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mircea_popescu: asciilifeform re http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812408 the item the idle dorks "following" "open source" and "technology" "news" on "platforms" entirely miss is just how fucking inconsequential they are. not that this is some kind of surprise, lazy nonthinkers being bombarded with vacuous statements of their overpowering importance, so they end up believing the crap ; completely immune to the otherwise obvious and direct ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 17:10 asciilifeform: ( i still have nfi, fwiw, who/where linked to it, to which heathens, possibly from mircea_popescu's logs later we will know some of it )
mircea_popescu: observation that the ~ONLY~ reason the empire of stupid puts forth that pretense has nothing to do with them and everything to do with the few remaining intelligent people that even speak the language / bother to tune in (a fine example being the recent "triggering" nonsense re the abort() manual : the pretense the neets matter is SO THAT RMS BELIEVES, not so that anything to do with the neets themselves ; yet somehow this te
mircea_popescu: xtbook example of abuse doesn't curdle anyone's wholly hallucinated "awareness")
mircea_popescu: in practical terms : trilema traffic is 97.5% direct, 1.7% from search engines and 0.5% from website links.
mircea_popescu: ie, it makes exactly 0 difference to its might whether the web even exists tomorrow or not. but even in this very constrained field, btcbase is a larger source than twitter, or facebook, or ycombinator, or you name it (and yes, any and all of the pantsuit platforms are vying for relevancy in my referral log, month after month after month, they just don't get to actually raise to importance on the merits of their own inconsequ
mircea_popescu: ential weakness)
mircea_popescu: and as far as "search traffic" is concerned, 99.x% of it is http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/cockworship-5.gif and so following.
mircea_popescu: in short, the diminutively tiny list of people who, to quote one among them, "I took evening classes from the institute via phone. (I half-listened while clicking through lolcat photos.)"... what difference can they possibly make, to anyone ?
mircea_popescu: (ref is http://trilema.com/2012/the-imbecilitarians/#footnote_7_43344 ).
mircea_popescu: but seriously now, so there's 10k, maybe 50k inept kids in this vertical. do you realise that's less than the average vampire stories franchise gets ? and do you understand they are EXACTLY as useful / capable / potent / whatever objective measure of capacity to alter reality ?
mircea_popescu: yes, slashdot was once the flagship of a mighty youth movement. so was woodstock, at one time. slashdot failed on its own power and found out what it's worth these days for a fucking reason -- the party moved, and it moved years ago.
mircea_popescu: 2018 web is ~= 1988 disco or 1968 "rock&roll". there's no beatles, there's no elvis, there's just you know, "rock and roller Little Richard performing in 2007" ie wikipedia. there's fucking F!TV. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: turn a tv on if you can find one, and tune it to mtv, which still exist. compare/contrast to 1988 mtv, it'll illustrate the matter perfectly. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: remember 1988 mtv ? peak of live concerts, 120 Minutes was just getting started... whole different story. heck, people who weren't complete mouthbreathers even owned tv sets back then.
mircea_popescu: in other lulz : http://www.pepijnvanerp.nl/2017/01/disappointing-outcome-of-bardens-vs-lanka-measles-proven-to-exist-but-anti-vaxxer-lanka-keeps-his-money/
hanbot: mircea_popescu, so where did the people go?
lobbesbot: hanbot: Sent 6 hours and 21 minutes ago: <danielpbarron> http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/4x7iw/?raw=true << i also had to make changes in some other file. there's one that makes the form and another that receives the POST data
hanbot: ty danielpbarron
danielpbarron: i should say, the linked item is only comments.php ; if you can find the other file i'll send that one too, i don't recall which one it was
danielpbarron: i've made so many modifications to mp-wp it's like dpb-wp now
mircea_popescu: hanbot, i suppose the answer would be asciilifeform 's "bottle". consider this place -- there's people who come and read the logs. every day, in the morning or in the evening or whatever. there's people who write code, there's people who do all kinds of stuff. where were they BEFORE ? they did physically exist, yes, you can't say "nowhere". so then ?
mircea_popescu: the fact of the matter is people will express their better nature if there's a space where they can do it ~meaningfully~.
mircea_popescu: and meaning is still predicated on a structure of authority, and that structure WILL always be present ; the pretense to its absence is just that, a conceit. exactly like socrates' "everyone has a philosophy", if you "have no authority" backing your structure of meaning, you simply have the dumbest one, like the http://trilema.com/2016/please-stop-using-dns-already-and-other-considerations/#selection-711.0-711.610 idiots. it'
mircea_popescu: ll be a condensate of hot topic and assorted politrucking, but it will be there, as a matter of course.
hanbot: danielpbarron, hey, why not patch on it?
hanbot: mircea_popescu, so while people thought they can bring down the berlin wall they tuned into mtv, and once it became obvious there's nothing there they tuned out?
mircea_popescu: it didn't become obvious "there's nothing there". what became obvious was the curt cobain problem : that the only ~possible~ move remaining for the "man alone" is suicide.
danielpbarron: hanbot, i didn't start with the official v wp-wp. i had a very old original .tar.gz
mircea_popescu: very much the problem of http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-11#1500956 ; though not for the causes he ascribes, nor with the divisions implicit etc. there's no future for man in the brave new world exactly in the sense and exactly for the reasons there was no future for man in soviet russia 8th decade. white, black, turqouise, russian, turkmen, georgian, it dun matter -- the only possible move for they confronted with totalitaria ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-07-11 12:27 mircea_popescu: "If you are white, no positive, active role is left to you. Either you accommodate yourself to the unreasonable, or you play out your life in some futile back alley. You are doomed to this by the disgraceful history of your kind. Maybe it's fair, maybe it's not, but it is the way things are." << from another schmuck with a nobel prize.
mircea_popescu: n systems who insist on staying solitary is suicide.
mircea_popescu: and that's what ultimately killed "music" (as particularly understood in the 1950-1980 interval) for schelling point-ness : the realisation that the only possible conclusion is cobain's ; and hence all the emo / goth / etc bs, tiptoeing around old man charon's boat.
mircea_popescu: and hence the 1990s, and the "information superhighway" bs. they were going to, poor darlings, subvert the morloch, with a very naive, all-inclusive, republic v0.1, built out of "net neutrality" and wikipedia. except of course for the part where it didn't work, it was a splendid plan.
mircea_popescu: but it didn't in fact work. so where do "rock'n'rollers" go when it's disco time ? same place zappa went, neh, to the bottle of bitters.
hanbot: i never thought about it that way. though it seems evident once stated.
mircea_popescu: the world will be either authoritarian or totalitarian ; and only one of those is livable (though to people living through its early dissolution phases, it seems altogether as if things are improving -- much like the case may be that preteen orphans may subjectively perceive their first few hours with their new status actually liberating. then dinner time comes, and wel... the unbearable sadness of solitude sneaks in. somehow
mircea_popescu: .)
mircea_popescu: nevertheless, only one is livable, hence the "where are the rembrandts ?" and http://btcbase.org/log/2017-09-13#1713764 and http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812598 and on and on. ☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-09-13 19:34 mircea_popescu: so : the faberge egg, the original, was made in 1885 ; but it was the continuation and in a sense the crowing of a current of thought (ie, culture) and proper civilisation that reached back over a centry.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 23:19 asciilifeform: kurchatov being a great demo case; he had the authority to behead. laboratory -- worked. ( and not merely via 'copy leaked design', the ~indigenous~ nuke was crafted in parallel with the copied 'rds-1' , and subsequently went to production )
hanbot: danielpbarron still, it'd be great if we could merge dpb-wp with mp-wp and get something going.
lobbes: fig. 1: the mtv of today gave the d00d depicted in this ballas piece his own tv show >> https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/10/catfish.html << http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-12#1812646 ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-05-12 02:00 mircea_popescu: turn a tv on if you can find one, and tune it to mtv, which still exist. compare/contrast to 1988 mtv, it'll illustrate the matter perfectly.
lobbes: in other lulz: observe one hanno boeck in his natural habitat, one day before being called up for muppet duty, still doing... nothing >> http://archive.is/c8epK
mircea_popescu: lobbes, holy shit he's fucking retarded, gimp has had scheme built in since 2005.
mircea_popescu: a better example of what exactly it means to be a monkey, with these inane expectations of wysiwyg-ism and gui-ism and rtfm-is-racist and nobody-will-ever-expect-you-to-think-if-they-truly-love-you and on AND ON...
mod6 finally sits down to eat log
mircea_popescu: since we're discussing "retards are retarded", here's a fine example : https://archive.is/RbD9o ; it consists of a) let's leak through the inept choice of "pad by the value of padding, so if you need 5 bytes of padding pad with 5 bytes each = 5" (and then pretend this is not to be reviewed "because popular" and also do every other elbow trick in the book to stick it past) followed unneringly by... b) construct elaborate ritua
mircea_popescu: ls to discuss the matter, including spurious naming conventions and all the rest of the monkey dance, EXCEPT in terms of "leaking padding schemes are retarded, DO NOT DO THAT."
mircea_popescu: that's your "experts" zx2c4, from matthew retardenfield all the way down the mongoloid chain.
mircea_popescu: and this is also why ~nobody of any consequence reads any of them. i'd rather read engelbert humperdinck's introduction to greek philosophy. at least he sings, which, unrelated as it may be, IS WAY THE FUCK MORE THAN ANY OF THESE IDLE FUCKTARDS EVER DID. or will ever do.
mircea_popescu: !!up fromdeedbot
deedbot: fromdeedbot voiced for 30 minutes.
fromdeedbot: I want to learn to code/program. I am looking for sound advice on what to learn first. php? oop? python? I have looked all over the web and it seems everyone has a different opinion. any advice would be appredciated
mircea_popescu: either lisp or ada.
fromdeedbot: ty
mircea_popescu: of course, the more cogent question is, ~why~ do you want to learn to code/program
fromdeedbot: i would like to start as low level as i can without overdoing it
fromdeedbot: because I have been into computers for a long time and I feel like I could contribute productive elements to the community if i knew how to exoress my ideas in the right languge
fromdeedbot: It interests me more and more every day… but it is overwhelming where to begin and I dont want to start bad habits
mircea_popescu: well, this overanxious approach is a bad habit all of itself.
fromdeedbot: my apologies
mircea_popescu: hey, i don't mind. but understand that avoiding bad habits is a lifelong uncompletable task, there's no magic pill that'll keep you safe from such. certainly contemplation from outside isn't much of one.
mircea_popescu: anything speciffic you're trying to express ?
fromdeedbot: hah, that’s good advice. noted…. As far as what to express specifically, I’m not sure exactly yet, but this has always interested me and I have waited long enpough
fromdeedbot: buliding smart contrct’ish programs would be a short term goal
mircea_popescu: how old are you then ?
fromdeedbot: 38
fromdeedbot: I have been blown away by blockchains use of public private key
fromdeedbot: and how escrows, and othjer such related things could be revolutionized
fromdeedbot: its a new way to set in stone, amongst many oother imagined, and not imagined yet things
mircea_popescu: i guess you'll have to do a bunch of log reading.
fromdeedbot: I been lol
fromdeedbot: and I figured i’d break my silence here
mircea_popescu: might as well pick a better nick.
fromdeedbot: ha! I kinda like it low key, but I’m not “from deedbot” in the way people might think… this is the only channel that I use tghis Nick
fromdeedbot: so you know it’s me, if that matters
mircea_popescu: so when you say you've been reading logs, what do you mean ?
fromdeedbot: So reg a new key with the new nick
mircea_popescu: yes, that's how "we know it's you".
fromdeedbot: well google landed me on your logs when I was researching the whole wiki leeks thing and how it related to bitcoin
fromdeedbot: blockchain more specifically
fromdeedbot: and the deedbot got crossed up in my googling
mircea_popescu: it's more of a half year sort of thing, reading logs.
fromdeedbot: I have to admit I have not read them in full, and if that is a pre req, I will.
fromdeedbot: 1I have read a fair bit from here, and a lot of gitter.im logs from web3 and go-ethereum
mircea_popescu: not so much as a prerequisite as a filter. reading helps you figure out if it's for you.
fromdeedbot: that is exactly I why I read them… you guys have came up with a really cool thing
mircea_popescu: https://gitter.im/ << gotta archive this lulzgem. "Where communities thrive Gitter is a chat and networking platform that helps to manage, grow and connect communities through messaging, content and discovery."
fromdeedbot: noted
mircea_popescu: reminds me of this chick on fetlife, "So you don't want to have a smart discuss, you're here for what ? What do you research here ? Because I'm agree with your description." ☟︎
mircea_popescu: !!up fromdeedbot
deedbot: fromdeedbot voiced for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: fromdeedbot, which thing is that ?
fromdeedbot: Requirment of a pgp key to become a part of a new web built on trust and accountability
mircea_popescu: ah. yes.
fromdeedbot: so that peoples online identity has a “fingerprint"
fromdeedbot: and your reputation means something and can be quantified
fromdeedbot: and compared to who backs you up… and who they are, and how old is their nick
fromdeedbot: and are they solid
fromdeedbot: ?
fromdeedbot: it’s cool
mircea_popescu: so i take it you read http://trilema.com/2014/what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works-and-how-to-use-it/ ?
fromdeedbot: yes
mircea_popescu: cool.
fromdeedbot: I thinlk that this type of system could change the way we define “percieved value” and even credit
fromdeedbot: like to get a loan or a lease on a place to live
mircea_popescu: what do you mean "could" ?
fromdeedbot: explain please
mircea_popescu: it long ago has ; the republic built its uruguay datacenter out of what, you expect ? wot.
fromdeedbot: I mean globally
mircea_popescu: what's that mean ?
fromdeedbot: or am i that late
fromdeedbot: lol.. I have looked a lot into estomia e-citizen program as well
mircea_popescu: if by globally you mean "we throw darts at a earth globe", then yes, you're that late. if by globally you mean "every last idiot on two legs" you're way the fuck early, in the sense that such miracle's never gonna happen.
fromdeedbot: it’s roughly along the same lines, but not the samee
fromdeedbot: I am of the belief that things will move this direction naturally
mircea_popescu: not really. most people are neither useful nor interesting.
fromdeedbot: if a new internet is built and a pgp key is mandatory, and everyone is on the new internet..
fromdeedbot: if www addresses have tumbleweeds rolling by because most businesses have moved to a new more secure web
mircea_popescu: mno. have you seen say http://trilema.com/2014/ill-pay-for-your-tits/ ?
mircea_popescu: everyone gets a tit string ; not everyone gets to be in the wot.
fromdeedbot: I saw that but was distracted while reading
fromdeedbot: what was the purpose of that demonstration?
mircea_popescu: exactly as stated : that some of the usable bipedal mammals will get a serial id ; the unusable will get nothing. there's no birthright to the lordship.
fromdeedbot: noted
fromdeedbot: What do you guys have against Ethereum (if anything, maybe i am not rembering the logs correctly)
fromdeedbot: It seems like a really good concept
mircea_popescu: it starts with http://trilema.com/2013/digging-through-archives-yields-gold/#selection-109.0-109.416
mircea_popescu: why did you think the usg bitcoin-ersatz is a good thing ?
fromdeedbot: sorry my cat got out… brb
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in random lulz, "Copy right laws are in tact and if you violate those rules then you will be prosecuted."
BingoBoingo: <fromdeedbot> I mean globally << What part of moving from Southern Illinois to Uruguay on WoT fuel isn't global? Gotta circumnavigate or something?
BingoBoingo: !!up mother[m]
deedbot: mother[m] voiced for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: mother[m]: Comó andas?
mod6: mornin'! logs finally eaten :]
ben_vulpes: i crunched some numbers, and i think it's going to cost around 3 btc to put the production rockchip plant together and get it down south, all based on 4 2U's with 24 rockchippen each, transpo of ~2.5kusd and per-chassis fab costs of ~800usd. i think with the outrageous success of the rockchip pilot plant pizarro's in a *great* spot to refinance per mircea_popescu's suggestion, to provide for the production
ben_vulpes: safe-online-rsabox production plant buildout and consolidate the physical beachhead in .uy. so mod6 asciilifeform is the board inclined to raise more capital to build this out and attend to morale in sudamerica?
mircea_popescu: !!up gunnarson
deedbot: gunnarson voiced for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, 3 btc is like 30k, 4 * 8 + 2.5 is like 5k, did we misplace an order of magnitude somewhere ?
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo, if you end up in hong kong next, it'll be 2/3 done! ☟︎
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: no, there are also the rockchips themselves. full breakdown http://cascadianhacker.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/rockchip.lisp
mircea_popescu looks.
mircea_popescu: !!up candi_lustt
deedbot: candi_lustt voiced for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: candi_lustt http://cascadianhacker.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/rockchip.lisp
mircea_popescu: i guess this'll take some more tinkering.
ben_vulpes: hm yeah how did i have this thing eat random text
mircea_popescu: anyway, be the details as they may : the original http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-05#1809921 / http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-05#1809793 discussion was looking at a trip 3x the size ; downsizing it (which seems unavoidably necessary for OP considerations) has the tucked in advantage that you don't specifically need to refinance, if you don't want to. so prolly should discuss in board what discounts do you expect to see pre and ☝︎☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-05-05 03:06 mircea_popescu: besides, you can afford it, shockingly enough. 300 x 100 is what, 3.x btc. not the end of the world. if he actually gets it through the blocade you have an item arguably worth twice that.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-05 00:25 mircea_popescu: if i were you folk i would very seriously be looking at geting refinanced, taking ~300 rockchips there and filling a dozen us with them.
mircea_popescu: post successful delivery.
mircea_popescu: but the good news is that lobbesbot permits you to do a bond auction a la carte.
ben_vulpes: it is pretty neat like that!
ben_vulpes bbl
mircea_popescu: !#s opennet.ru/opennews/art.shtml?num=44356
a111: 2 results for "opennet.ru/opennews/art.shtml?num=44356", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=opennet.ru%2Fopennews%2Fart.shtml%3Fnum%3D44356
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-05-02#1461007 << you know, i wouldn't even call it lulz. "Система проверяет применение для начальных коэффициентов составных чисел и выявляет использование в разных ключах одинаковых цикличных коэффициентов (модуль), что может указывать на во ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-05-02 12:43 asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu https://www.opennet.ru/opennews/art.shtml?num=44356 << moar lulz
mircea_popescu: зможное наличие дубликатов закрытого ключа. ", they produced that on their own power ? that's like... 1000% more than what the esl world managed.
mircea_popescu: anyway, https://www.opennet.ru/opennews/art.shtml?num=48531 item not even terrible. this Максиму Чиркову guy really should be here. https://www.opennet.ru/contact.shtml
BingoBoingo: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-12#1812776 That's a bit crowded. Maybe best Korea? ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-05-12 16:49 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo, if you end up in hong kong next, it'll be 2/3 done!
mircea_popescu: ulaan baator.
BingoBoingo: Now there's an option
ben_vulpes: trinque: http://trinque.org/cuntoo.tar.gz 404s
mod6: I'm having a reaaaaaly hard time installing gentoo with a gcc4 now.
mod6: Whatever docs TMSR~ has to install a gentoo are out of date. New ones are required.
trinque: ben_vulpes: I'm awaiting the new V before I re-release that. I'll update the article if you like.
trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-03-14#1787780 << might even be *more* package breakage now than when diana_coman tried. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-03-14 03:13 trinque: diana_coman: regarding your cuntoo build problem, net-tools upstream has apparently broken build on default gcc-4.9.4. If I pass -std=gnu99, the definer of IFNAMSIZ is included and the thing builds.
mod6: I'm trying to build up two machines so I can do some trb testing with rawtx, et. al. Kinda hung until I can get an OS installed.
trinque: I'd rather get a v-tree of our own portage going than continue to flail at the empire's ceaseless breakage.
trinque: mod6's experience will repeat until we own the portage tree
trinque: esthlos: how goes it?
mod6: yeah, our own thing is 100% required at this point.
trinque: mod6: it's very much in the works.
trinque: if you were to build a gentoo using their standard instructions, nothing in that would block you from replacing with a cuntoo userland later.
mod6: Once opon a time, the docs we put together for trb users to build a gentoo worked. Much better, and much more clear than the gentoo garbage docs.
trinque: sure. and next time you blink they'll require clang
mod6: We need exactly that, but something that yields an actual working box. I was unaware that since apparently last year, the wreckers junked us. ☟︎
mod6: Yeah, so our own OS, even if we don't know what we're quite doing yet, is more worthwhile than what gentoo has to offer.
trinque: mmmhm. they specifically called out gcc-4.x as excluded from glorious future.
trinque: obviously there are other problems. if you want musl, you need ebuilds with musl patches. as it stands on stock gentoo, this means using "layman" which for the musl overlay, eats directly from shithub
trinque: you know, the one with the chewy ssh keys. ☟︎
mod6: aha
mod6: alright, im gonna see if I can get ben_vulpes' downgrade dance to do the trick.
mod6: if so, will keep track of the steps for a possible new doc.
asciilifeform: mod6: your hosed gentoo : what year stage4 didja use ?
asciilifeform: if it was q3 or 4 of 2016, or later -- ~impossible to restore sane gcc
ben_vulpes: this is factually incorrect, i have removed gcc6 and 5 from gentoos built with modern stage3.
asciilifeform: hmm
ben_vulpes: granted the 5 is built with a ken thompson'd 6, and the 4 built with a thompson'd 5.
asciilifeform: from q2 2016 or prior, no need to remove
asciilifeform: mod6 is still ultimately right, gotta confiscate portage from the shitgnomes
asciilifeform: my point was, rockchip gentoo was made with 0 gcc reversion gymnastics, all i needed was a vintage stage4 tarball , and my blacklist
ben_vulpes: girthy spittoon, i still don't understand how the overlays of trinque's musl overlay work properly; not even really which knobs to pull
asciilifeform: now ~these~ i have not yet touched.
asciilifeform bbl,meat
mod6: Well, I've gotten stuck 2 different times. The first way was with a stage3 from yesterday, which, the install worked, but left me with GCC-6.4.0.
mod6: The second way, I just tried was with a stage3 from 2015: stage3-amd64-nomultilib-20150716.tar.bz2
mod6: (all the details are in #pizarro)
mod6: I thought the second way would work, and in fact `gcc-config -l` does report : x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-4.8.4 ; however, it seems like none of the ebuilds would work with a stage3 that old.
mod6: not even seems like, did report errors. see #pizarro.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-12#1812820 << no that was some guy being not nice, it never happened. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2018-05-12 21:59 trinque: you know, the one with the chewy ssh keys.
mod6: lol