log☇︎
183600+ entries in 0.094s
asciilifeform: problem is that a language with nonhardrealtime gc is unsuitable for cryptography.
mircea_popescu: they didn't turn into very sad shriveled raisins of pain for trying.
mircea_popescu: say between whatever phf runs log on and the log itself ; or whatever ben_vulpes runs the bot on and so forth
mircea_popescu: yes, but so far i am rather impressed with the demonstrated interop.
mircea_popescu: there's no absolute reason most of the dos thing can;t actually be lisp
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform how did yo9u want to spend life decade ago ?
asciilifeform: but it will have to be made.
mircea_popescu: ie, low level labour strife, "how to make capitalist incapable of using his own capital goods without feeding us"
asciilifeform: nothing like what asciilifeform wanted, decade ago, to spend his life making.
asciilifeform: single-tasking, grim wartime thing.
mircea_popescu: in general, seems dos model is the winner. i dunno wtf unix is even supposed to be, honestly.
asciilifeform: but this is yet far.
asciilifeform: end result is to be a vaguely msdos-like thing that understands how to configure x64 page table, put/get blocks of disk, and speak over rs232 port. and on top of this, a self-building gnat. ☟︎☟︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: by now, pretty much foregone conclusion. if we need it, they can't have it.
asciilifeform: asciilifeform has stabbed on and off at the problem, for a very long time.
asciilifeform: it will have to be confiscated from the monkeys, like trb was.
asciilifeform: in other 3-years-and-continuing lulz, https://archive.is/kGc6w >> '...I've been trying to build these style tools for around 10 years, on and off, and they have never built correctly for these targets and any attempt to put in a bug report about it is a waste of time as someone comes along states it works and closes it, even though it doesn't.'
BingoBoingo: FUCK, no way to fix in lawg
mircea_popescu: ah that's right isn't it
jurov: asciilifeform: sorry to be shitharbinger, just writing to /dev/random is not enough https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/141197/why-writing-to-dev-random-does-not-make-parallel-reading-from-dev-random-faste ☟︎
mod6: this whole year has been nuts. i feel like im constantly behind. all that stuff with my mom just sucked up so much time.
mod6: na, not quite that long. it ~has~ been at least since xmas or so since I popped in last tho.
mod6: having fun with that.
mod6: gathering some things up in eulora.
mircea_popescu: glad to hear
mircea_popescu: so how's tricks in mod6 castle
asciilifeform: mod6: spits out the banner that Framedragger forgot to put in the original conversions
mod6: what does that ssh thing do?
mod6: one of these times you're gonna pop it
asciilifeform: ( part of the appeal of 'atomic' trng is that the 'fumes' concern evaporates. )
mod6: then that's what it is.
asciilifeform: von neumann's debias algo, and xor fold, are the two legit methods of dealing with this, but they have considerable cost ( each application of either , burns away 50% of incoming bits )
asciilifeform: all 'electric' schemes for trng have the basic problem of 'breathing own fumes'.
asciilifeform: there simply ain't moar to be had ( safely, that is -- you can use a faster-slewing op amp, in this collection scheme, but you will be harvesting power supply artifacts, 'voice of america', switching transients.. )
asciilifeform: mod6: you will notice that no fg hits >8kB/s at room temp, while the theoretical max is 14.4kB
asciilifeform: 2x temporal, that is. on top of 4x spatial.
asciilifeform: ( why to bother with hardware, if resorting to prng , remains a mystery )
asciilifeform: mod6: elementarily, 'limited entropy', 'respectable mainstream' turd can put out whatever it wants, GB/s, of prng
mod6: "m00" "oh your butt hurts" "m00!" "maybe get that fist out of your ass..." "n000!"
deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/7BD81DECC6EBEB3D6B64A8BB042AF3DEBE41F28F7BC5DD0CC2768C84A5297453 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 1792...6587 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '94.156.19.254 (ssh-rsa key from 94.156.19.254 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (nagios2.telecablenet.com. BG 13)
deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/7BD81DECC6EBEB3D6B64A8BB042AF3DEBE41F28F7BC5DD0CC2768C84A5297453 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 1568...0739 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '94.156.19.254 (ssh-rsa key from 94.156.19.254 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on Freenode, or email fd at mkj dot lt) <ssh...lt>; ' (nagios2.telecablenet.com. BG 13)
mod6: these cows just don't care they they have an NSA fist in their asses. never did, never will.
mod6: <+asciilifeform> ^ d00d pushing 'onerng' over FUCKGOATS, with argument that the former 'is open source, mathematically verifiable, ...drivers for all current os, even openbsd...' while the latter 'no drivers, connection using obsolete medium - serial port, limited entropy' << limited entropy?! herp.
mircea_popescu: "use these things thatr won't do anything"
mircea_popescu: there's a reason the "security.nl" maggots say what they say.
asciilifeform: if you can't recompile ( or better still, use sane proggy ) you're fucked, there is no pill.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the koch episode was actually illustrative of the futility of 'just fix /dev/random'. it'd have done ~zero~ against the koch rng poisoning thing.
asciilifeform: shinohai: add to the loooong list of 'tardanos'
asciilifeform: keyboardization gives even greater 'nonspecificity of diddling', at the cost of 'can't have it plugged in 24/7, must use in bursts' ( as most os don't work with >1 kbd correctly )
shinohai: Ledger branching out to pgptronics: https://github.com/LedgerHQ/blue-app-openpgp-card
asciilifeform: relatedly, at one point i considered a FG add-on that'd turn it into a ps/2 'keyboard' eternally pissing out, e.g., d0bc05f466024f14... which, e.g., xxd will happily eat & turn into binariola
asciilifeform: ( incidentally astute students of FUCKGOATSology will notice that the principle is applied INSIDE the device as well - FG has nfi what is plugged into rng jacks, actual analogue rng boards or tester jig )
mircea_popescu: basically it's the eternal culture shock. "i protest that this tmsr item is ideologically incompatible with the shitempire i inhabit" "blow it out your ass" "TERRORISM!"
mircea_popescu: whereas just feeding it into the kernel pool might help to some degree and is actually feasible.
mircea_popescu: yes. the idea being that your methiod while correct requires fixing all the shit programs. which ain't gonan happen. nor can it.
asciilifeform: to see if the expected output results
asciilifeform: not to mention a proggy that eats rng oughta be periodically tested using ~known~ bits
asciilifeform: 'need to know principle', if you will -- kernel has no business having centralized 'and these here are rngs'
mircea_popescu: yes but they already got their userland, and it's a) shit and b) unrecompilable.
asciilifeform: but that the ~correct~ move is proggy that takes a /dev/foo1,/dev/foo2... as command line params and eats rng from ~there~
mircea_popescu: i suppose "driver" in context might mean a kernel patch to feed /random from fg
asciilifeform: it isn't that it is necessarily bad move
mircea_popescu: seeing how the alternative is koch-hashes.
mircea_popescu: it's still not clear to me dumping it into the pool is a bad move.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: iirc we had a thread even here where somebody whined that FG doesn't work as a 'totem' where you 'plug in and forget and it just becomes your /dev/random' and that it has to be actively ~used~ ☟︎
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> might as well ask the kfc colonel his professional opinion re fort sumter. << "Lincoln was a war criminal" is the response I got
a111: Logged on 2016-06-19 05:35 asciilifeform: the next morning, commander tours the base, says to sergeant: 'everything seems ok, but what is this nonsense, they showed me the scrapyard and your men threw out a perfectly fine burbulator!!!'
mircea_popescu: but everything has a bunch of them so
mircea_popescu: better than driver.
mircea_popescu: anywya, maybe we can talk diana_coman into borrowing us a manager class.
mircea_popescu: no but all the peripheral boxes he ever saw had the bullet point there.
asciilifeform: better still, to read the docs and think for 30sec and realize that THING USES NO DRIVER
mircea_popescu: thje everloving fuck will they do ?
mircea_popescu: rather than try and fix it, and in the process learn a thing or two about just how utterly fucktarded they are.
mircea_popescu: but no, instead every two bit twentysomething shithead importantly sits on an imagined throne and JUDGES THE WORLD!!11
mircea_popescu: isn't THAT what the douche was supposed to publish on his stupid blog ?
asciilifeform: gotta luvvv all the nitwits who think that pc has any business being able to talk TO an rng box
mircea_popescu: and here i sat and thought naively that open source is all about "hey, i perceive the need for these so called drivers, item dun has them, I WILL MAKE MYSELF"
mircea_popescu: "you can always recognize a fuckgoats by that sure sign, that all the dounces in the county are arrayed in a confederacy against it."
asciilifeform: linked mainly for the 'drivers' lul
mircea_popescu: how did that quote abnout a confederacy of dounces go
mircea_popescu: isn't "onerng" the thing captain bullshit was pushing in that dumb chan ?
asciilifeform: ^ d00d pushing 'onerng' over FUCKGOATS, with argument that the former 'is open source, mathematically verifiable, ...drivers for all current os, even openbsd...' while the latter 'no drivers, connection using obsolete medium - serial port, limited entropy'
asciilifeform: iet bij nosuchlabs. En nee, er is totaal geen sprake van meer spreekwoordelijk alufolie, integendeel. Geen drivers, aansluiting via een niet meer aanwezig medium (seriele poort), beperkte hoeveelheid random data en ga zo maar door.'
asciilifeform: meanwhile, in other excavations, https://www.security.nl/posting/505769/Random+Bit+Generator+voor+zelfbouw >> 'Het ontwerp is volledig open source, het geleverde product is te verifiëren zodat je kunt zien dat er niets is toegevoegd of weggelaten, de randomization is wiskundig verifieerbaar. Er zijn drivers voor eigenlijk alle gangbare operating systems, zelfs voor OpenBSD, en dat voor een prijs van USD 40. Die onderbouwing zie ik n
asciilifeform: not sure if that one can be pinned on rms per se -- he was already in his ambulatory mushroom phase at that point
mircea_popescu still can't forget the "i have a laptop that doesn't exist" bs.
mircea_popescu: then he worked it on software, and THEN he worked it on hardware.
mircea_popescu: but he worked the cycle on emacs first.
mircea_popescu: 2 things.
mircea_popescu: and that was emacs ?
asciilifeform: rms afaik is not a serial anything, had exactly 1 thing
asciilifeform: 'worked' seems to imply cynical fraud from t=0
asciilifeform: where's the cut between 'worked cycle' and 'turned traitor' ?
mircea_popescu: and this model ENTIRELY explains all of the "luminaries". werner koch worked the feeder-chumper cycle. stallman worked the feeder-chumper cycle. curtis yarvin worked the etcetera. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: which is why "eth has market value". the entire market value of ethereum (all chains) is under a grand. but the lizards will keep buying it, for all the fiddy bux a week that costs, to prop up the pretense. if it catches, they got "millionz" and if not they're out five coffees for a dozen losers who were getting that coffee off social security anyway.
mircea_popescu: the ur-model of this is "modern" ourdemocracy currency. while they can falsify it, YOU can't. this means they can prop its value up for as long as it takes for idiot-you to buy into the theory that "usd is actually valuable", after which they can turn on the printing.
mircea_popescu: the hanno boecks always work in the same cycle. feeder phase where they "seem reasonable" and chumpatron phase where they shed the half-hour-horizon idiots who bought it. ☟︎
mircea_popescu: might as well ask the kfc colonel his professional opinion re fort sumter.
asciilifeform: dunno, but he's marched under the colours, and asciilifeform has not, so automatically 'gotta ask'