log
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mod6: hanbot: hmm, ok that makes some sense as far as the philosophical components. i wonder if simply an index with pointers to indexed topic wouldn't just be something worthwhile. i.e. "Discussion around MP's change requirements and keccak hash family => [LOG_URL_1] [LOG_URL_N] [...]"
mod6: at minimum that could point a person in the right direction to find #b-a discussions in the log about said topic.
mod6: thoughts on that?
mod6: asciilifeform: about that error I saw, thanks for your insight. I looked the other system logs to see if that was the issue, but didn't see the OOMKILL like I have before. So I was thinking it wasn't related to that somehow. Anyway, good to know.
mod6: *looked at
mod6: And beyond that, as you were saying, it didn't get oomkill'd, just kept right along going. i think you're right, we should throw a fatal exception in the event of oom.
asciilifeform: http://www.internetsociety.org/sites/default/files/04_2_2.pdf << almost ideal case study of WHAT NOT TO DO omfg111111
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1T225Z1 )
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29300 @ 0.00041975 = 12.2987 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: In "lovedog" news http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/a4-waist-challenge---new-trend-for-women-to-slim-down-to-thinner/
assbot: A4 waist challenge - new trend for women to slim down to thinner than a sheet of paper ... ( http://bit.ly/1T23zTa )
phf: installing gentoo is a special form of sadomasochism.
mircea_popescu: best masochism of all david niven's masochisms, the one in which he keeps his eggs.
phf: ok, not sure if anybody tried yet, but asciilifeform's gentoo chicken works as prescribed. in fact i tried installing unknown package that turned out to have a hard poettering dependency, and gentoo refused to proceed
phf: i've managed a reiserfs/lilo combo, though genkernel claims that it doesn't work with reiserfs. uclibc vanilla failed on chroot step, ifconfig and all the other networking bits refused to work. perhaps i needed to grab a uclibc iso? in any case i proceeded witha glibc install for now
BingoBoingo: https://i.imgur.com/FAY63Ar.jpg?1
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1TY2hcT )
BingoBoingo: !up koinplug
koinplug: hi everyone
koinplug: I have been looking at mpex and I think I'm misunderstanding something
koinplug: in the feb statement it says there's 60 btc revenue from new accounts
koinplug: http://trilema.com/2016/mpex-smpoe-february-2016-statement/
assbot: MPEx (S.MPOE) February 2016 Statement on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1UI1ETH )
koinplug: but http://mpex.co/faq.html says there's only one exchange address, 1Fx3N5iFPDQxUKhhmDJqCMmi3U8Y7gSncx
assbot: MPEx, the Bitcoin securities exchange. ... ( http://bit.ly/1UI1Fad )
koinplug: and that address has not received any payments in Feb
koinplug: also the new accounts fee is 50 BTC, minus possibly 2x5 BTC for the affiliate fee, so multiples of 40 or 50 BTC. how can that add up to 60 BTC?
koinplug: mircea_popescu?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32400 @ 0.00041934 = 13.5866 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2015/jul/21/nothing-indicate-nothing-indicate-subject-had-any-/
assbot: "Nothing to indicate the subject had any interest in any matter other than Mathematics” Paul Erdős FBI file ... ( http://bit.ly/1RsH9ev )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3600 @ 0.00041922 = 1.5092 BTC [-]
punkman: koinplug: here is the relevant thread: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-03-2015#1058365 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 19-03-2015 22:00:35; kakobrekla: was this addressed yet? http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-03-2015#1057811
punkman: !up koinplug
koinplug: thanks punkman that makes sense
koinplug: but multiples of 40 or 50 btc can't add up to 60 btc?
koinplug: unless it is being amortized for some reason?
punkman: yeah not sure about that, maybe someone got a discount?
punkman: heh http://www.nature.com/news/south-korea-trumpets-860-million-ai-fund-after-alphago-shock-1.19595
assbot: South Korea trumpets $860-million AI fund after AlphaGo 'shock' : Nature News & Comment ... ( http://bit.ly/1R7iEkQ )
deedbot-: [Daniel P. Barron] Tightly controlling the present. - http://danielpbarron.com/2016/tightly-controlling-the-present/
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell koinplug a) mpex also uses undisclosed addresses in special cases ; b) we have some old fixed-price contracts with some users who renew their key periodically.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: phf> ok, not sure if anybody tried yet, but asciilifeform's gentoo chicken works as prescribed << it does, yes, and it IS a very good and useful thing. almost makes me feel bad when mocking linuxen.
mircea_popescu: and check it out, danielpbarron found peace in reading trilema!
shinohai: dafuq is a gentoo chicken
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436573 << congrats phf! this makes 2 known hard-sane gentootrons on planet3 now. others here encouraged to replicate. double-encouraged to replicate ~with musl~.☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 06:25:18; phf: ok, not sure if anybody tried yet, but asciilifeform's gentoo chicken works as prescribed. in fact i tried installing unknown package that turned out to have a hard poettering dependency, and gentoo refused to proceed
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436574 << most folks boot off a small (<=128m) ext3 for this reason☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 06:27:49; phf: i've managed a reiserfs/lilo combo, though genkernel claims that it doesn't work with reiserfs. uclibc vanilla failed on chroot step, ifconfig and all the other networking bits refused to work. perhaps i needed to grab a uclibc iso? in any case i proceeded witha glibc install for now
asciilifeform: and uclibc sucks
asciilifeform: pretty much only fit for 'busybox' afaik
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436589 << l0l check out the megatonne of censored bit☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 09:36:19; BingoBoingo: https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2015/jul/21/nothing-indicate-nothing-indicate-subject-had-any-/
asciilifeform: ( most of the small chunks appear to conceal names of stoolies )
danielpbarron: is mine one of the two? The box I'm using to test trb had already been a sane gentootron
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: you used my config?
danielpbarron: it'd using it now, you hadn't made that formal list at the time i did it
asciilifeform: danielpbarron made same thing earlier? ( no dbus, etc. ) ? neato.
asciilifeform: the point of my config was to stop the crud from getting pulled in by portage at every turn, which it otherwise does.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MG] 42954 @ 0.00009 = 3.8659 BTC [-]
trinque has a similarly neutered personal recipe
assbot: [MPEX] [S.NSA] 57279 @ 0.000085 = 4.8687 BTC [-]
phf: asciilifeform: did you manage to get emacs to build on musl gentoo? (i.e. does the musl patches overlay include a solution for temacs dump process)
phf: also anyone tried doing a kernel level key rebind before? is that just in config or you need to patch source. i want to switch some keys around, but i don't want to have to do it for every single userland environment
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436624 << not tried yet. but expect this to fail.☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 15:02:08; phf: asciilifeform: did you manage to get emacs to build on musl gentoo? (i.e. does the musl patches overlay include a solution for temacs dump process)
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436625 << afaik there is no provision for this, because retardation☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 15:04:05; phf: also anyone tried doing a kernel level key rebind before? is that just in config or you need to patch source. i want to switch some keys around, but i don't want to have to do it for every single userland environment
asciilifeform: it desperately needs a cure
asciilifeform: imho key rebinds should be processed ~when machine boots~
asciilifeform: prior to whatever else
asciilifeform: i end up rebinding keys in hardware when possible
asciilifeform: because os is militantly retarded
phf: right, linux root=/dev/foo kbrebind=10:20,40:50,etc.
asciilifeform: ideally in lilo
asciilifeform: i don't EVER want capslock to not be ctrl.
asciilifeform: not in boot menu either.
asciilifeform: hell i'd put it in bios if x86 had any provision for this
asciilifeform: so it ends up going in the keyboard.
phf: resolder hw
asciilifeform: can't simply resolder
asciilifeform: kbd had grid system
asciilifeform: need own controller, or a cooperating one (e.g., northgate's)
asciilifeform: but yes, kernel needs to have key rebind, to make laptop behave sanely
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436622 << consider posting?☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 14:54:42; *: trinque has a similarly neutered personal recipe
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436602 << undisclosed addresses? unprincipled-exception from 'no such thing as taint' ?!!☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 13:53:13; mircea_popescu: ;;later tell koinplug a) mpex also uses undisclosed addresses in special cases ; b) we have some old fixed-price contracts with some users who renew their key periodically.
phf: seems like the kind of thing that would be worthwhile to diff against chicken
phf: also i learned that gnutls depends on guile :o
asciilifeform: phf: aha!
phf: i don't remember homebrew pulling guile, so it's something gentoo specific. and putting -guile into useflags don't do notin
asciilifeform: i started actually making a systematic list of exclusions, then barfed, really we want to enumerate ~good~ parts, they are few
asciilifeform: phf: guile is an old scheme
asciilifeform: used as a tinyscheme of sorts
asciilifeform: iirc gimp once used it, but now has the latter
phf: guile is the old warhorse of the "scheme in emacs!!" agenda, pretty sure even naggum ranted about it
asciilifeform: aha
asciilifeform: it is a turd incidentally
asciilifeform: very heavy relativly to ts
phf: right, even hardcore schemers (of the mit/scheme48 background) think it's pos
asciilifeform: i have nfi what the upside of guile was supposed to be
asciilifeform: iirc it ended up in various places because it had fsf copyright
asciilifeform: and so politically favoured
phf: there's a very vocal minority trying to get it into emacs as a replacement for elisp, you'll have an elisp emulation layer, but you can also have javascript emulation layer!!1
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436653 << you gotta ~mask~ and flag. what this does is to guarantee that the thing won't be pulled, but at the same time allow other things that might be severable from the dependency to still build.☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 15:25:22; phf: i don't remember homebrew pulling guile, so it's something gentoo specific. and putting -guile into useflags don't do notin
phf: aah, hence crapolade
asciilifeform: aha
asciilifeform: and anything that fails to build after that, is not respecting the flag, and has to be either discarded or patched.
asciilifeform: e.g., 'wireshark'
asciilifeform: (for which NO substitute exists)
phf: i assume it can be built with qt3, but it still hard depends on dbus? or you mean that it just requires patching
asciilifeform: iirc dbus
asciilifeform: needs a pill
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436599 << 'us too! if usg can hand out $B to aggressive mediocrities, so can we!111'☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 10:35:54; punkman: heh http://www.nature.com/news/south-korea-trumpets-860-million-ai-fund-after-alphago-shock-1.19595
mircea_popescu: hey, aggressive mediocrities ALWAYS fuck over neurotic geniuses / lazy talent.
mircea_popescu: very safe bet.
asciilifeform: no shit
asciilifeform: and bacterium eats coward and hero just the same at the end of the war.
mircea_popescu: unrelated matter.
asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436666 << elisp , and emacs as a whole , suck donkey balls. it is in many ways a microscopic model of how linux sucks, a turd for which NO replacement is available, so it is kept on life support at all costs .☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 15:31:18; phf: there's a very vocal minority trying to get it into emacs as a replacement for elisp, you'll have an elisp emulation layer, but you can also have javascript emulation layer!!1
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> hell i'd put it in bios if x86 had any provision for this <<< odd that the bios has provision for any and all retarded shits, including "power saving" but not for defining the buttons.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> iirc gimp once used it, but now has the latter << yea.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i use coreboot, and would put in what i want, but the ~hardware~ makes no provision
mircea_popescu: right.
asciilifeform: southbridge.
mircea_popescu: good thing they implemented orc glyphs tho.
mircea_popescu: THAT was a priority.
asciilifeform: soo it goes in the kbd. luckily ps/2 is very simple to talk in, you can use , e.g., a 16f84
asciilifeform: fiddycents of iron.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform << undisclosed addresses? unprincipled-exception from 'no such thing as taint' ?!! << very principled. "no such thing as taint" means that i do not recognize the concept, or any reasoning that relies on it. it very pointedly does not mean i will behave in such a manner as to protect the taint assumptions of third parties but just the opposite.
asciilifeform: waiwut
asciilifeform: would that not mean ~refusing~ to use secret addrs?
mircea_popescu: if you think that you can in any manner or for any purpose distinguish any bitcoin from any bitcoin we can't be friends.
mircea_popescu: no, it wouldn't.
mircea_popescu: just like not recognizing the institution of marriage doesn't mean you never marry. it means that you randomly and entirely unreliably marry.
asciilifeform: ok now this makes sense.
asciilifeform: could marry six times before breakfast.
mircea_popescu: in other news, i had never discussed theology on a blog before. dat republic!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17100 @ 0.00041922 = 7.1687 BTC [-]
thestringpuller: damn. this stuck node thing.....
danielpbarron: !up bl00m
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: post your debug.log tail ?
thestringpuller: i'll have to grep it for when it stopped
thestringpuller: receiving blocks
mats: https://cs.stackexchange.com/questions/356/why-hasnt-there-been-an-encryption-algorithm-that-is-based-on-the-known-np-hard
assbot: complexity theory - Why hasn't there been an encryption algorithm that is based on the known NP-Hard problems? - Computer Science Stack Exchange ... ( http://bit.ly/1nZDTcK )
asciilifeform: mats: see old thread;
mats: am posting in reference to thread
asciilifeform: this is actually much harder than it appears, because there must also be a proof that the PARTICULAR INSTANCES of the problem you make use of are ~likewise~ of the worst AVERAGE CASE complexity
mircea_popescu: moon proof!
mircea_popescu: "i kept no records of the presumptions i made in constructing the subclass, therefore no such presumptions exist!"
asciilifeform: aha, sop in what passes for 'cryptographic komyoooonity'
mircea_popescu: then i get incensed when derps start with the "~~~~~I~~~~~ don't see how..."
asciilifeform: see also the idiocy of 'nothing-up-my-sleeve constants'
asciilifeform: e.g., aes
mircea_popescu: un minimo respecto por el trabajador, i say.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu et al: incidentally, this edges into the definition of 'random', as per the 1,001 threads on subj. specifically, solving a problem ~you already know the solution to~ is O(1) in all cases!111
asciilifeform: complexity is only defined for ~unknowns~
asciilifeform: the 'unknownity' of which is not an attribute of ~them~ but of the ~system~ of them+yourhead
phf: as manifest in every "my first crypto", this is so convoluted i can't grok it, surely nobody else can
asciilifeform: phf: the mega-discovery (at least to me) last month is that this is ~still so~ for 'official' crypto
phf: i have a hunch that this is not a conspiracy of incompetents, but rather an aspect of the whole knowing the unknown in relation to yourhead. i.e. stupid is not obscurantist for your benefit, but for own
phf: very little thinking is going on, most of so called thinking is integration and regurgitation of past thinking, that trickles from occasional pockets where thinking happened. by the time one integrates that thinking one is disinclined to further think (for one is a ph.d. or whatever at that point). but any question can be grothendieck-ed if you're so inclined, to reveal and remove your systemd's and kdbus's
asciilifeform: aha, this removal is imho ~the~ business.
asciilifeform: see also the 'inventors - cut things' thread.
asciilifeform: for some reason many folks focus on ~synthesis~ as the main act of productive thought
asciilifeform: but this is a half-truth.
asciilifeform: you gotta remove the crud first.
asciilifeform: as in metallurgy.
deedbot-: [» Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski] The Brothers Grimsby - http://www.contravex.com/2016/03/20/the-brothers-grimsby/
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44462 @ 0.00041959 = 18.6558 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: phf the whole premise of bourgeois society is "me too". apprentice wizard "becoming" "just as good" as wizard. sons becoming just as good as fathers. seedling becoming just as tree as the tree.
mircea_popescu: the unspoken part being, of course, "but better".
mircea_popescu: such as : reading jane austen, just as good as falling in love, except cheaper and safer. no fluids involved.
mircea_popescu: reading dickens, just as good as having a life. reading age of exploration crud, just as good as having travelled.
mircea_popescu: going to unversity, just as good as thinking. fast food, just as good as food.
mircea_popescu: no wonder and no explanation needed that darwin became such a religious lightning rod. theory of... "evolution". there's no evolution involved in darwinism, per se. a wasp today has "evolved" just as much and for just as long as jane austin "evolved".
mircea_popescu: this pious fraud beset poor darwin all his life, and he pretty much perelman'd because of it.
mircea_popescu: so then, in this perspective, balabusta (fat jewish housewife), who is absolutely the apotheosis of bourgeois society, will make clam chowder (just as good as) out of whatever it is she finds in her pantry, such as for instance beans.
mircea_popescu: going to church, just as good as living well ; and then when going to church is too much trouble, going to protestant church "inside oneself" just as good as going to the proper one.
mircea_popescu: (it wasn't good enough anyway - it was, don't you know, ~corrupt~!!!!. see http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=17-03-2016#1435480 for what "corruption" means and how that narrative plays.)☝︎
assbot: Logged on 17-03-2016 21:09:58; mircea_popescu: anyway. by and large, the "cleanning out corruption" narrative is what happens to a colonized place, ie, after the top leadership was defeated.
mircea_popescu: so of fucking course modernity would be unthinking, for which reason sterile, and centralizing, for which reason boring. it has to be, its aims require it, its basic tenets imply it.
mircea_popescu: (if you think about it, worst cinematic villain line of all time, most insulting to "the gods" of the viewer ? "you will never be as good as me." o noes!)
mircea_popescu: but in other news, http://41.media.tumblr.com/e68eb9884b89059401c939cae4d85bc7/tumblr_nqqiosB39o1twuavro1_1280.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/21C8RVx )
asciilifeform: l0l! what is the old man wearing ?!
asciilifeform: pants made from old bagpipe ?!
mircea_popescu: clown costume ?
mircea_popescu: oh and also : the definitive romania http://36.media.tumblr.com/d3e5c0ad09bffa6f2cc89a0cd749c032/tumblr_n8vifxwcK91sd6qo9o1_1280.jpg
assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/21C8XfW )
asciilifeform: l0lwut
asciilifeform: definitive how?
mircea_popescu: everything, EVERYTHING screams it. the odd attire of the brunette walking away. the facade of the apartment building. that ugly monkey bar set ; the thin grass, the inconvenient walkway. absolute item.
asciilifeform: i'dve assumed ru
mircea_popescu: the idiots sitting uncomfortably for fear of not being others' suckers...
asciilifeform: and i have grass like this right here in my backyard!11
mircea_popescu: (speaking of which, http://trilema.com/2011/povestea-celor-trei-imparati-smecheri-si-a-celor-trei-negustori-fraieri-fabula-in-versuri-ilustrata/ << about the most insulting to romanian sensibilities thing out there.
assbot: Povestea celor trei imparati smecheri si a celor trei negustori fraieri - fabula in versuri ilustrata on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/25dHZjf )
mircea_popescu: this is anathema.
asciilifeform: and walkway right here in front...
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform uneven ? bordered by some concrete margin of no apparent utility than to ensure it turns into a river if it rains ?
asciilifeform: aha!
mircea_popescu: the details are important.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform now i'd rather fancy to see this thing. pic it sometime.
asciilifeform: actually no border, wtf
asciilifeform: but still river, high groundwater
mircea_popescu: heh.
mircea_popescu: there's a difference between sfortunati and disgratiati.
asciilifeform: waiwut
mircea_popescu: (approx, unfortunate and good for nothing, respectively)
asciilifeform: ah.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if you wanna lulz, http://logs.minigame.bz/2016-03-20.log.html#t20:01:39
assbot: #Eulora log for Sunday, 2016-03-20 ... ( http://bit.ly/21Ca5jH )
mircea_popescu: "eclypse" (some wanna-be c compiler for windows ?) never heard of jamfiles.
asciilifeform: eclipse is not a compiler
asciilifeform: it is text editor
mircea_popescu: uh
mircea_popescu: oh just ide ?
asciilifeform: very bulky thing, written in java
asciilifeform: aha
mircea_popescu: ok... eclupse, some wanna-be ide for windows never heard o' jamfiles.
asciilifeform: me neither
trinque: boooooost
asciilifeform: looks like a heathen gnumake ?
mircea_popescu: make alternative!
asciilifeform: l0l why.
mircea_popescu: you know iirc boost builds via jam
asciilifeform: itself, aha
asciilifeform: but why use it for human work
asciilifeform: (rotor invokes boost's jam thing but trb, recall, builds with ordinary gnumake)
mircea_popescu: so then you DO know what it is!
asciilifeform: apparently!
asciilifeform: i mercifully forgot.
mircea_popescu: soooo then....
mircea_popescu: da fuck is the point of an ide that doesn't support things.
asciilifeform: i wouldn't dream of using it for a project tho
mircea_popescu: might as well use vi then, equally unaware of the world.
asciilifeform: because wtf
asciilifeform: and yeah eclipse is this thing where there are 10,001 plugins, prolly one of them eats it.
mircea_popescu: it occurs rto me - someone should get google to make googlebot author a collection of jokes.
mircea_popescu: possibly the one place for ai in intelligent discourse.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: every natural-language whateverthefuck attempt looked like, at best, RACTOR.
asciilifeform: (and PARRY)
mircea_popescu: aha
asciilifeform: shannonizer cum lipstick.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14100 @ 0.00041995 = 5.9213 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: holy shit, elgamal works for spammerz!??
asciilifeform: https://bitbet.us/bet/1249/alphago-will-defeat-lee-sedol-overall-in-march/#c5867 << there is what, dozen of these, and i dun think they're all nubbins`..
assbot: BitBet - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match :: 80.22 B (54%) on Yes, 68.59 B (46%) on No | closed 1 week 4 days ago ... ( http://bit.ly/1RdvTNC )
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: looks like it may be due to -connect vs -addnode
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: -connect lives and dies by the nodes you -connect'ed to
thestringpuller: this, but I think it may have other behavior
kakobrekla: bb comments confirm http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-03-2016#1436209 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 18-03-2016 18:11:44; kakobrekla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-03-2016#1435731 < not at all - i think there is some merit in the argument in the sense that bitbet will hardly survive the upset its going through now (which is actually devaluating the asset to be liquidated)
asciilifeform: (it also results in a nearly useless node because nothing can ever connect to it)
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: i used it just for syncing!
thestringpuller: it worked just find connecting to ~your~ node for the last month and a half
thestringpuller: once synced it was like "okay i'm done" and just stopped receiving blocks
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: now this is interesting, and i would really like to see the log
thestringpuller: one second
thestringpuller: i really should patch this to rotate logs...
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform dozens of whats ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: of whiners
asciilifeform: who, very reasonably, 'i put in coin and nothing came out, wtf'
mircea_popescu: eh, the whole internet consists of people who think they can do things better than anyone ; and then can't do jack shit to save their lives.
mircea_popescu: let them stop whining and get in the wot, administer receiverships, do things.
mircea_popescu: opining from the side is both free and worthless.
asciilifeform: 'i put in a coin in the coke machine and nothing came out.' ' mircea_popescu: let them go to mechanic school, learn to fix machines...'
hanbot: kakobrekla so in the process of protecting the shareholders from a 17 btc bill, you managed to destroy all their holdings and stick the bettors with a 13 btc or w/e it's going to end up. pretty sucky, innit?
mircea_popescu: exactly.
mircea_popescu: what the fuck, someone stands for the consumer, now ? fuck the consumer.
mircea_popescu: abomination of mistaken history, fuck the consumer with a rusty nail plank.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: glbse was pretty good at fucking the consumer, and gox, etc. these were doing god's work ?!
mircea_popescu: separate issues.
asciilifeform: how's that
mircea_popescu: surgeon and worm both excise dead tissue.
asciilifeform: i mean, did they fuck somebody other than 'consumer', or they fucked with wrong kind of stick, or what.
mircea_popescu: surgeon is surgeon ; worm is worm.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'Царь справедливый и тиран. Не одинаковы бывают. Так хлебопашец и кабан. По-разному поля взрыхляют.' << i found in yellowed vintage volume of transl. of persian poetry to ru, as a kid
mircea_popescu: but i ~am~ well impressed by the proposition. i suppose coming up next is, "asciilifeform and poettering both write software".
asciilifeform: the ploughman and the boar!11
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: unfortunately i haven't found a way to truncate this log
kakobrekla: hanbot lolwat, i managed to destroy? do you recall writing https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=124441.0 (especially point 0)
assbot: So you think you're going to start a Bitcoin business, right? ... ( http://bit.ly/1MVvoFd )
hanbot: yes, i recall
kakobrekla: cool, so you are aware that you cant have responsibility without liability
hanbot: get to the point?
nubbins` lols at hanbot
nubbins`: dat cog diss
nubbins`: <+asciilifeform>https://bitbet.us/bet/1249/alphago-will-defeat-lee-sedol-overall-in-march/#c5867 << there is what, dozen of these, and i dun think they're all nubbins`.. << why does everyone labour under the impression that i think about any of this shit while i'm not here?
nubbins`: i give precisely, literally, zero fucks about anything to do with bitbet, mp, etc
kakobrekla: the point is that i agreed to do bitbet back then as long as mp is responsible and liable for bitcoins (as per thread - i refused to handle them)- which he no longer wants to be
kakobrekla: if there is no liability its much easier to fuck up the coins myself
asciilifeform: kakobrekla: i might be too 'young' for this. how did it go that you 'refused to handle them' ?
hanbot: mm, mk.
asciilifeform: nubbins`: when precisely did you give your last fuck ?
mircea_popescu: in other news video cards can apparently die. who knew.
kakobrekla: asciilifeform we discussed various models of bitbet operations, one of mps suggestions was that i hold the btc and flush the deposits over to him occasionally or somesuch which i refused and suggested he gives me a huge list of his address which i will be handing out
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: nvidia is ~really~ good at death
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: typically bga is the culprit. thermal flex waltzes the balls loose.
asciilifeform: and you only need to loosen one.
nubbins`: asciilifeform in general or on said topics?
mircea_popescu: and replacement is fucking up the monitor. apparently, can't have previous mode because it puts it out of bounds
mircea_popescu: holy shit nothing works.
asciilifeform: nubbins`: on subj
nubbins`: never
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: whaddayamean you don't have 5 identical replacements for every part!111
mircea_popescu: apparently identical is not a thing.
asciilifeform: what kind of dirigible warehouse is that!
mircea_popescu: ikr.
asciilifeform: even asciilifeform has this nailed
mircea_popescu: goody for him ?
asciilifeform: just pointing out, mircea_popescu ought have a stern talk with his supplier.
mircea_popescu: have a stern talk with the notion of computing, rather.
asciilifeform: normally i'm the one who immediately 'notion of computing!11'
asciilifeform: but how does that plug in here ?
mircea_popescu: i'm starting to notice that most insufferable things and people i ever ran across were computers and computer experts.
mircea_popescu: politicians are by comparison pleasant.
asciilifeform: programmer has uniquely unpleasant profession, in the sense that even coal miner enters into a kind of numb routine, but with computer you can be gangbanged into a different orifice that you never knew you had, every day
mircea_popescu: apparently.
hanbot: kakobrekla from the outside, all that's seen is you going gotta protect the shareholders!!1 and a week later the shareholders are fucked...and the customers are boiling. not that i expect you to take responsibility rather than talk about it, but you've fucked up.
asciilifeform: didn't mircea_popescu just explain that the customers are the mold in the cheese and don't really matter ?
kakobrekla: hanbot to quote you: The k factor comes from the specified nature of the business (ie, BTC business). In order to be able to offer BTC business you must at a minimum be able to correctly and safely handle payments.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 87100 @ 0.00041893 = 36.4888 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: let it be stated that i don't wish asciilifeform to be doing any interpreting of what i've said after i'm dead.
hanbot: asciilifeform he said that they're more than welcome to do something other than whine eh?
mircea_popescu: i'd rather alphago do it.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i intend to be dead first !111
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7759 @ 0.00041886 = 3.2499 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: hanbot please enlighten me how and why should i take responsibility for mps double payment of which i was aware of only after the fact?
asciilifeform: unrelatedly, http://gustaf.thorslund.org/src/allegra/doc/allegra.html
assbot: The Allegra Info-Bot ... ( http://bit.ly/1SbRoRh )
asciilifeform: ^ a 'gribble'-like animal in ada.
hanbot: nah, take responsibility for the following thing: "i, kakobrekla, turned the situation where the shareholders owed 17 btc and had credit to repay it in the future, into a situation where the shareholders have nothing, and the bettors owe at least 13 btc, if not more. this is the best i could do, hire me and i'll do the same for you."
nubbins`: there was no situation where the shareholders owed 17 btc
nubbins`: that's a fiction
nubbins`: hallucinated by mp
nubbins`: so, no, he didn't turn a situation from that into anything.
kakobrekla: or maybe mp can go "i, mp, have through a series of mistakes made a double payment and will now pretend it was a chinese conspiracy, say publicly i did it masochistically but actually bill it sadistically to the company as a made up war expense"
nubbins`: you need to take a course in basic logic
nubbins`: kakobrekla i could've told you last week that they'd fever-dream their way through this
nubbins`: must be humiliating
nubbins`: having to blatantly spout nonsense
nubbins`: altho i guess it's mostly a show for folks that don't go back and read the logs
oglafbot: http://oglaf.com/survival/
assbot: Survival* ... ( http://bit.ly/1SbS9Kg )
mircea_popescu: o.O
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla you ~know~ this happened ?
kakobrekla: which?
kakobrekla: i know this http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-03-2016#1436889 ☝︎
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2016 23:21:15; kakobrekla: hanbot to quote you: The k factor comes from the specified nature of the business (ie, BTC business). In order to be able to offer BTC business you must at a minimum be able to correctly and safely handle payments.
mircea_popescu: looky, that nonsense isn't going to snivel into factuality just because butthurt. chinese miner conspiracy is a fact, undisputed and accepted as such.
kakobrekla: surely
mircea_popescu: now then. that you or anyone else "dunno, wasn't there, whatever", it's one thing.
mircea_popescu: but "i dunno, wasn't there, don't believe" does not actually enact anything. it's just the typical position of the scholar withdrawing from the world.
kakobrekla: (surely was sarcastic btw)
mircea_popescu: tough tits, it's what it is.
kakobrekla: anyway, even if ufos delete your private keys you cant just put it on the company
kakobrekla: or else its much easier for me to ufos delete my private keys for it
mircea_popescu: that has exactly nothing to do with the discussion, so let's let it be.
kakobrekla: o but it has.
kakobrekla: if nothing else it brings about a bad set of incentives.
mircea_popescu: looky : part of your trying to cope with hanbot's deriding your peculiar notion of responsibility was to come hide under my skirts. i said plox don't come hide under my skirts. that's all.
kakobrekla: so you are saying you can have responsibility without liability?
kakobrekla: (yes or no answer will do)
mircea_popescu: i am saying that whatever you're talking to her about, stick to it an' let me be.
kakobrekla: will do my best!