trinque: screen is kinda bright for outside eh?
mircea_popescu: gotta convict them to be beheaded, along with the entire fambly, through plain legal proceedings.
punkman: gonna be a long wait for that
punkman: the terrorists never did much anyway, firebomb here and there every few weeks for a while
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37701 @ 0.00053428 = 20.1429 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: iirc they killed some cia dude then tapered off after that
punkman: CIA station chief was their first one, then they killed some people in the 80s
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46399 @ 0.00054175 = 25.1367 BTC [+] {4}
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 291.05, Best ask: 291.48, Bid-ask spread: 0.43000, Last trade: 291.28, 24 hour volume: 74167.38437043, 24 hour low: 281.5, 24 hour high: 312.0, 24 hour vwap: None
punkman: "the Baris journalist who had come into the possession of FM 30-31B disappeared and was never heard of again"
punkman: but it's totally a soviet forgery
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 112852 @ 0.00054015 = 60.957 BTC [-]
trinque: someday... it's going to be either the longest or shortest trial there ever was
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 94600 @ 0.00054542 = 51.5967 BTC [+] {4}
trinque: who knows what the future will bring
mircea_popescu: nothing is ever more common than the delusional notion that "these people" will escape.
mircea_popescu: yet it hasn't yet occured to date anyone skipped on the "impossibru" sauce, either.
trinque: uk ruled the whole world; look at them now
trinque: from where I sit they got theirs
trinque: maybe so, and maybe someone will say that's still true of the next thing
mircea_popescu: "This has become the case with many white employees in retain food establishments who spend their shifts being harangued, threatened and demeaned by hate-spewing black customers who typically spend more on groceries in a visit than many retail food employees make in two weeks. Being a white employee in a city supermarket is like being a peasant on a medieval lord’s land."
mircea_popescu: guy's got money and you're the clerk. go suck his fucking cock omfg.
mircea_popescu: of course being an employee in a supermarket is being a peasant on a lord's land. that is EXACTLY what it is.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform heh mkay, let's fix stupid by being stupid the other way!!1
mircea_popescu: wtf's next, we're all equal to the supermarket bozo and #holdhands ?
mircea_popescu: anyway, petty supermarket hostility bs. guy has better posts imo.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86500 @ 0.00053767 = 46.5085 BTC [-]
trinque: god damn that cat in the sandal is hilarious
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30200 @ 0.00051702 = 15.614 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> anyway, petty supermarket hostility bs. guy has better posts imo. << Supermarket guy is rightly in a low place. Welafare orcs excessively elevated. It's this sort of mess that will take Aztalan all the way to Long Island.
mircea_popescu: i dunno dude, seems nuts to me. some derp wishes to justify his being an asshole to some woman on the grounds of wide reaching sociodynamics ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12015 @ 0.00052569 = 6.3162 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: what, he's a faitful soldier in the war of whitehood against the evil blacks through not holding the door to some woman ?
mircea_popescu: some people are born to die on plastic carpeting under fluorescent lights srsly.
BingoBoingo: Dude seems rather obviously nuts, but it seems a symptom of the larger American decay.
mircea_popescu: there was some random retard of equivalent potency i loled at the expense of on trilema. this one was on a trip about how he "is trying to live to the server's expectations" or some shit in a restaurant.
mircea_popescu: the issues people have in their own heads, when those heads are squarely devoid of anything worthwhile...
mircea_popescu: he's supposed to go "i'm a fuckwad of a lifeform, and not only i deserve every bit of the shit i get, but if i keep course there's going to be more"
mircea_popescu: not this retarded "blacks made me be stupid and lousy" nonsense
mircea_popescu: asshole comes from a three generations line of jwz "i only wanted to...", and now he doesn't like the just dessers ?
assbot: Big Head Press - Thoughtful Stories, Graphic Novels Online And In Print - The Probability Broach: The Graphic Novel, by L. Neil Smith and Scott Bieser ... (
http://bit.ly/1HZrrkg )
BingoBoingo: Millions of noveau poor USians emerge from school every year disadvantaged because they went to "good" schools in the suburbs that insulated them from orcraft
mircea_popescu: i thought us supermarkets all have those sliding autodoors anyway, specifically to deal with the ever growing social awkwardness of usians.
trinque: sucks to be them; I went to those shitty suburban schools too
mircea_popescu: they're in kindergarten, there's no other way to look at it.
mircea_popescu: they're in kindergarten and they're whacking each other over the head with the cubes.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> they're in kindergarten and they're whacking each other over the head with the cubes. << Seriously can't even have a good riot
mircea_popescu: what i don't understand is why do they take it out on the blacks ffs.
mircea_popescu: THEY are to blame, for having believed bush or whoever the fuck they believed.
trinque: because they're there, and different
mircea_popescu: like, before. and for that matter, know the terrain a lot better.
mircea_popescu: i suppose these are the same typically retarded usians that go to india and blame the indians for their inability to dowhatever X they wish to do.
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> what i don't understand is why do they take it out on the blacks ffs. << noveau poor envies the comforts of the old poor
mircea_popescu: not like black dude cold-called you and persuaded you to be poor, motherfuckar!
BingoBoingo: Mostly noveau poor lacks the refinement of the old poor which prevents them from going full orc and riding the welfare train
mircea_popescu: if white bitches spent more time learning how to twerk at age 6, perhaps anyone'd give a lot more of a shit about the problems of white trash.
hanbot: <mircea_popescu> hanbot do you recall which article that was ? < i apparently don't
trinque: americans are subconsciously terrified of their own govt
mircea_popescu: what, he's special or something ? can't fit a shoeshine box in his hands ?
trinque: they simultaneously derive some kind of self-esteem from this fact
trinque: so no, they're not going to lash out at the monster, just some weird looking guy if they run across one
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so don't hold open the door to THAT OFFICE then!
mircea_popescu: trinque or an incapacitated woman with children, why not
trinque: the louder my "countrymen" shout about nonsense the more I smell pissed pants
mircea_popescu: dude's such a public danger, why doesn't he go around at night through the ghetto bumping into derps and immitating anything they say!
mircea_popescu: (yes, i used to do that, at that age. it was fun, fwiww.)
trinque: why's every american an anxiety-ridden, pill-popping nutcase?
trinque: couldn't possibly be the unpredictable insanity of the economic system, or the brutal, violent govt
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 116100 @ 0.00052869 = 61.3809 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ironically enough, with a beheaded hamilton the us would still to this day be a sort of congo.
mircea_popescu: the brief excursion into world relevancy of the shithole in question is wholly owed to hamilton & co.
mircea_popescu: true enough that it doesn't seem to last, congo is congo. but... it was a decent trip, for as long as it lasted.
punkman: I got a couple scamcalls from the Congo few months ago
punkman: no idea, didn't pick up in time, just saw them in logs
mircea_popescu: twist : punkman's half brother has been in prison in congo since feb
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo i wonder if this is going to lead to a new musical genre off the old superhero comics tree. just like destitute niggers had their stupid gangsta shit.
mircea_popescu: christian glam rock bands singin' about how they don't hold doors open at supermarket
mircea_popescu: "whatever... i slam doors and i kill people! it's my hot country and i do what i want!"
trinque: there's some kind of shitty white supremacist "punk" I think
trinque: I've long wondered where all the supposed neonazis are; met one a while back and I think all he did was shoot guns and get tattoes
mircea_popescu: should make for some pretty easy enthusiastic teenage poon, if it ever takes off.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I don't see how it doesn't happen as I only anticipate the rape of white trash to increase.
trinque: it's strange; there's something similar between the guy's door-holding and the utter lack of any dangerous subculture
trinque: as if all we can do is "act as if X"
trinque: somebody more well-read could identify what's malfunctioning in american identity-synthesis there
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Sure, but there's going to be a lot more Chinese. It also really doesn't help the newer generations of white trash that they are ill equipped mentally, physically, and morally to cope.
trinque: mircea_popescu: yeah, what you said about a country being a place where young men know who they are, it's right on the mark
trinque: I considered that particular line for a long while after
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo on the positive side, all good things ever come out of an ill equipped kid stuck in a blender.
kakobrekla: the timeout on the search is outrageous.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla mthreat said it's being moved to another server.
kakobrekla: aha, i had that particular
http request in mind, but good to know
mircea_popescu: trinque and that's what multiculturalism actually is, ftr. given that it is SO COMPLICATED to have a cultural superstructure that allows any semblance of passible solution to that, and given that any sort of formal proof of superiority and inferiority ~AMONG THAT SET~, strictly, strictly among that set is so hopeless,
mircea_popescu: you're way the fuck better off just letting everybody use their own answers than trying to force some sort of homogenity.
mircea_popescu: obviously you can't have "multiculturalism" among things that aren't even subcultures, let alone cultures in their own right.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: but go explain to taleb why he should stop wearing the facial hair style he does. because why ? reasons ? he got reasons too.
trinque: hm, it's like in the place where culture might develop, they've placed a culture-shredder
trinque: I wonder whether anyone actually intended it. It seems too well designed, that you create this concept "multiculturalism" which by definition subsumes whatever particular ideas you might have as an individual.
trinque: but you see.. in order for us to hold hands multiculturally, there are going to have to be some rules...
trinque: where have I seen this kind of short circuiting before
trinque: like in portland you can come to work at a software company as a male with a skirt on and your nails done, no shoes on, so long as you shut the fuck up and work
trinque: not that I mind that at all, but it illustrates the "make any choice, so long as your domain of choosing is entirely irrelevant"
mircea_popescu: the original concept is merely commentary, on lengthy extant tradition, and it stands on its own as a perfectly sensible term of art in its field.
mircea_popescu: that the usians can not read and regularly hang themselves in the fancy underwear they bought in paris is not the underwear's fault.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 133650 @ 0.00053734 = 71.8155 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: just a matter of words meaning whatever ya like
trinque: if there's a facebook group for it, it's a culture
trinque: if there's a github, there's a community
trinque: gotta have that other thing of which to be "sub"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58500 @ 0.00051339 = 30.0333 BTC [-] {3}
cazalla: mircea_popescu, would you give any weight to studies that show multiculti undermines social trust? (i try to keep in mind these are studies done by gov dept)
mircea_popescu: yeah well, here's the thing : the variable you are likely calling this is a direct inverse of graph connectivity.
mircea_popescu: which means it is being undermined by improved communication.
mircea_popescu: it stands to intuitive reason if you look at it : the more people can talk to more people, the less any individual talk can be trusted, yes ?
cazalla: my experience is that no-one talks to anyone
mircea_popescu: once software acquired the ability to be "updated online", atomic software versions became less trustworthy.
mircea_popescu: because instead of doing anything right, people just slap it together and "we'll do an update later"
trinque: cazalla: I greet neighbors or people on the street here and they look down
mircea_popescu: technology's your enemy there, not anything to do with society.
trinque: I still do it, because fuck them.
trinque: but that was a nice thing about Texan (sub)culture
trinque: you goddamn greet people when you walk by
trinque: well there are unspoken rules of it
cazalla: trinque, i talk to my neighbour over the back but i couldn't tell you who else lives in this street.. growing up it was rare not to know
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63014 @ 0.00055212 = 34.7913 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: I knew and drank with everybody I lived in an apt building with in tx
trinque: dunno any of these nervous fucks
trinque: sure that might be a factor
mircea_popescu: older people eventually figure out everyone's an idiot anyway
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23518 @ 0.00054815 = 12.8914 BTC [-]
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 01:29:17; mircea_popescu: how do you measure "social trust" ?
mircea_popescu: for one thing, because dumbass russian locks, kept no one out.
trinque: meh, I leave windows open all night on the ground floor
mircea_popescu: fgor the other, because orly, you're gonna ROB ME ?!!?
mircea_popescu: you ever read the story of the whores and the thieves ?
trinque: only crime around here is someone comes and steals your grill off the porch
assbot: You rated user phf on 24-Jun-2015, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: New blood.
mircea_popescu: !rate phf 2 Actually managed to compile Eulora on OS/X, which is a first.
mircea_popescu: !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.phf.2:6b5c1f07e27f7b7ae974773e4c050cfce50f47f405a2e9fdf2666a78059e721a
assbot: Successfully updated the rating for phf from 1 to 2 with note: Actually managed to compile Eulora on OS/X, which is a first.
gribble: Current Blocks: 365212 | Current Difficulty: 5.1076366303481926E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 366911 | Next Difficulty In: 1699 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 4 days, 23 hours, 9 minutes, and 17 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 47150109359.0 | Estimated Percent Change: -7.68703
punkman: ok turdatron must hate me, seems it even ate last email which I sent with "swaks"
BingoBoingo: punkman: Have you tried sending with 'mail'
punkman: BingoBoingo: does it do attachments?
punkman: swaks is a crazy perl script for smtp testing, it works.
assbot: Big Head Press - Thoughtful Stories, Graphic Novels Online And In Print - The Probability Broach: The Graphic Novel, by L. Neil Smith and Scott Bieser ... (
http://bit.ly/1eY3I8R )
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 01:15:43; mircea_popescu: obviously you can't have "multiculturalism" among things that aren't even subcultures, let alone cultures in their own right.
decimation: absolutely. I've mentioned the german community that used to exist, for instance
decimation: us cities around 1900 were full of ethnic ghettos
decimation: the black were imported to bust these up in order to prevent 'independent vote blocs'
trinque: doesn't seem like those transplants took
mircea_popescu: eh for chrissakes. you and your wife going on a cruise does not now constitute an "english culture" in oceania.
trinque: my family goes back to a big italian clan that moved over in I think the 30s or so
trinque: do you think I have any connections?
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 00:33:04; mircea_popescu: servants getting uppity ffs.
decimation: maryland, for instance, has a 'poor people health insurance' where they are required to pay $1, if they can afford it
trinque: lol how do they means-test that?
trinque: ask for a dollar, and then write down the "no" response?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61593 @ 0.0005364 = 33.0385 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: and ftr i am naught impressed with this "got bugsprayed" bs.
trinque: cazalla: heh I got bussed as a white kid to the shittier public school back in the day for the same reason
decimation: cazalla: Obama's a lame duck, the most he can do is hand out goodies so that democrats show up to vote next time
cazalla: taking the bus to school such a strange concept.. i use to ride my bmx doing bunny hops and all sorts along the way
decimation: cazalla: most us towns - even little cities - have a massive bus infrastructure just to take kids to and from school - and nobody else
mircea_popescu: what, is this the universal excuse now ? "why is he fucking dumb ?" "he is ~~~affraid for his own physical safety~~~ magic wordsd!!!" "oh ok then, all is well, carry on"
decimation: mircea_popescu: which is why they left, and it is crumbling
mircea_popescu: by any practical measure they were an offense to the land they shaded.
mod6: So over the weekend and today, was working on building a new gentoo-amd64-nomultilib (glibc) instance to test out application of patches with v0.5.3.1-RELEASE as the base. Was able to build static binaries with gentoo & glibc just fine with both a modified auto-static (auto.sh) and with a slightly modified stator.sh script.
mod6: Upon successful compilation, both static builds were able to pull at least 150`000 blocks from mp's node.
mircea_popescu: tried to track it with a node, it resulted in a stuck node 0.O
mod6: mircea_popescu: it appears to me that they are. I have two build logs (one for with auto.sh and one with stator.sh). They can be found:
cazalla: decimation, they had a bus for the high school i attended and when i got sent to naughty boy school i was given a train ticket which provide free travel (which was self defeating in that i no longer had to jump the train but could now ride legit for free lol)
mod6: (at the bottom of these sizeable files, you can see me run `ldd` and `readelf` against the output binaries)
mod6: I have created a simple build script that will pull all of the patches, verify them, apply the patches at the top of the file. Along with anything else that was required.
decimation: cazalla: at least you rode transport that others in the city could use
mod6: This is all leading up to a new "patching guide" that I'm working on. Which is basically finished, save the fact I've yet to decide which direction to go on the build script. On one hand, I really love how simple and clean stator.sh is, but with auto.sh, I like how it automatically pulls the archives for you and creates the directories. etc.
decimation: my node has taken almost 2 weeks to get to 264k
mod6: Anyway, working on it. :]
mod6: decimation: plugged into mp's node?
mod6: <@asciilifeform> modified how ? << with stator, I needed to add back in 'no-shared', according to
http://wiki.openssl.org/index.php/Compilation_and_Installation this is required for us (probably). And I also needed to modify your line `cd bitcoin/bitcoin/src;` to `cd bitcoin/src;`. All of the things are in the build log, I tried not to leave anything out.
ag3nt_zer0: several months back I was at the plug and play bitcoin meetup... Nathaniel Popper was there talking about his book... anyway, after the talk I was standing in line to ask him to clarify something when this familiar-looking chap gets in line behind me. asks me who what etc...
mod6: Those were the only changes to stator that were required to make it fit with the release artifact.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 74689 @ 0.00053922 = 40.2738 BTC [+] {2}
mod6: thx trinque, asciilifeform, mircea_popescu, et al. :]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 198721 @ 0.00055277 = 109.847 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 182100 @ 0.000534 = 97.2414 BTC [-] {4}
ag3nt_zer0: at the time I was all zigzagged about Trilema and so I asked him if he had heard of it... he scanned the files that the eye accesses when it looks down/right and there was a spark... he said "what's that?"... I said "dunno, run by this guy Mircea something or other"... he said "oh, that guy doesnt like me"... later he asked for my number and when he pulled out his phone I saw his name was Tim Swanson
ag3nt_zer0: trivial perhaps, and not to make fun of him, but I thought it was pretty funny...
decimation: ag3nt_zer0: was already done, look in the logs
ag3nt_zer0: decimation: thanks. guess I should make that a habit before posting here...
cazalla: i think the tim swanson story more than makes up for it ag3nt_zer0
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51444 @ 0.00055465 = 28.5334 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 117256 @ 0.00055519 = 65.0994 BTC [+]
mod6: well, actually, I didn't /have/ to at all.
mod6: every time i've built the 'stator' before, the output binary was fine.
mod6: statically built. but I recall going through this in march how we needed that in there... just maybe overly paranoid.
mod6: <@asciilifeform> might be interesting << i have not, as of yet.
trinque: didn't openssl itself have some derpy module-loader thing?
mod6: would be easy for me to try now though.
trinque: perhaps the flag enables/disables that
decimation: yes, openssl had a dynamic library loader flag
mircea_popescu: <mod6> I have created a simple build script << you may consider signing some of the things you pull
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11900 @ 0.00055519 = 6.6068 BTC [+]
mod6: sign the patches before pulling?
mod6: this is for *Experimental* only.
mod6: I only stamp approval at release time.
mircea_popescu: ag3nt_zer0 i dun particularly care one way or the other. the discussion's in teh logs which atm can't be searched it seems.
decimation: mthreat explained his hosting guy forgot to pay the bills
ag3nt_zer0: yeah was just gonna say search not working
mod6: There are some very far reaching effects of the patches applied in these build logs. They appear to "work", but as of yet, they're basically untested.
mod6: not taken that way :]
ag3nt_zer0: asciilifeform: yes I found that... thx
mod6: ok building again without 'no-shared' for binary examination
mod6: <@asciilifeform> doesn't imply endorsement << ok. i was just under the impression that's excatly what it meant.
mod6: I emboss cryptographically, stating that I've read, comprehended, approved and would apply in my own battlestation.
mod6: That's fair if it has a disclaimer.
mod6: lol, guess I just didn't wanna clutter up the turdomatic or confuse anyone either.
mod6: less is more, as always. if there's too much in there, it's less likely to be read.
mod6: I see, we just have a bit different view of the thing. I only wanna send stuff in that I can pretty much stand behind.
mod6: One of the resasons that I haven't even posted the gentoo build guide to the list either.
mod6: I've tested it, trinque has tested it, but we need a third party to independantly verify so I know what I'm publishing there is as correct as it can be.
mod6: I'll give this some further thought going forward. I don't wanna hold off on pulling the trigger on this stuff if all I need is simple skull & cross bones.
trinque: I can see the point that two signatures would've communicated what you said, mod6
mod6: asciilifeform: noted.
mod6: <+trinque> I can see the point that two signatures would've communicated what you said, mod6 << in that it would have been 1/2 of the foundation's official seal?
mod6: i thought so too. and it's a credit to my trust of asciilifeform that I verify his signature, and we have a L1 trust between us.
mod6: eh, that was poorly worded. I think you all understand my meaning.
trinque: I mean that it indelibly marks the text in question with the involvement of the signers
trinque: I do read the mailing list, yes
trinque: jurov: tls outbound smtp for the mailing list plz?
trinque: should be a simple switch to flip in main.cf
trinque: for no better reason than I've required it on my end and it cut spam by 100x
mod6: asciilifeform: point taken. glad we talked about it. and yeah, very much so read and examine every patch.
trinque: sure, I wasn't saying that
trinque: the box was getting ass-blasted with spam
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8800 @ 0.00054366 = 4.7842 BTC [-]
trinque: sure, was running spamassassin and whatnot
trinque: your point about heartbleed is well taken
mod6: it does help. i often have to come back to it like a day later and re-read my own stuff for the 9th time.
mod6: also more eyes help too. sometimes we all miss stuff.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23750 @ 0.00054366 = 12.9119 BTC [-]
mod6: I'll make an effort this week to sign the patches I've read and understand, even if still experimental at this time.
mod6: and I'll find a new ascii art instead of the jolly roger ;)
mod6: ah, yeah... hm. I believe when I went to sign all the patches from the last release, I had to pull the patches, and then sign them as if I had wrote them myself for them to be accepted.
mod6: They needed to basically have the same SHA1s as the originals, with my own detatched sig.
mod6: Anyway, yah, will take a look when search comes back.
mod6: Someday, we're gonna get the kinks worked out of this system.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 87466 @ 0.00054424 = 47.6025 BTC [+] {2}
mod6: ok this build is just about done...
ag3nt_zer0: whoops that was for trinque... hadn' scrolled
mod6: asciilifeform: ok, compile complete.
mod6: welp, they do hvae differenet hashes. that at least is obv.
mod6: ok, i was just gonna do a quick `xxd <file> | less` and look at 'em side by side.
mod6: ok looking through the hexdump -C diff now....
mod6: yeah, i thought about that first actually. but gotta recompile since bins are striped
mod6: i'll tackle that tomorrow i think.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 67637 @ 0.00055146 = 37.2991 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30750 @ 0.00055533 = 17.0764 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52050 @ 0.00055536 = 28.9065 BTC [+]
phf: i will neither confirm nor deny it until i understand the implications :>
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49636 @ 0.00054258 = 26.9315 BTC [-] {2}
phf: speaking of, why are keys get turned into little bit o' nothings?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 114400 @ 0.00055561 = 63.5618 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66762 @ 0.0005416 = 36.1583 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41000 @ 0.00053454 = 21.9161 BTC [-] {2}
cazalla: mircea_popescu, is this ddos on qntra or something else?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30400 @ 0.00054874 = 16.6817 BTC [+]
phf: well, that was my first eulora drama, came back to find my future fortune literally crumble to little bits o' nothing. tracked the coordinates, explored.. nothing. literally feels like i just frantically dug a bunch of earth looking for wooly mushrooms that are no longer there
phf: i had no time to, i was enjoying the scenery :)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34450 @ 0.00055472 = 19.1101 BTC [+]
phf: scuffed up my pick for nothing too. eulora is unforgiving!
gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 289.0, Best ask: 289.01, Bid-ask spread: 0.01000, Last trade: 289.0, 24 hour volume: 69603.92785995, 24 hour low: 281.5, 24 hour high: 308.8, 24 hour vwap: None
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20019 @ 0.00055472 = 11.1049 BTC [+]
phf: it's amusing, old school. reminds me of early 3d rpgs. i didn't realize how small the island is though. needs more scenery
phf: mircea_popescu: oh, then and they stick around?
mircea_popescu: anyway, as the population progresses there's gonna be moar maps, but atm too noobish :D
phf: i saw someone's tent so i assume that was possible, but a ship
phf: are you thinking of extending the same map, or completely new locations via teleports or such?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28300 @ 0.00055472 = 15.6986 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: anyway, the whole thing is very much player driven. for instance, out of the ~dozen skills available, afaik players found like .. 4 so far ? i guess 5.
mircea_popescu: there's going to be an update this week adding more, but i doubt anyone's gonna see it this month. maybe. depends how seriously ppl play.
mircea_popescu: and generally, i expect expansions to be there long before anyone actually reached the point where they can play them
phf: well, my initial impression is that it would be hard to discover all the available functionality
BingoBoingo: Does Eulora have chairs yet, so that they may be stacked for space exploration purposes?
phf: i started with help, but there wasn't even a mention of mining, and some of the commands that are in help are not implemented (e.g. /dig)
mircea_popescu: phf yeah the helpfile as bundled with the client is a mess atm.
phf: oh i thought that was pulled from the server
mircea_popescu: if you read the first node, which is really all that i've bothered with, it even tells you the location on disk
mircea_popescu: it'll get wiped eventually even if locked, but you get more than the unlocked hour.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 83137 @ 0.00055533 = 46.1685 BTC [+] {4}
mircea_popescu: anyway, the current eulora problem as far as miners are concerned is : there's a single shot very powerful mining tool, which seems like the oinly hope to acquire essential resources choking toolmaking and cooking. since these are in short supply, people are working to make a map of known resources, so as to explore the unknown spots
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 146113 @ 0.00055648 = 81.309 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: or alternatively you could find someone to sell you the crafting starter item and try to get skill starter drops
phf: it's very much a scarcity world
phf: right, exactly i was about to say, necessary with the funding model
mircea_popescu: not even the funding model, it deliberately has a strong currency for purely game design concerns
mircea_popescu: none of that bullshit bezzle game economics, ima puke if i see another SoJ
CrazyLoafer: wow this is where all the celebrities hang out :O
CrazyLoafer: just a crypto investor; saw a mention of this site and wanted to check it out
cazalla: CrazyLoafer, what are your investments?
mircea_popescu: phf or for that matter wow style "rares" which everyone has. wtf is achievement even supposed to mean outside of a scarcity world.
mircea_popescu: dumbass ipad games, you tap the screen twice and it's CONGRATULATIONS! you're level 5.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 114303 @ 0.00055811 = 63.7936 BTC [+] {4}
mircea_popescu: which obviously, together with their inability to model, makes bullshit like "level caps" unavoidable and on and fucking on
BingoBoingo built cal3d, building crystalspace, seeing later if Eulora builds
phf: 3d jiggle technologies have gone a long way
mircea_popescu: phf cheaper to just put one slave girl on twerk detail while playing an actual game
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63595 @ 0.00053865 = 34.2554 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11098 @ 0.0005376 = 5.9663 BTC [-]
phf: it seems like a tricky balance between integrity and fun. i've not thought about this enough, but it seems the more integrity you have in game the more you gain by not actually directly playing the game
BingoBoingo: I'm just trying the lazy way before actually hunting down the "correct" versions of Cal3d and crystalspace
phf: mining for example is usually solved either by people who have nothing better to do but grind, or else heavy scripting
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26800 @ 0.00056078 = 15.0289 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 78600 @ 0.00056172 = 44.1512 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: phf in any case, there is no actual incentive to bot, or i suppose the proper format would be to say everyone can bot just as well.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 65900 @ 0.00056172 = 37.0173 BTC [+] {2}
phf: i'm thinking i don't know enough about how eulora world works to say much. you mentioned that people are mapping mining locations, but then i tried searching for mushrooms around a location where i found them previously and couldn't find any
phf: so i'm sure there's some kind of logic there that i don't yet understand
mircea_popescu: but basically, from a player pov, the economy is elastic enough you can choose. you wish to risk 100 coppers per click, do X. you wish to risk 10k per click, no need to do X 100 times, can just as well do Y.
mircea_popescu: whereas in stupid games, it's "faucet X is the biggest, gotta bot this or bust".
mircea_popescu: and it has little to dowith bottage, it becomes a time arbitrage - if bots are prevented chinese farms will do it by hand
phf: seems like if i wanted to find them, i might as well write a bot that would do random walk, then explore, etc. let it run for a day. though that will cost me in pick quality. hmm
phf: i see what you mean above
mircea_popescu: some people enjoy the detail, they can do X. some people enjoy pacino's puckered asshole... let them do y.
mircea_popescu: there's no level cap either, you can craft anything as a noob.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: yep I have, although afaik he's getting out the silver game
mircea_popescu: had the longest standing debate with hanbot, whether he's a superellaborate troll or what.
fluffypony: yeah, and he's a nice enough guy, had fun drinking with him in Berlin
mircea_popescu: phf which is why it's fun - actually fun. because you gotta find a way. it's too complex to effectually model even, at least so far, so therefore what bots.
mircea_popescu: now, granted, this isn'tr most people's idea of fun - having an untractable problem in their lap.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58300 @ 0.0005575 = 32.5023 BTC [-]
phf: well, it was naive of me to expect a b-a game to be mindless ;)
mircea_popescu: it is pretty disruptive, or in the converse expression, it isn't at all described by what people think when they hear the word mmorpg.
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell nubbins` btw, phf managed to get it going on os/x
trinque: seriously where are the administrators
mircea_popescu: threats are a serious matter. expecially on the internets!
trinque: this would be the best publicity yet for mr trump
mircea_popescu: and especiallymost when directed at random starlets so desperate for publicity they'd eat their own head
ag3nt_zer0: I struggle to see how cultural relativism, multiculturalism as manisfest in states, offers any sort of couldn't-do-without-benefit to the western civilizational heritage... It seems to be manifested as a hugely destructive and degenerative force in US regarding everything from lowered national debate standards to laxed educational standards, erosion of free speech, critical theory where it doesn't really belong, poltical
ag3nt_zer0: past and thus no concern for the future,, etc
mircea_popescu: ag3nt_zer0 cultural relativism has just about nothing to do with multiculturalism
mircea_popescu: mr tricatel isn't in any sense part of the academie francaise, that's for mr. duchemin
ag3nt_zer0: mircea_popescu: in the states this is what it is
mircea_popescu: "the states" isn't a special place where the derps can get 5 to be an transcendental if they so agree.
ag3nt_zer0: I think we are talking about different thnigs here
ag3nt_zer0: Here it becomes simply a term that excuses all of that shit I described
trinque: I think we just wiped our ass with our only copy of the language.
mircea_popescu: sure, and there you also have "the country of africa" and assorted other fictions
ag3nt_zer0: its lumped right there with tolerance and diversity
ag3nt_zer0: I think Mark Steyn said multiculturalism is a unicultural phenomena
ag3nt_zer0: mircea_popescu: if that was for me, I haven't seen l'aile ou la cuisse
trinque: whatever one can say about multiculturalism, it's not going to come from any observation of the modern usa
mircea_popescu: so maybe check it out. it's the same discussion, except carried out in the 70s
ag3nt_zer0: I mean I like the mexicans tacos for sure but the culture doesnt respect education in the same way... so there is a clash there
trinque: the education problem isn't their culture, it's the school's culture
ag3nt_zer0: and the way it is dealt with in the west these days seems to just LCD everything
ag3nt_zer0: ok. does not Sharia Law conflict in a number of ways with the western "liberty traditon"?
ag3nt_zer0: well for instance what's the left gonna do when the gays have issues with the muslims?
mircea_popescu: but from the little i cared to read, it'd seem to me "sharia law" applies in london within sharia laws communities, which is not actually relevant to you.
ag3nt_zer0: trinque: I don't think thats the reason... Intelligence and motivation are greater than facilities and even teachers
ag3nt_zer0: check US Ed Reform black hole for supporting statistics
trinque: ag3nt_zer0: my comment was about why you have to care whether they "respect education"
trinque: if so why are they in school
trinque: once they're there, how do you expect to fix it?
trinque: as for the sharia thing, they play that a lot in the "right" leaning news here
trinque: that europe is falling to teh muslims
trinque: probably about like maryland is falling to the blacks
ag3nt_zer0: mircea_popescu: I don't know what about Amish Law.
mircea_popescu: but there's this community of weirdos doing things like forcing kids to go without electricity.
ag3nt_zer0: I see multiculturalism as about as well-intentioned as the food court in the mall
mircea_popescu: not to even go into the no-transfusion groups or whatnot.
cazalla: the no transfusion thing is bullshit .. i grew up with that and when push comes to shove, most opt to take blood
mircea_popescu: so what's this, we're gonna tailor the shoulds and should nots by what you mind ?
mircea_popescu: some people keep the kids in blessed underwear ; some people keep the kids without ipads ; some other people keep the kids in burkas
trinque: yes but I don't like the burkas
mircea_popescu: what exactly is your choice paradigm to distinguish between these, and why exactly is it that the utah mormons don't bother you but the london muslims do.
trinque: that totalitarian thought gets buried deep.
mircea_popescu: to not even go into the chinatowns. those people put VINEGAR into their COOKED food, and sugar in things which are not desert.
ag3nt_zer0: because the utah mormans are still under the umbrella of western aeonic development
chetty: the difference is the mormons dont try to insist everyone should wear their underwear, the muslims get pretty insistant about burkas
ag3nt_zer0: different peoples just have different ways of doing things... this also means that they have different ways of doing civilization... so that maybe one group can't take the reigns from another without significant hardship and the potential high risk for failure and disaster
mircea_popescu: i take it you've never had jehovites at the door chetty ?
chetty: well none of them ever tried to behead me for not listening
mircea_popescu: ag3nt_zer0 yeah well if the brits weren't some unvigorous waster cunts, mayb the muslims wouldn't HAVE TO take their country from them
trinque: chetty: sounds like a defense problem
trinque: technology should solve that one
mircea_popescu: chetty as proven by what, that you still have your head ? maybe they tried but ineptly, like anything else they do
ag3nt_zer0: mircea_popescu: how bout it. might be somethin to that
trinque: they did after all blow up that building that time
mircea_popescu: i dunno that muslims pester non muslim women to wear burkas. not anymore than catholics pester non catholic women about how to raise the children
mircea_popescu: but i did find out with dismay that the fucktarded usians convicted some dude to hard prison for fucking his partner on some beach
mircea_popescu: which to me personally is about as offensive as anything the mulsims do in their god forsaken desert shithole.
chetty: well if the news can be believed they are killing a lot of christians in the ME for not converting ...
trinque: it's really sad. reported as a pair of perverts because gasp, a 4 year old saw
mircea_popescu: what, like the us is killing a buncha ukrainians for same ?
ag3nt_zer0: let's talk about this again in 20 years!
chetty: MP just might feel a little different if he were female
ag3nt_zer0: I, for one, can't wait for the premiere of I am Cait!
cazalla: ag3nt_zer0, are ya gonna gather the family round and watch together?
ag3nt_zer0: given that the suicide rate is like 10 times higher if you are by "nature" transgender, I have this sick thought that it would be epic if I am Cait ended with a self inflicted shotgun blast to the head...
trinque: so this guy cut his dick off to land a TV series?
mircea_popescu: anyway, there's a very readily obvious and openly available method to not have to suffer the indignities of the defeated.
cazalla: ag3nt_zer0, the white guilt shit in that video, i don't really understand or grasp why people suffer from that
trinque: so how long before saudi asks pakistan for one of its preordered nukes?
ag3nt_zer0: well, ... the video is 12 minutes long and i posted it 6 minutes ago... maybe at least give the whole thought a listen
ag3nt_zer0: fwiw, I sat through college lectures on "micro-aggressions" where the big bad white man just sat there and took it that he was the bad guy
trinque: yeah, american college is terrible
trinque: I was paid to go and still left
punkman: "“We’re dealing with basically tourists,” Dafonseca said. “They’re here on the beaches of Manatee County, our public beaches. So you want to make sure that this isn’t something that just goes by the wayside. And that it is well known to the community what will be tolerated and what won’t be.”"
trinque: ag3nt_zer0: what guilt? the class is on teaching you that you're guilty.
trinque: so tell them to fuck themselves?
ag3nt_zer0: I was terrified while I was doing it man... they held the power
ag3nt_zer0: and I did it for stupid idealistic shit
trinque: I'm just a bag of mineral water walking around, man
trinque: fuck a national or cultural identity
ag3nt_zer0: like "if I dont stand up now, I cant tell studetns to later"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 77500 @ 0.00056235 = 43.5821 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: yeah man, he's just giving people excuses for being confused about who they are
trinque: maybe it is harder in the shit ocean, but sucks for them
trinque: otherwise what, a better church?
ag3nt_zer0: it's like medicine for california disease
trinque: I am always suspicious of a person giving someone a very serious sounding description of an abstract mental dysfunction they have.
trinque: apply that to whatever you like
trinque: church, public school bureaucrats, so on
cazalla: ag3nt_zer0, i never finished school but by paying to attend these places of higher education, you are buying what they're selling whether it be white guilt or what not.. i ran into this type of shit in different jobs but i always just refused to go along with it and they were always stumped as what to do next
trinque: both for the obvious reason and because for the person hearing it, it sounds like a damned fancy excuse to not put themselves together
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46800 @ 0.00056159 = 26.2824 BTC [-]
cazalla: in the mid 90s students were asked to sign a "sorry book" apologising to the australian aboriginies.. i just refused to sign it and that was that, if the other students had simply done the same, it would not have gained any traction, there was no consequence for not signing the stupid fucking book
punkman: "Jose Caballero, 40, was sentenced to two-and-a-half years in prison today for an X-rated beach frolic he had with Elissa Alvarez, 21, last July. Both Caballero and Alvarez will both have to register as sex offenders for their mischief, which involved copulating on a crowded beach, in the middle of the day, in front of a four-year-old."
trinque: we're just supposed to look sadly at the page of the book on the trail of tears for a few minutes, then move on
cazalla: but these fucking drones just signed it and passed it to the next person, i never really understood that
ag3nt_zer0: trinque: fuck a national or cultural identity - i used to feel that way... but I always felt like you can go the other way too... thinking that things matter. So, it's from there that I would ask are a culture and, much later, a nation, originally expressions of individual races?
cazalla: but anyway.. what is that saying.. a nation can survive anything but treachery from within.. mircea_popescu is right that if you don't want to suffer this, don't be on the losing team.. if muslims ride into battle and rape and kill all the english (or australians) than i guess so be it, only thing i despite more than the muslims are the limp wristed whites
trinque: she got less time, maybe because of that?
trinque: or maybe she turned on him and signed the "yes we actually fucked" papers
mircea_popescu: cazalla so people wanna play this kink for a while, big whoop.
mircea_popescu: trinque or maybe they just dunno wtf they're doing, spinning the wheel of morality over there
ag3nt_zer0: trinque: I still feel that way btw... I just oscillate in efforts to destroy what I thought earlier
trinque: who trusted us with a country
mircea_popescu: "in front of a four year old" wtf is the snotty shit, a judge now ?
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20943 @ 0.00056159 = 11.7614 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: nothing can happen "in front of a four year old". because no four year old is the fucking axis of thew world already
trinque: well good, it's only penises that are illegal anyway
ag3nt_zer0: cazalla: yes I bought what they sold and willingly... and I am that now
BingoBoingo: What's the weirdest node useragent everyone is connected to right now. I'm apparently peering with: "subver" : "/Satoshi:0.11.99/Gangnam Style:v1.00XL",
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 144500 @ 0.0005588 = 80.7466 BTC [-] {2}
cazalla: what is the command BingoBoingo
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Depends on your version. In 0.7 getpeerinfo was introduced
BingoBoingo: Otherwise I guess you gotta check the logs
cazalla: "subver" : "/btcwire:0.2.0/", have not seen this one before
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70700 @ 0.0005575 = 39.4153 BTC [-]
cazalla: meh nothing interesting, only 30 odd connections.. was over 100 for a few weeks but dropped off for some reason
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49209 @ 0.00056288 = 27.6988 BTC [+]
Itile: Hi all. When bet 1158 will be payed, who know?
cazalla: Itile, you win that one too eh?
cazalla: i believe bets are paid 2 days from resolved now
cazalla: poor Itile, waiting like patience on a monument over here
Itile: What is maximum of delaying in days? Faq not answer this.
cazalla: eh i'm waiting too, i could bitch that kakobrekla should pay as fast as he collects but who'd listen, i'm sure it'll be paid
cazalla drinking... drought has ended, whiskey rains from the sky
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 97550 @ 0.00056311 = 54.9314 BTC [+] {3}
punkman: how long did ya hold out cazalla
mircea_popescu: Itile you mean maximum so far ? i dunno, something like a week on contentious bets iirc.
cazalla: punkman, about 6 weeks.. not drinking sorta reminded me of why i drank in the first place
cazalla: meh i dunno, it's a good friend in that you don't see it for a while but you just pick up where you left off
cazalla: can't say that about many other people in my life
Itile: Bet 1090 was resolved 30-06, but payed 11-07. Why so long period? 11 days!
cazalla: BingoBoingo, yeah longer than i thought i'd last.. i'll enjoy this bottle and then take another break i think
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50566 @ 0.00056323 = 28.4803 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27000 @ 0.00056324 = 15.2075 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66150 @ 0.00056405 = 37.3119 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 79450 @ 0.00056407 = 44.8154 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 121558 @ 0.00055694 = 67.7005 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12100 @ 0.00055668 = 6.7358 BTC [-]
cazalla: but i am so drunk i forget how
punkman: you gotta sign it, but maybe wait until tomorrow
cazalla: ya, can't even sign my own name at this point
punkman: just don't dpaste your private key
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 120900 @ 0.00055944 = 67.6363 BTC [+]
cazalla: nah it'd have to be deliberate to do such a thing
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91070 @ 0.00056172 = 51.1558 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12030 @ 0.00056458 = 6.7919 BTC [+] {2}
fluffypony: oh apparently Michelle Obama is a man too
cazalla: yeah this is some deep level alex jones type shit fluffypony
cazalla: new ISIS movie is preddy gud
cazalla: "kill them wherever you find em"
assbot: Islamic state fighter shoots down Iraqi helicopter with MANPADS in Salahuddin province (July, 2015) - YouTube ... (
http://bit.ly/1K5x00a )
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40750 @ 0.00056531 = 23.0364 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43900 @ 0.00056415 = 24.7662 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58154 @ 0.00056415 = 32.8076 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49175 @ 0.00055885 = 27.4814 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12800 @ 0.00055118 = 7.0551 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 97150 @ 0.00056444 = 54.8353 BTC [+] {2}
jurov: <trinque> [20150714 03:19] should be a simple switch to flip in main.cf << no, it needs own valid cert, otherwise peers will go "wtf is this. disconnect!"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37600 @ 0.00056215 = 21.1368 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44271 @ 0.00056253 = 24.9038 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29629 @ 0.00056554 = 16.7564 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 193300 @ 0.00055437 = 107.1597 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 109935 @ 0.00056581 = 62.2023 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33109 @ 0.00054846 = 18.159 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50568 @ 0.00056158 = 28.398 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 84200 @ 0.00056676 = 47.7212 BTC [+] {2}
thestringpuller: why is qntra getting hammered? they hate us cause they ain't us?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 67173 @ 0.00055695 = 37.412 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99261 @ 0.00056477 = 56.0596 BTC [+] {3}
fluffypony: why not just stick qntra / a mirror behind CloudFlare? it's a news site, it's not like the information is super sensitive
☟︎ assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27015 @ 0.00056692 = 15.3153 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59235 @ 0.00056707 = 33.5904 BTC [+]
decimation: asciilifeform: it is taking weeks for my 2gb ram server ti sync
decimation: it's not even hitting swap all that hard
jurov: decimation: it has hdd/ssd?
jurov: well.... that's just too slow. either add RAM or change to SSD
jurov: or some unholy combination, perhaps
decimation: it seems to be maxing disk reads at around 16 megabit/s and writes at 8 megabit/s
jurov: dm-cache using 8 GB SSD would be worth trying, i will when pogos come
☟︎ jurov: now if these ssds in msata format were actually cheap
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41700 @ 0.00054607 = 22.7711 BTC [-]
decimation: ah, I had cstate shit enabled, might be part of the problem
mats: hm, seems all versions of Flash on Firefox are blocked by default right now
junseth: Hi everyone. thought i'd come by for another flogging :)
funkenstein_: junseth, don't give me that you snotty faced heap of parrot droppings
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 14:57:48; asciilifeform: pogo is going nowhere until we have a mempool limit mechanism.
jurov: funkenstein_: imo tx relaying is fine.. but holding them in memory beyond that is problematic
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28000 @ 0.00054607 = 15.29 BTC [-]
funkenstein_: jurov, true, one could have a max size or max bandwidth even as command line flags with a bit of work.
funkenstein_: i was sorta under the assumption the main purpose was to be present en masse in block relaying network, hence providing some sanity in block verification
jurov: and who will relay transactions?
funkenstein_: that is responsibility of tx publisher to get them to a miner
funkenstein_: though plenty of full nodes on real iron still will relay
funkenstein_: tx relaying is strictly philanthropic at the moment if iiuc
jurov: so you yourself connect directly to miners and never need tx relaying services?
funkenstein_: for broadcasting a TX today i would recommend blockchain.info, coinb.in.. there are a few others that will get your tx to miners
☟︎ funkenstein_: with increasing use i expect it to get harder and harder
funkenstein_: my point is, tx relaying is useful but non-essential
jurov: how it is non-essential?
jurov: are you using bitcoin at all?
funkenstein_: integrity of blockchain and consensus is essential. How TXs get to miners is not. They could go by pigeon to Luke-JR's kitchen if need be.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 131050 @ 0.00054559 = 71.4996 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: "blockchain is more important than bitcoin" i heard it somewhere
funkenstein_: my argument is bitcoin is more important than TX relaying
jurov: and my experience is that having a stable long-running and well-connected node gives me an edge with my transactions propagations
jurov: why even running a node otherwise?
jurov: lets just submit everything to blockchain.info and verify their blocks and sleep tight
funkenstein_: so you can check yourself the coin you receive
jurov: how? pogo will not have wallet nor block explorer
jurov: also, what happens when blockchain.info screws up like recently? how are the tx gonna go to miners?
funkenstein_: ok pogo is a different story again.. for me broadcasting a tx is not as time important usually as your needs i bet
gernika: <+mats> ideology. << what about a qntra email list? I'd search the logs to see if this has been proposed in the past but ... can't.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61900 @ 0.00054559 = 33.772 BTC [-]
gernika: My OpenBSD bitcoind has stopped syncing: trying connection x.x.x.x:8333 lastseen=-371358.4hrs lasttry=-399136.2hrs | it had been syncing from the address in the qntra post.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16600 @ 0.00054559 = 9.0568 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 186085 @ 0.00054559 = 101.5261 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 84987 @ 0.00054607 = 46.4089 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 76650 @ 0.00054533 = 41.7995 BTC [-] {3}
mod6: ok, yeah, im getting the same thing.
mod6: (gentoo) turned mine on to try. node must be down or something.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50064 @ 0.00054509 = 27.2894 BTC [-]
danielpbarron: ERROR: AcceptToMemoryPool() : not enough fees << lots of this in my debug.log
fromphuctor: hello, how can I get my information removed from nosuchlabs.com?
☟︎☟︎ danielpbarron: i don't think you can, but asciilifeform and mircea_popescu are the ones that could do it if it can be done
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 08:20:36; mircea_popescu: "in front of a four year old" wtf is the snotty shit, a judge now ?
fromphuctor: so should I private message them or wait here?
jurov: fromphuctor: did you remove the info from SKS keyserver, too?
jurov: also, other keyservers might mirror it
fromphuctor: i havent but when I google my name it's only showing up at nosuchlabs.com
mod6: danielpbarron: so you're like 50 blocks behind now?
fromphuctor: I no longer use the key and I just dont want my info being indexed by google
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 90885 @ 0.00054509 = 49.5405 BTC [-]
danielpbarron: fromphuctor, but is the key cracked? I'm sure a bunch of people would like to know how you created it if it was.
fromphuctor: danielpbarron. I have no idea, I longer use it
trinque: fromphuctor: maybe you don't understand the purpose of phuctor?
nubbins`: it's to find keys that were generated insecurely
danielpbarron: fromphuctor, was the text all a happy green or a mean red?
nubbins`: phuctor is smashing numbers together, right now, churning through huge data sets of pgp keys
mod6: its purpose is to factor keys with GCD
nubbins`: trying to find clues as to broken implementations, flaws in rsa, etc
trinque: fromphuctor: sks is the system which distributes public keys
trinque: fromphuctor: then why would you want that info taken off the internet?
trinque: this means your key is *not* broken
nubbins`: means nobody else's key is suspiciously similar to yours :D
fromphuctor: I dont want the other associated info on the net
trinque: fromphuctor: a public key is called public because it is safe to distribute
trinque: what is this, the right to be forgotten?
nubbins`: fromphuctor, i can only imagine your key was gleaned from some other publicly-accessible key server
mod6: yeah, iirc keys will not be removed from the phuctor pool.
danielpbarron: and makes a good point: only nosuchlabs shows up in google search
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 16:35:26; fromphuctor: hello, how can I get my information removed from nosuchlabs.com?
fromphuctor: im pretty sure there's laws in place that give me the right to have that info removed
☟︎ ascii_field: in my country, you cannot copyright your name.
trinque: I'm still perplexed by the idea that someone would be bothered by what is a highly beneficial *free* service annotating entirely *public* data
fluffypony: but pubkeys are easily browsable on other key servers
ascii_field: aha, virtually all of the pubkeys in phuctor come from sks.
trinque: but it's really important that *this* one be taken down
fluffypony: hosted by the Glorious Defenders of Privacy at MIT
fromphuctor: if my info disappeared from sks, would it be removed from nosuchlabs
ascii_field: fromphuctor: afaik nothing has ever disappeared from sks.
fromphuctor: do you maintain the database for nosuchlabs
ascii_field: fromphuctor: realize that anyone can submit anything to sks
fluffypony: SKS doesn't mandate that you remove data to keep in sync
ascii_field: i am under no obligation to modify my code to make 'mr x' (whose name we do not yet know, nor have any proof that 'his' key is his) disappear every time someone submits him.
fluffypony: 'Once a public key has been uploaded, it is difficult to remove. Some users stop using their public keys for various reasons, such as when they forget their pass phrase, or if their private key is compromised or lost. In those cases, it was hard to delete a public key from the server, and even if it were deleted, someone else can upload a fresh copy of the same public key to the server. This leads to an accumulation of old fossil
fluffypony: public keys that never go away, a form of "keyserver plaque".'
fluffypony: also known as the "sorry for you" problem
fromphuctor: im not concerned about the key floating around, just the other information listed on nosuchlabs
ascii_field: fromphuctor: we even have a list of folks for whom some hooligan submitted entirely fraudulent (as far as we can tell) keys. nothing can be done about this.
ascii_field: fromphuctor: what other information? the only things visible are what is in your key - the name and email addr entered when it was generated.
ascii_field: fromphuctor: did you upload your key to sks? or did it live under your pillow, and you are telling us that someone stole it and uploaded it ?
fromphuctor: I'm pretty sure I uploaded it to sks years ago
ascii_field: then you are officially fucked and i officially have zero sympathy.
ascii_field: you are welcome to wait until mircea_popescu logs on, and ask him for a contact address where to file a frivolous lawsuit. he loves winning those.
fromphuctor: im not asking for sympathy, Im asking you to remove my name and information from your website
jurov: name and email (optionally even photo!) are part of public key and thus public.
ascii_field: fromphuctor: the answer is no. any other questions ?
ascii_field: fluffypony: nah he wants to give mp his money
fluffypony: my company doesn't have a public key in SKS
trinque: encounters strange... gets scared and angry...
trinque: they ought to have a test for this in early childhood
trinque: fromphuctor: you've been done a service at another's expense, and you're behaving like a fool
ascii_field: trinque: we haven't even any reason to believe that mr x owns the private key to this pubkey (which? also no idea)
ascii_field: nor that this fella's mother gave him this name (again, which name?)
trinque: sure, but y'know he's gonna SUE
fluffypony: I do find the righteous indignation humorous
ascii_field: aha. not even in schmuckistan where i live, can you win this.
fluffypony: it's not like this is a revenge porn site and we're laughing at the diminutive size of his member
trinque: it's a goddamn public phone book
ascii_field: none of which the fool wrote to, presumably
ascii_field: nor google, which appears to be the proximate cause of his sorrows
ascii_field: (why not write to google? they censor first, ask questions later)
trinque: anyone else noticed the from* pattern of nicks?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 100300 @ 0.00054607 = 54.7708 BTC [+]
ascii_field: trinque: folks who click the link on phuctor www get a webportal into freenode
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 143200 @ 0.00054164 = 77.5628 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 97200 @ 0.00053789 = 52.2829 BTC [-]
danielpbarron: SetBestChain: new best=00000000000000000581 height=365258 work=10171447580846858256181698 << my 0.5.3.1-beta node is syncing again
danielpbarron: don't think so, or at least I did nothing to correct anything
mod6: ok so you've moved up 5 blocks.
mod6: would be inetersting/nice to see the ms time on how long it takes to process blocks {365`251, 365`252}; blocks > 900kb
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 130150 @ 0.00053554 = 69.7005 BTC [-] {6}
thestringpuller: mod6: "The bitcoin foundation doesn't care reddit-people." - Kanye West
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40670 @ 0.00053319 = 21.6848 BTC [-] {3}
mod6: thestringpuller: ha
mod6: danielpbarron: ah ok
mod6: 365259 = 908.97k - 1090 tx's
mod6: 365260 = 249.83kB - 467 txs
mod6: 365261 = 909.83kB - 693 txs
gernika: Still seeing: connect() failed after select(): Connection refused
gernika: Maybe the qntra node is running short of connections?
ascii_field: 'The site’s support documentation explains how it works: “First you write a normal original article. Then you make two rewrites of it. All three articles (PDF) must have the same number of paragraphs and each paragraph of each article must have about the same meaning.” This is because the end product is cut up, chopped, and changed to create even more alternative stories. In the content-producing machine
ascii_field: , the sausage is just the start of it—that's ground up and made into meatballs, meatloaf, and a million other products.'
gernika: sorry, not qntra node, bitcoind node referenced in qntra article. canonical bitcoind node is a better term?
ascii_field: ^ purportedly official statement from 'hackteam'
ascii_field: (they don't appear to believe in pgp, so i cannot say if authentic)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15200 @ 0.00054551 = 8.2918 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73842 @ 0.00054667 = 40.3672 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Why did victims in Islamic State beheading videos look so calm? They didn’t know it was real. - The Washington Post ... (
http://bit.ly/1I0dtRl )
ascii_field: appears to be fully explained in the lined article.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69400 @ 0.00053921 = 37.4212 BTC [-] {3}
funkenstein_: thestringpuller, wow that is awesome. do people use this in grav. or e&m simulations?
ascii_field: funkenstein_: mno. it's accurate enough for 3d shooter, that's more or less it
ascii_field: then again, i wouldn't put it past some chinese grad student to throw it in somewhere
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 162100 @ 0.00054833 = 88.8843 BTC [+] {2}
ascii_field: i'm not really happy with the removal of the rpc password generator
ascii_field: i suppose mod6 and ben_vulpes ought to make the call
danielpbarron: my node is held up again, this time at height=365262
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47000 @ 0.00053508 = 25.1488 BTC [-] {2}
ascii_field: danielpbarron: anything about rejected blocks in the debug.log ?
punkman: danielpbarron: you have any logs with a reorg?
punkman: whoever does, maybe post to mailing list
danielpbarron: yeah, this same node has reorganized in the past, but that's not the case with this latest hold up
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 227100 @ 0.00055471 = 125.9746 BTC [+] {6}
kakobrekla: [20:39:14] <punkman> why no title assbot
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9584 @ 0.00055851 = 5.3528 BTC [+]
punkman: kakobrekla: 10/10 customer support, would buy again
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37900 @ 0.00055941 = 21.2016 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21263 @ 0.00055874 = 11.8805 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 140800 @ 0.00056568 = 79.6477 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 12:32:12; jurov: ;;isup qntra.net
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 14:43:36; fluffypony: why not just stick qntra / a mirror behind CloudFlare? it's a news site, it's not like the information is super sensitive
mircea_popescu: and the infortmation of WHO READS IT is not usg's business.
nubbins`: why not use windows for casual web browsing?
nubbins`: why not smash your dick with a hammer?
mircea_popescu: "Please understand that you mentioned you accept "Bitcoin" as a method of payment. Some online payment companies are fairly new and inexperienced and they do not provide sufficient fraud protection to members. When we review payment methods to determine whether they are allowed on eBay, two key factors that we consider are "Security and Safety" and "Ease of use". Please do not offer this payment method."
mircea_popescu: "ideology" ? yeah, that's right : usg's fucking ideology.
ascii_field: who exactly expected to be able to use btc there
mircea_popescu: im not setting mental limits on the basis of implicit conventions.
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 14:57:48; asciilifeform: pogo is going nowhere until we have a mempool limit mechanism.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: I didn't mean indefinitely
mircea_popescu: if i recall this was discussed, i was spouting things like "sort the tx pool by value per byte, kick out bad txn and nodes that propose them, always offer a buttered selection to askers"
ascii_field: no, i meant what i said and i said what i meant, walrus is certain one hundred percent (tm) (r)
ascii_field: unbounded data structure + finite ram == barf
ascii_field: we have two of these left: the block index (discussed previously, 300 byte per blk) and the mempool.
thestringpuller: ascii_field: you can set the policy to drop tx's without fees from the mempool i though
trinque: so suppose I dropped a link to last night's islam thread
ascii_field: thestringpuller: not the answer to 'potentially infinite liquid shit in a finite bag'
trinque: it's a problem solved by both the WoT and building cities according to a concept of "good standing == access" not universal access for all
mircea_popescu: ascii_field i dun parse that, are you disagreeing or wut ?
trinque: cardano would be a nice device for this
trinque: you go up to some gate and do assbot-style authentication
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: was trying to point out that we need a mechanism to manage mempool on the node. just simple oldest-evict for starters.
mircea_popescu: if we're going to do this, which is nonstandard, a) better make it good.
ascii_field: so where is this 'nonstandard.' ~ANY~ machine has finite ram, it is entirely standard.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41922 @ 0.00055874 = 23.4235 BTC [-]
ascii_field: this is closest to the default behavior (death of whole node)
mircea_popescu: so, how about, something like this : 1. pogo acquires max memory to be used for tx pool ; 2. pogo accepts txn into this until full ; 3. pogo calculates per byte value for eacxh accepted txn ; 4. pogo accepts new txn only if their per-byte value constitutes an increase to its pool ; 5. pogo keeps a score on all nodes ir EVER SAW, by IP! as to what txn it sent : -so much for sending unacceptable txn, + so much for sendin
mircea_popescu: g accepted txn. then it refuses connectioon to shit nodes. permanently. it still reads from them, but sends nothing.
ascii_field: did mircea_popescu just ask for a <=4GB db ?
mircea_popescu: this way, our nonstandard behaviour can at least be excused, nodes will continue to peer us for economic reasons, and your dream fo someday someone mining off a pogo may come closer.
mircea_popescu: ascii_field nothing wrong with keeping a finite ip db and flushing the lowest entries as needed, just like iptables works.
mircea_popescu: ideally the -so much, +so much and min_node_value are to be set in config file by user.
ascii_field: this is not a bad scheme, but - complicated
mircea_popescu: not worth doing the other one. you'll just end up isolated on the network.
ascii_field: 'why not start small, he said, offering the yoga n00b a single nail'
☟︎ ascii_field: mircea_popescu: briefly describe hypothesis re: why an evict-oldest mempool node would end up isolated
mircea_popescu: because you present an arbitrary fraction of the current mempool, there is no incentive for anyone to peer you.
mircea_popescu: you may either present : a) the whole mempool (current best behaviour) or b) a selected fraction (hopefully future best behaviour)
ascii_field: this is different from 'isolated.' isolated would mean that extant nodes auto-drop you
ascii_field: 'no incentive' for most of the network participants to do what they are doing - is the current situation.
mircea_popescu: i didn't mean that isolated. i just meant, "and it never amounted to anything" isolated
ascii_field hopes that no one is waiting for ~him~ to write this, is occupied with other things presently
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 15:08:39; jurov: dm-cache using 8 GB SSD would be worth trying, i will when pogos come
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 15:40:48; funkenstein_: for broadcasting a TX today i would recommend blockchain.info, coinb.in.. there are a few others that will get your tx to miners
ascii_field: possibly the most dangerous change yet proposed
mircea_popescu: but it is i think the first chance to actually improve on extant code by writing something since the start of this project. rather than just cutting warts off and sewing the crater together
nubbins`: <+ascii_field> who exactly expected to be able to use btc there <<< once listed a casascius coin on ebay. a buyer messaged me through the site asking to pay in btc :o
ascii_field: nubbins`: as i understand, buyer can contact you and ask to pay in cocaine
mircea_popescu: ascii_field his point was "who expects". apparently, buyer.
ascii_field: but if you accept anything but paypal - can be thrown out of 'ebay'
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 19:31:33; mircea_popescu: ascii_field yes, complicated, especially due to txn chains.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: why would the network isolate you if you're dropping tx's out of the mempool?
thestringpuller: it seems this is broken, if tx's oom a nodes' mempool wouldn't this technically be a fraction of the mempool shared by other nodes with more memory?
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 16:35:26; fromphuctor: hello, how can I get my information removed from nosuchlabs.com?
ascii_field: thestringpuller: but it is also true that most nodes presently have sufficient physical ram to hold the mempool
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller the notion that bitcoin is open "to everyone" does not include fromfuctorhead above.
mircea_popescu: bitcoin is open for everyone who can keep the whole thing. the whole blockchain, the whole mempool, etc.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43400 @ 0.00056844 = 24.6703 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 16:58:35; fromphuctor: im pretty sure there's laws in place that give me the right to have that info removed
trinque: ... and it's a beneficial service?!
ascii_field: mircea_popescu: you know that's the shared arse for everyone who comes in from nosuchlabs.com, right ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86082 @ 0.00056869 = 48.954 BTC [+] {2}
trinque: ascii_field: but he banned the specific mask for that user
nubbins`: <+mircea_popescu> o look who's back. when did you get out nubbins` ? <<< just coming up for air 8)
ascii_field: he didn't claim a name, or a key, much less a signature of one with the other
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33529 @ 0.00056879 = 19.071 BTC [+]
nubbins`: <+ascii_field> nubbins`: as i understand, buyer can contact you and ask to pay in cocaine <<< i suggested to buyer we take tx off-site; he agreed. mildly surprised message filters or smth didn't get in the way
ascii_field: and readily admitted to having uploaded it himself, to sks
ascii_field: nubbins`: 'How often, or on what system, the Thought Police plugged in on any individual wire was guesswork. It was even conceivable that they watched everybody all the time. but at any rate they could plug in your wire whenever they wanted to. You have to live - did live, from habit that became instinct - in the assumption that every sound you made was overheard...'
ben_vulpes: trinque: the hsa company can't figure out their ssl cert
ben_vulpes: trinque: and emails passwords baaack to users in plaintext
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes everyone emails passwords in plaintext. EVERYONE
ben_vulpes: the *unsalted* *unhashed* *stored* password
nubbins`: i used to work for big insurance co
mircea_popescu: well if you email it anyway... why bother with bcrypt ?
nubbins`: called helpdesk one day with an issue
nubbins`: they asked me for my password over the phone
trinque: that idea of opening a gate with a cardano... really fun
trinque: I can't wait to hold one in my hands
ascii_field: i can't wait to see all the nails folks try to pound in with this microscope.
trinque: ascii_field: was imagining a futuristic city with access controls based on WoT standing in response to chetty's comments about islam and violence
☟︎ trinque: I've actually had a few dreams about such a place
trinque: thestringpuller: same answer as if someone steals your anything
trinque: what's better, a retinal scan? lol
trinque: ascii_field: which? stolen cardano?
trinque: seems you'd have some other key elsewhere, you'd sign your cardano key
trinque: and you could perhaps sign a "my cardano was stolen" message to address thestringpuller
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 19:56:20; trinque: ascii_field: was imagining a futuristic city with access controls based on WoT standing in response to chetty's comments about islam and violence
ascii_field: trinque: also not so easy. see the key revocation thread of last month.
trinque: in this case presumably the city itself would be controlled by someone in particular
trinque: so it is a centralized problem
trinque: *he* grants you access or does not
trinque: so there is a central point which can reject the key in the future
trinque: ben_vulpes: the lesbian dreadfort notwithstanding
ascii_field: perhaps folks who are '! downed' will slide, literally, down a chute.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58000 @ 0.00057034 = 33.0797 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 120100 @ 0.00056091 = 67.3653 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: gernika_ it's up and down as i have the 363736 issue examined.
mircea_popescu: by now a multitude of people have copies, of that chain.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25126 @ 0.00055874 = 14.0389 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: relatedly : i am reasonably satisfied the ~950 kb single tx a few days ago was trying its best to make pre 0.10 clients unable to verify the chain anymore.
mircea_popescu: it didn't actually work, obviously, but i must say without all the work the foundation put in, it probably WOULD have.
☟︎ ascii_field: would love to read the logic behind this hypothesis
mircea_popescu: ascii_field not fully understood yet, but it seems to exploit a buffer overflow in their own fucktarded code.
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 20:32:01; mircea_popescu: it didn't actually work, obviously, but i must say without all the work the foundation put in, it probably WOULD have.
ascii_field: afaik i'm the only one actually running a public-facing realbitcoinotron
ascii_field: we cremate orphan tx. and the 'tx spam' is sent in rapid succession, and depends on previous instances of same, and hence spends much of its life cycle as 'orphan tx'
mircea_popescu: yeah you know what, this work actually made a difference.
mircea_popescu: i have nfi where i'd be had b-a never happened and foundation never happened and etc, trying to make sense of this situation
ascii_field: probably somewhere deep in the 2012 shitter
ascii_field will enjoy reading mircea_popescu's old node if he ever gets tired of it and prints it
mircea_popescu: neway, needless to say, i'm actually impressed. for once world of shit averted.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 113593 @ 0.00054082 = 61.4334 BTC [-] {2}
ascii_field: how, i must say i wonder, did mircea_popescu even persuade anyone to shovel the sheer tonnage of shit to write his soviet pdp clone 0.6
mircea_popescu: had no particular expectation to see anything like this yet, either.
ascii_field: if it was written by a phriend, i would love to see him among our number here.
mircea_popescu: but the truth, in general, is that closed systems have a very short shelf life. you can get away with it for a matter of years, maybe, if you're very good at managing it. not decades.
gernika: <+mircea_popescu> by now a multitude of people have copies, of that chain. << got it. switched to another node and now syncing.
BingoBoingo: ascii_field: Takes about as much time as any other "problematic" block but gets chewed through just the same
BingoBoingo: ascii_field: 0.7.2 Just renumbered it to advertise as 0.7.3.9
ascii_field: incidentally, there's never been a better time to open a zoo of these
ascii_field: not too late, flood of crud still going strong.
mircea_popescu: and it was not even relayed (as it's not in fact relayable)
ascii_field: the one moving to/from 6-char brainwallets
ascii_field: afaik it is part of the overall crap fleet.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 118000 @ 0.00054811 = 64.677 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 94426 @ 0.00053831 = 50.8305 BTC [-]
thestringpuller: but love the line "This compulsion means that, for the first time, the opinion of the ignorant masses (if misled, or merely divided) can actually destroy Bitcoin."
assbot: Logged on 14-07-2015 03:27:43; asciilifeform: and stopped
ben_vulpes: phf: didja grunt out a script or something else i could try?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11323 @ 0.00053831 = 6.0953 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 107850 @ 0.00053831 = 58.0567 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 160874 @ 0.00055702 = 89.61 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 146700 @ 0.00057024 = 83.6542 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36924 @ 0.00053974 = 19.9294 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36787 @ 0.00055576 = 20.4447 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 95431 @ 0.00055576 = 53.0367 BTC [+]
Adlai: straw poll here, please
Adlai: who's ever had somebody try to sell them bitcoins unsolicited?
Adlai only lost that cherry tonight
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [BTR] 2000 @ 0.00111 = 2.22 BTC
trinque: then the guy tried to give me some oddly
Adlai is guessing that ascii_field steers clear of bitcoin "meetups", of all their shapes and forms
trinque: mine was some scamzor from otc
Adlai: exactly. i ratted the guy out in front of the group, it was a little hilarious
ascii_field never went to anything even vaguely bitcoin-related in the flesh other than for mircea_popescu's c2 and c3
Adlai: suddenly everybody tries to buy
Adlai: HOW MUCH DID HE WANT etc
Adlai: ascii_field: bitcoin != Bitcoins
Adlai: but you get the idea
Adlai: one of those was a typo
ascii_field: i live in wrong part of the world for this
Adlai: as though i'm in the right part!
Adlai: now it's my turn to 'lol'
ascii_field: although university of maryland did have buterin over as guest speaker, apparently, some months ago
Adlai: one good thing did come of the meetup, my new Bitcoin Price Index is fees/coin
ascii_field: (they also had obama, no less than twice. also missed that. snore.)
Adlai: the question is... which percentile of "fees" is used in the calculation
Adlai: thus our answer is in fact just another question
mats: missed it? as in, you wanted to go?
ascii_field: missed as in, was vaguely aware and didn't give a flying fuck
Adlai: please tell me it was the same event
Adlai: last i heard, from the most reputable of reputables, obama was gunna "crush" bitcoin
Adlai: few days later, 300, 160, who knows what. here we are today.
pete_dushenski: the only thing obama is gonna crush are his video game enemies in 'easy' mode.
pete_dushenski: the dude couldn't even put boots on the ground in syria, as fucking if he could do better than gavin and hearn.
mats: hey, he armed ISIS. close enough to 'boots on the ground'.
pete_dushenski: he could -maybe- throw a wrench in some up and coming social media app. maybe..
pete_dushenski: because hey, can't just be losing wars for two generations straight.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35231 @ 0.00054945 = 19.3577 BTC [-] {2}
pete_dushenski: gotta find victories wherever you can. and, hell, just create them ex nihilo everywhere else.
mats: well, they weren't the enemy at the time. just 'moderates' looking for cash and weapons to fight al-Assad
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75769 @ 0.00054324 = 41.1608 BTC [-]
pete_dushenski: maybe if obama promises to pay eternal tribute to the caliphate, isis won't wipe his face in his own vomit.
mats: hard to anticipate, they've gotta take baghdad first
pete_dushenski: mats sure, in dreamlandia where anyone can be allies with the devil and then turn their back on him whenever they feel like it with no repercussions.
mats: iran and the saudis are active in the region and may crush them yet
mats: out of sheer self-interest and to return the balance of power to as it was
pete_dushenski: saudis are already teetering on the bring of self-immolation post-abdullah
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48050 @ 0.00057093 = 27.4332 BTC [+]
pete_dushenski: i dun seriously think that the saudis are ruthless enough nor rich enough to win this contest
trinque: how many oil fields do they have now?
pete_dushenski: but isis has a sufficiently powerful 'why' that their soldiers are cheap and oh so very cut throat
trinque: among other things I think whatever successes ISIS has had reflect that nobody really wants to have Iraq or Syria be their problem
pete_dushenski: and why should the middle east be anyone's problem other than that of the middle easterners ?
trinque: I am talking about middle eastern powers
trinque: I am not a scholar on the subject, but it seems as an outsider that the major factors are Saudi, Iran and Israel
trinque: those seem to be perpetually beating war drums against eachother; perhaps ISIS is a complicating factor in that situation which none want to approach lest they unbalance the former
decimation: saudis are not ruthless enough < I strongly doubt. Saudis would throw every merc in the world at someone challenging their rule
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54050 @ 0.00057227 = 30.9312 BTC [+] {2}
decimation: also they would very likely summon usg
pete_dushenski: trinque those 3, yes, plus usa currently holding down the eastern corners of the mediterranean with turkey and egypt
pete_dushenski: it's incredibly, almost impossibly expensive to fight against an opponent as ideologically driven as isis (or b, tmsr~)
decimation: pete_dushenski: not really, it's quite simple, they would fall to a single marine division if on the field in open battle
decimation: however, trying to dislodge them in an occupation war is another matter
pete_dushenski: aha, again, the expense of occupation of syria/lebanon is more than any soi-dissant 'world power' can seem to muster.
decimation: mainly because nobody can convince themselves to give enough of a shit
pete_dushenski: so battles can be won against isis, wars will be lost.
trinque: it's reasonable to say that the appetite for total war in the west... ^
decimation: yes, isis is much too young to expand beyond iraq/syria
decimation: in 30 years after their rule is solidified...
trinque: if what's said about their regressiveness regarding science is true, they're not going to amount to anything
pete_dushenski: it won't take a generation if the saudi's run out of oil money
trinque: they're going to what, shout about allah and shoot hand-me-down russian weapons?
trinque: and the force of their will alone will overcome?
pete_dushenski: trinque well, the west's 'science' is a largely (if not entirely) a lot of fluff 'epidemiology'
trinque: they're a nuisance and if they become anything more they'll all be killed
trinque: pete_dushenski: that has little to do with them ignoring the subject entirely
trinque: I bet central americans had a great deal of "will" too
pete_dushenski: i see them as being quite related, if throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
pete_dushenski: trinque sorry, you're saying that isis is a nuisance that'll be wiped out if they get too uppity ??
decimation: it's political suicide in the us to commit to another full-scale middle east war, which is what is giving isis breathing room
trinque: pete_dushenski: I could very well see something 20 years down the line that's much different
trinque: but it would require them getting that far
pete_dushenski: isis will continue to grow, because that's what lifeforms do : they grow.
trinque: one might speculate it will; we'll see
decimation: maybe, but if this happens it probably won't be through open battle
pete_dushenski: if isis is undone, it'll be from 'multicultural' technology
pete_dushenski: i don't see an external player that has the means or the will to take them down. they're no wimpy upstart. isis means business.
trinque: sure, and their ideology is based on magical thinking
pete_dushenski: hell, even the 'elite' ideologies can fall victim to dreams.
trinque: let me put it this way: if something doesn't come along that could squash an ISIS in a moment, that's on us.
trinque: they're primitive morons with weapons somebody else's war machine manufactured
trinque: sitting on oil wells they didn't drill
pete_dushenski: so what, bitcoin made the computers, chips, and internet infrastructure that it's taking over the world with ?
pete_dushenski: we're all sitting on 5-10 year old hardware. idjits would readily call this 'primitive'
trinque: I do not see the equivalence at all
trinque: isis is a cargo cult thinking allah will bring them more russian or american weapons if they piss in the wind some more
trinque: they will never make anything themselves
decimation: tribalism is in the bones over there, I find it unlikely that a political entity could centralize power effectively
pete_dushenski: trinque the equivalence is in the disruptive potential
trinque: as for bitcoin, one *would* hope those working within it do understand the mechanics of the technology involved
trinque: there's nothing novel or interesting about their ideology
pete_dushenski: the nation states of the middle east as we know/knew them.
trinque: they're not going to build a working empire when they're done
pete_dushenski: doesn't appear to me that they're trying to build an 'empire' in the centralised sense of the term
pete_dushenski: decimation perhaps not. though if you spill enough blood...
phf: ben_vulpes: eventually, aha. i'm not even sure yet that i can repeat the process. for example part of build process is a script that chooses between gcc-4.6 and clang based on whether it's .c or .mm. the fact that the result links i think is a miracle
pete_dushenski: trinque i mean hey, if isis were going the centralised route, don't you think they'd have a king or ruler already ?
trinque: they've got that baghdadi guy
trinque: and if they can't organize past that level, all the better
pete_dushenski: instead they have -dozens- of fiefdoms, all pledging allegiance to an ideology and a black flag
☟︎ trinque: furthermore if all they can manage is guns and missiles, the non-morons that understand science can respond with defensive technology that makes that irrelevant
pete_dushenski: under your defensive technology is a satellite colony orbiting the earth
trinque: cities have defended themselves well against raiding hordes of morons before
pete_dushenski: ideologies will rip through the heart of whatever armour you've got.
trinque: we build them today like they're safe from all that
trinque: praise be to allah the space god and pass the ammunition?
trinque: and how is their ideology going to rip through my heart?
trinque: I would just like to see bitcoin kill these morons too
trinque: 2015 is no place for desert gods
trinque: (unless as I said, it's outside great cryptographic walls)
trinque: might very well be that something like ISIS will kill a great many "westerners" in the future
pete_dushenski: and it'll take more than a generation, or even a hundred, to change our defaults
trinque: and I could still imagine a world where I don't care
pete_dushenski: trinque for sure, because those 'westerners' are a bunch of blinded sheep who could use a good raping
trinque: I had this incredibly vivid dream years ago of a city which denied access based on some mechanism (undefined in the dream) of verifying identity and relationship to those dwelling within
trinque: walls and automated weapons prevented entry by unsanctioned means
trinque: entering the gate meant being approved to do so
trinque: this is what I would like to live within someday
trinque: not something where every moron can piss on my front lawn
trinque: and if ISIS wants to keep the outsiders busy, have at it
pete_dushenski: well as long as you don't move the middle east, you can probably get by where you are, even without the ginormous walls.
pete_dushenski: it's one thing for isis to whip their compatriots into shape, it'd be an order of magnitude more resource intensive to bother with us.istan.
trinque: usistan may fall over on its own before they come of age
pete_dushenski: federal gov may 'fall over' but the only thing most people will notice is how much lighter the weight on their shoulders is
pete_dushenski: mebbe chinese come in to rape the blondies and suck up the minerals, maybe they can't be bothered and they leave the peoples formerly known as 'americans' to reoganise themselves
pete_dushenski: that could be along existing state lines, or regions could be smaller or larger.
pete_dushenski: anyways, i'm off. don't be surprised if this convo makes it into a post :D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 162697 @ 0.00056912 = 92.5941 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59332 @ 0.0005728 = 33.9854 BTC [+] {3}
trinque: ;;later tell pete_dushenski I've enjoyed when they do.
trinque: "Sorry for any inconvenience, this is just how these things work." << lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73869 @ 0.00057393 = 42.3956 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: they've decided they wanna hang out with wintel and the rest of the "good guys in their own mind" club
BingoBoingo: At least Bob Beck's financial crowd. Thing was saved by the forces of good, then the forces of Microshit came with ongoing whatever the fuck
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