mircea_popescu: thanks god we got rid of algebra ii in time for the education of arstechnica staff.
mircea_popescu: large scale conspiracy such as telling idiots they're not idiots could never happen. why would an idiot ever believe he's not an idiot ?!
mircea_popescu: what, next you're going to say we have actual proof the usg had been running a string of massive conspiracies, such as you know, inserting backdoors in software, such as "parallel construction", such as iran contra, such as whatever the hell.
mircea_popescu: but anyway - now that ars technica has proven that black slavery never happened, we can go back to separate but equal, i guess.
assbot: Romanian wife rips off husband's testicles on International Women's Day after he refused to do housework | Daily Mail Online ... (
http://bit.ly/220XyM2 )
mircea_popescu: (the issue seems to be over not getting flowers for 8th march, "mother's day" in commie lands)
mircea_popescu: anyway. apparnetly, not married, living together for 15 years, he owns the house, she's basically a tramp, dude drinks and nonconsensually humiliates the woman, had been driving her nuts the whole night, she lost it, is now sorry, tried to fix on teh spot, visits at hospital etc.
nubbins`: ^ re: the20yearplan / rentalstarter
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3400 @ 0.00052323 = 1.779 BTC [-] {4}
gribble: Current Blocks: 401953 | Current Difficulty: 1.584272037673917E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 403199 | Next Difficulty In: 1246 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 5 hours, 51 minutes, and 37 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None
jidan: just a pleb.. hoping to see some chat
assbot: Logged on 09-03-2016 23:44:28; mircea_popescu: pretty much the only way he could have made economic sense was by marketing the spare cycles of well connected people here - outside.
assbot: Logged on 09-03-2016 23:44:52; mircea_popescu: just ask alf.
assbot: Logged on 09-03-2016 23:49:08; mircea_popescu: i suppose to be cracked the same way all of them get cracked - guy with immense downlist and very well connected gets off his lazy, stupid fiat-ass and goes through the wot selection process. then has enough spots specific and high level enough to interest the locals. seems a tall order.
gribble: log.bitcoin-assets.com is down
gernika: asciilifeform: do you operate the EE Tools EeRom-8U (I think you referenced it in the logs recently) with windows? If so, with which 10 foot pole?
gernika: It looked like there was a dos util for it -- then I realized that was from 1999.
gernika: ok. bleh. one more laptop laying around the house couldn't hurt I guess.
gernika: I'm just going to try out some z80 stuff. seems easier to use this than flashing eeproms.
gernika: oh yeah - wasn't clear to me how to plug the thing in
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4400 @ 0.00052437 = 2.3072 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> or did i read that backwards ? <<< seems so ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> for the 5 people or so worldwide << oif which apparently two here ?
mircea_popescu: assbot> RIP Google PageRank score: A retrospective on how it ruined the web << this is not an idle comment. google, like every other usg item, like usg collectively, was entrusted with great responsibility in many fields after the war.
mircea_popescu: without exception it fucked up ALL of these. and not lightly fuck them up, either.
mircea_popescu: in other news - it still remains likely that this summer will see a bevy of various hardforks on offer. practically speaking, trb can offer either its own candidate, which takes a lot of work, or else sit tight and we'll follow the more intelligent of the avaialble offerings, which takes less work but also implies a lot of risk - experience to date shows that there's precious little intelligence available outside the w
☟︎☟︎ mircea_popescu: alls, and more likely than not we'll be stuck picking between a warty rat and a sickly mole.
mircea_popescu: in any case we should prolly have a strategy discussion here. paging mod6 asciilifeform jurov trinque phf an' the other interested parties.
☟︎☟︎ davout: i'm really not convinced we'll see a HF this year
mircea_popescu: i'm not convinced either. but there's the possibility.
mircea_popescu: so far, nsa-gavin, prb and [prolly] the miner cartel are all preparing something or the other.
☟︎ jurov: but seriously, what is a must have? mempool sanity and anything else?
☟︎ davout: pogo's still high on my personal what-do-if-spare-cycles list
davout: not much happening on my side
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 10:43:46; mircea_popescu: in any case we should prolly have a strategy discussion here. paging mod6 asciilifeform jurov trinque phf an' the other interested parties.
kodemurani: wondering if there is any discussion here on ether
shinohai: Plenty of discussion here. When there isn't, there is a plethora of information in the logs.
kodemurani: Thanks shinohai. Going through the logs
davout: "The lesson of the very well built lighthouse Bitcoin project, which has resulted in no more than a few thousand dollars of funding over the past years, has to be that there is extremely little value to be gained by introducing trustless escrow in crowdfunding. Even if you wanted to crowdfund something very controversial, where traditional web platforms will ban you, its not at all clear that disintermediating holding funds before cap is re
davout: ached is a big part of making this type of crowdfunding effective. Even worse, the project organizer could always fund the remainder of the contract privately, hence it is not at all clear that there is any actual gain of security. While it was a nice use of SIGHASH_ALL, it really solved a non-problem"
shinohai: Ether is simply a Rube Goldbergesque way of making money for it's founder to buy a lifetime supply of Retin-A. When he has it *poof*
davout: "The best case scenario for most of these projects is that there are end user benefits for other reasons, and that Ethereum is not required to deliver them. The complexity, and cost, of doing blockchain based products will in such cases eventually drive such products off chain, the same way changetip eventually went off-chain, and now recently into fiat mode."
fluffypony: davout: I made that exact argument at a meetup in Berlin last year where someone presented some junk they're building on Ethereum
fluffypony: and I asked them why they were building on Ethereum, and despite much hand-waving they couldn't give me an actual reason
fluffypony: most people building crap on top of "a blockchain" have no idea why they're doing so
☟︎ davout: to me there are exactly two use cases for bitcoin/blockchain
☟︎ davout: 1. decentralized timestamping
davout: 2. making taxes optional
kodemurani: That report on ethereum is rather discouraging. (why ehtereum project will most likely fail) :-(
fluffypony: kodemurani: this is not new information
fluffypony: all rational, thinking people have known this to be the expected outcome from the very beginning
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 10:43:06; mircea_popescu: in other news - it still remains likely that this summer will see a bevy of various hardforks on offer. practically speaking, trb can offer either its own candidate, which takes a lot of work, or else sit tight and we'll follow the more intelligent of the avaialble offerings, which takes less work but also implies a lot of risk - experience to date shows that there's precious little intelligence avai
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 10:49:38; mircea_popescu: so far, nsa-gavin, prb and [prolly] the miner cartel are all preparing something or the other.
shinohai: I will use trb as long as it works on the overall network, failing that I will have to find something else to occupy my time.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 10:52:32; jurov: but seriously, what is a must have? mempool sanity and anything else?
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 10:51:47; jurov: extract alf from mordor?
shinohai: As I told mod6 I do not advocate surrender myself :/
jurov: so whole shiva stuff is ded alley for you?
jurov: oh i misunderstood
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 10:43:06; mircea_popescu: in other news - it still remains likely that this summer will see a bevy of various hardforks on offer. practically speaking, trb can offer either its own candidate, which takes a lot of work, or else sit tight and we'll follow the more intelligent of the avaialble offerings, which takes less work but also implies a lot of risk - experience to date shows that there's precious little intelligence avai
shinohai: mircea_popescu is under stress lately perhaps and needs a nice lsd trip to put things in perspective :D
danielpbarron once had a 'vial' of the stuff; used it to put drops on sugar cubes, eat and go for bike ride in the summer
shinohai: lsd usually inspires clarity of thought and creativity tho.
danielpbarron: still had a little left for my great purge when i burned the contents of my drug box as well as some eastern philosophy texts and my karate uniform
shinohai: Heh I forgot I have mebbe 1/2 gram of 25C-nBOMe left xD
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:17:49; davout: to me there are exactly two use cases for bitcoin/blockchain
danielpbarron: yeah that's the question.. what to 'divest' into.. old computer parts?
shinohai: That's mainly what I use BTC for - equipment. (When I can actually acquire it!)
danielpbarron: although without a bitcoin i don't have much interest in computer parts anyway, so that's a catch-22
danielpbarron: i had all but given up on computers entirely until i found bitcoin
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 13:00:57; danielpbarron: someone set up that sommelier thing already
danielpbarron: you linked some thing on ebay, has amd processer and ecc ram or whatever
danielpbarron: how much do you need for this year off to build sane trb ? maybe we can crowdfund it
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:41:33; asciilifeform: i was willing to deal with the cpp miseryu of trb because 1) it pre-dates bitcoin being valuable 2) it was - and remains - the schelling point, 'father's pistols'
danielpbarron: asciilifeform> the 'reddit appeal' of what we do << i didn't mean reaching out any further than in this very channel
shinohai: Speaking of stakes, I wonder how BingoBoingo impalement project is coming.
☟︎ punkman: anyway, doesn't hurt to come up with a pricetag. who knows maybe the satoshi hoard might move this year.
☟︎ davout: punkman: unless these particular inputs are blacklisted by the Chinese Cartel(TM)
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: "Pederasty is an ancient Greek form of interaction in which members of the same sex would partake in the pleasures of an intellectual and/or sexual relationship as part of a socially acceptable ancient custom " << uh ok...
thestringpuller: "a (usually erotic) homosexual relationship between an adult male and a pubescent or adolescent male. "
jurov: drat. so far i failed to observe it with people that i hired
☟︎ nubbins`: still no signed financials from s.bbet
nubbins`: i thought you didn't like me anymore
danielpbarron: that's a violation of the rules you like to cite so much
danielpbarron: >> On the other hand professional also implies that you understand how context works, and will never ever under any circumstances omit relevant context when quoting, especially when such omission changes the meaning of your quote and the quoted then has to point this out to you like you were some sort of politician or assimilated retard.
nubbins` searches for something he quoted, comes up blank
nubbins`: danielpbarron your logic doesn't follow, again
jurov: nubbins`: i take it you're stabbing/hugging each other in the pederasty context
nubbins`: jurov danielpbarron has a lot to learn, he's come to me for guidance
nubbins`: sorry, i have a script that changes words of violence to words of kindness
nubbins`: once i checked the log, i understood that you actually "stabbed" me
nubbins`: besides, i didn't quote you without context, i *misquoted* you in the *midst* of context. jeez.
nubbins`: am i literally the ONLY person who understands the rules around here?
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 13:55:25; jurov: drat. so far i failed to observe it with people that i hired
nubbins`: BRUSHSTRIKE: Font not found on the system; missing font has been substituted. DKSensoryOverload: Font not found on the system; missing font has been substituted. Eminent: Font not found on the system; missing font has been substituted. Freshman: Font not found on the system; missing font has been substituted. JerseyM54: Font not found on the system; missing font has been substituted.
nubbins`: thanks, third-party graphic designer who obviously knows what they're doing
nubbins`: danielpbarron i did several parcels of work for the ministry of games, in paid official capacity as well as volunteer/unofficial capacity.
punkman: is "lower someone into pederasty" a russian thing? the phrase never made much sense to me
nubbins`: we created all of the heraldics for the family lines (yet to be implemented), i also produced the first round of OS X compilation instructions and helped get eulorum set up / own the domain
danielpbarron: i thought maybe you designed the item images or something
thestringpuller: placing art in that game is a PITA. the planeshift engine (on top of cs) comes with 0 middleware.
assbot: Logged on 17-10-2013 13:29:36; nubbins`: heraldry look OK?
nubbins`: thestringpuller sounds like a job for.... whomever
thestringpuller: Turning Planeshift + Crystalspace into Unity is like turning Bitcoin into Visa, so I don't think it should be a job for anyone.
danielpbarron: oh, in the context from which I found it, she was called 'he'
nubbins`: danielpbarron from "paschal", of or relating to easter. in various spellings, it's a male or female name
nubbins`: pasquale, pascal, paschal, pascale, etc
nubbins`: fr. aramaic "pasha" / hebrew "pesah"
jurov: thestringpuller what do you mean, turning them into unity?
jurov: the problem is in opposite direction, to untangle them
☟︎ jurov: i have not looked to doing art, only to network (de)serialization in order for lisp to be able to send and receive messages
jurov: ended up with horrible hack whereby in the process of deserialization the values are clandestinely pushed into lisp list...
jurov: serialization was not possible this way, fortunately client needs to send only dozen types of messages
jurov: i was thinking about it as potential learning practice for trb... but such things would make alf shit girder beams
thestringpuller: jurov: not that I'm a huge fan of unity, but after playing Kerbal Space Program you have to give it a little credit. What it does have is a large layer of middleware which allows for much better asset management. Whereas in Planeshift + Crystalspace it's all handled in essentially a textfile...
diana_coman: what's wrong with a textfile per se thestringpuller ?
assbot: Logged on 27-02-2016 19:14:30; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the other end of pederasty
punkman: diana_coman: ah I missed that somehow
punkman: diana_coman: are you having ideas about getting rid of planeshift yet?
☟︎ diana_coman: depends on what you mean by "ideas" (i.e. desires in that direction plenty) and by getting rid of planeshift (code is already quite far - in a good sense - from original planeshift and yes, I absolutely want to take it further away)
thestringpuller: diana_coman: it's a textfile that has no middleware for artist to import assets into the engine. you have to either write it yourself or place the geometry in their yourself. It's 2016 not 1993.
thestringpuller: Take Source for instance. You open up hammer, import your geometry (as a map), press play and Half Life loads with your assets.
punkman: the whole game interface was a pain for me. I'd give it another go when that changes.
diana_coman: uhm, thestringpuller I'll certainly have to study that, so I'll possibly get back to you on this then
mircea_popescu: punkman well, maybe wehen jurov releases the slime client :D
nubbins`: thestringpuller / diana_coman it's worth noting that for a game like eulora, which should conceivably have massive amounts of art assets down the road, easier tools for getting those assets in place will drastically increase the volume and quality of em
punkman: diana_coman: i just hated everything about it. moving/finding things in inventory, trying to equip things and and ending up with phantom copies if I didn't click just right. Trying to walk and floating at a 45 degree angle, falling to death off smooth hills. The claim sticks that are "points" in space and keys and... I dunno. I suppose some of that might have changed already.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:05:43; davout: ^guy has it
mircea_popescu: and half of those are built in spaces where provably no problem existsw.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:17:07; fluffypony: most people building crap on top of "a blockchain" have no idea why they're doing so
mircea_popescu: why do you suppose wanna-be singer/waitress sends demos with britney spears' stuff rather than actual music ? "this is fashionable, maybe some rubs off on me!"
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:38:38; asciilifeform: while there many be 'intelligence available outside of the wot', it is ~dead to me~
mircea_popescu: and note that i include (continue with current bitcoin) in the same (intelligence outside the wot) pile. which it is.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:48:50; asciilifeform: so if you lot end up surrendering, i will simply have to add 'bitcoin replacement' to my already tall pile of 'redo computing' pyramid, slowly grind it in my mostly nonexisting spare time, and wait another 20 years to find a new set of sane people, if i live that long.
mircea_popescu: 1 is, the perfect bitcoin. which, logically, would NOT conserve coinbases. as such, it has no meaningful humantime continuity with the present Bitcoin, and so it can be done at any point etc.
mircea_popescu: 2. is the usable interim continuation of the bitcoin prototype. which, obviously, doesn't HAVE TO exist at all points to 1, but it may help if it does. we're here mostly discussing 2, i think.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's no proof you can produce for this strontium assertion.
mircea_popescu: in any case : while a hierarchy could perhaps be constructed in the "not in wot" pile, as you propose or otherwise,
mircea_popescu: so in this sense, your objections as stated don't cut anything.
mircea_popescu: most of the crud you operate on was written by gavin & co.
mircea_popescu: currently, there exists bitcoin. while this is soupier than we'd like and perhaps the collapsed eigenstate is slowly vibrating away into an undecided cloud, nevertheless, for the sake of discussion, let's say.
mircea_popescu: tomorrow, there will be : 1) mit-hardfork, run by gavin and whatever anand prakashen they can find.
mircea_popescu: 3) a miner-fork, run by whatever that fat dumb fuck can hire on freelancer.com
mircea_popescu: 4) to perhaps 12 or whatever, hardforks run by various nuts.
mircea_popescu: at this juncture, tmsr must make the decision if it will continue strictly with trb, or ALSO offer a tmsr fork of trb.
mircea_popescu: in any case trb isn't going anywhere, nor need it go anywhere.
mircea_popescu: but you should note, that there is no good reason to consider current trb so much different from cases 1-3.
mircea_popescu: eliding the complements makes this discussion dangerous, both to us and to the future.
mircea_popescu: there is a very specific danger which you perhaps are not seeing. if indeed we continu with trb as is, and if indeed 3) happens, as these two share pow and we don't control .7 or so exahash we become extremelty vulnerable. recall the fate of altcoin ?
mircea_popescu: so in this sense, "trb as is only" opens us up to being forced, later on, to pick among the idiots.
mircea_popescu: perhaps or perhaps. looky, strategy discussions are about strategy.
mircea_popescu: anyway - what isn't a strategy is "if the bad thing happens i'll get really butthurt".
mircea_popescu: so basically you propose - wait and see on trb, meanwhile i'll also develop a fork variant which i won't either share or have ready in time ?
mircea_popescu: i do not expect anything, this is why this is a discussion.
mircea_popescu: whatever your position is, it may be, but it gotta be explicit so everyone can build on it.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:53:52; asciilifeform: danielpbarron: mircea_popescu ! unless i misunderstood him somehow.
mircea_popescu: understand that if there's a summer of crazy, a NEW schelling will emerge.
mircea_popescu: i don't see the future well enough to judge what chances we have, but i do see the future well enough to see that if you have no horse in a race, you can't win it.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:54:35; asciilifeform: it melted my brain that he even half-seriously hinted at the possibility of such a thing.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:57:10; *: asciilifeform doesn't expect to get to eat lsd in his natural lifespam, just as doesn't expect a real tailored suit or to sail on a dirigible
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:56:07; asciilifeform: shinohai: possibly he thought this also, and ate some ? and during it, suggested prb ...?
mircea_popescu: and you don't see how jumping from that to this is exactly panic ?
mircea_popescu: things are happening with or without permission, as a general rule. either you're prepared for the possible outcomes, or not.
mircea_popescu: i'd rather we be prepared, if possible, and i pointedly not care how unpleasant a discussion may be to anyone's/everyone's favourite assumptions. so here we are.
mircea_popescu: specifically : if miners come up with fork, what are you going to do ? so far all i hear is "blame de gods".
mircea_popescu: yes, sure, we'll be sooner or later coming out with the perfect bitcoin, or die trying.
mircea_popescu: not in statements of fact, we're not painting a still life here. what do!
mircea_popescu: you realise what you're saying is basically, that ~you~ are taking off.
mircea_popescu: wouldja try and engage what's actually on the table rather than what's in the noggin ?
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 13:11:28; asciilifeform: the 'reddit appeal' of what we do is ~0, and this is PROPER, and it is in many ways a barometer of doing The Right Thing
mircea_popescu: in general, when your preteen's sister's friends start taking an interest in your party, you're lame.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 13:11:00; asciilifeform: 'crowdfundings', as i understand, have worked for mass crapolade
mircea_popescu: yes there are some cases where it has redistributed some dollars. in this sense, the numbers racket as practiced between the same poor black marginals 50 years ago also "worked".
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the ideas of a not free man about what freedom'd do to him are null and void.
mircea_popescu: if there could be solid weapon in 1/2-1y, you would have long ago been free man. that you aren't makes the proposition rather dubious.
mircea_popescu: the discussion is a whole not a half. yes we both understand one half of it. now you understand the other half of it.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 13:36:51; punkman: anyway, doesn't hurt to come up with a pricetag. who knows maybe the satoshi hoard might move this year.
mircea_popescu: i do not trust it at all. i'm not sure you understand this, but AT ALL.
mircea_popescu: it goes, for me, in the same pile as xmas cardano, phuctor two weeks ago, and wahtever the fuck her name was,
assbot: Logged on 20-08-2015 00:01:57; asciilifeform: 'Élisabeth de Rothschild (née de Chambure; a.k.a. Lili; March 9, 1902 - March 23, 1945) was a member by marriage of the wine-making branch of the Rothschild family.'
mircea_popescu: they are the things you say to protect from change, or w/e.
danielpbarron: what is a free man in asciilifeform terms? do I qualify by being someone who only needs to work full time for one season out of the year?
mircea_popescu: i can readily see a definition of freedom as "one has enough resources to protect himself from the outside world". this definition is impractical, however, belonging to the sphere chicken world.
mircea_popescu: by this logic, the gardener who is free needs a garden, but the movie director who is free needs his own studio. the cost of their respective freedoms, many degrees of magnitude apart.
PeterL: asciilifeform around here you could fill you list for about 20k usd per year
PeterL: only flint has lead in water, the rest of the state has great water
PeterL: rent a 1600 sqft single family home for about 1000 usd/mo
PeterL: we have cheese here too
PeterL: how much money do you spend on cheese a month?
PeterL: I'm not saying downshift, just get out of the land of outrageous rents!
PeterL: <asciilifeform> health is still ~1k/mo. << you just added another thing to the list, now we are up to 32k, still nowhere near 500k
mircea_popescu: he is a very good lawyer, and a hardworking fellow too.
mircea_popescu: also, health at 1k a month is RIDICULOUS. pretty much all over the world, cancer treatment runs you 1k/mo.
PeterL: That is about what my in-laws pay, and they are on daily medications and recovering from extensive surgery/cancer treatment
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that's an interesting datapoint, because 100 gallons of gas provide enough energy to haul 100 * 1.2 * 10^8 / 3000 = 4 tons of stuff
mircea_popescu: so you're on the space station now, with your 4ton, ie, 200k volume library ?
danielpbarron: asciilifeform> mircea_popescu: i hauled it 3km in 2014 with own hands and spent more on ~petrol~. << gas was twice as expensive then as it is now
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 16:46:21; mircea_popescu: i have a lawyer whose yearly budget for family is ~8k.
mircea_popescu: he is actually in one of those god forsaken places, doesn't matter which.
mircea_popescu: looky, lashing at me is not liable to do much. the point remains that this "i could do except alas" line is a total waste of time and utterly broken in so many parts it's not worth fixing.
mircea_popescu: i'm not even saying that, nor is it even needed. even if you ~could~ actually, provavly, known from my personal discussion with the all-knowing god, do it, what the fuck sort of arrangement is this, "so b-a exists so that alf can fix it" ? how is it better than you know, hiring microsoft to do it.
mircea_popescu: so no, broken in too many places to be worth contemplating.
mircea_popescu: this is what we're trying for here : a) birth alfs ; b) continuously.
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron iirc he published a gentoo mask few days back
mircea_popescu: course... meanwhile things happened, might not work anymopre.
danielpbarron: yeah the sane gentoo part i can figure out no problem. just never coded in ADA before
mircea_popescu: the world is not a picture, alf. the world is a moving thing. let people be wouldja!
mircea_popescu: all the things that there are can in principle be understood, or as the old jew said (in fiddler on the roof) - there is a blessing for everything.
mircea_popescu: well, either that or screaming at all teh folk who try things.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: ever seen black book movie ? << Brittany Murphy is hot? ~_~
thestringpuller: ah I was thinking of little black book. was thoroughly confoosed.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller the incredible insanity of naming a girl carice. carici being one of the numerous ways you can say cunt in romanian.
mircea_popescu: anyway, she's great in that film, warmly recommended - not just to watch, but also to get one of your own.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 14:28:06; jurov: the problem is in opposite direction, to untangle them
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 04:16:24; assbot: Loper OS » Cypress EZ-Host Firmware Development Under Linux. ... (
http://bit.ly/1p9qDDf )
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 15:03:34; punkman: diana_coman: are you having ideas about getting rid of planeshift yet?
mircea_popescu: in other news, phuctor server paid for yet another month.
mircea_popescu: yaya. i'm all about to encourage ~that~ sort of insanity.
assbot: BitBet - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match :: 80.22 B (54%) on Yes, 68.59 B (46%) on No | closed 1 day 17 hours ago ... (
http://bit.ly/1Q5VsDd )
mircea_popescu: "No kidding. What a scam this site is. I suppose they're planning on people not really reading the FAQ. I mean it calculates the odds for you and says 1 pays 1 but that's a LIE."
mircea_popescu: "The fee should also probably be taken out of profit only, not the total bet."
mircea_popescu: how about the fee gets taken out of mps fortune, and losers are refunded for good measure.
assbot: BitBet - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match :: 80.22 B (54%) on Yes, 68.59 B (46%) on No | closed 1 day 17 hours ago ... (
http://bit.ly/1U5fPD4 )
mircea_popescu: anyway, thanks god for kakobrekla's idea of implementing that calculator on site, otherwise with bets like these that draw loads of noobs (i don't mean to bitrcoin, or to betting, i mean to thinking) we'd have had degrees of magnitude more idiotic spew.
mircea_popescu spent years hunting @ballet school. they do have other theorems.
mircea_popescu: anyway. konspiraci isn't, on reflection and review, much of a persuasive explanation here.
mircea_popescu: computer plays like a shoe - true, but not just any shoe.
mircea_popescu: the same thing exists in bridge, the stickler old lady.
mircea_popescu: usually makes a 3rd to 5th in singles tourneys or else somewhere 4-10th in teams. because her quarter tricks on minor points still buy a lot.
mircea_popescu: well if he wqants to go perelman all over eulora... something could perhaps be arranged.
mircea_popescu: oh, perelman takes money now ? darn, i should headhunt the original
PeterL: did mircea_popescu mean program eulora or play eulora?
PeterL: well, S.MG is sitting on how many thousands of btc? surely that would entice anybody if spent
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 13:30:05; shinohai: Speaking of stakes, I wonder how BingoBoingo impalement project is coming.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Yes, very thin weedy thing. But it's height had become a concern given it's proximity to the power line.
BingoBoingo: Aha! I have three trees several times too big then and none the right size. I like the big ones though. Will have to look up primary sources.
BingoBoingo: there is also locust tree I am not candidate because it likely no longer has a solid core and will likely require its removal to be outsourced.
jurov: mod6 ben_vulpes i have got bitcoin-foundation.info domain, should i toss it too?
funkenstein_: <trinque> hey, regrind your vpatch and I'll sign it <-- thanks trinque :) trouble is I'm not sure what base to regrind from
funkenstein_: this seems an unsolved problem in how to use V and/or my broken understanding of how to use V
danielpbarron: isn't that another "if you have to ask" sorta things?
trinque: publish list of mega-b00ks, or go raid whichever university is still teaching math/eng re: alfs
trinque: I was hoping for the reading list!
trinque: I've heard plenty of reasonable criticism of autodidactism
trinque: maybe gotta actually train an army at some point, instead of hoping heaven drops its own
☟︎☟︎ mod6: jurov: why would you toss it?
jurov: i forgot i registerd it and now it is expiring, asking if you want to add it
mod6: jurov: are you using it for anything at all?
jurov: also, just for lulz, got targeted spam - invite to bid on foundationcoin.com
jurov: mod6 no, there was promo for .info. so i regged it and forgot
mod6: ah. i think you can let it go. we've got 'thebitcoin.foundation' for at least the next 4 years iirc. (good until 2020), and im not sure about therealbitcoin.com -- i didn't register that one.
mod6: i guess therealbitcoin.com expires on 22-10-2016
mod6: so whomever may want to renew that one.
jurov: it's me too, i'll keep it for ml
trinque: asciilifeform: what does asking for a list of books have to do with fungible cogs
trinque: I can see very well that you're not engaging me on the turf I proposed
trinque: *they* made this world, and what is the proposal for the other? I suppose engineers and mathematicians will burst from the womb having spent 9 months proving theorems
trinque: if #b-a is not growing its own theorem-provers, it is merely feeding off the tit of the world it works against.
☟︎ trinque: what is this magical people-essense we will rediscover other than good leadership?
☟︎ assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 12:38:38; asciilifeform: while there many be 'intelligence available outside of the wot', it is ~dead to me~
funkenstein_: asciilifeform: health is still ~1k/mo. <-- I LOLed
trinque wonders which of the ancient conquerors ever sat waiting for power to show up of its own accord, shield and spear in hand
☟︎ trinque: I suppose spartans just sorta emerged
trinque: fell out the womb and of the random shuffling of life, some were spartans
☟︎ trinque: I have trb dev time today. it does not address the point made about education and its function in a culture
trinque: oh I don't know, learning math?
trinque: there are more books on mathematics than could ever possibly be read by one person in one lifetime
trinque: this is exactly, entirely my point
trinque: make the room!!!!111!!11!1
trinque: if you bothered to breed well a 90% failure rate is deplorable
☟︎ trinque: the whole rest is what information you put in the skulls
☟︎ funkenstein_: i guess if it is repeated enough, it is indeed in the canon
nubbins`: prepping the crate for airdrop today
nubbins`: block 401820 for your records! i'd only re-checked this morning
PeterL: counts as a soft fork?
funkenstein_: can you exclude me from your dinner even though I have a valid mouth?
funkenstein_: they pick and choose what TX to include in a block they mine as always
☟︎ funkenstein_: heh :) well having to pay miners for their service hardly implies something broken to me
funkenstein_: lol anyway asciilifeform, got any comments about how you see patch order established for V users?
PeterL: <asciilifeform> the kitchen, regardless of what ants may think, was NOT built as an ant restaurant. << I dun get it, how does miners not including your txn equate to raiding the kitchen?
funkenstein_: asciilifeform, so if I would like to make/rebase a patch.. i should take the longest chain I have seen as the base of the diff?
PeterL: so if your patch is not included, you have to keep rebasing it every time a new patch is added until it does get included?
funkenstein_: also if people don't like a patch SN which you have in the base, they will not get to use your patch
assbot: Logged on 20-02-2016 23:42:04; mircea_popescu: you don't "release" a patch.
funkenstein_: so when trinque asks me to regrind, perhaps I should ask him for his tree
☟︎ PeterL: funkenstein_ or do you just have to ask which keys are in his wot, and you can generate a tree from there?
trinque: funkenstein_: it makes more sense for you to make your own decisions about which patches you like, and if I don't like it I'm free to alter your patch to suit me
thestringpuller: PeterL: being a chemist what was the formative era when alchemy became chemistry?
funkenstein_: R. Boyle's name comes up often in this context
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Was looking at that actually, may make the cut.
funkenstein_: thestringpuller, imho as long as grant-writers pull the wool over the eyes of the grantors, alchemy continues
shinohai: Funny I was looking at that same article before gf came over.
thestringpuller: modern alchemy? psuedoscience in a sense... But I was more referring from the psychological transition of viewing the world through the lens of alchemy vs. that of chemistry
☟︎ thestringpuller: I agree we should stop playing fast and loose with the scientific method tho...
funkenstein_: well if you can get a grant from the king to do real chemistry by suggesting there might be immortality in it, why not?
thestringpuller: i don't think there are any grants for turning led into gold
funkenstein_: aha but micro-black holes, big bang cosmology, "the singularity", etc.
thestringpuller: but that's just congealing knowledge from alchemy to chemistry :P
thestringpuller: i'm more specifically pointing out formative moments like in 2001 when the monkeys encounter the monolith
shinohai: I wasn't aware you could use "Windows" and "Security" in same expression?
thestringpuller: I haven't had to reinstall windows on my gaming rig in 3 years.
thestringpuller: I guess using my machine for single purpose- Netflix and Steam, has limited risk.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 18:12:10; asciilifeform: (incidentally, any mail re: ciphers ??)
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 19:26:45; asciilifeform: rereading the thread re: the 5 necessary spare asciilifeforms leads me to ask related q, where do we get a spare mircea_popescu if our current one breaks !
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 19:32:16; trinque: maybe gotta actually train an army at some point, instead of hoping heaven drops its own
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 19:38:02; asciilifeform: he has a good grip of military craft, and understands that only idiots engage enemy on ~his~ strong turf
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 19:47:13; trinque: if #b-a is not growing its own theorem-provers, it is merely feeding off the tit of the world it works against.
PeterL: thestringpuller I am not really strong on history, I would say 1800s, peer reviewed journals became a thing
mircea_popescu: PeterL "peer reviewed journals" became a thing in 1950s, together with state-funded science.
mircea_popescu: they were trying to emulate the previous functioning of actual science, which was very much b-a.
PeterL: <thestringpuller> I haven't had to reinstall windows on my gaming rig in 3 years << I havn't had to reinstall the OS on my mac in 9 years, it mostly sorta still works
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 19:50:53; trinque: what is this magical people-essense we will rediscover other than good leadership?
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 19:52:06; asciilifeform: what, you think ~their~ students, ~will~ ??
PeterL: <asciilifeform> i saw a win98 box once, uninfected, i shit thee not. it was connected to an alarm system, in a closet, no net connection, for decade. << my previous job we had a windows 98 box dedicated to a piece of equipment
PeterL: If it still works, why upgrade?
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 19:32:16; trinque: maybe gotta actually train an army at some point, instead of hoping heaven drops its own
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:00:05; *: trinque wonders which of the ancient conquerors ever sat waiting for power to show up of its own accord, shield and spear in hand
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> because how do you budget for that. << i have no idea wqhat the because would be, other than idiots. if i ran the lab i would, simply on grounds of independence.
mircea_popescu: and of course i'd prolly have a wailing chorus of stakeholder idiots, whom i'd tell the usual get fucked.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:00:36; trinque: fell out the womb and of the random shuffling of life, some were spartans
PeterL: asciilifeform my current lab goes the direction of paying for "service contract" with equipment manufacturers to keep our software up-to-date
mircea_popescu: PeterL and if you tell the head manager that this is a miserable abdication from his job - which is to assure you the stuff will work no matter what, he says ?
mircea_popescu: let me guess, "nobody could have foreseen - no one got fired for following the herd".
PeterL: the equipment does what we want it to, what more do we need?
mircea_popescu: PeterL i tohuhgt you were scientists ? "this experiment came out right - what more ?"
assbot: Logged on 07-03-2016 23:26:24; assbot: Logged on 07-03-2016 23:20:09; mircea_popescu: you think you're running a node, because, symptomatically, in the windows definition of running code (hey, click items till it works) you are. but the sense of running code contemplated for bitcoin is negative, not positive, and you don't know how to check for that nor do you specifically care.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:05:42; asciilifeform: trinque: everything that is ~actually worth reading~ would fit in a large room.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:09:20; trinque: if you bothered to breed well a 90% failure rate is deplorable
mircea_popescu: 10% failure rate is based on the concept that a)most will be artisans, ie, gardeners and b) periodic war and disease anyway.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:09:29; trinque: the whole rest is what information you put in the skulls
mircea_popescu: being an us style "independent" has about as much to do with independence as being a us style "liberal" has to do with liberalism ; or as much as the 6th grader's idea of "a lothario" has to do with fucking, partying and generally the dyonyssian world.
PeterL: <mircea_popescu> PeterL and if you tell the head manager that this is a miserable abdication from his job - which is to assure you the stuff will work no matter what, he says ? << If the equipment does not work the way it is supposed to, we speak to our contact and he fixes it, I don't see any abdication of job by manager here?
mircea_popescu: suppose you get married, and if you or wife need anty money, you go ask your dad.
mircea_popescu: this doesn't abdicate your role, and she would be wise to mary you in this arrangement, yes ?
PeterL: well, the company can pay me to figure out how to program it or pay the guy who built it to program it, it is just cheaper/faster for them to do it
mircea_popescu: PeterL and it'd be cheaper/faster (== easier) for your dad to pay.
mircea_popescu: a discussion of whether x is an abdication or not can not be decided on the basis of "is it cheaper or faster". because of fucking course it would be, that's what abdication means.
PeterL: do you fix your pipes yourself or do you hire a plumber?
PeterL: is hiring a plumber an abdication of duty?
assbot: Give computers the vote. They're cheaper than women, even! on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... (
http://bit.ly/1pj8ALv )
mircea_popescu: PeterL i only hire plumbers because i know how to fix my pipes.
mircea_popescu: and i have not to date hired anyone to do anything whatsoever i don't know how to do myself. how would i pay them ?
mircea_popescu: (and yes that means i can read my own fucking x rays, and say to the doctor what he says back to me.)
PeterL: and you program your own OS from scratch?
PeterL: but you use an OS written by somebody
PeterL: so wtf is even your point?
PeterL: I'm just trying to figure out what you are trying to argue here?
mircea_popescu: well, i dun know how it'd be otherwise said, so i guess we let it lay ?
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:24:40; asciilifeform: i.e. that the collective of miners CAN exclude certain tx.
PeterL: other than running your own mining pool
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:29:36; funkenstein_: they pick and choose what TX to include in a block they mine as always
PeterL: with >50% if nobody else likes you
mircea_popescu: PeterL yes, i'm aware that if we felt like it, we could just buy visa hurr durr.
PeterL: as mircea_popescu always says, "don't be poor"
mircea_popescu: "how to fly!" "don't be poor" < works. "how to cold fusion" "Don't be poor" < fails. what'd money do ?
mircea_popescu: incidentally, maybe i have a better approach re the other thread. do you suppose PeterL that if you had to take a job with one of two labs, absolutely the same offer in every respect, you'd take the job with the lab that rents space in random buildings or with the lab that owns its own building ?
PeterL: I guess I would say the one that owns a building
mircea_popescu: by the same measure, i'd prefer the lab that owns its machinery rather than borrow it from unknown people in unspecifiable conditions.
mircea_popescu: just moreso, because machinery > real estate ever since the industrial revolution.
PeterL: Okay .... I don't know where you got the idea any equipment borrowing is going on here?
mircea_popescu: a girl i own, i can order to plug into whatever cock i choose. a girl you borrow from her parents - only with prior written permission from owner.
mircea_popescu: which i suppose is as good an explanation as any as to why i don't marry : i own my equipment.
PeterL: we get the equipment, we have the manufacturers give us software to run it, then we get to do whatever we want with it
PeterL: ah, if we want to run on win98 station we would have to make driver ourself, but why would we want that?
PeterL: well, sure, but newer winblowz than 98
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how many of those things in production ? 100s ?
mircea_popescu: this sort of thing readily informs me as to your views re, say, 0day mkt.
PeterL: some equipment is non-widows, like the NMR
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform in the sad truth of the matter dept, this is kinda why the closed box crud even exists, that's the vp : "by the time someone undoes the shit, it'll be too late for the world to care"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i believe it. "advertising" works as well as make-up.
mircea_popescu: PeterL it's just miserable management, whether you see it or not.
PeterL: I guess I don't see what you would do instead?
mircea_popescu: only buy open hardware. if hardware is considered for buying, add the cost of reversing and opening it to the bill, to make a proper comparison.
mircea_popescu: ie, the win98 item is 100k in cash + 4,5mn in fixing it to spec ; this is 340k in cash + 0 etc.
PeterL: asciilifeform has it, there is no open lab equipment or software
mircea_popescu: because closed is always a competition of empires, and the chinese got 10x more cash.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:40:03; funkenstein_: it seems perhaps a checkpoint might be in order
mircea_popescu: "this decentralized paradigm is great, now can we make it centralized again plox"
mircea_popescu: i mean, this would be the exact textbook example of "work really hard, do something useful, be rich"
mircea_popescu: except by now the shitworld is so thick with shit, it "only works" for approved lottery winner.
mircea_popescu: "be less poor" suddenly a lot bitter than previously contemplated, huh ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if it makes you feel better, i'd buy it for the putative chemistry lab i don't run.
mircea_popescu: well guaranteedly you can't make any mircea_popescu 's thus, they'd simply burn down your world.
mircea_popescu: my experience, on the contrary - whenever mp as much as vaguely disliked a world, that world caught on fire by itself and cut off its own head.
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 20:46:17; funkenstein_: so when trinque asks me to regrind, perhaps I should ask him for his tree
mircea_popescu: (well really, it'd be more like "i'd like your x rebased for my tree, here it is, you see problem ?", but w/e)
PeterL: asciilifeform this robot thing looks much like what I saw at Dow, I never used it but I had coworkers who used these things for high-throughput research, I dunno what software they used
PeterL: yeah, prolly something winblows
mircea_popescu: PeterL get him in room to pitch his thing, make 15% or w/e ? asciilifeform you should prolly hire someone to make the pitch tho.
PeterL: mircea_popescu: asciilifeform is going to reverse engineer an LC-MS? and what, we get better performance out of it or something?
mircea_popescu: seems to me a 50% speed gain in high thoroughput research would be worth money.
PeterL: that was at *previous* job
mircea_popescu: when you say "we did pitch" do you mean, you went into the room, or did you hire someone who does this professionally ?
mircea_popescu: while i am not actually saying "well that's why", do bear in mind you're a miserable closer.
mircea_popescu: you have to understand, this is an actual job, exactly as respectable as whore.
mircea_popescu: you wouldn't expect to come out of your bosses' cake, on a day's notice, would you.
mircea_popescu: my previous idea of "normally this is how this sort of thing gets killed"
assbot: Logged on 10-03-2016 21:01:33; thestringpuller: modern alchemy? psuedoscience in a sense... But I was more referring from the psychological transition of viewing the world through the lens of alchemy vs. that of chemistry
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform for my own curiosity, was this ever on, say, slashdot ?
mircea_popescu: "here's how we tried - and failed - to do somerthing useful"
BingoBoingo starting to think this actually kinda sounds like a pete_dushenski problem
☟︎ mircea_popescu: "putting final gravestone" and writing the above story are not the same.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> iirc i spammed reddit, fwiw << FWIW, after sporatic success it has taken about "3 ani experienta" before I got rather reliable results infultrating the various web traffic concentrators to gather eyes.
mircea_popescu: maybe the economics are just not there, let's try and quantify this.
mircea_popescu: now, your addon, if deployed would, for the average usecase, provide an improvement of what ? 10% ? 50% ? 300% ?
mircea_popescu: i have no idea, but that doesn't mean it's not your job to.
mircea_popescu: looky : a "typical case" is a convention, allowing management to make judgements.
mircea_popescu: it is, much like the "average voter", "median consumer" etc, a fiction, made by some methods.
mircea_popescu: i don't care how fucking different they are. typical case will be had or the sky falls.
mircea_popescu: anyway, if you don't have the experience to discuss typical, discuss case study. the one time you tried this.
mircea_popescu: seeing all the recent scandals with falsifications etc, i'd be much surprised if they even run the equipment anymore, so yeah.
mircea_popescu: and in other news, omfg this provolone is magnificent.
mircea_popescu: <mircea_popescu> now, your addon, if deployed would, for the average usecase, provide an improvement of what ? 10% ? 50% ? 300% ?
mircea_popescu: ok, so what i'll say is, "this machine, once deployed, would improve your workflow by about 15%, which is worth about 50k or so. it could also be had hiring techs, at a cost of about 60k a year for the machine's lifespan"
mircea_popescu: "the cost for its deployment includes me spending a month fucking up yoru shit, which is about 10k or so, and our fee, which is 2500 a year"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you forget that in a previous lifetime i made a lot of money out of insepcting and changing production workflow.
mircea_popescu: not to say it is your fault, tho. but i can see why it didn't sell, needn't any conspiracy to explain it.
mircea_popescu: this is a large part of the problem. there's a hidden barrier to entry here, that is the "cost to enter wot". ie, as a manager of x item, i MAY consider dealing wioth nobody. but not over anything.
mircea_popescu: much like the cost to send bitcoin txn, that random derps imagine to be "=fee" is in fact something like 0.5 to 5 btc PER TX, if you include EVERYTHING ytou need to run bitcoin payments,
mircea_popescu: just so the cost of dealing with some dude is not 0 in any sense.
mircea_popescu: just the fact that i have toi make an entry in my phonebook is $$$.
mircea_popescu: i wouldn't take this failure to be more informative than it is. the technology never entered into discussion, it failed on economic grounds.
mircea_popescu: so importantly - understand that it's in no sense a matter of 'stop being you, be somebody else'. anyone else would confront the same exact problem,, which is to say that this is not able to stand on its own. would work superbly as an add-on product of a company offering this kinbd of thing that can x-sell it.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: but otherwise, it's not workable, and it wouldn't be workable for trump.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: incidentally, this trap is what informs the vc circus' derpage about "big" bla bla.
mircea_popescu: yeah, it metastasized into idiocy, but originally it's the very logical observation that the draw needed to make sales in b2b is much larger than consumer.