log☇︎
72900+ entries in 0.016s
asciilifeform: afaik this cannot be done without a physical barrel shifter of the given bitness. ☟︎
asciilifeform: incidentally if apeloyee or anybody else knows how to make a 1..ffabitness shifter that doesn't leak the shift amount, on ordinary pc, plz post.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: barrett's idea, notmine
asciilifeform: if that's barrett, it'll be barrett. if it's knuthian, will be knuthian. if newtonian -- newtonian. in no case it will be montgomery, say, or any other non-universal one.
asciilifeform: apeloyee: i want the fastest possible universal reduction that works in fixed spacetime and provably so
asciilifeform: ( and when we do rsa, can store the reciprocal in the key, there's no particular reason to compute it every time )
asciilifeform: the cost of 1 knuthian div is negligible
asciilifeform: still 1 knuthian div, vs the 8192 i have now (in the example)
asciilifeform: ah yeah per modulus
asciilifeform: ( when ffa width is determined )
asciilifeform: and it happens once per program boot
asciilifeform: that's an ordinary knuthian div
asciilifeform: because as far as i can see, it has all of the same problems, but more so
asciilifeform: apeloyee: what do you see as its advantage, vs barrett ?
asciilifeform: apeloyee: yes because for guarantee of convergence you need MASSIVE ( afaik, at least 4x the ffawidth ) bitness
asciilifeform: they depend strictly on which op ( which is not secret ) and the ffawidth ( also not secret )
asciilifeform: in any ffa routine
asciilifeform: apeloyee: shift amounts are not secret
asciilifeform: ty apeloyee , i will read .
asciilifeform: of given bitness
asciilifeform: apeloyee: my principal problem with barrett is that i don't have a proof that it works with 3 or fewer corrective-subtractions for ALL possible a,b,m in a*b mod m
asciilifeform: apeloyee: please elaborate
asciilifeform: apeloyee: ...hello?
asciilifeform: trinque: neato
asciilifeform: !!up apeloyee
asciilifeform: aite
asciilifeform: from thread some month ago
asciilifeform: hey trinque didja ever have time and write that piece re 'sane http replacement' ?
asciilifeform: just don't be surprised when nobody else wants to.
asciilifeform: go ahead an' bolt whatever you like to ~your~ kalash, hey.
asciilifeform: wtf is even the point of talking about primes if you ALWAYS gotta say 'but not 1'
asciilifeform: why not ignore by '1 ain't a prime', lol
asciilifeform: how about the 'every int has unique prime factorization' item ? ☟︎
asciilifeform: ahahahahaha
asciilifeform: and this is only the beginning of the ugh
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if 1 gets to be a prime, you then throw out the conventional def of prime, because now you have a prime that divides other primes unequal to itself
asciilifeform: ( really a lengthy .txt , but can be formatted however wanted )
asciilifeform: well naturally whole thing is to be an article.
asciilifeform: will be interesting if any reply, considering how the thing obsoletes half the idiocy they currently print
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i've been thinking about sending ffa , when finished, as an article into the saecular derps' 'cryptology journals', strictly for the lulz of getting their reject barf , and then posting, a la al schwartz
asciilifeform: but he dun have as many theorems.
asciilifeform: he is.
asciilifeform: so i know of it.
asciilifeform: asciilifeform's brother played it tho.
asciilifeform: it does
asciilifeform has not
asciilifeform: ( famously, kennedy bought entire railroad car right before signing the ban )
asciilifeform: for some reason i thought there were no ( at least Officially ) cuban cigars in usa
asciilifeform: aluminum thing
asciilifeform: yea it is EXACTLY that shape
asciilifeform believes
asciilifeform: but if thing tasted as good as the tube smelled!
asciilifeform: oh it was empty tube
asciilifeform: 20 yrs ago it still had the smell. ( not today )
asciilifeform: inherited from grandfather's 'weird shit from foreign lands' box
asciilifeform: hilariously, asciilifeform has a 'romeo&juliet' cigar tube from 1970s
asciilifeform: 2 ain't a real prime!1111!wasjustputtherebythegodstofuckus
asciilifeform: excluding 2
asciilifeform: it ain't as if you're ever getting a prime from prime+prime, tho
asciilifeform: folx with 'infinite' resources, turns out, can't afford some very basic things.
asciilifeform: >> http://btcbase.org/log/2017-02-19#1615434 << oblig ☝︎
asciilifeform: it's a triviality: if you have 1 , you can make the other out of it with ~no effort
asciilifeform: ( where 'good' is 'proof of difficulty of randomly-generated case is possible' )
asciilifeform: incidentally iirc we did the proof of 'if there is a good hash, there is a good blockcipher, and vice-versa' ☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: i won't say yet which it is
asciilifeform: there's usefulbreak and gutsalloverthefloor break
asciilifeform: commutes yea
asciilifeform: does it even work in a ring
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: lookx to me like your addition dun commute ( or associate... ) ☟︎
asciilifeform: i'd prefer a macroscale numbertheoretical hash, even one that explicitly stands on strength of, e.g., rsa, to the currently extant soup.
asciilifeform: then it'll be a table
asciilifeform: and incidentally i dun have a nonleaking miller-rabin yet, need nonleaking gcd ( have on paper, but not in ffa yet ) ☟︎
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: anything involving 'isprime()' during everyday life is either a table lookup (leaks!) or miller-rabin (slow as fuck, temptation to cut iterations and introduce eggog)
asciilifeform: depends 'better' for whom.
asciilifeform: and imho there is a serious problem with 'not ARX' in linked piece : omitting additions makes the hash ~considerably~ nsa-friendlier : it is easier to implement xor/and/not/shift on, e.g., optical computer, when you don't need addition (and ergo carries)
asciilifeform: ( plenty of known basis for ~weaknesses~ of various . the absence of which, in any particular case, has NO bearing on above. )
asciilifeform: TomServo: there is no scientific basis for the strength of ANY published hash algo whatsoever.
asciilifeform: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/s0ZSW/?raw=true << plain txt
asciilifeform: !!up TomServo
asciilifeform: bonus lul: https://archive.is/tK1o1 << list of public catastrophic bugs in bigint libs . bonus-2 : compiled by the perpetrators of mit's attempt at faux-ffa ( won't link separately, it's a megalith of mechanical 'proof' crapolade )
asciilifeform: ( why not 50%? exercise ! )
asciilifeform: ( ...handwaves!1!11!... ) this sums to a potential 25% saving of clock , if finessed.
asciilifeform: there are a total of Bitness * DividendWordness cycles , in this example 64*128 == 8192
asciilifeform: it isn't actually necessary to touch the entire R for the first Bitness*(RemainderWordness-1) (on 64-bit box, and for the 4096b example, that's 64*63 == 4032 ) shots of the inner loop !
asciilifeform: ( hint re FZ_Mod : notice that the first Bitness shift-lefts are really single-word; and same is true of the subtraction, and of the mux; the next Bitness ditto and ditto -- are really 2-word ops; and so on. )
asciilifeform: i ain't linking to pediwikian bowdlerizations , and there is no other source afaik .
asciilifeform: barrett reduction >> http://www.loper-os.org/pub/barrett_1986.pdf << 1333337 w4r3z . yes, pdf, it's the original 1986 article, scan.
asciilifeform: ( the 'corrector' at the end of barrett will have to go through a mux, and fire a fixed # of times, and gotta prove that this-many and no-greater suffices. )
asciilifeform: but i will need an ironclad proof that it worx for ALL possible inputs.
asciilifeform: with barrett, modexp should go back to below-1sec @ 4096b .
asciilifeform: ultimately it would make sense to use barrett reduction but currently i am not satisfied with the proof that it converges ( for some reason, every statement of this proof that i could find, seems to exclude reduction by powers of 2, and i do not yet understand why )
asciilifeform: all of this - naturally - remains properly constantspacetime and unrollable.
asciilifeform: alert reader will also notice that FZ_Mod is now ok with half-width divisors, eliminating the copying in FZ_Mod_Mul and FZ_Mod_Square .
asciilifeform: ^ no barrett yet. and there is still room for polish in barrettless variant, there is still a great deal of avoidable shifting and subtraction of guaranteed-empty words in FZ_Mod ( exercise for alert reader, to see where ! )
asciilifeform: in other noose, ACHTUNG, panzers, http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/BAjEK/?raw=true << 27.2 sec (4096b modexp) ☟︎
asciilifeform bbl, meat
asciilifeform: in other noose, asciilifeform found that 1) knuthian division can be sped up by ANOTHER factor of 2, by walking the bits of the quotient instead of shifting'em 2) barrett reduction in constant time is almost certainly possible ☟︎
asciilifeform: in this sense 'everything exists' in elvish.
asciilifeform: google trans or similar with a small bit of manual delousing (or perhaps not even)
asciilifeform: it's rubbish