tmsr - Log 2016-01-05

assbot: Logged on 24-09-2015 06:18:08; mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> mircea_popescu: one example of something which Must Die is 'subkeys' << absolutely. i have no fucking idea what chickenbrain thought that's a thing. "o hey, you know what this chevy is made out of ? chevys! because they didn;'t get me that lego set when i was nine and now im fucked in the head."

asciilifeform: and other threadz

kakobrekla: didnt a few ba folks write gpg tutorials including subkey handling not 2 years ago

asciilifeform: possibly

asciilifeform: but everybody (with the apparent sole exception of asciilifeform) is doing the whole 'no expire date' thing

BingoBoingo: I don't think I covered any thing about the subkeys in mine. One of the things passed around before that LOVED subkeys.

BingoBoingo: A subkey for every device that might be captured it advocated

kakobrekla: asciilifeform that or get kicked out of mpex

asciilifeform: subkey is one of those things that could be a useful idea IF IT WORKED and WERE NOT IMPLEMENTED BY IDIOT ☟︎

asciilifeform: kakobrekla: my understanding was that mpex users kept a separate, unpublished pubkey just for it

kakobrekla: some perhaps do.

mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-01-2016#1360407 << it's... not on FB. or on "Telegram". i'm feeling all babbage-like over here. ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 04-01-2016 21:58:41; Tomiii: so what are the main technical differences between this room, and an invite-ony group-chat on FB, Telegram, etc?

asciilifeform: my main objection to subkey as implemented in gpg is that IT DOES NOT TELL YOU OR EVEN LET YOU CHOOSE with which modulus (i.e. which sub) it actually signs with ! ☟︎☟︎

asciilifeform: anyone recall how mircea_popescu spewed chunks when i pointed out that he's been signing with a subkey and not with the magical modulus ? ☟︎

asciilifeform: (the one on the tits)

mircea_popescu: "subkey" belongs exactly in the same pile "expiration date" belongs in

mircea_popescu: they're "your picture"

asciilifeform: it will all go to same pyre.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36849 @ 0.00051089 = 18.8258 BTC [-] {2}

asciilifeform: but presently it is plugged in and quite annoying

mircea_popescu: but yes - i would have loved to be a bff of gpg. instead we're just best enemies.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12289 @ 0.00050524 = 6.2089 BTC [-] {3}

asciilifeform: the sin, it turns out, was a mortal one, and there from the very beginning:

asciilifeform: it is in the attempt to divorce the abstraction of what the user is doing from the actual rsa (moduli)

mircea_popescu: go on ?

asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360580 ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 01:37:32; asciilifeform: my main objection to subkey as implemented in gpg is that IT DOES NOT TELL YOU OR EVEN LET YOU CHOOSE with which modulus (i.e. which sub) it actually signs with !

asciilifeform: sorta like the lack of coin control in bitcoin

asciilifeform: (the idiot 'wallet' abstraction)

asciilifeform: same exact idiocy

mircea_popescu: so basically "trying to be a service".

mircea_popescu: fucking brain rot. all these brogrammers have nfi what the point of programming computers even is.

asciilifeform: 'have nfi what the point' would be an ~improvement~

asciilifeform: instead they have a maximally perverse idea

asciilifeform: 'make this usable by monkey'

asciilifeform: but you cannot make even bulldozer 'usable by monkey', much less pgptron

asciilifeform: instead you only end up with monkey who is a danger to self and others.

kakobrekla: and a crappy bulldozer

mircea_popescu: myeah.

mircea_popescu: as phf ironically points out.

mircea_popescu is somewhat surprised at how in the log, the deep understanding comes from the newb!

asciilifeform: the other interesting part is that IT LIES

asciilifeform: e.g., the foo bar example,

asciilifeform: 'Key ID - 0xB98228A001ABFFC7'

asciilifeform: but looks like the actual rsa op was carried out WITH THE SUBKEY

asciilifeform: how this was ever tolerated ?

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this is a longstanding bit of C"S" idiocy. somehow the idea of a "painless" subsystem is "a subsystem that lies about being in pain". if organs worked like that we'd be all dead.

asciilifeform: this is a classic case of what mircea_popescu spoke of in the earlier thread - 'illicitly uses thing outside of itself'

asciilifeform: obligatory crackpottery, http://www.loper-os.org/?p=278

assbot: Loper OS » Seventh Law of Sane Personal Computing ... ( http://bit.ly/1RnpCSn )

asciilifeform: 'The machine shall never tell a lie to the operator.'

asciilifeform: SHALL NEVER TELL A MOTHERFUCKING LIE to operator !11111

mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-01-2016#1360438 << the more important difference is re : identity. the POINT of social media is to make it possible for entities devoid of identity to seemingly communicate. the point of b-a is to make it fucking impossible for entities devoid of identity to pretend they're communicating. ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 04-01-2016 23:08:28; phf: in "social media" the mechanism of mediation is entirely controlled by platform owners. nothing even remotely similar could be produced on top of facebook, because it would get snuffed in its infancy, with undesirable behaviors eliminated through technical or policy changes.

mircea_popescu: the former paradigm works well for people without identity. the latter is ideal for people with.

asciilifeform: !s dead souls

assbot: 17 results for 'dead souls' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=dead+souls

mircea_popescu: neatly mirroring the dichotomy discussed earlier today, about the group that is trying to use computers to compensate by its members outright lack of intelligence, vs the group that is tryi9ng to use computers to leverage the already present intelligence of its members.

mircea_popescu: !gettrust Tomiii

assbot: Tomiii is not registered in WoT.

mircea_popescu: go fix that noob.

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you will note, re "lying", that in my extensive experience 90% of beatings that ever get administered do get administered to a crying, repentful slave that does not believe she was lying.

mircea_popescu: it is exceedingly difficult to not lie if bereft of sane priors.

mircea_popescu: no, that doesn't make lying not lying, but it does make the problem of not lying as an idiot intractable.

asciilifeform: actually it is difficult for machine to lie without having been constructed with malice

mircea_popescu: or stupidity.

mircea_popescu: stupidity is an exceptional proxy for malice.

asciilifeform: normally there is not much space between 'white noise' and 'works'

mircea_popescu: the problem is that complex systems are not obviously normal-izable.

mircea_popescu: hence fractals.

asciilifeform: at any rate, my axiom specifically concerned deliberate untruths

asciilifeform: (as in, intended by the builder)

mircea_popescu: your definition of deliberateness is weak.

asciilifeform: e.g., 'hidden files' in winblowz, etc

mircea_popescu: nope. all programs hide the heap. why does that not qualify ?

mircea_popescu: (ftr that's the fucking definition of the heap : program's own notebook, that it doesn't show you)

kakobrekla: unix has same

asciilifeform: and your gurlz hide their guts

mircea_popescu: quite.

mircea_popescu: you know the first strip tease story ?

asciilifeform: hm?

mircea_popescu: bored eastern ruler, is presented with novel entertainment. girl comes and slowly strips to music.

mircea_popescu: once she's buck naked the music stops and teh guy inquires why the fuck she stopped ? he was having fun!

mircea_popescu: so she's skinned alive.

asciilifeform: reads like a variant of 'i drill my own holez!1111'

mircea_popescu: well... "hiding", you know ? whassat.

asciilifeform: where was it... in koran ??? that had the reminder of 'woman is merely a vessel of guts!111'

mircea_popescu: i just burn 'em, i dun read 'em.

asciilifeform: at any rate, the problem is never abstraction as such, but leaking abstraction.

asciilifeform: as in, woman which has no back side and you put your arms around, and out come the viscera

mircea_popescu: aha.

asciilifeform wanders off to pet pet

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14100 @ 0.00050396 = 7.1058 BTC [-] {2}

mircea_popescu: mind the backside@

mircea_popescu: too pokey down there guts may well come out!

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13550 @ 0.00050396 = 6.8287 BTC [-]

BingoBoingo: https://i.imgur.com/hJUcwC8.jpg

assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZL8WqQ )

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43994 @ 0.00050212 = 22.0903 BTC [-] {2}

BingoBoingo: It's a beached Karpeles https://i.sli.mg/RtTDdp.jpg

assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZL9rBb )

kakobrekla: dunno if he can afford all that food

BingoBoingo: Well he ate mt gox into collapse

mats: pls no

ben_vulpes: what is the latest and greatest on the oregon thing?

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12451 @ 0.00050559 = 6.2951 BTC [+] {2}

BingoBoingo: I've seen no loss of victory since http://qntra.net/2016/01/candidates-in-us-denouce-oregon-liberators/

assbot: Candidates In US Denounce Oregon Liberators | Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZLa6CQ )

mircea_popescu: abhababa what the fuck is that.

BingoBoingo: Bunch of presidential candidates not-Trump from USia's other socialist party are denouncing the liberating militia's actions in Oregon

BingoBoingo: TV and talk radio conveniently ignore the Bundy ranch is still successfully defended from Federal forces

ben_vulpes: heh is that so?

BingoBoingo: It seriously is

BingoBoingo: I'm still thinking the Feds are prolly going to channel Janet Reno and Waco the Oregon resistance though.

BingoBoingo: I don't think the derps trending #VanillaISIS realize how close they might actually be to right with that label

mircea_popescu: mno i was stillo on the whale

BingoBoingo: Ah, that's the Plus sized model who is a dead ringer for Karpeles in the face

ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: shit's going to be expensive, and cold.

BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: Shit tends to be

mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo i doubt they have the gall.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31000 @ 0.00050163 = 15.5505 BTC [-] {3}

mircea_popescu: but yes, getting a bunch of kids out there'd definitely help.

asciilifeform: hey doesn't ben_vulpes live close by ?

mircea_popescu: that discussion, tis in the logs.

asciilifeform: or is he not ready for valhalla yet

asciilifeform digs in logz

ben_vulpes: dude that is five hours away and i am not seeking valhalla.

ben_vulpes: heh

ben_vulpes: also out of curiousity mircea_popescu would you pay for the babetruxx necessary as well?

ben_vulpes: or would this party planner actually have to recruit gap-teeth dropouts from the surroundings?

mircea_popescu: heh. are you chanlleing indiancandy or something ?

ben_vulpes: so you'll pay for the beer but not for the babes to get to the middle of goddamn nowhere?

mircea_popescu: but in better news : the summer's also coming.

mircea_popescu: and , for that matter, better people are potentially born daily.

mircea_popescu: so at some point...

asciilifeform: hey i thought mircea_popescu told us that nobody born after '90 was fit for so much as stove fuel ??

mircea_popescu: at some point ideally i won't have to pay for anything.

ben_vulpes mostly curious to know how mircea_popescu thought this would come off

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes but those kinds of trends never last.

mircea_popescu: i have exactly no care in the world for that, ben_vulpes. purposes do not interest me.

asciilifeform: those trends to tend to last for the lives of those seeing them

asciilifeform: *do tend

mircea_popescu: if only.

mircea_popescu: i have in my lyf seen like three of em.

asciilifeform: 3 consecutive ?!! shitgenerations that had to be thrown out ?

mircea_popescu: yeah.

asciilifeform: and 4th, usable, born where, from wolves ?

ben_vulpes: well, /raised/ by wolves.

mircea_popescu: first, there was the generation of tov burtica. [belly-let, commie bugman]. then was the generation of the inteprid "privatizati". and finally the generation of "we belong in the eu and we'll sack this ridiculous derp of a prime minister that survived every turpitude in the book because a club caught fire and some moo-moos died".

mircea_popescu: tis three.

mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360575 << not even then. ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 01:35:56; asciilifeform: subkey is one of those things that could be a useful idea IF IT WORKED and WERE NOT IMPLEMENTED BY IDIOT

ben_vulpes: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-01-2016#1360029 << fwiw, i generally like the /people/ i met /working/ there. ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 04-01-2016 14:47:39; ascii_butugychag: quite surprisingly readable.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21900 @ 0.00050125 = 10.9774 BTC [-] {2}

mircea_popescu: top search term leading to trilema ? "teenage cunt".

mircea_popescu: da duck is wrong with this interweb!

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12759 @ 0.00050125 = 6.3954 BTC [-]

asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: what didn't you like ?

asciilifeform: in other nyoooz,

asciilifeform: bucephalus is repaired and working.

asciilifeform: (did anyone notice that it was dead for a week+ ?)

asciilifeform: unrelatedly,

asciilifeform: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShzmzcJM7QI

assbot: Japanese Old Animation (1929) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1OILaUq )

asciilifeform: ^ instructive fable

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21495 @ 0.00050223 = 10.7954 BTC [+] {2}

asciilifeform: !up okcupiddude

okcupiddude: hello?

mircea_popescu: heya

mircea_popescu: lol.

mircea_popescu: social media, that festival of clicking.

mircea_popescu: hopefully they grow beaks to go with the clucking.

asciilifeform: related, '"The Tengu, and the Woodcutter": A tengu bothers a woodcutter, showing off his supernatural abilities by guessing everything the man is thinking. The woodcutter swings his ax, and a splinter of wood hits the tengu on the nose. The tengu flees in terror, exclaiming that humans are dangerous creatures who can do things without thinking about them.'

asciilifeform: (rng!)

mircea_popescu: hehehe

mircea_popescu: one of the better stories.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34400 @ 0.00050076 = 17.2261 BTC [-] {4}

ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: good question.

ben_vulpes: but i have a more mundane one for you

asciilifeform: aha?

ben_vulpes: suppose i have a series of voltage readings over time, and i wish to turn these into binary data.

asciilifeform: ...?

ben_vulpes: should i come up with my own hairbrained scheme to do so or ask how best to get entropy out of this rng directly from you?

asciilifeform: buy the kakobreklascope

asciilifeform: comes with convenient usb plug.

asciilifeform: (or similar.)

ben_vulpes: scope i used vastly prefers to shit csvs.

asciilifeform: for the rng experiment in particular, 'bus pirate' (~$20) works just as well as $1k scope

asciilifeform: (small programmable widget, does 1,001 things)

ben_vulpes: neato

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26784 @ 0.00049773 = 13.3312 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42255 @ 0.00049765 = 21.0282 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10337 @ 0.00050021 = 5.1707 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7043 @ 0.00049764 = 3.5049 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32157 @ 0.00049762 = 16.002 BTC [-]

mircea_popescu: ahhh pork wellington ftw.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25605 @ 0.00050175 = 12.8473 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11400 @ 0.00050413 = 5.7471 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70078 @ 0.00050068 = 35.0867 BTC [-] {3}

mircea_popescu: !up massiro

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48200 @ 0.00049755 = 23.9819 BTC [-] {3}

massiro: The-Eth-Scam payout is in trouble I think... (BitBet)

massiro: The payout of /bet/1199/the-eth-scam-wont-see-2016/ is stuck for some reason. The payment is expected to be come from: https://blockr.io/address/info/1EMmmcooTXe64SY5X3FwTC1HU1t32XLWPx

assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Us4jOS )

massiro: the txid d8e60a0979024cce9159bd7b59594eae7dec627db5ac6bd088866afea533b0e9 is not visible for some block explorers...

massiro: What could I do for this?

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20700 @ 0.00049652 = 10.278 BTC [-]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34964 @ 0.00049835 = 17.4243 BTC [+] {2}

massiro: https://live.blockcypher.com/btc/tx/d8e60a0979024cce9159bd7b59594eae7dec627db5ac6bd088866afea533b0e9/ ☟︎

assbot: BTC Transaction d8e60a0979024cce9159bd7b59594eae7dec627db5ac6bd088866afea533b0e9 | BlockCypher ... ( http://bit.ly/1Us5he9 )

massiro: The above site says the fee is 0.001 BTC so I think it is more than enough. Is this related to low/high S value problem? ☟︎

mircea_popescu: <massiro> What could I do for this? << wait it out, basically.

massiro: Mr. mircea, thank you!

mircea_popescu: might also try and encourage any dudes running non-conformant bitcoin implementations to come to sanity, but that's a tall order yet.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27520 @ 0.00050419 = 13.8753 BTC [+] {3}

massiro: I have heard only low-S value is permitted since around October 2015, due to the severe tx-malleability attack by amaclin (at bitcointalk). Core devs quickly responded because it is very annoying (original TxIDs will be changed and one might lose the record of incoming payments).

mircea_popescu: that position is without any actual merit, and as you can attest it does in fact inconvenience you.

mircea_popescu: feel free to tell them so.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46882 @ 0.00050088 = 23.4823 BTC [-] {2}

mircea_popescu: http://qntra.net/2016/01/militia-liberates-oregon-land-from-federal-occupation/#comment-35441 << lol BingoBoingo's private jokes ever more obscure ☟︎

assbot: Militia Liberates Oregon Land From Federal Occupation | Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1VDW97p )

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38400 @ 0.00050213 = 19.2818 BTC [+] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38400 @ 0.00049998 = 19.1992 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8700 @ 0.00049652 = 4.3197 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7869 @ 0.00049652 = 3.9071 BTC [-]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27900 @ 0.00049648 = 13.8518 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4084 @ 0.00049861 = 2.0363 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29916 @ 0.00049775 = 14.8907 BTC [-]

deedbot-: [Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski] 7 lessons for hitting the broad side of a barn with your professional resume (curriculum vitae). - http://www.contravex.com/2016/01/05/7-lessons-for-hitting-the-broad-side-of-a-barn-with-your-professional-resume-curriculum-vitae/

punkman: "Use a professional e-mail address. “luvbunnie69@hotmail.com” or “buzzlightyear2infinitynbeyond@yahoomail.co.uk” just doesn’t cut the mustard." << meh, I really wouldn't care about that. having your own domain instead of gmail is a nice touch though.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37889 @ 0.00050236 = 19.0339 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26450 @ 0.00050237 = 13.2877 BTC [+]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23300 @ 0.00049611 = 11.5594 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 72300 @ 0.00050332 = 36.39 BTC [+] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8619 @ 0.00050384 = 4.3426 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26181 @ 0.00050422 = 13.201 BTC [+]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27798 @ 0.00050492 = 14.0358 BTC [+] {4}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3200 @ 0.00049829 = 1.5945 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21200 @ 0.0005057 = 10.7208 BTC [+] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9600 @ 0.00049857 = 4.7863 BTC [-]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5175 @ 0.00050575 = 2.6173 BTC [+]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13906 @ 0.00050605 = 7.0371 BTC [+]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30200 @ 0.00050609 = 15.2839 BTC [+]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42350 @ 0.00050484 = 21.38 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19184 @ 0.00050391 = 9.667 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12322 @ 0.00050143 = 6.1786 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14300 @ 0.00049839 = 7.127 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21948 @ 0.0004983 = 10.9367 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11071 @ 0.00049829 = 5.5166 BTC [-]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4416 @ 0.00049829 = 2.2004 BTC [-]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38874 @ 0.00049516 = 19.2488 BTC [-] {4}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38741 @ 0.00049895 = 19.3298 BTC [+] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13452 @ 0.00050091 = 6.7382 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13317 @ 0.0004948 = 6.5893 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2857 @ 0.00049398 = 1.4113 BTC [-]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16343 @ 0.00049831 = 8.1439 BTC [-]

BingoBoingo: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360788 << Can't deny the metals desk glory ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 06:27:37; mircea_popescu: http://qntra.net/2016/01/militia-liberates-oregon-land-from-federal-occupation/#comment-35441 << lol BingoBoingo's private jokes ever more obscure

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6200 @ 0.00049358 = 3.0602 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8350 @ 0.00049538 = 4.1364 BTC [+]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91778 @ 0.00049542 = 45.4687 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28650 @ 0.00050014 = 14.329 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10986 @ 0.00050258 = 5.5213 BTC [+] {2}

BingoBoingo: Apparently mp triggered more people on okc https://archive.is/upmuU

assbot: I’m Overweight…But That Doesn’t Give You The Right To Be Rude! – Horse Junkies United ... ( http://bit.ly/1myHO0t )

BingoBoingo: Poor horse

BingoBoingo: Could have been so delicious, but instead tortured.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6400 @ 0.00050567 = 3.2363 BTC [+] {2}

punkman: https://foragerfunds.com/bristlemouth/dick-smith-is-the-greatest-private-equity-heist-of-all-time/

assbot: Dick Smith is the Greatest Private Equity Heist of All Time - Forager Funds ... ( http://bit.ly/1PdrJ6O )

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4680 @ 0.00050404 = 2.3589 BTC [-] {2}

BingoBoingo: !up ziggs

BingoBoingo: !up zigglar

kakobrekla: chanserv is a bad boy

zigglar: when do bets payout?

kakobrekla: my guess is soon

BingoBoingo: zigglar: They now hold for 48 hours after resolution to check for objections/errors so prolly pay out when a bitbet mod wakes up

zigglar: It's been about 96 hours

BingoBoingo: Ah

kakobrekla: well, it says after 48hrs and technically 96 is after 48

BingoBoingo: ^

zigglar: lol

kakobrekla: anyway, a shitload of bets closed at new years so give so time to sort them all out ☟︎

kakobrekla: give them some time*

zigglar: Ya makes sense

zigglar: Assumed it was automated

kakobrekla: nah, mtgox was automated. ☟︎

BingoBoingo: !b 2 ✂︎

assbot: Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1JFY4JY.txt )

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14300 @ 0.00050404 = 7.2078 BTC [-]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 78021 @ 0.00050714 = 39.5676 BTC [+] {4}

thestringpuller: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3zjtkp/does_coinbase_ask_to_see_check_stubs_if_you/cymtv18 << And why would I trust you with my pay stubs? Next thing I know some schmuck in New Mexico is opening credit cards in my name.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41200 @ 0.00050776 = 20.9197 BTC [+] {3}

thestringpuller: " A penny for an average on-chain transaction is probably too expensive to be competitive. " - Stephen Pair << and this is why your company is dying

jurov: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1314390.0

assbot: Bitcoin Foundation: Where on Earth Did all the Money Go? ... ( http://bit.ly/1myW4Gq ) ☟︎

jurov: Jon Matonis: $137.5k through "THE HOLE OF ROY LLC". Salary up from $31k. Jon Matonis acted as Executive Director up to October 2014.

jurov: wtf that company name

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34300 @ 0.00050356 = 17.2721 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56000 @ 0.0005081 = 28.4536 BTC [+] {5}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21982 @ 0.00050915 = 11.1921 BTC [+]

davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360855 <<< top kek ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 15:19:23; kakobrekla: nah, mtgox was automated.

davout: the bash web interface seems to be stuck at beginning of november

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26944 @ 0.00051197 = 13.7945 BTC [+] {4}

kakobrekla: davout wanna be mod ?

davout: shit

davout: i guess if one's needed then why not

davout: am i allowed to autoh-mate moderation?

kakobrekla: lol no.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47400 @ 0.00051284 = 24.3086 BTC [+] {5}

kakobrekla: davout you now have mod access, on that note some guidelines http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=31-08-2015#1257804 ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 31-08-2015 23:27:05; kakobrekla: not at all, but i have a process for approving bashes

kakobrekla: approve/delete them in order

kakobrekla: clean them up as much as you can

kakobrekla: check the logs for possible better framing

kakobrekla: i dont usually approve those containing links because fuck that shit and also links tend up ending dead

kakobrekla: i prolly end up removing over half of them

kakobrekla: feel free to ask if you have questions and good luck.

davout: ok, i'll give it a go

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15252 @ 0.00050757 = 7.7415 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12641 @ 0.00051366 = 6.4932 BTC [+]

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36450 @ 0.00051542 = 18.7871 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10360 @ 0.00051179 = 5.3021 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15250 @ 0.00051582 = 7.8663 BTC [+] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17685 @ 0.00051179 = 9.051 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18000 @ 0.00050402 = 9.0724 BTC [-] {3}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18000 @ 0.00050325 = 9.0585 BTC [-] {3}

BingoBoingo: !up taub

BingoBoingo: !up tautology

jurov: !up mircea_ahoy

mircea_ahoy: hola!

mircea_ahoy: in other argentine news, half of belgrano's out of power an' so i evacuated to a boat.

jurov: !up Dava

mircea_ahoy: turns out that if you're going to run a generator, the best way to go about it is, make it part of sailing

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14500 @ 0.0005031 = 7.295 BTC [-] {3}

mircea_ahoy: Things your mom would have your rear end for saying, things that though you’re no expert you feel that you are clearly the most intelligent on the forum and have to interject. Things you would NEVER say to their face or at least that directly… in my blog I really want to expose just how a simple Facebook comment has torn my life apart about horses and how unfortunately I witnessed a Facebook friend receive the same cruel attack just last w

mircea_ahoy: eek.

mircea_ahoy: “You’re too fat to ride that horse”.

mircea_ahoy: fuck that shit ? what's the horse, a rock ? if you prick it, it does not bleed ?

jurov: alf: see - mircea's dirigible

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27400 @ 0.00050233 = 13.7638 BTC [-] {2}

mircea_ahoy: the biullshit they hide behind. no, my mother wouldn't have been protecting your delusional "right" to be colossaly stupid at the expense of a poor unfortunate horse that has no fault.

mircea_ahoy: for that matter, i have said this to people, and so has anyone who owns horses and lets random street people ride them.

mircea_ahoy: that aside, the actual woman in the picture isn't actually too fat to ride, and besides its her own fucking horse. but fucking SAY THAT. not random bs about mothers and whantot.

shinohai: ahoy, Cap'n! o/

mircea_ahoy: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360851 << for the record, all bets that closed for new year were paid out ~ coupla days ago. some non conforming miners have been failing to include the txn in mined blocks. this is part and parcel of bitcoin working poorly as it does. ☝︎☟︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 15:16:51; kakobrekla: anyway, a shitload of bets closed at new years so give so time to sort them all out

mircea_ahoy: direct any complaints as to "why my txn has been waiting for x days" to anyone and everyone who is running non-conformant bitcoin implementations. starting with the pools. ☟︎

mircea_ahoy: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360864 << the money that they were pretending to have and never did went to places. just like eth and just like every other fiat-pushing "bitcoin" scam to date. ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 16:05:26; assbot: Bitcoin Foundation: Where on Earth Did all the Money Go? ... ( http://bit.ly/1myW4Gq )

mircea_ahoy: "I have not been presented any evidence of any theft, criminal act or similar wrongdoing but would be *happy to pay a bounty of at least 10%* for anyone with information and evidence of any such act leading to recovery of any funds which were misappropriated or stolen. Those who imply that there is any wrongdoing at the foundation now or by those involved now should come forward with evidence or at least a solid and specific accusation. If p

mircea_ahoy: resented with any such evidence I would work to have justice done."

mircea_ahoy: fucking bullshit. fenton using the meni rosenfeld defense "hey, if you don't get a fiat court to give us fiat then ergo no crime was committed by our bitcoin scam"

mircea_ahoy: yeah, right.

mircea_ahoy: ;;later tell mircea_popescu remember to negrate that fenton dumbass.

gribble: The operation succeeded.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14700 @ 0.0005078 = 7.4647 BTC [+] {2}

BingoBoingo: !up mircea_ahoy

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57545 @ 0.00050782 = 29.2225 BTC [+] {2}

mircea_ahoy: apparently it's gonna storm. herp.

kakobrekla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360915 < are you checking and resending as well or ? ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 19:27:56; mircea_ahoy: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360851 << for the record, all bets that closed for new year were paid out ~ coupla days ago. some non conforming miners have been failing to include the txn in mined blocks. this is part and parcel of bitcoin working poorly as it does.

mircea_ahoy: kakobrekla, yes, they're being broadcast constantly.

kakobrekla: roger

mircea_ahoy: besides, what's mempool remanence, 48-72 hrs ?

kakobrekla: idk

mircea_ahoy: 50something average last i recall looking at it.

kakobrekla: i cant say i remember having such issues ever

mircea_ahoy: yeah well. you don't really get to kno wwhat pos the bitcoin network is until/unless you try and run a high volume merchant on it.

kakobrekla: do txes you broadcast end up shown on some blockexporer in a timely manner?

mircea_ahoy: yep

mircea_ahoy: on various ones. heck, guy complaining yest linked to one.

mircea_ahoy: "broadcast two days ago, miner priority 84%", not included

kakobrekla: dunno, even my fee-less txes came through in less than a day recently

mircea_ahoy: are you using trb or bullshit-b ?

kakobrekla: doesnt make a diff for broadcasting - you can use various endpoints

mircea_ahoy: yeah, but i also don't honor whatever random "improvements" derps made.

kakobrekla: even some blockexplorers have a 'broadcast tx' option no?

mircea_ahoy: sure.

mircea_ahoy: anyway, it's no trlike the txn is secret or anything. it's signed, anyone can broadcast it any way they please.

kakobrekla: im just trying to figure out where the problem is

kakobrekla: i cant say i did so far

mircea_ahoy: best i can tell, miners haven't been including 100s of btc worth of valid txn.

mircea_ahoy: which... you know, is not technically something bitcoin guarantees won't happen.

mircea_ahoy: even if you don'

mircea_ahoy: t care about days destroyed, the fee was in the top fifth anyway.

kakobrekla: !up mircea_ahoy

mircea_ahoy: but hey, for as long as the bullshit subsidy for blocks continues, this problem will persist.

mircea_ahoy: once they get 0.1 btc for a mined block, not including 0.0001 feed txn won't be feasible anymore.

kakobrekla: would be nice to figure out if this is some specific miners or all of them

mircea_ahoy: yes.

mircea_ahoy: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1360777 relevant ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 05:55:35; massiro: https://live.blockcypher.com/btc/tx/d8e60a0979024cce9159bd7b59594eae7dec627db5ac6bd088866afea533b0e9/

punkman: it's not even multisig, probably is nonstandard for 0.11 :D

kakobrekla: uh that site makes my head hurt.

kakobrekla: https://blockchain.info/address/1EMmmcooTXe64SY5X3FwTC1HU1t32XLWPx

assbot: Bitcoin Address 1EMmmcooTXe64SY5X3FwTC1HU1t32XLWPx ... ( http://bit.ly/1O3RWH7 )

mircea_ahoy: heh

kakobrekla: >Fee: 0 BTC

kakobrekla: this could possibly have something to do with it.

mircea_ahoy: possibly but it's not actually correct ?

mircea_ahoy: i don't think i've sent a 0 fee since 2012.

kakobrekla: i dunno

kakobrekla: odd stuff

punkman: so other txs from same wallet have gone through?

mircea_ahoy: same system's been paying bitbet since bitbet has invented.

mircea_ahoy: it's been running into random problems ever since, none of which have ever been fucking fixed.

kakobrekla: !up Batchulism

mircea_ahoy: occasionally i do a trilema piece about them, or used to at any rate, but really... kinda lost interest.

Batchulism: shouldn't 0 fee txn still show up on blockchain or other explorer, just with 0 confirmations?

mircea_ahoy: nobody's actually involved in making bitcoin not suck. there's a large group of idiots involved in trying to make themselves look good, and there's trb trying to make bitcoin be less g narly.

mircea_ahoy: fixing the actual usability issues looks at the present time like 2020

thestringpuller: ahoy mircea_ahoy

thestringpuller: where are you sailing to?

mircea_ahoy: just going up an' down the silver river.

mircea_ahoy: recharging tits & butts with solar power.

Batchulism: how long do 0 fee txn take to process? do they ever time out?

mircea_ahoy: even if in fact it were 0 fee, with that cointime mass it shouldn't take hours, let alone a whole day.

mircea_ahoy: ofcourse we've probably abandoned days destroyed because it's unfair or something, fuck knows anymore.

mircea_ahoy: but more generally, a txn can't time out for as long as it's being rebroadcast.

Batchulism: so what happens with the txn that were sent for the bets closed for new year that havent come through?

mircea_ahoy: they're in the mempool waiting to be included in a block.

mircea_ahoy: anyway, ima be landing. bbl.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25050 @ 0.00050989 = 12.7727 BTC [+] {2}

punkman: "Twitter Considering 10,000-Character Limit for Tweets"

punkman: http://img.svbtle.com/xpk4h3gh3zoq.png

assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Z6rAga )

shinohai: Sounds like the [ANN] section of bitcointalk.

punkman: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=102395.0

assbot: [Full Disclosure] CVE-2012-2459 (block merkle calculation exploit) ... ( http://bit.ly/1Z6sPf6 )

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39100 @ 0.0005129 = 20.0544 BTC [+] {3}

punkman: https://np.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3v1qv5/488_btc_was_stolen_from_me_but_how/cxjrv0w?context=3

assbot: arkanoah comments on 4.88 BTC was stolen from me, BUT HOW?! ... ( http://bit.ly/1Z6uYYj )

punkman: oops, that was in the log

punkman: CVE-2012-2459 isn't though, maybe a good thing to fix next trb release

punkman: https://np.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3zm3m7/cryptsy_halts_both_trade_engine_and_withdrawals/

assbot: Cryptsy halts both trade engine and withdrawals : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1Z6woSv )

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20455 @ 0.00050934 = 10.4185 BTC [-] {2}

shinohai: Good, I hope their little scam factory crashes and burns.

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22455 @ 0.00050003 = 11.2282 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17050 @ 0.00049675 = 8.4696 BTC [-] {2}

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12500 @ 0.00050183 = 6.2729 BTC [+] {2}

jurov: blockchain.info and blockexplorer.com know nothing of d8e60a0979024cce9159bd7b59594eae7dec627db5ac6bd088866afea533b0e9

jurov: anyone tried to submit it there directly?

deedbot-: [Qntra] Man Driven Into Historic Flood Waters By Missouri Police Dead - http://qntra.net/2016/01/man-driven-into-historic-flood-waters-by-missouri-police-dead/

jurov: blockr.io idem

jurov: interesting, this shows there is some unconfirmed tx, but never loads it https://blockexplorer.com/address/1EMmmcooTXe64SY5X3FwTC1HU1t32XLWPx

assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1mE5DmK )

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24200 @ 0.00050215 = 12.152 BTC [+] {3}

kakobrekla: http://lhartikk.github.io/ArnoldC/

assbot: ArnoldC ... ( http://bit.ly/1mE80Ga )

BingoBoingo: nice

BingoBoingo: except for the java part, but that can be fixed

BingoBoingo: !up Bitbet123

BingoBoingo: !up mircea_popescu

mircea_popescu: !rate brucefenton -10 working to coverup vessennes various frauds with the faux bitcoin foundation ☟︎

assbot: brucefenton is not registered in WoT.

mircea_popescu: rrright.

Bitbet123: Hi, why is bitbet not paying out?

mircea_popescu: Bitbet123 bitbet did pay out.

mircea_popescu: miners currently not including the transaction in blocks. go ask them why not.

Bitbet123: Can you not resend?

mircea_popescu: it's being rebroadcast every 2-4 hours actually.

kakobrekla: finally the pile of emails overflows to irc.

mircea_popescu: kakobrekla the wrong irc, but anyway.

Bitbet123: Well i'd like to receive my winnings

mircea_popescu: i bet you would.

punkman: you just gotta mine a block

mircea_popescu: unfortunately bitcoin doesn't seem to be ready for prime time just yet.

mircea_popescu: just like it wasn't back in... you know... http://trilema.com/2013/bitcoind-not-quite-ready-for-prime-time/

assbot: Bitcoind : not quite ready for prime time on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1mE8QCT )

mircea_popescu: 2013...

BingoBoingo: Mebbe you gotta double spend with moar fee?

mircea_popescu: if 0.001 ain't enough for 1kb it will just have to fucking wait.

mircea_popescu: i dunno who the fuck pays 100k satoshi / kb other than me.

BingoBoingo: 0.o

BingoBoingo: I usually do, but holy shit

danielpbarron: that's about hiw much it costs to train gathering in Eulora when you're the highest rank gatherer :D

mircea_popescu: anyway, Bitbet123 : the correct avenue here is to ask antpool / f2pool / whoever else why they aren't including tx d8e60a0979024cce9159bd7b59594eae7dec627db5ac6bd088866afea533b0e9

mircea_popescu: alternatively you could also ask various monkeys masquerading as "bitcoin devs" why the fuck they broke the protocol and are costing you money. ☟︎

shinohai: kek

davout: stuff's weird, i broadcast txes multiple times a day, paying 0.001 per, around 1~2kb, never had an issue

mircea_popescu: aha.

mircea_popescu: bitbet also never has an issue 99.9% of teh time

mircea_popescu: but as it turns out, THAT is not good enough for an actual, usable payment network.

davout: you sure you're not paying 0.0001 instead of 0.001 ?

davout: care to share the raw tx?

mircea_popescu: again - even if it were free, it should have been much higher priority than anything else.

davout: should it ?

mircea_popescu: myeah. i'd have to extract it, tho you could just fish it out of the mempool by hash i guess ?

davout: first thing i tried

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4001 @ 0.00050516 = 2.0211 BTC [+] {2}

davout: i want to try to push it myself, see what happens

mircea_popescu: aite ima have it extracted.

davout: bc.info doesn't see it, which happens fairly often in my experience, because it sucks

davout: but blockr.io doesn't see it either, which is more surprising, again, in my experience

davout: so i suspect it simply doesn't propagate

mircea_popescu: i dunno they kinda dropped off my map since they were acquired.

mircea_popescu: but, if you run a proper node i can connect to you and it should be in your mempool within the ... i dunno, minute, hour ?

davout: hang on, gonna check a different node

davout: nah, paymium's production node doesn't see it either

deedbot-: [Qntra] Twitter Suspends Oregon Hero's Account - http://qntra.net/2016/01/twitter-suspends-oregon-heros-account/

mircea_popescu: does twitter even do anything OTHER than suspend any account the moment it threatens veering into maybe vaguely interesting ?

BingoBoingo: Not really.

BingoBoingo: But the indictment in this case seems necessary

assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5086 @ 0.00050183 = 2.5523 BTC [-] {2}

BingoBoingo: So the next chapter of VanillaISIS knows to establish an embassy with tmsr before seceeding ☟︎

shinohai: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-01-2016#1361025 <<< I trolled Bruce Fenton by tweeting this to him earlier. ☝︎

assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 22:51:16; mircea_popescu: !rate brucefenton -10 working to coverup vessennes various frauds with the faux bitcoin foundation

punkman: Kodak brings back Super8, "Shooting Analogue has never been so easy. When you purchase film you will be buying the film, processing and digital transfer. The lab will send you your developed film back and email you a password to retrieve your digital scans from the cloud so you can edit and share in any way you choose."

punkman: who the fuck is gonna buy this thing

pete_dushenski: what's it cost ?

punkman: no idea

shinohai: https://i.imgur.com/VNAgKQV.jpg

assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1mEd7WZ )

mircea_popescu: chicks that wanna-be cool on the cheap ?

mircea_popescu: no shortage of those.

punkman: film is not cheap

mircea_popescu: yes but what people want and what people get...

punkman: though LOMO is another thing that inexplicably still exists, and it's pretty popular with the hipster chicks

mircea_popescu: i thought i just explained it.

punkman: http://shop.lomography.com/en ☟︎

davout: looks like hardware-instagram

punkman: heh

punkman: http://shop.lomography.com/en/home/newpetzval58-brass "the New Petzval 58 Bokeh Control Art Lens features a classic gear rack focusing mechanism and Waterhouse aperture plates for a truly 19th century-like photographic experience."

mircea_popescu: anyway, a casual inspection shows numerous txns with problems this year

mircea_popescu: http://dpaste.com/3SFFTB3 << list.

assbot: dpaste: 3SFFTB3 ... ( http://bit.ly/1mEdJfi )

davout: "Experiment with a diverse selection of films just for you! Choose from true-to-life color negatives or moody black & whites. Give slide emulsions a go or try your luck with expired rolls."

mircea_popescu: davout happen to see any of those ?

davout: lemme check

davout: none

mircea_popescu: heh.

davout: but do share d8e60a0979024cce9159bd7b59594eae7dec627db5ac6bd088866afea533b0e9, you made me curious

mircea_popescu: yeah, ima have it extracted.

davout: nothing about it in my debug.log

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform remind me, does -connect stack ? ☟︎

punkman: mircea_popescu: yes

mircea_popescu: cool, ima run up a node from that cluster including the known trb nodes specifically. if you want to get yours included davout or anyone else pm me an ip.

danielpbarron: i have a trb node that is not yet full, currently at block 312275