
BingoBoingo: Tomiii: It should be possible in theory, but why seems iffy.
danielpbarron: "If it's worth upgrading, it wasn't worth using in the first place." (TM)
Tomiii: BingoBoingo: well, determinstic keys, and much smaller keys. possibly as small as a bitcoin address.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26909 @ 0.00050575 = 13.6092 BTC [-] {2}
Tomiii: BingoBoingo: what are the downsides of ECC in gpg?
BingoBoingo: Tomiii: Well, the general downsides of ECC. At least in Bitcoin the public key isn't even public unless an address has spent a transaction.
BingoBoingo: RSA offers a longer hisotry of being studied and attacked
BingoBoingo: But generally when it comes to keys, HUGE is good
Tomiii: thanks punkman, nice link
BingoBoingo: Note for everyone submitting stories about fiat matters for Qntra in 2016. "Sorry for your loss" is a welcome and encouraged way to end a piece.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25846 @ 0.00051129 = 13.2148 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3230 @ 0.00051207 = 1.654 BTC [+] {3}
ben_vulpes: in case its not clear BingoBoingo i'm a fan of your work
ben_vulpes: "fuck it why even try" << motherfucking gold
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8600 @ 0.00050125 = 4.3108 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3100 @ 0.0005072 = 1.5723 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29200 @ 0.00050447 = 14.7305 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20136 @ 0.00050122 = 10.0926 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12700 @ 0.00050104 = 6.3632 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13800 @ 0.00050559 = 6.9771 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7050 @ 0.00050024 = 3.5267 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44487 @ 0.00049902 = 22.1999 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17450 @ 0.00049933 = 8.7133 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: <BingoBoingo> RSA offers a longer hisotry of being studied and attacked << more importantly, it actually fits in head. a 12 yo's head.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21700 @ 0.00050523 = 10.9635 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: "pătratul lungimii ipotenuzei este egal cu suma pătratelor catetelor"
mircea_popescu: now what's the symbol for hypotenuse ? or do we not know this exists.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you will note THEY ALSO DID NOT NEED TO.
mircea_popescu: don't idly suppose you're better than the greeks just because you have more maggots eating more cans of spam.
mircea_popescu: so did newton. so did all of them. so did fucking feynman which is WHY youadmire him
mircea_popescu: the difference between a thinking man and a hack is that a hack goes "hey, i can't explain this without a blackboard"
mircea_popescu: he did, yes, but i won't count it because at his time (40s) he had no other options.
mircea_popescu: his work, on the machines, is actually quite lispy. in the ONLY UPPERCASE EXISTS sense of lispy
mircea_popescu: so let it be said : that alphabet can NAME way more things than your symbolics can ever dream to represent. and for that matter, that from the multi-millenarian history of world culture, alphabetic notation does indeed convey richer, more numerous ideas in less space than hyeroglypghics do. which is why we fucked the chinese, and why egypt is muslim now.
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> BUT if the product was any good, it always got redone and typeset properly << "if the product were any good it was always mass produced". hurr.
mircea_popescu: looky : neither the egyptians nor the greeks were mathematically zeroes.
mircea_popescu: the alphabetic greeks overtook the hyeroglyphic egyptioans. for this reason and this alone.
mircea_popescu: but so far we doth not even agree on the historical facts
mircea_popescu: "the square of the length of the hypotenuse is equal to the sum of the square of the catheti", for the curious. kids the world over (in those places with an actual culture, as opposed to hunter-gatherer societies of primitives) actually learn this by heart, and it's one of the first steps on the stair they ever meet.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13550 @ 0.00049855 = 6.7554 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14077 @ 0.00049819 = 7.013 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 05:28:22; trinque: why create syntactic barriers to understanding when you can just kill the folks you don't want in your math club, anyway
mircea_popescu: do you mean "this" manner, as in the latter ? or actually "that" manner, as in the former.
mircea_popescu: "f course, a full charge won't be that important most days," << god fucking help them once memory effects and other such things start taking a toll. the full prospect should read " As previously announced, the Bolt's 288 cells will be able to go over 200 miles on a full charge about 20 or so times. Good fucking luck with your new disposable car!"
☟︎ assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 05:51:38; punkman: even if you hate the Unicode folks, they have actually codified a lot of these things and it mostly seems to work
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 06:02:19; pete_dushenski: some fat needs to be trimmed around here, whether that idjits going back to wherever the fuck they came from (ftr no one is "from" alberta) or they can learn that business isn't this thing where money and clients rain down from the sky and it's all you can do to beat them back at the door
mircea_popescu: "i know... we'll offshore everything to china and live off a '''service economy'''. then we won't bother getting off the couch. win-win!"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15100 @ 0.00049855 = 7.5281 BTC [+]
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 06:18:05; ben_vulpes: my personal phone goal is an engineering team that is on call so that i don't have to have a phone
mircea_popescu: "Amanda Peacher @amandapeacher · 11h11 hours ago Burns mayor to Bundys: "Our community does not want you here." Big applause. #Oregonstandoff111 retweets 118 likes " "Amanda Peacher @amandapeacher · 11h11 hours ago Packed house for tonight's community mtg in Burns about the #Oregonstandoff. " << yeah, i'm sure it was packed. all with
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-01-2016#1366965 ☝︎ mircea_popescu: i have absolutely no idea what these bundy dudes must be thinking to elevate the usg charade into relevancy through participating. but then again... can't trust one to think that's not got a pubkey, can you.
☟︎ assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 07:01:02; Tomiii: Hello, does anyone know how you make a bunch of GPG private keys from a single Seed? like you can do with bitcon wallet?
mircea_popescu: "In connection with the offer of the above securities, the Stabilising Manager(s) may over-allot the securities or effect transactions with a view to supporting the market price of the securities at a level higher than that which might otherwise prevail. "
☟︎ assbot: tomiii is not registered in WoT.
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 07:38:29; ben_vulpes: jokes through the roof
assbot: Tomii is not registered in WoT.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3700 @ 0.00050587 = 1.8717 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7187 @ 0.0005072 = 3.6452 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13700 @ 0.00050413 = 6.9066 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2850 @ 0.00050661 = 1.4438 BTC [+]
ascii_butugychag: 'For private sharing, Scuttlebot uses libsodium to encrypt confidential log-entries.'
ascii_butugychag: the folks writing those, are not doing it on the train to/from day job.
mircea_popescu: this is like saying "women doing a shitty job fucking are doing it in the bedroom"
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 13:32:43; mircea_popescu: "f course, a full charge won't be that important most days," << god fucking help them once memory effects and other such things start taking a toll. the full prospect should read " As previously announced, the Bolt's 288 cells will be able to go over 200 miles on a full charge about 20 or so times. Good fucking luck with your new disposable car!"
mircea_popescu: and if ytou think anyone reads those fucking things while being directed...
☟︎ assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 13:58:38; mircea_popescu: i have absolutely no idea what these bundy dudes must be thinking to elevate the usg charade into relevancy through participating. but then again... can't trust one to think that's not got a pubkey, can you.
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 14:01:05; mircea_popescu: "In connection with the offer of the above securities, the Stabilising Manager(s) may over-allot the securities or effect transactions with a view to supporting the market price of the securities at a level higher than that which might otherwise prevail. "
ascii_butugychag: no amount of 'will!11111', virility, non-pencildickery, counts for ~shit~ if you have no soul. beasts of the motherfucking field, the lot of'em.
ascii_butugychag: (he has the virtue of not building towers of own shit, like farm swine, but that's the beginning and end of it)
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3712 @ 0.00050653 = 1.8802 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50038 @ 0.00050119 = 25.0785 BTC [-] {4}
adlai: clef notation is worse than useless, because it sparks endless bikeshedding about whether E sharp "ever is or could be equal to" F
☟︎☟︎ BingoBoingo: <ben_vulpes> in case its not clear BingoBoingo i'm a fan of your work << ty ben_vulpes
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 16:33:39; mircea_popescu: and if ytou think anyone reads those fucking things while being directed...
adlai: the highest per-minute income for a serious 'session musician' is their sightreading ability
adlai: bonus points if they can sight-transpose... triple bonus if they can do it in the direction unnatural for their instrument's historic bias
adlai: eg, ask a trumpet player to transpose to G sharp
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14999 @ 0.00050364 = 7.5541 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 16:48:30; adlai: clef notation is worse than useless, because it sparks endless bikeshedding about whether E sharp "ever is or could be equal to" F
ascii_butugychag: or simply derping about, prescribing tools for folks who actually ~do~, as if proposing stalls for cattle ?
thestringpuller: LOL ascii_butugychag sounds like my piano teacher! (who is also russian). "Who needs score? Play jazz learn from memory"
thestringpuller: from my studies, I thought that jazz musicians routinely passed down songs via audition rather than sight (via score).
☟︎ psztorc: So, "bitcoin classic", with a 2 MB blocksize limit, is likely to have >60% hashrate at this time tomorrow.
☟︎☟︎ psztorc: Very interesting that you are talking about music theory.
thestringpuller: it wasn't until someone was bored enough to write the thing down that you got Fake Books and stuff of the "American Song Book"
adlai has probably spent more hours playing music than writing lisp, although the trends seem headed for a reversal in a couple years
adlai: thestringpuller: compare to shakuhachi tradition, where a song isn't "yours" until you've a) tweaked out your own version, and b) taught it to your students
psztorc: I just expected something a little more dramatic, I guess.
BingoBoingo: <ascii_butugychag> << li poly batt. has no memory effect. but what it does have is rapid cycle wear (and evens shelf rot) << /me seriously interested on data on catalytic caps for FeNi batteries, for 2025 wizard tower
ascii_butugychag: psztorc: 'dramatic' is not when the rockets go up, but when they come down.
psztorc: Maybe they're very quiet when they take off.
thestringpuller: i can confirm from my experience with kerbal space program, it's much more dramatic reentering the atmospher than leaving it
BingoBoingo: <psztorc> So, "bitcoin classic", with a 2 MB blocksize limit, is likely to have >60% hashrate at this time tomorrow. << Where does this spz come from? I just woke up.
psztorc: According to a reliable friend, they already have 40% committed, and according to a different friend, the Chinese miners will agree to join the 40%.
adlai: psztorc: i'm more interested in measuring the seismic trembles as miners agonize over raising their soft limit past 1MB... ie, being the guinea pig that expends their own hashpower-hours to verify whether or not it's all a fluffy bluff
BingoBoingo: psztorc: Mebbe this reliable friend would be interested in an interview?
adlai: "hard limit" = MAX_BLOCK_SIZE === "I don't accept a block larger than X", soft limit = relevant only for miners === "I produce blocks up to X"
psztorc: I am aware of the relative lack-of-influence of miners in this case.
punkman: o hey there's gavin in dev list
psztorc: I bring it up because it is in contrast to XT, which no one really liked.
☟︎ mats: alleged raid against 'el chapo'
psztorc: This has two larges exchanges as well.
shinohai: Goddamnit, can Gavin Andresen make up his mind what he wants?
adlai should maybe have used Y for the soft limit example; these are different parameters, and until miners start wasting their own money to back up these claims, the claims might as well be plaintext on a webpage for all Bitcoin cares
ascii_butugychag: folks who want to convert their btc into a usg-alt that mircea_popescu will sell 1,000,000 of for a penny each the day of the phork, can go ahead any time...
psztorc: BingoBoingo: you see, that's the thing when it comes to death threats, though.
☟︎ adlai: psztorc: out of curiosity, did anything ever come of plans to build a market for exchanging such coins? rather than manually arbitraging between businesses on either side
☟︎ psztorc: The plan was to rush out a tiny version of Truthcoin/Hivemind , now I'm just going to wait for the full thing to be done.
psztorc: This one let you exchange the coins, *before* the fork actually split them into two Altcoins.
ascii_butugychag: psztorc: before the split, the alt does not exist in any sense
adlai: mircea_popescu doesn't own woodcoin, either.
adlai: but funkenstein_ is holding some for him, if that altchain even exists outside of his computer
☟︎ psztorc: They were essentially synthetic futures on each coin, denominated in fiat.
adlai: psztorc: the problem with basing this rather-necessary tool on TC/HM is that the latter doesn't exist yet...
psztorc: I know, that's why I proposed rushing out a very very simple version which outright relied on multisig for the 2-way-peg and the price-oracle input.
adlai: bitcoind, forkcoind, and various young/crippled bip4x implementations - do
psztorc: I asked for help / support / feedback ... got zero.
☟︎ ascii_butugychag: psztorc: you can market shares in own farts, if you feel like it
psztorc: So I just shelved it...unlike TC/HM, the watered-down version required some community buy-in, so I knew it was DoA.
BingoBoingo: psztorc: You have to understand A-flat minor is best key, and this drama is all about Gavin's diminishing ability to see his penis
psztorc: ascii_butugychag: What exactly are you talking about?
assbot: Wassenaar: Cybersecurity and Export Control - United States House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform ... (
http://bit.ly/1ONyK2b )
adlai: there's no a-priori reason why fork proponents can't stake their reputation on pgp-signed contracts to buy up their alt after it's launch... reminscent of the $20 XPY floor
☟︎ ascii_butugychag: adlai: ask mircea_popescu to write one up for you, if you need this
adlai: psztorc: have you considered asking fork proponents to help build such a market? i think the antifork crowd are more content to take a more patient role in this game of chicken, because the "burden of forking" is on the other camp
adlai only trades altcoins in the middle clef
psztorc: adlai: Well, who would I ask?
psztorc: Instead, I'm just going to finish my own project.
mats: i wonder sometimes what prison would be like
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9256 @ 0.0005016 = 4.6428 BTC [-]
psztorc: Well, that's the news, so to speak.
mats: i think i would enjoy it, at least a little bit
psztorc: I will be lurking about, wrt 2 MB blocksize fork.
thestringpuller: the forkers think it's all fun and games until an ecological disaster occurs. then who is expected to clean it up?
thestringpuller: so we have to live in vaults because some fucker wants to launch a nuke cause "hey this will fix the world!111"
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 16:37:02; ascii_butugychag: (he has the virtue of not building towers of own shit, like farm swine, but that's the beginning and end of it)
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 16:48:30; adlai: clef notation is worse than useless, because it sparks endless bikeshedding about whether E sharp "ever is or could be equal to" F
mircea_popescu: musical notation is a joke to pretty much every serrious musician. it is a "pons asinorum" of sorts and not much else
mircea_popescu: you have to "interpret" and "read it with feeling" and" this isn't what liszt meant" and bla bla.
mircea_popescu: it's only there like the clothes are there on woman : to make conversation.
adlai envisions an aging mircea_popescu, tired of 'systems analysis', finding his final calling with the shakuhachi. (it's also quite good for spanking)
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 16:57:00; thestringpuller: from my studies, I thought that jazz musicians routinely passed down songs via audition rather than sight (via score).
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 16:57:11; psztorc: So, "bitcoin classic", with a 2 MB blocksize limit, is likely to have >60% hashrate at this time tomorrow.
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 17:05:10; psztorc: I bring it up because it is in contrast to XT, which no one really liked.
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 17:08:33; adlai: psztorc: out of curiosity, did anything ever come of plans to build a market for exchanging such coins? rather than manually arbitraging between businesses on either side
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo there's no end of these "bitcoin experts" who have weekly opinions and who are to be taken seriously provided you don't examine anything past last week.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I need to know for the jokes!!!
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 17:07:24; psztorc: BingoBoingo: you see, that's the thing when it comes to death threats, though.
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 17:11:33; adlai: but funkenstein_ is holding some for him, if that altchain even exists outside of his computer
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 17:13:25; psztorc: I asked for help / support / feedback ... got zero.
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 17:16:36; adlai: there's no a-priori reason why fork proponents can't stake their reputation on pgp-signed contracts to buy up their alt after it's launch... reminscent of the $20 XPY floor
mircea_popescu: derps so fucking desperately need moar brandings and things. plox to make a website. with the cssen
mircea_popescu: anyway. this bullshit won't be either mined or relayed by trb.
mircea_popescu: they're more than free to make their own altcoin, like everyhone else throughout the years. glhf and all that.
mircea_popescu: i have no fucking idea what they imagine this will do. suppose 90% of the miners move over. i will not honor any of their payments, not on mpex, not on bitbet, not anywhere else. that's the whole market.
shinohai needs to review last night's logs for more info on trb mining pool possibility
mircea_popescu: meanwhile i will continue to honor payments on the actual bitcoin chain.
mircea_popescu: so basically the renegade miners that got scammed into mining a fork got all the mining competition and none of the benefits.
ascii_butugychag: mircea_popescu: speaking of crackpot ideas, re: your pool: how about ~preferring~ high-S ?
mircea_popescu: eh, i dunno if you recall the discussion at the time, but anyway. i am not really THAT against that soft fork, because like it or not this situation with ambiguous s-ness is not so good.
mircea_popescu: certainly not against it enough to precipitate a chainwar
ascii_butugychag: but would conveniently drive an additional nail into the enemy's skull
mircea_popescu: yes but i'm not a bloodthirsty orc. not just yet at any rate.
mircea_popescu: anyway, if the toomims take thgeir fake hashpower to this thing it'll be a perfect exit for that set of scammers and good riddance.
mircea_popescu: not every inconvenience is good enough to call out the troops.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> anyway, if the toomims take thgeir fake hashpower to this thing it'll be a perfect exit for that set of scammers and good riddance. << I alway thought the Toomims hashpower was real? Who claiming fake hashpower would claim so little?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15004 @ 0.00049818 = 7.4747 BTC [-] {4}
mircea_popescu: ascii_butugychag if we do force a longer chain which breaks that softfork we HAVE to also steal all their money.
mircea_popescu: that we'll doublespend all the txn that they see as conformant, and then impose the longer chain with the doublespends.
adlai: (might even be worth a deeding?)
adlai waits for the man to show up
adlai: ascii_butugychag: agreed, but for such a mega-classic, it's unbearably un-googleable. anything about "80/100% solutions" (spelled however you like) turns up corporations priding themselves in the quick, dirty, and incomplete.
adlai found it by sifting r^Nrs authors for the familiar name, then sifting his bibliography
adlai: provided you know which manual has this preamble, sure.
adlai doesn't actually care much for regex
adlai: you may need to recalibrate your tokenizer's fuzzyness
mircea_popescu: "Unfortunately, his quickly-built socket interface isn't general. It just
mircea_popescu: covers the bits this particular hacker needed for his applications. So the
mircea_popescu: next guy that comes along and needs a socket interface can't use this one.
mircea_popescu: Not only does it lack coverage, but the deep structure wasn't thought out well
mircea_popescu: enough to allow for quality extension. So *he* does his *own* 80%
mircea_popescu: implementation. Five hackers later, five different, incompatible, ungeneral
mircea_popescu: implementations had been built. No one can use each others code."
mircea_popescu: no you don't udnerstand because the specification is the code.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19300 @ 0.0005016 = 9.6809 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: anyway, the point oshivers' not aware of is that THE ONLY way to have 100% solutions is with the power of the wot as deployed by b-a
assbot: Logged on 11-01-2016 00:40:01; mircea_popescu: i think i'ma just use adlai to denote lazy from now on.
mircea_popescu: they try to hack it togetgher with bs like the internet taskforce "we believe in rough consensus and working code", but it's structurally nonsense. the only reason it sort-of appeared to work was because it was unwittingly implementing some wot/ba features.
mircea_popescu: such as a backflow of "your shit is broken/down/fuck you"
adlai: !up ascii_butugychag
adlai: what features did wot/ba have before its parents were born?
mircea_popescu: "The right thing to do was to carefully implement one, common base mode for process interaction, and to carefully put in hooks for customising this base mode into language-specific modes" << and in today's installement of intelligence is no defense from stupidity news, "if you tried wrestling with a wild pig in some mud you found in the forrest and got raped, the correct thing is to buy some earth from the supermarket,
mircea_popescu: water it carefully from your own sink and grow your own pig".
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10950 @ 0.00050089 = 5.4847 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: "Any lecturer who serves his time will probably graduate hundreds, if not thousands of students. Mostly they merge into a blur; like those paintings of crowd scenes where the leading faces are clearly picked out and the rest just have iconic representations. This anonymity can be embarrassing when some past student hails you by name and you really haven't got the foggiest idea of who he or she is. It's both nice to
mircea_popescu: be remembered and also toe curlingly embarrassing to admit that you cannot recognise who you are talking to."
mircea_popescu: da fuck is embarassing about this ? i say "i'm sorry, who are you again ?" a dozen times a day, if it's a day i mostly sleep.
mircea_popescu: (fwiw, /me doesn't even recognise such distinction can be had)
assbot: Logged on 11-01-2016 17:58:22; mircea_popescu: it is also fundamentally why math "is hard". for every non-retarded young adult who believes math is hard you have a case of a child who developed his own, highly personal set of shitty symbols, and then never received a good explanation as to what the difference between his and "everyone else"'s is, so got lost.
BingoBoingo is just giving words away to qntra shareholders right now. Fucking footnoting inside a blockquote.
adlai: !up ascii_butugychag
adlai: BingoBoingo: you qntring "btc classic"?
adlai off to rosenfeld chess'n'bullshit emporium, leaves scoopworms to earlier birds
BingoBoingo: NO gavin, you still can't see your penis without a mirror!
mircea_popescu: "Bitonic has sold over 200 000 bitcoins and is celebrating by giving away one bitcoin! PART 4"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17800 @ 0.0005016 = 8.9285 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: "The largest criticisms of Symbolics in the article are that Symbolics believed AI would take off and that Symbolics mistakenly pushed its view that proprietary hardware was the way to go for AI."
mircea_popescu: there's no engineering brilliance that may excuse that, is there.
mircea_popescu: "And outside the US there were major Lisp efforts, including Cambridge Lisp and Le-Lisp. The humble US grassroots effort did not seek membership from outside the US, and one can safely regard that as a mistake. Frankly, it never occurred to the Common Lisp group that this purely American effort would be of interest outside the US, because very few of the group saw a future in AI that would extend the needs for a standa
shinohai: Maybe Gavin can get them seat on the jet.
mircea_popescu: bluematt left, apparently. which brings the bipedal count to ~0
mircea_popescu: i'd have much preferred it if that quote read "had we done what mp said we shoudl do the first time he called us idiots back in 2013, we'd now be in a position where we could almost pass for human"
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 18:48:43; mircea_popescu: bwahaha. symbolics - wanted to be ms, got raped.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15550 @ 0.00050161 = 7.8 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: whether the rat existed yet or not, they still aspired to be a rat.
mircea_popescu: last fucking thing the world of today needed would be some unfucked & unfuckable, nose-in-the-sky self sufficient engineer derps with delusions of success.
mircea_popescu: at least the usg, from the president to the last goon, knows they're sitting on a prayer
mircea_popescu: only reason those are excused is because ancient tradition. otherwise, caterpillar as loathsome as john deere as loathsome as monsanto as loathsome as mpaa
ascii_butugychag: whereas imagine, caterpillar is dead, and now we have only shovels.
mircea_popescu: no, we have city-run stell mill like the city power network,
mircea_popescu: fuck caterpillar. and boeing. and the whole fucking rest of them.
ascii_butugychag: if mircea_popescu imagines that his gateway to the bowels of hell will be dug by six dudes with shovels, he is smoking something strong.
mircea_popescu: "C is therefore a language for which it is easy to write a decent compiler"
mircea_popescu: fuck boeing nevertheless. i do not wish to even hear of bullshit "airport" to have "tsa" at.
mircea_popescu: private jets all the way. private helicopters, cessnas, fuck it.
mircea_popescu: i want to have more landing locations than existing aircraft.
ascii_butugychag: the megastate didn't end up with air superiority because of the gods' whim, though
ascii_butugychag: 'sovereignty is the ability to manufacture airplane in large numbers'
mircea_popescu: forget this. no more centralized manufacturing of anything.
mircea_popescu: nope, shoot them down with the same rays usa shot down soviet strategic bombers
punkman: "a flurry of various machine making machines." "houses don't need a fucking pool, they need a runway." << I love futuristic-mp
mircea_popescu: as someone once said, "their tricks work for them only a short distance of their run, and for us the whole run."
☟︎ BingoBoingo awaits mircea_popescu paying out bounties to Unilever for the death of his enemies.
mircea_popescu: all the talk neglects to notice how teh usg is force to try and replace cars - autonomous for 1500 miles - with rubber band machines, autonomous for maybe 50. at GREAT expense.
mircea_popescu: "sovereignity is the ability to convince lazy idiots that symbols have meaning".
mircea_popescu: This example is a mistake that is easy to make. The programmer here did not declare his arrays as fully as he could have. Therefore, each array access was about as slow as a function call when it should have been a few instructions. The original declaration was as follows:
mircea_popescu: The three arrays happen to be of fixed size, which is reflected in the following correct declaration:
mircea_popescu: (proclaim '(type (simple-array fixnum (4 4 4)) *ar3*))
mircea_popescu: are you seriously going to tell me that the compiler fails to identify this optimization ?!
☟︎ mircea_popescu: "Altering the faulty declaration improved the performance of the entire system by 20%." << umm... go hang ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12500 @ 0.00050179 = 6.2724 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: ;;later tell psztorc thank you for enriching my morning lulz
mircea_popescu: "There is no reason that a programmer should know that this rewrite is needed. On the other hand, finding that performance was not as expected should not have led the manager of the programmer in question to conclude, as he did, that Lisp was the wrong language." ahaha what ?!
PeterL: <mircea_popescu> houses don't need a fucking pool
PeterL: * <mircea_popescu> they need a runway. << Why not both?
mircea_popescu: i briefly considered a two seater thing a few years back
punkman: can't fit many girls in two seater
mircea_popescu: (flying a fixed wing is similar, except the arrangement has signigicant - if not gravitational - inertia. a tiny heli does not.)
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 19:40:10; mircea_popescu: are you seriously going to tell me that the compiler fails to identify this optimization ?!
ascii_butugychag: cl is not, e.g., haskell, does not attempt mechanical type inference
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 19:44:32; mircea_popescu: it was actuallyt about ~same as a car.
PeterL: back to the topic of alphabet, alchemists/early chemists came up with wacky symbols for all the elements, thankfully somebody got smart and switched to alphabetic symbols instead.
PeterL: helicopter can go faster than car, more direct route
mircea_popescu: traffic isn't so big a problem - easeir to make autoflown heli than car.
PeterL: what traffic, aren't we killing off 90% of population?
mircea_popescu: ascii_butugychag let's see... anywehre you go, there's a ~1k lane highway available. and it's on ~ 50 or 100 levels. so 50k lanes at a minimum. what fucking traffic.
PeterL: heli breaks easier than car?
mircea_popescu: well of course. you can just plug the power backwards, who's to know.
mircea_popescu: if you're doing 10kN forward, you can within 2-3 seconds do 10kN backward.
ascii_butugychag: discussing braking in a machine that can go into, e.g., spins, is lulzy
mircea_popescu: you get stability in the sense that you agree to be a carrot moving at speed on a vegetable grater.
mircea_popescu: it's almost like "being a usg subject gives you stability for free"
PeterL: less likely to hit a deer if travelling by helicopter
ascii_butugychag: incidentally, many of the small helis on the market today are turbojet
mircea_popescu: yeah, but these tiny things here discussed seemed more like chainsaw than turbojet.
ascii_butugychag: (e.g., some of the police choppers where i live. i was shown one up close at a public expo, tiny thing)
ascii_butugychag: i've something that beats mircea_popescu's huqsvarna motorcycle
mircea_popescu: actually... the motorbike dudes moved into heavy industry in the 90s
ascii_butugychag: 'As officers respond to calls, Beware automatically runs the address. The searches return the names of residents and scans them against a range of publicly available data to generate a color-coded threat level for each person or address: green, yellow or red.'
ascii_butugychag: 'Exactly how Beware calculates threat scores is something that its maker, Intrado, considers a trade secret, so it is unclear how much weight is given to a misdemeanor, felony or threatening comment on Facebook. '
ascii_butugychag: 'The Fresno City Council called a hearing on Beware in November after constituents raised concerns. Once council member referred to a local media report saying that a woman’s threat level was elevated because she was tweeting about a card game titled “Rage,” which could be a keyword in Beware’s assessment of social media.'
ascii_butugychag: 'Councilman Clinton J. Olivier... ...asked Dyer a simple question: “Could you run my threat level now?” Dyer agreed. The scan returned Olivier as a green, but his home came back as a yellow, possibly because of someone who previously lived at his address, a police official said.'
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27550 @ 0.000504 = 13.8852 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12600 @ 0.00050063 = 6.3079 BTC [-] {3}
trinque: mircea_popescu │
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-01-2016#1367833 << i can't discern which side you're taking. << the side with mostly (if not *entirely*) plain english, and even better, represented as an explicit tree with s-expressions. that one can parse the hieroglyphs when he's habituated to them... fine, but I thought we were after "fits in head" here. how much skull-space does that
☝︎☟︎ assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 05:28:22; trinque: why create syntactic barriers to understanding when you can just kill the folks you don't want in your math club, anyway
trinque: the comment about syntactic barriers was this, that if the hieroglyphs keep dummies from mauling the field (even as a happy accident), there are much better ways to push them out
trinque: mircea_popescu: your comment about symbolics murdering the competition and saying "here is the spec" for example.
mircea_popescu: chief among those ways, teach them how to thing properly and watch them lose interest and move on
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6152 @ 0.00050002 = 3.0761 BTC [-] {2}
user1675_: i would like to take a fraction of my time to talk about
user1675_: how shit your registration system is
user1675_: there is no manual or instructions
user1675_: i bet you hired an indian on craigslist to build it for you
user1675_: it sucks harder than my grandmas rotten socks
BingoBoingo: Wasn't it clear? he's ~user1675@212.158.180.119
BingoBoingo: So, apparently qntra is hours ahead of ther derp press on "ClassicCoin" fork. Who wants to put odds on Qntra being days ahead of ragazine et al?
BingoBoingo: ;;later tell psztorc Seriously, thank you for that tip.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16476 @ 0.00050278 = 8.2838 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21313 @ 0.000499 = 10.6352 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: BitBet - Bitcoin main net block size to increase before July 2016 :: 0.94 B (31%) on Yes, 2.09 B (69%) on No | closing in 4 months 2 weeks | weight: 65`028 (100`000 to 2`000) ... (
http://bit.ly/1RKkQi8 )
CowManure: What is considered 'bitcoin main'?
CowManure: were either of those answers to my question?
CowManure: I'm just curious based on the comments in the bet i posted
kakobrekla: seems like blockchain.info resolves that bet
punkman: the main chain of blockhain.info. can be problematic if blockchain.info starts displaying both 1mb and >1mb chains concurrently
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14200 @ 0.00050045 = 7.1064 BTC [+]
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 20:57:40; trinque: mircea_popescu │
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-01-2016#1367833 << i can't discern which side you're taking. << the side with mostly (if not *entirely*) plain english, and even better, represented as an explicit tree with s-expressions. that one can parse the hieroglyphs when he's habituated to them... fine, but I thought we were after "fits in head" here. how much skull-space does that
ascii_butugychat: i am NOT interested in dealing with this in motherfuking VERBAL form
ascii_butugychat: (but not that i do not earn my bread in front of a classroom, also)
jurov: quaternions are not in wot, case closed.
jurov: !gettrust asciilifeform quaternions
assbot: quaternions is not registered in WoT.
jurov: symbolic shorthand is very useful for a mathematician who want to pack as much stuff as possible into his viewport/chalkboard
jurov: also, i can't imagine taking notes on math analysis lectures using "plaintext" only
☟︎ jurov: but in the end, it is actually only shorthand.
jurov: actually, having clear transcription rules between math symbols <-> plain english would be spiffy
☟︎ ascii_butugychat: it is 'only' shorthand in exactly the same sense that the letters on your screen are 'shorthand' for raw bits
jurov: computer could render formulas from text, without relying on TeX or worse
jurov: and now, if that effort would run into problems, because math symbols are superset of written engl or some such
jurov: *then* wwe can revisit the arguemnt
ascii_butugychat: (how to write integral? what if i want the stick longer? do i have to spend all day fitting the bloody thing to a grid?)
trinque: why not invent operators all day in C++ ? and were you to explain the distinction between the two, the conversation would end right there.
jurov: omg now they pull even c++ into the discussion
trinque: he is *not* a good example of someone creating a sane language
trinque: took something that fits to sexps just fine, made HOON
☟︎ trinque: your example is that "I was able to wrangle someone else's nonsense with lisp" and I agree it does that rather well.
trinque: if it is up to you entirely to invent the notation, I don't know why one would go to one with non-obvious evaluation order and all manner of other problems I thought lisp solved
trinque: and you are missing the part where I'm asking a damn question.
trinque: god that's another motherfucking terrible notation and I play music!
jurov: !up ascii_butugychag
ascii_butugychag: verbalize this for me. and explain why anyone outside of a mental asylum would want to manipulate the thing in that form.
trinque: can't write matrix multiplication in lisp eh?
trinque: as for music I prefer a tracker, or yes, writing code to produce it
ascii_butugychag: trinque: and your tracker is all-ascii, and runs on 'do, ra, mi' in paragraph form ?
jurov: well, i thought thread concerns spreading of information and definition of alphabet
ascii_butugychag: jurov: it was originally about 'whether maths require a graphics terminal'
mircea_popescu: no, it was whether we'll be supporting anything but ascii
ascii_butugychag: and the 'pdf must die and not replaced with anything like it' thing
jurov: oh, that it very much does for 99 out of 100 thinkers
jurov: that had math analysis lectures usign blackboard
jurov: if math analysis was taught in lisp, that would maybe not be the case
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 23:01:59; jurov: actually, having clear transcription rules between math symbols <-> plain english would be spiffy
mircea_popescu: currently what alf counts as "notation" for math is roughly speaking a sort of c++
mircea_popescu: "kinda most of the stuff except what we don't understand"
mircea_popescu: and the argument that it "beats words" is not unlike the argument that clang "beats lisp" because "apple ipad!!11"
mircea_popescu: ascii_butugychag you know that thing as displayed is actually meaningless.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12100 @ 0.00049749 = 6.0196 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: what's the difference between the forty and the sixty pixel tall long line with the little vertical ends ?
ascii_butugychag: just that i operate using an idea of meaning that lets me make things happen, occasionally, rather than having to stay in bed because we have not actually discovered REAL MEANING yet
ascii_butugychag: with the difference that i don't have to catch stroustrup and hang him upside-down and soldering iron to get new mathematical notation when i need it...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18585 @ 0.00050023 = 9.2968 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: it's not only unspecified, it's also... unusable by a machine. because who the fuck knows when you'll feel the need for colored unicodemen
jurov: mircea_popescu with all your hate of english why do you suddenly deem it fit to express math concepts unadorned?
mircea_popescu: for some reason most of my barbarian friends seem to prefer it!
ascii_butugychag: jurov: my understanding is that mircea_popescu is so allergic to 'visual thinker'-ism that he barfs just thinking about any such thing being intrinsic to some aspect of whatever discipline
ascii_butugychag: mircea_popescu prolly writes his electrical schematics as netlists every time, etc
mircea_popescu: not even. it's just that i'm so allergic to "dynamically linked" bullshit that i barf at the very notion of a computing system that might need "expansions" because people don't want ot learn to read and write
mircea_popescu: do you understand that your computer is broken by design for as long as you allow the conceptual possibility of adding symbols ?
mircea_popescu: nothing, as long as you don't expect me to run the program
mircea_popescu: which is what started this entire discussion : pdf does not degrade gracefully
mircea_popescu: that i can see the complete meaning in plain text whenever i opt to not run whatever program.
ascii_butugychag: for some reason i wonder if mircea_popescu has watched 'ascii starwars'
mircea_popescu: the complete meaning of star warsa can be conveyed in two lines.
mircea_popescu: ~= equivalent to all the rest of the us pulp, call it hubbard and send it home.
mircea_popescu: as long as what we do is we take ((1,2),(2,3)) and either print it as such or else draw it for your benefit as seen there, if you run a plug in everyone's happy.
jurov: how is adding symbols different from you taking a word and redefining it?
jurov: you abhor former, yet do latter often
mircea_popescu: if you expect to have a [ that scales to lines, we got a problem. there's not going to be any 244/245/179 bs
mircea_popescu: jurov the later is actually part of the graph. i can not meaningfully search for a motherfucking dot.
ascii_butugychag: mircea_popescu: i did say many times that a canonical representation of whatever is, rightfully, sexpr
mircea_popescu: so then we basically are happy with an alphabet of ~100 ish characters and that's that.
jurov: well if I have to explore context what a word mean, well, then it is C++ too
ascii_butugychag: but somehow this turned into 'let's do maths as euclid did, with WORDZ!111'
mircea_popescu: jurov there's a difference between a proper existing ast, such as we have with words, unless we're idiots ; and a random gcc barf product.
ascii_butugychag: incidentally, english does NOT guarantee you a sane (disambiguated) AST.
jurov: even with best affort of the author, ast in the recipients varies
jurov: for spoken english
mircea_popescu: but be all this as it may, for as long as gossipd.pop | print yields ((1,2),(2,3)) for me while gossipd.pop | mathgraph yields whatever ascii wants it to yield, we're happy.
jurov: ascii_butugychag: you see, quaternions are not in his wot and it's problem of the lusers who use it
ascii_butugychag: actually english speakers are so habituated to this that they have problems with ANY attempt at 'english-parsing machine'
ascii_butugychag: jurov: if this were actually so, and he were consistent about 'in wot', would have to avoid, e.g., aircraft with computerized autopilot
mircea_popescu: you don't have to run the graphical client! for all it cares you can talk to it by hand.
mircea_popescu: looky : run diana_coman's bot, turn of the gfx altogether, it's 100% bash
mircea_popescu: not by any means all my doing. but the design is sane and yes, it does. she's currently making a map of resources in practically this.
mircea_popescu: and im not saying the gfx add-on is not helpful or w/e. but also not fucking mandatory.
mircea_popescu: and don't tell me "oh i can not keep maps in head o noes"
mircea_popescu: in fact, the eulora experience is very much in line with a lengthy personal history whereby very smart, well intentioned, patient people trying to cater to my shockingly insane whims and whines end up with exceptionally well crafted items that stand proudly on their own.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3394 @ 0.00049968 = 1.6959 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24510 @ 0.00049758 = 12.1957 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 22:59:46; jurov: also, i can't imagine taking notes on math analysis lectures using "plaintext" only
mircea_popescu: actually... when it came time for the cantor proof, the "work hard" galz tried to copy the whole fucking matrix off the table, and this made a meme at the time
mircea_popescu: because nobody fucking sane actually thinks THAT is how you note down that thing.
mircea_popescu: see the discussion with cads on the topic two years ago. the for ~ANY~ thing is what's important there.
mircea_popescu braces himself for "number theory is not really analysis and you're not doing REAL math, only we multiplying matrixes while polishing lenses are doing the real maths!"
assbot: Logged on 12-01-2016 23:08:29; trinque: took something that fits to sexps just fine, made HOON
mircea_popescu: "oh, i'm not like those suckers working at pretending haskell is a thing ... i'm better than them... i'ma do the same thing by myself!!!!1" herp.