▁▁▁▁▁⏐︎▁ 6803
asciilifeform: in other noose, a geiger ( sbm-20 tube: sov., circa early 1980s ) tied to a 500g plastic bottle of KCl registers 0.18uSv/hr (incl. room background: 0.07 uSv/hr.)
asciilifeform: 99.99% (supposedly) synthesis-grade kcl.
mircea_popescu: so about 0.1 huh
asciilifeform: this is just the gamma tho
asciilifeform: ( kcl puts out a very scarce gamma per however many betas )
asciilifeform: very soon i will have with what to pick up the beta.
asciilifeform: ( current idea being, ZnS+optical-grade-epoxy paste spread on PIN diode. )
mircea_popescu: could work.
asciilifeform: btw very same geiger parked on top of common american smoke detector (unmodified!) (am-241) -- 0.54uSv/h
mircea_popescu: they still sell those ?
asciilifeform: no idea
asciilifeform: house came with a pile of'em (mandatory!)
mircea_popescu has never lived in a place with smoke detectors. is a good life.
asciilifeform: not to be confused with 'sprinklers'
mircea_popescu: o, those either. fucking hell.
mod6: wait, are you building your own geiger alf?
mircea_popescu: nah he has legacy
asciilifeform: mod6: i have a bog-standard geiger here in toolbox
mod6: ah, ok.
mod6: and KCl =~ Potassium Chloride?
mircea_popescu: they're hard to calibrate in kitchen
mircea_popescu: yes.
asciilifeform: mod6: but contemplated experiment (see kcl thread ) is re something else
mircea_popescu: it's a wonder they sell that, btw, considering how easy it is to kill someone with it.
asciilifeform: mod6: the idea of 'ideal rngistor', self-contained diode+isotope, but also in such a way that $isotope is something that is sold worldwide and passes unmolested through the post etc.
mod6: ah, sure.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: with kcl ?! you'd have to stab somebody with it neh
mircea_popescu: yeah, inject 10ml isotone, watch the heart failure.
asciilifeform: 10ml of air also kills
mircea_popescu: not even detectable unless someone's looking specifically.
mod6: yeah, dont they use that stuff for leathal injections?
asciilifeform: aha
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: believe or not, americans ~eat~ it
asciilifeform: ( supposed to be a 'diet replacement for salt' or sumthing )
mircea_popescu: hey, americans eat ~everything.
ben_vulpes: in the brief quiet, a surprising cover: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyRm5kc9ZUY
asciilifeform: meanwhile, from the dept. of liquishit, https://archive.is/zxmZA
asciilifeform: re usg.'journalists' 'helping' snowdens, e.g., 'If you want to set up a secure way to communicate (which I think every journalist should) the best method is IM with an OTR encryption. You’ll need: a Jabber account, Pidgin IM client, and OTR plug-in.'
asciilifeform: ^ for some reason, fresh batch.
mircea_popescu: kik
asciilifeform: ( get this -- pidgin. the thing with new 0day every 2 wks or so )
ben_vulpes: 4 mentions of pgp
mircea_popescu: "otr" is not very specific either.
mircea_popescu: anyway. im terrible idea for SECURE comms. because you leak time if nothing else.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 9/10 it means the lolcow 'libotr'
mircea_popescu: if you want to communicate securely, reg your key and pastebin encrypted stuff.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform even if it did, the way in which it is ductaped to the whole shebang is more important in the end.
asciilifeform: it gets better,
asciilifeform: 'From the start, he said, their communication was flawed. Snowden had initially forgotten to provide his own PGP key, which meant that Micah’s reply couldn’t be encrypted. “Everything wasn’t perfect,” Micah said, recalling such missteps. “But there was no red flag, and I’ve gotten lots of emails from random anonymous people. I did pretty well, considering that I had no idea what the hell was going on. I kept switching a
asciilifeform: nonymous identities. When I first talked to him, I made a new anonymous identity, and then when he got to Hong Kong, I switched. And when he left Hong Kong, I switched again.”'
asciilifeform: get this, 'anonymous identities'.
mircea_popescu: she's clueless, trying to say pseudonymous
asciilifeform: nope, probably meant exactly this. 'anonymous' (in the sense of, no fixed rsa pub.)
mod6: hello, this is dog!
asciilifeform: 'hi, it's still me, here's my new key, now let's talk'--anonderp4398598395
mod6: just install jabber and talk to the dog, w00f!
mircea_popescu: meanwhile at "what she should have been doing instead" ranch, http://68.media.tumblr.com/5bc80fc98bc47de87a0575b1a322db71/tumblr_o3hvmtIMT91uxdiqco1_1280.jpg
ben_vulpes: nice rug
mod6: haha
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes old country stuff.
ben_vulpes: i grew up on prayer rugs quite like it
ben_vulpes: older, rougher
ben_vulpes: eventually parents bought shiny new
ben_vulpes: palpable difference between that which came from grandpa's estate and the fresh purchases.
asciilifeform: in classical su rug like this is 1) on floor 2) on wall (usually next to bed) ☟︎
asciilifeform: 'Once the ladder ended, it was easy to climb from branch to branch up to where the material was located. A bird had built a nest on top of the sealed container. Happily, the nest was empty: breeding season had passed. We opened the container. The item was inside. We remained in the tree for a while....'
asciilifeform pictures nsa goons with NJDs combing the woods
asciilifeform: ( http://trilema.com/2013/and-then-i-said-to-him-jimmy << oblig!! )
mircea_popescu: lel
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in "cheap and effective pet carrier" news, http://68.media.tumblr.com/6edd44baf2da5f6359ceb6379eef268f/tumblr_o3qp6oxFhq1tvpchzo1_1280.jpg
asciilifeform: lol!
asciilifeform immediately thought 'vectored shit?!'
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2017/hiking-inc/ << Trilema - Hiking, Inc.
asciilifeform: police radio : '...no one was in danger. and the caller was anonymous.'
mod6: no mosquitos!?
mod6: im in the wrong locale.
mod6: i just killed the first ones of the year, last weekend. which is pretty insane for Minnesota to have mosquitos /already/.
mod6: I had my revenge though.
mod6: It snowed on very early Tuesday morning and killed the SOBs.
mod6: muhahaha
mircea_popescu: i haven't yet seen one. or i think i might've seen one, that may also have been a misidentified wasp
mircea_popescu: the variety of wasps they have here is staggering. i got TWO kinds nesting, one's a perfectly harmless paper wasp, they eat the polen off a vine growing ion the fence. the other's a mud hut building guy, i think he eats spiders. then a third really fearsome type showed up evidently praying on the first type... then later a fourth super tiny kind was discovered when one fell in my drink....
asciilifeform: cop 'a': 'your caller is janet. she wants to discuss... strange things with you. she says she saw strobe lights in her neighbour's house, and that he is communicating with her via... electromagnetic fields.' cop 'b' : 'yes i'm familiar with her'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform a good half of police work in all times, interfacing with bored / insane middle aged women.
asciilifeform: i'd naively imagine they would 'excommunicate' these
mircea_popescu: in functioning state entirely not up to them.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in home invasion news, http://68.media.tumblr.com/9142f815031afe4b548edd08528c563f/tumblr_oaz8rea7BC1uvwznco1_500.gif
asciilifeform: i suppose dc is 'functional' then!11
asciilifeform: '...an ar-15, a shotgun, five pistols... in bedroom closet'
asciilifeform: '... the complainant's dog is running around the house, strangely, as if it senses someone... '
mircea_popescu: is this in the "we're about to break and enter and trying to pretend like no warrant is needed because probable cause" ?
asciilifeform: apparently
mod6: the wasps sound nasty tho ya.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> asciilifeform a good half of police work in all times, interfacing with bored / insane middle aged women. << did alf just flip on his scanner?
mod6: lol
BingoBoingo: lol https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/654yzl/goxxed_by_bitbetus_lost_16_btc/
mircea_popescu: they're not really the attacking type.
asciilifeform: '...25 y.o. female... took entire bottle'
asciilifeform: 'Mircea Popescu stole a large amount of BTC from BitBet.us prior to this...' << lol ☟︎
CompanionCube: lol: 'They used fake details for the domain registry. The "company" behind the domain is Polimedia which is currently in "Forfeited Existence" in Texas. The registry info has been the same even before they switched owners a year ago.'
mircea_popescu: ahem ?
CompanionCube: mircea_popescu: from some random redditor re: bitbet
mircea_popescu: !#s polimedia
a111: 649 results for "polimedia", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=polimedia
CompanionCube: ik it's yours
CompanionCube: you'd think they'd update the whois *eventually*
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2012-08-15#-319236 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2012-08-15 19:45 mircea_popescu: smickles http://trilema.com/2012/falimentul-polimedia-srl/ there, 2011 results. the 2010 and 2009 are also published on my blog
mircea_popescu: ~nothing changed, same corp numbers etc.
CompanionCube: unfortunately I can't read romanian.
asciilifeform: '...94 year-old, said he was a vet..'
mircea_popescu: CompanionCube what is this relevant to ?
CompanionCube: the linked blog post?
mircea_popescu: you think ?
mircea_popescu: aanyway, let's just say this bla bla has been going on for as long as there's been an internenet. nubbins abound, and they have shit to say about things, obviously.
mod6: <+CompanionCube> unfortunately I can't read romanian. << i used to translate trilema from .ro for, a long while before it was ever written in english.
mircea_popescu: meanwhile on the webz, The password should not contain the invalid characters like: ', ".
asciilifeform: '...complainant's father is hitting her... ...he has access to long guns, a shotgun, but it was not used in this incident...' << lol!
BingoBoingo: Condolences mod6, consider submittting obituary to paper of record?
mircea_popescu: eh, too much publicity don't you think.
mod6: Thanks BingoBoingo
mod6: I don't think it needs to be announced otherwise. Just my way of tribute for my folks.
mod6: My family appreciates the outpouring of sympathy from the Republic.
mircea_popescu: Last updated at block 461176. << is that like 3 days ago ?
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> eh, too much publicity don't you think. << The option's available to the berieved lord
mod6: wb
mircea_popescu: ty!
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> Last updated at block 461176. << is that like 3 days ago ? << i think trinque's node was down for repair for that wallet thing. might be behind a bit. not sure tho...
mircea_popescu: ah yeah.
mircea_popescu: did you ever nail that issue trinque ? ☟︎
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2017/04/bitcoin-mining-difficulty-up-4-238-to-520808749422-13983154/ << Qntra - Bitcoin Mining Difficulty Up ~4.238% To 520808749422.13983154
hanbot: Keeping you in my thoughts mod6
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in high performance lubrication, http://68.media.tumblr.com/3932bbda25a6fdabeef5c2c3164f8ee5/tumblr_oh3b2a4MHL1tgc11ao1_500.gif
mod6: thanks hanbot
mircea_popescu: meanwhile at the "sisters in focus with dicks in the background" farms, http://68.media.tumblr.com/a726cda44255b148a0a9b900f7babcd0/tumblr_ogse8xthTz1ucoif3o1_1280.jpg
mircea_popescu: in other wins for "social justice" and just being a retard generally, pretty much every online game defaults to making your avatar brown-skinned with the next option being some sort of african black. because TOTALLY not a vast majority of white boys play these things, and there's ABSOLUTELY nothing ridiculous about a bunch of teenaged male drones going around with the equivalent of little gril pillows of themselves.
asciilifeform: in other noose, asciilifeform set a squirrel trap on the roof but at night experienced squirrel sappers defused it and threw to the ground...
mircea_popescu: hahaha!
mod6: mircea_popescu: looks like the sisters are in az
mircea_popescu: aha
mod6: fg advanced test update: i've collected about 500Mb so far. ~half way there.
mircea_popescu: how long's it been going ?
mod6: eh, maybe like 18-20 hours?
mircea_popescu: nb.
mod6: with both of my RNG-TWs connected, it was collecting at about 7kB/s ... for that quick 10s test or so to ensure that it was a "full speed" ☟︎
mircea_popescu: aha
trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-04-14#1643440 << yep, turns out I pebkac'd, series of misunderstandings of how sendmany worked. got a tx out with double fee (0.0002), which still wasn't enough, so I've now double-spent that tx with a 0.0005 fee. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-04-14 03:07 mircea_popescu: did you ever nail that issue trinque ?
mircea_popescu: a kk
Framedragger: doublespending double fees, this is bullish for ethereum
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-04-14#1643455 << 7K/s is indeed the rated minimal. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-04-14 14:57 mod6: with both of my RNG-TWs connected, it was collecting at about 7kB/s ... for that quick 10s test or so to ensure that it was a "full speed"
asciilifeform: in other 'news', bbet still dead!1111
trinque: pretty sure it was dead sometime last year
asciilifeform: trinque: for how long, do you recall ?
trinque: !!gettrust znort987
deedbot: L1: 0, L2: 1 by 1 connections.
trinque: just making a general comment about the guy not having much of a wot presence
asciilifeform: 0 proper presence afaik.
asciilifeform: znort could be literally anybody.
asciilifeform: nothing of any interest whatsoever, is, afaik, publicly known about this character.
mircea_popescu: did he lose his ancient keyh or not have one or what was it ?
asciilifeform: somebody (iirc mircea_popescu, even) advanced a hypothesis, last year, that znort is a purchased key
asciilifeform: (or confiscated, or otherwise changed hands.)
mircea_popescu: got a link or nething ?
trinque: can't tell him from adam, or usg.gamblingprohee
asciilifeform: digging nao
davout: key's in wot
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-05-01#1460232 << related lulz ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-05-01 17:36 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform kinda too lazy to deedbot a list of the various spots in logs where the fact that bitbet keeps no logs was discussed. seems about 99 and 3/4% that the whole point there was to create an entry point for later parallel construction, "o look what bitbet logs show".
trinque: !!key znort987
deedbot: http://wot.deedbot.org/9F1C2534ACEE115E18EF02A5FD5AA2A5E26602B0.asc
mircea_popescu: how much was the pot, did anyone figure it out ?
mircea_popescu: heh/
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: https://archive.is/If4Gx
mircea_popescu: so like 27 bets worth a few pennies each, maaaybe 5-10 btc total ?
mircea_popescu: seems somewhat unlikely a dude that paid 100 btc for it last year would run off with 10.
asciilifeform: maybe not so much 'ran off with' but unplugged.
asciilifeform: 'fuck it all'.
mircea_popescu: could as well have cancelled the bets then. takes what, coupla hours.
ben_vulpes: "modern banking is wholly owned subsidiary of usg" "what? no it's not" "yes it is: https://medium.com/@msuiche/the-nsa-compromised-swift-network-50ec3000b195" "...oh but that's different somehow"
mircea_popescu: heh
asciilifeform: and not '10 btc total', the new alphago one just by itself is worth ~17 btc
mircea_popescu: ah
mircea_popescu: i skimmed.
asciilifeform: it ain't a mega-fortune, but also not penny on asphalt.
mircea_popescu: i guess tis possible.
asciilifeform: 'A SWIFT Service Bureau, is the kind-of the equivalent of the Cloud for Banks when it comes to their SWIFT transactions and messages, the banks transactions are hosted and managed by the SWIFT Service Bureau via an Oracle Database and the SWIFT Softwares. This is why we see that many of those Service Bureau also offer KYC, Compliance, Anti-Laundering services since they have access to all those transactions as their are the host for
asciilifeform: their clients.' << lulzy.
asciilifeform: also run moar winxp.
mircea_popescu: no, oracle, totally different.
asciilifeform: lul
asciilifeform: seems like they use... both
mircea_popescu: twice the safety.
asciilifeform: ( sorta like contracting hiv + hepc )
davout: seems unlikely dude just ran off with ~20 btc
asciilifeform: could have, say, died.
davout: at least if you plan on doing that, at least keep the site up and maximize profit by collecting more
davout: or just, on a week end
lobbes: In other noose: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/gbu-43b-mother-of-all-bombs-massive-ordnance-air-blast-afghanistan-isis-a7682996.html
asciilifeform: lobbes: gotta wonder why this is 'news'. similar ordnance was used by brits in ww2, many times
asciilifeform: (it isn't even a gas-air bomb. regular one.)
asciilifeform: under bush II, gas bombs were in use, spectacular fireballs, many pr photos
asciilifeform: (~0, afaik, results on the field)
mircea_popescu: that's good for usgcoin!
asciilifeform: and re bbet, hey mircea_popescu , recall http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-12#1520195 thread ? ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-12 23:17 mircea_popescu: nobody asked you anything of how bitbet's capital is to be used by bitbet.
asciilifeform: one possibility is that znorta gambled the coins -- and lost.
asciilifeform: corzine-style.
mircea_popescu: i suppose.
asciilifeform: *znort
asciilifeform: that's one handy way to 'accidentally' scam.
Framedragger: not arranging if-hit-by-bus switch is irresponsible, hrm
mircea_popescu: Framedragger what % of an operation do you deem should be allocated to pay for that arrangement ?
mircea_popescu: (pro tip : the cost comes out of the fee.)
Framedragger: out of the fee which is 0?
mircea_popescu: so then.
asciilifeform: waiwat, it was 0 ?!
Framedragger: bitbet was/is profitable.
Framedragger: payout fee, he means
mircea_popescu: this "i'm not paying for the drinks and not having better ones is irresponsible" thing only goes so far.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger so if it was 1% of 17 btc that's 200 bux or so ?
mircea_popescu: if you think "switch" as described may cost as much as 1% of the total cost structure, voila, he has a $2 arrangement in place.
Framedragger: 200 bux is not absolutely nothing, first off; and second off, 17 btc? was that the profit in the last P&L? honestly don't remember
mircea_popescu: i;ve not been following, guessing based on the alf provided number above.
Framedragger: but i see the point, low profit.
mircea_popescu: i think the concept carries irrespective.
asciilifeform: Framedragger: really, do you think that 200bux is enough to 1) hire 2) retain a substitute operator ?!
asciilifeform: or what arrangement did you picture as 'dead man switch'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform $2. the remainder 198 are needed for other things.
Framedragger: implementing a procedure to refund all bets if no signature by $key into $system, say. not that it's not easy to fuck this up royally.
mircea_popescu: or have it hijacked.
asciilifeform: Framedragger: you're talking about a 'bbet folds' button
asciilifeform: ^
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu has it
mircea_popescu: you know, by the everfriendly usg, for instance.
asciilifeform: ~having~ this device around, is a quite expensive proposition.
Framedragger: maybe.
mircea_popescu: or what, were you going to use an INDEPENDENT website ?
Framedragger: i can think of couple of approaches but i agree that they are not zero-in-cost, so, meh, i concede
mircea_popescu: do they deal well with "blackhole" ?
asciilifeform: there are no sane robotic solutions to this kind of thing.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: no; neither do they deal with EC backdoors or sun exploding. having a practical but limited-in-scope threat model is not useless in itself.
Framedragger: anyway, i won't argue further.
mircea_popescu: there are, more broadly and more sadly, no robotic human or alien solution s available to dealing with the usgtard to his satisfaction. because he's worth less than a pig and demands more than a duchess.
mircea_popescu: dutches demanding less than a pig would be workable economcially. but chronical rotinculo/mortidafame who imagine they should get the moon on a golden platter, these aren't economically interesting.
trinque: Framedragger: what recourse is there that doesn't involve exposing keys to more than one person, and why is that multiplied risk of absconding more agreeable to you than present circumstances?
mircea_popescu: poor guy.
asciilifeform: Framedragger: there is a very basic fallacy at the root of 'multisig thinking', that somehow you can cut up control over a key and give the pieces to a group, which somehow can 'keep the owner honest' but not (why not?) fuck him
mircea_popescu: a Framedragger walks into a bar, and the bar goes WHAM!
Framedragger: he tries to remedy but laptop battery dies.
Framedragger: trinque: asciilifeform: i did naively 'assume' that one could think of an arrangement when 2-of-2 or similar signature scheme would be 'safe'.
asciilifeform: Framedragger: describe for me, how this works
asciilifeform: and what means 'safe'.
Framedragger: (to be clear: machine-which-can-send-moneys has to sign, and operator has to sign as well. necessarily both.)
Framedragger: 'safe' as in usg hacking into machine doesn't do anything.
Framedragger: can't spend coin.
Framedragger: wait.
Framedragger: ah fuck
asciilifeform: does scenario where the coins end up permanently parked in graveyard orbit because the operators refuse to move'em count as 'safety' to Framedragger ?!
asciilifeform: aaaha.
trinque: lel! there's the wham
Framedragger: boy do i abuse this channel
Framedragger: in consideration, machine + operator having keys is not a good idea and the risk is indeed multiplied. 2-of-2 sig doesn't work if one can do basic arithmetic.
asciilifeform: there we go.
Framedragger: yep, the only way this 'may' work if you have a partner whom you fully trust, and the arrangement of which somehow does not involve monetary compensation. which is ~untenable ☟︎
asciilifeform: these are typically called wives (and even they do not necessarily work as 'ideal spherical wife in textbook' always.)
Framedragger: (larger profitable orgs may be able to implement this, with ample compensation, but, sure, not bbet.) ☟︎
Framedragger: yeah.
asciilifeform: there is no such thing as purchased honesty, Framedragger
asciilifeform: just like there is no hired suicide belt bomber
Framedragger: heh re. latter, i'm sure there is ("pay my family suicide-money after my death")
asciilifeform: it is never the whole incentive to do the work.
Framedragger: nono, i agree.
asciilifeform: ( ~all armies have some form of widow's pension )
trinque: no such thing as purchased, but probably such thing as "owned"
trinque would not be the expert
Framedragger: re. purchased honesty, well i dunno, two business partners entering business arrangement.. that's a thing that happens (cue mp "as we have seen, it doesn't! so can't ever!1")
trinque: I don't think that's an honest interpretation
asciilifeform: multisig crapola is fundamentally about http://btcbase.org/log/2015-12-27#1354404 . ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2015-12-27 17:38 asciilifeform: 'It is about sending a strong message. I think we may need to start an accreditation scheme for Bitcoin-consensus compliant wallets and services. Through code signing and use of multisig, we can even distinguish transactions made by compliant wallets and non-compliant wallets, and have pools not mine them (or wallets refuse to send to known-non-compliant wallets).'
trinque: see: S.NSA
Framedragger: trinque: i was being facetious. you're right of course
asciilifeform: trinque: i dunno if this is obvious or not, we don't have multi-man keys of any sort at s.nsa
trinque: nono, in re: partnering up in biz
asciilifeform: the collaboration does not pretend to be a living thing on its own, separate from mircea_popescu and asciilifeform
trinque: of course
asciilifeform: see also thread, http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-16#1522361 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-16 13:09 mircea_popescu: oh since i'm thinking about it : there's two specific items tmsr wants to bring to the field of probate reform : a) no juridical person beneficiary. no government, ngo, corporation, trust etc may obtain as much as a farthing from any succession. physical persons only. b) no tax or fee of any kind may be levied against succession.
trinque was taking the shears to an overly broad statement.
trinque: having separate identities is a sanity requirement of doing any business
deedbot: http://www.contravex.com/2017/04/14/was-it-worth-it/ << » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski - Was it worth it?
asciilifeform: 278.73 BTC << notbad ☟︎
trinque: Framedragger: better odds for good outcome in business partnership if you had a preceeding relationship with the guy eh?
asciilifeform: ( re multisig, see also, e.g., http://btcbase.org/log/2015-12-10#1340332 . ) ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2015-12-10 14:26 asciilifeform: none of the idiot heresies are even in any sense new. 'multisig', for instance, is simply 1990s clinton key escrow, 'old wine in new bottle'
Framedragger: trinque: didn't understand the reference hm, but (necessarily and totally) yes?..
Framedragger bbl
trinque: Framedragger: I'm disputing that business partnership is definitionally "purchased honesty"
Framedragger: ah. yeah i concede/agree.
asciilifeform: 'purchased honesties' give you, e.g., carl force.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-04-14#1643576 << and let me guess, i'm supposed to expose this incredibly rare and expensive resource for the benefit of the redditard peons, who don't want to pay for it but DO want to make random claims because hey, gotta make a claim to exist and research of any description is way above their pay grade ? ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-04-14 17:19 Framedragger: yep, the only way this 'may' work if you have a partner whom you fully trust, and the arrangement of which somehow does not involve monetary compensation. which is ~untenable
mircea_popescu: yes, some people have others who'd die for them. why the fuck would they let $rando into that club again ?
mircea_popescu: what, some kind of "we're all gonna share things" ?
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-04-14#1643578 << no. AGAIN. large orgs ie your usg.* friends CAN NOT impl;ement this. MPs can implemenrt this, ie men who beat women and keep slaves. they AND THEM ONLY may implement this. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-04-14 17:20 Framedragger: (larger profitable orgs may be able to implement this, with ample compensation, but, sure, not bbet.)
mircea_popescu: utter and complete monopoly, no bureaucracy may have the wonder in the future nor ever had it in the past.
ben_vulpes: yeah who in fiatorg holds keys? controller? ceo?
ben_vulpes: goes against the whole grain of how those systems work. single accountable individual with life and death power.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-04-14#1643603 << holy, was that more than it held before ? ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-04-14 17:28 asciilifeform: 278.73 BTC << notbad
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski's arithmetic. i did not massage it.
mircea_popescu: znort is female ?
asciilifeform: he seems to think so.
asciilifeform: ( i have nfi why )
mircea_popescu: there was a very talented (also female) scammer early on, made a "fund" called "obsi" something. very soft approach, also quietly disappeared.
asciilifeform: very quietly. i dun recall any discussion of this. or maybe it was before i tuned in.
mircea_popescu: was 2012 yes.
asciilifeform: ( most of the chumpatronic 'wonders of the world' in btc seem to have happened prior to asciilifeform tuning in )
mircea_popescu: !#s "obsi"
a111: 2894 results for "\"obsi\"", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=%22obsi%22
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2013-03-20#-69718 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2013-03-20 20:17 pigeons: usagi had 3 different risk profiles for his cdos, and he bought OBSI.HYPT (High Yield Pass Through into secret business model now run away with the money) in the EXTREMELY LOW RISK group
asciilifeform: lul, 'high yield'+'low risk'
mircea_popescu: hey, it is EXACTLY what the usg banking world did.
asciilifeform: in kindergarten one learns that that's what defines scam
mircea_popescu: they got bailed for it.
asciilifeform: a very selected 'they', and - naturally - with fresh printolade
asciilifeform: did anyone actually expect a similar event in btcdom ?
asciilifeform: what would that even look like.
mircea_popescu: yea well.
asciilifeform: the quoted text is hilarious per se : if i say 'invest in this High Thrust antigrav engine, with Extremely Low Energy Cost energy intake' -- everyone will laugh. but if mr.suavetalker offers a 'High Yield Pass Through ... in the EXTREMELY LOW RISK group' financial instrument, greedy idiots jump over one another to buy,buy
asciilifeform: with 0 demand of proof of whatever kind.
asciilifeform: this is why, when reading about the early (1st 3 or so yrs) bitcoin landscape, i found it hard to feel any sympathy for the scamola victims
mircea_popescu: it was a painful and sad process, being disabused of the notion that average human is capable to tribune (ie, maintain law, complicated discussion i won't go into) via the rota experiment AND the notion that average human is capable to praetor (ie, administer resoruces) via the whole bitcoin finance/investment/profits/etc thing.
asciilifeform: they were willing participants in pyramids, it seems clear to me
mircea_popescu: the disappointments to the latter are indeed far reaching. cosnider someone like say death & taxes, http://trilema.com/2015/gerald-davis-is-wrong-heres-why/
mircea_popescu: man has a handle that suggests he groks it ; then has government steal his fucking business ; then goes on to... propiose & defend empire.
mircea_popescu: it's just... people aren't made for this world ; they properly belong in the grave and not perambling ab out.
mircea_popescu: but let's just say that mp started bitcoin cca 2011 as a very classical liberal. it didn't survive long.
asciilifeform: on other hand, early bitcoin did not exactly attract 'cream of mankind'
mircea_popescu: oh ? and why not ?
asciilifeform: now this i do not know.
asciilifeform: but it didn't.
mircea_popescu: no, no, i mean on what do you base this assertion.
mircea_popescu: seems to me assuming that it did attract the very cream of mankind is very safe indeed.
asciilifeform: probably ought to be more specific : early ~public bitcoin~ atmosphere was not 'cream' of anything.
mircea_popescu: and on what do you base yourself ?
asciilifeform: ahahaha is this when mircea_popescu will explain that 'pirate is the cream, the ubermensch' ?
mircea_popescu: looky, that you don't like what the cream looks like dun excuse you from having to admit. they found it, yes ? definitionally cream.
mircea_popescu: ie, better than all the lazy fucks sitting on ass dreaming their jwz/djb dream
mircea_popescu: but yes, i will say pirate, for all his warts, dpb, fucktarded ustard teen as he was, and the whole rest of the menagerie are better people than pick your pick. obama. hillary. nuland. whatever 5k dickless drones are sitting around wash dc offices reading this now. all of everyone
mircea_popescu: certainly better than any subhuman africans toiling with the donkeys.
mircea_popescu: and on it goes.
mircea_popescu: the sad, dirty secret of humanity is that the very cream of it ain't fit to shine shoes.
asciilifeform: hilaries ain't cream of anything.
asciilifeform: nor gorbys.
asciilifeform: fundamentally just another sort of pirate40.
mircea_popescu: what can i tell you.
asciilifeform: likewise i suspect that mircea_popescu's (or, say, mark twain's) positive view of 'good con men' is also 'fata morgana', mirage, con men is not necessarily a 'force of will' ubermensch, he is every bit a creature of the times and the opportunity, the rat crevice in which he finds himself, as is any clinton.
mircea_popescu: i was not proposing anything of the sorty.
mircea_popescu: i was simply saying, thr 50 that found the door are definitionally and for that reason alone better than all the others.
mircea_popescu: there is no "oh, i was busy with my dick" excuse to explain why couldn't find way out of paper bag.
asciilifeform: mno. if a broken oak trunk made its way from europe to 'new world' pre columbus, it does not follow that oak is great navigator.
mircea_popescu: what, you expect kakobrekla will be remembered for anything other than "oh, the dude who couldn't swing being part of bitbet" ? for what exactly, he's gonna accomplish what in his life to compensate for that failure, cold fucking fusion ?
mircea_popescu: there's very little leeway in teh cold equations for the usual human bullshit.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it does so follow, yes.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: pretty sure d00d transitioned to 'model airplane' mode, and has no intention of 'remembered'
mircea_popescu: yawell. he is not in charge of his own life in this sense. what intentions he has matter not one wit.
mircea_popescu: conceivably quisling also had "no intention of being remembered".
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: a man can be a navigator. a piece of dead wood -- is, whatever else it is, not a navigator. i did not think this would be controversial.
mircea_popescu: it is controversial.
mircea_popescu: hanbot no way ?!
mircea_popescu: common italian word wtf.
mircea_popescu: oh i misspelled it did i.
asciilifeform: waiwat
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: recall naggum's (and then -- our) discussion re how computing was wrecked not so much by microshit per se (which in 1980s was not a mega-power) but by the idiot worship of gates and his lottery winner 'success' ?
mircea_popescu: ok ?
asciilifeform: it is exactly the oak.
mircea_popescu: it really dun make difference if "one got lucky". symbolics is still dead ON ITS OWN MERITS.
mircea_popescu: this because "luck" and skill are indistinguishable for the unskilled.
asciilifeform: 'was scum, but he grabbed the brass ring, where were you' gives you cockroach world.
mircea_popescu: there's no way out of it. grab the brass ring, there's no way to excuse it.
asciilifeform: incidentally, putting up framed pictures of lottery winners, praying at their feet, etc. does nothing per se, is harmless. it is when n00bs begin to try to 'learn' from them, there comes problem.
asciilifeform: the microshit thing was a civilization-scale disaster, and it continues.
mircea_popescu: i'm sure there's right now all sorts of ~in their own mind~ important smart useful whatever folk. they're not in the wot, they don't exist, and this inexistence of theirs WILL COUNT AGAINST THEM
hanbot: <mircea_popescu> dutches demanding less than a pig would be workable economcially. but chronical rotinculo/mortidafame who imagine they should get the moon on a golden platter, these aren't economically interesting. << googled rotinculo definition, got a suggestion of trilema articles to read
mircea_popescu: where were you is the first legitimate question.
mircea_popescu: hanbot :p
hanbot: s'about a 50% chance a googling a given unknown word in a #t article yields...just moar t articles.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: and the answer can be 'i was in the laboratory, creating the things that the scum later stole'
mircea_popescu: it';s a maaaan's world....
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and maybe we'll opt to credit this. or maybe we won't.
mircea_popescu: shoulda followed the topic. the topic is there for a reason.
asciilifeform: in mircea_popescu's conception, only a thief is 'a man' ?
mircea_popescu: gotta pass bacalaureat before may even consider going tinto laboratory.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no. in mp's conception, lab does not take all comers.
mircea_popescu: EVEN if they think it does.
asciilifeform: expand plox
mircea_popescu: in order for item to go into lab, item must first pass maturity exam. become man as opposed to child. See http://trilema.com/2016/how-to-participate-in-the-affairs-of-the-most-serene-republic/ is there for a reason.
asciilifeform: hanbot: at one point i tried to unearth what rotinculos (other than a portmanteau, presumably, rotten arse) were , and gave up
mircea_popescu: that reason is, "infantile delusion of having been in lab before completing the basic steps ARE NAUGHT BUT INFANTILE DELUSIONS."\
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's about what you'd call a twink in english, ie a teenaged gay prostitute. generally applied to the aged variant nobody anymore seriously contemplates paying for.
mircea_popescu: literally "broken in the ass".
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there was not a tmsr in '09. bitcoin was quite equivalent, by afaik any possible litmus, to similar crackpotteries which were known then.
hanbot: aha!
mircea_popescu: but today there is.
asciilifeform: i thought thread was re: the age of the great pirates.
asciilifeform: rather than today.
mircea_popescu: that was 2012.
asciilifeform: no tmsr in '12 either
mircea_popescu: and you know what, that "there wasn't" is scarcely any excuse. why didn't they make it, these MEN ? if they're so respectable and errything.
asciilifeform: why didn't h. hertz make a radio ?
asciilifeform: or , better, maxwell .
mircea_popescu: what, you think i'm excusing him in my mind ? i'm not. fuck him.
asciilifeform: btw marconi was a pretty good example of 'opportunistic thief'
asciilifeform: exactly the gates of his time
mircea_popescu: i am also not impressed with wozniak's teary stories.
asciilifeform: nor i
mircea_popescu: shoulda been less fucktarded.
asciilifeform: wozniak wasn't an originator of anything serious
mircea_popescu: there isn't going to be a divine kingdom of the heavens insulating dumb bitches from their inept choices in locales to get drunk into and badly washed dorks from their inept choices in whom to submit to and what to obey.
mircea_popescu: you eat too much, you get fat ; you jwz, you get pissed on. shouldn't be so hard.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform to hear him recount it, he was the maxwell/hertz of job's marconi or some such.
asciilifeform: and to hear the inmates, in every asylum - 100 napoleons
mircea_popescu: so then.
asciilifeform: woz drew up a 6502 box with slightly reduced glue logic chip count, vs the state of art at the time. about same level of accomplishment as, e.g., fuckgoats.
asciilifeform: not a maxwell, no.
mircea_popescu: the overarching point is that technical merit doesn't enter into this.
mircea_popescu: and i have every intention to credit everything to the first wot person to bring it up, not to the "originator". fuck him. should have had a wot.
asciilifeform: thread wasn't about 'which one gets into valhalla, maxwell or marconi', however. i specifically assert that n00bs ~learning~ from the thief -- whose achievement is essentially accidental, quite destructive overall to everybody else, and at any rate in no sense ~replicable~ -- vs from the maxwell - is the problem.
mircea_popescu: noobs learning from anything, be it a thief, be it their mother, be it hillary clinton, be it bernstein, be it ANYONE is very harmful to them.
mircea_popescu: See http://trilema.com/2016/how-to-participate-in-the-affairs-of-the-most-serene-republic/ is there for a reason. there's NO OTHERR WAY to learn.
asciilifeform: can learn , e.g., galois theory, from the l0gz ?
asciilifeform: how about mig pilotage ?
mircea_popescu: you do not start with galois theoryu.
mircea_popescu: and you MAY NOT pretend you're not at the start if you are at the start.
mircea_popescu: there's no self-appointed graduation.
asciilifeform: you start with alphabet. which i dun recall being taught here, either
mircea_popescu: on occasion. see
mircea_popescu: !#s alphabet
a111: 147 results for "alphabet", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=alphabet
asciilifeform: ( and if only alphabet. there is a quite serious qualification to meaningfully starting to learn from the l0gz, yes )
mircea_popescu: it's self contained. you learn what you need by confronting the things here you don't know.
mircea_popescu: this "oh, but mp, i'm interested in other things, i'm speshul" is more adlaism bullshit. THERE AREN'T OTHER THINGS.
asciilifeform: we had, iirc, a 'problems of the age' thread
mircea_popescu: i think so.
asciilifeform: ( where, e.g. in 1890s they were flight, radio, few other lessers )
asciilifeform: today - 'trb-i', ciphers of known strength, a few others.
asciilifeform: it is not even clear which these are, except in retrospect.
asciilifeform: ( if 1890s folx had given up on airplane, same way today's grant-eaters gave up on, e.g., room-temp superconductor, could have gone quite differently )
asciilifeform: btw the 'beta decay can be arbitrarily sped up in magnetic field' throws a bit of new light on just how 'strange, new' a world with roomtemp supercon would be.
asciilifeform: ( suddenly you have, e.g., an intrinsically-safe (cut the field - cuts the reaction) betavoltaic reactor that fits in pocket, runs on ordinary KCl... )
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2017/04/french-financial-regulatorast-fines-payment-service-provider-over-bitcoin-business/ << Qntra - French Financial Regulatorast Fines Payment Service Provider Over Bitcoin Business
asciilifeform: 'failure to collect KYC paperwork for 34 customers, failure to report 9 customers to legal enforcement on suspicions of money laundering, and failure to further interrogate 20 customers, for which the declared wealth allegedly didn't match the transaction volumes.' << lol!
mircea_popescu: heh
mircea_popescu: "aml/kyc" is for the birds, to be very plain.
mircea_popescu: why the fuck would anyone deal with the sort of schmucks that do thjat in the first place, i have no idea.
asciilifeform: 'why would anyone' live on boiled cabbage, wear a striped pajama all year long ? maybe because in a prison ?
mircea_popescu: i guess.
hanbot: <mircea_popescu> why the fuck would anyone deal with the sort of schmucks that do thjat in the first place, i have no idea. << sure you do, people just love easy-to-complete tasks that earn them an "everything's okay" signal from authority. even if that authority consists of a crayon-drawn badge paperclipped to dork's lapel @ supermarket exit.
mircea_popescu: there is htat.
mircea_popescu: the grues won't come to eat them in the night eh.
Framedragger: !!up airgapped
deedbot: airgapped voiced for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: and in other guides for noobs, http://68.media.tumblr.com/3d93c7f98cd625c06261e4143016bbbc/tumblr_oc9mfsRLOZ1vrs34so1_400.gif
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: does there in fact exist a 'free world' of non-kyctronic fiatola banking ?
mircea_popescu: sure.
asciilifeform: ( ...china? )
mircea_popescu: yep.
davout: in china even bitcoins are locked down
asciilifeform: davout: goxcoins
asciilifeform: ( how would you 'lock down bitcoin' lol )
davout: tell exchanges "don't send them, or else"
davout: see http://qntra.net/2017/04/30-day-constipation-of-chinese-fiatbitcoin-interfaces-continues-well-beyond-30-days/
mircea_popescu: you can lift a million in cash off the chinese doing supermarkets offshore for instance, on a few hour's notice.
mircea_popescu: all sorts of things work as cp, including bitcoin, heads of usg "operatives", etc.
asciilifeform: davout: ergo goxcoin
asciilifeform: if you didn't generate the privkey for it -- it ain't bitcoin
asciilifeform: this strange notion, that you can have a 'your' bitcoin where privkey is held by somebody else, is a serious problem imho.
Framedragger developing product to make real estate investment for chinese easier, actually. will report results and types of failure if any and if possible..
mircea_popescu: for my curiosity, are you developing this "product" because a chinese dude told you so ?
asciilifeform: Framedragger: i can hardly picture how it could be any easier, iirc they already de facto own ~all real estate anywhere that is for sale
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: chinese and other (e.g., south korean) bankers told a dude whom i believe in and who's paying me
mircea_popescu: works then
davout: asciilifeform: they're being forced not to honor IOUs to be very precise
Framedragger: asciilifeform: plenty of real estate in western yurop still up for sale. a *lot* of it may crash soon, but 'pockets' of it (e.g., specific places in italy (which in itself may / will crash, depending on your outlook) may be good investment, and they acknowledge that
Framedragger: )
Framedragger: (obvs if this 'works out' -- remains to be seen...)
asciilifeform: davout: from my (admittedly distant) chair, it'd appear that chinese gov strategy was, roughly, 'this bitcoin heresy, let's wait for the americans to kill it, it's the kind of wetwork they specialize in'. and when this failed, now they smell burning flesh, 'looks like gotta do everything ourselves'
BingoBoingo: http://oglaf.com/pseudopods/
BingoBoingo: http://oglaf.com/jocasta/
BingoBoingo: http://oglaf.com/ermine-shadow/
BingoBoingo: http://oglaf.com/zoorp/
mircea_popescu: o wow they got active huh
Framedragger: hah transcendent sex academy.. so in that realm in the comic, when dude puts transcendentally-ideal penis in vagina.. is that the infamous 'synthetic a priori' act??
Framedragger tried to joke
asciilifeform: modern chinese gov is smarter than mao's, won't hamhandedly dekulakize, nationalize the mining farms. will instead drive them slightly farther into -ev , and they will simply be sold off to pliant shell corps
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I think I just got forgetful. Weather's been good for playing in dirt.
CompanionCube: mircea_popescu: you run mysql right?
CompanionCube: http://riddle.link/
ben_vulpes: > Are you blind? Don't you see the above logo? It is an indisputable fact that it is a critical vulnerability available on the Internet.
ben_vulpes: god i hate this shit