mircea_popescu: that'd be the other point of interest, "how big does S get"
mircea_popescu: lobbes are you going to not let delinquents auction till they pay ? :D
lobbes: mircea_popescu, hehe. I was thinking of implementing that once n00bs start using the thing. Make it Wot-based at some level; disabling auction service for people lower down in WoT once delinquent x amount of time
lobbes: I gotta say, I'm experiencing the whole "WoT make decisions easier" thing in practice now. I.e. I know hanbot is good for it, and since I trust danielpbarron's rating of Birdman, I also trust that he, too, will be good for it
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i'll letcha know after i rerun and capture that
ben_vulpes: 65536/2048 now at wall clock time of 5.5 hrs
ben_vulpes: also, was wrong last night, go impl still trouncing
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes you should prolly also capture the M/H pairs
ben_vulpes: uniform strings; still setting all this machinery up
ben_vulpes: once i start collecting data in earnest, yes
ben_vulpes: going to look at output distribution too
mircea_popescu: and do some standards : M, xor M, M+1, M-1, M shifted 1 etc
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: keep 'em coming, experimental design in this space is not my strength
mircea_popescu: ok, so for every string of FG bits called M, do hashing of M, M+1, M+2, M with first bit flipped, M with first two bits flipped, inverse of M. that's 6 items.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: add to that 2 instances of a single randomly located bit flipped.
mircea_popescu: this is turning into some pretty hardcore computering, 8 versions per M, esp in the 64kb / 2kb format
phf came back from the woods again
☟︎ a111: Logged on 2017-06-30 09:10 mircea_popescu: paging phf for ben_vulpes 's needs
phf: it's a special thread alright.
phf: i think ascii already made that point, that if you're profiling lisp with the vm startup, then you should also profile c machine from boot time. at the very least the vm should be warmed up by loading all the dependencies into the core, doing save-lisp on it, and then making sure that your foo.lisp has an up to date fasl. inside lisp though to achieve the optimizations you run variants of your function inside (time ...) until you bring it within the ra
☟︎ phf: you can do sampling profiler to get some idea of what your mainloop looks like, but in the code of that size you should be able to reason about it. you then ensure that you have best possible type for your task, and type annotate the mainloop functions. type annotation for speed is tricky and unless you know both the standard and your implementation in and out, you have to look at the assemble of the resulting function
phf: i think maybe it's worthwhile as an auxiliary exploration. you can run it and it will either confirm what you already understood, but sometimes it'll correct your understanding. either way you have to understand how sampling profiler works (particularly when it comes to sampling freq), to use it effectively
phf: if you quicklisp bulk of your code, you're still basically in honeywagon territory
a111: Logged on 2017-07-03 14:38 phf came back from the woods again
mircea_popescu: you're not gonna be remembered as "that guy who spent the whole time touristing" are you.
a111: Logged on 2017-07-03 14:54 asciilifeform: whereas for item that ~you wrote~, you already have the kind of picture that a sampling profiler is giving you -- in your head
mircea_popescu: people have this uncanny ability to describe abstracts they do not in the least comprehend.
mircea_popescu: "what's the difference between whimsical and whipsical ?" "the welts."
a111: Logged on 2017-07-03 05:50 mircea_popescu: ok, so for every string of FG bits called M, do hashing of M, M+1, M+2, M with first bit flipped, M with first two bits flipped, inverse of M. that's 6 items.
mircea_popescu: at the very least should give some indication what to look at closer
mircea_popescu: as someone who has written 64kb in one sitting, it's ONLY FUCKING FAIR.
mircea_popescu: 6 months is no less than 500 patches. what tree is 500 patches long ?
mircea_popescu: rebase. now you know why yo uhave to -- nobody's waiting for your 500 long tree.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you can't have a computationally infeasible algo that's also easy to compute!
mircea_popescu: in taking hours it is doing EXACTLY what we wanted it to do.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you can't have alternatives WITHOUT ALTERNATIVE!
mircea_popescu: this can't be a thing "i want a bunch of substantially different items that are all identical to the best performing one in any arbitrarily chosen criteria"
mircea_popescu: this outlook is how america became walmart and cmachine
mircea_popescu: it pushes in 1st stage "well, select some criteria you REALLY care about then" and after that it's "wel lthis ball of warts does that, so fuck you with it"
mircea_popescu: i'm just hoping S is over 1mb for the 64kb/2kb item and yay.
mircea_popescu: good for you. now you can't use it to do 5k hashes parallel.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform every algorithm rewards not-intel-hardware.
mircea_popescu: point being, this isn't a valid objection. any work will take a truck, and any computing will take custom hardware.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you can't unwrap it in hardware. unlike rsa, fhfs you sitll hafta iterate.
a111: Logged on 2014-03-29 01:53 asciilifeform: encode payload as bits on a grid, and run cellular automaton
mircea_popescu: in fact the whole game of life thing was exploratory in that direction.
BingoBoingo: Well, (game of/war of) life is finite. Death infinite!
mircea_popescu: a lot of interesting questions for the thinking man in our age.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-24 01:02 asciilifeform: incidentally, since (to borrow the lament of turing's school headmaster) 'the room already stinks of mathematics', i'll share a tidbit that i promised folx some half year ago and promptly forgot:
a111: Logged on 2016-12-24 01:10 asciilifeform: say i want to encipher (dun matter with what) a string, 'To: mircea_popescu Subj: thermonuke launch codes ...'
mircea_popescu: so bnasically, fhf as just a m is a hash, as s+m it's a "padding" function
mircea_popescu: the idea was that you need them together. maybe concat, i guess.
mircea_popescu: if you have the end S of a hashing, you can reconstruct M from H.
mircea_popescu: no. if you have message M, and compute a fhf on it, and give out the M, you used fhf as a hash. if you give out both H and S, you used fhf as a "bit convertor" or w/e, the original M can be extracted, with sweat.
mircea_popescu: and this should, at least to my superficial mind, work as rsa padding.
mircea_popescu: i'm not 100% on it, but my own napkins seem to indicate.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that's also the precursory to proof of its strenght : to reverse a 64kb msg hash you need to intuit 1mb of data.
mircea_popescu: speaking of which, this was to be my next step, once ben_vulpes done profiling : impl a reverser, see the impact of bitwise altered S on end result.
mircea_popescu: it is similarily possible for last bit of xor otp to flip only last bit of r.
mircea_popescu: but go ahead and compute that "possible" into something ?
jhvh1: shinohai: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 2560.0, vol: 12050.11464246 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 2518.362, vol: 4959.23008 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 2538.0, vol: 15695.64266697 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 2664.318528, vol: 12913.91030000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 2556.0, vol: 7185.44696892 | Volume-weighted last average: 2574.51815697
a111: Logged on 2017-07-02 00:32 mircea_popescu: chicks love teh electric stove tho.
ben_vulpes: i always figured the electrical stove was just another shitanium knockoff of The Real Thing; in what ways is it so much better than gas?
shinohai likes the convection properties of electric ovens
ben_vulpes: you know i was just thinking about wiring pids into my electrical unit for precision control!
ben_vulpes: pidbox is like 13 bucks on ebay with thermocouple included
ben_vulpes: odds that i'll ever buy a fancy brand new stove are pretty low anyways
ben_vulpes files this away with the refrigerated drawers for the Someday Kitchen
ben_vulpes: oh, as water comes out of the air, pressure drops and makes opening the thing impossible?
mircea_popescu: and as moisutre in the environment cools, it either rusts on them or else outright freezes
mircea_popescu: even if it neither rusts nor frezes permawet bs is horrible for hygiene
mircea_popescu: then if you insulate them they grow to where the chicks gotta work them in teams...
ben_vulpes: could vinyl slides and drip trays but the complexity begins to mount
ben_vulpes: well, figured the drawers would slide into and out of a refrigerated cabinet
mircea_popescu has spent some cycl;es optimizing restaurant kitchen of all things
ben_vulpes: not refrigerate the drawers themselves
mircea_popescu: afaik the only actual implementation oif this that ~works is in morgue. they are side of beef sized drawers, and rather expensive.
mircea_popescu: never saw a way to make them work for you know, 10 to 20lb sizes.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes you know what that does to your insurance incidentally ?
a111: Logged on 2017-07-03 17:11 mircea_popescu: fine temperature control.
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: don't those things have internal actuators?
mircea_popescu: at another time, mp lived in a place where july/dec diff was maybe 2 degrees
mircea_popescu: and in other "omfg biodiversitiers" : my power alarm has this very strident, two sharp note bee-bop noise
mircea_popescu: that day, there was a bird doing the ~exact thing outside, we thought nothing of.
mircea_popescu: he's been back ever since, ALL AROUND, perching, singing an ever more dejected bee-bop.
scriba: ssh banner of 177.234.7.47 as seen on 2016-06-13: SSH-1.99-DOPRA-1.5
scriba: ssh banner of 177.234.11.157 as seen on 2016-06-13: SSH-1.99-HUAWEI-1.5
scriba: ssh banner of 177.234.2.145 as seen on 2016-06-13: SSH-1.99-HUAWEI-1.5
mircea_popescu: obviously the presidency is a racist/rapist institution no longer adequate fopr the needs of ourdemocracy!
mircea_popescu: just think... one single guy making decisions! on his own! having authority!