a111: Logged on 2018-02-02 16:49 asciilifeform: phf: imho 'what, if anything changed' is a q that oughta be answered by a mechanism that can do it, when (as often is) wanted for the ~entire site~ compactly
mircea_popescu: but consider if you will the problem of dynamic content. every one (of what, 10k ?) pages on trilema changes at least once a day (header), and so on. what now ?
asciilifeform: not the header; nor that posts are editable (i've added errata edits to mine, etc) , but rather the ugliness of the kludge stack
mircea_popescu: i dun see it in a design perspective ; heck, i actually doin't even see the problem with php. (by the time you're protesting a text preprocessor being used as a systems language your problem is not properly speaking with the tool).
asciilifeform: prolly the way to unkludge it would be to give the various elements of the page, own urls, somehow.
phf: the notion of "static content" is a c-machine-ism
mircea_popescu: this said, the implementation is in fact kludgy, but this is no reason to alter the design.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this is discussing the header production only.
asciilifeform: the current hack around this is the archiver. but it is a hack.
mircea_popescu: well, the baked in assumption here is that the tits, great as they are, benefit from impredictable dress prison each day.
asciilifeform: imho dynamics oughta have a marked-as-separate form of addressing. e.g. dyn:// .
mircea_popescu: that's the major challenge : can the argument be constructed to see what is actually wrong with that piece of gnarl ?
mircea_popescu: it evidently crosses all conceivable sanity boundries. so ?
asciilifeform: this goes back to the trinque thread, where he (correctly) observed that 'gimme resource R, find it using hash H' is a separate, conceptually, entity from 'perform command C and return result R'
mircea_popescu: (for convenience, in pesudocode : select from an array of possible headers the one which corresponds to the remainder of dividing by 42 the number you obtain by converting from hexadecimal format the string you obtain by taking 6 characters from the 7th of the md5 hash of the current date)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform in that one is imperative and the other descriptive so to speak.
asciilifeform: asciilifeform's angle is that it is wrong that there is no sane scheme for distinguishing these. and likewise for properly handling the fact that most of what people do with 'dynamic' is really kludge to display bouquets of statics properly
a111: Logged on 2016-06-28 03:58 mircea_popescu: trinque tbh, i think wikis are a (braindamaged, dysfunctional, uncomprehending) response to the html-is-broken / transclusion issue discussed yest and etc.
mircea_popescu: and considering what happens in response to curl -v -X GET -H "range: bytes=1-8" www.loper-os.org (full page dump) we can add asciilifeform / nfs to the list of "does not support ranges"☟︎
a111: Logged on 2018-02-02 17:11 asciilifeform: so i suppose we have different personalexperiencesingoodfaith
trinque: the thing's so steeped in "the way things are" I daren't comment further
trinque: sure, if http is understood that it always hands back headers, and these are decided to exclude the "I want an item of x length and no further" then get with range 0 offset 0 would hand back only headers
trinque: same thing's going to happen in a thread on HTTP
mircea_popescu: the reason i linked the two items was, that you had a paradoxical result evaluating logical implication of negated absence in there ; and a paradoxical result evaluating predicated nothingness, here. seem to me intuitively they're related to some sort of 0-difficulty you have.
trinque: you didn't get back zero in the latter case
trinque: you got however many bytes of headerstuff
mircea_popescu: you're asking for 0 bits of X, not for 0 bits altogether.
mircea_popescu: and if you say "i'm interested in x but in 0 bits of it" the logical implication is that you're only interested in any meta-x may be available. which yes might be null, but also doesn't have to be.
mircea_popescu: similar to trinque goes into santaria shop, "do you have any bibles ?" "yes, shall i read you from it ?" "no, thanks. how much for one ?"
trinque: why would you imply it in that manner, and it's understood you may want potentially boundless metadata
trinque: rather than specify what question you may have about the thing specifically
mircea_popescu: this is a major flaw of the "design" such as it is, that yes you're asking for potentially infinite metadata.
a111: Logged on 2018-02-02 17:27 phf: content-type is a meaningless header, since that's up to client to decide anyway (and it's frequently misconfigured), all the other headers are straight up metadata fluff.
a111: Logged on 2018-02-03 00:22 mircea_popescu: "find a thing such as x" vs "follow steps x give whatever comes out"
mircea_popescu: ://trilema.com/2014/ill-pay-for-your-tits/ as a complement to 302 response also quite useful.
mircea_popescu: you'll also probably have trouble without a connection: close signal, and so on.
a111: Logged on 2018-02-02 18:02 BingoBoingo: I will have to dig that up, but it is not trivial and requires having a foreign corporation in the loop somewhere. Perhaps someone with a corp that is offshore to Uruguay can inquire? Depends on the revenue reported and a whole bunch of other miscellanea.
ben_vulpes: guy delivering servers today wanted to know what i was doing with em; "well let's see, install some software and then rack 'em in a datacenter, what else does one do with servers?" "no but like are you mining bro?" "haha funny. don't you have something for me to sign?"☟︎
a111: Logged on 2018-02-03 01:20 mircea_popescu: and considering what happens in response to curl -v -X GET -H "range: bytes=1-8" www.loper-os.org (full page dump) we can add asciilifeform / nfs to the list of "does not support ranges"
asciilifeform: but i suspect phf is right, and ranged-GET evaporated ~everywhere while asciilifeform slept in his cave.
a111: Logged on 2018-02-03 04:52 ben_vulpes: guy delivering servers today wanted to know what i was doing with em; "well let's see, install some software and then rack 'em in a datacenter, what else does one do with servers?" "no but like are you mining bro?" "haha funny. don't you have something for me to sign?"
asciilifeform: nobody ever asks asciilifeform 'what is the 100kg of crate'.
a111: Logged on 2018-02-03 15:09 asciilifeform: hilarious buncha idjits, 'let's all move to 1 usg reservation and feed the waterfall there while awaiting cokemachine'
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-03#1780744 << "Mr. Pierce walked around the tree and said prayers for Puertopia, holding a rusted wrench he had picked up in the territory. He kissed an old man's feet. He blessed a crystal in the water, as they all watched. He played the Chaplin speech to everyone and to the tree, Mr. Nygard said."☝︎
BingoBoingo: In other Pais Pobre: "The idea that makes tPanel unique compared to other web hosting control panels is that the software does not require any root/shell access to function. Instead, it’s more of a manager for people who have ambitions to start a web host on their shared web hosting plan." - http://www.gnutoolbox.com/tpanel/
mircea_popescu: mod6 sadly i didn't have the time to check out the emeralds museum also, apparently this exists.
mod6: oh, a whole one for just that huh. kinda neat.
mircea_popescu: afaik for most of history most emeralds came from them.
mircea_popescu: apparently they also have a jewelry shop right in the museum. and a simulated mine. it was the next item on the list, but there's only so much you can cram into four days of fucking & drinking.
ben_vulpes: trinque: you said you had to go gcc 6 -> 5 -> 4, right?
mod6: yeah, makes sense. maybe something for next time 'eh