assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 13:28:54; asciilifeform: in other news, lee kuan yew is dead
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12250 @ 0.00021681 = 2.6559 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 13:45:18; nubbins`: put another way: those who are unable to judge the character/nature of others are more likely to wish for escape, and their disability follows them to their new life, where they make the same sort of mistakes they'd make at home
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 13:56:10; asciilifeform: reminds me of how when clinton was half-heartedly prosecuting microshit for antitrust violations, some 'think tank' (cato? i forget) had a 'microsoft defense fund' that the public was invited to contribute to !
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22300 @ 0.00023166 = 5.166 BTC [+]
funkenstein_: i just watched "under the dome" documentary on china air pollution
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 14:20:55; asciilifeform: the kind involving armoured trucks, rockets, demolition charges
pete_dushenski: "Get ready to ride in style Singapore, we’ve added supercars to the Uber platform. Starting this Saturday, March 21st, you will be able to request a Lamborghini Gallardo Spyder or Maserati GranTurismo Coupe to come pick you up." << yew moves out, uber moves in.
mircea_popescu: buncha guys broke a coupla 17 yos out of juvenile detention. a
mircea_popescu: amusingly, the guy they were actually there to break out had already escapeds.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 14:22:59; asciilifeform: 'Longo said the case is suspended, not closed. He said the fact that investigators could not find evidence “doesn’t mean that something terrible didn’t happen to Jackie.”'
mircea_popescu: why would anyone partake ? "i am not taking part in your kangaroo mockery. you want to either win or flip again, i dun have time for that"
mircea_popescu: seriously, women want to feel like something (even cancer) would fuck em ? heh
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: gmaxwell's anti-porn/free-speech stance
nubbins`: S.LORDSHIP-GENERAL-PROJECT-FUNDING
decimation: asciilifeform: have you tested the boards?
nubbins`: or, what was it the guy tried to pass off? "the peerage"
☟︎ decimation: well, it doesn't short, and has serial-ly output somewhere, these are good things
decimation: I've been thinking about building a 'geiger counter' rng like herr walker's
assbot: Logged on 23-03-2015 06:08:33; ben_vulpes: <decimation> I just thought of a brilliant anti-'area denial' (to usg term) weapon system. imagine a small turboprop uav ... that can drop its wings and turn into kerosene rocket << why bother with expensive turbomachinery? just use solid propellants...
☟︎ decimation: asciilifeform: did you get the remote u-boot console working?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6350 @ 0.00021568 = 1.3696 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: ^ latest in tradition of people doing this
decimation: it's an utterly crippled version of 'linux' with all the crud stripped out
decimation: "Uh, many. It's currently text-only, its IP stack isn't functionnal and will have to be partly rewritten, privilege-checking isn't implemented, it can't handle more than one hard drive..."
decimation: my daughter loves to watch Кро́т cartoons now
decimation: somewhat related, apparently you can order books, music, dvds from amazon.de for 3eur + 3eur per kg shipping (to the us)
brendafdez: This is weird, do I lose cloak when using the web interface? :/
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13800 @ 0.00021322 = 2.9424 BTC [-]
brendafdez: what does it mean I lose logging? local logs? bc I do see it in the online log for the channel
Adlai: brendafdez: identify before joining the channel and you'll be cloaked
Adlai: even better, use sasl (Auth to services: ☑)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10350 @ 0.00021321 = 2.2067 BTC [-]
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 246.32, vol: 19197.38270643 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 247.456, vol: 13466.6437 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 246.32, vol: 64980.74454729 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 249.99, vol: 47.82915974 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 243.810164, vol: 199545.78660000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 247.04008, vol: 29.82396973 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 247.8613, vol: 143.09772369 | Volume-weighted last (1 more message)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14600 @ 0.00021305 = 3.1105 BTC [-] {2}
mod6: alright, new droplet created for x32 deb6 testing.
☟︎ gribble: Error: You haven't asked me a command; perhaps you want to see someone else's more. To do so, call this command with that person's nick.
Adlai: ;;more BingoBoingo
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20900 @ 0.00021457 = 4.4845 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19400 @ 0.00021655 = 4.2011 BTC [+]
mod6: x32 OpenSSL built: requires adding -m32 flag to ./Configure & setting: SSL_ARCH_TYPE=linux-generic32
mod6: will work on bdb & boost... will publish findings/changes to mailing list when complete...
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yeah you did say, and yeah i guess pretty much everyone honestly trying has figured out the same thing, if not necessarily apt to express it.
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> where it apparently strips flags one added manually to .config << ahahaha
mod6: ok statically linked bitcoind x32 version built & pulling blocks.
mircea_popescu: <brendafdez> No bitcoin payoutsa, however << a) nothing surprising about it and b) everyone wants to get as many btc as humanly possible before having to admit it.
mod6: it's 1 change to the auto.sh file, & have to have the 3 vars at the top set correctly. I'll post a copy of this auto.sh, a diff to the 64 bit version and a diff to the original portatronic version yet tonight.
mod6: > 15000 blocks & counting...
mircea_popescu: this is why i don't like reading orlov. the propaganda angle doesn't bother me as much, but the millitant, sheer ignorance does.
mircea_popescu: find a fucking count that was allegiant to a duke in the entire history of feudalism.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10805 @ 0.00022068 = 2.3844 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: i am willing to bet, on the strength of that diagram, that his disneyland notions of "feudalism" preclude him even knowing WHEN in time this happened
mircea_popescu: protip : no, it's not 1550, that's the cinquecento in italy, feudalism is already dead and rotting everywhere.
mircea_popescu: russia did not exist. the various duchies were not even feudal ffs.
mircea_popescu: by the time anyone cares about this feudalism was long defeated.
mircea_popescu: in any case : counts as in, counts palatine, counts of the hre, etc, were sovereign.
mircea_popescu: dukes did not by and large exist, unless you mean dux, which was a leader of fucking cataphracts
mircea_popescu: marsh lord, what is known as marquis, actually outranked counts at court, chiefly because being the lord of a marsh he had much more legal power than the head of settled land
mod6: ok im gonna stop this thing, rebuild one more time for good measure, then will create diffs & publish.
mircea_popescu: "here's what i remember of this bad translation of a phenomena by some people who didn't live it, and who are so far from me culturally i in turn have no idea. let's make an infographic and educate reddit."
mircea_popescu: decimation landgraf aka margrave aka march lord is a post-feudalist construct
mircea_popescu: "about half the power a count used to have back when the counts of belgium dominated france, for to protect the country borders"
mircea_popescu: (march = marsh = border, in this understanding. strips of marginal and thus uninhabited lands)
mircea_popescu: anyway. the peak of feudalism is around the peak of things like the tournoi as a public sport.
mircea_popescu: it was ending just as the hansa was coming into its own.
decimation: The German titles of Landgraf, Markgraf, and Pfalzgraf bei Rhein are in the same class of ranks as Herzog ("duke") and above the rank of a Graf ("count").
mircea_popescu: decimation before long you'll be looking into subtle distinctions such as between "king of germany" and "king in germany"
decimation: Herr Fredrick took the "of" for himself
mircea_popescu: but basically, feudalism and metalwork almost look as a zero sum game : as the latter develops the former fades
mircea_popescu: this is like saying bows were replaced by submachine guns. well... no. at absolutely no point had people using bows encountered people using submachine guns.
mircea_popescu: perhaps an argument can be brought for places like sicily cca 1930, but it is still very tenuous.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the problem with using a language is that you're stuck using it according to itself tho. this is like, orlov horribly mauled a teenaged girl and you're like "well clearly the bear thought her cunt's salmon."
mircea_popescu: this may be true, but the girl's still pretty badly bloodied.
decimation: polish calvary charging the motorized wehrmacht?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26066 @ 0.00021246 = 5.538 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: decimation that cavalry was not feudal tho. prussian military.
decimation: fredrick inspired much socialistoid bureaucracy too
mircea_popescu: the centralised state can only be a centralised state after all.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10235 @ 0.00021359 = 2.1861 BTC [+]
decimation: my male line lived under the landgraf hesse-homburg for at least 400 years
mircea_popescu: "A new system of economic relations was brought into being, based on money that could be generated at will, in the form of debt" << this is EXACTLY unrelated to capitalism.
mircea_popescu: for most of the industrial revolution, late 1600s to early 1900s, this view was exactly not held.
mircea_popescu: moreover, as late as during ww2, the west thought the war is mostly about preventing exactly that.
mircea_popescu: i mean shit, you can't go around conflating everything you don't know about for chrissakes.
decimation: And in fact there was a rear-guard action, launched in May of 1944, just before the Bretton Woods Conference, by a group of influential New York bankers, who very much hated the Bretton Woods agenda. They offered to lend Britain at least $3 billion dollars after the War, in return for which Britain would walk away from the Bretton Woods Conference. Clarke and others in the British Treasury wanted to pursue this idea. But Keynes would
mod6: pulled over 70k blocks
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 300 @ 0.00354894 = 1.0647 BTC [-]
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 247.2, Best ask: 247.23, Bid-ask spread: 0.03000, Last trade: 247.25, 24 hour volume: 65365.6785161, 24 hour low: 241.39, 24 hour high: 267.49, 24 hour vwap: None
mod6: it seems a bit silly to post a patch also back to the original portatronic version for this. anyone have any objections if i just publish a full copy of the 32bit auto.sh and a patch of auto.sh to the previous version (v0.0.5 included in the -RELEASE) ?
[]bot: Bet placed: 1 BTC for No on "Silver at or over $22/oz before October"
http://bitbet.us/bet/1132/ Odds: 55(Y):45(N) by coin, 55(Y):45(N) by weight. Total bet: 3.665139 BTC. Current weight: 99,430.
BingoBoingo: Ah, we're unthreading all of the vocabulary today!
danielpbarron: that's it? i thought maybe it patched stuff in the source or something
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14728 @ 0.00021005 = 3.0936 BTC [-] {2}
mod6: going once... going twice ... SOLD! to the man with 3 letters and integer in his nick
mircea_popescu: so to conflate "modern idiotic usgtronics" with "capitalism" which in turn conflates with "everything minus stone age, feudalism, and the soviets" is...
mircea_popescu: "teach the faux controversy mayhap people forget shit doesn't have tyo be eaten"
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron there wouldn't normally be huge differences.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12633 @ 0.00020725 = 2.6182 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: so basically no os whatsoever builds on these things ?
decimation: keynes threw england into the shitter just so he could 'win at the game of life'
nubbins`: "Two SATA 2.0 ports with integrated PHYs"
decimation: one sign that nobody is rich today is that nobody could possibly dream of floating the national debt of england
nubbins`: or a sign nobody's been that poor before
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform> nubbins`: one's a phantom limb, i think << Phantom limbs got me much less excited about the latest Sun hardware I'd been investigating when the problem of keeping a post 2016 blockchain would have been a big challenge. (IDE limited to sub 127 GB, USB 1.1, and Firewire ports unsupported in OS of choice which means gambling on PCI USB 2.0 card working for moar storage)
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> does - would you believe - accelerated xor. << megalol
BingoBoingo: In other news I discovered apparently firefighting trains exist
nubbins`: might be something of interest there
BingoBoingo: sheevaplug seems to be different beast for reasons only Vishnu knows
BingoBoingo yet to try .foundation build as spec'd, mostly has moar weird in his plan pipeline
nubbins`: gzip: /proc/config.gz: No such file or directory
nubbins`: which is what i followed to get my pogo up and running
nubbins`: but i think the guide i used was for 3.18
gribble: What do you think I am, a shell?
nubbins`: i thought i accidentally pasted twice when scrolling down to pastebin submit button!
nubbins`: "for GoFlex Home/Net, Pogoplug E02/Mobile/V4, iConnect, Dockstar, Sheevaplug, NSA320, NSA325, Topkick, and all other Kirkwood plugs that are already in the mainline"
nubbins`: in other words, bring your own scissors :0
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17314 @ 0.00021445 = 3.713 BTC [+]
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 247.58, Best ask: 247.72, Bid-ask spread: 0.14000, Last trade: 247.97, 24 hour volume: 65174.61242121, 24 hour low: 241.39, 24 hour high: 267.49, 24 hour vwap: None
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18300 @ 0.00021445 = 3.9244 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: perhaps pogolinux is actually just OS/2 with gratuitous text substitution?
BingoBoingo also learned today all of his most exotic fire extinguisher ideas have largely been incorporated into class D fire extinguishers already except for the DU based supressant idea
BingoBoingo: And the carbon tetrachloride fire extinguishing grenade
BingoBoingo: JetA puts out fires pretty well though provided you are flicking a cigarette butt into a bucket of JetA most of the time
BingoBoingo: God dammit, coyotes are back already this year
nubbins`: he's got config files going back to 3.8.11 fwiw
nubbins`: so you didn't need anything from that patch file?
nubbins`: actually, looking at the pogoplug-related entries in that patch, it's all trivial stuff
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16476 @ 0.00022407 = 3.6918 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: (in the sense of having a miserable memory leaking low cost node)
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 01:20:19; mod6: alright, new droplet created for x32 deb6 testing.
nubbins`: have the eject button send us a message on irc or something
nubbins`: ah, i thought the purple logo'd one did
trinque: up to the operator to deploy updates later?
BingoBoingo: <trinque> 0.5.3.1 is perfect? << C doesn't do perfect
trinque: bet you could tell it about updates just like deedbot
nubbins`: asciilifeform: my pogo has an eject button :S
nubbins`: granted, it doesn't *do* anything atm
nubbins`: but it's at least a real button
nubbins`: no. pressed it like 5x to make sure
nubbins`: if we end up jamming the os onto the nand, you could have it scan SD cards on insert for patches
nubbins`: danielpbarron's project if anyone's 8)
nubbins`: far be it from me to assume ;D
nubbins`: i'll have 3 at some point this week
nubbins`: i've got some nebulous plans to kit-ify these & sell em
nubbins`: some sort of vinyl sticker would be easiest/cheapest
nubbins`: you wouldn't even need to apply the sticker yourself, people like doing that stuff
BingoBoingo: Does anyone have a python script for computing the odds of adult male of supplied height and weight versus (Y) pack of coyotes if armed with a tack hammer?
nubbins`: you'd want solvent inks to silkscreen on that, and yuck
nubbins`: it's too bad the name is already stamped into the top
nubbins`: you could laser a byline or smth tho
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7399 @ 0.00021258 = 1.5729 BTC [-]
nubbins`: anyone here have a lead on custom injection-molded plastics?
nubbins`: recall fake bomb detector story, the one thing the guy always brought when he ran was the tooling
mod6: <+asciilifeform> and i think mod6 had a bunch << naw, don't even own one yet.
trinque: my pogo's promised to me by the 3rd
ben_vulpes: <nubbins`> mod6 i should stress that *none* of the hardening options are included in that makefile, and it really should not be used for anything other than reference << see, reference y'all
ben_vulpes: it's a subtle rapier, not a thing for use in anger.
ben_vulpes: don't ask me what everyone doesn't know
ben_vulpes: i do this regularly, but in what scenario today?
trinque: right, you'll want to check them against each other before making the leap
trinque: asciilifeform: will also be useful to out any fuckery of the phoundation client later down the chain
ben_vulpes: i don't understand what's so special about 'tandem operable'
nubbins`: there's no POSIX standard for bitcoin
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> you can't postpone everything until everything else just like you can't have everything louder than everything else. << i think i found where this started
nubbins`: whoever survived the first time they tried the signatures was deemed an expert and dispersed throughout the other units
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> ben_vulpes mod6 what do you two figure is a realistic timeline for "bitcoind version that doesn't allocate memory without checks and so doesn't crash in THAT particular way" ? << this actually raises the all-important question of priority list
ben_vulpes: i get to strike #1 off the foundation todo list!
ben_vulpes: nubbins` pre-release regression testing is pretty dumb-dumb right now
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: right hang on let me diddle this text for a second
ben_vulpes: anyone who runs without -connect is asking for it in the arse.
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 04:21:10; trinque: up to the operator to deploy updates later?
ben_vulpes: what does that even *mean* asciilifeform?
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 04:29:57; asciilifeform: at the very minimum, development units ought to have it
mircea_popescu: once they make a 4gb unit for ~25 we'll think about it ?
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 04:33:41; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu iirc had some
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and now you gotta add gpg and debug it and srsly...
mircea_popescu: no dude. you're trying to raise the engineering bill by 1000s of dollah to save pennies.
assbot: 1 Pallet of PogoPlug Personal Cloud, New Condition, 100 Units, Retail $2,100, LaVergne, TN, PLT186057 | Closes: Oct 16, 2014 12:00:00 PM PDT | Essex B2B Liquidations ... (
http://bit.ly/1CX4PQN )
nubbins`: mircea_popescu not as easily as a box of tees 8)
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 04:35:44; asciilifeform: i was considering lasering mine
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 04:37:57; nubbins`: anyone here have a lead on custom injection-molded plastics?
mircea_popescu: it's not even just that. gotta make sure it correctly takes and verifies the sigs now. etc etc.
mircea_popescu: it's not just opioidis and nubbins`, it's also overengineering
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 04:46:57; ben_vulpes: i do this regularly, but in what scenario today?
nubbins`: if you wanted to do the acrylic slab + posts thing like the bitseed or w/e node
nubbins`: you could put whatever lid on the pogo you wanted
ben_vulpes: ;;later tell brendafdez yo you know anyone renting bikes at not retarded tourist prices?
nubbins`: slab+post case could hold the heat sink too
nubbins`: until you dropped it on a corner anyway
nubbins`: colored logo could be easily removed
nubbins`: alf will sleep the sleep of the just
ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> seems that's 64 bit only now o.O << ahaha in between this line and my logreading mod6 posted a patch
mircea_popescu: was keeping my fingers crossed for it being just you know, two lines and a whistle.
ben_vulpes: <nubbins`> we're assholes, yet here we are trying << "a for effort"
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> (fwiw, my father informs me that this custom was unknown in his unit, and only expert was trusted with wrapping chutes) << Many ground pounders in the extended family, slosest one to using chute at all broke ankle on helachoppa repel
gribble: Current Blocks: 349129 | Current Difficulty: 4.671754964470642E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 350783 | Next Difficulty In: 1654 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 2 days, 20 hours, 17 minutes, and 8 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 52321389587.7 | Estimated Percent Change: 11.99515
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 00:37:43; assbot: Logged on 23-03-2015 06:08:33; ben_vulpes: <decimation> I just thought of a brilliant anti-'area denial' (to usg term) weapon system. imagine a small turboprop uav ... that can drop its wings and turn into kerosene rocket << why bother with expensive turbomachinery? just use solid propellants...
ben_vulpes: and you can take fifty of them with you in a backpack...anywhere.
assbot: ButterNubber comments on An entire US school district is having its whole network held hostage for a 500 bitcoin ransom. The FBI and Homeland Security are getting involved. ... (
http://bit.ly/1GifYv8 )
BingoBoingo: Or Coindesk/buzz could stop inflating the typical numbers ransomeware demands
ben_vulpes: just had a "don't blame the hackers" conversation.
ben_vulpes: "two decades of malicious microsoft sales. you have to expect the attacks, and the schools are simply the widest-open targets."
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: Schools used to tend towards Mac fo a reason and that was Nvir vs all those damn DOS & Windows virii
BingoBoingo: SO, brainstorm, could anything real be within 4x as fast as fundnations headers only?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I have no backing for that brainturd. Just inundating el braino with tequila given seekrit mission otd.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 14:41:46; mats: ive personally confirmed with schneier - in person - and have second-hand confirmations by others who have interacted with recipients of leaks
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 14:51:20; mats: look, i'm putting my skepticism on the record. if there was evidence, it'd look like 'Tor Stinks' or the slides from Der Spiegel's work on the Belgacom pwnage. i'm not saying that Dual_EC_DRBG doesn't have obvious flaws or that anyone should continue using it, but my skepticism regarding it being an intentional backdoor remains
mircea_popescu: but importantly, your skepticism, while amply affirmed, is not supported by anything else. so you're skeptical of x theory, as an aesthetic matter. good for you. what's that do ?
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 14:54:16; fluffypony: I think it's very hard to tell the difference between mistake and malice.
mircea_popescu: but for the fate of a random usg muppet ? dude, burn him down, his name won't even be remembered.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 14:55:51; fluffypony: DJB believes secp256k1 is broken
BingoBoingo: More suspicious than niggers.o as a library function?
mircea_popescu: on the other hand, Daniel J. Bernstein is merely going by ec2, which is based on cm field discriminants / laders and indistinguishability
mircea_popescu: none of these seem, at least superficially, to be directly relevant to the usecase.
mircea_popescu: particularly the ladder... so it's not a montgommery curve. so what.
mircea_popescu: the cm field issue is probably the most concerning, and if there's a baked in backdoor (something like, say, nsa is able to directly see through maybe 10% of all keys ever generated ?) that's where it'd be, that 3= -1 * 3≈ -2^1.6 property it shares with weak curves like bn(2,254) etc.
mircea_popescu: well alternatively a) deedbot b) set the damned timer.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 15:01:59; asciilifeform: yes, some crypto designers make mistake, they are good people, sure, whatever. i will borrow from slavoj žižek and say then 'we put them to a good wall, shoot them with a good bullet from a good gun, and bury them in with a good shove in the good earth' - since sure, they are good people.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 15:05:28; asciilifeform: that from -tolerasty- comes poettering & crew.
midnightmagic: BingoBoingo: sorry.. what? lactation and salt paranoia?
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 15:13:34; mats: show me the motherfucking evidence! you mean to tell me these bureaucrats decided not to commit anything to paper this go-around?
Adlai: re: montgomery ladder, you can implement constant-time secp256k1, but it's a pita
BingoBoingo: midnightmagic: Oh, I was jsut supposing risperidone as an alternative to grains of salt
mircea_popescu: not sure it's particularly a point of interest for bitcoin for that matter.
Adlai: (this seems to be djb's real reason behind discounting curves without a *convenient* constant-time algorithm)
mircea_popescu: 256k1 fails VERY hard on what are more relevant criteria.
BingoBoingo: Someone pkg_add for qntra and claim words/shares
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 15:35:34; nubbins`: this place has done more to fundamentally change my thought processes than six years at university
nubbins`: i know, and all they gave me was a b.sc.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 16:22:37; mats: the claim i'm most concerned about is that the weakness was engineered by NSA, and that, by having approved it, NIST was complicit, thus casting doubt on all other NIST standards
mircea_popescu: nist specifically is hostis humani generis due to that and similar mishaps.
BingoBoingo: Everything about NIST that isn't pure time sucks
BingoBoingo: Even then Rubidium standards are cheap. Run Ntpd as Stratum 1.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 16:27:38; mats: leaving us with no real basis for actually figuring out the situation.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 290 @ 0.00347999 = 1.0092 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: the point of a functioning intellect isn't to make one one with the universe. the point of a functioning intellect is to make it impossible for the universe to make itself one with one.
mircea_popescu: as in, i don't think so i can go wallow in the mud. i think so the mud can't come wallowing on me.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> as in, i don't think so i can go wallow in the mud. i think so the mud can't come wallowing on me. << I wasted years 19 to 27 with the contrapositive here pls don't make the mistake
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 16:47:19; pete_dushenski: on one end is disinterest, a la paris or w/e, on the other end is entitlement
mircea_popescu: you wouldn't complain that the strippers don't wait on tables properly, would you ? as a woman ?
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> you wouldn't complain that the strippers don't wait on tables properly, would you ? as a woman ? << Serious labor problem here in the Middle West. Strippers aren't table servers
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 16:50:29; nubbins`: how much of your own time do you waste on maybes?
brendafdez: I was just approved to join the linux for women mailing list. In the welcome email I'm both reminded that 'what happens on list stays on list' (no archives or sharing) and they also say literally "You must know your password to change your options (including changing the password, itself) or to unsubscribe. It is: XGx4#KmI#HeF%P7C^ Normally, Mailman will remind you of your linuxchix.org mailing list passwords once every month, alt
brendafdez: hough you can disable this if you prefer. This reminder will also include instructions on how to unsubscribe or change your account options. There is also a button on your options page that will email your current password to you."
brendafdez: I like it when they tell me right away that their security is crap. So I don't have to wonder. Here, hashed what?
pete_dushenski: speaking of which, turns out that bitcoin atms can actually make a buck!
gribble: I have not seen adamobrien.
gribble: adam_obrien was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 4 weeks, 3 days, 3 hours, 48 minutes, and 11 seconds ago: <adam_obrien> I have to run here, if any of you need Bitcoin give me a ping adam@btcsolutions.ca
pete_dushenski: ^we had coffee today and apparently one of his lamassus did CAD$25k in transactions last month. at 8% commission
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 17:04:54; nubbins`: anyway tl;dr their approach works well enough for them
pete_dushenski: he has a couple other too, none do quite that well but i was reasonably impressed that he hadn't lost his shirt
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 17:14:37; pete_dushenski: this is assuming it wasn't hacked, shot down, etc.
mircea_popescu: those imperialistic dreams of the papal states were apparently never extinguished!
pete_dushenski: well i for one would like to see what the argentinian in the big house could muster as far as a military goes
pete_dushenski: he's in far better condition to charge into battle than the hitler youth opa
mircea_popescu: battle i dunno about, but off tune melee for a few hours - sure.
mircea_popescu: 'According to reporting, "1.6 percent of developers earn more than the other 98.4 percent combined. And the bottom 47 percent of engineers earn less than $100 per month." << o chjecxk it out asciilifeform! as jurov sayz, clearly this isn't working o.O
mircea_popescu: note that out of that 1.6%, about 1.5% is state-sponsored crapolade a la zynga. leaving the other 0.1% with an accidental 55k this year, which is barely enough to you know, pay rent.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 18:03:12; ascii_field: or do words have no meaning to him
pete_dushenski: nationalist workerbee. best defense against meta problem!
BingoBoingo did not know I was tone deaf until admited to US college as music specialist
pete_dushenski: you'll just have to trust me that i'm a decent singer then.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo most people that i've seen karaoke fit this boring midwestern 30something so-so woman type.
mircea_popescu: to the point in my head it connotes that, like bingo connotes old jewish women
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> BingoBoingo most people that i've seen karaoke fit this boring midwestern 30something so-so woman type. << But that's easy mode to getting your dick wet. It works
pete_dushenski: cheek-pinching connotes stereotypical old jewish women for me
BingoBoingo: I dunno that I've ever met an old jewish woman
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 18:15:00; funkenstein_: i refuse to admit that any creature would pay for an app
pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo: some are sneaky. you may have met one and not known it.
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: I've met plenty of young jews and gotten along fine. The mythic old jews are something else
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 18:21:31; trinque: best thing about gossipd is probably going to be writing software around it
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 06:59:23; BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'm pround of pete
assbot: You rated user pete_dushenski on 08-Jul-2014, with a rating of 2, and supplied these additional notes: Pimp..
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: I thought I rated you earlier. If not leave a not. I'm too pickled atm to access important keys. Insufficiently skilled at the knife.
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 18:24:31; ascii_field: nubbins`: payware costing money is by far the least significant problem with it, in my experience
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6200 @ 0.00021785 = 1.3507 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: lol there's little more amusing than seeing people try various fringe ideologies on b-a.
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: That would involve untrusted 3rd parties
mircea_popescu: dudes you should totally not eat meat and use free software!
BingoBoingo: brendafdez: Certain classes of drugs have a history of being very effectual on me, but most drugs dropped in drink I have a strongly trained cross tolerance to.
pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo: well, i'll bug you another time i guess. i just tend to strike when the iron is hot, even if the iron is also blackout wasted.
Adlai: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 237.14, vol: 21462.80141475 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 235.98, vol: 15570.03822 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 236.01, vol: 76464.99214271 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 244.0, vol: 54.30174294 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 233.579688, vol: 199715.62230000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 240.0, vol: 37.55828405 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 242.7126, vol: 148.46250756 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)
BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: But when the backbody is emitting in the IR spectrum>
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00021785 = 1.416 BTC [-]
pete_dushenski: "Jordan has signed a $10bn deal with Russia to build the kingdom's first nuclear power plant, with two 1,000-megawatt reactors in the country's north." << someone is actually building nuclear reactors these days.
BingoBoingo: <pete_dushenski> "Jordan has signed a $10bn deal with Russia to build the kingdom's first nuclear power plant, with two 1,000-megawatt reactors in the country's north." << someone is actually building nuclear reactors these days. << /me remembers when King Hussein was the "Good Guy" (TM)
assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 20:01:21; thestringpuller: ascii_field: snore for now, but if they start selling, they lower barrier to fork.
mircea_popescu: you don't seriously imagine the rasbperry pi 150 dollar node a) can achieve critical mass or b) can support gavincoin ?
mircea_popescu: a is a non starter because their demo is reddit demo = poor people. it has to be free or no dice.
mircea_popescu: all that thing's doing is a more expensive, less useful, bitcoin node.
pete_dushenski: i'm guessing that china, russia, india reactors are in-house worx
BingoBoingo: I support thestringpuller's idea that it could be dangerous because how much can it cost USG to rack 3 tons of banana pi's
BingoBoingo wonders if anyone else here remembers when the Library marketed LOCKSS solution was based on OBSD
BingoBoingo: When did I say dangerous in this convo tonight?
mircea_popescu: <BingoBoingo> I support thestringpuller's idea that it could be dangerous <
BingoBoingo: I was just asking if people remember a distributed memory safe system beign abandoned.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> <BingoBoingo> I support thestringpuller's idea that it could be dangerous < << Ah, I'm just thinking he might have a better measure of the enemy's pulse.
mircea_popescu: dude look at that graph, mpoe fell of a cliff in slow motion.
mircea_popescu: someone been playing teh big bad wolf ? i hope i haven't disappointed by not being impressed ?
mircea_popescu: cazalla im not so sure about "differnent site". in any case same quantcast codes, so...
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> cazalla im not so sure about "differnent site". in any case same quantcast codes, so... << SHHHHHH.... same atm
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18950 @ 0.00021896 = 4.1493 BTC [+] {2}
brendafdez: <BingoBoingo> Feel free to ask in chan why Bingo loves the Motorola 68K chips
BingoBoingo: lol, because I can play mario on my calculator
BingoBoingo: The -89 did algebra if you put it in right...
brendafdez: i never got algebra, it was like as far as i can write notes, the calculator is ok for me
brendafdez: i'll feel dumb discussing it here, now i regret moving to chan :P
BingoBoingo: Algebra spans a spectrum from HS math to Gimme meth Imma not Erdos
brendafdez: what i know is that i failed every single exam in my life which had word algebra somewhere
brendafdez: consistent results, always miserable utter failure
brendafdez: back then i thoguth i was oing to study engineering but this made me change my mind and say, ok... maybe law will be easier, less numbers, no algebra. Sadly no calculator to cheat either.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27473 @ 0.00022178 = 6.093 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo thought was going to be mathmagician, downgraded to teacher, to lawyer, to librarian
brendafdez: i ended up just being a pretend bitcoiner
brendafdez: didn't last more than a year in law school either, although it was in fact easier than math
BingoBoingo nevar made it from applied to law student in spite of 178 on LSat assumed to naturally shady to be a lawyer
davout: yeah, touch me i'm french
davout: fish & chips is british, all the rest was invented by the french
cazalla: i hear brendafdez has got a baby in es.qntra.net
cazalla: hop to it, your shares await brendafdez
brendafdez: <brendafdez> I always take a long time before I do anything, so as to be sure that I won't fail to disappoint everyone involved.
mircea_popescu: brendafdez better get out of the defensive shell of stupid and work your butt off, i think.
cazalla: i'm catching up on logs so i'm sure i'll get to that discussion soon
cazalla: mircea_popescu, oh? i thought she was quoting herself from an earlier conversation or something
BingoBoingo a liter in deeper than when I last touched the skunkswork project
mircea_popescu: cazalla i was thinking btw, on the general principle of translations. what do you think of a model where translations, be they en to es, or es to en or cn to en or whatever they may be count for half the shares ?
BingoBoingo: It isn't like I plan to battle syphillis anytime soon again
mircea_popescu: also, articles written by drunk people only counted for 13.37% of normal wordage?
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> cazalla i was thinking btw, on the general principle of translations. what do you think of a model where translations, be they en to es, or es to en or cn to en or whatever they may be count for half the shares ? << +10%vote unless that is horribly uneconomical
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29500 @ 0.00022406 = 6.6098 BTC [+] {3}
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> also, articles written by drunk people only counted for 13.37% of normal wordage? << Also totes fair
davout: mircea_popescu: half the shares of the original article? or half the shares of the translated piece? i'd say the former makes more sense
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> BingoBoingo what's +10%vote mean ? << You and cazalla are 20% a piece I throw my 10% behind translations, because we aren't fucking Cointelegrah with seperate US and UK press releases
mircea_popescu: the first time today i sat here and couldn't figure out a problem was when i tried to parse davout's proposal. brain just can't cope.
cazalla: BingoBoingo, they have indian and greek too now!
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo so you're thinking translation more like 2/3 ?
BingoBoingo: I thin translation is between 1/2 to 2/3rds. A full 1 if from strange to Eng
cazalla: i really don't see the issue with matching it 1:1 on the basis translation is useful, es not as much as cn but still
davout: mircea_popescu: some languages are much shorter than others, dutch is much denser than french for example
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo the thing is, if you give them parity you'll end up with you know, hungarian translation of 500 qntra articles diluting you to shit.
cazalla: but then seeing i can only speaka da english , i am prolly not qualified to "opine" on such matters lol
mircea_popescu: cazalla so then let them be 1:1 but only allow basically es, en, cn and mebbe portuguese ?
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> BingoBoingo the thing is, if you give them parity you'll end up with you know, hungarian translation of 500 qntra articles diluting you to shit << Editors discretion. Fucking hungarian sucks, not a lang
mircea_popescu: and before you dismiss that, you should see what fucking tits & ass lean tall blonde stuff they produce!
cazalla: why would we want anything other than spanish and chinesey?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I hurd they were on US feminist diabeetus diet
cazalla: but other than that, those are top 3 next to english i assume
mircea_popescu: but prolly portuguese > spanish, on account of... well... brazil is like > south america.
cazalla: oh russian.. here we go, give an inch..
mircea_popescu: russian, japanese right ? then all the arabs will get pissy because why do we pick the one or the other ?
BingoBoingo: I could see placing spanish well before portugese because fuck brazil if they aren't waxing
mircea_popescu: but i don't think we can go "all bitcoin happens in english fuck you"
Adlai: put it to shareholder votes. want more incentive for translations in your language? gotta pay to have a say, like in 'real' politics
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo brazil is waxing yo. and btw, general point : girls get their tit implants age 16 down here.
BingoBoingo: I think we focus on trade languages of En ES and Fu
Adlai: those who want more compensation for translators to some language, must buy shares in order to have their voices heard/regarded by the editors
brendafdez: <mircea_popescu> brendafdez better get out of the defensive shell of stupid and work your butt off, i think. << oops ;)
Adlai: (or they earn their shares the usual way)
cazalla: <BingoBoingo> I could see placing spanish well before portugese because fuck brazil if they aren't waxing <<< so muff is ok ya know
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I am totally fine with the En language space surrendering except as a pidgin used in trade. If you let a single slant language into the acceptable trading space though. I sense trouble. Don't know of, but anticipate
BingoBoingo: Muff gives my beard something to socialize with
mircea_popescu: cazalla he just doesn't want hair in the asshole is all.
cazalla: but they poop from there, so i don't care, not going near butthole either way
mircea_popescu: fun fact : most large felines don't know how to shit as infants, so the mother licks their asshole to stimulate bowel movements.
mircea_popescu: think your life sucks ? at least you're not mom jaguar.
cazalla: i can just see you as the romanian vers of it's only smellz
mircea_popescu: (this, incidentally, works in constipated human infants too.)
BingoBoingo: Same kinda happens for primates, you ever seen reddit and momma chimp
brendafdez: black kiss, just what the doctor ordered
BingoBoingo: I just think it is too early to surrender to the chicoms. Even though I could prolly bang out a qntra.chicom in 45 minutes if I wasn't so pickled atm.
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 09:13:35; brendafdez: what i know is that i failed every single exam in my life which had word algebra somewhere
BingoBoingo still takes the LSAT on commision for select bidders
BingoBoingo is sure most people's best chance at passing the bar is hiring me to ident as them through law school
BingoBoingo has never scored lower than 176/180 on the LSAT. I am the full package law school Fast Forward button.
mircea_popescu: so you could get me a law degree just in time for lawsky being extradited to serenissima jurisdiction so i can da myself personally ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8543 @ 0.00021886 = 1.8697 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10400 @ 0.00021643 = 2.2509 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Pretty much, so long as you offer me an identify that does not have a history of long term use of lamotrinine of chloro-amphetamines
BingoBoingo: I prolly should. Not enough people take it up in English.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5100 @ 0.00021505 = 1.0968 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: cazalla: You never write for students, you BE the students
cazalla: sounds like a lot of effort
cazalla: how well can a student pay you for pretending to be them?
cazalla: and good luck getting rolling down drunk and turning up in person, at least you can do online tests and write for them at home while drunk
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Have I ever told you about my GRE story?
cazalla: BingoBoingo, i don't even know what GRE is so, no
mircea_popescu: let some dude show up for you in exams today, be cited for 198 gang rapes next tuesday
cazalla: but if it's you turning up blind drunk and acing a test, i'd believe it
BingoBoingo: <cazalla> but if it's you turning up blind drunk and acing a test, i'd believe it << Since 1998 when the injun store stopped carding me
cazalla: BingoBoingo, ya know i use to get carded when i was 16, but i was smart enough to know the guy working at the bottle shop probably couldn't subtract my age from the current year, so he would glance at my provisional drivers licence and ring up my drinks no probs
cazalla: means something else where you're from eh mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu had a drink at his junior high prom. which was held in a bar. because romanians didn't actually give a shit.
BingoBoingo: * mircea_popescu had a drink at his junior high prom. which was held in a bar. because romanians didn't actually give a shit. << Wait Wut, you only had one drink at prom? Junior year I was trying to keep pace with Anya.
cazalla: BingoBoingo, ease up, he's a light drinker
mircea_popescu: that's kinda the thing, if it's not a big deal it just... isn't a big deal.
mircea_popescu: cazalla heh notrly. my high mark is putting away something over a liter of 50% moonshine and then walking out.
mircea_popescu: i suspek that makes me a heavy drinker, at least at the time.
BingoBoingo: Drink is totally not a big deal. In the same way standardized tests in the US are not a big deal. The cost to pass maximally is trivial.
cazalla: i suspek gypies sell non-alcoholic wine to young romanian men as american's sell oregano to the teens :P
cazalla: yeah my opa use to make it, locked him in the cellar once, such a hiding for that one
cazalla: the funny thing is, i could've left him in there but i was so frightened that i opened it so that he could beat me
cazalla: prob had war flash backs or something, he went fkn bananas
mircea_popescu: romania (at least the nw, where i'm from) is all about this particular plum distilate.
mircea_popescu: most respectable older men run their own stills, and they usually leak and are in basements
mircea_popescu: so when it's firing time... buncha very drunk dudes that swear they didn't drink a drop
cazalla: banned here, unless for extracting essential oils
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29700 @ 0.00021789 = 6.4713 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: romania (at least back in the day) was this place where nothing could be banned.
cazalla: and whenever some dudes die from the methanol they produced, they make a big deal of it in the media to warn of the dangers of diy at home
mircea_popescu: the very notion that the govt would tell you what to do or not do... lol.
mircea_popescu: actually, distilling fermented fruit can not yield methanol. it's ancient and perfectly safe at that.
cazalla: mircea_popescu, must be making something else then, i have nfi, just hear in the media now and again
mircea_popescu: i think you gotta boil wood before you get crap like that.
cazalla: "Initial reports about the four men's methanol poisoning suggest it occurred when they tried to concoct grappa, a grape-based brandy."
cazalla: prob for the best i don't bottle my own, i'd be in perpetual state of drunkedness
mircea_popescu: they probably tried to "concoct grappa" out of office chairs or something.
mircea_popescu: seeing how one hundred thousand people made their own for decade upon decade without ill effect.
cazalla: well, if one is going to eat plastic food, may as well drink plastic too
mircea_popescu: anywya, if memory serves there's a good 10-20 degrees differential between ethanol and methanol boiling points.
mircea_popescu: even if you start with a 50-50 mixture, keep the still open at ~75 degrees for half an hour, then you can just let it burn and collect the result.
jurov: heh. my parents themselves started to give me wine.. at 15 or so :D
jurov: <mircea_popescu> actually, distilling fermented fruit can not yield methanol << wait what???
BingoBoingo: <jurov> <mircea_popescu> actually, distilling fermented fruit can not yield methanol << wait what??? << It totally can
jurov: i have held in my hand plum methanol, wtf if mircea up to
BingoBoingo: jurov: He has an idealistic image of the old country
BingoBoingo: I've drank 98+ proof corn whiskey aged right with minimal fusile alcohols. Everyone wants their tradition to be the saint
jurov: "for example apple juice can have 0.2-0.3% methanol, or if derived from pulp by enzymatic degradation, the levels can be 2 to 3 times higher."
mircea_popescu: jurov there's two things : one, what you use and how you ferment it. two, how you distil.
mircea_popescu: but historically, methanol is "wood alcohol". ie, if you try to distil roadkill and old boots, you get a lot of it.
jurov: yes but that's very different from "can not yield"
mircea_popescu: otherwise, properly fermented plums specifically are so and so.
mircea_popescu: well i was talking of the traditional process as used, not of whatever random strange one may try.
mircea_popescu: you know these things get highly traditional / fixated.
mircea_popescu: but in any case : methanol has significant lower boiling point. which, again, means that even if you start with an equal part mixture, if you distil correctly you take it all out.
BingoBoingo is awfuly sure unregulated corn distillation products self has consumed in the past conatained far below te mandated fusile alcohols of the nao
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15150 @ 0.00021505 = 3.258 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20192 @ 0.00021756 = 4.393 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4711 @ 0.00022073 = 1.0399 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5863 @ 0.00022484 = 1.3182 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: According to the 2002/2003 census, 143,167 farms had plum trees bearing fruit covering a total area of 554 km². According to the same census, about 75% of the crop ends up as țuică.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25700 @ 0.00022792 = 5.8575 BTC [+] {2}
chetty: <mircea_popescu> According to the 2002/2003 census, 143,167 farms had plum trees bearing fruit covering a total area of 554 km². According to the same census, about 75% of the crop ends up as țuică.//only 75%?
Adlai: so 'eris' is... a database? an application server? does GenDoug support Hybrid-Flex™ blockchains?
danielpbarron: Adlai, it's a block chain with mining restricted by a centrally controlled key
danielpbarron: that is, blocks are only accepted as valid if they meet the difficulty requirement *and* are blessed with the magic key
danielpbarron: and that's supposed to eliminate the need for there being a currency
danielpbarron: to which I ask, why even use a block chain? it's like cloud storage with unneccessary drawbacks
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17400 @ 0.00022821 = 3.9709 BTC [+]
Adlai: decentralization theater :P
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10104 @ 0.00022497 = 2.2731 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: guess they hope to sell mining equipment with the key baked in
jurov: and thus dip both ends
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18150 @ 0.00022214 = 4.0318 BTC [-]
kyuupichan: danielpbarron: What do your messages saying "Height H1 vs H2" mean exactly?
danielpbarron: i'm running two pogos, one with a solid state drive, the other with a 5400 rpm drive
danielpbarron: i knew solid state would be faster; just seeing how much faster, and if 5400 rpm drive is a reasonable option
danielpbarron: i think it would take about a year for a 5400 rpm drive pogo to sync with the network
danielpbarron: i haven't caught up on the logs yet, maybe these issues were covered already
mod6: So can you explain what you're builing, what version of auto.sh, what OS, did you change anything? what arch?
mod6: if you tried to build that version of auto.sh on an ARM arch, then i can see why you had issues.
danielpbarron: emerge: there are no ebuilds to satisfy "libssl-dev".
nubbins`: headers.h:20:28: fatal error: openssl/buffer.h: No such file or directory
danielpbarron: my pogos are currently running a bitcoind that i compiled myself
danielpbarron: emerge: Maybe you meant any of these: virtual/libudev, dev-libs/libsolv, dev-libs/libsigsegv?
nubbins`: is buffer.h anywhere on your system>?
nubbins`: might be an include path issue
danielpbarron: i thought this is supposed to download a specific version of ssl and use a local copy
nubbins`: and your bitcoin/src/makefile.unix
nubbins`: heck, skip pastebin and danielpbarron.com them
nubbins`: openssl is the first dep that should get downloaded and compiled, so if it's halting there it's probably a path issue
mod6: i've never used gentoo before, but if this still a problem/not-resolved by the end of the day, I'll try to setup a new droplet and test the auto.sh changes there.
nubbins`: danielpbarron here's a snippet from the last chunk of text you shared
nubbins`: -I/home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.5th/ourlibs/include -I/home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.5th/ourlibs/include -I/home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.5th/ourlibs/include
nubbins`: that's trying to include the same dir three times
nubbins`: which might indicate that it's failing to parse something after /include
nubbins`: i had to modify makefile for osx because all the path stuff wasn't resolving, your gentoo might have similar prob
nubbins`: actually all three of your attempts show the same thing
nubbins`: (might be totally not the issue but worth examining)
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 246.34, Best ask: 246.48, Bid-ask spread: 0.14000, Last trade: 246.46, 24 hour volume: 71535.64113155, 24 hour low: 235.7, 24 hour high: 252.94, 24 hour vwap: None
assbot: Logged on 21-03-2015 04:52:20; mircea_popescu: but to belabour the point : one of the principal reasons "measuring iq" as it were height is so ridiculous, is because nobody has yet had an off day for height.
nubbins`: danielpbarron sweet, how about makefile.unix from 5th
assbot: Logged on 21-03-2015 04:30:25; mircea_popescu: at any rate : expecting human behaviour to be addressed by genetics is a little like expecting food to be discussed by chemistry.
PeterL: and yes, there are chemists who specialize in food chemistry
nubbins`: there were behaviourists who specialized in genetics 8)
PeterL: but are there geneticists that specialize in behaviour?
Adlai: there's a gene for smoking all the way down to the filter
Adlai: which is derpspeak for statistical correlation between certain genotypes, and that phenotype
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14275 @ 0.00022539 = 3.2174 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: <danielpbarron> to which I ask, why even use a block chain? it's like cloud storage with unneccessary drawbacks << this pretty much
mircea_popescu: <jurov> guess they hope to sell mining equipment with the key baked in << wouldn't this necessarily leak it ?
jurov: no rake is forever
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27350 @ 0.00022567 = 6.1721 BTC [+]
nubbins`: danielpbarron: add these two lines to your auto.sh, right below "export LDFLAGS=" at the bottom
mircea_popescu: <PeterL> I would say most of food is pretty well described by chemistry already << you have no idea.
PeterL: you think there is some mysterious undescribed part of food?
nubbins`: actually maybe preface with: echo "looky loo"
mircea_popescu: pretty much the only thing chemistry describes about food is that it has no hope in hell of describing it, and here's some alternatives that 90% of people can't distinguish
nubbins` points out that "artificial flavor" and "natural flavor" can be chemically the same molecule, but must be labelled according to origin
mircea_popescu: PeterL didn't we have the discussion with the complexity of aminoacids ?
mircea_popescu: nubbins` this "chemically the same molecule" ... i can distinguish peppers and capsein.
nubbins`: i can distinguish marijuana and pure thc 8)
PeterL: what about them? chemists can say what they are, but might not be able to recreate them in the lab
mircea_popescu: human taste is sensitive to ppb in some lines. smell easily to ppm.
nubbins`: protip: the smell of nice marijuana is precisely the smell of thc
mircea_popescu: nubbins` sure, soime cases are more advantageous than others. now go distinguish a glass of wine from another glass of wine, chemically.
mircea_popescu: your competent oenologist can usually spot the year and most of the time the vineyard. not the region mind. the vineyard.
PeterL: sure, you can identify the differing concentrations of various chemicals
nubbins`: everyone's seen a sommelier identify the vineyard by taste
mircea_popescu: PeterL no, you can't actually, because a glass is not enough sample.
nubbins`: now take a glass of house red and a glass of $5000/bottle red and ask the guy to do a blind taste test.
nubbins` has admittedly never drunk wine costlier than $500/bottle but can verify that all the superfluous descriptors on the label are actually present
☟︎ nubbins`: "it DOES taste like oiled leather and rustic tobacco"
mircea_popescu: if you had a cistern to run through, and a few years and an infinity of budgets, you maybe could get something sorta usable some of the time. which is about wheree it is.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17000 @ 0.00022567 = 3.8364 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: at any rate : most actual foodstuffs, such as pickles, cheeses, cured and aged meats etc aren't even flora-enumerated, in the sense that we don't even really know what all grows on them
PeterL: aren't pickles just cucumbers soaked in vinegar?
mircea_popescu: pickes are cucumbers fermented in a saline solution in the dark and cool.
mircea_popescu: the vinegar thing is an industrial product and at best cattle feed.
nubbins`: brining and fermenting is an art
mircea_popescu: not that i'm contesting the importance and corectness of whatever, maillard, what have you. but nobody who looked at the matter seriously is claiming the problem to be even described
nubbins`: this kimchi i'm working through could strip paint
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8725 @ 0.00022038 = 1.9228 BTC [-] {2}
nubbins`: but yeah, mp has it. you can take a stab at the /types/ of organisms or compounds therein
nubbins`: but that's about as close as it gets
nubbins`: like, i know my kimchi has lactobacillus strains
mircea_popescu: moreover, the variety of bacteria is actually staggering.
nubbins`: ostensibly different ones than are in my sourdough.
PeterL: but chemists have a general knowledge of what goes into good food, unlike geneticists who have very little idea what goes into intelligence
mircea_popescu: PeterL but geneticists have am uch better idea of what goes into phenotypes.
nubbins`: incidentally, coffee is up there with wine as far as variety of chemical compunds goes
nubbins`: coffee plantation was the first time i ever saw (and smelled) a smell sample kit
nubbins` prefers wet-processed coffees, which means -- you guessed it -- fermentation
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10550 @ 0.00021505 = 2.2688 BTC [-]
nubbins`: sometimes i feel like i've changed my gut flora enough that it's modified my brain chemistry to strongly desire stinky, fermented things
nubbins`: other side of the coin is that i've stopped indulging in mcdonald's and plastic food for long enough that the natural desire to eat /living food/ has come back
danielpbarron: i thought it might have been because i was still using my own script to patch 0.5.3, but the pre-patched 0.5.3.1 i tried also failed (that was the omitted 6th attempt
jurov imagined a dystopic flick featuring people with GMO gut flora living off all kinds of waste
jurov: i suspect such uncanny adaptations will be necessary for space, too
PeterL: I have entertained the idea of trying to implant gut flora from herbivores to allow us to live off grass, could be fun, no?
jurov: what fun? chewing all day?
PeterL: I've also wondered what would happen if we implanted chloroplasts in our skin, just live off sunlight?
nubbins`: danielpbarron so $OURLIBS resolves to /home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.7th/ourlibs
nubbins`: $OPENSSL_LIB_PATH resolves to /home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.7th/ourlibs/lib
nubbins`: ^ not sure that's drilled down deep enough
jurov: hardly chloroplasts. more likely figure out symbiosis with some sort of algae.. and i suspect it would not cover even significant part of metabolism
jurov: mostly worthwhile to synthesize vitamins and the like
nubbins`: danielpbarron your 7th halts at a different step, hey?
mircea_popescu: <PeterL> I've also wondered what would happen if we implanted chloroplasts in our skin, just live off sunlight? << toxic epidermal necrolysis much more likely./
nubbins`: bottom chunk: see 2nd line in paste
nubbins`: ...failed updating 163 targets...
nubbins`: i think your problem might start a bit earlier?
chetty: <mircea_popescu> <PeterL> I've also wondered what would happen if we implanted chloroplasts in our skin, just live off sunlight? << toxic epidermal necrolysis much more likely./// and poor vampires
nubbins`: danielpbarron compare to first paste, failed updating 1 target
mod6: danielpbarron: headers.h:26:20: fatal error: db_cxx.h: No such file or directory << did bdb get built ok?
mod6: you may want to do like one at a time: Comment out 77-95 (for BDB) & 97-119 (for Boost) and just see if you get a clean build from OpenSSL. Then if so, comment out 58-75 (openssl) and uncomment 77-95 for BDB and just run that... etc etc.
jurov: fatal error: db_cxx.h: No such file << that's known issue on gentoo, you have to add -I <bdb path>
danielpbarron: yeah, i think i remember doing that the last time i went through all this
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24900 @ 0.00021536 = 5.3625 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9875 @ 0.00021873 = 2.16 BTC [+] {2}
jurov: okay, but be sure to implement faster deposits :>
nubbins`: mircea_popescu hey who knows, maybe there'll be an osx build some time this summer
nubbins`: instead of just mousing around the login screen with no kbd input :D
mircea_popescu: moldavian count. famous pop singer of the 20s. after which, took up clay pigeon shooting, and became world champion 4ever.
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 04:13:16; asciilifeform: (it croaks, having no meaningful rootfs, but that's for tomorrow)
danielpbarron: on a related note, i'd like more specific info on how to make my own u-boot
danielpbarron: i'm not sure what asciilifeform recommends for this
danielpbarron: my adulterated pogo behaves strangly, sometimes it uses stock u-boot and sometimes it uses some thing i flashed to it, and i'm not sure why it changes
nubbins`: that covers flashing nand with u-boot
nubbins`: not quite roll-your-own, but...
assbot: 2014.07 U-Boot for FDT and Non-FDT Kernel - GoFlexNet, GoFlexHome, PogoE02, Dockstar, iConnect, NetgearStora, PogoV4/Mobile, Sheevaplug, NSA325, NSA320 ... (
http://bit.ly/1CP4myD )
danielpbarron: ...failed updating 1 target... << this happens when i use the prepatched 0.5.3.1, the looky loo outputs correct paths
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6000 @ 0.00022567 = 1.354 BTC [+]
nubbins`: danielpbarron at the risk of being silly, does db_cxx.h exist in /home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.7th/ourlibs/include
nubbins`: okay, so that's why that step can't find it :D
nubbins`: working backwards, next step is to modify auto.sh
nubbins`: comment out everything in auto.sh but the chunk where it builds bdb
nubbins`: then run it, see what errors it throws
danielpbarron: oh weird, it does exist in there when i try with the prepatched 0.5.3.1
danielpbarron: this is output when i use the 0.5.3.1 release and the patched for 32 auto.sh
nubbins`: haha actually sorry, the pastebin i linked above has 1 error
danielpbarron: so i'm the dummy that didn't realize he had a 64 bit cpu and put 32 bit OS on it
nubbins`: fwiw if you've got 3gb ram i guess it doesn't really matter
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron don't worry, you also put 64 bit on the 32 bit arm.
mircea_popescu: (also, 32 bit os should work on 64 bit hardware, compatibility mode)
nubbins`: i have no arms, and i must flail
danielpbarron: dpb@iscah ~/bitcoin/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1 $ ./autobdb.sh
ben_vulpes: you'll see that if you run ./auto.sh more than once, non?
danielpbarron: this is a different one than the one that didn't have the db_cxx.h
danielpbarron: (which is what i have been doing up until this point)
nubbins`: <+danielpbarron> this is a different one than the one that didn't have the db_cxx.h <<< ah
nubbins`: maybe you should start from scratch just so we can stay focused
nubbins`: it'll be a bit of a pain, but if you can comment out your auto.sh so that it only builds one component
thestringpuller: danielpbarron: i've done the same thing tho. i only had access to 32bit windows for my gaming rig, and i have to wipe the entire thing to install a 64bit version.
nubbins`: then comment out that one, uncomment the next, etc
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11552 @ 0.00022637 = 2.615 BTC [+] {2}
nubbins`: it'll be easier to spot which builds fail
danielpbarron: it seems to find all three of openss, boosts, and db
nubbins`: yeah, find is one thing, build properly is another
ben_vulpes: swinging sticks at each other in the muddy courtyard
nubbins`: hey, the best swordsmaster who ever lived was bested by a farmer with a quarterstaff
nubbins`: ^ rabbit hole if anyone's into reading dead trees
danielpbarron: on the openssl part, it ends with this: Makefile:640: recipe for target 'install_docs' failed
nubbins`: while docs generally aren't crucial, i wonder if that stops some later process from happening
danielpbarron: oh also, should i be using the patched for 32 auto.sh if my cpu is 64 but my OS is 32 ?
nubbins`: if you try running a 64bit program on a 32bit os, you're gonna be sad
danielpbarron: in my "ourlibs" directory, it looks like there are only doc files
nubbins`: ourlibs is where things get put as they're compiled
nubbins`: if you're only doing the first step, ourlibs won't be fully populated
nubbins`: here's the Makefile from openssl
nubbins`: install: all install_docs install_sw
nubbins`: you could remove install_docs from that line if you wanted
nubbins`: might be easier than figuring out why the docs won't install
nubbins`: failure of install_docs might preclude attempt at install_sw
nubbins`: (who in the fuck installs the docs /first/?)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20650 @ 0.0002306 = 4.7619 BTC [+] {3}
ascii_field: danielpbarron: i'd like more specific info on how to make my own u-boot << i have a u-boot built from official source. the buildroot thing -also- builds a u-boot, as a matter of course, but i have not yet tested that one
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: no, nodes don't get updated << so, let's go into this in detail. they ship with all the seed ips they will ever have? for the record i proclaim this to be retarded. -keys- are the constants of our world, not ip addrs
ascii_field: i utterly understand the desire to 'tivoize' these things so they don't get turned into phoundation nodes by lamers. but this can be done without idiot waste.
ascii_field: once the twentybux boxes run out (and i expect that it will happen sooner rather than later) prepare to pay six times more for each node.
ascii_field: right now some bezzlatronic idiot is paying the difference
ascii_field: (the vendor is selling a loss-leader, hoping to attract chumps to its 5/mo. 'cloud' crapolade)
nubbins`: i think a lot of it is genuinely overstock too
ascii_field: likewise physical delivery is expensive. (witness kakobrekla's attempt to buy so much as one pogo and still have it 'feel disposable')
nubbins`: physical delivery, for me, bottoms out at ~$10usd
ascii_field: so, what, we're expecting operators to throw out perfectly good boxes to add a fucking seed node!?!
ascii_field: turning an ip address into a critical constant in a field-deployed machine paints a big fat target on that ip for usg
ascii_field: one of the few things usg is reliably good at is making a particular ip unusable
nubbins`: my ip address will be fine to use as a seed node, but it /may occasionally change/
nubbins`: and is thus useless for inclusion in a baked-in
nubbins`: now, i can gpg-sign my ip address and publish it somewhere when it changes
nubbins`: in fact, i can almost certainly have this process be automatic
ascii_field: and mircea_popescu will say 'bah, unreliable, you're driving up engineering cost 1000 times'
nubbins`: gpg and curl, at the very least
nubbins`: where's the seed list now, in a fucking .c file or something?
ascii_field: can't rely on anything on the net staying put
ascii_field: SIGNED update would have to be on attached storage
nubbins`: the list'll be stale by the time someone gets a box
mthreat: after the land of chipotle
nubbins`: there's gotta be a sane way to do this over the wire
ascii_field: nubbins`: silent wire updates are ipso facto insane
nubbins`: altho otw explicitly means you're not examining anything
ascii_field: user is free to examine the (signed) update on his own time
nubbins`: so this is all agreed, anything that can be modified should be signed
ascii_field: not proposing anything idiotic, e.g., it being ciphered in some way
nubbins`: this brings us back to the seeds
ascii_field: nubbins`: i am trying to knock some sense into the folks taking the 'no updates, throw'em out every time' folks
ascii_field: (who don't appear to be logged in at present, but, still)
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 05:08:35; mircea_popescu: serviceable 19 dollar units ? gtfo.
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 05:10:32; mircea_popescu: forget it, you want to upgrade get a new unit.
nubbins`: until you hardcode a thousand seed ips
nubbins`: and a week later they're all dead in the water
nubbins`: and there's you with half a blockchain
ascii_field: except they won't be dead, they'll be hosting phoundation syblics
ascii_field: and i disagree with mircea_popescu's hypothesis that 'enemy is stupid'. he is not stupid. he is being slow, so as to show off his sprezzatura.
nubbins`: this is getting dangerously closer to bringing the whole seed thing back to first principles, you know
ascii_field: give or take a few months, enemy starts to bark up the vaguely-correct tree.
ascii_field: nubbins`: ultimately the first principle is that pubkeys are the only valid locators for anything purporting to be human
ben_vulpes: i may be wrong and stupid, but i'm willing to be corrected and learn
ascii_field: i was objecting to hardcoding of seeds -by us-
nubbins`: what sort of handshake happens when you find a live ip in the seed list
ascii_field: warning that if we bake machines with unchangeable ip constants, this paints a fat blinking target on them
nubbins`: you can't locate someone with a key
ben_vulpes: so if i might be forgiven for conflating things, should not any subset of the wot graph be able to use their own keys?
ascii_field: this is where you gotta make the call re: how much centralization you want.
ben_vulpes: if we're to entertain updating, operators *must* be able to update without foundation keys.
ascii_field: and where mircea_popescu wakes up and says 'now the machine is 1000x more complex, needs to know what wot is'
nubbins`: suppose you get a box and then start suspecting we've been turned.
ben_vulpes: perhaps must be supplied with keys on initial flash
ascii_field: to tivo or not to tivo, that is the question
nubbins`: now you're stuck with a box with OUR keys being the arbiter
ascii_field: why would someone buy a box from therealbitcoin when he suspects we've been turned ?
ascii_field: i'm fine with him having to buy a new box -then-
nubbins`: let him buy a banana cream pi or w/e
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: user-flashed possibly, from vendor state, but not into a configuration that is reflashable in the same idiot (remote exploit) way
nubbins`: fuck it, get it to scan a random /16 for .foundation nodes on first boot
nubbins`: sure, it'll take a couple days humming before it starts getting blocks
ascii_field: scan a random /16 for .foundation nodes << wai wat
ascii_field: how do you propose to distinguish friend/foe ?
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: he use the phrase '.foundation nodes'
ascii_field: implies that these can be told apart from others
ben_vulpes: and it'll remain that way until the block download thing is fixed to a) track node quality and b) spot-check blocks provided by high quality peers
nubbins`: you can't have visible to users but invisible to usg
nubbins`: anyway, consider the statement suitably modified
ascii_field: ultimately the only proper box is one where the only magical constant is an rsa key, and same key is also prominently burned into the chassis
nubbins`: i'm sure we all have at least a reasonably narrow range of IPs that'll be assigned to our nodes, even if they're dynamic
ascii_field: my isp is a mega-conglomerate which owns and uses multiple slash-eights
ben_vulpes: and shouldn't this discussion be looking at ipv6 as well?
nubbins`: lel, total country bumpkins here re: ip blocks obv 8)
ascii_field: ben_vulpes: i recommend strongly against ipv6 in this machine
ascii_field: multiple known bugs revolving around mostly untested ipv6 crud
ben_vulpes is a total country bumpkin re: anything combudder
ascii_field: i recall at least one that concerns marvell in particular
ascii_field: i don't even have ipv6 enabled on my lan, much less outgoing.
ascii_field: even if nothing else, complicates reading packet dumps
ascii_field: which any reasonable person does regularly
ascii_field: at the risk of pissing off many, i will still say, screw ipv6
nubbins`: hardcode DNS servers and fill the seed list w/ hostnames instead of ips
ascii_field: usg has real time iron control over all of dns.
ascii_field: this is right back to phoundation's idiocies.
nubbins`: well i'm not running a namecoin node
ascii_field: nubbins`: don't need to (and same problems apply to it)
ascii_field: the only way to cut usg-controlled apparatus entirely out of the loop is to have the node get all volatiles (e.g., ip addrs) from files, on inserable media, -signed- by burned-in and prominently-advertised key.
nubbins`: how many ips (or live ips, if you prefer) in current seed list?
nubbins`: i think this is on the ml somewhere..
jurov: if seedlist is to be signed, then it can download it automatically, no?
nubbins`: so according to this, six live seeds would ostensibly be enough to bootstrap with
ascii_field: the only reason they are alive (and are they? i checked a good while ago) is that no one cared.
nubbins`: in the meantime, we've been using a different six since we sent out the first X units
ascii_field: there will be considerably less cat'n'mouse if enemy -knows- that there can be no effect from chewing on the mice
ascii_field: and the only way this could be so is if there are no magic hardcoded ips.
ascii_field: or have it administratively forced to rout to ft meade
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021375 B (Total: 467.44 B). Delta: 0.31 B. Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.000207 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX:F.MPIF] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: / / ( shares, BTC), 30D: 0.000207 / 0.000207 / 0.000207 (1000 shares, 0.21 BTC)
nubbins`: ascii_field so what's the path from rsa key -> seed node
ascii_field: nubbins`: node ships with no seeds. even without bitcoind binary. user inserts a storage unit on which he has placed a therealbitcoin-signed tarball. this gets eaten up.
nubbins`: any seed list made public by any means is a target
nubbins`: us cloaked ones forget about ddos lurkers in here
ascii_field: nubbins`: yes. but -how attractive- a target, will depend on how much damage can be done to our cause by shooting at it
ascii_field: hence the sheer lunacy of unchangeable ips anywhere
nubbins`: at this rate you're gonna have to get in the wot before someone tells you a seed ip
ascii_field: nubbins`: bitcoin doesn't run on secret ips
ascii_field: but there is a reasonably sane solution that doesn't involve secrecy
ascii_field: but simply 'we can move these at zero cost to us and ours if we want to, so don't bother shooting at them'
nubbins`: foundation could publish a list of trusted seeds each month w/ state of the union
nubbins`: also woot, 2x raspi & 2x pogo just showed up
nubbins`: seed list is in a source file?
nubbins`: unit comes w/ instructions for use, that includes grabbing both the bitcoind tarball and a seed list tarball of choice
ascii_field: try to see, i don't suggest hosting therealbitcoin mega-seeds on dynamic ip consumer boxes
ascii_field: the movability is like nukes, shouldn't ever have to be -used- - with any regularity
ascii_field: it must be there to remind the enemy of his helplessness
nubbins`: so the switch from phoundation seeds to foundation seeds must happen after said pipes are tapped
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5115 @ 0.00023349 = 1.1943 BTC [+]
nubbins`: i try to use .foundation when they're not both in the same sentence 8)
nubbins`: gonna try the SD-for-block-storage route on one of these
nubbins`: still haven't found a reasonable purple-logo unit source for canada
nubbins`: although i suppose i'm sort of being an asshole by saying $28usd isn't reasonable
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14850 @ 0.00023234 = 3.4502 BTC [-]
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 04:18:28; asciilifeform: nubbins`: pogo4 has no buttons
ascii_field: danielpbarron: at first i though that the rear button was a cpu reset line
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6700 @ 0.000232 = 1.5544 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 17:13:12; punkman:
http://blog.samaltman.com/bubble-talk "This bet is open to the first VC who would like to take it . The loser donates $100,000 to a charity of the winner’s choice." meh
mircea_popescu: what's with the charity bs and what's with the sub million bs. is this the new jersey memorial golf circuit ?
mircea_popescu: (for poor people reading : "donating to a charity" = tax deduction = you didn't actually spend anything. because say my company has made 1mn revenue this year, and my tax accountant is bs so i have to pay like 120k in tax. if i donate 100k to a charity and pay 30k ish im all done. so therefore - whether i lose this bet or not decides whether i write a check to x or to y, not whether i write the check at all.
mircea_popescu: "donation to charity" is what rich people do to make poor people think something happened.)
mircea_popescu: and dealing in sub-million units is really like proposing to settle differences by wager of battle, "except let's use styrofoam weapons". totally dude, rad.
ascii_field: for extra mega-b0nus, the 'charity' is run by phriendz/childrenz/catamites of the 'donor'
mircea_popescu: considering how the entire subculture is composed of nothing but "transhumanists"
thestringpuller: ascii_field: so russian d00d works on implmentations team. he was in the break room and we go up to him to ask him random question about rapper or something, and he's like "I don't have time for this shit. Are you paying me to answer this question?"
ascii_field would likely demand pay to answer such a question
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 300 @ 0.00349371 = 1.0481 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14750 @ 0.00022722 = 3.3515 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Logged on 20-03-2015 04:12:53; mircea_popescu: "Jerm La Haine: I’ve been doing music production and graphic design for just under twenty years now."
nubbins`: what makes me think this guy is 25
danielpbarron: he claimed to not know who whoever someone here compared him to
mircea_popescu: and to round up the "sam altman is poor" thing : yes, he actually is.
mircea_popescu: leah goodman poor, which is to say he gets a few 100s of discretionary tspending a week and gets to - at the lord's pleasure - inhabit a decent mancave. for now.
mircea_popescu: and it his isn't poverty, i guess i'm just privileged.
mircea_popescu: nubbins` the ugly but aging sex in the city aspirationalist that "found satoshi's identity". then ascii_field thought she was rich then she wasn't.
mircea_popescu: if you b-a her name it's all in there because she's one of those (unfamous, anon irrelevant people that appear suddenly and on one topic. as opposed to say lenin.)
ascii_field has a possibly different imagination of 'rich' than mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: you know, stupid people sleep ad libitum by the definition of those terms.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: do they? or does the dependapotomus and its six screaming offspring wake'em
nubbins`: i generally wake the roommates, not the other way around 8)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5800 @ 0.00023317 = 1.3524 BTC [+]
punkman: " Is this your only job? No. I have a full time job changing the world."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16931 @ 0.00022409 = 3.7941 BTC [-]
trinque: punkman: hah I just quoted that part myself
trinque: looks like uh... twitter social thing, part 2352580238
trinque: "I've always felt as if my brain was always wired for a short circuit or at least in a way that wasn't too appealing for anyone else but me.
trinque: Ideapod has given me courage to share my insights with its delightful community and made me realise that the problem wasn't my personal content, but my personal context. "
trinque: yep given the right spotlight, any hag becomes irresistable
trinque: that's what I just learned
trinque: get enough of those together and "progress concentrate" starts to form, which can be bottled and sold at Whole Foods
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9946 @ 0.00023349 = 2.3223 BTC [+]
ascii_field: 'my targeting computer was programmed not to fire at usg'
ascii_field: anybody recall the gps-boobytrapped cnc mills thread
ascii_field: 'We as a company own all of the machines. There is no outstanding balance and we've already had the tech come out to unlock them. Due to some business changes, we want to move the machines around the shop floor to reconfigure our machining cell however as we've done more research, we've found that there is a small board in the electrical panel of the machine that houses a gyroscope so that if the machine is moved/tilted,
ascii_field: ^ vintage thread. but reposted for the record
ascii_field: this is what usg-mandated code looks like.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75438 @ 0.000236 = 17.8034 BTC [+] {6}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15826 @ 0.00025392 = 4.0185 BTC [+]
jurov: <fluffypony> Romania: Internet vs. Roads << slovakia the same
mircea_popescu: <assbot> The User is Drunk ... << why not go all the way and admit it. "the user is stupid, therefore worthless. so am i. please pay me money because worthless idiots are people too. HUMAN RIGHTS ARE IRREVERSIBLE!!11"
mircea_popescu: trinque oddly that thing doesn't load any content for me. either im not drunk enough or you broke it.
mircea_popescu: nubbins`> batorade (tm) << secreted by the batshit insane ?
nubbins`: it still rhymes with gatorade!
trinque: mircea_popescu: you're not missing anything
mircea_popescu: anyway, the "Copy machine money" : this is a sad necessity. if it weren't present, muppets WOULD "try it", and discover "it works", and srsly financial collapse. for real.
trinque: the great canon pixma revolution of 2018
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: they did try, and result could only fool a muppet
ascii_field: and it takes some actual work to bleach a 1usd note to get anything like plausible paper for benjie
mircea_popescu: check it out, bitcointalk scams fooled tons of "early adopters", "world changers" etc.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field im talking money cut out of a fucking notebook.
mircea_popescu: ;;google christina applegate buys a car with kellog's cornflakes cutoutsd.
ascii_field: (phun phact for non-u.s. folks: all u.s. dollar notes have exactly the same physical dimensions.)
mircea_popescu: ascii_field i don't get it. who would "buy" such a thing ?
mircea_popescu: we're not talking 100 bucks for a piece of plastic here.
mircea_popescu: 'We as a company own all of the machines. There is no outstanding balance and we've already had the tech come out to unlock them."
ascii_field: i thought mircea_popescu was asking why a firm would purchase rather than lease the machines
ascii_field thought that mircea_popescu was asking why the machines are offered for purchase rather than, as often happens with such equipment, for lease
trinque: should've sued instead of just thanking the tech for restoring access to their property
mircea_popescu: trinque im thinking the same, this is something readily resolved in court.
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 17:37:53; ascii_field: ben_vulpes: no, nodes don't get updated << so, let's go into this in detail. they ship with all the seed ips they will ever have? for the record i proclaim this to be retarded. -keys- are the constants of our world, not ip addrs
trinque: how hard would it be to break the accelerometer?
nubbins`: gzip: turdel.gz: not in gzip format
trinque: mircea_popescu: someone should have a business doing aftermarket mods on these
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: what about it << it being in a usg-blessed region
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 17:39:09; ascii_field: i utterly understand the desire to 'tivoize' these things so they don't get turned into phoundation nodes by lamers. but this can be done without idiot waste.
mircea_popescu: they need imaginary hardware to support their imaginary "technologies"
ascii_field: ^ my puny brain does not get the meaning of this
mircea_popescu: usgavin's been on a kick about this imaginary hardware that will run his 200 trillion jiggabit nodes.
ascii_field: neh from my perch it looks like they're gearing up for an elementary meat war of conventional nodes
mircea_popescu: understand : they can stand on their fucking head. "vote" ? what fucking vote ?
mircea_popescu: heck, i'll vote WITH them on the voting stage of things
mircea_popescu: this is not a discussion of anything but the hard laws.
mircea_popescu: so : yeah, usg&friends thinks it's engaging me on its own terms.
trinque: is it just a matter of preserving the existing chain?
trinque: not "winning" in the sense of a fork?
mircea_popescu: it does not work. might as well grab the moon with a tweezer
trinque: because they become incompatible, then go off to eventually die?
nubbins`: ascii_field oh wait this is just a blob, isn't it?
mircea_popescu: "i wonder why that doesn't work, the allignm,ent was perfect!"
ascii_field: nubbins`: it's just a demo kernel for pogo
ascii_field: nubbins`: armv5 binary. nothing earth-shaking
nubbins`: brainfarted and thought you mentioned smth about a uboot being in there
ascii_field: and in case anyone needs to be reminded, please don't use downloaded binaries for anything serious
nubbins`: i was about to flash the nand when i recalled a nebulous something about this
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: if i understand, the meaning is that there is no phoundation node ?
ascii_field: this still doesn't give us a license to be retarded when making these
mircea_popescu: there can not be a power ranger node that can run on a pogo.
ascii_field: actually, i can see them trying to convert'em to 0.10 or what it was
mircea_popescu: but if you imagine there's any room in the spec of this thing for the end user to fiddle with it you're ourgiht nuts.
trinque: mircea_popescu: yeah thought in the shower today that giving an easy way to dump other code into the thing later was a terrible idea
trinque: all the thing has to do is hold the line
ascii_field: they -will- be ddosed and sinkholed to usg machines.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14500 @ 0.00025269 = 3.664 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: wtf people. srsly. if anyone WANTS TO run a pogo they can
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: 20bux + a man with a suitcase to bring it to you, if you're in ar
mircea_popescu: fuck the third world with a spiked club. if it wasn't made by retards it wouldn't be third.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: if we're so non-thirdworld, where's my ic fab ?
ascii_field: fact is, 101st or 202nd pogo, whichever, will cost $maxint.
mircea_popescu: the mexican billionaire w/e his name is has his own ic fab made out of driewd cunt juice./
ascii_field: so we're thirdworld. or we wouldn't be playing junkyard wars.
ascii_field: thestringpuller: we're repurposing obsolete hardware
mircea_popescu: but anyway : forget argentina, and forget the anecdotal peculiarities of my odd choices in things.
thestringpuller: ascii_field: this seems more like battlebots than junkyard wars. (Junkyard wars reminds me more of ed edd and eddie which was pretty much all junkyard hacking"
mircea_popescu: this is a consumer product, it works like a consumer product. once it stops working it gets thrown out.
mircea_popescu: it is not an item to be loved, dreamed about, repaired, tuned etc.
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: i get this. but we're dealing with a fundamental case of amplification attack.
ascii_field: enemy can cost us K by spending J, where J is close to nil and K is positive
ascii_field: they ddos the magic ips - or worse, silently redirect to own boxes
mircea_popescu: for the cost of this project, i wish to see large scale ip diddling
ascii_field: just for mircea_popescu's pleasure they will do straight sinkhole
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5400 @ 0.00025269 = 1.3645 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: dja see how the fucking attacked ips are actually more valuable than the damned pogos ?
ascii_field: at any rate, -we won't know- that it's pointing to usg boxes emulating our nodes
ascii_field: there is no mechanism for distinguishing a correctly operating node from one that will be until day X
ascii_field: the fucking attacked ips are actually more valuable than the damned pogos << they are not valuable because we can never prove they exist
mircea_popescu: because they only exist halfway, like competent usg and able nsa ?
ascii_field: 2) usg redirects them to exact copies of our own boxes sitting in ft meade
ascii_field: 3) ages pass and we notice nothing. they switch theirs off when ours go off, etc. direct mitm
ascii_field: 4) on day X they turn on the mitm diddlamatic and do... something
mircea_popescu: ft meade gets to look like a kiddy pool i took a piss in
nubbins`: so deploy them with magic ips and "check here monthly for updated seed list, the walls have eyes, sam is in the trees, etc"
nubbins`: the original seed list is a "here"
ascii_field: precisely why i didn't say 'network update'
nubbins`: (and there, and there, and there...)
ascii_field: the key in mircea_popescu's ring, or wherever
mircea_popescu: ascii_field if you're so absolutely convinced, how about seedlist is a config file sits with blockchain on disk ?
trinque: ascii_field: that's what I proposed
trinque: an address sending transactions which indicate hashes of updates
trinque: and yeah, then somebody is a point of failure
mircea_popescu: ascii_field seemed to me you're asking for an entirely something erlse, but anyway
mircea_popescu: iirc you were asking for a complex update gpg signature thing. not for a simple "move x text file from /sda to /sdb"
nubbins`: <+mircea_popescu> right but you're adding a narrower version. << so "check the usual places monthly", w/e
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16171 @ 0.00024929 = 4.0313 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: nubbins` if it's not narrower just make it the seed list. bam back to square one.
mircea_popescu: you're trying to jump a fence by crawling on your back.
trinque: what if the seed list was encoded directly as transactions?
nubbins`: monthly state of bitcoin address, "check out these sweet seed ips"
trinque: trusted after some large number of confirmations
nubbins`: "feel free to update the seed list that came w/ your device"
nubbins`: "it's been signed by us and our pubkeys shipped with your device"
nubbins`: THEN you only need to worry about the NSA intercepting the shipments.
trinque: encode IPs into outputs or something
nubbins`: <+trinque> what if the seed list was encoded directly as transactions? <<< how you gonna get those transactions?
mircea_popescu passes out "you suck at system design" dounce hats liberally.
trinque: obviously the thing has to connect to something first
trinque: if you wanted it to connect to other somethings later, either the natural way or some means of signaling
nubbins`: i'm suggesting shipping them with a hardcoded seed list *just like you are*
trinque: if you can't trust a txn that's very old, uh
nubbins`: i'm just also saying that /new seeds can be published in the future by the .foundation, if they want to/
mircea_popescu: (im kinda nonplussed that nobody even seems to realise seed list is only interesting on boot and these aren't intended to ever reboot, really.)
trinque: comcast will eventually go out
trinque: if they're consumer turds no ups
nubbins`: once every whoops i unplugged it
trinque: "fucking around behind the TV"
mircea_popescu: nubbins` onoes, you ruined 20 bux worht of old gear (plus shipping and handling!)
mircea_popescu: this is hopw the problem is solved in this space : buy more units.
mircea_popescu: "dude that zergling's broken" "mmkay" "aren't you going to repair it ?" "wut ?! *click* *click* *click* *click* *click*"
nubbins`: nobody's gonna pay ten cents for something that breaks if you turn it off
mircea_popescu: it breaks if you turn it off && fort meade floats in the air above your house.
trinque: anyhow I think any remote control of any kind is bad, mkay
trinque: but if they need some kind of signaling, signaling by blockchain is probably the safest
trinque: not "we trust this pastebin" or w/e
mircea_popescu: in general. not when you're signalling how to get the blockchain.
trinque goes to find the length of the longest-ever fork
trinque: rather, fork which was abandoned
mircea_popescu: in any case, the "this thing breaks if it runs out of power at any point after the enemy (or more likely plain old rust) has destroyedall seed ips" proposition is better value than
mircea_popescu: "this thing breaks iof there's a bug found in gpg. or if we didn't implement signature checking correctly. or or or or"
nubbins`: trinque for all you know i forked the blockchain 2 years ago and am still shuffling my forked coins
mircea_popescu: (and before anyone goes "how could we implement signature checking incorrectly", this was discussed mere days ago. === "no errors found" or what was it)
trinque: nubbins`: you can declare you've spent my coin? and others will be able to verify this?
nubbins`: trinque that's not what you were looking for 8)
nubbins`: mircea_popescu so are you proposing that all pogos ever sent out will contain 0.5.3.1 or w/e current release is when the first one goes out?
nubbins`: then it's sort of a self-solving problem
mircea_popescu: i propose whoever makes one puts w/e the fuck they want in there and that's that for the damned unit in question
mircea_popescu: and if you want to change, derp. change the production flux.
mircea_popescu: you know, like industry works since fortever. not like ford mondeo got recalled because hey, they got ford fluence out, so they'll conver them
nubbins`: obviously if the foundation is still producing new releases, it's going to be maintaining a seed list for that release, rather than just continuing to let the dead nodes build up
nubbins`: so if anyone particularly feels like they don't want their out of date unit to be so
nubbins`: they're 100% welcome to grab the latest foundation release, because obv it'll still work
nubbins`: it's just off-label usage as far as we're concerned.
danielpbarron: i know "time isn't really money" but however long it takes to upgrade one of these things is probably enough time to earn more than 20 USD working at McDonalds
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron the (actually sound) argument is that they won't be 20 forever, we're eating up a bubble of externalised cost.
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 21:56:26; mircea_popescu: i totally wish to see it.
jurov: i see, it actually helped thepirateby immensely
mircea_popescu: they ARE making political parties and getting various lawmaker seats because of it.
jurov: and alf will finally get his dreamed out gasenwagen too
trinque: beat the thing one more time... publishing say a magnet link from a known address to an address or addresses representing a bittorrent magnet link seems a fine way to be able to trust shuffling bits out to nodes if that were wanted
trinque: pub/priv-key encrypt either works or doesn't, sha256 either works or doesn't
ascii_field: trinque: mircea_popescu was alluding to protocol finesse
mircea_popescu: it's just more hard work to read the shit. which is work. which we don't fucking hasve the time for.
trinque: mircea_popescu: 100% granted, that is a fine reason not to do it
mircea_popescu: i'm in no case saying that w/e, any one in b-a *couldn't * correctly implement what alf is proposing./
mircea_popescu: i am however saying that no one here can implement it in zero time.
ascii_field can probably implement it in less time than building linux 3.18 took
ascii_field wishes to ask mircea_popescu for a favourite tarball of gpg, signed
mircea_popescu: dude keeps exposing himself to these cardano by xmas type of things. why all the self hate yo!
mircea_popescu: just forget it, srsly. seed list can live on hdd with blockchain if the notion of hardcoded magic ip numbers makes you retch
mircea_popescu: that's a completely sufficient solution here, lettuce move on.
ascii_field: if anyone has notions of what cmdline utils ought to be included - please say.
trinque: danielpbarron: that's all in busybox iirc
danielpbarron: top might not be needed; i'm just listing the things I use on a regular basis on pogo
danielpbarron: i use top to watch for when bitcoind is done throwing a tantrum
trinque: if they're fire and forget anything that needs an open port is an attack vector
danielpbarron: in that case, none of what i just listed is needed
trinque: the disposable RTS unit thing rings true
trinque: the guy who buys this either can service, can buy a new one, or fuck off.. there's no support staff
danielpbarron: if the thing ascii is making will not sshd, anyone who wishes to help test will need to "adulterate" their pogo
trinque has simply read too much loper os, the blockchain telegraphy one in particular
jurov: did you solve the clock, does it need time sync at all?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8950 @ 0.00023389 = 2.0933 BTC [-]
assbot: Logged on 27-01-2015 01:58:25; asciilifeform: ^ above code will have to be changed to actually set the machine clock ?
trinque: ^ relevant perhaps, found via googling, heh! not via logs.b-a search
nubbins`: <+danielpbarron> if the thing ascii is making will not sshd, anyone who wishes to help test will need to "adulterate" their pogo <<< plz to sshd!
trinque: if you give a mouse an sshd he's going to want his pubkey added
danielpbarron: it sounds like a very hard thing to do if you've never soldered before, but think of it as a good excuse to learn a new skill
nubbins`: i'm not soldering anything into more than one unit
trinque: my VPS has something attacking it at the moment, lol
nubbins`: anyway for the sake of popping it in there, keep sshd
brendafdez: mircea_popescu it works now. Anyway the IP I'm on now is one of a public AP, it shouldnt be whitelisted. I'll later give you my home IP, and BingoBoingo has my VPS IP already. I didn't know you were filtering.
BingoBoingo: The insanity would really be not filtering
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18380 @ 0.00024063 = 4.4228 BTC [+] {2}
mod6: <+danielpbarron> top << instead of this heavy weight bs, vmstat
mod6 has never liked top much
trinque: seems irrelevant, if you're in, you can already install stuff
mircea_popescu: <jurov> did you solve the clock, does it need time sync at all? << REAL CLOCKS KEEP THEIR OWN TIME!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21200 @ 0.0002424 = 5.1389 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: danielpbarron: nah I was talking about a bot attacking my VPS
trinque: hah I stopped getting hit when I mentioned it here
mod6: does anyone know where I might be able to get a gentoo vm?
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 17:48:05; ascii_field: (who don't appear to be logged in at present, but, still)
mod6: digitalocean has ubuntu/freebsd/fedora/debian/coreos/centos
trinque: mod6: I've got gentoo up on ec2
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 18:04:25; ben_vulpes: there is no friend/foe
mircea_popescu: there literally is no enemy. there can't be. bitcoin is agnostic in this sense.
mircea_popescu: the only option agents have is whether to exist or not exist.
mod6: trinque: ah, ok. thanks. i think i'll try to set up a local one first. my env is x86_64, but maybe vbox will let me run a x86_32 environment
mircea_popescu: there's no lever to toggle from enemy to friend or w/e.
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 18:04:58; ben_vulpes: and it'll remain that way until the block download thing is fixed to a) track node quality and b) spot-check blocks provided by high quality peers
assbot: Logged on 25-03-2015 18:07:41; ascii_field: ben_vulpes: i recommend strongly against ipv6 in this machine
mod6: is there a preferred version of gentoo that I should test on?
trinque: wow. seriously, entries in auth.log every couple seconds until *just now*
mod6: danielpbarron: what version of gentoo are you using?
mod6: im confused here...
trinque: danielpbarron: get ye some fail2ban
trinque: mircea_popescu: yeah I will
nubbins`: sorry guise, misconfig on my chinese node botnet
trinque: danielpbarron: oh yeah, I've got those IPs
danielpbarron: someone is also doing the same to another ip address i have
danielpbarron: Blocking 103.41.124.173:4 for >630secs: 40 danger in 4 attacks over 8 seconds
jurov: just move the sshd to alternative port (best if it isn't in nmap shortlist)
assbot: Moderator asks audience, "Who here thinks there will be a hard fork missile crisis?" /petertoddbtc raises his hand.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform recall the ancient discussion re "what if nsa held a bunch of btc" ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform but there isn't a box in the windoze to input that purpose.
trinque: asciilifeform: the notable part is that attack stopped for both of us when I mentioned it
mircea_popescu: i think you may have a genetic explanation of intelligence there.
mircea_popescu: (me last year, waiting for cab with dude in timisoara. cab kinda late. me : "check it out, i'ma light a cigarette and by the magical magic of smoking, it'll show up immediately.
mircea_popescu: mp lights cigarette, cab turns in immediately, mp is revered as god by the kid in question.)
trinque: danielpbarron: where does it end in your log?
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> (me last year, waiting for cab with dude in timisoara. cab kinda late. me : "check it out, i'ma light a cigarette and by the magical magic of smoking, it'll show up immediately. << Most well known phenomenon associated with tobacco use
mircea_popescu: correlation of pseudorandom variables is a wonderfuil thing
trinque: notably the thing never tries any username obviously associated with public info about me
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9200 @ 0.00023937 = 2.2022 BTC [-] {2}
trinque: probably chinese bots just crawling the internet for hostnames to poke