ThickAsThieves: mp did you see preston's retort? it's like a text version of the baby-with-mirror gif http://prestonbyrne.com/2014/04/21/that-didnt-take-long/
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06835246 = 0.3418 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: TLDR = No u!
kakobrekla: bb dude have you read that thread, jesus fuck.
ThickAsThieves: the preston dude is offensively oblivious
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves no, is it any good ?
mircea_popescu: mike_c you now get a link off "cookie". good enuff ?
BingoBoingo: kakobrekla: The part where they finally liquidate after a bunch of "no u" back and forth between Gar and Goat
mike_c: ah, yes. good enuff.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves heh wd.
kakobrekla: im not even sure what they are doing
kakobrekla: its like monthy python on drugs
kakobrekla: and real.
assbot: Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. (http://dpaste.com/1795538/plain/)
mircea_popescu: !b 3
mircea_popescu: the stones from the earth have spoken through the kako
mircea_popescu: bashed 102 quotes with 4440 votes < this is like.. not bad is it.
kakobrekla: srs, look at this, must be preserved;
kakobrekla: --
kakobrekla: Quote from: Garr255 on April 21, 2014, 10:30:18 PM
kakobrekla: Cognitive Mining LLC is no longer liable for any past or present action or involved in the management of this project in any way. It is fully within the rights of Cognitive Mining LLC to find a new operator and resign.
kakobrekla: --
kakobrekla: what is this even
BingoBoingo: No one knows except the people who shouldn't
mircea_popescu: it looks like they're announcing a new bitcoin credit card
mircea_popescu: imo
kakobrekla: lol
artifexd: ;;rate hanbot 1 vital part of my education
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user hanbot has been recorded.
ThickAsThieves: yknow this auth shit frustrates when paired with a crash
Duffer1: a ~20min grace would be nice
Duffer1: if possible
BingoBoingo: It already has a 2-3 minute grace
BingoBoingo: http://ricks.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2014/04/18/the_future_of_war_25_you_better_be_ready_to_fight_like_its_a_pre_electronic_age
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5408 @ 0.0009501 = 5.1381 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10298 @ 0.00094989 = 9.782 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: jurov: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=579498.0
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.06963114 = 0.6963 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12050 @ 0.00094851 = 11.4295 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: http://prestonbyrne.com/2014/04/23/bitcoin-needs-a-new-logo/
mircea_popescu: !up vcorem
assbot: Voicing vcorem for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: Preston has so much derp http://prestonbyrne.com/2014/04/22/the-ballad-of-doug-the-dao-part-1-time-to-stop-thinking-like-an-engineer/
mircea_popescu: "The U.S. Air Force, for example, no longer trains navigators in celestial sightings,"
mircea_popescu: holy shit.
BingoBoingo: Yeah, but... sounds right based of whisperings.
BingoBoingo: The ground pounders seem to still be getting well versed in the arts of map and compass, but for the rest...
mircea_popescu: this reads to me like "the us cook force no longer trains sauce chefs in flour-and-oil saucing"
BingoBoingo: Then there's the accident by which a fuel tanker and crew were lost because control systems failed. The crew was done in though by a lack of parachutes which had been recently removed.
mircea_popescu: well what the fuck then
mike_c: this preston jackass strikes me as a rebirth of dr foreskin. not worth even getting riled up over, and yet he manages to get under my skin with his herp derp.
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 496.2, Best ask: 496.41, Bid-ask spread: 0.21000, Last trade: 496.41, 24 hour volume: 8131.92029418, 24 hour low: 480.0, 24 hour high: 505.0, 24 hour vwap: 490.566399614
mircea_popescu: mike_c do you like zappa ?
mike_c: i don't really know him
BingoBoingo: Well the US defense posture goes back to the comments here where the challenges of an actual invasion of the US are discussed in terms of some areas having too many hillbillies to hold for an invader http://trilema.com/2014/most-wrong-and-absolutely-wrongest/
mircea_popescu: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZHa0_W8PD8 that's the song.
mircea_popescu: ow fuck. no, wrong one. this is it : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQQOhwL7nkM
mike_c: i was getting into disco boy :) i like it.
mircea_popescu: Don't know much about dancin' that's why I got this song
mircea_popescu: One of my legs is shorter than the other 'n both my feet's too long
mircea_popescu: 'Course now right along with 'em I got no natural rhythm
mircea_popescu: But I go dancin' every night hopin' one day I might get it right
mircea_popescu: I hear that beat; I jump outa my seat but I can't compete, cause I'm a dancin' fool, I'm a dancin' fool
BingoBoingo: The greatest problem with the movie Red Dawn is that no sane invader of the US would spend more effort than necessary to hold the Rockie Mountains than that necessary to cripple command structures there.
mircea_popescu: When they see me comin' they all step aside
mircea_popescu: They has a fit while I commit my social suicide,
mircea_popescu: etc.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo i don't imagine anyone would be invading the us.
mircea_popescu: just you know, sink all its cruisers and impose a massive war reparations programme.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: In the next 100 to 500 year someone might want to use Kansas as their own breadbasket.
mircea_popescu: why ?
mircea_popescu: just tax the locals.
BingoBoingo: See this is the genius of Putin in Crimea and the enablement of US golden toilets all rolled into one.
BingoBoingo: Putin could have crimea and Eastern Ukraine because the people already favor Russia.
mircea_popescu: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BmAqdKJCUAAHdzf.jpg << dat michelle ass.
BingoBoingo: However if 1000 hillbillies with rifles oppose their own government over cows...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7652 @ 0.00094896 = 7.2614 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: What luck do the Chinese have
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1848 @ 0.00095066 = 1.7568 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: The same thing that gives Putin his good fortune enables America's golden toilets thus.
BingoBoingo: The entire world is Italy.
mircea_popescu: http://bitbet.us/bet/804/obama-will-mention-bitcoin-before-2015/#c2845a << re this, kakobrekla or anyone with the data ready, what's the average duration for bitbet bets ?
jurov: BingoBoingo they don't necessarily favor Russia, they know well who Putin is
jurov: but they will be made to favor it any way necessary
BingoBoingo: jurov: Well, no one is offered a perfectly selection of choices.
BingoBoingo: What enables or prohibits aggression for territory, is not tanks fighter jets, or nukes but the williness or lack thereof to accept certain kinds or sources of governance.
mircea_popescu: let me interject something related i was just happening to read. a bit of a paste :
mircea_popescu: This stickiness of the Semitic languages supports a speculation: by the 7th Century there had to be many pockets in the Western Mediterranean of Punic-Canaanite speakers, about a thousand years after the fall of Carthage. Falling under Roman rule did not turn the population into Latin speakers (only for scholarly purposes, say Saint Augustine of Hyppo; we have much evidence of diglossia in the Levant, of the use of a l
mircea_popescu: anguage at home and for oral communication that is different from the language of writing, and doing so for 1000 years). And there had to be plenty of Semitic language speakers; just follow placenames from Carthage to Ramatuelle in France near Saint Tropez (ramat el means hill of God in both Canaanite and Hebrew). Even Marseilles seems to come from Marsa, port in Canaanite (and not from Massilia the Roman name since th
mircea_popescu: e Romans did not make names, but transcribed them). I estimate that the third of the coastal villages spoke Semitic dialects. The modus of the Phoenicians was network, hence a system of trade links built on trust (you send merchandise to a relative who pays you back; you needed a certain amount of trust before the letter of credit). The region is large: it extends all the way to Mogador on the Atlantic coast.
mircea_popescu: This explains the mystery of the effortless Arab invasion of the Southern and Western Mediterranean, all the way to Spain (and, less advertised, the Portuguese Algarve). They had to be welcomed by the local population along the coast. Canaanite and Arabic are easily mutually comprehensible (the distance between Semitic languages is very short, a corrollary of the stability thanks to the triplet of consonnants). And it
mircea_popescu: is wasy for a Punic speaker to progressively become an Arabic speaker, since he already knows 80-90% of the vocabulary.
mircea_popescu: This also gives some credibility to the thesis that was popping up in the 19th century that the North African Jews had a Phoenician origin (or that the difference between Canaanite and Jew before the rabbinical period was not very pronounced for p
mircea_popescu: ( http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/notebook.htm, taleb's article)
BingoBoingo: !up aadeseye
assbot: Voicing aadeseye for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: !up vcorem
assbot: Voicing vcorem for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: so BingoBoingo, war may simply be that : dating.
kakobrekla: 85 days
mircea_popescu: who are the hillbillies going to support ? bigus dickus, the roman bureaucrat ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Of course it is. Diplomacy is also dating. Governance is a different thing though. Marriage.
mircea_popescu: jesus, the local nut ?
BingoBoingo: Usually the local nut.
mircea_popescu: putin the redbeard, the norwegian rapist cum invader ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1164 @ 0.00094851 = 1.1041 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla ty!
mircea_popescu: do you also sleep ?
mircea_popescu: http://www.youtube.com/embed/zPGb4STRfKw << bigus dickus
BingoBoingo: The hill billies always support the local nut, or the regional nut they can identify with
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11100 @ 0.00094837 = 10.5269 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: 90 if you include the time from closing to resolution
kakobrekla: ;;ud sleep
gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sleep | You have been awake for 18 hours and are now viewing this useless definition of sleep. You are very tired and your brain is not functioning at its ...
kakobrekla: srsly someone planted that there eh
kakobrekla: next time ill rather google.
BingoBoingo: The wife is called Incontientia
mircea_popescu: incontinentia buttocks
BingoBoingo: Lol phrasing
BingoBoingo: .bait
ozbot: http://37.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8732uiP5v1r6bw5mo1_1280.png
BingoBoingo: http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20810638,00.html
ozbot: Justin Bieber Detained by Customs at Los Angeles Airport - Crime & Courts, Justin Bieber : People.co
mircea_popescu: shot ruined by panties srsly.
random_cat: wut benkay
BingoBoingo: Yeah, in other news, elmo acquitted http://gawker.com/ex-elmo-voice-actor-kevin-clash-cleared-of-sexual-abuse-1567240733
mircea_popescu: im sure the practicak difference between acquittal and conviction is less than the difference between his life pre and post that nonsense.
BingoBoingo: For sure
BingoBoingo: In still continued news http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/24/us/colorado-marijuana-fourth-graders/index.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_topstories+%28RSS%3A+Top+Stories%29
BingoBoingo: Also a case of If you can You must http://gawker.com/school-agrees-to-stop-pumping-kids-full-of-mountain-dew-1567173577
BingoBoingo: !up jborkl_
assbot: Voicing jborkl_ without time-limit.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11100 @ 0.00094776 = 10.5201 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: http://girls.twistys.com/preview/dailyupdates/2014/04/20/ryanryans-31565/images/full/03.jpg
mircea_popescu: check out that awful titjob
ThickAsThieves: 0O
BingoBoingo: That's like liver and stomach boobs. Missed the chest by quite a bit
BingoBoingo: Chicago http://deadspin.com/the-cubs-400-pound-wrigley-cake-is-sitting-in-a-dumpste-1567177257
ThickAsThieves: nonsensical derpitude
BingoBoingo: Also the left hand path http://regressing.deadspin.com/can-you-predict-if-your-kid-will-throw-left-handed-1552111458/+kylenw
BingoBoingo: ThickAsThieves: Whatever, you aren't getting any of my insider info.
ThickAsThieves: "he researchers indeed discovered that left-handedness, like schizophrenia, was highly associated with being conceived in May or June " yknow this has always been my theory of how zodiac traits were started
BingoBoingo: I also swear deadspin might be the only Gawker enterprise worth saving.
ThickAsThieves: seasonal effects on mother, child, and the people influencing the child
BingoBoingo: Eh, I'm right handed but left eye dominant. Sometimes I'm clumsy, but that is usually just distilled rather than beyond the grave spirits at work.
ThickAsThieves: also in my own experience many of the crazies i met that are also smart are left-handed
cazalla: BingoBoingo: interesting article - my son is 14 weeks ATM, is favouring his left hand when grabbing for things yet no left handers in my family although my father is schizophrenic as was my grandfather and my uncle
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Well, teach him to throw a baseball and save his economic future.
ThickAsThieves: my brother favored his left hand but my dad basically "corrected" him out of it
mircea_popescu: speaking of may and june, check this shit out :
mircea_popescu: http://bitbet.us/bet/804/obama-will-mention-bitcoin-before-2015/#c2849
ozbot: BitBet - Obama will mention Bitcoin before 2015
mircea_popescu: the may-june-july hole
Duffer1: in case anyone has some scorn they need to let out https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=581995.0
Duffer1: Adeally
cazalla: mircea_popescu: didn't Obama already mention it last year albeit off the cuff remark questioning he needed to worry about it or not
ThickAsThieves: do those stats also conveniently map to bubbles?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: What I gather is that SEO spammers can't spec interesting bets
cazalla: if*
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves maybe. was there a bubble last summer ?
ThickAsThieves: april
BingoBoingo: No, last summer was a slump
ThickAsThieves: maybe it's an indicator!
BingoBoingo: $100-80 until the rally to the millenial value
ThickAsThieves: correlation = causation!
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: The discussion usually centers around “politeness“, because the mimics don’t really have the intellectual ability to identify, nor the ethical fiber to enunciate the real problem << reminds me:
ThickAsThieves: i think low bet submissions being topical is enough to change the tide
asciilifeform: paging herr naggum!
asciilifeform: http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3243007932071437@naggum.no.html
ozbot: Re: Bohr's way - Naggum cll archive
asciilifeform: http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3244958379944187@naggum.no.html
ozbot: Re: Difference between LISP and C++ - Naggum cll archive
asciilifeform: (ignore the thread titles, these were strictly psychiatric ruminations, nothing to do with programming computer)
ThickAsThieves: ascii thats good stuff
ThickAsThieves: "It has been my experience that it is strongly related to competence, but
ThickAsThieves: competence is related to some method of measurement of your success at
ThickAsThieves: what you try to do. If you work in a field where you cannot distinguish
ThickAsThieves: between good or bad, where everything is someone's "personal opinion" and
ThickAsThieves: nobody has any right answers, that just /has/ to be destructive for your
ThickAsThieves: self-confidence. "
ThickAsThieves: basically my epitaph in marketing industry
cazalla: http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/columnist/wolff/2013/10/27/ceos-are-often-clueless-about-technology/3182203/ so Obama aware of Bitcoin in October of last year, wonder if that increases odds of meeting bet criteria
BingoBoingo: The most exciting treatise on politics Gawker has ever hosted http://deadspin.com/pine-tar-should-be-fully-legal-and-baseball-is-still-f-1567100538
ThickAsThieves: "The reason we didn't like it was because it was so 'in your face.' If he had been a little more discreet with it nothing would have ever been said."
ThickAsThieves: lol
BingoBoingo: Truth
BingoBoingo: Everything is legal so long as you wait until the contest is over to flaunt it
ThickAsThieves: even the commenters that think they get it don't
ThickAsThieves: "Totally agree that it should be legal. In the mean time, Pineda really just needs to get better at this. I mean, he should realize that he is being watched after the last incident, there has to be a better place to put pine tar than on your neck. Just learn to cheat better."
ThickAsThieves: everyone talking about how he should have cheated
ThickAsThieves: not whether
BingoBoingo: I mean the writer cam to the wrong conclusion. It should still stay "banned" but discretion is the first step towards sophistication.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo, ThickAsThieves, other players of baseball - is the tar considered a cheat because it gives actual advantage? or merely not part of the regulation game?
ThickAsThieves: assimilate or eliminate is my motto
ThickAsThieves: if elimination is not possible,
ThickAsThieves: assimilation is mandatory
ThickAsThieves: as in, they obv cant totally stop people from using it
ThickAsThieves: therefore allow them to use it
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Tar for pitchers is considered a forbiden necessity. For batters it is completely acceptable.
BingoBoingo: Also http://deadspin.com/does-your-favorite-team-suck-at-keeping-an-efficient-pa-1567366582
asciilifeform: elaborate on the 'forbidden necessity'
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3482 @ 0.00094846 = 3.3025 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: similar to, say, steroids?
ThickAsThieves: basically people are superstitious that picthers can do magical things when using tar
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: It's use is necessary to master the craft, but exposing it is a faux pas.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Different from steroids in that the results are more quantifiable.
ThickAsThieves: pitchers argue its only to prevent totally losing the ball into ttghe crowd
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3818 @ 0.00095492 = 3.6459 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: the answer is probly in the middle
ThickAsThieves: baseball is very traditional though
BingoBoingo: Steroids do little in baseball beyond decreasing the time to recover from injury and maybe adding a bit of power. Doctoring a ball though is nearly essential for a pitcher to excel.
BingoBoingo: Basically there are reasons it is mostly aging hitters taking steroids, but every pitcher is doctoring the ball.
ThickAsThieves: has anyone done useful research about pitching with tar?
BingoBoingo: (This sidesteps the part where all of the good batters have ADHD diagnoses because amphetamines are the best performance enhancer for a batter)
BingoBoingo: ThickAsThieves: Not for your budget.
ThickAsThieves: ?
ThickAsThieves: my budget?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: what kind of diagnoses do, e.g. marathon runners get? anemia?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Yes. Marathoners get anemia. Hockey players get various autoimmune diagnoses.
BingoBoingo: To justify constant anti-inflammatory drugs
asciilifeform: lol
asciilifeform: what disease should one contract as, say, chess player ?
BingoBoingo: That probably would be ADHD again.
BingoBoingo: And is the reason many high level players don't want to see olympic chess.
asciilifeform: i thought this was because FIDE wanted to ban coffee
BingoBoingo: That too.
mircea_popescu: the se;f confidence thing sounds just like greenspun's problem
asciilifeform: (who'll play after this!?)
BingoBoingo: But the distinction between leaded and unleaded coffee isn't caffinated vs. decaf.
mircea_popescu: cazalla well, if he had or hadn't, still has to be in bet interval. wasn't like a "first time" or anything
asciilifeform: leaded coffee!
ThickAsThieves: lol forumite says to me "What would it possibly take for you to remove the negative trust you left me?"
BingoBoingo: It was rumored that in baseball clubhouses leaded vs. unleaded was how they refered to amphetamine spiked coffee
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo what does tar do ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: It affects grip and the aerodynamics of the ball.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: And this is baseball so there are nearly as many balls spent in the game as outs.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: amphetamine isn't magic. see:
asciilifeform: http://yarchive.net/med/nootropics.html
ozbot: Nootropics ("smart drugs") (Steven B. Harris, M.D.)
asciilifeform: mandatory reading for the 'better living through chemistry' aficionados.
mircea_popescu: this is what, tar like on their hands ? like oil ?
asciilifeform: tldr - engineering tradeoffs of self-medication
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10500 @ 0.00094732 = 9.9469 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Pine tar. So the sticky stuff pine leaks basically. Batters use it to not throw the bat into the crowd. Pitchers use it to add precision to the point they release the ball.
ThickAsThieves: it's sticky
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Those exist indeed.
mircea_popescu: oic
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: analogous to flying jet on 'afterburner'
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Or rocket with boosters. The sauce only provides benefits for so long.
mircea_popescu: afterburners are a pain in most situations tho. much less precision
BingoBoingo: Well afterburners is amphetamine. Pine tar is whatever makes a plane more responsive, engineered instability or whatever
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0698999 = 0.3495 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: amusingly, i think pine tar is... amphetamine
mircea_popescu: funny how that wraps.
asciilifeform: i can hardly think of pine tar without tasting in my head that crap the greeks drink.
BingoBoingo: Well, it is not an incredibly simple mapping.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo but the one thing that makes the plane "more responsive" is spiking the pilot.
BingoBoingo: Of course. It is better though if both the pilot and plane are spiked.
asciilifeform: one can easily think of the design boundaries here (spiked fellow in ww1 sopwith, vs 'clean' one in modern jet)
asciilifeform: basic boojum here is, however, 'first ecstacy, then laundry'
BingoBoingo: Pine tar is spiking the plane (The F-16, a wily old pitcher) amphetamine is spiking the pilot (B-2 crews, Barry Bonds)
asciilifeform: as described by steve harris
BingoBoingo: lol
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Your link on nootropics reminds me of why the alcohol/caffine combination is my prefered and only regular combination from that toolset.
mircea_popescu: "If you /are/ the majority and I am in the minority, how could you possibly believe that I have not already and many years ago figured out exactly how you guys work? If you had the brain to do it, this would be a grave insult, but you do not think ahead. You do in fact not think at all, because the things you say can only be uttered by a mind closed shut long ago."
mircea_popescu: lelz
BingoBoingo: The only big error with the link is that nicotine is not *cholinergic* at all
BingoBoingo: Nicotine is nicotinic
BingoBoingo: Works on its own subset of the acetycholine responsive system while ignoring others.
asciilifeform: ;;google nicotinic acetylcholine receptor
gribble: Nicotinic acetylcholine receptor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotinic_acetylcholine_receptor>; Acetylcholine receptor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acetylcholine_receptor>; Nicotinic agonist - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotinic_agonist>
asciilifeform: pediwikia will have to suffice for now
BingoBoingo: And the literature reveals nicotine excites some, but not all cholinergic receptors.
asciilifeform: sure
asciilifeform flashbacks to old day job
mircea_popescu: no he has a point, calling it cholinergic is a ridiculous approximation.
mircea_popescu: might as well call busses "avionic"
asciilifeform: lul
mircea_popescu: well... they're kinda similar.
asciilifeform: the little plane that goes to timis. from germany is astoundingly bus-like.
BingoBoingo: Well, think of dopamine (which the pharmacologically illerterate posit fuels all addiction)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.069975 = 0.4199 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: There are different dopamine agonists and antagonists that don't all hit the same types of dopamine receptors
mircea_popescu: dude i love this chan. i shall now write yet another great trilema article on the basis of shit i ran into here.
BingoBoingo: And of the major addictive drugs of abuse only cocaine and amphetamines hit any type of dopamine receptor primarily
mircea_popescu: and i'm not gonna give stan any more credit than i gave benkay either
asciilifeform: one of the things i used to do is model action of oximes (as an antidote to anticholinergics)
BingoBoingo: If dopamine for its own sake was the desired effect, junkies would skip heroin and just eat L-DOPA and broadbreans
asciilifeform: and this always gave me sad thoughts about how a very similar mechanism could probably be used to zap 'tolerance' to, e.g. caffeine
asciilifeform: but It Would Be Wrong (TM)
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: And I sat through literally 2/3rds of the PharmD curiculumn, half of it twice. But as a TA so I get no credit for having done such a thing.
asciilifeform: eat L-DOPA and broadbreans << nope. kinetics are 90% of the fun
asciilifeform: as you probably know.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Kinetics are huge.
asciilifeform: consider why cocainistas snort, inject - never eat
BingoBoingo: Poor first pass metabolism
BingoBoingo: isn't economical to eat.
BingoBoingo: With L-Dopa the Blood Brain Barrier plays a role, but convulsions play a bigger one
BingoBoingo: Nicotine is the perfect model of an addictive drug because tremendous excess is tolerated by the peripheral neurons, but its absence after tolerance raises holy fucking hell.
mircea_popescu: holy fucking hell my foot.
mircea_popescu: it raises the most minor of inconveniences conceivable.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: In the accultured. As opposed to the occasional
mircea_popescu: people just conveniently pretend like their experiences matter out of all proportion.
BingoBoingo: Sure.
mircea_popescu: do an experiment where you get shocked at a modest 48 volts at random intervals on average 8 times a second.
mircea_popescu: for you know, nine weeks.
BingoBoingo: Imma prolly miss the shocks.
asciilifeform: you can buy a convenient instrument for this.
mircea_popescu: in your teeth.
asciilifeform: at dog shops
mircea_popescu: now that's an inconvenience. not fucking nicotine deprivation.
asciilifeform: teeth? what'd you have? the fabled 'radio amalgam' ?
mircea_popescu: just sayin'.
mircea_popescu: get a special bed rigged where you get pricked with a pin. all the time. somewhere.
BingoBoingo: Well, you have to consider what receptor is involved at the intersection of skeletal muscle and the neuro
mircea_popescu: or forget that even. just a sm
mircea_popescu: simple programme of... load crates 16 hours a day. every day.
mircea_popescu: or dig ditches or w/e.
BingoBoingo: Now we're getting to common ground
mircea_popescu: after six weeks of that, the choice is never smoke again and never have to crate it up again
mircea_popescu: or both.
mircea_popescu: suddenly the hot fucking hell is like...
BingoBoingo: 16 hours of lifting arbitrary things about nicotine cessation for the habituated
mircea_popescu: arbitrary things over 30lbs
BingoBoingo: Over 15lbs even, if we are going arbitrary and 16 hours, 5-15 lbs, The unpredictability of load has value.
mircea_popescu: 30 to 60.
mircea_popescu: good enough
BingoBoingo: Keep in mind my experiences prolly don't map onto to many others. I'm missing 1/2 to 3/4 the D2 receptors most people have in the general population)
mircea_popescu: anyway. i'm kinda up to here with the smoking addiction thing. i've been smoking since ~16. that's two decades ago. i still smoke, i average a pack a month. prolly less these days. it takes all the willpower of a tomato as far as i can tell, it's never bothered me.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: I'm missing 1/2 to 3/4 the D2 receptors << where'd you misplace them?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform bad divorce.
asciilifeform: lol
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Back when 23andme made medical declarations I spit in a tube. Apparently I am part A-Rab
BingoBoingo: I guess because the gene was TAQ something or other
asciilifeform: my first guess was MPTP.
BingoBoingo: Nah
asciilifeform: ;;google Barry Kidston MPTP
gribble: MPTP - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPTP>; Opiophilia: The Frozen Addicts: A Cautionary Tale: <http://opiophilia.blogspot.com/2013/09/the-frozen-addicts-cautionary-tale.html>; Heroin, MPTP, and the key to Parkinson's Disease - Everything2.com: <http://everything2.com/title/Heroin%252C+MPTP%252C+and+the+key+to+Parkinson%2527s+Disease>
BingoBoingo: I'm familiar with MPTP induced parkinsons from reading.
asciilifeform: better than from practice!
BingoBoingo: Parkinsons is more a D-1 and D-3 thing though.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 9 @ 0.07 = 0.63 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: I have an admitedly odd neurology. I throw a baseball right handed but have to shoot the rifle left handed.
BingoBoingo: My left eye tremendously overpowers the right, but my right hand tremendously has dexterity over the left.
BingoBoingo: In practice this works great for watching porn because different halves of my brain can be watching porn vs. jacking me off, a perfect stranger
asciilifeform: wetware DMA ?
BingoBoingo: More like SCSI.
asciilifeform: lol
BingoBoingo: Terminators and all
asciilifeform: this has potential for good sf story mindfuck
asciilifeform: folks in the Dark Future of Hello Kitty (TM) splitting their brain, so they can literally (in their head) fuck themselves.
BingoBoingo: I also throw a bowling ball with alternating hands given situations favorable to one side or the other's strengths
BingoBoingo: The only people IRL on OL with similar issues were notorious epileptics so I guess being more functional than that is a plus.
BingoBoingo: For all I actually know maybe I am more addicted to menthol than nicotine
asciilifeform: shouldn't be hard to find out which, no?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.512005 = 1.024 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Especially hard since 23andme conceded medicine to MObama
BingoBoingo: The beautiful thing is this doesn't much matter.
asciilifeform: i meant, by taking only one and see what happens
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 481 @ 0.00444549 = 2.1383 BTC [-] {14}
BingoBoingo: There are some practical restrictions. Like my preference for menthol cigarettes.
BingoBoingo: Next thing you know I will forsake N.W.A. for Sheryl Crow
BingoBoingo: Also I can't threaten incapacitating my self that much lest BTC/AtC goes to hell
asciilifeform: where's it now?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: It is well within the specs I set when I raped herbi and his wife's future.
BingoBoingo: Between 100 and 200 satoshis
asciilifeform: i now confess that i missed what was herbi and wife
asciilifeform: some bozo invested his fortune in atc ?!?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: The conversation is attached to here http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2014/04/24/my-role-in-s-mpif/
BingoBoingo: He invested little. It seemed to be a small portion of his anything.
asciilifeform: so how'd this constitute a zapping of future?
BingoBoingo: You were at points in the conversation.
asciilifeform: lol i was wasnt i
asciilifeform: prob. on autopilot
BingoBoingo: Read on, you saw it the first time.
BingoBoingo: He sought to seed microstructures, but every order he entered was like my betting green in roulette and hitting.
asciilifeform: lel
mircea_popescu: <BingoBoingo> asciilifeform: It is well within the specs I set when I raped herbi and his wife's future. << dude srsly.
mircea_popescu: suppose you actually do something like that one day.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.0742218 = 0.1484 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: what are you going to say, "herp", because you already used the proper expression in april 2014 ?
mircea_popescu: gotta save yourself some cake.
asciilifeform: 'dynamic range'
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0325 = 0.1625 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Prolly. Cake comes and goes. I might hammer out consistent gains, but probably never again over a bid-ask pread of 4 times
BingoBoingo: (spread so deep it lost a consanant)
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i re-read that thing. maybe it'd make sense to me with strong drink.
asciilifeform: as it is i'm tuned to wrong frequency, perhaps
benkay: ;;later tell decimation i did indeed and would be pleased to help you do the same although i'm sure you can figure it out
gribble: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Well I mentioned this in another post, but it goes back to baseball. Who carries half of a ptcher's success and why?
asciilifeform reviews piece on baseball in '93 issue of 'наука и жизнь'
asciilifeform lives in usa since '92 and needs to do this
BingoBoingo: Normally the answer is the catcher calling pitches, as a great catcher is a slightly better source of entropy than the batter
BingoBoingo: This exists as an exact why for bitches loving Yadier Molina.
BingoBoingo: Though on the same team and Albert Pujols becoming a legend first, this is the exact machanism that made Pujols fungible with Carlos Beltran et al. while Molina was and is irreplaceable.
asciilifeform: anyone here other than BingoBoingo - gets this?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo works as scholar of sport? a referee?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Consider the game of chess vs. the game of artillery.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.07 = 0.21 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: In chess there is a tremendous advantage to anticipating lines your opponent might try to put forth.
BingoBoingo: Where as in artillery the goal is to hit the target first.
asciilifeform: vs where?
BingoBoingo: Well, a pitcher to get an out either has to throw three strikes or get the hitter to put the ball in a location favorable to one of their fielders.
BingoBoingo: Multiple attempts are a necessity
BingoBoingo: No less than three.
BingoBoingo: Vs. artillery where the opponent merely needs to hit you once
asciilifeform: perhaps in msdos game 'scorched earth', where each side gets one cannon.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Actually I am thinking the Apple II version, but yes, that artillery game
benkay: <mircea_popescu> and i'm not gonna give stan any more credit than i gave benkay either << wot ch2 omission smarted
BingoBoingo: Otherwise we could suppose infinite shitty alternate artillery games where one side produces a grunt who climbs a hill and stabs the cannon to death.
mircea_popescu: benkay hm ?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: 'paratrooper'
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: lol.
asciilifeform: http://image.dosgamesarchive.com/screenshots/paratrooper.gif
benkay: mircea_popescu: dun think i got any credit for popping the recent sybils.
mircea_popescu: no credit for you!
benkay: used to it
benkay: 's why i'm in mgmt these days
benkay: (marginally)
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Reminds me of a conundrum. Every US Infantry officer gets the chance at ranger school after graduation, but many officers deployed to ostentiably infantry assignments will not be infantry officers.
BingoBoingo: Afghanistan fucks all empires
BingoBoingo: Because Italy
BingoBoingo: By Italy I mean classic Italy, anyone born more than two barns from you and your goats is a foreigner
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: If you want a shortcut to understanding baseball the 2011 world series game six and 2012 StL vs. Washington NLDS game five paired with the 2013 NLCS makes a nice summary of the entire contemporary game
BingoBoingo: Narrative: Innexplicable offense, still moar inexplicable offense, dissapointement by regression to the mean.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13800 @ 0.00094742 = 13.0744 BTC [+] {3}
BingoBoingo: benkay: Am I representing 'Murican infatuation with baseball fairly?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.03201 = 0.3201 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: Poor assbot, the BTC-TC collapse has kept it so quiet
ThickAsThieves: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 469.95, Best ask: 469.96, Bid-ask spread: 0.01000, Last trade: 469.96, 24 hour volume: 13964.55874092, 24 hour low: 469.96, 24 hour high: 505.0, 24 hour vwap: 487.558581229
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0703 = 0.3515 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: the sky, it's at my feet!
benkay: BingoBoingo: couldn't say i'm a rebel cascadian hiding in the hills
benkay: BingoBoingo: were we to lay out diamonds we'd get insta-zapped by drones
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0704 = 0.1408 BTC [+]
benkay: so uh amazon
BingoBoingo: benkay: Well befor I realized my mammal vexation was an actual mouse what remedies did I Spz?
benkay: oh wizards of high finance and running companies - what the fuck is up with amazon?
benkay: pardon, BingoBoingo ?
BingoBoingo: benkay: Amazon burns all the capital, because growth.
benkay: it can't be that simple
BingoBoingo: benkay: May be a couple logs ago
benkay: BingoBoingo: moisin, do i recall?
BingoBoingo: benkay: Mosin was one option, some sks variant was another with the particular variant left in the air, so long as it wasn't chinese
benkay: rifles vs drones?
BingoBoingo: Nah, vs. "mice"
BingoBoingo: Shoe took care of "mice" which was an actual mouse
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 19 @ 0.0075 = 0.1425 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: Bitch to scrape off of the floor, but... learning
benkay: BingoBoingo: is amazon burning the capital? the party line is that they're reinvesting it.
benkay: i haven't looked at the actual books but i'm imagining that each spend on one side is balanced by an acquisition on the other. maybe just of engineering time, but w/e.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.0715 = 0.286 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: benkay: As best as I can tell with Amazon is that they have done nothing other than reinvest in their history. Like the Poker Player who doubled down 21 times in row and won.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.0321 = 0.321 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 24 @ 0.50897936 = 12.2155 BTC [-] {8}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24100 @ 0.0009493 = 22.8781 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0715 = 0.3575 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 28 @ 0.071999 = 2.016 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: http://io9.com/wwii-propaganda-billboards-from-the-united-states-secre-1567145725
ozbot: WWII Propaganda Billboards From The United States' Secret Atomic City
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.071999 = 0.216 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: Mysteries I want in a blog post, Benkay, why did you ever stop trolling me after my return to -assets
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.071999 = 0.144 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 22 @ 0.0075 = 0.165 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1000 @ 0.00095061 = 0.9506 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13700 @ 0.00094761 = 12.9823 BTC [-] {2}
benkay: ;;rate decimation 1 a fellow, i reckon.
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user decimation has been recorded.
benkay: BingoBoingo: what, you want me to perpetuate the mystery in a blog post or three? ;)
benkay: ;;seen blackwhite
gribble: blackwhite was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 week, 1 day, 3 hours, and 55 seconds ago: <blackwhite> hola peeps
decimation: Why thank you sir
benkay: BingoBoingo: a few reasons.
decimation: ;;rate decimation 1 gave me a hand
gribble: Error: You cannot rate yourself.
decimation: ;;rate benkay 1 gave me a hand
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user benkay has been recorded.
decimation: I missed ;)
benkay: misfire!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.500001 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 107 @ 0.00464986 = 0.4975 BTC [-] {3}
benkay: a) i don't actually troll.
benkay: b)
benkay: b) you've got stuff 'twixt your ears that'll spill more easily if we're on good terms than ill.
benkay: c) make friends not enemies?
benkay: that's the short of it, BingoBoingo
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.500001 = 1.5 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.5000001 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 28 @ 0.00468173 = 0.1311 BTC [+] {3}
decimation: http://www.profitconfidential.com/real-estate-market/dead-cat-bounce-housing-market/
ozbot: Dead-Cat Bounce Over for the Housing Market?
decimation: In the first quarter of 2014, mortgage originations at Citigroup Inc. (NYSE/C) declined 71% from the same period a year ago. The bank issued $5.2 billion in mortgages in the first quarter of 2014, compared to $8.3 billion in the previous quarter and $18.0 billion in the first quarter of 2013. (Source: Citigroup Inc. web site, last accessed April 14, 2014.)
decimation: but the "recovery" is great guys, just some snow, no problems here
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3900 @ 0.0009488 = 3.7003 BTC [+]
benkay: nice to have you back, decimation :)
benkay: i think it's time to go all cash, neh?
benkay: or at least balance hard in that direction.
decimation: re: amazon, I've heard it's a tough life working there. Look at the glassdoor reviews: they cheapskate on everything. Yeah, the salary is okay, but you better enjoy being on call
decimation: Well, of course cash sucks because no return, and inflation is biting at your heels
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16060 @ 0.00095071 = 15.2684 BTC [+] {3}
decimation: I suspect a large crash would signal another leg up for bitcoin though
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 64 @ 0.0047091 = 0.3014 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14550 @ 0.00094757 = 13.7871 BTC [-] {3}
benkay: kinda hoping to get the tax situation dialed before btc legs up
decimation: yeah you have to lock in those losses
benkay: asciilifeform: thanks for those naggum links.
benkay: decimation: ugh don't talk like that
benkay: decimation: if i burn all my bridges here, i'm moving up to seattle and working in the server mines for a year to reestablish my capital base.
decimation: heh well that's a plan I guess. It's honest work at least, keeping the internet goblins at bay
benkay: honest work
benkay: shipping finely spun plastic widgets that should never have been made to the herds who should never have been granted credit in the first place
benkay: honestly?
benkay: in one way or another i've been standing by and squirting grease on the thing since i was a bairn.
decimation: well, people "need" "their" "stuff"
benkay: i gotta decouple, man.
benkay: get out of this shithole somehow or make it tolerable until the us comes crashing down about my ears.
decimation: http://time.com/2742/nearly-half-of-america-lives-paycheck-to-paycheck/
ozbot: Nearly Half of America Lives Paycheck-to-Paycheck - TIME
decimation: The CFED calls these folks ?liquid asset poor,? and its report finds that 44% of Americans are living with less than $5,887 in savings for a family of four. The plight of these folks is compounded by the fact that the recession ravaged many Americans? credit scores to the point that now 56% percent of us have subprime credit.
decimation: It's hard to see how amazon is going to keep exponential growth selling crap to indebted peasants
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.49001 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 50 @ 0.00434629 = 0.2173 BTC [-] {3}
Apocalyptic: amazon is not the only one with this business model
Apocalyptic: and far from it
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19800 @ 0.0009513 = 18.8357 BTC [+] {2}
decimation: presuming that only %46 of Americans can qualify for a mortgage, it seems likely that a subset of that %46 will end up owning %100 of the homes
decimation: ;;later tell mircea_popescu how does the idea of the Punishment Gazette interact with the common law idea of corporate personhood? When you are wronged by an idiot employee, is it he who takes the hit on the WoT or his employer?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: decimation depends on the reaction of the corporation. if they fire him, him. if they don't, both.
decimation: This reaction being fully played for everyone in the WoT to judge, of course
mircea_popescu: well yes.
mircea_popescu: for instance recently : gigaom's atrociously mendacious coverage of bitcoin has put him on my blacklist.
mircea_popescu: he's a sort of max keiser, as far as i'm concerned.
decimation: one can see a business opportunity: summarize the gazette in a trustworthy manner, like a monk-scribe and not like a "journalist"
mircea_popescu: sure. it's one of the principal tasks mpoe-pr had
decimation: ;;rate hanbot 1 freely published timely advice which triggered my exit from btct.co
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user hanbot has been recorded.
decimation: ;;rate mircea_popescu 1 publishes mentally stimulating content
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user mircea_popescu has been recorded.
decimation: and with that g'night
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://trilema.com/2014/the-scum/ here, that is what you made me do.
mircea_popescu: ten thousand fucking words.
wywialm: good morning everyone
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11520 @ 0.00095192 = 10.9661 BTC [+] {2}
Apocalyptic: morning
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 400 @ 0.00084218 = 0.3369 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.49001 = 0.98 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4300 @ 0.0009527 = 4.0966 BTC [+]
fluffypony: Apocalyptic: morning
fluffypony: wywialm: morning
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.4900067 = 1.47 BTC [-] {2}
fluffypony: that Dunne Capital UK exchange-slash-casino thread got pretty hilarious (https://bitcointa.lk/threads/xcp-ipo-announcement-dunnecapital-ltd-uk-bitcoin-exchange-and-a-casino.304299/page-2)
fluffypony: I loved the comment by theMiracle - "Protip 4 U 2: Take it slow. Start off by snagging a few extra newspapers from a vending machine when u pay for one. Practice stealing rolls of toilet paper from public restrooms. Get the hang of the basics -- then you can come back to looting bitcoiners."
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.00445 = 0.445 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.032 = 0.128 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0425 = 0.1275 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10032 @ 0.0009461 = 9.4913 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 100 @ 0.07000302 = 7.0003 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0322 = 0.161 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 1194 @ 0.00084601 = 1.0101 BTC [+] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 300 @ 0.00085 = 0.255 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.07197666 = 0.2159 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 11 @ 0.0719989 = 0.792 BTC [+] {2}
Naphex: ;;ident
gribble: Nick 'Naphex', with hostmask 'Naphex!~naphex@btcxchange.ro', is identified as user 'Naphex', with GPG key id 64CDBADCE1E0BBAF, key fingerprint F3D76A985F5844814A93F46364CDBADCE1E0BBAF, and bitcoin address 12mVDqdWqFY6zrCqNqgHbxhDPB4ZVUuaTu
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8350 @ 0.00094795 = 7.9154 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1450 @ 0.00094556 = 1.3711 BTC [-]
Naphex: morn
fluffypony: Naphex: morning
wywialm: good morning, Naphex
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6700 @ 0.00094555 = 6.3352 BTC [-] {2}
Naphex: morning to all, need more coffee:D
fluffypony: also
fluffypony: but our power is out
fluffypony: so guess that'll have to wait
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12800 @ 0.0009486 = 12.1421 BTC [+] {2}
fluffypony: between the MrWDunne guy and DrGregMulhauser I'm seriously considering becoming SirFluffyPonyPhd on bitcointalk
fluffypony: feeling so left out without a title amongst all the Mr's and Dr's
HeySteve: good morning
HeySteve: fluffypony, I recommend a portable Honda generator like the EU20i
HeySteve: it's more than enough to run 2 PCs or fridge/freezer/kettle
fluffypony: seems to be back on now
fluffypony: I looked at that little honda a while ago, I should actually just get it
HeySteve: it's a bit pricy but the low weight is a plus
HeySteve: CCN editor scooped me on the China Ban #4 story
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3250 @ 0.00094908 = 3.0845 BTC [+]
fluffypony: davout: bon matinée!
davout: fluffypony: ca roule?
davout: s/ca/ça/
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18800 @ 0.0009474 = 17.8111 BTC [-] {2}
fluffypony: davout: ça marche!
davout: fluffypony: nah, that's "it works"
davout: you can just say "ça va", or "ça roule"
fluffypony: oh that's not what I was trying to say
fluffypony: French idioms elude me
fluffypony: French in general does
fluffypony: I'ma stick to Afrikaans and Zulu
davout: fluffypony: ja, dat werkt ook
fluffypony: heh heh
fluffypony: LOL - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=579138.0
davout: "you can some and say Hi."
HeySteve: heh that gif says it all
fluffypony: my favourite is the logo in the last post
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10750 @ 0.00094967 = 10.209 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9287 @ 0.00095254 = 8.8462 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11150 @ 0.0009527 = 10.6226 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6382 @ 0.00094554 = 6.0344 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0711 = 0.1422 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.071999 = 0.288 BTC [+]
fluffypony: !up MrWDunne
assbot: Voicing MrWDunne for 30 minutes.
MrWDunne: Thank you DrFluffyPonyPhd
DrFluffyPonyPhd tips his fedora
DrFluffyPonyPhd: of course, my good fellow
DrFluffyPonyPhd: how goes the shower-cap-wearing Satan worshipper colleague of yours?
MrWDunne: It is you!
DrFluffyPonyPhd: nope
DrFluffyPonyPhd: I just know how to read
MrWDunne: I would imagine he is sleeping, he was being drilled with questions until about 5AM his time. Ah okay, should have guessed that one
DrFluffyPonyPhd: I know some other people who were being drilled until about 5am, just not with questions
MrWDunne: OPs mum?
DrFluffyPonyPhd: now now, we aren't THAT base here
MrWDunne: I presume I should never go full base
fluffypony: ;;ident
gribble: Nick 'fluffypony', with hostmask 'fluffypony!~fluffypon@geartri.be', is identified as user 'fluffypony', with GPG key id 7455C5E3C0CDCEB9, key fingerprint BDA6BD7042B721C467A9759D7455C5E3C0CDCEB9, and bitcoin address 1FAvFCgXBmJ4uV3p1NFzWkkyndH7FJ6Vzx
MrWDunne: Anyhow, I thought this would be an appropriate place to announce the IPO
MrWDunne: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=583262.0 has the relevant information, essentially I am currently working on a UK bitcoin exchange
ozbot: [XCP] IPO announcement. DunneCapital LTD - UK bitcoin exchange and a casino
MrWDunne: Thank you ozbot
MrWDunne: FluffyPony I have sent you a tip for giving me a voice
fluffypony: Bitstamp is already in the UK?
fluffypony: oh tks
HeySteve: this place is becoming a real Dragon's Den, I'm thinking of writing something to that effect
fluffypony: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitstamp
ozbot: Bitstamp - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
fluffypony: "The company initially operated in Slovenia, but moved its operations to the UK in April 2013"
MrWDunne: Bitstamp isn't really in the UK. Its mainland Europe and as such very expensive for those in the UK
MrWDunne: Its banking is in mainland Europe, we have a UK bank
MrWDunne: That is the primary difference
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12350 @ 0.00094536 = 11.6752 BTC [-] {3}
fluffypony: https://coinfloor.co.uk
fluffypony: like them?
MrWDunne: We have of course already secured the bank account
MrWDunne: No
MrWDunne: They have a polish bank account
MrWDunne: *Polish
MrWDunne: Its just denominated in GBP
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.492 BTC [+]
MrWDunne: In the UK we have "Faster Payments" which are free and instant bank transfers. CoinFloor take international wires which cost between £15 and £25 and take up to 5 days
MrWDunne: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faster_Payments_Service
fluffypony: well SEPA to Kraken is same day, SEPA to BitStamp is a day at most
ozbot: Faster Payments Service - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
fluffypony: can't speak to CoinFloor
fluffypony: but sure, cost savings are great
fluffypony: except that if Kraken, Bitstamp, and CoinFloor all chose to have bank accounts outside of the UK (presumably not for lack of trying) how do you propose to overcome that hurdle?
MrWDunne: SEPA incurs a 3% hidden cost + £15. Also in the UK it doesn't normally take a day for a SEPA, more like 3.
MrWDunne: It was thanks to our main adviser we have the account. The banks are all turning everyone down however an exception was made essentially.
BingoBoingo: Let us not forget Intersango was a UK exchange
fluffypony: ok so if you're key differentiator is that you have a UK bank account, maybe that needs to be specified in your proposal
MrWDunne: Exactly
fluffypony: rather than "The UK is the world's 6th largest economy, but so far they have no bitcoin exchange"
fluffypony: that is factually incorrect
MrWDunne: Well there is no true UK bitcoin exchange, but yes I will make it more specific. One moment
BingoBoingo: GLBSE was a UK exchange, and that killed it along with the operator not taking it seriosly enough until it was too late
BingoBoingo: I honestly don't know if the English, Scottish, Welsh, or North Irish have it in them any more to run anything
BingoBoingo: !up Diablo-D3
assbot: Voicing Diablo-D3 for 30 minutes.
MrWDunne: And now he is trying to run coinfloor
MrWDunne: (The man who ran GLBSE)
Diablo-D3: glbse was a STOCK exchange, not a forex.
BingoBoingo: MrWDunne: That isn't exactly a secret.
Diablo-D3: MrWDunne: why the fuck is anyone letting him run something again
MrWDunne: I have no idea. And I know what GLBSE is, the guy who ran it owns coinfloor
Diablo-D3: nefario is the reason that I quit bothering with the bitcoin investment community
MrWDunne: Nefarious nefario
fluffypony: "I estimate bitstamp earns approximately 20BTC per day currently."
fluffypony: that can be calculated more accurately
fluffypony: YTD Bitstamp has done, on average, 18682.27233 BTC daily in volume
fluffypony: which means their earnings are between 37.364 BTC and 93.411 BTC daily
MrWDunne: Thank you very much, I shall adjust it
fluffypony: (they have a sliding fee scale dependent on volume)
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: You also have to consider the problem of actual vs. imagined volume
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: werd
MrWDunne: I know about the sliding scale, I used yesterdays volume for the calculation.
fluffypony: "We should be attractive to customers thanks to lax KYC/AML, as we will not require identification for those who wish to trade £500/€600 or less per week." <- so basically I can get around all KYC/AML issues by opening 100 accounts?
fluffypony: money launderer's paradise, yo
MrWDunne: Technically speaking we have no legal requirements to have any KYC/AML policy. We will require them giving us an address just not "proving" it. Also that is meant to be per month. I need to proof read better
MrWDunne: Not to mention we can see which bank account the money comes in from, so if 100 accounts are getting money from the same bank account it is very obvious
BingoBoingo: MrWDunne: Why not go full measure and take Western Union and other retail wire transfers?
HeySteve: I suggest stating it not as "lax" but rather "minimal"
MrWDunne: The bank have been quite clear with how they expect us to use the account. They don't want large amounts of cash deposits
MrWDunne: HeySteve: I second that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2865 @ 0.00094511 = 2.7077 BTC [-] {2}
fluffypony: so there seems to be a lack of technical details about how you'll accomplish this (and Bitcoin is generally a technical audience, investors doubly so)
fluffypony: need to have lots of details about your proposed architecture
MrWDunne: We're having a KYC/AML policy not to be legal, we don't have to do it to be legal. But to keep the bank account.
fluffypony: how your software will handle large volumes
MrWDunne: I can get those details available by the end of this month
HeySteve: I suggest engineering for provable deposits from the getgo, multisig control of cold wallets also good
BingoBoingo: MrWDunne: Who ensures that your fiat handling operation stays legal?
fluffypony: what the software will be written in, who the team is and what qualifies them to write the software, what database platform you're going to be using, how you'll handle consistency, etc.
fluffypony: probably a bunch of other things Naphex can ask
MrWDunne: HeySteve: For cold wallets we will be using multisig and of course we will have provable deposits.
HeySteve: yeah that deserves a mention
MrWDunne: Yes I can imagine, I'm not the one handling the most technical matters. But by the end of the month I will have the technical details available
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5935 @ 0.00094255 = 5.594 BTC [-]
MrWDunne: BingoBoingo: Our financial adviser worker at a high street bank for 25 years. He knows several people who will work in compliance once we have the volume to support them.
BingoBoingo: Opening first and doing compliance later seemed to have been what doomed the other UK ventures.
Naphex: back
MrWDunne: The main thing that doomed UK ventures was the banks not knowing what they were doing, also if we sell 10,000 shares at the second tier rate (once software + servers are ready) we will have enough to take on a compliance officer from the getgo
Naphex: sorry was out for dinner break
BingoBoingo: MrWDunne: Where are you fundraising again?
MrWDunne: CounterParty BingoBoingo
MrWDunne: Ticker DUNNECAP
BingoBoingo: See, that is a problem.
BingoBoingo: What kind of screening and diligence did that listing require?
fluffypony: !up MrWDunne
assbot: Voicing MrWDunne for 30 minutes.
fluffypony: ;;gettrust MrWDunne
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user fluffypony to user MrWDunne: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=fluffypony&dest=MrWDunne | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=MrWDunne | Rated since: never
MrWDunne: BingoBoingo: In future we will be moving to another exchange - post launch. However I will happily provide ID to a trusted member of the community in order to verify who I am - and I am willing to meet people IRL
MrWDunne: Thanks again fluffypony
BingoBoingo: If only these things hadn't been said so many times before.
MrWDunne: BingoBoingo: I totally agree. Then again how did the due diligence stop say N&B happening
fluffypony: there wasn't any
BingoBoingo: MrWDunne: Exercise for an educated reader.
Naphex: so what's this new exchange you're openning MrWDunne ?
MrWDunne: Hey Naphex , apparently you will have a lot of technical questions for me. UK bitcoin exchange, with UK banking
BingoBoingo: "I've heard this Country song, a thousand times before. Heard it all my life. Sung by different people."
fluffypony: https://wiki.counterparty.co/w/Assets <- so basically to create an asset all you do is a CLI call
ozbot: Assets - Counterparty Wiki
fluffypony: assbot: how amazing is that?
Naphex: MrWDunne - are you using inhouse developed software? buying it or extrernalizing?
MrWDunne: We have a third party developing it, we were referred by someone else
MrWDunne: Hence why I cannot answer questions directly about technical measures
Naphex: are you doing regular code checks, security audit on the source code?
BingoBoingo has to head out. Will return eventually.
Naphex: do you know what you get with the product you're paying for?:P
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5267 @ 0.0009494 = 5.0005 BTC [+]
MrWDunne: The third party is doing that as they go, but prior to launch we are paying for a full security audit of the code. Also the person who referred us knows them personally, and its an interesting project.
Naphex: what's it written in? the project?
fluffypony: Naphex: PHP :-P
MrWDunne: I believe I would be correct to say the frontend logic is simply done in PHP, but the trading engine is C++
MrWDunne: I know as a matter of fact its not just PHP fluffy
fluffypony: maybe RealSolid's writing it
MrWDunne: I don't think so
MrWDunne: aha
Naphex: on what OS is the trading engine going to run? Are the components sufficiently isolated?
MrWDunne: Anyhow, I have to leave in about 10 minutes to visit another bank (looking to get additional accounts for redundancy). If you have a few questions you want me to get a proper answer to just put them here and I'll get an answer as soon as possible
Naphex: can you scale that C++ engine up, or will you just be running on single big server?
MrWDunne: Naphex: Different server for each "chunk", and we're hoping to use OpenBSD
MrWDunne: Scalable, however it should be find for a very long time on one high powered server
fluffypony: tbh, an exchange is a REALLY tough sell given the regulatory hurdles and the track record of many past exchanges (gox etc.) - you're going to need a far more fleshed out business plan and a LOT of details about how you're overcoming the technical and legal challenges (and about how you calculate your fundraising requirements)
MrWDunne: Fund raising requirements are really rather simple. We already have quotes on all of the costs
MrWDunne: The only cost we don't know the price of yet is compliance officer
punkman: so you only have quotes at the moment?
fluffypony: listing on an "exchange" that anyone can list on with zero due diligence or even an email address verification makes it doubly challenging...I suggest leveraging the -otc WoT and GPG contracts (http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/GPG_Contract) to build trust and tie yourself down to shareholders
Naphex: do you have a contract with the development team? too keep extending/bugfixing after release?
fluffypony: good starting point: http://trilema.com/2014/what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works-and-how-to-use-it/
MrWDunne: Also the actual business plan is a 25 page PDF, but it has details about an additional project planned to launch in a year. And Naphex: yes we certainly do.
fluffypony: also last thing in terms of reading material is hanbot's glorious epilogue here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=124441.0
fluffypony: (well, an epilogue in that I don't think anything further needs to be written on the matter)
Naphex: tbh, i'd be scared of doing that in C++ enterprise wise
Naphex: you're gonna need too attach lots of other components, for reporting, monitoring, and keeping track off
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.50199999 = 1.004 BTC [+] {2}
Naphex: so it depends a lot on what the tradeengine is going to do
Naphex: but you'll need tons of tools attached especially when you go live
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3265 @ 0.00094898 = 3.0984 BTC [-] {2}
fluffypony: yeah, and on the topic of reinventing of wheels... https://alphapoint.com seems...interesting if you're going that route
MrWDunne: Of course, as I said don't quote me on C++ I just know its not a PHP trade engine
MrWDunne: Anyhow, I do now need to go. So please send any questions to me on BitcoinTalk and I'll answer them as soon as
punkman: so, quotes on costs, outsourced tech, 25 page pdf and listing on Counterparty. What else you got?
Naphex: MrWDunne: who wrote the specs, for the third party to develop?
Naphex: outsourced tech is the most problematic imho
MrWDunne: Punkman: two bank accounts known to be for a bitcoin exchange, with the bank explicitly saying that is okay for us to use.
Naphex: for something so sensitive, i wouldn't do much trusting. or use developers that are not in-house
MrWDunne: Naphex; More details will emerge on that, its a hard one to explain.
jurov: wut "SEPA incurs a 3% hidden cost + £15"? I wouldn't touch such scumbag banks with dry pole
Naphex: i'd care for backdoors, known 'issues', and insider leaks
Naphex: and you'd want someone doing lots of monitoring
MrWDunne: Naphex: Hence code security audit
Naphex: especially early
fluffypony: Naphex: buffer overruns are a feature
MrWDunne: Naphex: This will be my fulltime job
MrWDunne: Jurov: unfortunately that is every UK bank. 3% is every bank though. That is the currency conversion discrepancy
Naphex: MrWDunne: are you going to do the tehnical monitoring as well?
MrWDunne: Naphex: No that would be unwise, I will have a professional do that, and learn from him as we go along
Naphex: MrWDunne: what about hardware?
Naphex: the servers, the colocation, the hosting
MrWDunne: The data center will monitor the hardware
Naphex: who will mange them full time?
MrWDunne: Node4
MrWDunne: Northampton data center
MrWDunne: Tier 3
MrWDunne: 100% uptime since it was created
MrWDunne: I'm responsible for initial setup. That is something I can handle
bounce: fluffypony: just scanned a bit, but we need less AML, not more. so if the rules allow for this, that's positive.
Naphex: you're relianing on a lot of outsourcing
Naphex: which for a bitcoin exchange, i doubt its going to be enough
MrWDunne: Naphex: Better have a professional do it than myself
fluffypony: bounce: 100% - I wasn't arguing for or against it, although I do think that the best non-AML route will always be otc/face to face
MrWDunne: Bounce: Indeed, the laws allow for no AML. But the bank doesn't
Naphex: MrWDunne: better have that proffesional hired and with an office near ;]
bounce: find a bank who does?
MrWDunne: bounce: there isn't one. Not in the UK.
fluffypony: Naphex: and a noose around his neck and a limit on his frappuccinos
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 60 @ 0.00435463 = 0.2613 BTC [-] {4}
bounce wonders how hard it is to set up a bank and have it talk to other banks
MrWDunne: Naphex: Once we have the volume we will be doing just that.
fluffypony: bounce: licensing is the issue, I think
bounce was thinking it'd be useful to have a fiat bank connect various exchanges
MrWDunne: fluffypony: In the UK it is almost impossible
MrWDunne: We have had one bank open in the past 100 years
fluffypony: if the Bank of England stands....England stands!
fluffypony: brb coffee
fluffypony: mircea_popescu
fluffypony: you missed MrWDunne by 6 seconds
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4650 @ 0.00094289 = 4.3844 BTC [-]
punkman: you can make another one for fiddy cents
fluffypony: Banka de Fluffy has a certain ring to it
mircea_popescu: fluffypony who is mrwdunne ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: the guy that's starting a UK exchange because there "isn't one"
mircea_popescu: awww
mircea_popescu: well, maybe next time someone starts a uk exchange.
HeySteve: anyone familiar with SingleHop hosting?
HeySteve: "This week, SingleHop engineers noticed an increase in the number of customers reporting compromised servers. As we investigated these reports, we were able to identify a common malicious software program installed on many of the compromised servers. The malware is specifically designed to siphon the server’s computing power into mining bitcoins. This has been a growing trend throughout
HeySteve: the web lately, with malware attacks of this nature being reported by customers of AWS and the Iowa State University."
fluffypony: that just points to shitty sysadmins; if they're not monitoring load what are they doing?
HeySteve: call of duty and bong hits? who knows. but would monitoring load prevent this sort of thing occurring in the first place?
fluffypony: not entirely, but any sysadmin worth his salt needs to know *when* to scale
fluffypony: and you do that by consistently monitoring resource utilisation over time
HeySteve: well I have no idea if they caught this early or late
HeySteve: but they've taken action, cleaned it apparently
HeySteve: I'm more interested in the malware and where the coins are going, I wonder if they preserved a specimen (sort of thing)
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: The entire world is Italy. <- true words
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4678 @ 0.00094625 = 4.4266 BTC [+]
HeySteve: they hint it's related to heartbleed, NRPE or Ebury, not that I'd heard of the other 2
fluffypony: ebury is an rk
fluffypony: can you search the WoT for a specific gpg key id?
random_cat: mircea_popescue: <a href="http://xeur.bitcoin-central.net/">here</a> on http://mpex.co/?mpsic=X.EUR is apparently invalid
random_cat: mircea_popescu, even
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.0708 = 0.2124 BTC [-]
jurov: davout ^
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.50000001 = 5 BTC [-]
random_cat: signed documets and stale urls: yum
jurov: davout will surely fix it
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44478 @ 0.00094902 = 42.2105 BTC [+] {6}
jurov: !up MykelSIlver
assbot: Voicing MykelSIlver for 30 minutes.
jurov: !up Sahtor
assbot: Voicing Sahtor for 30 minutes.
fluffypony: bitcoinpete: morning
bitcoinpete: fluffypony: howdy!
bitcoinpete: fluffypony: saw that article about the mt gox coins flowing into maidsafe. that thing is more crooked than a chicago politician
bitcoinpete: fluffypony: and if you go to http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewgpg.php you should be able to just search the page for a key
fluffypony: bitcoinpete: yep, but then some bright spark traced some coins back to BTC Guild and accused Eulethria of being complicit
wywialm: hello, bitcoinpete
fluffypony: without thinking that maybe someone mined some coins in the pool, withdrew them, and then used them
fluffypony: because obviously all coins just appear out of thin air
bitcoinpete: magic coins are magic!
bitcoinpete: wywialm: ahoy :)
fluffypony: needless to say, eulethria was pissed
fluffypony: was/is
bitcoinpete: fair enough
bitcoinpete: so ltb head adam levine tried writing about maidsafe for techcrunch and they pulled his article cuz it had a tip widget
bitcoinpete: so he republished it on his website: http://letstalkbitcoin.com/maidsafe-wildly-successful-crypto-crowdsale-debacle/
fluffypony: lawl
fluffypony: did they think it defeated journalistic integrity?
bitcoinpete: that's exactly it
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1499 @ 0.0001291 = 0.1935 BTC [+] {2}
bitcoinpete: kid is pissing me off pretending he knows shit though, quotes like "Life is about variables, monetary fundamentals is entirely about variables." abound
cazalla: how'd he sneak that widget in
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEEQ] 5395 @ 0.00006412 = 0.3459 BTC [-] {9}
bitcoinpete: "The MAIDSAFE project specifically and these types of crowdsales broadly have a great future ahead, but it’s a bit like launching a boat – careful thought, diligent planning and rigorous construction must all come together or the whole thing sinks." <<such derp
fluffypony: someone needs to tell MaidSafe and this "Dark Market" crap that they're reinventing the wheel; Tahoe-LAFS over I2P already has a web client and is a distributed data store etc.
cazalla: bitcoinpete: so you won't be accepting ltbcoin for your writings?
bitcoinpete: cazalla: good question. obviously not very subtly or else tc wouldn't have published and retracted
bitcoinpete: cazalla: oh goodness
cazalla: maybe the editor just copy/pasta'd without proofreading
bitcoinpete: levine is also doing this humint.is thing. he's the "cvo"
bitcoinpete: "We help brands create digital
bitcoinpete: currencies to make good.
bitcoinpete: We are Humint."
fluffypony: oh god
fluffypony: CVO as in Chief Visionary Officer?
davout: random_cat jurov it's fixed, thank you for reporting
davout: ;;rate random_cat 1 reads the fine print
thestringpuller: ;;google Chief Visionary Officer
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user random_cat has been recorded.
gribble: Chief visionary officer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chief_visionary_officer>; What is CVO (chief visionary officer)? - Definition from WhatIs.com: <http://searchcio.techtarget.com/definition/CVO>; Chief Visionary Officer | The Black Man Can Institute: <http://tbmcinstitute.theblackmancan.org/leadership-team/chief-visionary-officer/>
thestringpuller: ;;google define Chief Visionary Officer
gribble: Chief visionary officer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chief_visionary_officer>; Chief executive officer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chief_executive_officer>; What is CVO (chief visionary officer)? - Definition from WhatIs.com: <http://searchcio.techtarget.com/definition/CVO>
bitcoinpete: ;;google cvo
gribble: CVO: Summary for Cenveo Inc- Yahoo! Finance: <http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=CVO>; Cascades Volcano Observatory: <http://vulcan.wr.usgs.gov/>; CVO - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CVO>
bitcoinpete: mmm vulcans...
thestringpuller: ratings for finding bugs
thestringpuller: lol davout where do you live in France?
fluffypony: thestringpuller: new idea for a Bug Bounty program?
thestringpuller: (trying to estimate shipping for cookies)
davout: thestringpuller: ~paris
davout: thestringpuller: reading fine print is a good thing, why not rate it as such? :D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 60 @ 0.00469993 = 0.282 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6350 @ 0.00094353 = 5.9914 BTC [-]
jurov: <troll>if random_cat really did read fine print, he'd ask you straight, not mirceau popescue</troll>
random_cat slaps jurov about a bit with a wet puppy
davout: brb, gonna slap myself with wet pussies
davout: !up Luke-Jr
assbot: Voicing Luke-Jr for 30 minutes.
random_cat: good choice
fluffypony: drowning cats again?
ThickAsThieves: so much log
random_cat: blame the wet pussies
davout: random_cat: wet pussies are the consequence of so much log, not the other way around
random_cat: i think that depends upon where one's nose is
bitcoinpete: http://www.institutionalinvestor.com/Article/3332609/Banking-and-Capital-Markets-Emerging-Markets/Chinas-Rate-Liberalization-Stakes-Who-Wins-Who-Loses.html?ArticleId=3332609&single=true#.U1kNLuaSyXQ
bitcoinpete: http://www.institutionalinvestor.com/Article/3332458/Asset-Management-Macro/Is-China-Really-Prepared-to-Shift-to-Market-Driven-Interest-Rates.html?ArticleId=3332458&rel=nofollow&single=true#.U1kEB-aSyXQ
ozbot: Is China Really Prepared to Shift to Market-Driven Interest Rates? | Institutional Investor
random_cat: not at all
bitcoinpete: "Worry about skin in the game, not inequality."
bitcoinpete: taleb's on a roll right now
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1469 @ 0.00094559 = 1.3891 BTC [+]
HeySteve: yeah Eleuthria contacted me, glad I was vague and didn't make any accusations of involvement there
HeySteve: re: <+fluffypony> needless to say, eulethria was pissed
fluffypony: yeah for real
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4000 @ 0.00094843 = 3.7937 BTC [+]
punkman: http://cryptome.org/jya/digicrash.htm
danielpbarron is left-handed
fluffypony: danielpbarron: my sincere condolances
danielpbarron: heh
fluffypony: I have both my left and my right hands still attached
Naphex: http://www.fentonreport.com/bitcoin/why-the-savegox-plan-is-very-important-to-the-bitcoin-ecosystem
ozbot: Why the SaveGox Plan is Very Important to the Bitcoin Ecosystem | FENTON REPORT
Naphex: or just let gox diee
fluffypony: he has a point though - if the 200k coins they magically "found" form part of the assets sold off to pay creditors, customers will proportionally get less as they have to share with other creditors
fluffypony: I'm just glad I never kept coins on there
danielpbarron too
Naphex: https://i.imgur.com/CDR0owC.png load times post frontend optimizations :D
fluffypony: nice
fluffypony: did you reduce page size as well?
Naphex: nah
Naphex: mostly cacheing tuning
Naphex: and removing some bugdowns
fluffypony: cool nice
fluffypony: http://i.imgur.com/xmnlXIW.jpg
Naphex: lol
Blazedout419: guys can China get out and stay out..
Blazedout419: So bored with the China bans already
Naphex: they banned btc again?:)
fluffypony: !up MrWDunne
assbot: Voicing MrWDunne for 30 minutes.
MrWDunne: Yes, they are banning btc again
MrWDunne: Essentially leaves China to use Cash only, not sure if they will be willing to use that
Naphex: well, i missed the whole news
Naphex: so.. hooray!
fluffypony: lawl
pankkake: I'm surprised things like mtgox bankruptancy were considered "bad" for bitcoin price
pankkake: after all, you realize there are now less bitcoins than previously thought
MrWDunne: No
ThickAsThieves: dont blame china for US selling bitcoins
ThickAsThieves: etc
fluffypony: Naphex: that graph on the front page, it's not possible to zoom in right? wanted to see if you guys saw a dip from the China thing as well
MrWDunne: Pankkake Same amount of bitcoins. Just in fewer people's hands
MrWDunne: Starbucks apparently holds a large amount of BTC
Naphex: fluffypony: there is a slider down, you squeeze it
pankkake: well no, fractionnal reserves means more bitcoins than there are
Naphex: will switch it with a good graph pretty soon, the data plant should be ready by monday
fluffypony: OH, didn't see that
Naphex: and we'll replace it with proper OHLC-V data & candlesticks
fluffypony: neat
Naphex: brb, heading home. done with the office
asciilifeform: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-04-24/52-year-old-french-banker-jumps-her-death-paris-after-questioning-her-superiors
ozbot: 52 Year-Old French Banker Jumps To Her Death In Paris (After Questioning Her Superiors) | Zero Hedge
Naphex: and its raining :|
MrWDunne: pankkake: They didn't just disappear. They just moved to somewhere other than the owners hands
pankkake: but that was a while ago. so those bitcoins were already out, priced. yet people were still seing pretty numbers of bitcoins that were not there
MrWDunne: The problem is we don't know when they left, so its hard to price in.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.49953258 BTC [-]
pankkake: right
MrWDunne: It does mean for a while there were more bitcoins in circulation than actually existed. But when did it all start?
fluffypony: pankkake: you'll love this - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=579498.0
fluffypony: raed the 2nd post
fluffypony: *read
pankkake: yeah I saw it :)
MrWDunne: Owch, good job by them
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1900 @ 0.00094843 = 1.802 BTC [+]
Naphex: fluffypony: prolly more interesting, RON vs BTCHotWallet https://i.imgur.com/ZvdQiSl.png
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1100 @ 0.0001291 = 0.142 BTC [+]
fluffypony: *clicks*
fluffypony: interesting
ThickAsThieves: "On the business front, Android fans are more apt to show a strong interest in Evernote (16.65X), LinkedIn (6.90X), venture capital (5.44X), and corporate finance (3.85X). The only business topics to feature prominently for iOS fans are TechCrunch (13.55X) and Bitcoin (7.93X)."
bitcoinpete: "#blackcoin is temporarily down but because of excellent community support we're working super hard to get it up again. ETA 2 hours." << ummm
mod6: so this looks weird:
mod6: $depth s.mpoe
mpexbot: mod6: S.MPOE Bids: ['15250 @ 0.00094828', '2256 @ 0.00094717', '4878 @ 0.00094541', '9100 @ 0.00094403', '4358 @ 0.00094297']
mpexbot: mod6: Asks: ['12204 @ 0.00094843', '18446744073709523111 @ 0.0009494', '10350 @ 0.00094958', '11050 @ 0.0009503', '3779 @ 0.0009512']
mod6: '18446744073709523111 @ 0.0009494'
ThickAsThieves: eek
bitcoinpete: holy
ThickAsThieves: mircea_popescu ^^^
mod6: it's happened before, was quickly fixed.
kakobrekla: broken again
ThickAsThieves: http://pando.com/2014/04/23/startups-anonymous-things-founders-say-to-investors-that-are-complete-bs/
ozbot: Startups Anonymous: Things founders say to investors that are complete BS | PandoDaily
bitcoinpete: ThickAsThieves: sounds like maidsafe and bitgo all wrapped into one
ThickAsThieves: !up MichalisBTC
assbot: Voicing MichalisBTC for 30 minutes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0718 = 0.1436 BTC [+]
bitcoinpete: "US bank credit money supply growing at about $45bn/month currently, well offsetting the +-$7bn/month QE slowdown. http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/TOTBKCR" << bueno!
ThickAsThieves: MichalisBTC is the bitcoin software guy I mentioned
ThickAsThieves: from the ashes of Neo
ThickAsThieves: benkay you around?
MichalisBTC: hehe yes indeed
ThickAsThieves: MichalisBTC do you have a link for details on your plan?
ThickAsThieves: or maybe share the website?
MichalisBTC: sure check it out, this is just to showcase projects cryptosysinc.com
ThickAsThieves: my own goal is for you guys to put him through the wringer so as to temper (snuff?) his plans as appropriate
ThickAsThieves: i am not particularly experienced or understanding of what he wants to offer
ThickAsThieves: other than specialized bitcoin software for businesses
MichalisBTC: we are working on a new project, it's Blockchain as a Service. It's a friendly RESTful API that allows creating bitcoin apps...to put it in single sentence. with a lot of automations and event type notifications.
ThickAsThieves: I met the Cryptosys guys last year, we broke bread, Danny proceeded to fuck them in the ass, etc
MichalisBTC: ass still hurts...
ThickAsThieves: maybe we can talk about this Hearn as your technical advisor thing
ThickAsThieves: why him? and what is he actually doing for you?
MichalisBTC: Yes, we approached Mike because all our previous work was on bitcoinJ. BitcoinJ was designed to be a mobile client rather a backend server.However, the tools of the library are helpful and because we code in Java we decided to give it a shot. We broke it appart and used what was good for our purposes but as some point we wanted advise on how to proceed, so we thought to pass our plans
MichalisBTC: through the Man himself.
MichalisBTC: Really nice guy btw. We had a one hour skype video call and went over our designs. A few days ago we asked him if we appoint him as our advisor for the funding process and he was kind enough to accept.
fluffypony ponders
ThickAsThieves: my own personal observations of Hearn are mixed
ThickAsThieves: he's obviously sharo
ThickAsThieves: sharp
ThickAsThieves: intelligent
Naphex: high scale services on spv?:(
ThickAsThieves: but he takes some questionable positions on things
fluffypony: so is he a technical advisor in terms of checking your architecture and designs, or is he an advisor to the funding process/business proposal?
ThickAsThieves: so i wouldnt rely on him for anything strategic or conceptual
MichalisBTC: technical advisor, our talks are strictly technical
ThickAsThieves: Naphex care to dumb down your comment for me?
ThickAsThieves: <+Naphex> high scale services on spv?:(
ThickAsThieves: whats spv?
MichalisBTC: The space we are entering with "Blockchain as a Service" is kind of competing with blockchain.info, some features overlap. his advise on that was that indeed we need more of these type of SaaS to help the eco-system...
Naphex: ThickAsThieves: as in thin client, in bitcoinj
Naphex: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Thin_Client_Security
Naphex: simple payment verification
ThickAsThieves: was does this sadden you? weak security?
ThickAsThieves: ah so clients that arent nodes
bitcoinpete: like multibit
ThickAsThieves: Michalis have you seen blockr.io ?
Naphex: any MITM will own the SPV's
MichalisBTC: no i haven't let me see
ThickAsThieves: kakobrekla knows the blockr people
MichalisBTC: yes, similar to this
ThickAsThieves: so, i'm not clear how making thin clients and acting like blockchain.info will make you money
ThickAsThieves: do you have a full business plan?
ThickAsThieves: or just the website content
Naphex: too me it just looks like products spinned off bitcoinj
MichalisBTC: well we are not making thin clients. Our customers will be those requesting software services. not the end users.
ThickAsThieves: could you give a case of an ideal client?
MichalisBTC: i guess there are a number of ways to do this, we went with Java and bitcoinJ was of great help.
Naphex: MichalisBTC: so the clearing engine keeps the wallets, provides restful apis to the other products right?
Naphex: ThickAsThieves: run a full-node cluster, and get whatever data you need from there. use full nodes for payments, and multi-sig cold wallets for storage
MichalisBTC: FX companies that need to offer bitcoin clearing without us being in control of their bitcoin. Anyone who wishes to built a bitcoin app. We do the heavy lifting for them.
MichalisBTC: We will be also offering notifications (sms/email/callbacks) in realtime
Naphex: "
Naphex: The built in API allows to perform the following functions:
Naphex: A. Send bitcoins from master, customer, hot wallets.
Naphex: B. Get balance updates for any existing wallet under the control of the system.
Naphex: C. Create new customer wallet.
Naphex: D. Create hot wallets.
Naphex: E. Process large amount requests.
Naphex: "
Naphex: MichalisBTC: what does the secure architecture entail? what other security systems are in place, besides the GRE tunnel
Naphex: and locked down internet
Naphex: can i clean you out if i get access to the gre?
Naphex: All the private keys and wallet files are immediately backed up to multiple physical locations via encrypted tunnels. The keys and files are stored in an encrypted format on database which reside on encrypted partition file systems. Thus eliminating the possibility of stealing keys, even if hard drives from backup locations are stolen.
Naphex: where are the encryption keys kept?
MichalisBTC: We are not holding any funds for "Blockchain as a Service" and the only input in the system is the bitcoin netowork.
Naphex: MichalisBTC: bitcoin network, as in SPV BitcoinJ
Naphex: not a full verifying node yes?
MichalisBTC: However, on other implementation, where we did host wallets, we had clear separation of non critical servers with distributed security. And at the back end everything was separated with APIs.
Naphex: MichalisBTC: did the API's require signing? like HMAC?
MichalisBTC: also, on the complete from end we used custom proxies.
MichalisBTC: *front end
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.07190556 = 0.5033 BTC [+] {4}
MichalisBTC: for blockchain as a service we plan to use oauth, so yes
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.50579145 BTC [+]
punkman: MichalisBTC: why "as a service"? why not license the software that provices the convenient API for the blockchain?
fluffypony: ^^
punkman: *provides
fluffypony: less reputational risk as well, let the customer take ownership of their screw ups
MichalisBTC: we could license it, the main feature are the notifications. Business is to charge for the notifications, integration and support. Mainly because we will deal with businesses.
MichalisBTC: We are in Cyprus, low corporate tax attracts a lot of FX companies, who wish now to integrate bitcoin. Some list it already as CFDs, but they cannot clear bitcoin. We do the hard work for them, they are in control of the wallets. We are just the passthrough, offering a service.
MichalisBTC: fluffypony: yes, indeed
Naphex: MichalisBTC: what is the hard work in clearing bitcoin?
punkman: what is "clearing bitcoin"?
Naphex: punkman: ok payment, at 3 confirmations. send clearence
Naphex: 'here is your money, its good'
Naphex: !up MichalisBTC
assbot: Voicing MichalisBTC for 30 minutes.
Naphex: the weak point beeing any DDoS
Naphex: completly shutting down you're clearing node
Naphex: as we see every day with blockchain
Naphex: getting ddos'ed and cloudflare shutting down the API's
thestringpuller: ;;ident
gribble: Nick 'thestringpuller', with hostmask 'thestringpuller!~leflor@99-39-97-12.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net', is identified as user 'thestringpuller', with GPG key id 0FF2943DA179E169, key fingerprint 6ACE36E786F39A4ADC4506DE0FF2943DA179E169, and bitcoin address None
thestringpuller: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 454.09, Best ask: 455.9, Bid-ask spread: 1.81000, Last trade: 454.09, 24 hour volume: 31575.48797401, 24 hour low: 438.05, 24 hour high: 505.0, 24 hour vwap: 467.11276242
thestringpuller: !ticker m s.mpoe
assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00094255 / 0.00095081 / 0.00095978 (639879 shares, 608.41 BTC), 7D: 0.00094255 / 0.00097499 / 0.00101 (5908739 shares, 5,760.96 BTC), 30D: 0.00092844 / 0.00096165 / 0.00101 (21700966 shares, 20,868.83 BTC)
thestringpuller: !last m s.mpoe
assbot: Last trade for S.MPOE on MPEX was at 0.00094843 BTC [+]
MichalisBTC: with our security design for the perimeter the worst thing that can happen to one of our satellite nodes is go out of service. But with a DDoS they cannot penetrate further than that.
MichalisBTC: but yes point being that the mid-tier business ie fx, don't have to worry about it. We do
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 6 @ 0.14 = 0.84 BTC
Naphex: yeah but when ddos hits, and their customers can't deposit / withdraw, support phones and emails start burning
Naphex: why hasn't anyone implemented clearing notifications in BitcoinD Core ;o
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust MichalisBTC
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user MichalisBTC: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=thestringpuller&dest=MichalisBTC | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=MichalisBTC | Rated since: never
thestringpuller: gtfo
thestringpuller: lol
Naphex: ;;later tell Naphex fork BitcoinD, and implement clearing notifications via JSON-RPC
gribble: The operation succeeded.
MichalisBTC: Naphex: yes, our nodes will not be publicly available. :) no notification in core
artifexd: Naphex: GRE tunnel? Wassat?
Naphex: artifexd: VPN
artifexd: Why did you make the distinction? What's the difference?
artifexd: Nevermind. Found the rfc
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2005 @ 0.0001291 = 0.2588 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: MichalisBTC I'd recommend registering your name with nickserv, then signing up for the Bitcoin Web of Trust. These are some of the verification methods we live by and a great way to build your rep while establishing an identity.
MichalisBTC: Oks thx
ThickAsThieves: people here can help with any aspects you are unclear on
ThickAsThieves: it's a slow time of day here, so the more you're around the more you can float your questions and answer them
ThickAsThieves: trust isnt built quickly in these parts
MichalisBTC: sure, and I also I would like to get more feedback on the project, give out more info
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 60 @ 0.00435 = 0.261 BTC [-] {2}
MichalisBTC: thanks for the intro! catch you later
Naphex: MichalisBTC: go core!:D
Naphex: :]
MichalisBTC: thanks much
ThickAsThieves: so http://www.bitangels.co is still a thing huh
fluffypony: I would trust Naphex with my infrastructure
fluffypony: ;;rate Naphex 1 knows his shiznat regarding infrastructure, architecture, and deployment. is probably a better developer than me to boot.
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user Naphex has changed from 1 to 1.
Naphex: thq fluffypony
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: when are we starting BitDevils?
ThickAsThieves: you have my attention :)
ThickAsThieves: all we need is some handsome pictures of everyone in a suit or bitcoin t-shirt
fluffypony: yes
fluffypony: and we'll call it a "consulting service" for startups
fluffypony: where we play devils advocate to the ideas
ThickAsThieves: no no
fluffypony: to help them refine it
ThickAsThieves: incubator
ThickAsThieves: the Devil's Nest
fluffypony: BitDevils - The Startup Womb
kakobrekla: sounds like s cheerleaders team
ThickAsThieves: well yeah
jurov: !up smidge
assbot: Voicing smidge for 30 minutes.
jurov: !up mrwdunne
assbot: Voicing mrwdunne for 30 minutes.
mrwdunne: Thank you jurov
mrwdunne: Anyhow, does anyone have any new questions re exchange?
Naphex: mrwdunne: will you have liquidity at launch?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 2 @ 0.14 = 0.28 BTC
mrwdunne: Naphex: yes, we are selling in stages, at each stage we will sell the shares for more. Whatever we have left we will use to provide liquidity. However I think we will see a flood of people from the UK when we launch. Especially as the bank transfers are instant
ThickAsThieves: you think youll get a flood of people on a new exchange?
ThickAsThieves: how
mrwdunne: First in the UK to have access to UK banking. Immediate advantages to competitors
mrwdunne: (UK banking has free and instant transfers)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04233333 = 0.127 BTC [+] {3}
mrwdunne: *immediate advantages over competitors
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 18 @ 0.07179111 = 1.2922 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: mrwdunne srsly, it's not the first in any sense, forget about that angle.
mircea_popescu: all it does is telegraph noobishness.
mrwdunne: mircea_popescu Which other ones are still running?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 15 @ 0.07198 = 1.0797 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: so are you going to make the first roman empire, too ?
mrwdunne: True, first might be the wrong word. Regardless it is the only
ThickAsThieves: why use either as a quality?
ThickAsThieves: first, only, all bullshit
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 8 @ 0.07198237 = 0.5759 BTC [+] {2}
mrwdunne: Only is not at all bullshit, although yes first is the wrong word
ThickAsThieves: well only what?
ThickAsThieves: being the only human on island doesnt make you valuable
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3500 @ 0.00094843 = 3.3195 BTC [+]
mrwdunne: Only exchange with access to the UK banking network. That does make you valuable
mircea_popescu: mrwdunne only also telegraphs noobishness. you're too new in this game to know, but nothing is valuable in any market unless and until it has ocmpetitors.
mircea_popescu: noob founders try to pitch onlyness to vcs all the time, innocent of the plain obvious fact that it's a disqualifier.
mrwdunne: mircea_popescu I have read through your posts on bitcointalk already. You pitch that if someone is competent and the idea has potential that is what matters. I am the only person who has managed to get the account
mrwdunne: That is why no one else has done it
ThickAsThieves: i think you missed the points
mircea_popescu: mrwdunne i never posted on btctalk.
fluffypony: mrwdunne: every entrepreneur pitching a business says that their product is a special and unique snowflake the likes of which have not been seen from the beginning of time until now, no nor shall be seen again...that's not a compelling reason for customers to move en-masse to your exchange
mrwdunne: Offering free, instant bank transfers however is a reason to move en-masse. Being the only may not directly be the selling point, however that is a very valid advantage
mrwdunne: And mircea_popescu, sorry, I assumed this was you; https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=124441.0
ThickAsThieves: i'll tell you, bank transfer fees are of little concern to notable buyers
ThickAsThieves: so i save $20
ThickAsThieves: big deal
ThickAsThieves: that doesnt erase that you are new
ThickAsThieves: and of unknown reputation
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves I agree, to significant buyers it is not an issue. However it is a significant advantage to significant amounts of smaller buyers.
mircea_popescu: ever clicked on her signature ?
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves reputation is something that can be earned
ThickAsThieves: have you earned it?
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves No, not yet
ThickAsThieves: what makes a UK exchange ideal over an EU one?
ThickAsThieves: like why is yours better than say https://bitcoin-central.net/
kakobrekla: FCA :D
mrwdunne: Free, instant bank transfers. Perfect regulatory environment for an exchange as there are no AML/KYC requirements.
mrwdunne: kakobrekla Yes, to a degree
ThickAsThieves: Perfect regulatory environment for an exchange as there are no AML/KYC requirements.?
mircea_popescu: mrwdunne dude seriously. you've been running this for what, six weeks ?
ThickAsThieves: none you acknowledge, or none that exist?
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves None that exist
mircea_popescu: a perfect chair that's not been sat into is no sort of advantage. those things will count in five years.
ThickAsThieves: so i can money launder at will in the UK?
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves no you cannot. There are just no reporting requirements
mircea_popescu: fuck, even nefario had a "perfect" regulatory environment for an exchange
mircea_popescu: he said so, to people, at his lolconference
mircea_popescu: two weeks before obscurely shutting down.
mrwdunne: Nefario was a scammer, essentially
ThickAsThieves: whats the distinction, how does AML exist if it doesnt exist?
mircea_popescu: mrwdunne he was an idiot, just like you are.
Naphex: mrwdunne: before i got splitted, i asked what is your defense against bank fraud considering 'instant' bank transfers?
mircea_popescu: unlike you, he didn't have the benefit of -assets existing.
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves it does not exist for bitcoin exchanges in the UK, according to the FCA. We have no legal obligation to collect identification (we will be, but not for small buyers)
fluffypony: lawl - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=584283.0 - "Private message me if interested. Include in your message a personalized (custom) messaged signed from an address with at least $100,000 USD worth of bitcoins contained to prove qualification."
Naphex: as in hacked bank accounts, or clients wanting reversals because they inputed by mistake too many 0's
ThickAsThieves: you are not just a bitcoin exchange though
ThickAsThieves: you process cash too
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves remarkably I have actually spoken with the FCA about this, as opposed to just reading their manuals.
ThickAsThieves: did they provide anything in writing for you?
ThickAsThieves: some kind of exemption or such?
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves I have it in writing that they do not, and have no intention to regulate any bitcoin exchange
mrwdunne: Not an exemption
ThickAsThieves: care to share?
mrwdunne: This is already public knowledge, however I confirmed it with them. Hell I think coindesk did an article on it
ThickAsThieves: so show me
ThickAsThieves: i'm a noob
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-regulation-uk/
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.502 BTC [-]
mrwdunne: (That is not our private correspondence with them however)
ThickAsThieves: this is some bumfuck logic no? "However the FCA has not offered any constructive guidance or comment on the regulation of digital currencies. In fact, the FCA has gone as far as stating it does not regulate digital currencies and has no intention of doing so. The result is that bitcoin businesses in the UK are not obliged to register with or be authorised by the FCA."
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves Sorry, I don't know what you mean by bumfuck logic
jurov: mrwdunne: but you are not bitcoin-only business
mrwdunne: jurov We got further confirmation from them behind closed doors
jurov: you'll be holding your customer's pounds
ThickAsThieves: the text specifies crypto itself
ThickAsThieves: not the buying or selling of it for fiat
mrwdunne: The article specifies crypto itself. We are not basing our compliance on an article
ThickAsThieves: look at it from a real world view
ThickAsThieves: can people launder money through your business?
mircea_popescu: 50.02315578 << jd finally fixed itself!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07199807 = 0.72 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1000 @ 0.0001291 = 0.1291 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: (launder fiat, specifically)
mircea_popescu: pankkake btw, explain pif to me ?
mrwdunne: ThickAsThieves No, we will be complying with the KYC/AML laws regardless.
pankkake: it's just not investing
jurov: recently there was this type of scam around: A buys from B something, B gives to A his exchange E's bank account
jurov: A then sends fiat to E, B exchanges them for bitcoins and vanishes without giving A anything
mircea_popescu: a just hold teh coins ?
jurov: A asks his bank to reverse payment.. what will you (E) do?
pankkake: yes :)
mircea_popescu: lol cool.
mircea_popescu: jurov recently in the sense of... since 2000 :)
mrwdunne: Jurov There are ways of ensuring deposits are not reversed.
ThickAsThieves: panbankke
Naphex: jurov, asked that too.. even hacked bank accounts
ThickAsThieves: bankkake
mircea_popescu: Naphex last numbers i've seen, about 85bn try to move through triangular transfers a year worldwide.
pankkake: I wonder what a bankkake would be…
mircea_popescu: about half manage to.
fluffypony: bank-bake
ThickAsThieves: sperm bank obv
Naphex: !up mircea_popescu
assbot: Voicing mircea_popescu without time-limit.
pankkake: nice
Naphex: !up mrwdunne
assbot: Voicing mrwdunne for 30 minutes.
mrwdunne: Thank you Naphex
ThickAsThieves: !down mircea_popescu
assbot: ThickAsThieves, you can't do that to mircea_popescu.
mike_c: !up mike_c
assbot: Really, mike_c?
ThickAsThieves: but what CAN i do to mircea_popescu?
mike_c: ooh, assbot got brains now.
mike_c: !up ThickAsThieves
assbot: Voicing ThickAsThieves without time-limit.
mike_c: !down ThickAsThieves
assbot: mike_c, you can't do that to ThickAsThieves.
mike_c: !kissmyass assbot
mircea_popescu: if tat were a girl it should say "munch munch munch"
ThickAsThieves: mike_c here's the website for the software guys http://cryptosysinc.com/ (the printout i shared in Timis)
ThickAsThieves: he was here earlier and will likely be back to hang out
ThickAsThieves: hopefully wotted up and such
mircea_popescu: ciil
mike_c: site needs moar css
asciilifeform: java ?!
Naphex: java is good
fluffypony: asciilifeform: ikr
Naphex: a good tool :]
fluffypony: Naphex: a sledgehammer is an amazing tool, but you try cutting a medium-rare steak with it
mike_c: ThickAsThieves: it looks like they are in no way biting off too much ;)
Naphex: fluffypony: ofc same with everything :]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-]
Naphex: but java gets you lots of bonuses early, when working on anything mid-size
mircea_popescu: fluffypony well if you flail it around fast enough you could generate enough plasma to cut a steak...
Naphex: speeds up development, keeps it tidy
fluffypony: hah hah
Naphex: you can JNI plug and do some C to make it faster
mircea_popescu: so what is this publicly traded corp you c'd for ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: the Altech Group
fluffypony: http://www.altech.com
mircea_popescu: decimation: but the "recovery" is great guys, just some snow, no problems here << in fairness, they were overissuing
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4819 @ 0.00094843 = 4.5705 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: hm. ATNP is atlantis
mircea_popescu: where is this listed, sa se ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: JSE (Johannesburg Stock Exchange), which is our equivalent of the NYSE
mircea_popescu: JSE:ATNP allied ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 2.59776300 BTC to 7`210 shares, 36030 satoshi per share
asciilifeform: looks like they make cable boxes.
fluffypony: ah - http://www.bdlive.co.za/business/technology/2013/08/21/altech-delists-from-jse-after-buyout-by-parent-altron
fluffypony: delisted now
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] [PAID] 61.04601580 BTC to 80`674 shares, 75670 satoshi per share
fluffypony: worst two years of my life, so much discord and backstabbing and dick-measuring among their management
mircea_popescu: seem to be on an acquisition spree now, and pumping per share earnings
fluffypony: they're always on an acquisition spree
fluffypony: they got lucky early on with a couple of smart acquisitions
fluffypony: which then funded every acquisition
fluffypony: so then they buy stupidly, and if a company gets folded into your division/company you're fucked trying to integrate staff that don't want to be there
mircea_popescu: so what's your name again ?
fluffypony: especially management staff that are defunct
fluffypony: Riccardo Spagni
mircea_popescu: nice to meet you.
fluffypony: :)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0719999 = 0.144 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 9 @ 0.0719999 = 0.648 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 55 @ 0.070803 = 3.8942 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: lol family concern of the venters, 1k p/e
mircea_popescu: what sort of lolcompany is this
fluffypony: it's ridiculous, daddy is smart and started a company, and then basically gave his sons companies and shitloads of money
fluffypony: Altech is successful in spite of its CEO, not because of it
fluffypony: !voice mrstickball
fluffypony: !up mrstickball
assbot: Voicing mrstickball for 30 minutes.
fluffypony: that thing
Blazedout419: sup mrstickball
mrstickball: lots and lots of work
mrstickball: as always
Blazedout419: that is a good thing
mrstickball: turns out, there's a new crypto-security that is based out of Grove City
mircea_popescu: so who replaced you ?
mrstickball: so I am gonna meet with him soon
mrstickball: !up Mrstickball
assbot: Insufficient rights, mrstickball, !up yourself on PM first.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: no clue, I left just before they folded Swistech into ISIS (Oct 2012), so whoever ended up managing that process would have been my replacement
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 13 @ 0.07066246 = 0.9186 BTC [-] {4}
mircea_popescu: anyway, this added an obscure foreign lolcorp for my shortlist
mrstickball: Blazedout419: look into Adeally... They're out of Grove City
mrstickball: its somewhat interesting. Not their business as much as they are using Counterparty
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 8 @ 0.03251 = 0.2601 BTC [+]
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: shortlist of companies never to deal with or invest in? coz that's where they should be on:-P
Blazedout419: ;;gettrust mrstickball
gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask mrstickball!uid14687@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xhdulznzsjnbbbyc. Trust relationship from user Blazedout419 to user mrstickball: Level 1: 5, Level 2: 3 via 2 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=Blazedout419&dest=mrstickball | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=mrstickball | Rated since: Fri Jul 5 18:09:54 2013
mrwdunne: Is that the online store? The one that valued themselves at several million?
Blazedout419: I woud think you can !up your self?
mrstickball: I can now, I think
mrstickball: mrwdunne: yeah, I think so
mrstickball: its a crypto penny auction site
mrwdunne: mrstickball It seemed like an interesting idea. But not worth close to that much
mircea_popescu: fluffypony no, just to keep short positions in
mrstickball: not the best plan per-se in terms of what it is, but the PPM and DD look good
fluffypony: ah ok
mrstickball: so its a weird combination of great plan, bad idea
mircea_popescu: once mr w croaks that thing's gone.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 8 @ 0.0706 = 0.5648 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8600 @ 0.00094897 = 8.1611 BTC [+] {3}
mrstickball: !voice mrwdunne
mrstickball: !up mrwdunne
assbot: Voicing mrwdunne for 30 minutes.
mrwdunne: Thank you mrstick
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.042 = 0.126 BTC [-] {2}
mrstickball: now we need a counterparty ticker..
fluffypony: who is this minerpart cat?
mircea_popescu: unclear.
mrwdunne: No one who seems very significant at this point in time
jurov: !up chetty
assbot: Voicing chetty for 30 minutes.
mrstickball: You can pull out the BTC from when people buy into your company, correct mrwdunne ?
mrwdunne: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=148712 Reputation isn't very good
ozbot: Login
mrwdunne: And mrstickball yes you can
mrwdunne: *yes I can
numerisTrade: hello
numerisTrade: do you have any experience with ititch.com (or can recommend any other bitcoin domain registrar)?
mrwdunne: namecheap.com is excellent numeristrade
mircea_popescu: or at least used to be. i dunno anyone used it itches thingee, so you get to be the first.
artifexd: When will trading of s.mpif begin?
mircea_popescu: prolly next week
mircea_popescu: the idea being that it'll have its first report before the 5th, and that'll allow a nav, and then it can trade.
artifexd: ty
numerisTrade: mircea_popescu, is there any domain registrar you can recommend? What is wrong with namecheap.com?
mike_c: piffy nav is ~250 btc?
mircea_popescu: they were really great, but recently did a dumbass websiute redesign breaking everything. i bitched about it, they fixed some things, what can i say. nothing good endures
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/namecheap-goes-off-the-deep-end-anyone-know-a-decent-domain-registrar/ < the long version if you care.
ozbot: Namecheap goes off the deep end. Anyone know a decent domain registrar ? pe Trilema - Un blog de Mir
mircea_popescu: mike_c should be about 200ish on start yes.
mircea_popescu: numerisTrade anyway, definitely a better bet than godaddy, which is unequivocally atrocious. maybe enom if you have a direct contract with them.
mircea_popescu: decimation: re: amazon, I've heard it's a tough life working there << but it's a large corp. of course they'd be managing the fuck out of all cost, neh ? afaik google is pretty much the only giant still trying to play the startup, otherwise even apple is bezos-ing it away.
bounce: http://mises.org/daily/2542 seems to say that the whole "unenforeable contracts" thing isn't that new
ozbot: The Enterprise of Customary Law - Bruce L. Benson - Mises Daily
ThickAsThieves: The verdict is in, unless i'm ready to move to Romania, and/or MPEx blocks US customers, and/or I register as a broker/dealer with SEC, I must decline the MPIF mgr position due to legal concerns. Even then, it'd take a combination of those to have any remote chance of safety. :(
mircea_popescu: forward soviet!
ThickAsThieves: i need to gtfo usg
numerisTrade: thank you, mircea_popescu, for link and help
ThickAsThieves: :(
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: move to South Africa
bounce: well, then gtfo usg
fluffypony: we basically have no laws of real worth, and those that could possible get in your way seem to disappear at the wiff of money
ThickAsThieves: as an interesting aside, my lawyer, a former US Attorney, has expressed interest in coming here tp pick your brain MP
fluffypony: (not quite that bad, but it's a little wild-westish)
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: get on the fscking plane.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves am i to charge him retainer ? :D
ThickAsThieves: hehe
ThickAsThieves: i told him "on YOUR time, not mine!"
bounce: isn't there a private jet thing for this sort of situation yet?
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: optionally - on the boat.
bounce: slow boat out of america
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.07111 = 0.2133 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: who's the guy that crossed pacific in a barrel ?
bounce: great opportunity to catch up with the reading. *is a bit swamped*
ThickAsThieves: Super Mario?
bounce: can't trust a thing that guy claims, he's clearly on shroomz
asciilifeform: my puny brain boggles at folks who can afford to rocket out and still don't
ThickAsThieves: so anyone have any great leads on jobs in animal conservation in non-US countries?
bounce: "self preservation" ought to count *gdr*
mircea_popescu: fluffypony should be able to hook you up
BingoBoingo: http://it.slashdot.org/story/14/04/25/1227204/hp-server-killer-firmware-update-on-the-loose
ozbot: HP Server Killer Firmware Update On the Loose - Slashdot
mircea_popescu: his blondy looks like she's doing lots of animal conservationing :D
fluffypony: lol
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: yes, she can come here and look after our dogs, we have 6 of them
ThickAsThieves: lol
fluffypony: seriously tho, there are a bunch of programs
ThickAsThieves: more like saving rhinos and okapi
fluffypony: but they're pretty stupid because you pay them to be a volunteer worker
fluffypony: which seems insane
ThickAsThieves: she actually works for one that runs the Okapi Conservation Project
ThickAsThieves: except no way am i moving to the COngo
mircea_popescu: why the fuck not ?
ThickAsThieves: butt rape?
bounce: probably more effective to start a militia/hire a bunch of trigger happy goons/whatever and do some "long pig hunting" on poachers
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: the Congo's a tough haul for a white guy
mircea_popescu: he's not white.
ThickAsThieves: white enough
ThickAsThieves: worse, i'm portuguese
Naphex: bbl
mircea_popescu: he's just shy. these are not the same :D
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: anyone not tall, dark, and French speaking is white to them ;)
ThickAsThieves: we raped africa plenty
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves be a man, take the wife to the congo.
ThickAsThieves: lol
ThickAsThieves: teh peer pressure in thizs place!
mircea_popescu: worst that can happen is you end up dead. which will happen anyway.
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: in all seriousness, there are a number of really good programs out here that are always looking for help - I think I linked to these guys the other day, but in case not: http://www.jukani.co.za
asciilifeform: 'coward dies a thousand deaths, brave man - one'
ThickAsThieves: luck can separate the brave from the fools
mrwdunne: I think people prefer to live for longer though. Definitely go and do some charity in Africa though - its a great experience
moiety: mew
bitcoinpete: asciilifeform: hail!
ThickAsThieves: but yknow i will bring up visiting Africa
ThickAsThieves: does S Africa have MLAT with US?
moiety: <ThickAsThieves> so anyone have any great leads on jobs in animal conservation in non-US countries? << manuls obviously
fluffypony: mlat?
fluffypony: oh googled
bounce: depends on what you think is "charity". plenty of the oh-so-selfless white influence hasn't done the continent a bit of good
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves you don't bring it up. you go home and say "woman, we're leaving for the congo. pack stockings and tank tops, and read up on slim's guide to cook for bogart"
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/124466.pdf
fluffypony: so it would seem
ThickAsThieves: these USGs be so insidious
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07031794 = 0.7032 BTC [-]
ThickAsThieves: mp, to say as much would be to decide whether divorce is the answer
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: stay in usa - and perhaps we'll meet in our common gasenwagen.
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves women have this endless capacity to pleasantly surprise.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0711095 = 0.1422 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3100 @ 0.00094958 = 2.9437 BTC [+]
moiety: finally, someone noticed!
mircea_popescu: i knew it all along kitten.
fluffypony: looks like there's mutual extradition in place, but that they've refused to extradite before for a guy that could possibly have received the death penalty
fluffypony: "This infringed Mohamed's rights to human dignity, to life, and not to be punished in a cruel, inhuman or degrading manner. The Constitutional Court concluded that the handing over of Mohamed to the US government was unlawful"
mircea_popescu: fluffypony i wonder how much that cost.
fluffypony: lol
mrwdunne: What charges were they extraditing him on?
asciilifeform: russia doesn't extradite (anybody) but you might have other problems (Have Problems (TM)) there.
fluffypony: "Mohamed, a Tanzanian national, fled to South Africa after his involvement in the 1998 bombing of the US embassy in Dar-es-Salaam."
mircea_popescu: lmao
mircea_popescu: so they have an agreement, which they can't use to extradite terrorists ?
mircea_popescu: whoa how very fart reaching.
fluffypony: pretty much
mrwdunne: US doesn't have a very good track record when it comes to human rights and terrorism. Their judgement was probably the correct one
moiety: mircea_popescu: totally forgot i was due you cookies http://i.imgur.com/rswbqJI.jpg
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: before you move setup a fake murder in the US, and then if they try extradite you you can just claim that the death penalty is a possibility
fluffypony: problem solved
mircea_popescu: ahahah bears.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony you are clearly well qualified to give legal advice :D
ThickAsThieves: thats some fucked up legal system
ThickAsThieves: incentive to terrorize
moiety: :D yeah i havent found a manul cutter yet -- epic job for a 3D printer i reckon
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: clearly :-P
mircea_popescu: now who was i owing cookies to ? benkay ? kakobrekla ?
mircea_popescu: mike ain't getting one, he's rotund as it is.
ThickAsThieves: davout
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves i don't trust davout. his girl only rated him a 3.
ThickAsThieves: mike aint rotund, he just has a jolly face
kakobrekla: not that id get any, but i dont like cookies :(
moiety: you'll be needing more then http://i.imgur.com/jKKEEjY.jpg these are actually shortbread mid-sugaring
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla well we're all out of tits.
asciilifeform: ThickAsThieves: ianal, but is owning foreign stock actually banned in usa?
mircea_popescu: !up quantyfikator
assbot: Voicing quantyfikator for 30 minutes.
kakobrekla: asciilifeform arent you getting out?
ThickAsThieves: asciilifeform, no thats not the issue
ThickAsThieves: but
ThickAsThieves: you are obligated to report any foreign account with more than $10k
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: i'd -like- to get out. that's quite different from actually escaping.
chetty: you can run but cannot hide
moiety: kakobrekla: i'll make savoury ones for you
benkay: mircea_popescu: i already got my cookie. but it was a different cookie.
ThickAsThieves: ascii with your brains and my tongue we could surive easily in any place
ThickAsThieves: thats sounds dirty
ThickAsThieves: lol
asciilifeform: chetty: reminiscent of traditional american saying: 'don't run from a sniper, you'll just die tired'
kakobrekla: asciilifeform working on it or only wishing ?
mircea_popescu: benkay nookie == cookie ?
moiety: vagina == cookie
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: you saw some of the work. so decide for yourself.
mike_c: rotund! perhaps, but i am also strong like bull. all you scrawny europeans couldn't bench press a girl.
mircea_popescu: mike_c i could benchpress any girl i;d care to fuck.
mircea_popescu: i know this, because... guess.
ThickAsThieves: you fuck only men?
mike_c: that's like short guys saying they don't like tall women. very self serving.
mircea_popescu: mike_c that's my middle name, m self serving p.
benkay: what's the middle name in a four name name? lol
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: !up chetty
assbot: Voicing chetty for 30 minutes.
chetty: ty
benkay: http://letstalkbitcoin.com/maidsafe-wildly-successful-crypto-crowdsale-debacle/ << scammers accept mastercoin and bitcoin hoping mastercoin's too derpy for people to use, end up getting all msc go 'no no no you see we actually want your btc'
mircea_popescu: i quote, "<chetty> well you be glad to hear we're finally back to active programing on eulora - but right now need to hit the store for weekend supplies of milk and coffee - back in a bit"
mircea_popescu: figure you folks prolly care too!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 11 @ 0.07031794 = 0.7735 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: benkay lmao
asciilifeform: squadron of coffee to program converters?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 18 @ 0.07 = 1.26 BTC [-] {3}
ThickAsThieves: “I think it’s a really interesting area," Cook said. "We have almost 800 million iTunes accounts and the majority of those have credit cards behind them. We already have people using Touch ID to buy things across our store, so it’s an area of interest to us. And it’s an area where nobody has figured it out yet.
ThickAsThieves: "I realize that there are some companies playing in it, but you still have a wallet in your back pocket and I do too which probably means it hasn’t been figured out just yet.” ~Tim Cook
benkay: why weren't they converting coffee to program in the first place, mircea_popescu ?
mircea_popescu: milk is probably for enticing manuls or something
asciilifeform: in argentina, there is 'pampas cat' instead
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19769 @ 0.00094804 = 18.7418 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: very similar-looking beast
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there is, but moiety will never get to know.
asciilifeform: ;;google pampas cat
gribble: Pampas cat - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pampas_cat>; Pampas Cat Facts - Big Cat Rescue: <http://bigcatrescue.org/pampas-cat-facts/>; Pampas cat videos, photos and facts - Leopardus colocolo | ARKive: <http://www.arkive.org/pampas-cat/leopardus-colocolo/>
asciilifeform: moiety could also escape, meet pampas cat.
benkay: <bitcoinpete> taleb's on a roll right now << link?
moiety: i like them too! they have stripy legs!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 9000 @ 0.0001291 = 1.1619 BTC [-]
moiety: this is actually what got me thinking on expanding to a felinae site
mircea_popescu: ima pay 1 btc to taleb and 1 btc to whoever gets him to come here.
asciilifeform: ;;google colocolo cat
gribble: Colocolo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colocolo>; Pampas cat videos, photos and facts - Leopardus colocolo | ARKive: <http://www.arkive.org/pampas-cat/leopardus-colocolo/>; Leopardus colocolo (Chilean Pampa Cat, Pampas Cat): <http://www.iucnredlist.org/details/15309/0>
bitcoinpete: benkay: same as the one posted the last few times in here: http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/notebook.htm
benkay: bitcoinpete: that's the footnotes to FBR?
benkay: (those're)
mircea_popescu: also in s.mpif news : juraj whom you know as jurov has accepted to take over pc #5.
bitcoinpete: mircea_popescu: un défi!
jurov: yes
moiety: do you get crazy [wild]cat ladies? if so, i need a tshirt
bitcoinpete: benkay: the notebook is like his blog, a running tally
benkay: ;;later tell ThickAsThieves may i help you, sir?
ThickAsThieves: grats jurov
gribble: The operation succeeded.
benkay: ;;later tell ThickAsThieves ah i see you wanted me to talk to MichalisBTC?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
ThickAsThieves: yeah
ThickAsThieves: he'll be back probly
bitcoinpete: jurov: indeed, best of luck!
ThickAsThieves: but the website link is there
jurov: thx
jurov: asciilifeform, you mentioned some code to rape other bots? imma interested ;)
mircea_popescu: "44% of Americans are living with less than $5,887 in savings for a family of four" << fun fact ? most romanians own more than that.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12201 @ 0.00094552 = 11.5363 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: so, i stopped by the doc today had my blood pressure measured. anyone care to guess ?
jurov: 120/80
mircea_popescu: (as a bonus hint, before retiring a good decade ago, i was doing something like 240/160)
jurov: 100/60 if you had an erection
mircea_popescu: lol j
fluffypony: ;;later tell davout just in case you have't seen this - http://www.pfhub.com/report-revenue-from-bitcoin-must-be-declared-to-french-authorities-602/
gribble: The operation succeeded.
BingoBoingo: 135/90
mircea_popescu: dude the sa crew is actually doing a splendid job raping teh tardtalk forums
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo 130/90, you take the cake.
mircea_popescu: HeySteve: this place is becoming a real Dragon's Den, I'm thinking of writing something to that effect << by all means. maybe get nubbins to draw us all as pony dragons.
mircea_popescu: speaking of which
mircea_popescu: ;;seen nubbins
gribble: I have not seen nubbins.
mircea_popescu: ;;seen nubbins`
gribble: nubbins` was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 week, 0 days, 14 hours, 18 minutes, and 33 seconds ago: <nubbins`> you will need it if you don't want to have to download a client and python every time you boot
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4750 @ 0.00094751 = 4.5007 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: omfg our untalented drawer / sausage maker guy is gone! WHERE!
BingoBoingo: Fell into sausage grinder with nailgun?
mircea_popescu: come back nubsy we need ourselves drawn as flying dragon princesses
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: which SA crew?
mircea_popescu: fluffypony not sa as in south africa, sa as in something awful
fluffypony: oh lol
mircea_popescu: which admittedly is an easy enough mistake to make.
mircea_popescu: !up veeminer
assbot: Voicing veeminer for 30 minutes.
ThickAsThieves: Java updates are a scam: yes/no
BingoBoingo: yes
fluffypony: yes
ThickAsThieves: seems they are just veiled ads
ThickAsThieves: and/or reports to the mothership
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16563 @ 0.00094834 = 15.7074 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.0325 = 0.13 BTC [+]
fluffypony: I hate having to even have Java installed, but SuperMicro's IPMI requires it for remote console
mircea_popescu: fluffypony REFLASH IT
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: is there a non-Java IPMI bios available for their boards?
fluffypony: coz that shit irks me more than NameCheap's new design
mircea_popescu: nothing os afaik
fluffypony: leu sigh
mircea_popescu: they use what, vnc ?
fluffypony: I have nfi
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.0711097 = 0.4978 BTC [-] {3}
fluffypony: "The underlying protocol seems to be VNC, but with a different authentication scheme, making standard VNC clients useless. (Also it appears to be an OEM version of ATENs KVM/VNC stuff.)"
jurov: just use openjdk
mircea_popescu: what the hell useless. have your wizard rewrite the auth scheme
mircea_popescu: bs auth in-house giga scheme anyway, prolly more broken than a 50yo whore.
fluffypony: jurov: yeah I may just do that
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: I think there are tons of undiscovered issues with all this non-standard IPMI shit, I'm waiting for something major to hit any time soon
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.508535 = 1.0171 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: kinda why you have to have homebrew
mircea_popescu: for these sorts of shit.
fluffypony: yerp
veeminer: mircea_popescu: what?
mircea_popescu: going through the londerfull log of this mrwdune dood. did he at least have the sense to locate in Guernsey ?
mircea_popescu: !up heretostay
assbot: Voicing heretostay for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: veeminer sorry, what what ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.51199997 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: in the butt
mircea_popescu: fluffypony: how your software will handle large volumes << that's the funniest thing i read today.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: well the point being that he has to have some more details on the proposal other than "money plz, will spend on sekuriteez and kode"
fluffypony: "and data center"
mircea_popescu: no i know, but ...
mircea_popescu: you know.
BingoBoingo: http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/which-states-hate-themselves-the-most-1567602325/+reubenfb
fluffypony: I know
ozbot: Which States Hate Themselves The Most?
fluffypony: he could probably do it in PHP for the volume he's going to get
fluffypony: :-P
jurov: ;;bc,tslb
gribble: Error: "bc,tslb" is not a valid command.
jurov: ;;tslb
gribble: Time since last block: 38 minutes and 40 seconds
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo did they leave out ny or am i blind
ThickAsThieves: 41%
BingoBoingo: Blind, New York was a 41%
ThickAsThieves: Montana and Alaska at 77%
mircea_popescu: aok
ThickAsThieves: Illinois at 19%
ThickAsThieves: they just miss Obama
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: lol counterparty.co srsly ? "pls to trade your bitcoinz for very valuable xcp"
BingoBoingo: Chicago dragging down the good middle of nowhere we have
mircea_popescu: https://forums.counterparty.co/index.php/topic,289.msg2078
mircea_popescu: What Happened
mircea_popescu: Due in part to this process, we have been notified of a security bug in bitcoinjs-lib (the bitcoin javascript library counterwallet uses) that was internally disclosed to us by the bitcoinjs-lib team yesterday evening. We worked with them on applying a fix, which was made live late last night and this security notice was drafted pending confirmation from the team. However it appears the bug has already been exploited i
mircea_popescu: n the wild to take BTC.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.50200001 = 1.004 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 227 @ 0.0044 = 0.9988 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: somehow i seem to have missed this ? did bitcoinjs announce something ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.50200001 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 113 @ 0.0044 = 0.4972 BTC [-]
fluffypony: LOL
fluffypony: what a fail
mircea_popescu: wait, there's more.
mircea_popescu: "After scoring a major grant awarded by the Bitcoin Foundation, Coinpunk’s beta version is finally available. The project, which is being developed by the veteran startup founder Kyle Drake, intends to build the first fully open-source, self-hosted do-it-yourself Bitcoin wallet service that you can run on your own server."
mircea_popescu: "To reward the work of the developers, Drake is “offering three bounties of 0.20 BTC each for anyone that finds and fixes (via pull request) any bugs/code issues that potentially cause wallet data loss, a major security bug in the Coinpunk wallet code (coinpunk/models/wallet.js), bitcoinjs-lib, or in the random number generation code”."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6041 @ 0.00094962 = 5.7367 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: the... wait for it... the random number generation code.
mircea_popescu: can i get a cup of coffee now ?
fluffypony: oh I saw that - it's a web wallet that you host yourself, because that seems like a great idea
fluffypony: because statistically speaking people know how to secure shitty/cheap VPS instances
ThickAsThieves: Now selling random numbers, .01 btc each!
jurov: it's a "wiggle mouse here" kind?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.50200001 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 112 @ 0.0044 = 0.4928 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: but srsly, anyone heard of this major bitcoinjs-lib hole ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 71 @ 0.0044 = 0.3124 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: (incidentally, the rng of the java thing is particularly atrocious. piuk (blockchaininfo) made some fixes on a fork)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.502 = 1.004 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 327 @ 0.0044 = 1.4388 BTC [-] {4}
jurov: ;;tslb
gribble: Time since last block: 53 minutes and 9 seconds
jurov: zactly when i need it
asciilifeform: jurov: re: bots - consider some simple examples, you can probably think of
mircea_popescu: record
jurov: i did think of, and made countermeasures when i ran mine
jurov: but did not try to actively exploit
asciilifeform: jurov: e.g. if you can figure out that mr. whale runs bot with 'stop loss' at $x/btc, you can estimate resulting price move, effect on other such machines
asciilifeform: no rocket surgery, this
jurov: okay
asciilifeform: jurov: at the time i simply itched to write 'something with ai' that 'could money'
Naphex: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0USm3AilHiU - good tune to start your fridays ;]
ozbot: ZHU - Moves Like Ms. Jackson (Outkast Cover) - YouTube
moiety: <fluffypony> coz that shit irks me more than NameCheap's new design << dude, glad it's not just me. i seriously thought i'd gone to the wrong place for a second
kakobrekla: did you try it live ascii?
Blazedout419: ebay
Blazedout419: woops wrong windows
fluffypony: moiety: their old interface wasn't pretty, but I'm buying a domain...I wouldn't mind an ncurses interface if it worked well
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: tried it on recorded data stream from 'btc-e'. 'won' on some segments, lost on others. then mp gave me a demo account on mpex, where bots do no good, and i lost interest
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: if you actually find this interesting, i can say more
mrstickball: 1hr since last block..
mrstickball: what happens if it reaches 1MB?
asciilifeform: i sort of assumed that everybody here had tried their hand at such things personally
moiety: fluffypony: it now looks like a hipster site of some sort
kakobrekla: yes continiue
mrstickball: do all transactions go to the next block once its mined?
moiety: fluffypony: oh and i dont mind what the site is like, as long as it isn't godaddy tbf
fluffypony: moiety: yeah, until you need to manage a domain, then you have the old interface iframe'd in to the Hipster Header
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: i concluded that one could actually do an interesting 'predator bot' if it has a heavy bag of coin to 'shake around' and cause (however small) price moves on demand.
mircea_popescu: ^
kakobrekla: well i did have some robots on btcusd back in the day but prolly nothing as sophisticated as you
mircea_popescu: fluffypony really they backed off over twitter threats and general discontent
mircea_popescu: you should have seen the original version
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: perhaps i'll test this hypothesis one day. right after my nuke sub, etc.
moiety: i actually have hosting with namecheap D:
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform trader experience is that any strategy that starts with "if you had a lot of money" is a loser.
BingoBoingo: ^
mircea_popescu: this is counter-intuitive perhaps, but quite true
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i believe it. notice i've no truck with any such thing at present.
fluffypony: moiety: I have a VPS with them that runs an Electrum server, and then all my international (non-.co.za) domains are with them
asciilifeform: don't recall how it came up.
kakobrekla: well with inifinite moneey theres no issue for sure
fluffypony: except for a handful of domain hacks for TLDs they don't offer
mircea_popescu: yeah. the master model of the preoblem is "cornering X market", such as the 5 i think to date attempts on silver/gold
asciilifeform: the point wasn't to merely 'with enough money' but specific target - dumb bots
moiety: when they opened up a uk data centre, they gave too good a deal. what i dont like is the hoops you have to jump through to get ssh access fluffypony
mircea_popescu: the copper pair and so forth
mircea_popescu: it NEVER works. it always seems like it just might.
fluffypony: moiety: is that for shared hosting or a VPS?
asciilifeform: i don't for a minute imagine it'd work against humans
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no but that's always what it is, "dumb x". the mkt isnt dumb
moiety: just shared, im not in anyway ready for vps type affairs fluffypony XD im just getting to grips with ssh!
asciilifeform: i originally had the thought when noticing a proliferation of particularly dumb bots running on gox etc
fluffypony: ah ok ok :)
asciilifeform: many, with published source
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform from a mathematical standpoint : the most important quality of markets is that you can't isolate participants.
asciilifeform: a very sorry sight, all of them
mircea_popescu: but yeah i remember that bs.
moiety: believe me when i have anything worth showing i'll be begging you all to take a tour :D (just be dont make me cry if im super proud!)
mircea_popescu: this was how mtgox managed to lose daytrading.
asciilifeform: in some particular cases (online poker table) you can in fact isolate the idiots (at least, long enough to squeeze juice)
asciilifeform: the idea was to engineer such a case
asciilifeform: but this is boring story.
kakobrekla: its impossible for me to do buy/sell bot on btc, im stuck in bull mode since ever, so my only game was straight forward arb
asciilifeform: i only tell it because i was foolish enough to mention it once here, and then kako asked 'how did it end'
mircea_popescu: anyone remember https://blockchain.info/address/1HKywxiL4JziqXrzLKhmB6a74ma6kxbSDj btw ?
kakobrekla: yeah blame it on kako
asciilifeform: lol
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla means "that's who she blamed" in slovenlyan right ?
kakobrekla: thats who she slandered
kakobrekla: whats that addy ?
fluffypony: kakobrekla: the Android Java RNG hack
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla remember the android hole last year ?
mircea_popescu: aye.
kakobrekla: the random() return 4; ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.49907271 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.03154 = 0.1577 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 400 @ 0.0075 = 3 BTC [+]
kakobrekla: the damage is rather small
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: aye, and duplicate signature nonces, and the obvious consequences
kakobrekla: myea
mircea_popescu: MrWDunne: Also the actual business plan is a 25 page PDF << i like this part best so far.
asciilifeform: re: IPMI: lol let's put a piece of remote-controlled strange on the system bus.
asciilifeform: gonna be great.
kakobrekla: i parsed it as "25 kg PDF" for some reason
fluffypony: asciilifeform: yeah I know, but it's better than our dedicated box at a DC here where I have to log a fault and they send an engineer out to press enter on the keyboard because it's stuck at the grub screen
mircea_popescu: is it better for the pdf to be heavy or long ?
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: i'm one of those weirdos who likes to print docs (mainly chip datashits) and has encountered 25kg pdfs.
kakobrekla: :D
fluffypony: I think it's important for PDFs to have images that haven't been compressed or resampled, because you really want that small logo at the top left to be a 2.5mb PNG
asciilifeform: fluffypony: an ordinary 'ip kvm' solves this
asciilifeform: the people pushing crap like ipmi have other motivations.
fluffypony: asciilifeform: agreed
mircea_popescu: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BmFYGWkCMAE8CK6.jpg
mircea_popescu: russians caged like animals. art project.
mircea_popescu: fucking losers these kids. if i were 20 and doing a lulzy project like that, the russki'd be naked.
asciilifeform: lel
asciilifeform: 'djvu' is better format for scans, anyway
asciilifeform: 1/20th the size & rendering time
asciilifeform: a little like the diff. between 'mp3' and 'wav'
mircea_popescu: so romania has a large lawyer's forum, where pretty much everyone that's not fucktarded in the profession has an account. think fuckedcompany, except for lawyers.
mircea_popescu: http://www.avocatnet.ro/content/forum%7CdisplayTopicPage/topicID_423694/Vanzare-papagal-pentru-o-partida-de-sex-Cum-recuperez-pasarea.html
ozbot: Vanzare papagal pentru o partida de sex Cum recuperez pasarea? Pagina 1 - Forum, Avocatnet.ro
mircea_popescu: people ask for free advice all the time. some of the shit's pretty weird.
mircea_popescu: this guy threw a party, asked a girl to sleep with him, she said she'll do it if he's "generous"
mircea_popescu: except, she wants no money, he wants is macaw
mircea_popescu: so he gives it to her.
mircea_popescu: then, the next day, guy realises that the bird costs 2500 euro and besides, he had it since it was a chick and htey had a special relationship
mircea_popescu: so... can he sue ? should he report her for prostitution ? is there some fruits of the poisonous tree doctrine ?
mircea_popescu: hilarity ensues.
asciilifeform: sounds more like 'enjo kosai' than prostitution
mircea_popescu: he's got nothing there, nobody ever granted a cause for anything but the most outrageous streetwalking.
mircea_popescu: prostitution is , in the romanian legal tradition, a part of the creating a public disturbance/being a bum area.
asciilifeform: in english world, 'soliciting'
mircea_popescu: "soliciting while being poor, unpleasant and unattractive, in a loud and obnoxious manner"
asciilifeform: how else could it work.
asciilifeform: '... for if it prospers, none dare call it treason' etc
mircea_popescu: i guyess
mircea_popescu: i dunno, the us is no longer sane, so one feels bound to insist.
asciilifeform: wait this was in us?
mircea_popescu: no no but you are :D
asciilifeform: lol
mircea_popescu: hehehe
mircea_popescu: btw, anyone here with a lot of insurance experience or connections ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6800 @ 0.00094962 = 6.4574 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: http://www.unitedliberty.org/articles/17407-nra-to-push-national-reciprocity-for-concealed-carry-permit-holders?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
ozbot: NRA to push national reciprocity for concealed carry permit holders | United Liberty | Free Market -
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this has been an 'any day now' thing forever.
mircea_popescu: hey, if fags can be married everywhere regardless whether they married, why shouldn't rednecks carry wherever they go.
mircea_popescu: the strat is sound, that's how you push it.
ThickAsThieves: http://img.thesun.co.uk/aidemitlum/archive/01963/breast_1963596a.jpg
mircea_popescu: http://pagesix.com/2014/04/24/warren-buffet-ordered-dairy-queen-a-coke-at-four-seasons/
ozbot: Warren Buffet ordered Dairy Queen, a coke at Four Seasons | Page Six
mircea_popescu: i swear to god i'd have kicked him out.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1400 @ 0.0009503 = 1.3304 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves looks like the right tit for the job.
ThickAsThieves: "Sharon Spink is used to turning heads when she breastfeeds her daughter in public." lol
asciilifeform: 'buffet drinks the same coke as the beggar drinks' - literally true
mircea_popescu: sharon spink soulds like a super villain name
mircea_popescu: her power could be... i dunno, snatch.
ThickAsThieves: buffet resorts to shilling, another sign it's over
ThickAsThieves: The ketchup on my kobe better be Heinz!
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves prolly just codgery.
mircea_popescu: Meanwhile, “pretty young things swarmed Warren as soon he walked through the doors, asking to have photos taken with him,” said one observer. “He graciously did it. A few people asked him to open his wallet in the picture. Oddly enough, he did this too.” According to the onlooker, Buffett had “just a few dollars in his wallet.” The source added, “He’s more popular than the Dalai Lama!”
mircea_popescu: jesus these people.
kakobrekla: whats wrong with coke, its got sugar, caffeine and co2, all the bad shit you can have in one bottle
kakobrekla: the poison of choice
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: what in actual...eugh...
fluffypony: remind me never to click on breast.jpg links from TAT
kakobrekla: i dun get the hate
kakobrekla: maybe because ima beggar .
ThickAsThieves: lil girl was thirsty, dont judge
jurov: be glad WB did not order frappucino
fluffypony: jurov: thus secretly revealing himself to be Karpeles' father?
fluffypony: s/father/grandfather
mircea_popescu: http://pastebin.com/TrZeKFXs << is this fud ?
ozbot: "About a week ago some colleagues and I discovered a set of x509 certificates wh - Pastebin.com
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4600 @ 0.00094933 = 4.3669 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: Hmmm... Who has windows?
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: I have an XP VM I can fire up
mircea_popescu: i don't have samples.
asciilifeform: 'nsakey'
fluffypony: oh XP is negative
fluffypony: nm
ThickAsThieves: i have some windows systems, but none are fresh
asciilifeform: first catch loch ness monster, then consider how to skin & stuff her.
ThickAsThieves: so ive had solar power for 3 days now, they come to collect check for install and say, hey yknow you should shut this off, because the new meter isnt installed by power co, it's actually making the count go up not down
ThickAsThieves: so basically i'm gonna be billed for like 400kw of power i gave to elec co
mircea_popescu: hahaha
mircea_popescu: wait you made 400kw in 3 days ?!
mircea_popescu: where the fuck do you live, the pentagon ?
ThickAsThieves: 340m i just checked it
ThickAsThieves: 340kwh
asciilifeform: let me guess, heat pump.
mircea_popescu: wtf.
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 340 / 3 / 24
gribble: 4.72222222222
mircea_popescu: 5kW installed ?
ThickAsThieves: we have 38 units on the roof
ThickAsThieves: 10k system
mircea_popescu: hey... more power to you.
ThickAsThieves: lol
ThickAsThieves: he says itll perform closer to 9
ThickAsThieves: per mo
jurov: i'd not use 24 hours in solar panel calculations
ThickAsThieves: no one would
mircea_popescu: lol
mircea_popescu: moonlight!
ThickAsThieves: oh you did
ThickAsThieves: hehe
asciilifeform: nah he's got an antipodal cable & 2nd set.
fluffypony: lol
fluffypony: that's how he gets news about China first?
fluffypony: best tin can phone ever
ThickAsThieves: guess how much the sys cost
ThickAsThieves: including hybrid water heater (not solar)
ThickAsThieves: $14k
ThickAsThieves: thank you obama
asciilifeform: gov.-subsidized, ah
mircea_popescu: lmao the derpage.
mircea_popescu: http://3w.blogidol.ro/2014/04/dmca-takedownvali-petcu-aka-zoso.html
ozbot: DMCA takedown–Vali Petcu aka Zoso | Blog Idol ro
fluffypony: wow, ThickAsThieves we'd pay $37k-ish for that here
mircea_popescu: tl;dr : blogger butthurt over blogger.com having deleted some pix off his blog. turns out... he had stolen them from some guy who had stolen them from trilema
ThickAsThieves: yeah it's $44k before rebates and shit
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves pretty sweet deal. i'd drop 15k on a 10kW solar system.
mircea_popescu: how much roof you got ? do they use all or just half ?
ThickAsThieves: half
fluffypony: likewise, in a heartbeat
ThickAsThieves: i was like i want more panelz!
mircea_popescu: what surface ?
moiety: that blogger is ridiculous btw
ThickAsThieves: ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: betcha you could buy a soviet rtg pod for <$10k
ThickAsThieves: facing east and south
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves what surface is your roof
mircea_popescu: like, in sq fett
ThickAsThieves: no idea
mircea_popescu: zese marketing ppls.
ThickAsThieves: house is like 2700 sq ft if you incl garage
mircea_popescu: you live there! a ok so like 5k
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8800 @ 0.0009503 = 8.3626 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: pretty sweet.
mircea_popescu: they got a similar system here but it dopesn't cover 2/3 of the cost, more like 1/3, and the red tape is beyond obnoxious.
ThickAsThieves: the install co handled all red tape
ThickAsThieves: it's some kinda lottery thing
ThickAsThieves: where they have to bombard th computer system when lottery goes live
ThickAsThieves: we were like 8th on waiting list, which is basically a shoe-in
kakobrekla: actually a 50kw solar plat that i know of comes online with just over 50w on a clear night
kakobrekla: also moon.
mircea_popescu: :D
dooglus: https://just-dice.com/mpif tells you the current S.MPIF JD investment size
mircea_popescu: dooglus ah now that's some sweet coding
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: probably more from light pollution (city lights reflected down)
kakobrekla: no no asci its from the moonž
kakobrekla: -ž
ThickAsThieves: dat jf mpif manager has great performance
ThickAsThieves: jd*
ThickAsThieves: give him a raise
fluffypony: dooglus: moiety would love if that had a responsive hipster layout with lots of CSS and jQuery
mircea_popescu: dooglus now if only cloudflare didn't redirect me to root
ThickAsThieves: install a button that let;s you up the font size too
mircea_popescu: 50.23890514 so wait omfg, this is up... 0.4% ?
Duffer1: ctrl + mousewheel TaT
ThickAsThieves: tis a jok
mircea_popescu: we haven't even started yet o.O
Duffer1: oh
ThickAsThieves: that's 146%/year!
moiety puts on specs that have no glass
ThickAsThieves: buy buy buy
kakobrekla: i thought this was gonna be a competition.
mircea_popescu: ;;calc ((0.23890514/50)+1)**365
gribble: 5.69651294191
mircea_popescu: 469% even
jurov: much extrapolate
jurov: wow
mircea_popescu: http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/04/23/Why-my-daughter-doesn-t-recycle-an-economics-professor-s-letter-to-his-child-s-teacher
ozbot: 'Why my daughter doesn't recycle': an economics professor's letter to his child's teacher
mircea_popescu: jurov CLEARLY ITS A GOLF CLUB PATTERN
mike_c: yes.. and if cloudflare didn't prevent me from getting it through code. gotta love cloudflare.
mircea_popescu: dooglus do you have assbot ip whitelisted ?
mircea_popescu: mebbe kakobrekla adds it to !jd command
mike_c: similarly https://just-dice.com/wagered.txt is not accessible from scripts.
mike_c: which is annoying for people trying to automatically genrate statistics to report on such things :)
mircea_popescu: ^
Naphex: cloudflare sucks
Naphex: why are people still using it
kakobrekla: assbot is whitelisted for the general stats, i dont know if that coveres the new link
mircea_popescu: dooglus mike_c runs http://www.btcalpha.com/ prolly want to be on his good side :p
mike_c: he is, as he was very helpful when i was writing up the original post on JD. but easier access to stats would be nice.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 850 @ 0.0009503 = 0.8078 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3750 @ 0.00095057 = 3.5646 BTC [+] {2}
Naphex: hey mike_c can we add BTCXChange on btcalpha?:p
mike_c: well, it's more geared towards btc investments. not sure what I would put up.
Naphex: ah
mrstickball: Anyone know of any Bitcoin businesses in Ohio? My company may be purchasing a huge complex, and want to create a facility that can house crypto startups
mike_c: although i am sure you will get a mention/link when i cover s.mpif
kakobrekla: so you gonna do real time coverage of mpif mike_c ?
jurov: mrstickball: rentalstarter?
mrstickball: other than them
mike_c: kakobrekla: interesting idea.
mrstickball: RentalStarter, BuyAHash and Adeally are out of Ohio
mrstickball: looking for others
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0719029 = 0.1438 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: i would say these are exciting times.
mrstickball: mircea_popescu: only if you didn't have me on ignore
Naphex: dunno about that
Naphex: i'm pretty bored
moiety: are there still forumites 3D printing things for btc?
jurov: moiety 3dtlac.com (not forumites, but gave me nifty btc keyfob)
moiety: oooo thanks very much jurov!
moiety: oh i like their rainbowness too
danielpbarron: I lost funds in that counterparty bug; nice to see that they are offering reembursements now.. gonna have to follow those steps i guess
danielpbarron: I told them about it at least a week ago; took them until now to officially admit it was a problem on their end?
mircea_popescu: how much did you lose, how did you find the problem etc ?
mircea_popescu: and they seem to be claiming it was a problem with bitcoinj which i find somewhat dubious
danielpbarron: about 0.3 BTC (not that much)
danielpbarron: I was one of the first users of their web wallet
mircea_popescu: aha
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6252 @ 0.00094837 = 5.9292 BTC [-]
danielpbarron: I found out after I had finished moving all my assets to their new web wallet, went to eat breakfast, come back to see my BTC has been moved
danielpbarron: I started the asset MEAT on the counterparty exchange, which until very recently was the only asset traded on there
jurov: !up joecool
assbot: Voicing joecool for 30 minutes.
danielpbarron: but I stopped using it ever since that bug happened, and also because everyone in here advised me to leave
thestringpuller: that's because counter party will likely become GLBSE
mircea_popescu: "My impression is that the feel-good guys are incompetent and stupid and need others to be nice to them because if other people were fair and just to them, they would suffer tremendously, and therefore defend other incompetent and stupid people because they can identify with the sloppy bastards, but not with those who actually do their job well and have that as their primary motive and their reason both for asking ques
mircea_popescu: tions and providing answers to problems from others who also want to do their job well and who find their enjoyment in their capacity to do just that."
mircea_popescu: gnarly phrase competition winner.
asciilifeform: norwegians ftw.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: who said that?
mircea_popescu: noggin
mircea_popescu: i mean naggum
mircea_popescu: wait.
asciilifeform: ibsen.
mircea_popescu: there we go :D
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3243007932071437@naggum.no.html
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform's link
asciilifeform: i like digging out unexploded shells from great flamewors of teh past
asciilifeform: but i'm a weirdo
mircea_popescu: norse flamewhores
asciilifeform: pulled by housecat chariot.
thestringpuller: Act from reason, and failure makes you rethink and study harder.
thestringpuller: that's a good quote
asciilifeform: speaking of, if anybody wants a 'compact' dead lang, - old norse
asciilifeform: http://norse.ulver.com/dct/zoega/
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17500 @ 0.00094541 = 16.5447 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 800 @ 0.14 = 112 BTC
mircea_popescu: !up belcher
assbot: Voicing belcher for 30 minutes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.0713 = 0.2852 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: for anyone fond of naggumisms (whether to cheer or vivisect,) here's more -
asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=165
ozbot: Loper OS » The Wisdom of Erik Naggum
asciilifeform: (yeah posted here before, ages ago)
mircea_popescu: http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--E7j7p4lU--/c_fit,fl_progressive,w_636/jkgwlgpzwrgbycvi3u85.jpg
mircea_popescu: is woman holding geiger counter ?
mike_c: i think that's an ipod
asciilifeform: 'rio' mp3 player.
mircea_popescu: damned 1940s hipster time travelers
mircea_popescu: ;;google radio portabil ric
kakobrekla: portable ladies mirror
asciilifeform: http://www.minidisc.org/RioPlay.gif
gribble: Portable AM/FM Radios | eBay: <http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/Portable-Radios-/96954/i.html>; RBR-4 — Standards for the Operation of Radio Stations in the ...: <https://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/smt-gst.nsf/eng/sf10650.html>; RIC-7 — Basic Qualification Question Bank for Amateur Radio ...: <http://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/smt-gst.nsf/en/sf09338.html>
mircea_popescu: http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--I7BrG8aK--/c_fit,fl_progressive,w_636/nsrieshcfpe5judn5k1r.jpg
mircea_popescu: Buy.More.Bonds.
BingoBoingo: Great Justice
BingoBoingo: http://edition.cnn.com/2014/04/24/world/asia/japan-whaling/index.html?sr=tw042514whalehunting330pstorylink
ozbot: Japanese whaling to continue despite court ruling - CNN.com
mircea_popescu: this'd be apretty cool advertising ploy for s.mpif
TomServo: no loafing!
asciilifeform: now for the pepsi:
asciilifeform: http://www.bestads.lt/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/SovietPropaganda6.jpg
mircea_popescu: the funniest one is the KEEP CLOTHI
mircea_popescu: what was it, on or off ?
asciilifeform: http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Original-Soviet-Poster-1963-Factory-Industrial-Very-Rare-Russian-Propaganda-/00/s/NzAwWDcwMA==/z/eyYAAOxyUrZSrLJv/$_58.JPG
asciilifeform: 'here great machines must sit forgot / because the idler wants to nod...'
mircea_popescu: http://www.vox.com/2014/4/25/5653390/chipotle-s-calorie-labels-are-a-lie
mircea_popescu: calories ? 10 to 900
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07182 = 0.1436 BTC [+]
benkay: someone's visiting the chipotles at the tail of the upgrade cycle
benkay: any reasonably high-traffic chipotle publishes numbers for individual items, eg guac, sour cream, cheese, various salsas, the different meats...
benkay: plus also lets ignore that the base measure is +/- 20% iirc, cuz what's research anyways when you're chasing provocative headlines.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 1999 @ 0.0002289 = 0.4576 BTC [+] {3}
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: did you ever encounter the tale of 'подвиг радиста' as schoolboy?
mircea_popescu: mnop
mrstickball: what's this about Chipotle publishing numbers for items?
mrstickball: how does that work, benkay
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: http://www.stalingrad-battle.ru/images/stories/ris42.jpg
mircea_popescu: benkay o hey, im a total noob when it comes to all these topics
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform lol "dreaming of kansas" ?
mrstickball: what's that supposed to be of, asciilifeform ?
asciilifeform: mrstickball: fellow who pinched a broken wire with his teeth, died in the correct position
asciilifeform: one of those soviet legends that 'everybody knew'
asciilifeform: if modern sysop monkeys had myths & legends, they'd pick up this one
Naphex: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQm5BnhTBEQ now guys in the desert, they get bored hardcore ;o
ozbot: Saudi's Again Changing Wheels/Tyres while driving - YouTube
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22800 @ 0.00095136 = 21.691 BTC [+] {4}
mrstickball: so he pinched a wire with his teeth and got electrocuted?
asciilifeform: field telephone.
danielpbarron: he kept the current flowing, even in death
mrstickball: i see
asciilifeform: that's the legend anyway
asciilifeform: interestingly, подвиг doesn't translate to eng.
benkay: naphex why are both front and rear wheels stationary?
Naphex: differential probably
benkay: they'd still be spinning though, right? diff only has an effect when turning.
benkay: unless it's some crazy e-diff? and they've hacked it to say 'don't spin up wheel'?
nubbins`: mircea_popescu http://imgur.com/VG85ul7 < this is pretty close to the final draft
Naphex: nah i it's the same on my audi/quattro
mircea_popescu: nubbins` ahaha
Naphex: if wheel doesn't do contact it doesn't spin
mircea_popescu: the bearded dragon lighther
nubbins`: now imagine two of those straddling a shield with some leafwork on top/bottom
mircea_popescu: do i get a heart butt tattoo ?
Naphex: probably the diff or systems like ASR/ESP, not really sure.
nubbins`: men would go to war under such a banner!
nubbins`: i think that might be from the ol' heart-shaped-sticker-in-the-tanning-booth trick, but i'm not sure
Naphex: ASR only operates in conjunction with the Electronic Accelerator (E gas) and uses components of the Anti-lock Brake System (ABS). If one wheel suddenly begins to rotate faster than the others (slip), ASR intervenes in the engine management system and reduces power until the wheel stops spinning.
nubbins`: http://imgur.com/1vmEJij
ozbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
nubbins`: http://imgur.com/pOhMaAm
ozbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
mircea_popescu: muy hipster!
asciilifeform: lol, google's best transl. of 'подвиг' is... 'exploit.'
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 500 @ 0.00023001 = 0.115 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 7 @ 0.03252 = 0.2276 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8108 @ 0.00095174 = 7.7167 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 850 @ 0.14 = 119 BTC
mircea_popescu: http://imgur.com/a/OKLDf
ozbot: Balconies are for the Birds - Imgur
jurov: asciilifeform: isn't подвиг heroic deed?
nubbins`: :D
jurov: asciilifeform, also i think you assume there was more cultural exchange between ussr and its colonies than there actually was
fluffypony: here
fluffypony: for the hipsters
fluffypony: http://spagni.net/jdmpif/
jurov: iirc, it was actually discouraged because it would create conternation on both sides
jurov: *consternation
fluffypony: mike_c: I figured out how to scrape through CloudFlare, if you need me to make the jd mpif number available for you or explain how to walk past cloudflare
fluffypony: complete PITA
Naphex: http://oglaf.com/illusionist/
ozbot: the Illusionist
Naphex: there's a lesson there
mike_c: yeah.. i've seen PITA ways with scraping the cloudflare response, grabbing the JS shit and posting some form or something.
mike_c: all of which breaks when cloudflare tweaks their page
fluffypony: oh
mike_c: i didn't feel like participating in the arms race
fluffypony: no, this is unbreakable
mike_c: oh? do tell.
fluffypony: lemme pastebin
fluffypony: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=v0Zscx9Q
fluffypony: phantomjs script
fluffypony: just /usr/bin/phantomjs that script
fluffypony: it loads the page, lets the js/meta-redir/whatever they add execute for 10 seconds
fluffypony: and then dumps the page down
fluffypony: you end up with: <html><head></head><body><pre style="word-wrap: break-word; white-space: pre-wrap;">50.24414705</pre></body></html>
fluffypony: so you still have to strip tags
fluffypony: but it'll work for all changes except a captcha, and you can run it every 10s
mike_c: ah. i thought about doing something like that with selenium. i haven't tried phantomjs.
mike_c: thanks
jurov: mike_c: guess i'll need to feed you marketmaker bot's trades, yo?
mike_c: i don't know if i'll go that route though. i hate web scraping.
fluffypony: selenium is nice, phantomjs is headless
kakobrekla: just get whitelisted
mike_c: jurov: yeah, that would cool. if you provide it I will ingest it
fluffypony: I hate having to have a UI on a server, lol
kakobrekla: jurov you will be mm on mpif ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.07000335 = 0.28 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12916 @ 0.0009455 = 12.2121 BTC [-] {3}
mike_c: whitelist what, IP address? api keys would be nicer.
jurov: kako yes, TAT declined, so mp asked me
kakobrekla: cool
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20080 @ 0.00094464 = 18.9684 BTC [-] {3}
kakobrekla: mike_c yes ip
kakobrekla: or i can proxy it for you
mike_c: i like that idea
kakobrekla: dammit.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00094403 = 6.1362 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: :D
mike_c: hah
mike_c: IP whitelists are just PITA for everyone. api keys are so much easier..
fluffypony: yeah except CloudFlare doesn't support anything like that
mircea_popescu: Naphex http://trilema.com/2013/the-strange-case-of-the-delusionist-and-later-stories/
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07170659 = 0.1434 BTC [+] {2}
bounce: oh, while I know next to nothing of trading, I have a possible mm candidate: moriarty, the one of spamming come to ##econometrics (in)fame
benkay: hey hanbot is 'hanbot' an acceptable way to refer to you now that you're not stalking the forums as 'MPOE-PR'?
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust moriarty
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user mircea_popescu to user moriarty: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=mircea_popescu&dest=moriarty | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=moriarty | Rated since: never
mircea_popescu: you gotta be kidding me.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.5000001 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 50 @ 0.00439988 = 0.22 BTC [-]
bounce: your due diligence is going to be a bit of a whale, yes
mike_c: fluffypony: surely you can have URL patterns that don't get cloudflared? if not, stats.just-dice.com would work.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 63 @ 0.0044 = 0.2772 BTC [+]
jurov: + CDN worth its name
fluffypony: mike_c: I don't know if you can exclude it in CF's PageRules, never bothered checking, but you can have a subdomain (CNAME / A record) and just turn CF protection off for it
fluffypony: which is what most do - www. and @ is protected, api. is not
Naphex: mircea_popescu: :D
fluffypony: (and api normally lives on separate hardware so the site stays up in the event of a DDoS on the API layer)
jurov: i suggest just using normal CDN
jurov: for it
Naphex: or just set up your own proxy/load balancer/cleaner
Naphex: cloudflare just setup varnish
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 440 @ 0.0044 = 1.936 BTC [+]
Naphex: i got like ~100GB/s DDoS protection from the datacenter, after they cut upstream
hanbot: benkay hanbot's fine, or hannah, mpoe-pr, whatever. just don't call me eddie-baby. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXhnzIO5N30
benkay: late for dinner it is, then.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.5 = 1 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 227 @ 0.0044 = 0.9988 BTC [+] {2}
fluffypony: benkay: always late for everything except for every meal?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 70 @ 0.0044 = 0.308 BTC [+]
benkay: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 463.5, Best ask: 466.17, Bid-ask spread: 2.67000, Last trade: 466.17, 24 hour volume: 32390.83705859, 24 hour low: 438.05, 24 hour high: 505.0, 24 hour vwap: 465.483723915
benkay: dag.
kakobrekla: !jd
assbot: Just-Dice stat: 16476 BTC profit, 36.1k BTC invested, 1100.33 mio bets, 5.20 mio BTC wagered
kakobrekla: !jd mpif
assbot: Current MPIF account balance on Just-Dice: 50.24467048 BTC
mircea_popescu: ha!
mircea_popescu: splendeed
mircea_popescu: btw, you have one for panacea too ? :D
mircea_popescu: could be !mpif, spits out jd, panacea :D
kakobrekla: i dun think i can do that there because of the fee structure
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 10 @ 0.14 = 1.4 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 21 @ 0.00737639 = 0.1549 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: oh
mircea_popescu: but i mean... at any point you must somehow know the maximum im allowed to withdraw
mircea_popescu: like i go... pls to pay me back 100 btc. you say well... you ain't got 100 btc. how do you know i don't ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07117736 = 0.7118 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 47 @ 0.0044 = 0.2068 BTC [+] {3}
kakobrekla: like we discussed, the accounting is done at the end of the month
kakobrekla: at that point withdrawals are done
mircea_popescu: ah yeah. a fixed figure for 1 month isnt too useful
mircea_popescu: aite!
kakobrekla: theres 2 things
kakobrekla: - you can see the trades so you can estimate something from that
mircea_popescu: maybe add the trades in chan ?
mircea_popescu: iirc they weren't very numerous
kakobrekla: i think its 5 this month
mircea_popescu: so add them to assbot feed.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 100 @ 0.0075 = 0.75 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 40 @ 0.0075 = 0.3 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 900 @ 0.14 = 126 BTC
benkay: what's the endgame for counterparty look like?
benkay: it's not a classic GLBSE in the sense that someone's going to shut it down. theoretically anyone can walk the 'exchange' at any time and discover the assets available for trade.
benkay: i guess the real question is 'is there an endgame for distributed exchanges'?
jurov: to fall into obscurity?
benkay: if exponential decay counts as endgame.
jurov: provided that the codebase is solid, which us pretty strong assumption
benkay: but they can't even fall into obscurity - noobs are still going to show up and want some return.
benkay: i guess i'm assuming someone does a 'distributed' 'exchange' adequately at some point in the future.
jurov: on the other end of scale, planetary bubble?
benkay: ugh
jurov: fortunately no contemporary distributed systems can support 10e9 shareholders
benkay: do not want
jurov: actually, if p2p trading system that can truly do that gets invented, i think it's inevitable
benkay: global bubble?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7400 @ 0.00095013 = 7.031 BTC [+] {2}
jurov: yes
mircea_popescu: benkay the endgame for it is now
mircea_popescu: this is it. same as ripples.
Naphex: mircea_popescu, ever seen the thick of it / in the loop? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MSScBIopM8 Alistar Cambell loved it ;]
danielpbarron: if counterparty does take off, I have some choice asset names squatted
mircea_popescu: ^
jurov: mircea_popescu: how? if it doesn't have a website that can be shut down and is decently resistant to double spends?
mircea_popescu: just one of the many problems with "distributed" shits
jurov: (the latter remains to be seen)
mircea_popescu: jurov exactly the way myspace went. servers no purpose, has no utility. its entire lifetime is its endgame
benkay: mircea_popescu: those problems won't stop people from using it to sell seekyoorities
mircea_popescu: nothing's stopping people from using myspace to organise major concerts,
mircea_popescu: nothing stopped yahoo from recruiting their ceo on linkedin
mircea_popescu: etc.
mircea_popescu: soft constraints.
benkay: "major" "ceo" are orders of magnitude beyond the scope of btc scams.
kakobrekla: i deleted my linkedin a couple of days ago
mircea_popescu: benkay the purpose of a stock exchange is major and ceo.
benkay: kakobrekla: hipster!
kakobrekla: is that what they do now?
benkay: mircea_popescu: the purpose of a scam exchange is no accountability and access to pennies from paupers
mircea_popescu: yea ok.
mircea_popescu: like the purpose of myspace/linkedin etc is advertising and "user data"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 30 @ 0.03281792 = 0.9845 BTC [+] {8}
benkay: is it?
fluffypony: I don't think the tech is fundamentally flawed, I think there's a lot of good stuff and good ideas underlying it all...I just think that anything like that is only really going to be useful in 20+ years when the current banking/regulation systems are significantly different from today
fluffypony: when accountability can be controlled programmatically instead of enforced by the po-po
benkay: i thought facebook/myspace were "VC Gems"
mike_c: <+fluffypony> when accountability can be controlled programmatically << that hurt my brain.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony the fundamental flaw is the naive expectation for tech to work by intself and in of itself.
mircea_popescu: this is the nonsense at work here, a sort of tech worship.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 29 @ 0.03409809 = 0.9888 BTC [+] {8}
fluffypony: benkay: so what you're saying is counterparty is the next "Red Hot Penny Stocks"?
mike_c: no, that's haveloc
mike_c: counterparty is the next nothing.
mircea_popescu: that's a great blog name
mircea_popescu: TNN. The Next Nothing.
mircea_popescu: covering Republican finances since 2014
benkay: fluffypony: if i can't list a thing on mpex, i haven't made a good enough thing. there isn't another exchange out there that i'd sully my thing by listing on.
kanzure: does deleting your linkedin account actually work?
benkay: the taint coming from 2 sources:
mircea_popescu: kanzure yes. before you deleted it, you can delete it.
benkay: a) provenance of exchange.
mircea_popescu: after you deleted it, you can no longer delete it anymore.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6400 @ 0.00094953 = 6.077 BTC [-]
kanzure: mircea_popescu: does it remove your address book etc? or does your data still contribute to their spam machine.
benkay: b) the 'security' 'peers' on the alternative exchange.
mircea_popescu: as i said :D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.5 = 1 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: benkay our bitlordity's black, cold heart is warmed by your sentiments.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 226 @ 0.0044 = 0.9944 BTC [+]
fluffypony: mike_c: I think interesting things are coming from "trustless" systems when trust becomes a product of data instead of a product of human decision making. For instance, imagine a designer works with a client who specs their project out. When the designer has completed it and delivered it, intelligent software is able to analyse his design and determine within a reasonable amount of probability that it matches the client's agreement both
fluffypony: functionally and from a design perspective. The *software* signs off on the transaction with no input needed from the client.
benkay: let me know the conversion rate of mp heart-degrees to btc, eh?
mircea_popescu: "when trust becomes a product of data instead of a product of human decision making." << srsly, this is nonsense fluffy
benkay: fluffypony: i've yet to figure out how to build a DAC i can't rob.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: well it's already somewhat possible to have automated escrow with multisif
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.042 = 0.168 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-]
fluffypony: *multisig
mircea_popescu: run me through it.
fluffypony: ok so a 2 of 3 multisig transaction to purchase an MP3 - funds are now out your wallet and requires two sigs to release to the supplier
mircea_popescu: so i buy some shit from you. i send it to an addy where you have a sig and i have a sig and we must both sign for you to get paid ?
fluffypony: an automated system is able to verify the validity of the download link and that the checksum on the download matches the expected checksum of that song
fluffypony: and so merchant + automated system = 2 sigs
mircea_popescu: i'd never use it.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.5 = 1 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 226 @ 0.0044 = 0.9944 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.0712 = 0.2136 BTC [+]
benkay: gotta trust automated system to not get haxxed
benkay: oops
mircea_popescu: "expected checksum" wtf nonsense is that
fluffypony: I'm thumbsucking here, I'm not a distributed systems expert
fluffypony: s/checksum/hash
fluffypony: but look at a decentralised data store like Tahoe-LAFS, for instance
benkay: distributed systems as a term of art in the industry (as i'd expect you to know, fluffypony) does not refer to these blockchain applications
mircea_popescu: yeah, this is exactly the problem we're discussing. you don't understand the subject, but you do have convictions as to what works and how, and what the future will bring.
mircea_popescu: this is religion, nothing else.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: absolutely, I have faith the Grand Designers will come up with Cool Shit (tm)
mircea_popescu: yes well.
jurov: having ability to check specs automatically will result in unemployed designer, will be easier just to machine evolve something that fits the spec
mircea_popescu: where are your submerged cities and flying cars ?
mircea_popescu: jurov has it. the entire thing is a restatement of the perpetuum mobile,
mircea_popescu: in flashy new terminology.
benkay: lol machine evolved designs
benkay: not a terribly bad idea
mircea_popescu: a sort more palatable to the modern religious mind, which as you stated, works on the " Grand Designers will come up with Cool Shit" faith
benkay: "here are 20 seeds! pick five."
benkay: machine thinks for an hour
benkay: "here are 40 'ideas'! pick 10"
benkay: machine thinks for another hour
mircea_popescu: "go to buy shoes. come back three hours later with a half cup made out of tin foil and something that looks like a mouse with no buttons"
benkay: "here are your five options! send btc to 1MACHINETHINKER and pick one package for downloading!"
benkay: point is only to outcompete the fiverr crowd
benkay: not the handmade leather shoe crowd
mircea_popescu: i was thinking, this is kind-of how plenty of women do shopping today anywya
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2450 @ 0.00094953 = 2.3263 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: give her $100 to buy fishnet stockings, watch her come back with a purse and batteries.
benkay: hah
mircea_popescu: anyway, this constant tendency to abstract people out of life is a sickness by now.
mircea_popescu: law without people degenerates into the us sort of national-socialism.
mircea_popescu: sex without people is masturbation. finance without people is also known as crisis.
mircea_popescu: on it goes. you gotta have people in the loop or it ain't a thing.
mircea_popescu: we'd be better off allowing violence, from the schoolyard all the way to the workplace, than having this diffuse "everyone hates everyone" sort of poison floating about.
benkay: i'd be satisfied if we allowed sex in america
benkay: allowed it to be a part of life, you know?
benkay: i go out, i meet a chick as part of my gadding about the local scene. she's an acceptably well-practiced and hardworking programmer. i like her, we fuck. i can't hire her now basically.
benkay: wtf is this nonsense
mircea_popescu: why cant you hire her ?
benkay: bringing insane risk down onto the company.
mircea_popescu: eh, have topless day, what.
benkay: hostile work environment
benkay: "i don't feel comfortable being topless at work."
benkay: don charnley has some hack for this
mircea_popescu: so work somewhere else.
benkay: except then the Labor Department steps in.
mircea_popescu: ~somewhere else~
asciilifeform: benkay: atlas, suitcase, airplane.
benkay: "we see that you're making your employees uncomfortable. please pay us your entire profits for the past ten years."
benkay: asciilifeform: working on it.
benkay: mircea_popescu: working on it.
mircea_popescu: funny story : at one particular workplace we actually had topless day. buncha young people, the guys thought it was great.
mircea_popescu: six weeks later we no longer had topless day
mircea_popescu: the guys thought it puts too much power in the hands of womenz and it basiclaly sucks and is opressive.
asciilifeform: me in 5yr. sitting in gasenwagen with benkay and ThickAsThieves: 'so, let's chat about how we worked on it. while the motor revvs.'
benkay: shit we only have 5 years?
mircea_popescu: the settlement included guys having to always split the drinks tab among themselves.
asciilifeform optimist
benkay: how so too much power in the hands of the girls?
asciilifeform: benkay: 'radiation damage'
mircea_popescu: benkay well after the first coupla hours of awkward, the chicks loved it, cause apparently it's more comfortable.
mircea_popescu: the guys ended up spending all their time being awkward.
mircea_popescu: it was quite the show tbh
benkay: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVHkteZJFlY
Naphex: http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2013/292/4/5/tucker_s_law_tea_towel_by_masterplanner-d6r36bp.png
benkay: now that's punishment!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 19 @ 0.06998434 = 1.3297 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06987327 = 0.1397 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 4 @ 0.0735 = 0.294 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10757 @ 0.00094538 = 10.1695 BTC [-] {2}
cazalla: that towel is clearly australian made
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0709999 = 0.142 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3400 @ 0.00094645 = 3.2179 BTC [+]
Naphex: gn
fluffypony: also here
fluffypony: night Naphex
Naphex: gn fluff` :D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7007 @ 0.00094645 = 6.6318 BTC [+]
danielpbarron: hm, I wish cookies were more persistant in chromium for iOS; keep having to re-enter my trilema credit pass
thestringpuller: thats a good thi g
thestringpuller: fucking save that shit
thestringpuller: to a file
thestringpuller: gpg encrypt
thestringpuller: back up a million times
danielpbarron: save what?
thestringpuller: the trilema key
thestringpuller: i j
thestringpuller: i have like 20000 credits
danielpbarron: oo -- big spender!
thestringpuller: uh sure.
thestringpuller: if i lose it. im fucked. re enterin makes you back that shit up if anything.
danielpbarron: maybe i configured something wrong; don't have this problem on my laptop
danielpbarron: it's "backed up" in my gmail "archive"
danielpbarron: it's probably apple's fault; I never should have bought an iPhone
danielpbarron: first and last apple product I will ever buy
benkay: best laptop chassis on the market, though
ThickAsThieves: so i'm watching Paul Romero's youtube and listening to Heroes shit. The guy's damn good.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5600 @ 0.0009472 = 5.3043 BTC [+] {2}
BCB: just for shits and giggles: http://imgur.com/r/Bitcoin/YiJNWOX
benkay: no
benkay: oh god
benkay cannot unsee
benkay: looked...really weirdly she-gendered? not looking again.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 11 @ 0.07049999 = 0.7755 BTC [-] {2}
moiety: jesus fuck
moiety goes to wash eyes with bleach brb