shinohai: I'll be back in a week when the vomiting, dizziness, and diarrhea subside.
ben_vulpes: so i'm fiddling with some source delivery pipeline, and i discover that some asshole has put executable code into his cl .asd files; which i suppose is fine in some circumstances, but i'm doing Terrible Things over here and the asd's aren't getting concatenated with everything else and so just to add another entry to my list of folks whose decisions have made my life harder i look this dude up and can ya
ben_vulpes: believe it he proudly writes ethereum shits now
mircea_popescu: i don't get it, i can make a plain light colorized image of an ultraviolet source, but i can't make a sound pattern of some microwave ?
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: tiny set of scripts to get all of the source for a project from box a to box b
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes i am entirely unsurprised. the "scale bitcoin" shitheads + the "exciting blockchain technologee" shitheads + the "we are marketing" dogeheads are pretty much === the cancer that has eaten foss.
trinque: sec, lemme add his key to the right box
trinque: there's an append only thing that doesn't exist yet
ccmtacks: !!invoice mircea_popescu 0.0145
mircea_popescu: ccmtacks give it one moment, trinque has to fiddle the bot's guts.
trinque: nah it's the good kind of pain
trinque: I always start with human mechanisms and then speed 'em up
ccmtacks: !!invoice mircea_popescu 0.0145
trinque wiggles hand at asciilifeform
mircea_popescu: hm, there's no way to pay it without the number, huh. !!received-invoices step mandatory.
trinque: I could have it burp the invoice number in logs if people don't care that it does
mircea_popescu: the right thing would be for it to execute !!pay name if unambiguous and protest otherwise it needs an invoice number (or heck, just pay everything ?)
mircea_popescu: but still up in the air this, needs more human strokes.
trinque: anyhow ccmtacks gotta pass the decrypted otp back to deedbot like with !!up
mircea_popescu: maybe have a magic !!pay joe all ? and btw, why is it not simply !!pay ?
trinque: I don't like overloading commands
trinque: that sends a defined amount to a person, hasn't to do with invoicing
trinque: don't want people sending 3 btc when they meant pay invoice 3
mircea_popescu: trinque o shit i should have just sent it to him huh. my bad, still new at this.
ccmtacks: !!v 56988162BA62D0ED252CC97D66917B8BDA0B156175326682ED0A3942D6598114
deedbot: Invoiced mircea_popescu 0.0145 <<
mircea_popescu: trinque oh it counts PER NICK. this is very workable then.
trinque: yep, unique between you and other party
trinque: i.e. if you invoice him it'll be 2
mircea_popescu: this way you have a passive "your books and my books gotta match yo" extra accounbting check there.
mircea_popescu: ccmtacks you're good to go. can see your btc wallet with !!balance and can also !!withdraw if you wanna sell it etc.
mircea_popescu: or can keep it there, it's safe. DO NOT LOSE YOUR PGP KEY though.
ccmtacks: !!withdraw 0.0145 32uGGc1G4Cytie5zXa8gGWZJvdyM2KncX5
ccmtacks: !!v 22201C7FC5E2694EBCF2F5240D0507A41EE8C2F0FDC7C2179622E424142A1556
ccmtacks: mircea_popescu, during the withdraw process, if I don't receive any response from deedbot, when I give him the encrypted OTP, does it mean that I have to do all the process again ?
ccmtacks: !!withdraw 0.0145 32uGGc1G4Cytie5zXa8gGWZJvdyM2KncX5
trinque: hold on. what are addresses starting with 3 again?
ccmtacks: !!v 58E3CD3F416C32C575F676B62CC83B062D2AF5E9E7D384C3F3150E2817C6F44A
ccmtacks: mircea_popescu, I've received a message from deedbot that the amount of coins will be transfered to desired btc address
ccmtacks: so I guess everything is fine now
trinque: lol, hi ccmtacks. I'm the operator of deedbot
mircea_popescu: ccmtacks yeah but trinque runs it and if he says it won't then i tend to believe him.
trinque: asciilifeform: there's no hot wallet here; I'm marching my ass over to another box and making signed tx, then popping into a trb with polarbeard patch for sendrawtransaction
ccmtacks: ah, sorry trinque, I didn't know that
mircea_popescu: ccmtacks sorry for all the hassle ; re-do once more, use a 1something address like god meant it.
trinque: idea is to tighten the loop until it is a matter of <1min
trinque: then from there, hot wallet, but one where refilling it is both human operated and quite easy
a111: Logged on 2017-10-12 20:52 mircea_popescu: trinque here's a thought : write me a branded single page "how to" somewhere, and ima modify the pay for your tits thing to only work with deedbot invoices. can then use it to push teh service, how's that sound ?
ccmtacks: !!withdraw 0.0145 1JxsMSnFZdNdVnnDqiTV4aAYM3sESdbPrE
ccmtacks: !!v 9E0C56CF6821F571DF1F6D81BC05291FD0506A8F574D423CAA51B1650FF6DD29
ccmtacks: !!v 9E0C56CF6821F571DF1F6D81BC05291FD0506A8F574D423CAA51B1650FF6DD29
ccmtacks: I don't get it, I only type one space and it gives me two
ccmtacks: !!v 9E0C56CF6821F571DF1F6D81BC05291FD0506A8F574D423CAA51B1650FF6DD29
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform check it out, macs give double \n windows give double \s
ccmtacks: ok, I believe that now is everything ok
trinque: ccmtacks: actual amount will be less the tx fee. I'll fire that off in a bit.
ccmtacks: trinque: ok, no problem at all.
trinque: nbd. there needs to be a whole tx weighing mechanism in order to let people know what that amount will be in the response.
mircea_popescu: ccmtacks next time, remind me i'll tack on an extra coupla bucks.
ccmtacks: ok mate, no problem. I wanted to ask you regarding the fees, however, this time I've just been looking to do everything right
mircea_popescu: anyway, simple way to sell anything for bitcoin : get a !!deposit from deedbot, give out that address.
trinque: well, give out the amount. otherwise it's not going to right account
mircea_popescu: make sure you get exact ammts though, otherwise there's trouble. if deedbot says 0.044236666 then make sure op sends exactly, all the way to the 6666.
trinque: this thing obviously pairs up with a buy/sell board quite well
mircea_popescu: trinque zinx ran me a grand or so so far, but i would way the fuck rather blow a grand on that than what the fuck is the alternative
mircea_popescu: pay a coupla dumb hos who don't even hooker for a living to sit among some plastic shits at a "conference", spend 10x that much ?
ccmtacks: Noted, I've read a lot of the help material, so I actually get it how it all works now, well a good part of it :)
mircea_popescu: ccmtacks the important part is that unlike websites etc it's actually secure.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> i don't get it, i can make a plain light colorized image of an ultraviolet source, but i can't make a sound pattern of some microwave ? << AHA, like "traffic safety" radar
trinque: mircea_popescu: I'm gonna post a tutorial on deedbot.org tonight, and also hook up the newb nick+key conveyor
mircea_popescu: trinque don't sweat it, she'll do it when i tell her to, what. tomorrow, monday, whatever.
☟︎☟︎ trinque: buy sell board does appear within reach now huh.
mircea_popescu: trinque can directly push lobbes 's bot into it, what more is needed ? we have all the parts.
☟︎ trinque: oh hey it's got auctions, doesn't it
lobbesbot: Logged on 2017-10-11 21:42:21: <diana_coman> !QAuction 2.86mn 48 29173 Flotsam q62
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: k, I'll wait for ones with numbers
BingoBoingo: Still, the Asian cador continues to impress.
deedbot: saot voiced for 30 minutes.
saot: i don't know what he does, he wrecks his life
saot: bad but it doesn't affect me
BingoBoingo: Maybe one of these days hitting a rock bottom will give him an opportunity for a spiritual experience? Anyways, what are you lurking for?
saot: some mental stimulation, cool corners of the internet are good to find unusual options
saot: i think this is one of them
BingoBoingo: So, who's your favorite? Any memes here you are a fan of?
saot: I like 4chan but recently i find it boring
BingoBoingo: Ah, why not register a key? Make yourself at home?
saot: i'm not fan of a specific meme but throwing communists out of helicopters sounds fun
deedbot: saot voiced for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: So, anyone in the Repulic have any ideas on network switching equipment?
☟︎ ben_vulpes: my trinqulator sez "mac mini with openbsd"
a111: Logged on 2017-10-13 03:11 BingoBoingo: So, anyone in the Repulic have any ideas on network switching equipment?
BingoBoingo: How many mac minis are necessary to bond together a 14 Gbps link to the worl?
BingoBoingo: Well, AA battery as power supply means won't interfere with heat envelope too much
BingoBoingo: Were sold at local bookstore. There was even electricity kit where lightbulb, battery, and wire was offered.
BingoBoingo: Ah not quite the same then, thing I am thinking of came in box same size and shape as "poptarts". Sold as "you know school sucks too much to teach this"
gribble: Error: "!Up" is not a valid command.
deedbot: gribble voiced for 30 minutes.
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 5798.99, vol: 24018.43 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 5889.0, vol: 3789.33 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 5808.9, vol: 105254.63 | GDAX BTCUSD last: 5790.0, vol: 29298.53 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 5799.9, vol: 10452.24 | Gemini BTCUSD last: 5782.07, vol: 17737.44 | OKCoin BTCUSD last: 5836.8, vol: 6258.49 | Volume-weighted last average: 5804.41
trinque: ^ lemme know if those look goofy. process that spat them out is brand new.
a111: Logged on 2017-10-12 23:49 asciilifeform: if anyone can see obvious 'this can be simpler' or 'this dun make sense' plz write in.
apeloyee: by the way, the bot which saved pastes on archive.is doesn't seem to do it anymore.
☟︎☟︎ a111: Logged on 2017-10-13 11:19 apeloyee: by the way, the bot which saved pastes on archive.is doesn't seem to do it anymore.
shinohai: asciilifeform: think it was a scriba feature .... though bot appears to be present
mod6: that's a mighty useful feature too btw.
mod6: we've gotta have that.
mod6: how you doin' shinohai?
shinohai: Not too bad, got jhvh1 back online now catching up on logs
mod6: ive been writing unit test for ffa
shinohai: Awesum ... I'm going to take a look at the thing asciilifeform posted last night later, gotta get Excedrin for preemptive strike on headaches lol
mod6: i don't have a ton of coverage yet -- just mainly around the fz bitwise ops, fz_add, fz_mult, handfull of others.
mod6: im hoping to get some tests around the shifting procedures possibly today or this weekend. alf's latest changes from yesterday would fit into that as well.
mod6: i hope to glean some deeper understanding of the secret shifting from these tests as well.
mod6: im certain that even the tests that I do have are missing certain cases -- but its a starting point. and when I publish these, the hope is that people here can help fill in the gaps of the coverage so we can use this as a means to ensure that we do not regress as changes occur to the code.
mod6: again, these are unit tests, not functional, integration, or performance tests. meaning: i simply call a (so far public) procedure/function within ffa with specific parameters, and expect specific outputs.
mod6: once we have some solid unit tests in place, i'll look at some functional tests as a higher-level way to ensure we don't regress as well. but that's a bit later yet.
mod6: probably won't even start until we're closer to a finalized version of ffa.
mod6: that's more of a higher-level, functional style test.
mod6: i believe there to be a lot of merit to having unit tests around the specific procedures and functions in ffa.
mod6: so, that's what I'm spending time on now anyway. and, making good progress in a short amount of time. however, ya, many gaps i msure.
mod6: well, they're hopefully clear enough to be understood.
mod6: we'll see how hairy it gets :]
mod6: the fz_mux wasn't too bad, etc.
mod6: to understand the thing, one can simply do the: B ^ ((S - 1) & (A ^ B)) on a calc
mod6: aha, this indeed may be the case - something found. but the main interest "does it do what it ~should~ do, given these inputs"
mod6: that's the aim anyway. but, yah, might find something along the way too.
mod6: ANNND. hopefully will grok moar as well.
mod6: a way of doing necessary work, and forcing myself to do the maff at the same time.
mod6: The hope here is... when these changes are made, the given inputs still match the expected outputs.
mod6: see... i thought so too.. because yesterday i was digging up our conversation from august of '15 where we were looking at gnupg -- that night we had like 69 pastes.
a111: Logged on 2017-10-13 11:19 apeloyee: by the way, the bot which saved pastes on archive.is doesn't seem to do it anymore.
mod6: and Framedragger came along and did that handy thing and archived all that stuff. really, can't live without that bot.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform afaik it was a scriba feature. Framedragger !!1111
mod6: unless you wanna give me access to your drive
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform theoretically it also gets the zips. at least iirc.
mod6: <+asciilifeform> so there has to be a synthetic (i.e. Unsigned_32 ) type , that on archs that have narrower bitness than that, ends up a doubleword << ah, i see.
mod6: it adds so much to the history though. being able to see wtf we were talking about.
mircea_popescu: i am loath to put "and load this website" into the eg log bot spec.
mod6: asciilifeform: sure. makes sense.
mod6: anyway, i don't wanna be a distraction. am simply, hopefully, on a useful side-quest.
a111: Logged on 2017-10-13 15:14 asciilifeform: keep in mind that ffa ( esp. the more recent items ) will change.
trinque: actually mircea_popescu's solution to forcing miners to hold all blocks could conceivably used to hire hosting for the archive from whoever has space. folks register with eg deedbot, must produce hash of all archived items at interval to receive a small bitcoin payout, flowing from subscribers to the archive service.
mod6: mircea_popescu: understood. it is more a learning process than anything at this point.
mircea_popescu: trinque entirely feasible but let's revisit in next year.
trinque: must also provide a web endpoint for the archive, etc
trinque: sure, not going to break ground on it
mircea_popescu: mod6 in any case don't completely abandon the trb-v castle, you're like our last guy there i fear
mod6: mircea_popescu: aha, indeed Sir.
mod6: speaking of trinque's usage of polarbeard's rawtx vpatch -- im planning to get deeper into that this month.
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: I have not seen polarbeard.
mod6: iirc I had created a proper vpatch of the thing last year, but we never wrapped up all the testing. i'd like to revisit that.
mircea_popescu: anyway, i tried /invite polarbeard but * polarbeard :No such nick/channel ; anyone know him irl drop a line ?
mircea_popescu: pity guy left, totally got teh wrong impression re tmsr.
mircea_popescu: yes, complete with the pixelization and the fb_img etc.
mod6: ah yeah, i do have a rawtx on sitting here -- just needs testing. also, still have some makefile changes that are needing some testing/review. and further, want to put in some requested changes to import/dump priv key.
trinque: the introduction of new classes should be perma-banned
a111: Logged on 2017-09-14 05:30 trinque: in the process, realized I oughta publically denounce something in the funkenstein importprivkey/dumpprivkey patch
mod6: I dunno about perma-banned, but I do see what you mean by that trinque, in this specific case.
mod6: Submit me a vpatch, Sir.
trinque: mod6: I dunno how you make the thing intelligible while walking further into C++ madness
mod6: trinque: i didn't say we /should/ add more classes.
trinque: mod6: sure sure, I admit being hyperbolic
trinque: I do owe a few patches at this point. btw, am using sendrawtransaction with deedbot, works so far.
mircea_popescu: trinque you won't be able to fix trb into sanity without new classes.
mod6: and please do send 'em my way when you have time
mircea_popescu: now, that they should be used sparsely is certainly true.
mod6: i know you're pretty swamped -- when you're comfortable with deedbots changes, etc. you know.
trinque: if they demolish old, muddy concepts that's far better than subclassing the mud
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nevermind the actual implementation. the design/concept however you call it.
mircea_popescu: when we're discussiong classes we're not automatically discussing an impl. it's a data model.
jhvh1: Gracias Sr. mircea_popescu!
jhvh1: It is good to be self-aware again
mod6: ohmahgerd, it's alive
trinque: mod6: I did lose a transaction in a node's mempool the other day using it. was clearly there, sitting, going nowhere.
trinque: fed to another node, went fine
trinque: I dunno who to blame for that yet
mircea_popescu: trinque one working model : all the nodes node 1 was connected to decided "it is spam", because they can do this now, so they didn't forward it but also didn't tell node 1. same did not hold for node 2.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: typical sybilling, happens and has happened tons, which is why it's important to talk to many nodes for payment safety.
mircea_popescu: and EVEN IF maintaining a large (and, obviously, expensive) network of nodes etc, you can still run into surprises, as the bitbet issue very well illustrates.
trinque: mhm. node 1 sits on a domestic line; 2, commercial. I could see it
mircea_popescu: you'll end up with node lists, fingerprinting, mothership identification, the whole shebang.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: if you keep money and man-hours into this, you'll eventually reach that vaunted summit.
mod6: please do keep reporting such irregularities though.
mircea_popescu: (amusingly, this node-sybil-pie entirely exists BECAUSE IT CAN exist. think in GT terms : at t1 it doesn't exist. at t2, player 1 figures out it could exist, whether it can or not, and takes defensive meansures. at t3, some bug in player1's implementation is exploited (consciously or accidentally) and now... it DOES exist.)
mircea_popescu: human problem of meta is that humans can think outside the box. they end up choking each other with the unintentional by-products of that thinking.
mircea_popescu: now THIS would be some interesting ecology, of the "keep the world safe for your children" kind.
deedbot: lobbes voiced for 30 minutes.
lobbes:
http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-13#1724782 << I am more than willing to make required tweaks to get something like this working (allowing auctions to be denominated in btc as well as ecu, having lobbesbot spit out deedbot invoice, etc)
☝︎ a111: Logged on 2017-10-13 01:55 mircea_popescu: trinque can directly push lobbes 's bot into it, what more is needed ? we have all the parts.
lobbes: Also gotta figure out where auctions would happen. I'd imagine #t wouldn't be keen on the auctions taking place in this channel. Would be a lot of added noise.
mircea_popescu: tbh, i don't think doing it in #trilema is either unfeasible or a bad idea.
lobbes: That is a point. I can always tweak the announces to be less frequent as people see fit anyways
shinohai: I can't remember what I did with it lobbes .... but there was a plugin that let you announce a msg only to folks subscribed to it.
trinque: commerce happening here wont annoy me!
mircea_popescu: but anyway, yes, all sorts of options available. can readily just use pastebin if it gets bad
mircea_popescu: though honestly, may take a while for it to become a problem.
a111: Logged on 2017-10-13 15:40 mircea_popescu: trinque one working model : all the nodes node 1 was connected to decided "it is spam", because they can do this now, so they didn't forward it but also didn't tell node 1. same did not hold for node 2.
a111: Logged on 2017-02-25 23:22 mircea_popescu: basically nodes are the digital equivalent of women : men fuck them so the state can have babies. hurr durr, pill plox.
a111: Logged on 2017-10-13 15:42 mircea_popescu: you'll end up with node lists, fingerprinting, mothership identification, the whole shebang.
mircea_popescu: the problem is that they're not automatically diffedrent just because they could be.
mircea_popescu: satoshi made an engineering mistake, taking the assumption the wrong way
shinohai: This is the lulziest bit: " If you have transactions to make around late November, we suggest you buy some Ether in our wallet today. "
mircea_popescu: basically the excel-powered secret agent strategy has become "try to disrupt bitcoin by creating fud on social media". which works to... disrupt usage by the usg's own muppets, the redditards, wikitards and assoerted other dust mongers ? which is somehow bad for bitcoin, or even noticeable or something ?
mircea_popescu: hey USG - take your useless sheep and drown them all for what anyone cares. seriously now.
mircea_popescu: more like "this bitcoin is like britney, entirely built out of pennies and walmart e-cards"
mircea_popescu: but anyway, apparently taking a few heads here and there creates exactly no conception of own vulnerability in the rest of the heads.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: there's a great gif with a stupid little girl confronting a lion from behind a glass pane.
mircea_popescu: this has apparently become a major psychological liability for the crowd, they imagine that since everything they ever encountered was safely behind bulletproof glass, that's "just how life is".
mircea_popescu: well, these fucktards are going around looking for chtulhu.
mircea_popescu: "i tried stuffing all the stick and rock types i could find in all the holes that there were and even some that i made. why airplane not wash jocularstrap ???"
mircea_popescu: an autistic child you didn't kill at the age of 7 will support a whole comicbook industry until age 70 ?
shinohai: "I prosecute all the meth-heads and STEAL THEIR STASH! Bwahahahaha"
mircea_popescu: more meth she steals more effective she gets more meth she steals etc.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that last pic dun work for all the diff it makes
jhvh1: mircea_popescu: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 5549.99, vol: 27743.23574480 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 5589.5, vol: 100804.08249558 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 4280.016, vol: 0 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 5525.6, vol: 9517.72500364 | Volume-weighted last average: 5577.15568871
mod6: asciilifeform: i like the added comments in there. keep it up.
mircea_popescu: !!withdraw 0.45364891 13YczpPCDAxBWQwMmNyyAASHYR4EmbwagP
mod6: i do also think there could be paragraphs even written around certain procedures in ffa. but not sure if that belongs in the code, or as a corresponding document outside of the code.
mod6: and ya, that's what i mean, more or less. what/why/how type of explanations.
mod6: but the comments I've seen in there are helpful, as long as they are accurate.
mod6: perhaps -- i certainly think it's good to link l0gz in footnotes or whatnot. the what/why/how doc aught to summarize all of thinking/decision making that went into the code.
mod6: i'm probably getting ahead of myself though. was just saying "*thumbs-up*" on comments.
mod6: Here's a dumb question...
mod6: what does 'P' stand for when you say "FZ_OddP" or "FZ_EvenP" ... etc? Parameter?
☟︎ BingoBoingo: Looks like the Pinoys can't do it: "hello sir I'm sorry to inform you that it is not possible to met your requirement of 14Gigabits but our offer of 10mbps for 504 USD and we can upgrade that as your needs increase still stands." -jolo
BingoBoingo: I really need something much closer to 14 Gigabits per second. I understand that this will have a price attached to it."
BingoBoingo: Which I offered in reply to his first mention of 10mbps hoping he got the letters confused
a111: Logged on 2017-10-13 21:07 mod6: what does 'P' stand for when you say "FZ_OddP" or "FZ_EvenP" ... etc? Parameter?
mircea_popescu: in even further lulz, there apparently exists a dharvard university in indja.
shinohai: Maybe Preet can get a job there lol