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a111: Logged on 2019-07-20 00:43 trinque: upstack, trying to capture linux in this manner might've been a fool's errand. might be that a muntzed kernel and a busybox-like are a saner beachball to eat.

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-20#1923917 << there was also a s.mg attempt where diana_coman tried to preserve all linux (in the manner of trb, naive speccing at the time). also fucking died, over explodig complexity (basically, there's no way to control for repetition, end up having to store GB-size^2) ☝︎☝︎

mp_en_viaje: ave1, tjhe fact your blog doesn't have a datestamp under the title makes working with articles like this one harder than it needs to be.

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-20#1923917 << i do not see that any of this was avoidable, or is useless. i think mostly you just got pissed off upon discovering there's a redoubt behind the redoubt, "motherfucker, there's not a full strength regiment behind these three surviving dudes" be ☝︎

mp_en_viaje: something that takes the filter of "i want trb, eulora but not blogotron" our of the long list of all things available and creates a local-tree out of the world tree, just for you. which is STILL a complete tree, and presses and string of vpatches and all ; but it is merely an aspect of the omnitree.

mp_en_viaje: ie, the problem here in correct abstraction would be that trinque worked on the "phantom' tree (how to go from ONE TRUE ROOT -> ALL THINGS) whereas everyone else started on real tree of ALL THINGS, and well, there's a disconnect there.

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 15:26 mp_en_viaje: asciilifeform, it's entirely possible we'll end up with a ~pile~ of genesises.

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 23:53 BingoBoingo: So, it appears Iran took two British ships and released one with a warning.

billymg: i.e. to make a new shareable selection, user selects text, js constructs url with appropriate ?start=x&end=y for server to return content with highlight wrapped in <span> ...but if DOM varies then these values will be different depending on the browser making the request

billymg: the way i understand it, client makes a request to url?start=5&end=7, server pulls content from mysql and returns with <span class="highlight"></span> injected where start/end indicate

asciilifeform: mipsism is a half-solution, of sorts, in that can build a mipsistic gnat and then will execute anywhere you can port the 12kB emu to

asciilifeform: trinque: to expand -- currently gnat srcball aint a complete description of gnat. i.e. it demands existing gnat. iirc was described pedantically in old thrd.

trinque: upstack, trying to capture linux in this manner might've been a fool's errand. might be that a muntzed kernel and a busybox-like are a saner beachball to eat. ☟︎☟︎

asciilifeform: where if you snip a MB, ~that patch~ now weighs 1MB+

trinque: rather than having a perforation point which can be torn off, preserving the references for whichever historian that cared, but *not importing the shitwad into the future indefinitely* was the point

asciilifeform: i.e. it's a theoretical (if somewhat burning) q, rather than 'ohnoez, trinque Did It All Wrong'

asciilifeform: trinque: iirc we don't yet even have a vdiff that'd eat 900M

trinque: at any rate no, I'm not doing a man-month of rework on the thing any time soon. not standing in the way of anyone else doing it either.

BingoBoingo: So, it appears Iran took two British ships and released one with a warning. ☟︎

mp_en_viaje: in theory you could possibly htccess script-fu something like domain/a/b/c into domain?q=a&w=b&e=c ; HOWEVER, the problem is the domain space is currently narrow.

asciilifeform: loox like finally a potential justification for spyked's thing

mp_en_viaje: a ((b)) c ((d)) appears as a b --- c d on-page.

mp_en_viaje: in continuing sads : /me attempted to spec the server side php job ; and it can be done, roughly, there exist primitives for, eg, "insert this after nth word and that after mth word". however : a) this interferes with the footnotes, because footnotes exist as z (( b)) and not as displayed on page ; and b) there's no good way to # and ? at the same time because of the way trilema handles title-urls.

mp_en_viaje: who else is there, billymg ? Mocky ? either of you got a moment to do this ?

asciilifeform: it's a wonder that even displaying text worx reliably

mp_en_viaje: do you recall that arguably famous-er pic of the guy on the er table with hips turning cyanotic hugging a telephone pole up his ass ? ☟︎

mp_en_viaje: this extensive travel is going to make finding shit in a few years SO fucking painful. "i wonder, did i say mircea_popescu ? mp_en_viaje ?"...

mp_en_viaje: eventually hit a wall

asciilifeform: i found one as a boy , had nfi what it was

mp_en_viaje: cig metal tubes pretty good for all sorta uses. decent butt dildo in a pinch too.

mp_en_viaje: asciilifeform, aha, i have a bunch of them ~same reason

asciilifeform: this kinda thing aint a point of pride for asciilifeform , would rather sit in well-tidied workbench. but in fuckholeistan where real estate costs like on space station -- even commercial labs look same.

asciilifeform: was scene where 2 d00dz sitting by a table, and it is full of mobos, rifle optics, cpus, unspeakable wirings, etc

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 13:05 trinque: diana_coman: I'm going to have to leave. my final point is that this "do it all perfectly and yesterday" is a great way to never go anywhere

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923572 << dood, nevermind the "yesterday" and dramatis persona generally. last i saw stuff from you it was A DIFFERENT YEAR. what yesterday ? ☝︎

asciilifeform: there's a scene in 1 of mp_en_viaje's fictions where almost literally depicts asciilifeform's torture room

asciilifeform: guest: 'is that.. bear trap?!' a:'what's the problem'

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 15:18 mp_en_viaje: there's this strange habit in many places in eastern europe, including romania, where peasant houses, even two room houses, get a "front room" which is never lived in. the family deposits "the good stuff" there, never uses it, goes in for two hours a year during easter or w/e.

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 13:04 trinque: but having crammed them all into the genesis ruins the "what's a linux" overview

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923569 << ruins nothing, add it as a comment file "here's your blueprint". gets the incalculable benefit of proper tooling, can now reference meaningfully. ☝︎

a111: Logged on 2017-03-26 15:03 mp_en_viaje: basically a novel vector of imperial attack seems to be this "let's take republican items and ~EXPAND~ the downstream so that siberian river attack is then feasible".

asciilifeform: fast-fwd to nao, when asciilifeform goes into what formerly 'obvious nuttery', i.e. 'let's genesis a whole machine arch' ☝︎

asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923625 << was a sort of cheat tho, the genesis did not actually include bdb etc ~textually~ . so maintained illusion of 'trb is this 300kB of shitoshi' ☝︎

mp_en_viaje: asciilifeform, it's entirely possible we'll end up with a ~pile~ of genesises. ☟︎

asciilifeform: if accept '100MB genesis' , then most of 'portage' is actually redundant, and as i understand whole thing can be replaced with a slightly mechanized vtron

mp_en_viaje: i might be wrong, but as far as i can see portage will work just fine on a pressed pile of code.

mp_en_viaje: whatever its merits from a religious pov, it's fucking insanely inconvenient. what am i supposed to say here, "oh, now that we have v, let's not use it, and instead work on everything outside of v" ? and what... let's design... u, for preparatory work for v ? and what, make it different from v /

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 14:13 diana_coman: asciilifeform: as far as I understand it, trinque's algo is http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923467 aka in a way the precise opposite: we don't actually have cuntoo at all; we have (genesised) just a map and the rest is a sort of "for illustration purpose only"

mp_en_viaje: there's this strange habit in many places in eastern europe, including romania, where peasant houses, even two room houses, get a "front room" which is never lived in. the family deposits "the good stuff" there, never uses it, goes in for two hours a year during easter or w/e. ☟︎

asciilifeform sees trinque's pov, many times was wedged on a problem where 'i have 95% of solution but for the remaining 5 -- ugliest turd ever seen' . but must agree with mp_en_viaje -- you can't get orig text from a hash, and can't vpatch if you aint got orig

mp_en_viaje: ego bricks around the house. this doesn't make them some kind of magic gurus, nor does it make your own understanding of the systems and processes involved somehow inconsequential. why does it constantly have to come back to this purely psychogenic, oh, nobody reads, oh, nobody can sit down a kernel, whatever the hell ? it's just not a way to go about things, nobody's achievement is diminishing your own nor does your achievement necessarily require

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 13:03 trinque: my objection is that nobody here knew how to build a linux aside perhaps 3 folks.

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923558 << hash reference is useless for this purpose, because of the very meaning of a hash -- you can't get the hashed source back out of it. the hash worked well enough for trb because ~everyone has ~all versions and so it's a narrow and well documented domain. the hash will not work (and, experimentally, in plenty of cases you weren't involved with, failed to work, because the domain is 2+ degrees of magnitude v ☝︎

mp_en_viaje: all discussion to shock and surprise aside, this is the fuck exactly how trb genesis happened, too. nobody wrote a good one, just picked an actual one and genesis'd that.

a111: Logged on 2019-06-22 06:45 mp_en_viaje: leaving aside how a rate of progress of 0 items / week for week after week after livelong week puts extremely low demands on my time and attention -- far, far from requiring it be a central locus of my focus, republican 2019 as seen so far would have worked just as well if i gave it an hour biweekly, and i don't mean twice a week, i mean every other week -- there's just no need to keep the engine running on big brutus for the "j

mp_en_viaje: there's approximately 0 need of telling what work, and immense need of the actual work. if you'd like to shine, shine that way ; you can start for instance with a http://bvt-trace.net/2019/07/todo-items-and-work-plan-jul2019/#selection-11.0-23.54 ,to cover the seven month old http://trinque.org/2018/11/27/cuntoo-bootstrapper/ ☝︎

a111: Logged on 2019-07-14 22:25 trinque: diana_coman: congrats. the next step would be to produce a vpatch which adds your curl ebuild atop the genesis.vpatch the bootstrapper produced.

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923543 << aside from the apparent divergence as to what means what / what is implied by what / etcetera, you seem to be developing a more biting divergence in thsi signalling thing. i let pass http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-14#1922463 in silence, but apparently it wasnt such a wise course. what do you mean, exactly, "i told you what work" ? it's not apparent that's a priviledged function for some reason, you can't ☝︎☝︎

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 12:51 trinque: my intent here was to have the vtree read as a history of the items as they have been understood, not as "here's the wad of shit diana_coman needed one day so we put it all in and signed it"

diana_coman: asciilifeform: as far as I understand it, trinque's algo is http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923467 aka in a way the precise opposite: we don't actually have cuntoo at all; we have (genesised) just a map and the rest is a sort of "for illustration purpose only" ☝︎☟︎

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 13:03 trinque: my objection is that nobody here knew how to build a linux aside perhaps 3 folks.

asciilifeform: and prolly i missed a few by other folx (e.g. mod6 had at least 1 in recent 2y)

asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923496 << mno. let's walk a few. e.g. : 'aggression'. dec. 2017. ben_vulpes 'aggression'. dec. '17. ; ☝︎☝︎☝︎

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 13:04 trinque: but having crammed them all into the genesis ruins the "what's a linux" overview

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 12:53 trinque: "fuck you I deal only in platonic ideals" is not a way of interfacing with the world

asciilifeform: trinque: sure. but you can't have vpatch w/out a genesis that actually puts the original on the machine, or what am i missing

trinque: asciilifeform: I really don't care what the perfectly preserved historic curl was, so long as the revised item passed through a single human head in my wot

asciilifeform: in fact, recall how trb 'chicken' genesis was a hand-cranked recipe, cuz had to delete binary gif turds etc and vtron of the time could not autodigest such deletion

trinque: diana_coman: I'm going to have to leave. my final point is that this "do it all perfectly and yesterday" is a great way to never go anywhere ☟︎

diana_coman: but enumeration is not "know what wads goes" , how does this work? how is "a wad called soandso" enough?

trinque: but having crammed them all into the genesis ruins the "what's a linux" overview ☟︎☟︎

trinque: my objection is that nobody here knew how to build a linux aside perhaps 3 folks. ☟︎☟︎

diana_coman: I want however A genesis from where to be able to start

diana_coman: trinque: not cleaned no, not swearing either; hence mp_en_viaje 's earlier observation that I'm not vpatching but genesising and those are different precisely because genesis is a place to start (be it a wad of shit) not "this thing I can swear to "

trinque: "fuck you I deal only in platonic ideals" is not a way of interfacing with the world ☟︎

trinque: my intent here was to have the vtree read as a history of the items as they have been understood, not as "here's the wad of shit diana_coman needed one day so we put it all in and signed it" ☟︎

trinque: this "gb genesis is fine" thing comes as a surprise.

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 05:42 mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923443 << but of course. once precious cuntlet ends up importent into any process flow, you know for a fact it won't get undone willingly -- it's either burn it down or forget about it. (pc is this thing, you've surely seen it, the dumb chick who thinks she's got a "career" out of "following 3 ring binder". the exact other half of the dumb chick who thinks "nobody can call her a slut" because she's dressing poorly

girlattorney: i saw also he was here on irc a couple of years ago

diana_coman: BingoBoingo: make me a shared hosting account with wp installed please; bill it for one year and let me know if there's something else you need from me

a111: Logged on 2019-07-14 08:12 mp_en_viaje: so since thelastpsychiatrist.com went all fucking stupid (cloudflare aside, and mountain of pointless js aside, there's a spurious 1min delay before any pageload also now!), i scraped the article list both from archive page and category page, and downloaded the list.

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923463 << this being why the wot system even exists : so ten dozen different worms can work together, digest mysql codebase or w/e, and produce a usable item. which yes, once it's made can be re-genesised into sanity and we can safely forget the name mysql. but until then, work. ☝︎

mp_en_viaje: When version 5.6 is removed, I will have to pack up and leave. By imposing these changes, you will have lost a customer of 12 years. And probably not only one." says exactly the same thing.

mp_en_viaje: and so, given that we've decided "something like the item will have to exist" and also "the actual item may be just as good a starting point as anything, and in any case better than pen, blank paper, and alf's scheduler", thus therefore it follows, mandatorily and undisputably, that there will be a bunch of large genesises.

a111: Logged on 2019-07-19 03:09 asciilifeform: trinque: imho GB-sized vpatch makes a mockery of very concept.

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923461 << gb size PATCH yes, and is forbidden. GB sized GENESIS not the same thing at all. plox to not confuse vpatch and genesis! patch says, "this is a change i'm making to an item, plox judge ~the change~. not the item. the item is taken for granted". gensis says, "this is an item i'm proposing ; please judge it". ☝︎

mp_en_viaje: the fact that young girls do this a lot more than young boys, these days, is the principal reason of white man culture failure, btw.

mp_en_viaje: the problem, of course, is that b) is still a slut, just, a very shitty one ; and a) still doesn't have a career, she just also doesn't have any friends.

mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-19#1923443 << but of course. once precious cuntlet ends up importent into any process flow, you know for a fact it won't get undone willingly -- it's either burn it down or forget about it. (pc is this thing, you've surely seen it, the dumb chick who thinks she's got a "career" out of "following 3 ring binder". the exact other half of the dumb chick who thinks "nobody can call her a slut" because she's dressing poorly ☝︎☟︎

asciilifeform: if mp_en_viaje or other serious brain tells me why it's a stupid idea, i'ma listen. but atm i suspect it is necessary and inescapable.

a111: Logged on 2019-07-16 17:28 girlattorney: well the prices are a high for my budget, will check if here there somebody that want to group buy a node in uruguay to split the cost

asciilifeform: would like to offer heathens a) fully isolated linuxen b) at competitive cost. so far erryone in meat wot to whom showed piz rate sheet, replied something in vein of http://btcbase.org/log/2019-07-16#1922858 . ☝︎☟︎

asciilifeform: btw trinque i have a patched kernel, at some pt (sept?) when free hand, will be porting cuntoo userland. ☝︎

trinque: it's a map

asciilifeform: trinque: imho GB-sized vpatch makes a mockery of very concept. ☟︎

trinque: it'd be entirely appropriate to move to a model where the src is in the same tree.

a111: Logged on 2019-07-17 21:57 asciilifeform: meanwhile, in envirowhinerism noose : asciilifeform uncrated a 'window' type air conditioner to help in torture room; and found 1) cost ~2x than last time bought one 2) plastered with 'explosion hazard' warnings. apparently europistan banned ~all~ freons, new-type, old type, and as result EVERYONE gets cooling compressors fulla... butane. 3) internal insulation is... styrofoam. the white,

BingoBoingo: The surprise is that they did not simply say node.js or fuck you, to be discovered when their announcement in the form of a leaded chicom dildo materializes on your front stoop

BingoBoingo: The NFS folks marketed a weird and persisted in man-aloning