⏐︎ 18066
mircea_popescu: http://a-ztrainingcentre.org/ o.O
assbot: a-ztrainingcentre.org - /
ben_vulpes: jurov: can you straighten the s3 bucket backing therealbitcoin.org out?
ben_vulpes: i'd almost rather stick it behind a webserver running on the same host as the mailman app.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i've pushed an update to the site, but the byzantine serving mechanism isn't providing it for some reason.
ben_vulpes: the site i want to serve has links to /charter.html, /v0.5.3-gd05c03a.tar.gz and other stuff
asciilifeform: 'elephant garden' << see also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0c_cUcgOEI
assbot: From Left to Right (Sleva Napravo) - YouTube
ben_vulpes: ah yeah that must be why i thought you'd like it.
ben_vulpes: anyways.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32645 @ 0.00079727 = 26.0269 BTC [-] {3}
ben_vulpes: hey asciilifeform do a sapper a favor and start emailing your patches to btc-dev@therealbitcoin.org
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: how to package them?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: that is, attachment?
ben_vulpes: .tar.gz, including patch and detached sig.
ben_vulpes: same as we've been doing.
asciilifeform: body of message?
ben_vulpes: is such necessary?
asciilifeform: yes!
asciilifeform: it should be a functioning mail list
ben_vulpes: a description of contents should suffice.
asciilifeform: we should be able to talk using it
ben_vulpes: at the moment it's not even relaying mail to me.
asciilifeform: useless then
ben_vulpes: hardly.
ben_vulpes: not as useful as it *will* be, granted.
ben_vulpes: but a vast improvement over your pooping patches into the noisestream here.
asciilifeform: aha sure, but i still end up crapping out descriptions of patches here
ben_vulpes: yes, please do.
ben_vulpes: but this right here http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2014-October/thread.html constrains the filtering problem to something vastly more manageable.
assbot: The BTC-dev October 2014 Archive by thread
asciilifeform: jurov: did you ever get message-as-attachment working?
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2014-October/000001.html ??
asciilifeform: that's a turd!
asciilifeform: the text should be visible in www browser
asciilifeform: if only for spamatronic search engine presence
ben_vulpes: woof turd indeed
ben_vulpes: stinky
ben_vulpes: <jurov> asciilifeform: mailman will display gpg clearsigned attachment inline if you rename it to .txt (and i don't ned to diddle code then)
ben_vulpes: have you tried that?
asciilifeform: about to
asciilifeform: sent...
ben_vulpes: mailman thinking...
ben_vulpes: (stinking...)
asciilifeform: that thing's running on what, a commodore64?
ben_vulpes: iPnohe
asciilifeform: mMac
asciilifeform: (non-electric)
ben_vulpes: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2014-October/date.html#start
assbot: The BTC-dev October 2014 Archive by date
ben_vulpes: still kinda stinky.
asciilifeform: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2014-October/thread.html << not showing there, why not ?
assbot: The BTC-dev October 2014 Archive by thread
ben_vulpes shrugs
asciilifeform: and what's with the '---next part'
ben_vulpes: seems escaped in the body as well
ben_vulpes: what, you want a custom mailman in 2 days?
ben_vulpes: we're not all wunderkind
asciilifeform: lol
ben_vulpes: so sil vous plait
ben_vulpes: actually
ben_vulpes: !s patch
assbot: 354 results for 'patch' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=patch
ben_vulpes: !s *.patch
assbot: : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=%2A.patch
ben_vulpes: *sigh*
ben_vulpes: returning to my original point, please email the set of your patches and sigs to benkay@gmail.com, asciilifeform
ben_vulpes: (and anyone else interested in patching)
asciilifeform: i'll wait for working turdatron.
asciilifeform: hate doing things twice
ben_vulpes: i'm waiting on turdatron for merges, as well.
ben_vulpes: logs are great, but this shit will benefit strongly from a mailman list record of actions and discussions.
asciilifeform: aha.
ben_vulpes: so while i appreciate the slicing dicing and otherwise pureeing of warts...
asciilifeform: !s bitcoin-asciilifeform
assbot: 0 results for 'bitcoin-asciilifeform' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=bitcoin-asciilifeform
asciilifeform: hm
ben_vulpes: yeah.
ben_vulpes: what's the rush, anyways?
asciilifeform secretly hopes that folks other than him will pick this thing up when turdatron is operational
ben_vulpes: if hopes were horses we'd all gallop to bsas.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4100 @ 0.00079151 = 3.2452 BTC [-]
undata: http://altcoinpress.com/2014/10/bitcoin-foundation-we-dont-want-everyone-starting-a-bitcoin-business/ << war.
assbot: Bitcoin Foundation: We Don’t Want Everyone Starting a Bitcoin Business
asciilifeform will laugh when bitcoin foudation is richer than bitcoin phoundation
punkman: can someone run this deed through gpg --verify please http://deeds.bitcoin-assets.com/deed/kLuzx7GD
assbot: Deed kLuzx7GD | #bitcoin-assets deed registry
mats_cd03: interesting decision, keeping the name
asciilifeform: mats_cd03: mircea_popescu's idea
punkman: ok so I'm pretty sure bot never validated signatures
asciilifeform: in other news...
asciilifeform: http://cryptome.org/stasi-list.htm
asciilifeform: (how news? exercise for alert reader)
undata: asciilifeform: news that stasi found their way back into power? I'll bite. News... how?
ben_vulpes: punkman: can you give that to me in raw format? i'm seeing ^M all over the place
punkman: ben_vulpes: what, you don't have utf?
ben_vulpes: curl deedbutts > deebut.html
ben_vulpes: cat deedbut.html ... poopy
punkman: could try curl -s http://deeds.bitcoin-assets.com/deed/kLuzx7GD | grep -oP "(?<=>).+(?=</text)" | base64 -d > deed
assbot: Deed kLuzx7GD | #bitcoin-assets deed registry
mats_cd03: stasi list? sounds like a good name for the courts circus project.
ben_vulpes: or bash emacs into submission
punkman: so apparently I need to download everyone's key to bot pubring
ben_vulpes: yes, yes you do.
punkman: perhaps obvious if not stupid
ben_vulpes: you should really grab fingerprints out of otc db and then import those keys.
punkman: I blame GPG library
ben_vulpes: how can you possibly verify a signature without the key?!
punkman: that's where the stupid kicked in
ben_vulpes: are you willing to share the source for deedbot?
punkman: yeah as soon as I rewrite this part
ben_vulpes: mkay.
kakobrekla: emm
kakobrekla: cam you gettrust by key ?
kakobrekla: can*
kakobrekla: assbot doesnt have any pub keys locally, just asks gribble
kakobrekla: by [ident nick]
kakobrekla: you can do same?
punkman: yeah but I gotta verify the deeds
kakobrekla: aha
bounce: compare and contrast ``Bitcoin Foundation: We Don3t Want Everyone Starting a Bitcoin Business'' with ``Open Letter to Bitcoin Businesses: Why I'm closing my accounts'' on the bitcoinfoundation.org forum
undata: bounce: read that earlier; that guy gets it.
bounce: he does, and it's where every single government to date is failing in their digitalistation efforts
cazalla: i bet this multisig shit turns into a customer service nightmare for coinbase
ben_vulpes: hee hee hee
ben_vulpes: on the topic of "no more bitcoin businesses" the bitcoin foundation is finally capitulating and following in MPEx's footsteps.
ben_vulpes: 2(?) years later.
ben_vulpes: punkman: fwiw, i get a bad sig out of that
nubbins`: i get btc address 12cKT5TpNzKMMD7gNAthMbtp1VaVQUebW1 out of it
nubbins`: i also get bad sig
ben_vulpes: punkman: without the deed title i get a good sig
nubbins`: :o
nubbins`: like if you cut that line out?
nubbins`: oh, uh, so do i
nubbins` raises a third eyebrow
ben_vulpes: nubbins`: how on earth do you get a btc addr out of it
nubbins`: ben_vulpes by running it through my deed verifier, natch
ben_vulpes makes faces
ben_vulpes: oh, i get it.
ben_vulpes: i've not gone so far.
nubbins`: anyway, the DEED_TITLE line was added after the sig was generated
ben_vulpes: heresy
nubbins`: it's not even heresy
ben_vulpes: making a thing that can't be dumped into gpg and produce a clean sig?
ben_vulpes: clean verification i mean
nubbins`: nope. not heresy, just nonsense :D
nubbins`: i am unable to verify two of the 5 processed deeds: 6LTeLfd6Scf1sgq9qmAYCT51oqoNmGP4k9uBp9oZtwR1 and kLuzx7GDPg8uXRawaZG9ndU7hfTd8CBHSTCCffSdzLA
nubbins`: the other three verify just fine
nubbins`: for the deed contained in 6LTeLfd6Scf1sgq9qmAYCT51oqoNmGP4k9uBp9oZtwR1 i generate a deed id of 6zUpQ65f28U8e8AHYJ1nL7tcLgNxamJg37LJCo3rxksq
nubbins`: for the deed contained in kLuzx7GDPg8uXRawaZG9ndU7hfTd8CBHSTCCffSdzLA i generate a deed id of AUJMybt23x4ddt8xUV1NVMj6M5fuQrqzdp1PrTZDTe5Q
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes: logs are great, but this shit will benefit strongly from a mailman list record of actions and discussions. << word.
mircea_popescu: assbot: Bitcoin Foundation: We Don’t Want Everyone Starting a Bitcoin Business << lmao these fucking idiots.
mircea_popescu: "oh i know, let's go for double whammy! that'll teach us!"
nubbins`: punkman: the 4 pending deeds all verify as well
mircea_popescu: punkman: so apparently I need to download everyone's key to bot pubring <<< how else.
mircea_popescu: nubbins`: i am unable to verify two of the 5 processed deeds: <<< software never fails eh stan ? if it worked once it always works right ? :DF
mircea_popescu: SCAM!
punkman: nubbins`: problem with 6LTeLfd6Scf1sgq9qmAYCT51oqoNmGP4 is the escaped html in the <pre> you are grabbing
nubbins`: ah
nubbins`: gpg: BAD signature from "Hannah Wiggins (hanbot) <han.bot@gmail.com>"
nubbins`: yeah, lookit that
nubbins`: hmm...
punkman: here is python verifier http://dpaste.com/05YF5VH
assbot: dpaste: 05YF5VH
ben_vulpes: just put the repo into sunlight
mircea_popescu: nubbins` www.printresgroup.com/ << here's a gem.
nubbins`: so
nubbins`: i apologize if this seems obtuse
nubbins`: i can't copy/paste the deeds because of line endings
nubbins`: and i can't fetch via curl because the website has escaped all the html chars inside the deeds
nubbins`: :S
punkman: you can get the raw bundle
mircea_popescu: punkman you know htmlizing chars is horribru practice.
punkman: mircea_popescu: but it has html in deed
nubbins`: punkman where can i grab that?
ben_vulpes: woo
mircea_popescu: ugh
nubbins`: oh! nevermind
mircea_popescu: who the fuck makes html clearsigned things ;/
nubbins`: http://deeds.bitcoin-assets.com/raw_bundles/17/171BanmCMde84Zr28Z4EsCzXw4nGZdfPaG.rbundle
punkman: even if not actual html, html chars could break page, must be escaped
nubbins`: is the directory, e.g. /17/ always the first 2 chars of addr?
punkman: yes
nubbins`: hm
mircea_popescu: im pretty sure the idea is to sign the txt not the html
nubbins`: so to verify deed X, i need to first generate address Y from it, in order to grab the raw bundle
ben_vulpes: punkman: i'm not seeing the part where you shell out to gpg in there
nubbins` scratches head
nubbins`: are the raw deeds published, or just the raw bundles?
punkman: http://deeds.bitcoin-assets.com/deed/BXZKQx2i/raw gives you base64, maybe I change it to actual raw and add /b64
punkman: also http://deeds.bitcoin-assets.com/deed/BXZKQx2i/json
nubbins`: sweet, ty
ben_vulpes: http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/29/us-markets-sec-traders-idUSKBN0II0DC20141029 << what the fuck am i even reading
assbot: Studies find fast traders get data from SEC seconds early: WSJ| Reuters
ben_vulpes: edgar has been tuned to deliver to certain IPs before others?
punkman: ben_vulpes: yeah just threw that together to check bundle key/address
punkman: gpg.recv_keys() is refusing to work :(
ben_vulpes: have people dump their keys in themselves
ben_vulpes: capture keyid, barf if they're not in l2
ben_vulpes: then check again on deed submission and barf if they're still not in l2
ben_vulpes must away
mats_cd03: http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2014/10/29/jian_ghomeshi_8_women_accuse_former_cbc_host_of_violence_sexual_abuse_or_harassment.html << looks like at least one isnt anon nubbins`
assbot: Jian Ghomeshi: 8 women accuse former CBC host of violence, sexual abuse or harassment | Toronto Star
bounce: therefore she must be fake
mircea_popescu: well, there's this chaining suspicion.
mircea_popescu: remember all the fame-seeking ditzy bitches trying to claim assange raped them too ?
mircea_popescu: same deal with strauss-kahn, and with berlusconi, and generally, what's in a late claim.
mats_cd03: maybe he orchestrated this himself so he could score 55mn CAD
mats_cd03: like... whats his face... owner of the basketball team with a negress woman
undata: “Big Ears Teddy shouldn’t see this.” << oh man, my sides
xiando: I live in .se where two women claimed assange "raped" them, one of them said "yes we had sex and I did that of my own free will but he said he used a condom but didn't so it was rape"
undata: xiando: I read that in the Assange case, the women didn't even want to press the case, but the prosecutor kept at it anyway.
undata: Sweden sounds like a socialist hellhole nanny state.
nubbins`: mats_cd03 oh wow
nubbins`: she was in Trailer Park Boys
thestringpuller: nubbins` would know trailer park boys
thestringpuller: canadians lol
undata: love that show.
thestringpuller: i'm fucked in the head
thestringpuller: I dunno who has better shit-isms, asciilifeform or Leahy
nubbins`: heh
undata: http://lisp.shithouse.tv/
assbot: lisp
nubbins`: you guys watch the new season?
xiando: undata: and the original procecutor refused to take the case but a totally corrupt and known criminal feminist procutor named "Marianne Ny" insisted on taking up the case
dub: lets not forget those two women worked for the CIA
asciilifeform forgot for a minute that deedbot and turdatron are separate mechanisms, had a bit of mindfuck
undata: dub: he was stupid to trust them
undata: I'll say that
undata: he should've known intellgence agencies would be after him.
undata: sorry guys, the war was going great, then the other side sent pussy.
Duffer1: cia?
cazalla: http://qntra.net/2014/10/multisig-vault-by-coinbase/
assbot: Multisig Vault By Coinbase | Qntra.net
cazalla: coblee herp derp store your bitcoin with coinbase cause you face the same risk from hackers doing it yourself anyway
undata: cazalla: do I recall correctly that they're using one of two?
undata: or is it two of two
mircea_popescu: <undata> Sweden sounds like a socialist hellhole nanny state. << that's because it is.
undata: <- derp
undata reads article
undata: right, the third is some passphrase encrypted key
mircea_popescu: <dub> lets not forget those two women worked for the CIA << srsly, this works ?
asciilifeform: northern caliphate is one hell of a loltron.
asciilifeform: did they ever find the imaginary sub?
asciilifeform: 'Подводная лодка / В степях Украины / Погибла в неравном / Воздушном бою.'
nubbins`: node.js deed verifier, now without pesky curl script
nubbins`: http://pastebin.com/Nq6kCtpe
assbot: [JavaScript] checkdeed.js - Pastebin.com
cazalla: undata, 2 or 3 or 3 of 5
mircea_popescu: nubbins` cool!
assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0HQHZY0.txt )
mircea_popescu: !b 5 ✂︎
nubbins`: takes full or partial (min 8 chars) deed id as argument
thestringpuller: .deed
nubbins`: sample run: http://pastebin.com/n15mWWrv
assbot: [Bash] macbook:btcjs nubs$ node checkdeed.js 6LTeLfd6 URL: http://deeds.bitcoin-assets - Pastebin.com
xiando: undata: Name 1 other country where the Police can legally stop you for no reason (other than that you went outside) and take a blood sample by force
mircea_popescu: splendeed
mircea_popescu: xiando mongolia.
xiando: So Sweden isn't the only one? Interesting
mircea_popescu: well the mongolian police will use their fists, but anyway :D
nubbins`: hi
asciilifeform: and now a word from a favourite lolmeister:
asciilifeform: http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2014/10/putin-to-western-elites-play-time-is.html
assbot: ClubOrlov: Putin to Western elites: Play-time is over
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform does he read here ?
asciilifeform: not afaik
asciilifeform: he, last i saw, was of the 'you fools and your electrical toys, doomed to die so soon' school of thought
asciilifeform: doesn't keep him from cranking out his lulz
asciilifeform: but what'd i know.
asciilifeform: (he does occasionally answer mail though)
mircea_popescu: the "what utility is the sun to us" line seems cribbed.
mircea_popescu: (nttawwt)
asciilifeform: incidentally, not one word of this in u.s. papers.
asciilifeform: (thus far)
mircea_popescu: you recall that older observation re time covers ?
asciilifeform: aha.
mircea_popescu: they're pretty awful at reporting anything of substance.
asciilifeform: funnily, even here people know if it.
asciilifeform: *of it
mircea_popescu: sorta like mcdonalds is awful at cooking
mircea_popescu: also, this is by no means the first or the most mommentuous "?speaking directly to the public"
mircea_popescu: guy did that over syria, and it paid.
asciilifeform knows this
mircea_popescu: Whether or not a new world order of any sort is to be built is not just Russia's decision, but it is a decision that will not be made without Russia. << this is false incidentally.
mircea_popescu: we are making it, right here, and it specifically excludes "russia" in the sense of "putin"
asciilifeform: not that the old kings could visit even if they really wanted.
asciilifeform: a bit of a throne-ending move
mircea_popescu: sure they could
mircea_popescu: what's to stop em ?
asciilifeform: the old could-vs-would
mircea_popescu: indeed
mircea_popescu: anyway, orlov's putin reads like mp. which i guess is a good thing for all those involved.
asciilifeform looks forward to the possibility of the coprophagiac zoos of western eu waking up to the fact that what turned them into such was - nato.
asciilifeform: 'airstrip one.'
asciilifeform will however believe the noises of 'there cannot be just one great kingdom' when mr. p starts impaling anyone caught with winblows
asciilifeform: whatever kind of winblopocalypse it would take to make this statement seem perfectly reasonable to the most thoroughly retarded 'old king' - will likely happen reasonably soon.
asciilifeform: the really sad and avoidable aspect would be if it were to leave the most deeply retarded old king with a fat stash of plundered btc.
BingoBoingo: Ebama could spead a lot of Obola with a fat stash of BTC
thestringpuller: Fucking Giants.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56254 @ 0.00079415 = 44.6741 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36250 @ 0.00079557 = 28.8394 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26227 @ 0.00079577 = 20.8707 BTC [+]
ben_vulpes: hah microsoft's got a wristband product
mircea_popescu: so this dingy old laptop is converting two movies and playing a third
mircea_popescu: such a little trooper i swear
ben_vulpes: converting?!
mircea_popescu: * asciilifeform looks forward to the possibility of the coprophagiac zoos of western eu waking up to the fact that what turned them into such was - nato. << at least the warsaw pact countries figured it out.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes i hate mp4.
ben_vulpes: but vlc handles everything...
mircea_popescu: i still hate mp4.
ben_vulpes: lol can you hear the movie over the things fans?
mircea_popescu: fans are so quiet the street's louder at 1 am.
ben_vulpes: what magic dingy laptop is this
mircea_popescu: ibm thinkpad.
thestringpuller: old as fuck
thestringpuller: didn't ibm sell that to lenovo?
undata: yep
mircea_popescu: yeah this is before that. 10 yo or so.
mircea_popescu: actually i think lenovo was manufacturing them anyway
mircea_popescu: i'd be much suprised if ibm actually MADE anything, even a decade ago.
undata: IBM still does the US "support"
undata: I had to get the screen replaced on this one under warranty
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12618 @ 0.00079832 = 10.0732 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: undata: I had to get the screen replaced on this one under warranty << My 4 yo Thinkpad will probably be getting its third fan soon.
undata: BingoBoingo: I almost wrecked this one's fan coding in the sand by the columbia
undata: but I was able to clean it
BingoBoingo: I take this one out to the garage to smoke cigarettes
undata: cigs are the natural enemy of computer fans
undata: beer meanwhile, keyboards
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo you should hear this fan.
mircea_popescu: girl pissing two doors away is louder.
BingoBoingo: Why would I spill the precious? Also not much of a beer person. Prefer my drink closer in composition to what would be used to clean it anyways
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Damn.
BingoBoingo: It's been a few days since my fan made the angry bees noise.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Is that the original fan?
mircea_popescu: far as i know...
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: I'm having trouble finding an MPOE-PR post using something Buffet wrote in relation to mining. How capital expenditure is made in textiles etc.
thestringpuller: whatever happened to dr. foreskin
cazalla: http://qntra.net/2014/10/carders-cashing-out-into-bitcoincash-via-coinbase-others/
assbot: Carders Cashing Out Into Bitcoin/Cash Via Coinbase & Others | Qntra.net
cazalla: thestringpuller, he got circumcised
assbot: Last 4 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1RA9G2S.txt )
thestringpuller: !b 4 ✂︎
thestringpuller: ;;calc 21000000 / 30
gribble: 700000
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51929 @ 0.0007939 = 41.2264 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: !up eightyeight
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller so look straight in buffett's letters.
ben_vulpes: thestringpuller: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=201268.msg2121475#msg2121475
assbot: ASICMINER vs. Cado.AvalonB3
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10532 @ 0.00079743 = 8.3985 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15297 @ 0.00080241 = 12.2745 BTC [+]
bounce: so, is there any data anywhere of the efficacy and efficiency of KYC and AML reg implementations?
undata: bounce: seems like a question for a finance industry lawyer
undata: I'm sure they're highly effective at creating a target for identity theft.
RagnarDanneskjol: efficacy and efficiency for whom or what?
thestringpuller: !up w0lf
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45300 @ 0.00080311 = 36.3809 BTC [+] {2}
bounce: the stated purpose might be a good start
bounce: then you tally the side effecets and perhaps you can make a nice little table with false and true positives and negatives perhaps
bounce: those civil forfeitures for people "structuring" their deposits so their bank has less paperwork to do is clearly an effect but not, as far as I know anyway, a publicly stated purpose of the reporting rules
RagnarDanneskjol: the 'stated purpose could only be trolling for unauthorized activity. it would be the same as efficiency/efficancy of any other surveillance - its much better than nothing but not as good as they'd like. there would simply be all negatives for one party, all positives for the other
bounce: that sounds like a load of rationalisation bs.
RagnarDanneskjol: hmm, I actually couldn't comprehend how to gauge the proficiency of kyc/aml, so was trying to help you clarify for me
bounce: then look at what they're supposed to do, like look at the language used to introduce the regs.
bounce: "combat money laundering" -- what is money laundering and (leaving aside for the moment why it would need combating) how exactly do you discern when something is money laundering or not.
bounce: s/\./?/
bounce: if there's no sure-fire way then perhaps the whole idea of combating needs to be scrapped. if that isn't the case, you can look at what effects the regs have and tally incidents they have an influence on, discerning "this was money laundering" and "this wasn't", tally separately
bounce: that at least gives you an idea of its visible effects, which isn't the whole picture but at least is a start
RagnarDanneskjol: the definition for ML is fairly straight forward - like an arrow, it either hits a target or doesnt depending on archer's accuracy. what you're talking about there is the proficiency of individual arbiters weighing decisions to execute warrants.. I'd guess their accuracy varies rather widely
bounce: warrants? what do you mean, warrants?
RagnarDanneskjol: warrants to get customer data
bounce: that's much too narrow. people getting their accounts shut down because too much bother is also an effect of these same regulations.
RagnarDanneskjol: essentially unrelated to aml I believe. account closure without legal action is just business discretion/risk mgmt. Of course regs preempt cautionary' corporate policies if thats what you mean. back to the original question, its all positive for regulators/prosecutors, all negative for account holders. virus is possibly a good analogy- its all warm, positive, and welcoming for the vi
RagnarDanneskjol: rus, entirely harmful for the host
adlai: > mark karpeles busy working on new software codenamed 'midas'
adlai: > SEC using new market analysis tool... codenamed 'midas'
adlai: wake up sheeple
adlai: "The system, akin to an X-ray machine for the stock market" Here we see the useless metaphor in its natural habitat, a NYtimes article
adlai: looks like without this, the SEC wasn't taking into account unexecuted offers, which is kinda laughable if they're trying to detect/prevent "manipulation"
bounce: <RagnarDanneskjol> essentially unrelated to aml I believe. << no, it is not. you don't get to exclude actions taken by non-government actors because of the rules because they're not government actors.
thickasthieves: <+asciilifeform> incidentally, not one word of this in u.s. papers. ---- http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/10/24/putin-accuses-us-undermining-global-stability-by-trying-to-dictate-its-will-to/
assbot: Putin says Washington fails to respect the interests of other countries | Fox News
adlai nurses his slumberbrain into wakefulness with http://youtu.be/fCF4B0f1O50 and classical music
assbot: 1000 Quotes in BPY - YouTube
thickasthieves: but yes, the Putin thing is mostly uncovered in us
thickasthieves: not covered, i should say
thickasthieves: <+cazalla> i bet this multisig shit turns into a customer service nightmare for coinbase ---- and they explicitly only do online customer service, no phone
bounce: ie, "help yourselves, dear clients"
bounce logged in with $site, nuked cookies somewhere along the way, now can't log in because "csrf token invalid, try again", no matter what trick I throw at it. support is in a forum that requires logging in through the same form of course.
thickasthieves: Tim COok just came out of the closet
thickasthieves: http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-10-30/tim-cook-im-proud-to-be-gay
assbot: Tim Cook: "I'm Proud to be Gay" - Businessweek
thickasthieves: SELL
thickasthieves: stock down .5% in premarket
bounce: down because fear it'll be down
adlai: dtf
thickasthieves: hehe
adlai: thus the modern stock market enables us to calculate the free-market price of a fuck, commonly only approximated through dark pools in back alleys
thickasthieves: So if the SEC is enabling some traders to get early info, will the SEC fine the SEC?
adlai: exchanges are enabling that and the SEC is two decades late to the party
thickasthieves: vid pf the putin speech https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9F9pQcqPdKo
assbot: Putin at Valdai - World Order: New Rules or a Game without Rules (FULL VIDEO) - YouTube
thickasthieves: worst translator ever
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18700 @ 0.00079979 = 14.9561 BTC [-]
thickasthieves: geez i like Putin
thickasthieves: let's get him in here
thickasthieves: :)
adlai: in soviet russia, wot get inside of YOU!
adlai: / logs read YOU
nubbins`: <undata> beer meanwhile, keyboards <<< my last laptop drank a beer and died. current one drank a coffee and is still kicking
punkman: I've always thought the drainholes under keyboard in Lenovo machines were a great idea, haven't had a chance to test it though
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10620 @ 0.00079979 = 8.4938 BTC [-]
nubbins`: speaking of testing, any sign of punkbot 8)
punkman: maybe today, gotta remove the stupid
punkman: but gpg libs are not helping
nubbins`: what's the backend written in
punkman: python
punkman: python-gnupg, I couldn't get recv_keys to work, tried fork of library, I can recv_keys but it burps on some unicode chars returned by keyserver and doesn't confirm key was imported.
nubbins`: oh hey, nanotube contributed to that particular method
kakobrekla: want wot? fix python.
punkman: yeah I'm not even sure what version nanotube is using
nubbins`: paste some code
nubbins`: where you're trying recv_keys
nubbins`: oh and what OS is this running on?
punkman: FreeDOS
kakobrekla: whut?
punkman: :P
nubbins`: ...
punkman: it's debian
nubbins`: heh, ok
nubbins`: yeah, paste yr code, let's take a peek
nubbins`: ;;google release early, release often
gribble: Release early, release often - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Release_early,_release_often>; Release Early, Release Often - Catb.org: <http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/homesteading/cathedral-bazaar/ar01s04.html>; The Hardest Lessons for Startups to Learn - Paul Graham: <http://www.paulgraham.com/startuplessons.html>
kakobrekla: ;;google shut the fuck up
gribble: YOU NEED TO SHUT THE FUCK UP - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nc_LIR5ExIU>; Even Carlo Ancelotti Wishes Sepp Blatter Would Shut The Fuck Up: <http://screamer.deadspin.com/even-carlo-ancelotti-wishes-sepp-blatter-would-shut-the-1652335633/+billyhaisley>; Urban Dictionary: shut the fuck up: <http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=shut%20the%20fuck%20up>
punkman: http://dpaste.com/00XNZ8B using this https://github.com/isislovecruft/python-gnupg
assbot: dpaste: 00XNZ8B
assbot: isislovecruft/python-gnupg · GitHub
punkman: (pip install gnupg)
punkman: https://github.com/isislovecruft/python-gnupg/issues/49
assbot: UnicodeDecodeError · Issue #49 · isislovecruft/python-gnupg · GitHub
nubbins`: ^ was just gonna paste that :D
nubbins`: https://github.com/isislovecruft/python-gnupg/compare/fix/49-unicode-decode-on-readline
assbot: Comparing master...fix/49-unicode-decode-on-readline · isislovecruft/python-gnupg · GitHub
nubbins`: give that a try
punkman: yeah I love that I'm running "develop" versions for all major pieces (supybot, electrum)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7150 @ 0.00079979 = 5.7185 BTC [-]
punkman is gonna need some tobacco, runs out
jurov: punkman, are you aware there are gnupg and python-gnupg as not fully compatible forks of each other?
jurov: i discovered that while doing mepxagent.
punkman: jurov: yeah and there's a dozen other similar libraries too
punkman: so pack of tobacco from corner store, 4-5eur from 17gr, bag of tobacco from guy I know, 20eur for 1kg.
punkman: if only he knew how to cure it properly
kakobrekla: properly curated costs even less than 20eur/kg in bosnia
kakobrekla: maybe 10 eur.
kakobrekla: for the high end.
punkman: kakobrekla: teach them how to bitcoin plz
kakobrekla: heh
kakobrekla: i dont know anyone younger than 40 there
kakobrekla: or well, a kiddo.
nubbins`: i thought about growing tobacco
nubbins`: quit smoking instead
punkman: good idea
nubbins`: it's like having a part-time job where you get paid to not show up
bounce doesn't smoke but isn't getting paid for the not-smoking either
bounce: where did I go wrong?!?
punkman: clearly you should start smoking
nubbins`: yeah
nubbins`: then quit
nubbins`: it's like getting paid
nubbins`: do you know how much money i've "earned" since quitting?!?!
thickasthieves: pankkake says hello: "That’s not an “update”, please avoid associating your nonsense with my script. Your “solution” provides no easy maintenance and comes with greater hardware requirements (as with anything pre-0.8), but I suppose you guys are pretty much clueless on this. Also conveniently forgetting that 0.9 introduced the possibility of disabling the wallet functionality
thickasthieves: altogether."
nubbins`: ;;calc (2*365+366+13)*10
gribble: 11090
nubbins`: er sorry
thickasthieves: http://www.contravex.com/2014/10/30/enough-of-what-most-people-think-tell-me-what-you-think-or-stfu/#comment-4222
assbot: Enough of What “Most People Think,” Tell Me What You Think or STFU | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski
nubbins`: ;;calc ((2*365+366+13)*10)/[ticker --last]
gribble: 33.224482459
nubbins`: like 33 btc!!!
punkman: well maybe you bought a pack for 10k btc long ago
jurov: <asciilifeform> [20141030 00:13] that thing's running on what, a commodore64? << seeing kako's problems, I put a CDN in outright in front of it
jurov: obv, that means caching delays
punkman: jurov, what are you using
jurov: cloudfront
nubbins`: thickasthieves why so butthurt anyway
nubbins`: !s pankkake
assbot: 17918 results for 'pankkake' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=pankkake
thickasthieves: dunno, he so mad tho
thickasthieves: " Whether one is a US-based exchange or not doesn't decide whether one needs to register. The question is whether a company has clients in the US or not. If so, they are subject to regulations of that jurisdiction."
thickasthieves: hmm interesting concept
thickasthieves: can a US exchange run unregulated by the US if it only serves non-US customers?
jurov: and if it does not register, then what?
punkman: thickasthieves: wasn't kraken doing that for a while?
jurov: iirc it's already established MPEx server everyone, what are they gonna do about it?
jurov: *serves
RagnarDanneskjol: thickasthieves - thats what coinsetter did their first couple of years for that reason
thickasthieves: quite interesting
kakobrekla: coinsetter is idiots.
thickasthieves: i mean, who wants us customers anyway
kakobrekla: not cause of that, just in general.
nubbins`: thickasthieves +1
nubbins`: http://imgur.com/gallery/vwI6Au3
assbot: Cybernetic arm goes crazy on canadian TV show - Imgur
nubbins`: my sides
thickasthieves: "Don't know if 1970's or hipsters" lol
nubbins`: aaaaah my face hurts
nubbins`: can't stop watching
nubbins`: the host!!!
nubbins`: he's all "this is highly irregular"
ben_vulpes: punkman: i've run afoul of the python gnupg wrapper
ben_vulpes: i ultimately went the route of shelling out to gpg directly and writing my own little lib that did exactly what i needed and nothing else
ben_vulpes: thickasthieves: where's that pankkake comment from?
thickasthieves: i linked
ben_vulpes: h foundit
thickasthieves: he still loves us
thickasthieves: i can tell
TomServo: "Russia favors a conservative approach to introducing innovations into the social order, but is not opposed to investigating and discussing such innovations, to see if introducing any of them might be justified." << seems like an odd point to wedge in amongst the rest.
punkman: ben_vulpes: which wrapper were you using?
thickasthieves: http://www.wired.com/2014/10/mit-media-lab-gets-transforming-logo-courtesy-pentagram/
assbot: MIT Media Lab Gets a Transforming Logo, Courtesy of Pentagram | WIRED
thickasthieves: Pentagram is like the identity design elite
punkman: megalol -> http://i.imgur.com/cpTYpu7.png
thickasthieves: ha
punkman: just when I was thinking hey this is pretty good
punkman: then the ad slide pops up
thickasthieves: it's really good imo
thickasthieves: it's nearly impossible to get a client to accept stuff like this thi
thickasthieves: tho
thickasthieves: it's why i always loved the Apple logo designer
thickasthieves: his deal was, i'll make you a logo, and you'll take it as is
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/sjw-you-mean-sew/ fresh off da presses.
assbot: SJW ? You mean SEW ? pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: TomServo why so?
nubbins`: thickasthieves this is how pink eye prefers to work for design jobs
nubbins`: it's way, way, way less painful for everyone involved
TomServo: mircea_popescu: It just struck me as not fitting with the rest of the message. What innovations might he be referring to?
mircea_popescu: well the way i read it it's not referring to anything, merely refusing to commit to anything.
thickasthieves: he does almost sound like he's gonna pitch Bitcoin for a minute
TomServo: hehe, that's kind of where I was going
TomServo: The other points seem much more specific, and I would think there is at least something in mind when referring to innovations into the social order.
thickasthieves: it's a well written speech in that its general enough any individual can map it onto his own perspectives
mircea_popescu: http://www.majestic12.co.uk/projects/dsearch/mj12bot.php << incidentally.
assbot: Majestic-12 : DSearch : MJ12bot
mircea_popescu: a distributed replacement for google might be a pretty damned good idea
mircea_popescu: especially if it doesn't end up with a manual "algo"
ben_vulpes: http://www.contravex.com/2014/10/30/enough-of-what-most-people-think-tell-me-what-you-think-or-stfu/#comment-4230 << when it emerges from moderation
assbot: Enough of What “Most People Think,” Tell Me What You Think or STFU | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski
thickasthieves: the local rap group in my hometwon was called 12Majestik
jurov: any non-manual algo will get spammed
mircea_popescu: jurov no, make search wot-based.
punkman: sort of distributed google http://yacy.net/
assbot: YaCy - The Peer to Peer Search Engine: Home
thickasthieves: my search idea could combine with a distributed one, have all ranking factors be open and weightable by the user
thickasthieves: provide templates to start from
jurov: mircea_popescu you forgot the wot ratings must be examined manually to be useful?
thickasthieves: and default mode is the average of all users
ben_vulpes: punkman: python-gnupg iirc
mircea_popescu: jurov which is why this is so useful : try and do it for search, high volume and low risk, see if anything useful can be done algorithmically.
thickasthieves: google killer in a nutshell
jurov: punkman: i ended up calling gpg --recv-key directly
jurov: even then, it did some failures like "key rejected by input filter"
jurov: dunno any lib can handle that
punkman: jurov, I think I could publish a pubring that gets updated a couple times a day
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves i suspect this is like the "myspace, music industry killer" idea a decade ago. yeah, it'd work, if people didn't suck. people do suck, and as a result, myspace dies.
jurov: punkman: incl. removals/revocations?
punkman: ideally
thickasthieves: i think "work" definition would change in this case
thickasthieves: from google being the curator, to newsearch being the db with sort
punkman: I am also considering making the bot spit out expiry/revocations in a diff channel
thickasthieves: google can still be google
mircea_popescu: it'd certainly be useful for linux-y types, me and google divorced when it took out the operands.
thickasthieves: and would be smart to move harder in the curation direction in the face of such a service
thickasthieves: they already are tho,
mircea_popescu: and google is the shittiest curator imaginable. people in commie romania thought they had it bad, but this is pointedly worse.
thickasthieves: Google Music, etc
thickasthieves: well thats why you use newsearch and lazy ignorants use goog
thickasthieves: i actually call it Project Search Party
mircea_popescu: "oh, everything is on wikipedia" is not curation. why the fuck would i want google to return a wikipedia result in the first place, what, as if i don't know they probably have a shitty article sort-of talking around topic x ?
thickasthieves: the project i'll never work on but always talk about
mircea_popescu: why aren't you working on it again ?
thickasthieves: how the fuck to make a search engine?
thickasthieves: i dont even mine!
punkman: thickasthieves: write down some ideas
thickasthieves: i think i do have a writeup started somewhere with examples, etc
thickasthieves: but i cant even manage getting someone to recompile altcoind for windows
thickasthieves: soooo
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves the way people do. you write down the task, break it up, write down the parts, break them up, read up on the topics, implement, refine...
mircea_popescu: what have all these other schmucks been doing ever since this chan started ?
punkman: I want to make personal search engine that gets fed with my browsing history, bookmarks, local content (email, logs, etc)
thickasthieves: i also would like (and surely others would to) a cumalitive customizable chart for bitcoin exchanges
thickasthieves: so i can choose which ones to combine into one chart
jurov: punkman KDE tried with akonadi... kinda works after years of prodding
mircea_popescu: such a consummate consumer this guy.
punkman: thickasthieves: I got code that can fetch ticker/trade data from dozens of exchanges
thickasthieves: punkman, this is kinda what cell phone OS are doing
jurov: such overarching systems are usable only for incredibly patient people like me
punkman: been wanting to put it into use
thickasthieves: when you search on android it digs into all kindsa shit
thickasthieves: punkman, are you capable of turning that into something that can output a custom file to feed into Metatrader or such?
nubbins`: ios/spotlight search too
punkman: yes
thickasthieves: and capable of serving such a chart on a website like bitcoinwisdom?
thickasthieves: (not bitcoinwisdom of course)
punkman: that'd take some time, lots of javascripts
punkman: unless I can export from metatrader
thickasthieves: i think traders would gobble it up
thickasthieves: a live aggragate chart with customizable tickboxes for exchanges
thickasthieves: aggregate
punkman: yeah and maybe sockets people can subscribe to
bounce: you built that fetch code?
thickasthieves: this was partly within my ideas for Coinflow, before bitcoin play exchanges all died
mircea_popescu: that's the risk, you put the work in, "traders" love it, then it turns out the "traders" are 500 redditards all sunk to the hilt in bitfinex/bitjam/whatever
mircea_popescu: then you make fiddy bitcents off them and a well.
thickasthieves: if you establish the user base, then you can become the dominant index provider
thickasthieves: Coindesk seems on this path, but theyre bound to fuck it up
mircea_popescu: you won't become the dominant index provider because people who matter don't chart and people who chart don't matter.
thickasthieves: but everyone wants to know the price
mircea_popescu: you will become the reddit index provider, which is not how you feed that market. you don't make goof stuff for the consumers, you make cheap shitty stuff for them
mircea_popescu: then hire people to tell them how it's all okay.
thickasthieves: lol
mircea_popescu: everyone does want to know the price, but a speshal few know you wouldn't know anyway.
mircea_popescu: this being kinda why all the however many exchange feed centralizers went nowhere.
thickasthieves: should there not be someone who is trying hardest to discern the price?
mircea_popescu: putting most work into != trying hardest necessarily. besides, what's this hardest, taking exchange feeds ?
thickasthieves: maybe mapping otc in there, trying to pry info from people like coinbase or bitpay, i dunno
thickasthieves: ur right tho
thickasthieves: other turdtards are already on this
mircea_popescu: not to be a parade pisser, but there's problems lurking.
thickasthieves: Winkdex
thickasthieves: Coindesk, etc
thickasthieves: i got off track anyway
mircea_popescu: generally what everyone thinks is the thing to do is wrong, which is why the "never compete in saturated markets" advice's served me so well over the years.
thickasthieves: the idea was to make the feeds managable
thickasthieves: not to curate
mircea_popescu: maybe my needs are unrepresentative, but i find they're served equally well by any of the older providers. bitcoincharts, bitcoinity, whatevers.
thickasthieves: true, this is more of a trader thing
thickasthieves: stemming from,
thickasthieves: there are big players working across exchanges
thickasthieves: so volume on one is far from representative
thickasthieves: so if you are attempting to chart or even look at trends or volume alone, you relaly need the whole picture
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20600 @ 0.0008034 = 16.55 BTC [+]
thickasthieves: i do understand this is still a limited spectrum
thickasthieves: but it's the spectrum in which traders play
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves do you understand that as dubious as charts are generally, which we won't rehash, at least generally there's the atomic market ?
mircea_popescu: whereas for all you know in bitcoin twelve whales get together in a secret chan somehwere and that's how the price moves ?
thickasthieves: sure, i meant this with the spectrum comments
thickasthieves: i'm not commenting on whether its just a shared delusion
thickasthieves: that doesnt matter
mircea_popescu: girls just wanna have fun ?
thickasthieves: cuz, well, everything is
mircea_popescu: mno.
mircea_popescu: not everything is. that's the essential point.
thickasthieves: i'm being hyper abstract
mircea_popescu: lol what's that ?
thickasthieves: well things only matter in a context
mircea_popescu: okay.
thickasthieves: and the more contexts you fractalize, the less they matter to the outside
thickasthieves: with the outer being total meaninglessness
mircea_popescu: what's to fractalize ?
thickasthieves: encapsulate smaller contexts
thickasthieves: paradigms
thickasthieves: in the end we're all just floating muck, without context
mircea_popescu: you gonna get butthurt if i tell you your though process would drastically benefit from more rigor ?
thickasthieves: nope
mircea_popescu: good, cuz it would.
thickasthieves: itd help if i knew what you meant tho
mircea_popescu: somehow i've never noticed it before, but chicks in this country have positively gorgeous hair
xiando: It doesn't matter if you really are 12+ whales on some private IRC channel, you can't just set the price anyway.
thickasthieves: are you just saying, stop spouting bullshit and read more books?
mircea_popescu: xiando o, no ? http://trilema.com/2013/in-which-noobs-learn-lessons-and-pay-for-the-privilege/ ? http://trilema.com/2014/this-is-how-much-i-rule-today/ ?
assbot: In which noobs learn lessons and pay for the privilege pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
assbot: This is how much I rule (today) pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves not at all. i mean something quite specific :
adlai: spouting bullshit is OK, as long as you curate it a bit better than just letting assbot dump it all in a text file
mircea_popescu: you say "hyper abstract". this is like in code, calling function X. compiler (me) goes wait, wut ? so you go "function X () { random banal shit; }"
mircea_popescu: now, it's entirely your privilege, as the human in this relationship, to define function x any way you please
mircea_popescu: but the particular definition you gave indicates to the compiler, were the compiler human, that a) you hadn't considered it before using it and b) as defined prolly doesn't serve you in any sense.
thickasthieves: i gave it such a name for this reason
mircea_popescu: how's that work ?
thickasthieves: as i knew i was about to explain something as i thought it, but i also knew it was a concept in my head from the past but which i have never articulated in words
bounce: something like abstract algebra. do math to numbers only forget about the numbers.
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves obviously i can appreciate thinking is a process, and one has to make sense of one's [intellectual] history, etc.
thickasthieves: in case you havent noticed i like to explore the space in between things, and question the extremes
mircea_popescu: that's not in question.
mircea_popescu: it's a matter of methodology not of scope. the how, not the what.
thickasthieves: this often puts my in either a devils advocate position, or stranded
adlai: "write drunk, edit sober"
thickasthieves: me
mircea_popescu: lol who's that, hemingway ?
adlai: indeed!
bounce: in this case I have no idea what you're on about
thickasthieves: lol
thickasthieves: tldr
mircea_popescu: bounce just a little defensive, because not erryday gets to discuss his headpenis, and in public to boot!
thickasthieves: i was merely saying that this aggregate chart idea was for traders and thats ok
thickasthieves: even if traders are delusional
thickasthieves: they have chosen their paradigm
bounce: eh, maybe.
adlai: why not sell it to the SEC for when they want to regulate bitcoin markets
mircea_popescu: so have camwhores ? what is this.
bounce had been playing with the idea of an aggregator. didn't get around to actually do it though.
bounce: it's a good place to sit, business model-wise.
adlai: how exactly?
thickasthieves: what charts do camwhores need?
adlai: camwhores could probably use some quality analytics
mircea_popescu: camwhores are expert anatitics.
mircea_popescu: because i never noticed as many flaws an dproblems in a woman as when sitting with a coupla camhos watching her.
mircea_popescu: half the shit wasn't even there.
thickasthieves: funny story, an ex client, against my advice, moved to a notoriously bad (cheap) web guy,
thickasthieves: yesterday their domain expired and now points to pornhub
thickasthieves: council on Aging
thickasthieves: just launched their capital campaign
mircea_popescu: o.O
thickasthieves: so all these old fogies are watching bj vids now
mircea_popescu: best thing for em.
thickasthieves: probly better than worrying about when Meals on Wheels will be by
mircea_popescu: speaking of which, i have a metal hand press, and a pile of oranges. so im going to make myself some freshly squeezed orange juice and douse it in the local cognac.
mircea_popescu: anyone want anything ?
ben_vulpes: 30 btc and a testing framework for 0.5.3
adlai: screwdriver pls
bounce: you got a teleporter?
adlai: made with cheap potato vodka
mircea_popescu: well no, but there's airplanes where you ppls live neh ?
bounce: if so, sure, why not
mircea_popescu: onus on the customer, that's the mpex way!
bounce: local airport is closed. nice long tarmac strip though, so send over the bitcoin jet.
thickasthieves: when can i have 3d printed jack&coke?
mircea_popescu: that doesn't taste like bottled tarmac ?
adlai: see now that is real fertile territory for innovation
bounce: bottled tarmac?
adlai: analyze jack&coke, engineer enzymes targeting its contents, put them in yeast and feast
mircea_popescu: bounce well 3d printing is mostly toothpaste sculpture, except with plastic.
mircea_popescu: (am i the only one into toothpaste art around the age of 5 or so ?)
adlai: well i did notice at one point that squeezing my asshole while pooping could theoretically sculpt the resulting turd, kinda like a lathe
adlai: then i began drinking coffee and my turds are now denser than depleted uranium
thickasthieves: lol
mircea_popescu: so coffee depletes the uranium in your got ?
mircea_popescu: gut*
adlai: "chemical printing" gets tossed around as the next step in automated manufacturing
ben_vulpes: sounds like your typical semi fab.
adlai: bounce: so you could theoretically "chemically print" the composition of any drink, medicine, poison, drug, explosive, etc
bounce: squirt acid on pcbs with an inkjet and skip the whole masking thing?
ben_vulpes: also, your typical us "food product" fab.
mircea_popescu: adlai and what it means is, "even cheaper furniture and finishings for the us mortgage mouse"
mircea_popescu: nah, it
adlai: well, semi fab is using chemicals to manufacture a physical design
mircea_popescu: 'll just be for cheap toys, nightstand knobs that sorta thing.
ben_vulpes: i really don't see the difference.
adlai: "chemical printing" (which doesn't exist yet, afaik) is about using sufficiently advanced technology to manufacture specific chemicals
thickasthieves: nude self portait figurines, etc
ben_vulpes: vlsi or crappy door handle...
bounce: on-demand printing of otherwise unobtanium and expensivium parts is kinda useful though
ben_vulpes: like dna base pairs in bulk?
adlai: yes
ben_vulpes: p sure that's a thing already.
adlai: well, maybe for DNA base pairs
ben_vulpes: but i been out of the atoms biz for a while now.
bounce: dna printing. grow result in petri dish. cook. serve as dinner.
ben_vulpes: cocaine?
adlai: but not for arbitrary compounds
ben_vulpes: thc?
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves i had a bet with a younger, entrepreneur friend, which went that if automatic "make clone of your own penis" and "test yourself for all diseases" kits appear at the same time, the former'll oversell the latter.
adlai: insulin?
adlai: epinephrine?
ben_vulpes: spider silk componds in goat bladders?
bounce: somehow I think I'll prefer food the old fashioned way
adlai: now we're talking!
ben_vulpes: it's all a matter of demand, the tooling is out there.
ben_vulpes: a fact conveniently overlooked by populist health preachers.
thickasthieves: You can haz TWO penises now!
bounce: lots of tools out there
mircea_popescu: Print-A-Girlfriend OneStopShop & Kinko's.
thickasthieves: you can screw your gf in all holes at once
thickasthieves: it's like youre really there
mircea_popescu: lmao
adlai: well what would you do with the extra cock
bounce: we'd be back with the whole eugenics problem, only with a different face on it
adlai: it needs to get stitched in somewhere
adlai: you can't just print a cock and start waving it around like a dildo
thickasthieves: well you print extra cock with handles of course
thickasthieves: you can have a strap-on of ur own dick to do both holes
adlai: this is more a challenge of neuroscience and plastic surgery
jurov: http://www.boycottlinux.org/ << asciilifeform don't read
assbot: boycott Linux
jurov: he'll be fuming half day from that
adlai: i'm already pissed from the lack of hyperlinked endnotes
bounce: pissed? bit early, no.
mircea_popescu: somewhat related : http://33.media.tumblr.com/31a8b25182400990210c3693b5dad84f/tumblr_n9qte4DDut1sgoh5do2_400.gif << this is exactly civilisation
mats_cd03: until now, i had never considered DPing a woman with a 3D print of my own dong
mircea_popescu: keep the natural away, use the replica.
mats_cd03: isnt modern life great?
mircea_popescu: mats_cd03 whatever you do, don't do the bj kiss. it'll ruin "traditional" life for you.
jurov: soon the replicas will be able to transmit feelings
mats_cd03: i try to discretely offer a glass of water
mircea_popescu: jurov first, diseases.
mircea_popescu: then feelings.
mats_cd03: not that i don't enjoy the taste of my own dong, just... i don't
mircea_popescu: mats_cd03 no, not that one. the one where you kiss a girl while the other sucks you off.
jurov: lolk
adlai: "Linux's spread... reinvents the flat tire" nice
mats_cd03: doing two at once seems like a lot of work
mircea_popescu: mats_cd03 only if you think of them.
mats_cd03: like... do you stop for a snack?
mats_cd03: i'd be exhausted.
mircea_popescu: i stop for a snack anyway !?
mircea_popescu: bounce: so, is there any data anywhere of the efficacy and efficiency of KYC and AML reg implementations? << nope.
asciilifeform: jurov: herr poettering owns a copy of 'sed' and a small sense of humour - but very little talent, turns out.
mircea_popescu: much like the tsa bs, it's never been reviewed.
thickasthieves: well nothing to review, it's not a service to the people, it's a service to the gov
thickasthieves: the internet makes crime easier, and US just wants to make sure they are the ones having it easy
mircea_popescu: but i like how bounce's legal mind works. seriously, contrary to all the pretense of the entrenched "profession" to the contrary, being a lawyer is EXACTLY being a coder, nothing different at all, let alone substantially different is taught in law school. the ONLY difference is that the hardware is very limited and the api incredibly old and terribly buggy.
mircea_popescu: course "loophole" doesn't have the same sound to it as "bug" does.
asciilifeform: attention turdatronic engineers:
asciilifeform: left turd syncing overnight, at bh ~= 252450, exhausted ram (8g)
asciilifeform: leakatron.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform o yea.
thickasthieves: you remove patches, it leaks
mircea_popescu: lmao
asciilifeform: anyone running 'bare' 0.5.3 ?
mircea_popescu: anyway, anyone willing to work with an incredibly intricately documented ad-hoc algol is more than welcome to be a lawyer. all it takes really.
mircea_popescu: adlai: "The system, akin to an X-ray machine for the stock market" Here we see the useless metaphor in its natural habitat, a NYtimes article << lol, quite. at least salon and the rest of the sew crowd make their metaphores pointedly wrong, rather than useless.
mircea_popescu: "The U.S. and the European Union have imposed several rounds of crippling sanctions against Moscow" << lolmkay.
asciilifeform: didn't point out, crippling - who
asciilifeform: *whom
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform myeah. writing for your audience, worst fucking idea ever.
mircea_popescu: also this is why english is the international language whereas russian is not : english allows two parties to reach a "mutual conclusion" which they can both live with.
adlai: why doesn't russian?
mircea_popescu: russians : "The U.S. and the European Union have imposed several rounds of crippling sanctions against Moscow" ; nato : "The U.S. and the European Union have imposed several rounds of crippling sanctions against Moscow".
mircea_popescu: but in russian : США и Европейский союз ввели несколько раундов санкций против Москвы парализует себя. / США и Европейский союз ввели несколько раундов санкций сокрушительный Москву.
asciilifeform: 'google translate' died for mircea_popescu's sins
mircea_popescu: :D
adlai: "US and European Union have introduced several rounds of sanctions against Moscow paralyze yourself"
mircea_popescu: wait wut ?
mircea_popescu: sebya = yourself now ?!
adlai: google translate of : until /
adlai: best mistranslation I've seen recently was a cop booking a swiss friend for rear-ending another car in massachusets
adlai: swiss guy's license is all in Deutsch, natürlich, so our brilliant state trooper scribbles in huge block letters in the accident report: "DUTCH LICENSE NUMBER 123456"
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves: So if the SEC is enabling some traders to get early info, will the SEC fine the SEC? << funny how that works eh.
mircea_popescu: ;;google hungary is a country turkey
gribble: A blonde and a 3rd grade geography question - Snotr: <http://www.snotr.com/video/675/A_blonde_and_a_3rd_grade_geography_question>; Relations between Turkey and Hungary - Ministry of Foreign Affairs: <http://www.mfa.gov.tr/relations-between-turkey-and-hungary.en.mfa>; Can she be THAT stupid? - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cey35bBWXls>
mats_cd03: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 337.26, Best ask: 338.0, Bid-ask spread: 0.74000, Last trade: 338.0, 24 hour volume: 10893.91462845, 24 hour low: 332.99, 24 hour high: 344.22, 24 hour vwap: 338.382085275
mircea_popescu: http://www.people.com/people/kellie_pickler/ << related.
assbot: Kellie Pickler : People.com
asciilifeform: so, no one ever put the cursed thing through 'valgrind' or the like?
asciilifeform: i'm supposed to believe this?
adlai: satoshi was a visionary artist, not an engineer
asciilifeform: satoshackson pollack
adlai: looking over his original code... i'm almost surprised he didn't write in pascal
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-10-2014#893892 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 24-10-2014 20:23:36; mircea_popescu: nobody that knows how to use valgrind.
adlai: well odin probably does, and a handful of grunts handling the sweaty work
asciilifeform: there is also the possibility that this shit is too much like work, and that is the explanation.
mircea_popescu: punkman: I've always thought the drainholes under keyboard in Lenovo machines were a great idea, haven't had a chance to test it though <<< this is the train of thought that ends up with keyboard rats.
asciilifeform was recently issued just such a machine by the fellow he works for. had an interesting 'face' when saw the holes.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform anyway, as you well know, easy to make small holes while writing c++. in fact, the best use of c++ might be irrigation systesm.
mircea_popescu: "our holes never plug!"
kakobrekla: calm down, not all holes are made for fucking.
adlai: this is not the attitude that put a robot on mars
asciilifeform: now it's fucking around aimlessly while trying to pull blocks
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: want wot? fix python. << want food ? invent deer!
adlai: import deer
mircea_popescu: dub weiser ?
gernika: Is there a seminal discussion on deeds/deedbot I can read up on?
adlai tried making a python joke
kakobrekla: adlai not compatible python 3
xiando: only 170 btc from 20k short at BFX \o/
adlai: they broke import!?
adlai: xiando: is anybody correlating swap market moves with market sells?
thickasthieves: "Her charming babe-in-the-woods persona also contributed to her post-Idol success" lol
mircea_popescu: gernika it's in the logs, yeah.
xiando: adlai: You see it clearly on bfxdata, like 2 hours ago there was a 1600 BTC trade where you clearly see both USD and BTC margin take spikes
asciilifeform: does phoundation's latest turd leak?
xiando: most swap taken is either used directly or within hours
thickasthieves: pankkake says .9 is where it's at
adlai: xiando: eyeballing correlations is nice, but it's just eyeballing... then again, this is just my kneejerk distrust of eyeballs rather than any concrete reason to suspect there's a problem with this approach
mircea_popescu: gernika http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-06-2014#718931 starts there. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 14-06-2014 11:59:24; mircea_popescu: so based on mike_c's discussion last night, i think i have a very good addition to b-a kako. it'd go like this :
gernika: mircea_popescu great thanks
mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-08-2014#789340 latter reprise. and there's a pastebin with the actual spec too. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 11-08-2014 00:24:04; mircea_popescu: Jason the idea is to expand current bitcoin-assets functionality with a register of deeds.
punkman: gernika, this should explain a lot http://dpaste.com/05YF5VH
assbot: dpaste: 05YF5VH
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: ever plugged the leak in your secret magic turd?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform mine doesn't leak, no.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: care to share even this patch?
mircea_popescu: but my dear man, it isn't A patch.
xiando: adlai: I actually do not get what you mean or why you are wondering if there is a colleration, if you short sell 1000 BTC then you borrow 1000 BTC so obviously swaps increase when the sell happens.
asciilifeform knew it, mircea_popescu is running own gadget.
asciilifeform: why are we polishing turd again...?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's at least two holes still extant to this day, i thought i said at some point
thickasthieves: why does this whole deeds, b-a form, sending 1btc to urself, hash, thing make me think about colored coins?
mircea_popescu: no idea ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10150 @ 0.0008034 = 8.1545 BTC [+]
thickasthieves: does it already serve the purpose?
thickasthieves: it essentially lets you attach a "hash" to a token and tx, which is just a hyperlink to stored data elsewhere i think
asciilifeform wondering if pankkake starved
asciilifeform: see also http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3217750625724755@naggum.net.html
assbot: Re: realistic but short and simple LISP examples? - Naggum cll archive
thickasthieves: http://blog.coinprism.com/2014/09/04/colorcore-open-source-wallet-for-open-assets/
assbot: Announcing Colorcore: an open source wallet for Open Assets - Coinprism Blog
thickasthieves: yay! http://www.coindesk.com/jon-matonis-resigns-bitcoin-foundation-executive-director/
assbot: Jon Matonis Resigns As Bitcoin Foundation Executive Director
mircea_popescu: in the sense that braindamaged implementations of nothing in particular are similar to actually useful implementations on the same basis, then yes, all c code reminds one of all c code and deeds of colored coins
thickasthieves: was onlybringing it up in case their stuff can be repurposed to save time
thickasthieves: a bit lately probly anywya
mircea_popescu: punkman: yeah I love that I'm running "develop" versions for all major pieces (supybot, electrum) <<< real manhood.
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves i wouldn't touch it anyway.
thickasthieves: "Matonis has served as the head of the bitcoin industry's oldest trade organisation since July 2013"
thickasthieves: oldest trade org
thickasthieves: lol
mircea_popescu: we're here in the process of reimplementing the world because we don't trust one set of turdmeisters, you expect code will be reused from an even derpier set ?
mircea_popescu: <thickasthieves> oldest trade org <<< check it out, they're aware bitcoin foundation is going to destroy bitcoin scamfoundation.
mircea_popescu: punkman: so pack of tobacco from corner store, 4-5eur from 17gr, bag of tobacco from guy I know, 20eur for 1kg. << srsly, you're too useful to be smoking by the kg.
thickasthieves: lol ur like the annoying kid that always wins
thickasthieves: stahp!
adlai: xiando: btc swaps go into short selling btcusd, but also margin longing ltcbtc, th1btc. some also get reserved and not used immediately
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves lol but i have 30+ year's experience at it!
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> why are we polishing turd again...? << only way there is.
adlai: xanthyos: another scenario: i place a margin bid. you market sell. usd swaps go up, but the market has dropped. does this show up in an eyeballing of the charts?
thickasthieves: adlai, most of the swaps are taken up by swap dealers, and more likely, bfx itself
xanthyos: ?
mircea_popescu: !up buytoshi
adlai: sorry, both messages were for xiando
xanthyos: ok
thickasthieves: only one x name per room, wtf
adlai: eyeballing is probably effective for reasonably accurate big picture view, especially in a situation like bfx, where most volume is in a single market
mircea_popescu: nubbins`: it's like having a part-time job where you get paid to not show up <<< you're like one step away from being a mobster don. which is what that job is.
adlai: but at some point i'd like to algorithmically snarf this data, and i wonder occasionally how exactly to correlate between all these feeds
mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-10-2014#903160 << what script is this about ?
assbot: Logged on 30-10-2014 13:20:00; thickasthieves: pankkake says hello: "That’s not an “update”, please avoid associating your nonsense with my script. Your “solution” provides no easy maintenance and comes with greater hardware requirements (as with anything pre-0.8), but I suppose you guys are pretty much clueless on this. Also conveniently forgetting that 0.9 introduced the possibility of disabling the wallet functionality
thickasthieves: mp, next is link
mircea_popescu: "It’s like talking to a wall. There’s no use arguing with a cult."
mircea_popescu: o.O
thickasthieves: thats why he does it?
mircea_popescu: "i can't convince you people that 3 = 4 it's like talking to a wall you're a cult wah wah"
mircea_popescu: what the shit even.
thickasthieves: mad at the world
thickasthieves: “The scenario of deflation is not there, because indeed we don’t consider that deflation is going to happen,” said the ECB’s vice-president, Vitor Constancio, ECB
mircea_popescu: but anyway, i still duno wtf script. what script ?
thickasthieves: pete mentions it, sec
thickasthieves: ah
thickasthieves: it's the script pankkake made to run a node
thickasthieves: pete modified it
thickasthieves: and pankkake says he dumb
thickasthieves: http://www.contravex.com/2014/10/10/guide-to-setting-up-a-remote-bitcoin-node-for-20-per-year/
assbot: Guide To Setting Up A Remote Bitcoin Node For $20 Per Year | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski
thickasthieves: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-10-2014#867680 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 10-10-2014 16:49:26; pete_dushenski: 0.9.3 is obviously dirt but how would one go about installing 0.6.x on a vps?
undata: what openssl version is the 0.5.3 fork being built against?
mircea_popescu: well, left a comment, doesn't show.
mircea_popescu: http://pastebin.com/LLMWKukj in case pete actually loses it.
assbot: Neither arguing something stupidly nor arguing for something stupid gives one li - Pastebin.com
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves: " Whether one is a US-based exchange or not doesn't decide whether one needs to register. The question is whether a company has clients in the US or not. If so, they are subject to regulations of that jurisdiction." << utter bullshit.
mircea_popescu: i will NOT register with anyone ever on the guise that they can't keep their cattle in line.
mircea_popescu: this is like pretending that ranchers must register with one another because the cattle strays on their land and eats their grass.
mircea_popescu: gtfo before i start shooting.
thickasthieves: granted, though i realize now the quote is missing a bit of context, I think he was more pointing out that you could operate in the US, outwardly
mircea_popescu: you don't likle us citizens betting on bitbet, put fucking dildos in their chairs.
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves no such thing.
mircea_popescu: they don't like it, close the borders.
thickasthieves: thats why i found it interesting
mircea_popescu: they want the border open ? lube up and moan with the music.
mircea_popescu: the world is not a us subject. the us is a subject in this relationship. an incredibly cheeky one, to boot.
thickasthieves: would they let me run SR from here if i only sold to Russians?
mircea_popescu: such broken.
mircea_popescu: ahh logs done.
mircea_popescu: this is so easier when y'all don't go fucking crazy with the keyboards!
thickasthieves: what happens if you apply this thought to S.nsa, it's safe only to sell encryption devices for btc from US, not to? nope...
thickasthieves: it's all so fukn retarded
thickasthieves: random thought, reading qntra this morning, i pictured 5 years in the future, where it was the craigslist of localized anarchonews
thickasthieves: california.qntra.net, etc
thickasthieves: just a thought...
bounce: florida.qntra.net, where everything happens
xiando: mircea_popescu, if US laws apply in practice if you serve US citizens or not is basically a question of where you are, really. If you are in this country and the US tells the regime they want you then you're just picked up and put on a plane and maby, if you are very lucky, someone in the regime will bother to ask why they want you
xiando: It is like property rights locally, you are supposed to have them but you don't anymore
asciilifeform: thickasthieves: for btc from US << i expect to be gassed at some point (or to escape, but that's a pipe dream currently.)
thickasthieves: underground railroad your way to me, i have an empty house atm ;)
asciilifeform: thickasthieves: why would slave take the railroad to a slave territory?
thickasthieves: well you can train wherever you want, but you gotta make stops
asciilifeform: thickasthieves: i think i explained on, possibly 10+ occasions, the hard part is not the airplane (i even bought one of those arse-search passes we spoke of.)
asciilifeform: any idiot can scrape together a few pennies and get on an airplane.
mircea_popescu: xiando not really that simple, but anyway.
mircea_popescu: ever saw this one http://libertymaven.com/wp-content/uploads/bird_swallowing_choking_frog.png ?
asciilifeform: i think i posted that here at one point.
mircea_popescu: <bounce> florida.qntra.net, where everything happens moar like, orangecounty.florida.qntra.net ?
mircea_popescu: http://the-legion-of-decency.blogspot.com.ar/2010/05/sometimes-dragon-wins.html
assbot: The Legion of Decency: Sometimes The Dragon Wins
mircea_popescu: fucking execution squad for bikers, i tell you that right off.
thickasthieves: if you forget the email addy for an admin in Wordpress, how to password reset?
mircea_popescu: should be a little link on the page.
thickasthieves: ah shit, it's an email box that doesnt ecist
mircea_popescu: so change it in the mysql.
thickasthieves: i figured out the email, it's a dead one :/
xiando: change it in the db if you have access to it
thickasthieves: i do, though only a lil experience
bounce: no execution squads for road users, thanks.
thickasthieves: do you know what records i'm diggin for?
bounce doesn't really understand the animosity between bikes and cars, though. seems to be a north american thing.
asciilifeform: ;;google gold plated car
gribble: This Gold-Plated Lamborghini Model Car Will Set You Back $7.5 ...: <http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/17/gold-plated-lamborghini_n_3942473.html>; Gold Touch Inc mobile gold plating: <http://goldtouchinc.com/mobile-24k-plating/>; World's most expensive car? £4million gold Lamborghini ... - Daily Mail: <http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2768199/Is-world-s-expensive- (1 more message)
thickasthieves: no one likes bicycles except cyclists
asciilifeform: fail
gernika: thx punkman
asciilifeform: (ancient essay on 'gold-plated cars', aka motorcycles, as moral hazard re: insurance)
mircea_popescu: bounce easy to explain : all preditors have an innate hatred of fast moving, light items ; preditors are better suited than rumminants for life on earth. as a result, people on bikes are in a position ot annyo people in cars, and people in cars are in a position to give them what for.
mircea_popescu: but the ruminants are really good at bleeting, and in the us currently that temporarily means something.,
mircea_popescu: so there you go. otherwise, the "animosity" is properly resolved with bikers paying the fuck attention and being humble and apologetic all the time to everyone.
xiando: thickasthieves: wp_users table ID 1
asciilifeform: elementary missing piece here - in many places in usa, a bicyclist is permitted to occupy a full lane. this slows traffic in the entire road to a crawl, very often, because now everyone is stuck in first gear.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform seems a detail.
asciilifeform: important detail when you're in this type of 'funeral parade' every other day.
mircea_popescu: for sure.
mircea_popescu: just run them over.
mircea_popescu: it's what i tell my drivers, anyway.
gernika: I once ran over a bicyclist. She then got a ticket.
mircea_popescu: if it was anyone important, he'd be in a car.
asciilifeform: drivers also struggle to escape from the 'funeral' lane, hastily swap lanes to the left, and often collide
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42727 @ 0.00080284 = 34.3029 BTC [-] {2}
asciilifeform: except in usa, just about everyone is in a car, king and slave
mircea_popescu: anyway, bikers in romania pissed me the fuck off. bikers here are actually pleasant,
mircea_popescu: except one time i nearly clobbered this purely retarded, english speaking middle aged woman.
mircea_popescu: so it's definitely education.
mircea_popescu: "According to the forensic report, the vehicle never exceeded an AVERAGE speed of 34 Kph." << gotta love these forensic reports. the never exceeded average ? lol
asciilifeform: other thing to remember is that sidewalks are not standard in usa.
asciilifeform: (no idea about ca)
mircea_popescu: scandalous, this. but they are standard in new england
mircea_popescu: they're just not standard in shitholes.
asciilifeform: 'anyone important is always in a car' (tm) - remember
asciilifeform: or, so it was when these roads were built.
asciilifeform: hence - no sidewalk.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform important. the notion that all the lemmings drive... meh. not really so great.
asciilifeform: direct interplay with housing bezzle
asciilifeform: the general magic number '1 hour commute' defines where usaschwitz inmate can work
mircea_popescu: and yet argentina has the world's widest street.
xiando: could actually be true if the vehicle had a constant speed of 34 Kph (such likely)
asciilifeform: those who are willing to pay the 'auto tax' into housing bezzle and get a 2-3x costlier flat, can live in special reservations where driving is optional.
bounce: that thing stinks quite a bit.
asciilifeform: as orlov pointed out, the u.s. bezzle consists of an iron 'car, house, job' triangle.
asciilifeform: in other news, turd firmly wedged at block height 252450. ☟︎☟︎
thickasthieves: looks like craigslist already does this kinda http://boston.craigslist.org/sob/rnr/4723589172.html
assbot: Death Row Inmate Asks For A Child As His Last Meal, Texas DOC Plan To
thickasthieves: hehe
asciilifeform: if only.
asciilifeform: (texas abolished the tradition of last meal in 2011)
thickasthieves: adlai you watching this bfx action?
thickasthieves: !up adlai
adlai: oh thanks
adlai tries not to watch the markets when he's not actively tinkering with scalpl
thickasthieves: unusual stuff
adlai: these are some nice dumps though
thickasthieves: washing?
adlai: washing?
thickasthieves: selftrading
kakobrekla: what is this bfx action
thickasthieves: someone posting 1000btc bids, someone filling them all at once
thickasthieves: 4 times now
adlai: anything is possible when you have such a wild west of unregulation
thickasthieves: http://bfxdata.com/sentiment/longshort.php
assbot: Bitfinex Short vs Long Swaps
adlai: well, if you're waiting around to sell a slippy amount, and liquidity appears, you'll take that opportunity
kakobrekla: there is even less (leveraged?) bids on bfx than on stamp
kakobrekla: <adlai> anything is possible when you have such a wild west of unregulation < noone can claim to be bitcoin 'insider' . that doesnt hold true for regualted markets.
asciilifeform: attention turdmasters: http://pastebin.com/ZeZGyAty
assbot: bitcoind retardation - Pastebin.com
adlai: dunno, maybe if we regulated bitcoin a little better, then we'd have proper insiders n stuff
xiando watches bfx
ben_vulpes: forgive my valgrind/c naivte, but i'm assuming that indirectly lost refers to memory that cannot be freed?
asciilifeform: the other thing is, i'm fairly certain this is not the end of the story: ☟︎
asciilifeform: the idiot db 'caching' also pisses away ram
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: '"Indirectly lost". This covers cases 4 and 9 (for the BBB blocks) above. This means that the block is lost, not because there are no pointers to it, but rather because all the blocks that point to it are themselves lost. For example, if you have a binary tree and the root node is lost, all its children nodes will be indirectly lost. Because the problem will disappear if the definitely lost block tha
asciilifeform: t caused the indirect leak is fixed, Memcheck won't report such blocks individually by default.' << from manual
asciilifeform: http://valgrind.org/docs/manual/mc-manual.html
assbot: Valgrind
asciilifeform: ^ for n00bz
asciilifeform: does anyone know the cause of permanent blockchain wedging in 0.5.3 ?
asciilifeform: coughs up 'maptransactions prev not found' in log
los_pantalones: 11k on the bid @ bfx now
asciilifeform: copiously
los_pantalones: wonder if this is the short swap closing
xiando: This DrewB closing?
xiando: (guy who bragged about having a 8k short position at BFX)
nubbins`: http://bitcoinstats.com/irc/bitcoin-dev/logs/2012/02/14#l1329182475
assbot: BitcoinStats
nubbins`: asciilifeform ^
asciilifeform: saw this.
asciilifeform: did not see anything useful
ben_vulpes: gratzi asciilifeform
nubbins`: nope
nubbins`: couple lonely forum posts
nubbins`: one guy says it started happening when he reverted from 0.6rc1 to 0.5.2
asciilifeform: attn turdmasters: ☟︎
asciilifeform: presently i'm not getting the impression that anyone actually gives a sufficient fuck about this undertaking.
mod6: why?
asciilifeform: imho, the only way this will 'go anywhere' is either 1) mircea_popescu releases some 'declassified' portion of his in-house gadget, or 2) a free man takes up the torch of the turdlathe
asciilifeform: ultimately this is one of those things someone who gives enough of a damn - will have to pay for.
ben_vulpes: what?
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: you're moving at a pretty high velocity.
asciilifeform: !s asciilifeform day job
assbot: 17 results for 'asciilifeform day job' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=asciilifeform+day+job
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i've taken it far enough to demonstrate that a usable gadget will require actual work.
ben_vulpes: sure.
asciilifeform: and provided basic impetus for anyone who wishes, to take up the work
asciilifeform: who wishes, knows how, and has time...
asciilifeform: i can satisfy criterion 1 and 2.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes, as i gather, 1 and 3; mircea_popescu - 2 and 3.
asciilifeform: this thing needs 1+2+3.
asciilifeform: let the hero step up.
asciilifeform drives sword into stone.
nubbins` cheers
ben_vulpes: that story had a what - century long incubation period?
asciilifeform: nubbins`: cheer with coin.
nubbins` paws blindly for a donation address
asciilifeform: jurov ^
nubbins`: 1blablablalblbalbalba doesnt pass checksum
asciilifeform: i will provide a few tips to hero, gratis:
asciilifeform: 1) bdb and openssl deps have to die.
asciilifeform: 2) boost must also die, but this will require rewrite in totality
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28250 @ 0.00079937 = 22.5822 BTC [-] {2}
thickasthieves: xiando, yes it is DrewR, but it's more like 15k+ coins, and he took the walls down
asciilifeform: 3) gavin & the phoundation gang boobytrapped the blockchain in a number of ways that appear to interfere with reliable operation of classical nodes, these will have to be ferreted out
thickasthieves: he could just as easily post the walls as Asks too, using margin
asciilifeform: 4) everyone remember the thread where mircea_popescu explained why none of the people who, through necessity, arrived at a functional bitcoind workalike, have shared it.
asciilifeform: (functional in our sense, not merely in the technical sense of 'appearing to work')
xiando: thickasthieves: thing is, I don't believe him for a second http://awesomescreenshot.com/0253rbni51
assbot: TradingView: Free Stock Charts and Forex Charts Online. | Awesome Screenshot
xiando: thickasthieves: total of 18k short and we are to believe 16k is his, eh?
xiando: while total net shorts were reduced 2k during those 1k trades?
asciilifeform: 5) if you think you have 'bitcoin career' or whateverthefuck, derping around with financitrons of whatever variety, and at the same time you're at the mercy of phoundation's turds and whatever direction they'll take them in, you're the goose waiting for christmas dinner.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: the argument "no benefit, some risk"?
nubbins`: !s 2ef25247
assbot: 0 results for '2ef25247' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=2ef25247
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: not enough to be willing to go on the expedition. also need pitons, tents, dogs, pemmican.
BingoBoingo: http://qntra.net/2014/10/matonis-to-resign-from-vessenes-bitcoin-foundation/ << Fuck me, of course CoinDesk gets the exclusive and the foundation blog has nothing.
assbot: Matonis to Resign from Vessenes Bitcoin Foundation | Qntra.net
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: or, in this case, 1+2+3.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i'm referring to mp's reasoning as to why functional turdatrons are not published
thickasthieves: xiando his 16k were bids, and he mentioned he ha slike 6k in shorts, of course we've no reason to believe him
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: they aren't published for the mundane reason of 'i paid $maxint for skyscraper, why should others live in it for nothing'
asciilifeform: as well as comsec considerations.
asciilifeform: if proposed 'benefit' is contributions of 'fixes' from strangers, that's a joke right off the bat
xiando: oh sorry and thanks thickasthieves I only got that screenshot from some & not context
thickasthieves: someone needs to eat his lunch, i dont have that kinda swing though
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes, mod6, mircea_popescu, others: http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3217750625724755@naggum.net.html << basic intro to 'open source doesn't work.' --- 'we' have steaming heaps of shit instead of software because that's what 'we're' willing to pay for.
assbot: Re: realistic but short and simple LISP examples? - Naggum cll archive
ben_vulpes: i can pay only in time.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i confess i'm one of the sinful looking for a golden middle way
asciilifeform: don't get me wrong, if there liveth among us a hero who can piss out the required diamonds in his spare time, let him pull the sword out of the stone.
asciilifeform: but if it turns out that i am the only one here who even knows how to operate 'valgrind', 'gdb', etc. - you're SOL, fellas.
mircea_popescu: not what i mean tho. incidentally : that's rms gnu. he lies when he says that's foss. it's not. it's a particular attempt at a middle way, with him as the "modest" hero.
thickasthieves: asciilifeform, i heard TBF is looking for a new gavin
asciilifeform: thickasthieves: go sign up
thickasthieves: i'd probly do a better job
thickasthieves: and i dont even code
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves not under pressure.
asciilifeform: whatchawaitingfor then.
mircea_popescu: you're in the position of the wooden plank that's straighter than a bridge crossbeam. yes, now.
mircea_popescu: gavin did a pretty ok job in 2012, too.
thickasthieves: well i do have pm experience, itd be my only tool to tackle the job
mircea_popescu: then gunk starts piling up, and before you know it... you're praying nobody notioces.
thickasthieves: but i'm not interested anyway
mats_cd03: is there a linter for iptables?
los_pantalones: the short is payin up right now
los_pantalones: 335-340 trades couple thousand
mircea_popescu: mats_cd03 wut is that ? you mean like lint for iptables ?!
mats_cd03: i can't tell if we're on the same page. but yes.
mircea_popescu: as in "sanity check" ?
asciilifeform: to finish off my 'sword into the stone' speech - yes, i can do this. (turd lathe.) but - if i were to put in the time required, the hour would soon come that i could not pay electric bill. and then s.nsa, and turdatron, will have to summon the gnome rumplestilskin to work in my stead. while i boil in whatever pot in hell moiety and pankkake are cooking in.
mircea_popescu: csf has something iirc.
mircea_popescu: poor moiety ;/
thickasthieves: drewr is market buying now
thickasthieves: this dude is askin for it
mats_cd03: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 339.85, Best ask: 340.88, Bid-ask spread: 1.03000, Last trade: 340.88, 24 hour volume: 10786.32003782, 24 hour low: 332.99, 24 hour high: 343.45, 24 hour vwap: 337.615467196
thickasthieves: this is the tview chat btw https://www.tradingview.com/chat/#bitcoin
assbot: Chat - TradingView
thickasthieves: mp sometimes i wish you used your coins for evil
thickasthieves: like gobbling up whales
mircea_popescu: http://pastebin.com/ZeZGyAty << something tells me that's just the beginning
assbot: bitcoind retardation - Pastebin.com
mircea_popescu: thickasthieves evil is a concept ulterior to mp and whales.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: that something being me, further down in log?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ahaha word.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-10-2014#903759 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 30-10-2014 17:54:25; asciilifeform: the other thing is, i'm fairly certain this is not the end of the story:
thickasthieves: well subsititute evil for which ever word permits said action
mircea_popescu: 64,000 (112 direct, 63,888 indirect) bytes in 1 blocks are definitely lost in loss record 62 of 77 << this tho
mircea_popescu: how do you lose 64000 exactly ?
mircea_popescu: why, by having an idiotic allocation policy.
mircea_popescu: how much of a buggy half implementation of a garbage collector is there in bitcoind ?
mircea_popescu: anyway, those 12 errors look like 6-10 different holes.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's a cpp turd that also depends on similarly buggy cpp turds
asciilifeform: e.g. bdb
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: may as well ask that i build a new sarcophagus for chernoble in my amazing! copious! free time.
mircea_popescu: and make it snappy.
mircea_popescu: also, you can only use chocolate, provided it's ecologically sourced!
asciilifeform: fine soviet chocolate.
asciilifeform: (for n00bs to the subject, ussr never invented erzats chocolate, except towards the very end)
mircea_popescu: "that every man carries an endless, self-replenishing, delicious chocolate factory is simply a matter of perspective" ~ lenin.
asciilifeform: ahaha.
joecool: i figure i'll ask, any of you guys ever built gnupg2 into an initramfs? attempting to use a smartcard for luks
asciilifeform is not thrilled with the fact that poroshenko owns most of the remaining supply chain for proper 'soviet' chocolate, and the latter may soon be in short supply
joecool: hitting a wall with pinentry not drawing a pin dialog (using the curses form)... just bails out
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: does anyone know the cause of permanent blockchain wedging in 0.5.3 ? << i am pretty certain it's the bdb locks initialisation issue.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: those 12 errors look like 6-10 different holes << also please remember that there is no deterministic full-walk test for this turd orchestra.
bounce: what's special about soviet chocolate?
asciilifeform: bounce: everything.
mircea_popescu: bounce he's just in love with one version of "no artificial hydrogenated vegetable fat, not oversugared" chocolate, because grew up on it.
mircea_popescu: cuban chocolate is no different.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: bdb locks initialisation issue << my current study suggests malformed txes in the mempool also.
asciilifeform: cuban << by aging soviet-trained confectioners, aha
bounce: so... what is in there? cocoa powder, cocoa butter, some sugar?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform bdb needs a set_lk_max_locks directive to function properly with larger blocks.
mircea_popescu: by default a DB_CONFIG file in bitcoin root fixes the problem.
mircea_popescu: bounce temperature treated, yes. like saying "iron, some carbon, some molybdenum" = sword.
asciilifeform: db.cpp: dbenv.set_lk_max_locks(10000);
mircea_popescu: !up indiancandy1
indiancandy1: HI babies
mircea_popescu: hey there desi.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform moar like 500k.
indiancandy1: how is every1
mircea_popescu: i *think* the maximal lock count a block may possibly need is somewhere just south of 600k, but i don't have the shithandy.
mircea_popescu: indiancandy1 lovely! how's your film ?
asciilifeform rebuilt, grinding
indiancandy1: all is well darling
indiancandy1: im home
indiancandy1: chilling
indiancandy1: on bed]
mircea_popescu: indiancandy1 how do you call an indian in indian btw ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: rebuilt with 500,000, same shit.
mircea_popescu: hum.
mircea_popescu: which block is this ?
indiancandy1: what is a indian in indian
indiancandy1: dont make sense
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-10-2014#903730 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 30-10-2014 17:09:54; asciilifeform: in other news, turd firmly wedged at block height 252450. ☟︎
indiancandy1: ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
indiancandy1: i gotchu
indiancandy1: well
indiancandy1: depends right
mircea_popescu: yeah
indiancandy1: generally
indiancandy1: like punjabi is desi
indiancandy1: you can say apne
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yeah this is prior to that issue. hm.
mircea_popescu: indiancandy1 what's "apne", breathless ?
asciilifeform: lol!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform don't laugh, greeks conquered them too :D
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if you want polished turd, buy a girl who knows cpp, 'valgrind', gdb, understands memory discipline, can implement bdb replacement ab initio, knows ecdsa mechanics, etc, etc.
mircea_popescu: just for the lulz :
mircea_popescu: namespace Checkpoints {
mircea_popescu: 16
mircea_popescu: 17 // How many times we expect transactions after the last checkpoint to
mircea_popescu: 18 // be slower. This number is a compromise, as it can't be accurate for
mircea_popescu: 19 // every system. When reindexing from a fast disk with a slow CPU, it
mircea_popescu: 20 // can be up to 20, while when downloading from a slow network with a
mircea_popescu: 21 // fast multicore CPU, it won't be much higher than 1.
asciilifeform: ehehe.
mircea_popescu: static const double SIGCHECK_VERIFICATION_FACTOR = 5.0;
indiancandy1: it means
indiancandy1: indian
indiancandy1: kind of
mircea_popescu: / Guess how far we are in the verification process at the given block index
mircea_popescu: 39 double GuessVerificationProgress(CBlockIndex *pindex, bool fSigchecks) {
mircea_popescu: etc etc ETFC!
asciilifeform: turd on lathe requires liquid helium refrigerant to stay solid.
indiancandy1: mp wen u comin
asciilifeform: or it splatters instead of chipping
indiancandy1: 2 bombay
indiancandy1: 2 c me
asciilifeform: He costs around what good whiskey does.
mircea_popescu: indiancandy1 not in the next five years.
bounce: from a hero to a girl in a few short log lines
asciilifeform: bounce: mircea_popescu only buys gurlz
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform anyway, "we" have nfi why 252450 would hang.
ben_vulpes: more lulz
asciilifeform: 'hero' would be the fella who submits to carrying out this mission gratis, and can stay alive long enough to chop down a critical mass of foes.
ben_vulpes: // What makes a good checkpoint block?
ben_vulpes: // + Is surrounded by blocks with reasonable timestamps
ben_vulpes: // (no blocks before with a timestamp after, none after with
ben_vulpes: // timestamp before)
ben_vulpes: // + Contains no strange transactions
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes "old for the sake of old" right ?
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: no checkpoint there.
bounce would starve a bit too soon to take that up, ATM. otherwise have the time.
kakobrekla: i dont even: http://shrani.si/f/3X/cK/1oCpAEBj/spambitbetus.png
ben_vulpes: let's see how this collection plate goes, turdmeisters
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla i don't get it ?!
asciilifeform hardened skeptic
kakobrekla: idk, 1000 shares sounds a lot
mircea_popescu: so they are going to feed the afrreddit hordes if oyu give them moneyz ?
ben_vulpes: i for one expect nothing.
ben_vulpes: can't disappoint me.
asciilifeform: anything that won't buy a whole man, may as well be nothing.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes the charter is signed, right ?
ben_vulpes: therealbitcoin.org/charter.html
asciilifeform: perhaps nubbins` can have 'sword in stone' t-shirts printed.
ben_vulpes: verify for yourself.
mircea_popescu: punkman so nao i want to verify things, but i can't, because no bot and i dun recall what the website is ;/
undata: ben_vulpes: nice!
nubbins`: perhaps i'll put it on the cover
indiancandy1: whyyy
ben_vulpes: curl http://therealbitcoin.org/charter-B71EADAF.asc | gpg --verify
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes okay, jurov appointed ? address published ?
asciilifeform: lol, http://therealbitcoin.org/treasurer_contract.html signed with '1blablablalblbalbalba' ???
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: you'll note: not signed.
asciilifeform: aha dead links
mircea_popescu: lulzy tho lol.
ben_vulpes: it's making a point.
mircea_popescu: jurov lettuce get this show on the road shall we ?
asciilifeform: fellas, i know, i have sympathy, when i was a boy i wanted to buy an airplane for 100 rubles too.
asciilifeform: and was indignant 'why not!?'
ben_vulpes: undata: yes i'm just so pleased to bite off this chunk of responsibility for no remuneration
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform when I was a boy i actually bought an airplane (ride) for 100 bux.
asciilifeform: ride, aha.
mircea_popescu: military tupolev tho.
ben_vulpes: at least this time nobody's asking me what color my trabamborghini will be, or offering me worthless options.
undata: ben_vulpes: glory sometimes requires loss-leading
undata: :p
asciilifeform: heroes - straight to sword, stone.
mircea_popescu: this convo's enough to give naggum a second ulcer.
asciilifeform working on first ulcer
mircea_popescu: you're too healthy-looking for ulcers
asciilifeform will probably get there soonish
mircea_popescu: you'll get gallstones and arthritis.
asciilifeform: where is it written that a fat man can't get ulcer.
mircea_popescu: i didn't say fat!
asciilifeform: lol
asciilifeform: military tupolev << lol. my father rode in those for phree.
mircea_popescu: ;;google Tu-75
gribble: TU-46 | Game 2 Play Online - Silvergames.com: <http://www.silvergames.com/tu-46>; Tupolev Tu-75 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-75>; TU - 46 | Miscellaneous Games | Play Free Games Online at Armor ...: <http://armorgames.com/play/12702/tu-46>
mircea_popescu: that ?
ben_vulpes: glory? who cares for that.
asciilifeform: well, only catch, have to jump out.
undata: ben_vulpes: yes, acclaim among your peers never helps anything
undata readies a WoT rating
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the men called those, affectionately, 'тушка' (little sorry carcass)
mircea_popescu: lol
asciilifeform: well any tu.
mircea_popescu: you know they weren't THAT bad a design.
asciilifeform: who said bad design.
asciilifeform: just rough ride.
mircea_popescu: yeah well.
mircea_popescu: anyway, those were the days. gasoline + 5 man crew for a day, 100 bux.
mircea_popescu: well, half a day. but they didn't fly wortha shit at night anyway.
asciilifeform: su army was fixated on parachutism, famously, quite like us army is fixated on pilotless flying machines
mircea_popescu: cuz they somehow had bad experience with the german paratroopers
mircea_popescu: tho they were an utter and total waste of resources
mats_cd03: us army is still fixated on parachutism, for no really obviously good reason
mats_cd03: besides test of bravery.
mircea_popescu: fwiw, the current us doctrine of "don't put the most valuable part of the plane in the most fragile part of the plane" is sound.
asciilifeform: the driver?
mircea_popescu: ya
bounce: the infrastructure to make that happen isn't cheap and isn't that robust either
mats_cd03: although the 101 airborne was converted to an air mobility unit recently, so theres that.
mircea_popescu: if plane could fly w/o ground installations, captive pilot may make sense. as it is, pilot belongs with the airbase not with the plane.
asciilifeform: and anything other than a stone age opponent can blind the machine. or, if usa continues to insist on unsigned control signals, take it home.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so ? make moar.
mircea_popescu: the allies didn't win the war by making good tanks.
asciilifeform: make moar << works for su. for usa - no.
mats_cd03: arguably, the allies won the war because of excellent maps and radios
asciilifeform: in usa, 'make moar' would mean that someone has to actually think about cost.
mircea_popescu: gtfo, i hear they got 3d printing now and errything.
asciilifeform: ahaha.
mircea_popescu: m sorry
mircea_popescu: 3d printing TECHNOLOGY
bounce: patenting war to win the patent war
asciilifeform envisions patent lawyers dropped by parachute onto hapless infringers
undata: ben_vulpes: oh and protecting your own bitwealth; how bout that one?
undata selfishly wants the stripped down daemon for his own experiments
asciilifeform: undata: ru proverb: 'one [man] with a plow, seven with spoons.'
ben_vulpes: ripping usg crud out of the thing is a recipe to endanger any coins i'd have if i were not eating ramen so that the dog might eat
ben_vulpes: and girl
undata: ben_vulpes: at least the dog would kill a guy for you; my girlfriend's cats would just watch
asciilifeform misread as 'girlfriend cats'
mircea_popescu: <ben_vulpes> ripping usg crud out of the thing is a recipe to endanger any coins i'd have if i were not eating ramen so that the dog might eat << dude that's touching, srsly.
undata: asciilifeform: don't tell me how to live :D
mircea_popescu: !up indiancandy1
mircea_popescu: anyway, gotta go, bbl. don't eat each other ye hear!
mircea_popescu: buncha cultists.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: wherever you're going, check for cpp gurlz.
nubbins`: ya down with cpp, yeah you know me
asciilifeform: !s down with entropy
assbot: 2 results for 'down with entropy' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=down+with+entropy
undata: asciilifeform: is there a new client mailling list yet?
undata: *mailing
asciilifeform: undata: jurov had something quasi-working
undata: jurov: where to?
asciilifeform: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev
nubbins`: he's busy generating a treasury address by hand
asciilifeform: lolesury
ben_vulpes: http://therealbitcoin.org/mailman/listinfo/btc-dev
nubbins`: sweet
undata: ben_vulpes: wonderful; thanks!
ben_vulpes: why thread does not show the same as date and author is a mystery to me.
asciilifeform: because it's b0rken?
ben_vulpes: reasonable.
ben_vulpes: source of breakage, also a mystery.
nubbins`: ah! finally got chickensoupd build
nubbins`: *built
nubbins` toots own horn
asciilifeform: nubbins`: now you too can watch it wedge.
nubbins` claps
nubbins`: !s wedge
assbot: 29 results for 'wedge' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=wedge
nubbins`: 252450
ben_vulpes: the notes on bdb lock size are hilarious
ben_vulpes: "just try a bunch of different numbers until you find one that works"
kakobrekla: a good rng will aid the process.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37450 @ 0.00080264 = 30.0589 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: adlai: bounce: so you could theoretically "chemically print" the composition of any drink, medicine, poison, drug, explosive, etc << Very hard problem when you want to print anything protein
BingoBoingo: https://www.quantcast.com/qntra.net#!states << It's like a map of #b-a Usians
assbot: Qntra.net Traffic and Demographic Statistics by Quantcast
BingoBoingo: Except who the fuck is in New York?
undata: in my case this will be where my VM is
asciilifeform: who the fuck is in New York << afaik most of 'verizon' ends up 'new york'
asciilifeform: incl. my fiber
BingoBoingo: thickasthieves: pankkake says .9 is where it's at << My 0.8.x node I run is rather low on memory consumption, runs with full txindex
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: these die during initial blockchain pumping
asciilifeform: why am i even telling this, go run it
BingoBoingo: I know. New ones exchange dying for a crawl during initial indexing instead.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: also see today's log, for why this is probably a doomed march
BingoBoingo: I'm still catching up to there
asciilifeform: !s sword stone
assbot: 9 results for 'sword stone' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=sword+stone
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-10-2014#903782 and below. ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 30-10-2014 18:08:51; asciilifeform: attn turdmasters:
undata: asciilifeform: "this" being code review?
asciilifeform: undata: 'this' being the overall affair of transmuting the 0.5.3 turd into a usable weapon
undata: asciilifeform: perhaps the wealthier among us have reason to offer bounties
chetty: I would go after that sword if eulora wasn't in the way
asciilifeform: undata: afaik mircea_popescu doesn't actually need the weapon - already has own
BingoBoingo: Ah. asciilifeform So a solution is raising soldering irons to get weaponized bitcoind from pool ops
undata: asciilifeform: what's the point of not distributing it then?
undata: his
asciilifeform: undata: ask him - not me
undata: mircea_popescu: ^
asciilifeform: he made it clear that didn't want to, why pester the man
undata: because I have an unanswered question.
BingoBoingo: undata: What is the use of releasing the chamber curve diagrams of an effective nuke?
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-10-2014#893903 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 24-10-2014 20:24:45; mircea_popescu: maybe once it's over in the sense of, we're all drunk in the retirement home.
chetty: curiosity killed the cat
asciilifeform: perhaps his only runs on gurlz with arithmometers, how the fuck would i know
undata: it's a bit difficult to steer the direction of a decentralized network with no offering.
undata: BingoBoingo: justify the aptness of the metaphor first.
asciilifeform: i will answer the secret question which i can answer. 1) i personally can't pay rent with btc without giving up every other one to usg. 2) cost of extrication from gravity well is inconceivably high. 3) no one crowned me hero to begin with, why even ask.
undata: if there's an existing stripped down client the deturdification process is a waste of time
BingoBoingo: undata: Alright. Spz you're a Jew in olden times coming onto the battlefield with your nifty bronze sword. Now the Assyrians emerge from the horizon, but instead of bronze they have Iron!
undata: BingoBoingo: that metaphor has no resemblance to what does and does not benefit the functioning of a decentralized network
undata: I'm not going to bother.
asciilifeform: undata: http://explo.yt/post/2014/10/29/some-dangerous-idea << i just wanted a fcking book.
assbot: A dangerous idea - serialized delusions
asciilifeform: ^ jurov's chronicle
asciilifeform: but 1) i'm not interested in a book with gavin's excretions 2) not interested in a book describing system which does not work on battlefield.
undata: asciilifeform: yep I was around for that convo
asciilifeform: undata: so you know. boat - has no motor.
asciilifeform: no sails, no oars.
asciilifeform: just sorta, vaguely, floats.
undata: if only there were some way to organize the efforts of a large number of people around projects
undata: :p
undata: some kind of open process of producing source code
asciilifeform: undata: result - gavin.
asciilifeform: openssl.
asciilifeform: enjoy
undata: asciilifeform: see: libressl
asciilifeform: turd sans scatole is still turd.
undata: everything is shit but the speaker
asciilifeform: hero? straight to sword.
undata: reasoning by metaphor has its strengths and weaknesses
asciilifeform: i would love to see it proven that what i've said is a load o'shit.
undata: receiving money isn't the only way to invest in your own goals
undata: I need a programmable, robust client for my own applications
asciilifeform: the idependantly wealthy - straight to sword.
BingoBoingo: undata: Well, avoiding starvation and the sword are obstacles on the road to goals.
undata: oh please
undata: you don't have 5 hours a week?
undata: I do.
asciilifeform: I need a << i need an airplane
undata: there's an absurd orthodoxy around here
BingoBoingo: What absurd orthodoxy?
asciilifeform: undata: the orthodoxy wants to be proven wrong. don't wait! fire.
undata: there's ample evidence in the market that one can reduce cost and increase quality by open sourcing the things not directly in your moneymaking pipeline
undata: I'm not going to argue the merits of open source
undata: you people are all on linux or bsd
asciilifeform: undata: this is how we got the extant bitcoind. if you like it - you know where to find it
BingoBoingo wonders about serious matters such as will Cardano prototype factory make the eventual loper prototype
ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> why am i even telling this, go run it << sir you are a gift to the logs
undata: asciilifeform: that is a problem of the artists and not painting
asciilifeform: undata: yes, we know the ru/jewish saying 'the bad dancer is hindered only by his arse.' this should be seen as an invitation to the good dancers.
undata: asciilifeform: where's the source
undata: stock 0.5.3 still?
BingoBoingo: <undata> asciilifeform: that is a problem of the artists and not painting << No, this is a problem of no one fucking reading and the world burning because the entire stacks sucks because unread. Worked until it didn't
asciilifeform: 'плохому танцору яйца мешают'
undata: BingoBoingo: lets do nothing then
undata: life is too challenging
BingoBoingo: undata: No, you do things. You just have to understand the obstacles as you make your cue.
asciilifeform: undata: http://therealbitcoin.org contains origin tree. 'chicken' lists the remaining files after first trim. rm_... is ben_vulpes's patch;
undata: how was the 0.5.3 choice made?
undata: reasoning by metaphor or an actual assessment?
asciilifeform: undata: read log
undata: I was here.
undata: I want your opinion.
asciilifeform: undata: earliest (lightest-weight, least lines of gavin) version that is known to be compatible with the extant net.
undata: there are myriad bugfixes that will need to be backported
asciilifeform: undata: yes.
asciilifeform: loper-os.org/pub/bitcoin-asciilifeform.2-https_snipsnip.tar.gz , http://www.loper-os.org/pub/bitcoin-asciilifeform.3-turdmeister-alert-snip.tar.gz , http://loper-os.org/pub/bitcoin-asciilifeform.4-goodbye-win32.tar.gz
asciilifeform: ^ other patches thus far
asciilifeform: signed by yours truly
asciilifeform: no one, yet, saw it fit to comment at length on them
ben_vulpes: hashtag asciilifeform patch collection
ben_vulpes: hashtag asciilifeform patch collection october
ben_vulpes: sweet. i can now custom index logs.
undata: I didn't initiate this thing; ben_vulpes do you have a desired process?
ben_vulpes: grab those patches, review, add sig if you want to put your ass on the line.
ben_vulpes: preferrably, build.
BingoBoingo wonders if there is anyone with more projects on their public plate than alf...
undata: what are the standards for "this goes"
asciilifeform: undata: i sorta initiated this thing, by pure accident.
asciilifeform: undata: but i have very little to do with it otherwise...
ben_vulpes: undata: we're currently blocked on a mailing list thinger that may or may not see the light of day anytime soon
ben_vulpes: i halfway think the gpg signature turdatron blocking merges and discussion needs to be nuked and implemented by some eager beaver later
undata: ben_vulpes: I'll just start a local git repo with stock 0.5.3, add your existing patches, and look into backporting a fix
asciilifeform: undata: standards << ben_vulpes and mod6 started, at instigation of mircea_popescu, a 'foundation', where somebody (them?) will sit as mergemaster
undata: process to submit is patch with signature?
asciilifeform: and decide what stays, what goes
asciilifeform: submit patch with signature, yes
asciilifeform: if you approve of another fellow's patch after honest study of it - you sign it as well
undata: alright. I'll take a look at it saturday.
ben_vulpes: if i don't have a thing going on on saturday we could even go so far as to pair
undata: ben_vulpes: k
asciilifeform: pair?
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: share physical space, look at code as a...
asciilifeform: aha you're neighbours?
ben_vulpes: aye
ben_vulpes: dark mirror images of each other in some aspects
ben_vulpes: he - software as a service
ben_vulpes: i - software services
undata: different enough to be enjoyable
undata: this sounds fun
ben_vulpes: both starving big zone kulaks
BingoBoingo: lies ben_vulpes, you do service as a software
undata: ha not bad ^
ben_vulpes: am software
ben_vulpes: will serve
asciilifeform: in my patches, thus far, nothing truly earth-shaking, just a surgical removal of what i consider clearly poisonous
undata: roughly... flamethrower, bandaids, minimal socket API?
asciilifeform: didn't even touch api
asciilifeform: that requires actual replacement
undata: that can be a later discussion
asciilifeform: or you have a machine with no steering wheel
undata: but poking the thing is desirable
asciilifeform: me - i don't want jsonism in my book.
undata: asciilifeform: hear hear
asciilifeform: my next patch was going to be a removal of the magic strings (seed ip table, etc) and replacement with ascii configs, as suggested by mircea_popescu.
asciilifeform: but now i don't see this thing as going anywhere
undata: asciilifeform: oh come on, at least give it *two* weeks before utter failure
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform issues challenge now.
undata: :)
ben_vulpes: classic russian fatalism
asciilifeform: the bare naked minimum worthy of nubbins` book, is a gadget that functions, reliably, on current network
asciilifeform: with no weird 'now please delete blkindex' crud
asciilifeform: and no runaway memleaks
asciilifeform: the more gavin removal, likewise, the better
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform wants valground turd and...what is this 'delete blkindex'?
asciilifeform: ^ someone suggested this as a 'fix' for wedged blockchain load
asciilifeform: this is not tolerable.
ben_vulpes: what about bdb lock config?
asciilifeform: had no effect.
asciilifeform: why take my word for it - try it.
asciilifeform: do i need to explain why i asked for the book?
asciilifeform: or is it obvious to alert reader.
undata: asciilifeform: books fit in brains?
asciilifeform: not magically, no
undata: good outer bound though.
thickasthieves: so he can go to forest and see if it's broken
asciilifeform: so, in peacetime, if i live that long, i can take it to forest and write a 'popescuan' replacement.
asciilifeform: or if not i - one of you.
mats_cd03: such drama.
asciilifeform: right now we can't even make drama, the actors are drunk and spewing over the stage
mats_cd03: asciilifeform fears for his life, but won't flee to save it.
asciilifeform spews
mats_cd03: what is this.
undata: disagreement is good for you
asciilifeform: flee - need diamonds for schindler's train.
mats_cd03: a game of catching the falling knife?
undata: someone should write a book of #ba metaphors
undata: speaking of books.
ben_vulpes: ;;google trilema variety speak
gribble: You're gonna have to learn that variety speak pe Trilema - Un blog ...: <http://trilema.com/2013/youre-gonna-have-to-learn-that-variety-speak/>; #bitcoin-assets +m pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2014/bitcoin-assets-m/>; Pro idiotas, which obviously means, people who have ... - Trilema: <http://trilema.com/2014/pro-idiotas-which-obviously-means-people- (1 more message)
thickasthieves: undata this is sorta started in the b-a wiki, which anyone with voice can add to probly
asciilifeform: the mostly-empty wiki?
thickasthieves: maybe the foundation should take it over
ben_vulpes: nope
thickasthieves: hehe
ben_vulpes: get outta heah!
undata: I'll just grind out code and leave the speak to the pros
asciilifeform: undata: might want to investigate why the original does not, in fact, work.
asciilifeform: before adding code.
undata: asciilifeform: exercise to reader eh?
asciilifeform: (rampant memory leakage is not 'works')
undata: the grinding out code was a general statement of what I value
undata: talk is not a product
asciilifeform: straight to sword then.
undata cuts the knot in half
undata: asciilifeform: were we not talking about the kelvin way of versioning code?
undata: the same value applies to communication.
undata: I can send you a disassembled rube goldberg machine every time I open my mouth
undata: and we can get nowhere
undata: or we can get to the point and get something done
ben_vulpes: have at, undata
BingoBoingo: !up chrysalus
BingoBoingo: !up PeterL
BingoBoingo: !up Squidward
Squidward: im squidward
BingoBoingo: WTF does that mean?
BingoBoingo: !down Squidward
cazalla: BingoBoingo, it's up now https://bitcoinfoundation.org/2014/10/the-next-chapter/
assbot: The Next Chapter | The Bitcoin Foundation
nubbins`: lel
ben_vulpes: glhf
PeterL: question: my scoopbot dumps links from posts into the chan, should I ask to have assbot ignore it or provide the title of each link?
BingoBoingo: Fucking white people http://valleywag.gawker.com/heres-what-the-mission-riots-looked-like-after-the-gian-1652846299/+tcraggs22
assbot: Here's What the Mission Riots Looked Like After the Giants' Victory
bounce: so, the guy that's going to actively support unleashing lots of onerous gov't regulation on this bitcoin thing is now executive director of the bitcoin foundation
bounce: did I get that about right?
BingoBoingo: bounce: Well, executive director of the CoinLab Foundation for the promotion of scams and Redditurds
undata: "Fuck techies" << to the ovens with you
BingoBoingo: !up scoopbot
thestringpuller: reddit is full with turds
gernika: undata to the ovens with techies?
undata: incorrect
undata: ben_vulpes: where is db_cxx.h on OS X?
ben_vulpes: os x what now?
ben_vulpes: the -assets build is realnix only
undata: ben_vulpes: statement behind the question is 95% of this build crap can go
undata: if that's so
undata: stating the obvious
ben_vulpes: take a look at the first patch on therealbitcoin.org
ben_vulpes: that has a manifest you'll find useful.
cazalla: my god this hag of a wife, god must be punishing by introducing her to me before bitcoin
mats_cd03: :(
ben_vulpes: lol popped one out and became intolerable?
cazalla: you got it ben_vulpes
asciilifeform: os x << lol
BingoBoingo: This is more interesting with the other side's context http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_world_/2014/10/30/why_do_russian_jets_keep_buzzing_european_countries.html
chetty: Are they using 'wish' maps maybe?
undata: ben_vulpes: k so that linux-mingw makefile as starting point?
undata: that and unix survived. I was using the unix one
PeterL: !up scoobot
undata: bleh nvm, mingw is that gnu windows thing
undata: shouldn't that die too?
bounce: do you have berkeleydb installed and are you using gmake?
bounce: though might not need the latter, dunno.
undata: I do; gentoo's just got it in /usr/include/db4.8
bounce: thought you were doing an os x build
undata: bounce: neg, was not led by the patch name "chicken" to believe that that one cleaned up the project
undata: so I was deleting things
nubbins`: <undata> ben_vulpes: where is db_cxx.h on OS X? <<< brew install berkeley-db4
nubbins`: mine's in /usr/local/Cellar/berkeley-db4/4.8.30/include/
undata: nubbins`: what I meant to be asking is whether gentoo was weird by putting it in /usr/include/db4.8
undata: gentoo has this "slots" mechanism for having multiple versions of libraries
nubbins`: beats me. i've got a debian install here, it's in /usr/include
undata: that answers that, ty
PeterL: !up scoopbot
BingoBoingo: Os X is the weird one
BingoBoingo: It always is
BingoBoingo: U can't measure apple color with tools, because Apple is beyond measuring with tools http://arstechnica.com/apple/2014/10/why-is-the-new-imac-5k-instead-of-4k-its-all-about-the-video-baby/
assbot: Why is the new iMac 5K instead of 4K? It’s all about the video, baby | Ars Technica
undata: asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: muchas gracias; patched and built
ben_vulpes: holy f
ben_vulpes: client signed a no-deliverable, best effort contract with us and then made promises to their client executives.
PeterL: why would they do that?
ben_vulpes: maybe the next time i actually laugh at a scope/timeline combination in a meeting and the potential client still falls all over themselves to sign our no deliverable, best effort contract my internal warning flags should go up
PeterL: what is a "no deliverable best effort contract"?
ben_vulpes: hours only
undata: "look, your cat is likely to die during this life-saving procedure. sign here." ?
ben_vulpes: "we understand that you want these things. we will work on them in the agreed upon and prioritized order. you authorize unlimited budget in hopes that we can get it all done."
undata: ah
PeterL: so if you never get the first thing on the list done, then what happens?
PeterL: who do I talk to to not have to !up scoopbot?
BingoBoingo: PeterL: kakobrekla
jurov: !up dignork
BingoBoingo: Oh, there's a coup in Burkina Faso
jurov: dignork: you second message got discarded
jurov: *your
jurov: not able to debug it right now (imbibed stuff)
jurov: will let you know lateer what was he problem
jurov: ;;gettrust assbot dignork
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user dignork: Level 1: 1, Level 2: 4 via 4 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=dignork | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=dignork | Rated since: Fri Oct 18 12:20:18 2013
xanthyos: hi
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Thank you for pointing me to the Folksom book. The practice drills are the best.
BingoBoingo: !up The20YearIRCloud
The20YearIRCloud: Hi?
BingoBoingo: Hi
The20YearIRCloud: On cell, just got on to check messages. You need anything?
BingoBoingo: No, just saw you pop in.
BingoBoingo: !up twistedether
BingoBoingo: !up buytoshi
BingoBoingo: !up yoloshill
BingoBoingo: Journalism problems
BingoBoingo: https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014/10/30/inside-story-matt-taibbis-departure-first-look-media/
assbot: The Inside Story Of Matt Taibbi's Departure From First Look Media - The Intercept
undata: "What they found instead was a confounding array of rules, structures, and systems imposed by Omidyar and other First Look managers on matters both trivial—which computer program to use to internally communicate, mandatory regular company-wide meetings, mandated use of a “responsibility assignment matrix” called a “RASCI,” popular in business-school circles for managing projects—as well as
undata: more substantive issues." << bunch of crying
jurov: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.encryption.general/12588/ << i'd like to have turdatron ready for the anniversary, but it's unlikely
assbot: Gmane -- Bitcoin P2P e cash paper
BingoBoingo: See, my reading of the story is that the Silicon Valley management style is even more broken than typical 'Murican MBA bullshit.
undata: BingoBoingo: articles like this are hard; they're trying to integrate two sides of a debate, where likely neither party is being fair
undata: as for corporate organization, *some* mechanism for order is needed
undata: how else are you supposed to coordinate?
BingoBoingo: undata: Well, key part of getting to why it wants to be read one way is evaluating... What platform it lives on.
ben_vulpes: ;;later tell PeterL first, second, third, umpteenth will get done. arbitrary items from bottom of list by time not communicated to dev team?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
undata: BingoBoingo: yes of course
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: wherever you're going, check for cpp gurlz. << none!
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: a good rng will aid the process. << srsly, how do you keep this dry ?
mircea_popescu: 1 minute kakonizing > 1 hour martinizing
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: https://www.quantcast.com/qntra.net#!states << It's like a map of #b-a Usians << i thought everyone was from portland and atlanta.
assbot: Qntra.net Traffic and Demographic Statistics by Quantcast
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: No, I'm in one of the green ones in the middle
BingoBoingo: At least I thought I was.
mircea_popescu: shit traffic dropped yest
mircea_popescu: gotta fire someone.
BingoBoingo: What? Yesterday was up.
mircea_popescu: well yesterday we shoulda hired someone.
bounce: buncha slackers
mircea_popescu: i wonder how would a site worked on that principle go. "ever day traffic is up, hire someone ; every day traffic is down, fire someone"
mircea_popescu: sorta like ford only faster.
mircea_popescu: undata: mircea_popescu: ^ << nothing was said publicly on this topic.
BingoBoingo: I think that's how you make an Edsel
mircea_popescu: undata: if there's an existing stripped down client the deturdification process is a waste of time <<< what are you, new ?
BingoBoingo: Apparently ben fox has a neighbor
mircea_popescu: undata: if only there were some way to organize the efforts of a large number of people around projects <<< there is. you're watching it. just because leadership is not in your face doesn't necessarily mean leadership is absent and it's your time to shine. it may also mean leadership is extremely good at what it does. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: who's ben fox ?
BingoBoingo: Vulpes
mircea_popescu: oh oh wow missed that one.
mircea_popescu: maybe it's the hottie gf of his wife ?
BingoBoingo: I thought this is why alf patch series was named chicken
mircea_popescu: lol!
mircea_popescu: dude incredible how much subtext i miss. and i do read the logs!
BingoBoingo: I know
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo i don't remember, is edsel a car or a bad cheesecake brand ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Twas a Ford spinoff, focused on "affordable" cars
mircea_popescu: my facetious question ;/
mircea_popescu: hm, i like girls that wash ashtrays. i don't mean empty them in the trash, i mean actually wash the damned things.
dignork: jurov: I've figured webmail got my signed message scrambled with html?
bounce likes an absence of smoking and ashtrays better