173900+ entries in 0.109s
sina: my understandinf of your POV is
that
there is currently no adequate constanttime impl
trinque: .. just gotta get
the
thing
to leak your sleep
timing
too
sina: what I'm
trying
to understand, is which adversaries can mount a
timing attack, and which cannot, given async comms
sina: right, I know
the
thing of synchronizing bullets with
the propellor spins
sina: however I would note
that at
the end of
that
thread it was still unclear
to me how
the final model I proposed was unsafe in any case
sina: asciilifeform: if you would consider
this question as a continuation of
that
thread rather
than repeat, I'd appreciate
a111: Logged on 2017-06-27 01:47 sina: any actual practical example of making it spill out of
the
time box? lets say
two independent processes, one is preparing
the payloads and putting
them in an "outbox"
mircea_popescu: cache hits
to reference
the recent rowhammer lulz, you name it.
mircea_popescu: sina doesn't have
to be "emr". it can be
the resonant behaviour of your power lines or
the acoustic polution in
the room or ping delays or anything else.
a111: Logged on 2017-06-27 01:45 asciilifeform: EVERYONE eventually asks
this
mircea_popescu: it is perfectly conceivable
that by following eg your delay in response
to pings on a network-routable box while a decryption is in progress, at least part of
the key material can be derived.
sina: giving
them away
to whom? certainly not
to a passive network adversary...right?
mircea_popescu: because
the processor clicks slightly as it works ; and if you fork on secret bits you are
thereby giving
the secret bits away.
sina: I lose
the key because an adversary is nearby watching all my EMR?
mircea_popescu: sina example situation, you decrypt your message in a room with an ipad, lose
the key.
mircea_popescu: actual key recovery via acousting channel has been demonstrated recently ; power lines both in draw and as antenna have long been known
to leak key bits.
sina: but if I write an email on my box, encrypt it with RSA,
then send it...what
timing info can be derived?
sina: I mean, I get
that
there are
timing attacks you could perform if
there was a synchronous stream of
traffic happening
mircea_popescu: sina you mean, is
there a side channel for constant
time ops ? or for rsa as commonly implemented atm ?
sina: asciilifeform: basically I am wondering about
the "threat model" of constanttime sidechannel stuffs. for example, let's say I want
to write you an email with RSA encrypted body, or receive same from you, is
there really a sidechannel
there? I guess I'm asking in
terms of async vs sync encrypted comms
sina: asciilifeform: if you are about I have a question for
the resident expert on constanttime stuff
mircea_popescu: should have listend when
toupac
told us all
to get credit cards.
mircea_popescu: i could have not predicted
this entirely surprising
turn of events.
mircea_popescu: funny
that antiseptic masculinity should be deemed
toxic by
the very bugs it is
there
to exterminate.
ben_vulpes: in other
toxic masculinity news, one of
the guys i share
the office with brought a set of olympic weights in
mircea_popescu: arguably not as well made, either.
the original had a lot of "boxes" and shit.
mircea_popescu: "oh, enigma machine sucked, surely if we used computer
to emulate one WILL BE SO MUCH BETTER"
a111: Logged on 2017-07-18 22:41 mircea_popescu: for instance : alf gets so livid when certain classes of events occur because
they contradict assumptions he's made upon which he built
the particular head-fitter he uses.
they'd better hold, or else
the whole
thing is in danger. specifically : a lot less could be fit in head.
whaack: aha yes
the blockcipher schemes always seem
to be security-by-obfuscation
mircea_popescu: the discussion as
to height of
towers and men in prison is apropos.
mircea_popescu: for instance : alf gets so livid when certain classes of events occur because
they contradict assumptions he's made upon which he built
the particular head-fitter he uses.
they'd better hold, or else
the whole
thing is in danger. specifically : a lot less could be fit in head.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: which you know, occurs
through contact with complexity and labour upon it.
mircea_popescu: what fits in head depends also on
the structuring of
the head.
whaack: i'm not advocating one doesn't make an effort
to learn, I'm just pointing out
that
the material covered does not "fit in head" (as alf puts it) very easily and
thus
the main
thing gotten from
that book, for me at least, is
the deep complexity involved with some of
these schemes
mircea_popescu: anyway,
to revisit whaack 's earlier lament : never
trust
the man who says "don't worry your pretty head, sweet" unless you're quite meaning
to be whored out ; because meaning or not, it's gonna happen.
mircea_popescu: well, whole point would be if
the ugly fat kid would get
the whole world
to love him. but, fail
that, picking and choosing which other's private keys can do what when will have
to do as a substitute.
trinque: eating a bullet would put an end
to all
this fretful uncertainty!
whaack: so it's just for
the pleasure of learning?
whaack: what's
the point of learning crypto for plebians,
the concepts are
too hard
to follow.
there are so many
traps in number
theory, and
the argument
to believe
that using a scheme like RSA is secure requires understanding so many lemmas. It's so easy
to make a false proof, how can one not believe
they're not being duped (intentionally or unintentionally) along
the way
to enlightenment.
The one
time pad is really
the only
thing I
trust
to
t mircea_popescu: "costs nothing" and "love her". after a fashion, both of
these.
mircea_popescu: this is how
they get pregnant, normally, but
the usg has managed
to
turn
that innate female idiocy into actual demographic aggregator for it.
mircea_popescu: somehow
this is !== "degree sucks" in her head, wants
to go back for another spin.
mircea_popescu: no. girl from here, goes
there, gets "degree", HAS
TO COME BACK
mircea_popescu: under discussion was orc girl of no particular qualities aspiring
to criminogogology degree from us.
mircea_popescu: besides, she figures if she were
to inherit shje'\d just run back home.
a111: Logged on 2017-07-18 20:41 mircea_popescu:
they "have rights" which is
to say, debt peonage is never going
to be
the south east asian brothel bed, or
the debtor's prison, or marylebone workhouse.
floog: # of hours in
the day
floog: basically, i realized
that i suck, and i want
to suck less. so i plan
to read schneier per ben_vulpes' blog post's recommendation. but maybe i should read vanstone instead?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform he's ordered
the early cycle schneier book, what.
mircea_popescu: rather
than put up with
their manifest insufficiency and social inferiority at home,
they find it preferable
to go be "equal"
to "everyone" in dumblandia.
mircea_popescu: they "have rights" which is
to say, debt peonage is never going
to be
the south east asian brothel bed, or
the debtor's prison, or marylebone workhouse.
☟︎ a111: Logged on 2017-07-18 20:11 user705: is
there a way
to do a
trb node not on Linux?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform
the place caters very well
to
the lazy vanity of
the inept.
a111: Logged on 2017-07-18 20:01 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform
trip does not cure ; know plenty of girlies who studied "criminalisticologies" in us, came back laden with debt,
trying
to GET BACK.