assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 32 @ 0.10294155 = 3.2941 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 13 @ 0.08 = 1.04 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 40 @ 0.01866781 = 0.7467 BTC [-] {10}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 1900 @ 0.00045 = 0.855 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 23 @ 0.1 = 2.3 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 27 @ 0.09998516 = 2.6996 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 21 @ 0.1 = 2.1 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 3 @ 0.093 = 0.279 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 602 @ 0.00045 = 0.2709 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 4 @ 0.093 = 0.372 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 377 @ 0.000435 = 0.164 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 1490 @ 0.00043501 = 0.6482 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 6 @ 0.1 = 0.6 BTC [+] {2}
KRS|Gotyawallet: used for purchasing fried chicken and watermelon at a discount
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 5 @ 0.1 = 0.5 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 2 @ 0.1 = 0.2 BTC [+]
ozbot: #bitcoin-otc order book
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 25 @ 0.05892203 = 1.4731 BTC [-] {15}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 2 @ 0.0915 = 0.183 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 2 @ 0.09 = 0.18 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 3 @ 0.07966666 = 0.239 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 2 @ 0.07805 = 0.1561 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 26 @ 0.02099999 = 0.546 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15050 @ 0.00090851 = 13.6731 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 54 @ 0.07703055 = 4.1596 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 31 @ 0.05959354 = 1.8474 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 10 @ 0.022189 = 0.2219 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 470 @ 0.00047491 = 0.2232 BTC [+] {6}
benkay: ;;ticker --market btcavg
gribble: BitcoinAverage BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 510.04, Best ask: 511.53, Bid-ask spread: 1.49000, Last trade: 510.13, 24 hour volume: 412704.96, 24 hour low: None, 24 hour high: None, 24 hour vwap: 557.2
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1010 @ 0.001 = 1.01 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 8 @ 0.0999874 = 0.7999 BTC [+] {3}
bloctoc: they will cease having fiat issues when people cease using fiat
BingoBoingo: bloctoc: On some level people will always continue using some fiat in some role. You have to buy toothpaste sometime.
skylax: the goverenment will always have the power to shut down crypto, they just won't do it yet
bloctoc: you don't anymore have to use fiat to buy toothpaste.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 3 @ 0.09999989 = 0.3 BTC [+]
bloctoc: whole foods on gyft for example
bloctoc: skylax - how on earth would the government shut down crypto?
benkay: BingoBoingo: it doesn't look like they use localbitcoins. i wonder if that's even an option for them.
BingoBoingo: bloctoc: Why would I want to consider parting with something valuable like BTC for a consumable like toothpast though.
BingoBoingo: Fiat will alway have that niche of stuff too boring to trade BTC for
skylax: @bloctoc they could easily block the protocol channels of any bitcoin related subjects. RIght now there is a bit of battle going on between bitcoin and legal institutions, if bitcoin wins, meaning it can bypass the law, then I'm pretty sure a lot of other things in society will probably be used to bypass the law in the same manner.
BingoBoingo: skylax: I think you are mistaken. Bitcoin is now the law and BitBet the court.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 136 @ 0.00243997 = 0.3318 BTC [-] {10}
benkay: don't go overboard with the sycophancy now BingoBoingo
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 3 @ 0.09999988 = 0.3 BTC [-] {2}
bloctoc: skylax you mean like China blocks CNN? There's no battle right now, at most there's fincen bragging that they found a way to fit bitcoin into their own status quo. I really suspect bureaucrats everywhere don't give a shit except that reporters only want to talk about bitcoin.
BingoBoingo: benkay: Sycophants aren't a bad thing, either to have or to be. I will admit though that mircea_popescu has made some poor decisions like Market Making X.idiff.
benkay: that has to have been a painful exercise.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 14 @ 0.0487 = 0.6818 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 2 @ 0.07400001 = 0.148 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 10 @ 0.09999988 = 1 BTC [+] {3}
skylax_: @bloctoc the beaucrats will eventually give a shit if bitcoin becomes too mainstream and manages to manipulate other currencies
skylax: @bloctoc the beaucrats will eventually give a shit if bitcoin becomes too mainstream and manages to manipulate other currencies
skylax: @bloctoc what do you think the future of bitcoin will look like?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 198 @ 0.001 = 0.198 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 29 @ 0.09499992 = 2.755 BTC [+] {9}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6600 @ 0.00090667 = 5.984 BTC [-]
bloctoc: skylax - A bunch of regulatory functions will be better served by crypto. Monetary policy is the most obvious, but there will be other "industries" that will be made redundant. There will be no more credit checks unless you actually want a loan. SEC no longer needed except for enforcement. Title insurance gone. Toothpaste still around.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6476 @ 0.00090532 = 5.8629 BTC [-] {2}
bloctoc: I'm pretty excited about the functionality suggested by mastercoin, ripple, and colored coins. I get that all those are not solid technically yet, but the direction is clearly laid out for those who care to believe.
bloctoc: oh, and cherry trucks on the cover of Rolling Stone.
KRS|Gotyawallet: bloctoc a lot of bitcoiners are not happy with mastercoin for instance because they're saying its centralized and a large portion of the wealth is privately owned
monolithik: mastercoin is a joke. ripple is technologically interesting but will probably be a failure due to high complexity and relative need for centralized trusted parties
monolithik: colored coins have potential but none of the implementations are of sufficient quality yet
BingoBoingo: Look, if you want to ipo without any gatekeepers isn't cryptostocks questionable enough for you?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10640 @ 0.00090425 = 9.6212 BTC [-]
bloctoc: If I knew MP personally, then sure. but MP might be the FBI for all I know.
bloctoc: … unless "cryptostocks" is more than some generic term. In which case I never heard of it.
BingoBoingo: bloctoc: Cryptostocks is the Vircurex spinoff Vircurex IPO'd itself on
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.27001 BTC [+]
skylax: bloctoc: I suppose the efficiency of crypto will erase many of worthless industries, but crowdsource law is pretty complex and unreliable so some kind of institution will still be present, if somehow someone made crowdsourced law work, then this method would be used in all legal fields such as commercial law and criminal law etc. Also to mention crypto if heavily technology dependent, if the power goes out, we go back to cave
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2550 @ 0.00090425 = 2.3058 BTC [-]
bloctoc: …if the power goes out, we go back to cave - yes crypto or no crypto that's true. Same argument for breaking SHA256. As far as crowdsource law it will be nice to see some template corporations that get set up by copy/paste instead of paying a lawyer $10K to copy/paste. For what it's worth, I do think the smart contracts will do that for us.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37584 @ 0.00090762 = 34.112 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29666 @ 0.00090985 = 26.9916 BTC [+] {6}
skylax: bloctoc: what do you mean template corporations?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 300 @ 0.001 = 0.3 BTC
ozbot: x-dream - the 5th dimension (live in paris) - YouTube
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15100 @ 0.00091079 = 13.7529 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 98 @ 0.00273497 = 0.268 BTC [+] {4}
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform bloodcurdingly obnoxious shit. "everyone respect the laws" ? bs.
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell dexx7 guy was actually emailing me about the thing. i sent him a list of no's and the way we left it was he's gonna lurk here for a while figure shit out.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo i never marketmade x.idiff ?! what are you talkin' about ?
nubbins`: i bet it's full of insufferable assholes
Bugpowder: I sold $20k to a nice family of four in Santa Monica
Bugpowder: I think it was their life savings :(
Bugpowder: They just wanted to move to Chile...
mircea_popescu: nubbins` they were trying to sell me on the thing. i tell you i don't see it, why would you want to go hang out there ?
mircea_popescu: Bugpowder is a family of four mean a guy and three women ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Ah, I must have confused futures and options
Bugpowder: Geeky father, overbearing fat mother, two incredibly cute blond girls
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: i remember a while back this guy on the forums had a huge thesis-length post about "bitcoin land", a place where bitcoin would be used everywhere
Bugpowder: they need bitcoin to go to $2500 to afford their land
nubbins`: he waited 8 or 9 paragraphs before bringing up the drug therapies
Bugpowder: warned them not to manic sell if it were to drop... I hope the held on...
mircea_popescu: nubbins` gotta give junkies credit when they manage to hold off for a thousand words before bringin; it.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo re options, you gotta understand that ecosystems are born out of shit.
nubbins`: mircea_popescu: you gotta do something like that in a city, not out in the woods. e.g. freetown christiania
mircea_popescu: nubbins` when i was a mobster i didn't wanna go live with all the other mobsters. generally this seems to be a common trend, too, people don't seem to go "a shit, you know what'd be cool ? let's move upstate. the city's a toilet!"
ozbot: How much for the little girl? - YouTube
mircea_popescu: Bugpowder it'll suck to be you when you're 50 and old and frail
ozbot: katie kaboom - YouTube
nubbins`: one week each month, the bathroom garbage fills up much quicker than usual
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 14 @ 0.06771428 = 0.948 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 9 @ 0.06422222 = 0.578 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell mircea_popescu remind me in 10 years to neg Bugpowder if his "i will never be frail" promise turns out to be made of milk.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 27 @ 0.06336149 = 1.7108 BTC [-] {3}
nubbins`: ok enough of this, gonna print one more color
nubbins`: we got a rush job earlier today, due tomorrow ;(
Bugpowder: my buddy just started getting T supplementation
pizzaman1337: mircea_popescu: just curious, what do you think bitcoin is worth right now?
pizzaman1337: mircea_popescu: and how about in terms of USD?
Bugpowder: oh shit... They needed their coins to appreciate to $75,000??
mircea_popescu: sorta like a badly managed pmb, i guess some people show green playing with fire, but overall...
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 10 @ 0.0655 = 0.655 BTC [+]
Bugpowder: Its going to take a while to get to $4,000 / btc I think. Doubt they will be able to hold on
mircea_popescu: not for you, for them. plunk the whiole thing down on yes :D
ozbot: BitBet - BTC network difficulty to top 1B before 2014
pizzaman1337: so do you think it's currently worth more or less than $500 per coin? (seems to be hovering at around 500)
ozbot: People Bitcoin is not worth 100+ dollars per. STOP BUYING! pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 8 @ 0.06328875 = 0.5063 BTC [-] {3}
Bugpowder: coinbase became like a real company and shit
BingoBoingo: Honeslty it is probably worth an amount such that you yourself would have to pay to get an honest answer
mircea_popescu: not that, really, but anyway. seriously pizzaman1337, it's impossible to make a definitive call like that in the current circumstance.
mircea_popescu: we're not imo in dangerous territory, and that's all i care about.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 5000 @ 0.001 = 5 BTC
mircea_popescu: i did have the "ppl stop buying" post prepared, but it never got there, so... crisis averted.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 100 @ 0.06281 = 6.281 BTC [-] {2}
KRS|Gotyawallet: mircea_popescu: I was wondering about a follow-up on that one, much time has passed in btc time.
mircea_popescu: moving on, did i mention body stockings are kinda cool ? they should put this in seventeen or w/e kids read, "if you don't own a coupla good ones you're no woman"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 10 @ 0.06282 = 0.6282 BTC [+] {2}
gribble: Current Blocks: 275787 | Current Difficulty: 9.08350862437022E8 | Next Difficulty At Block: 276191 | Next Difficulty In: 404 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 19 hours, 52 minutes, and 23 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1177706524.89 | Estimated Percent Change: 29.65326
mircea_popescu: and nobody is doing this, practyically, acoupla noname shops
Bugpowder: how many total computational power of the worlds is that
mircea_popescu: what will it look like when the miner producers dominate the silicon industry on the ground, and are like 5 of the top 20 corps on mpex
mircea_popescu: which by now of course does more in a day than the fiat stock exchanges combined in a week
mircea_popescu: Bugpowder an impressive chunk, no matter how you look at it.
ozbot: Things that matter these days ; things that don’t matter these days. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mirce
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22300 @ 0.00090519 = 20.1857 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10900 @ 0.0009089 = 9.907 BTC [+]
xoinfinityox: @mircea - good article. this might be a dumb Q but whats the danger of controlling interest in BTC?
mircea_popescu: a 51% attack is the situation where one party controls a majority of mining.
mircea_popescu: that party can then do some nefarious choosing in the transactions that get accepted and then rolled back
mircea_popescu: resulting in untrustworthy btc conveyance for as long as their 51% position lasts
mircea_popescu: can of course does not equal will, but giving that sort of an option to anyone is anathema to the bitcoin philosophy and the expectations built around it.
xoinfinityox: i gotcha, they can get out in front of the actual chain
mircea_popescu: we're roughly past the point where this is feasible, which is one of the major things tghat changed since back in spring.
monolithik: network consolidation is definitely a problem. Best case scenario IMO: ASIC development hits the point where an increase in ghash/watt would be reducible to a general improvement in human knowledge of semiconductors. At that point bitcoin ASICs will become commoditized like Intel CPUs, and the distribution of hashpower would settle to some equilibrium where power was not too widely concentrated
mircea_popescu: monolithik i tell you, it's when upscale bathrooms come with miners in the tile
xoinfinityox: i would prefer to be a slumlord with the same tiles
monolithik: question: will people run miners unprofitably to ensure that nobody has a majority share?
Duffer1: mircea what do you base your assumption on that us/china govs are hashing?
mircea_popescu: Duffer1 not rly an assumption. ppl have asked before, but i never said anything.
xoinfinityox: mono: i think once you get the market consolidated to a few big players, they will compete pretty fiercely
mircea_popescu: monolithik mining is roughly slightly unprofitable on the spot today, and has been for a while. on the long term it will remain so.
xoinfinityox: the value of their own coins vs the risk of losing them should keep from cartelizing
Duffer1: if it's not an assumption then how do you know?
monolithik: will people abandon bitcoin if some kind of nefarious mining cartel forms? Is that enough of a disencentive for the miners to do so?
monolithik: so far, the system has shown to be incentive-safe in practice
xoinfinityox: i dont think mining cartels would really be profitable or efficient
mircea_popescu: people will definitely abandon bitcoin if it fucks up. hash concentration is one such fuckup.
mircea_popescu: implementing any sort of legal controls is more of such a fuckup.
xoinfinityox: for large entities like nations (banks?) i think the value / advantage of ownership would keep them mining
monolithik: agreed. what is your opinion of libbitcoin/darkwallet initiatives?
monolithik: I read some of the libbitcoin source. It is high quality.
mircea_popescu: the wilson guy definitely means well. i don't see he;s delivering any value yet, but it's way too early. the other thing sounds like it means well, same situation.
monolithik: extensive use of boost::asio for purely async networking.
monolithik: I don't know about most of the other people involved, but Amir Taaki is a talented engineer.
monolithik: yeah he is pretty terrible as a spokesperson. But his code is good
mircea_popescu: seems of late he's taken to heart the invitation to do less of the speaking.
monolithik: yeah. I agree with the need to have multiple implementations. Right now the main point of centralization is the core development team.
xoinfinityox: what articles on trilema are required reading for getting started with btc?
monolithik: Obviously there are difficulties with ensuring that they all interoperate properly, but that just leads to better standardization, which is good.
mircea_popescu: that's kinda dying, really. anyway, yes, it's a good use of resources and has been for a while to try and specify the code. bar that, alternate implementations may work.
mircea_popescu: xoinfinityox hit the bitcoin category, can't hurt anything.
mircea_popescu: maybe even make your own list and publish it somewhere.
mircea_popescu: monolithik exactly. also, if there's going to be improvements to the concept, they may be discovered this way. atm we don't really know what utterly sucks in bitcoin.
mircea_popescu: sort-of like nobody figured out why ruby on rails utterly sucks until they had tried to make websites in it for a few years and they could never get one secure. then it was pretty clear.
☟︎ monolithik: mircea: I think that bitcoin or a direct descendant (i.e. forked from the current chain, not some premined crap) will win. It's classic "worse is better".
mircea_popescu: but yeah, Duffer1 has a point, trilema isn't exactly a manual, more like that one asshole instructor in karate that just beats the shit out of you and then laughs.
mircea_popescu: monolithik i agree, but that means little in the context.
monolithik: (I don't think we are disagreeing with eachother) the best technology doesn't always win. The one that is first to market that is un-shitty enough to provide some value wins.
monolithik: thats why I think altcoins are futile.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.28039999 = 2.804 BTC [+] {3}
xoinfinityox: what really distinguishes most altcoins at this point anyway?
Duffer1: lower transaction times, different proofs work
benkay: what's more important is their unifying theme of irrelevance.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I believe Vircurex is now the Canonical example of the failure of RoR to accomplish anything
Duffer1: there's legit innovation that should occur, alts serve that purpose
benkay: nah. 10m/block is fine
mircea_popescu: monolithik perhaps many alt chains are futile. keeping one on hand just in case makes some sense tho
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo nah, davout's site is the cannonical example opf that.
monolithik: i think that the idea of using a memory-hard hash function (e.g. scrypt a la litecoin) is good, but not enough of a gain to offset the network effects of all the infrastructure built up around btc
toffoo: so mircea_popescu getting back to us/china gov mining, did you just make that up or is it based on any kind of evidence?
benkay: didn't your name once only have one trailing 'o', toffoo?
toffoo: benkay only very briefly, like the first day
xoinfinityox: if they're gonna seize a couple $MM in bitcoins
toffoo: maybe in 5-10years it makes sense, not in 2013
mircea_popescu: it became a definite a coupla months back, but they had been doing it for a while.
xoinfinityox: I understand mircea not wanting to drop his sources, but I would think you can follow an appropriations bill or something to find the proof
benkay: unless the pentagon's doing it.
benkay: unless any bureau with acceptable operational financing is doing it.
benkay: unless anyone with any real power is behind it.
benkay: depends far more on involved individuals.
benkay: the great all seeing eye of USG mk. IV will not of its own make any decisions.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23450 @ 0.00091006 = 21.3409 BTC [+] {2}
xoinfinityox: what's the hypothetical effect on the market of an announcement that gov'ts are mining?
benkay: much like walmart does not hate women and want to prevent them from earning dollar parity with men, the .75/1.00 ratio is the accumulation of many individual's decisions
Duffer1: if confirmed i expect the price will rocket
benkay: bafflement and confusion? inability to comprehend relevance of statement?
xoinfinityox: i agree with you that if the goal is defense/intelligence/law enforcement keeping it secret is preferrable
benkay: let's play a thought game
benkay: we sit down to a poker game
benkay: wherein you derive some small benefit from knowing what i plan to do and the motivations behind it
benkay: why would any competent actor in the scenario disclose targets goals strategies or philosophies!?
xoinfinityox: this isn't about strategy, its about whether the US is playing the game at all
xoinfinityox: a better analogy might be, you sit down and the guy across from you is phil helmuth, or its some random guy
benkay: no, they are playing the game. you were making some sort of claim about their goals vis-a-vis sketchiness.
xoinfinityox: i don't doubt mircea's veracity, but one source does not a fact makee
benkay: well by the time one waits for confirmation of a fact the market has long since priced it in typically
xoinfinityox: did the market move based on mircea's article?
Duffer1: germany timezone waking up
xoinfinityox: i'm not trying to argue here - still trying to figure out how this market works
mircea_popescu: <Duffer1> if confirmed i expect the price will rocket << you know it was announced before btc rocketed ?
benkay: arguing is all -assets does, xoinfinityox ;)
mircea_popescu: Duffer1 yes, that 16th of oct article linked earlier, is where it was announced. toffoo has been asking me about whence and wherefore ever since.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 11 @ 0.0487 = 0.5357 BTC [-]
benkay: and people wonder why mining is unprofitable.
toffoo: I just saw the article for the first time today, when you linked it earlier..
toffoo: if it turns there's some truth to the statement, color me surprised
Duffer1: maybe toffo with one o? :P
xoinfinityox: im curious why other news outlets don't pick it up
benkay: yeah i don't quite understand that, mircea_popescu.
Duffer1: no proof = not really newsworthy, regardless of who says it
Duffer1: in this case it's still probably worth paying attention to though
nubbins`: halfway through a 4-color print run
mircea_popescu: xoinfinityox other news outlets don't practically exist. what's out there ?
mircea_popescu: "hey guise, here's a cool idea, make us president coins narf" ?
ozbot: imgur: the simple image sharer
benkay: mircea_popescu: how does mining being unprofitable make bitcoing work?
nubbins`: it encourages people to get the hashrate climbing as fast as fucking possible
mircea_popescu: benkay you read the buffett bit re commodified markets ?
xoinfinityox: @mircea_popescu other news outlets and tech blogs pick up gov't regulation / seizure of btc events
benkay: mircea_popescu: yeah but fail to draw the dots
xoinfinityox: like i said, i'm a total noob at btc but prooof that gov'ts are mining would be a huge headline
mircea_popescu: xoinfinityox i guess that may be interesting in the sense pointing the spot lights at airplane wrecks could be interesting. meanwhile in the real war...
benkay: nubbins`: but rational market participants won't buy if their investment never returns, so how does unprofitable mining work forever?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3868 @ 0.00090627 = 3.5055 BTC [-]
benkay: or even ever, as a part of the thing?
mircea_popescu: benkay well, the hash power is designed to be commodified. this means it'll always sell just a shade under average cost.
xoinfinityox: i know, im at a really topical level right now
nubbins`: benkay: rational market participants are absent, for starters
xoinfinityox: so accepting that fact as true, where is the real war?
mircea_popescu: rational market participants are individually rational.
nubbins`: benkay: the people buying mining hardware are falling over themselves trying to get it hashing as fast as possible, so they maximize their returns
benkay: some get their goods at an acceptable rate and delivered on an acceptable time, making money etc. this drives others in who make less excellent ops decisions, ruining margin.
mircea_popescu: " Each proposal to do so looked like an immediate winner. Measured by standard return-on-investment tests, in fact, these proposals usually promised greater economic benefits than would have resulted from comparable expenditures in our highly-profitable candy and newspaper businesses."
mircea_popescu: "Viewed individually, each company's capital investment decision appeared cost-effective and rational; viewed collectively, the decisions neutralized each other and were irrational, just as happens when each person watching a parade decides he can see a little better if he stands on tiptoes."
benkay: your lessons as always appreciated.
benkay: apparently i had to read that post 5 times before it made sense in context.
benkay: and must read it another 5 for penance.
mircea_popescu: that's ok, i just keep linking the same shit over and over.
mircea_popescu: surprisingly, it still delivers benefits way past the 5th repetition.
mircea_popescu: anyway, that;'s a particularly well fit quote. if only the various twentysomething ex-geek now bitcoin financiers & investors had a financial culture.
nubbins`: the 2008 meltdown caused cotton prices to skyrocket for a few months in late 2010
nubbins`: this was right around the time i started printing
nubbins`: spent several months wondering where the fuck these people on the forums were getting $2 blanks until i realized that was a thing of the past
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 10 @ 0.0629 = 0.629 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1000 @ 0.001 = 1 BTC
nubbins`: doge is kind of taking over the public consciousness, hey?
ozbot: Leonard Cohen - The Partisan / ISLE OF WIGHT 1970 - YouTube
BingoBoingo: nubbins`: That just means Doge has passed critical mass. Expect Old meme to set in soon.
jurov: first came drama-backed currency, then meme-backed, what's next?
benkay: meme:silver::drama:gold
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.281 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: xoinfinityox: That's totally old meme, worthless for coining
benkay: genesis block must be at least not be rotting on the floor stinking of irrelevancy.
benkay: but now it's MRRRNSTRRRRM.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 154 @ 0.00273997 = 0.422 BTC [+] {2}
truff1es: ryan gosling is hot good choice !
benkay: security apparatus recruitment pitch: "meet strange new people! put your hand up their butts!"
mircea_popescu: muricans gotta get it in their square jawed skulls that there's a difference between the rich and the poor, and confusing this difference will get you exterminated.
mircea_popescu: fucking travesty of justice, to pretend like you can meddle with the top tier.
benkay: who's going to get exterminated, mp?
jurov: BingoBoingo: you do realize that you have one searchable cavity less?
BingoBoingo: jurov: Sure, but I had no cavities searched.
truff1es: is sticking things in the peen a thing?
ozbot: Urban Dictionary: Sound Docking
mircea_popescu: benkay anyone who believes that, to quote asciilifeform's earlier quoted article, "the U.S. government expects laws to be followed by everyone in the USA" may translate as hassling a foreign high class person
ozbot: Urban Dictionary: sounding
mircea_popescu: or, for the earlier example, anyone who imagines a lower court us judge has the authority to detain strauss, and the testimony of a hotel maid can serve as basis for such
ozbot: Urban Dictionary: boofing
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04515011 = 0.2258 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: there's just no room in the world for such nonsense. you can arrest a bum because some other bum said so.
mircea_popescu: powerful people get their own courts and their own procedures or else.
benkay: nobody's getting their head chopped off in that case.
mircea_popescu: xoinfinityox well apparently they don't anymore, not in india.
mircea_popescu: anyway, this pedestrian equalitariansm has gone way beyond far enough.
truff1es: what evidence did they expect to find with a strip search i dunno what that was about
BingoBoingo: truff1es: Brown skin not created by a spray tan
truff1es: yea but it said state department ordered..
BingoBoingo: Never know when you might find a Kardashian as opposed to an actual foreigner
benkay: state department ordered just means that someone in the state department decided she needed a fist up the pooper.
xoinfinityox: thats how we send a message in modern politics
xoinfinityox: used to be you sent a fleet of ships out and blockaded a small island nation
mircea_popescu: except the message is "we're much too big for our breeches, please take us down three notches."
BingoBoingo: There are exactly 3 rules for being minimally hassled upon arrest in the United States: 1. Be white and hava a shitty American Accent 2. Wear a suit 3. Don't smell like a hobo
xoinfinityox: mircea: isn't that the whole point of this channel? :)
benkay: it's not simply los estados unidos, however, it's the entire fiat system. usg simply sits atop it for the meantime.
mircea_popescu: xoinfinityox sort-of. notrly, i think the point of this channel is more like, hm.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18102 @ 0.00090466 = 16.3762 BTC [-] {3}
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I think the point was not being -otc?
truff1es: i must say the "rules" in here are the more free in rooms ive frequented
mircea_popescu: i seem to remember simpleminded psychopathy was on the list.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I thought the simpleminded part was refuted...
xoinfinityox: unless there is an invisible hand up your anus
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.28799999 = 0.576 BTC [+] {2}
benkay: actually that does bring up a good point: the difference between psychotic and psychopathic
BingoBoingo: benkay: THe difference is that Vitamin H can surpress the former, but not the latter
BingoBoingo: (By vitamin H I mean Haloperidol and not the bullshit actual medical references are returning)
benkay: mircea_popescu is unsurpressable regardless of his psych status
benkay: i recall something about an entire litre of grain alcohol?
truff1es: "An earlier version of this article misstated the surname of India’s national security adviser. He is Shivshankar Menon, not Moon." hehe
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
benkay: bitcoin satan is invincible
benkay: at 1m/coin, he will bathe in virgins lactation while taking their virginity six in a session
benkay: at 1b/coin he will hog-tie the entire dev team and make them watch unspeakable horrors
benkay: or even better have their patches to the original client reviewed by his crack squad of c she-coders
benkay: must be thoroughly mixed with truth for maximum lulz
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 2 @ 0.0628 = 0.1256 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 3 @ 0.0629 = 0.1887 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 44 @ 0.00293 = 0.1289 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 21 @ 0.27024998 = 5.6752 BTC [-] {10}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13900 @ 0.00090606 = 12.5942 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 3 @ 0.0628 = 0.1884 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.28499998 = 1.14 BTC [+] {2}
monolithik: well since I asked this question elsewhere and nobody is up, is anyone here knowledgeable about crypto?
davout: mircea_popescu: ranting about rails again heh
monolithik: anyway, is it safe to use djb's nacl library in production to encrypt messages over the wire?
azi`: ruby on rails still exists?
davout: mircea_popescu: so i did a quick test but i couldn't find an order id in the stat or statjson for me to know which order the reported execution is related to
davout: i see a 'Track' field in the statjson that i don't have in the regular stat but it doesn't look like an order id
davout: yeah, that was the other way i way thinking of
davout: should give the same info
davout: ok, i see how the tracking field works
davout: how about the case where an order makes it to the book but gets eaten before i get a chance to issue a stat?
davout: it'll appear in the executed orders, possibly among other executions
davout: it's not going to be ap problem for me though, curious tho
mircea_popescu: so it appears among the executed orders. you know it's executed, at what price and what qty.
davout: heh it doesn't, just trying to think about whether there are edge cases that your solution doesn't cover, because you know, that's what i do :)
davout: nobody dissuades david francois of nitpicking on edge cases
davout: but from what i understand, simply adding an order id to the reported executions isn't really trivial on your end
davout: WHERE IS YOUR PHP GOD NAO
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 5000 @ 0.0029691 = 14.8455 BTC [+] {19}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04878988 = 0.2439 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4521 @ 0.00090347 = 4.0846 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 195 @ 0.00297195 = 0.5795 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 9 @ 0.0221 = 0.1989 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 19 @ 0.045 = 0.855 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 400 @ 0.00297197 = 1.1888 BTC [+] {3}
jurov: *snide comment about mpex edge cases*
gribble: MtGox BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 700.0, Best ask: 704.63625, Bid-ask spread: 4.63625, Last trade: 708.99999, 24 hour volume: 65249.82276421, 24 hour low: 500.0, 24 hour high: 704.63625, 24 hour vwap: 591.30602
davout: BITCOIN, Y U NO CALM DOWN
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04878998 = 0.2439 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15500 @ 0.00090121 = 13.9688 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 20 @ 0.045 = 0.9 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32379 @ 0.00090618 = 29.3412 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 45 @ 0.04878988 = 2.1955 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.28499998 = 2.85 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 371 @ 0.0009071 = 0.3365 BTC [+]
taub: all these crypto rip-offs
markedathome: I don't suppose anyone knows of how to extract private keys from the satoshidice desktop app that was around a year or so ago?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22300 @ 0.00090501 = 20.1817 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 41 @ 0.0221 = 0.9061 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 19 @ 0.04878997 = 0.927 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10437 @ 0.00090096 = 9.4033 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25937 @ 0.000898 = 23.2914 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.28999933 = 1.74 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 9 @ 0.06499997 = 0.585 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 40 @ 0.0027989 = 0.112 BTC [-]
kakobrekla: i think you have an extra space prefixed there
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 25 @ 0.05216 = 1.304 BTC [-] {7}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 5 @ 0.051 = 0.255 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 400 @ 0.00279899 = 1.1196 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 4 @ 0.29 = 1.16 BTC [+]
ThickAsThieves: France decides 'textopornographie' is French for 'sexting'+
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7600 @ 0.00090443 = 6.8737 BTC [+]
ozbot: Russia's Putin: Pussy Riot duo to be freed despite 'disgraceful' protest - World News
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17550 @ 0.00089747 = 15.7506 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: but seriously, the decriminalize corruption thing is quite along the lines of my thinking.
ozbot: De ce coruptia nu va putea fi niciodata eliminata pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
kakobrekla: that article has too much unrecognizable words
mircea_popescu: besides, when the us says "you're taking a step back" you know you must be doing something right.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 3 @ 0.08599999 = 0.258 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.29179997 = 0.8754 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.29179997 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 10000 @ 0.00012 = 1.2 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7594 @ 0.00012 = 0.9113 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2006 @ 0.00012 = 0.2407 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 11190 @ 0.00012 = 1.3428 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 34 @ 0.00295998 = 0.1006 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2073 @ 0.00012 = 0.2488 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2000 @ 0.00012 = 0.24 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 109 @ 0.00279899 = 0.3051 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1737 @ 0.00012 = 0.2084 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 3000 @ 0.00012 = 0.36 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2003 @ 0.00012 = 0.2404 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 3000 @ 0.00012 = 0.36 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.29179997 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 12 @ 0.02219999 = 0.2664 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2962 @ 0.00012 = 0.3554 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1000 @ 0.00012 = 0.12 BTC [+]
ozbot: Russian bank looks to create new digital currency to compete in Bitcoin market - National Finance Ex
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1000 @ 0.00012 = 0.12 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7311 @ 0.00012 = 0.8773 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 10008 @ 0.00012 = 1.201 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 9990 @ 0.00012 = 1.1988 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 80000 @ 0.00012 = 9.6 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2500 @ 0.00012 = 0.3 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7500 @ 0.00012 = 0.9 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.29179997 = 0.5836 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 90235 @ 0.00012 = 10.8282 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 99754 @ 0.00012 = 11.9705 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 99330 @ 0.00012 = 11.9196 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 99497 @ 0.00012 = 11.9396 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 4855 @ 0.00012 = 0.5826 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 95140 @ 0.00012 = 11.4168 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 19912 @ 0.00012 = 2.3894 BTC [+] {2}
ThickAsThieves: so itll be like, what, 3PH of mining added this diff period?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 20000 @ 0.00012 = 2.4 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 60000 @ 0.00012 = 7.2 BTC [+]
jurov: china is actually mining and trying to scare competition :)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1700 @ 0.00012 = 0.204 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 8300 @ 0.00012 = 0.996 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 94258 @ 0.00012 = 11.311 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10356 @ 0.0009041 = 9.3629 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 5000 @ 0.00012 = 0.6 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 10000 @ 0.00012 = 1.2 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1880 @ 0.00012 = 0.2256 BTC [+]
ozbot: Cardano : Xmas blown, other statements pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
jurov: "Well managed stakeholder expectations should keep blowback to a minimum in case of failure. Supposedly we have exceptional, unmatched strengths in PR, which we now have an opportunity to test, which is valuable."
ozbot: Overstock.com to accept bitcoins; CEO says 'money is too important to leave in the hands of governme
jurov: no one gives a fuck about cardano = unmatched PR strength
KRS|Gotyawallet: indeed had to bring the only the freshest news here to my friends in #bitcoin-assets
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 13 @ 0.05207384 = 0.677 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: i guess this dethrones roger ver as Bitcoin Jesus of the Used Computer Parts ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 5 @ 0.05 = 0.25 BTC [-]
jurov: mircea you have used laz0rs to make cardanos? liquid cooled ones? y u no photos?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 11 @ 0.04632909 = 0.5096 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform can you satisfy the inquiring minds by snapping a coupla shots of the ded lazr ?
mircea_popescu: ( jurov it's for cutting the plastic casing, not rly anything supersexy)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5700 @ 0.0009041 = 5.1534 BTC [+]
jurov: you really do think nubbins` manboobs are sexier than that?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 120 @ 0.002799 = 0.3359 BTC [+]
jurov: but seriously, if asciilifeform does most of the prototype including casing himself, that calls for photo here and there
ozbot: Join Our Live Q&A on Thursday: Is Bitcoin a Passing Fad, or Here to Stay? - MoneyBeat - WSJ
mircea_popescu: "i think it's here to say but please don't misconstrue anything i say into grounds to sue me. also don't ask me about various milky topics re the bf"
Duffer1: how long is this discussion?
ThickAsThieves: "What does everyone else think about the idea of Gox allowing rapid transactions to mexico and brazil and other "cocaine rich" countries. Is this not going to create a hyper bubble? "
jurov: at least i made 0.09 BTC off bitbet :D, thx mircea
Duffer1: gavin andreson, chief bitcoin scientist
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 34700 @ 0.00012 = 4.164 BTC [+]
ozbot: Unsee — Secure and private temporary image hosting
pankkake: oh, unsee.cc is the kind of service I was looking for
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 750 @ 0.00296204 = 2.2215 BTC [+] {4}
ThickAsThieves: lol why is btc-e trollbox saying I need another $99.99 to chat?
jborkl: you already used up your 1000 chat credits?
jborkl: new fee introduced to remove troll spam from the trollbox- $99.99 for 1000 chat credits
Duffer1: min balance required for chat to function
Duffer1: chat is just as useless, just less spammy
Bugpowder: You need to hold at least $100 worth of currency to chat
mircea_popescu: <Duffer1> chat is just as useless, just less spammy << lol
mircea_popescu: btc-e doing their part to help the usd have real world value ?
jurov: but since you have unmatched PR strength, you can gloss over such details, i guess :D
the20year2: I hope they don't start charging for IRC
mircea_popescu: the20year2 everything worthwhile will cost money eventually.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 48 @ 0.00283666 = 0.1362 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 96 @ 0.00297 = 0.2851 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 35 @ 0.045 = 1.575 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 23 @ 0.05286954 = 1.216 BTC [+] {4}
jurov: oh and MKOPT/SPLIT in the FAQ still suffers from this, too
mircea_popescu: yeah but updating the faq is a pain cause i had to go and get it translated ;/
mircea_popescu: the20year2 so re your listing idea, do you have your reports posted anywhere ? what's the cashflow like ? etc.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [KCIM] 1376 @ 0.0028 = 3.8528 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 99 @ 0.02287574 = 2.2647 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.00279899 = 0.2799 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28700 @ 0.00090428 = 25.9528 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.0487896 = 0.4879 BTC [-]
the20year2: mircea , i send out cashflow reports to all our investors now , i don't make them public. I can send over our current business plan + cashflow report if you'd want
mircea_popescu: well, i dunno how serious you are about trying to list.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1178 @ 0.00297086 = 3.4997 BTC [+] {2}
the20year2: We're finally cashflowing from rental income, but the bigger money is from our equity gain, our total USD investment was $92,668.54 and our current asset & capital value is $192,035.16
the20year2: And that's since the last part of July
mike_c: re: translations. I have had good success with programmatically getting good human translations from
http://gengo.com/. mircea_popescu: except units, ie, independently leased parts of a property.
the20year2: In my area, the median home value is around $100k, and most of what we're looking at are going in the ~$30,000 range
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 100 @ 0.00339966 = 0.34 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: so how do you gain confidence in your equity evaluation ?
the20year2: I've had 3rd parties assess the liquidation value as well as my own value estimates since I've been in the business of evaluating properties for every large financial firm in the US
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7406 @ 0.00012 = 0.8887 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: and what makes you confident you can efficiently deploy capital ? in what limits ?
Duffer1: are you counting btc appreciation on top of your units for your total equity #?
the20year2: That's covered in the business plan mircea_popescu. We feel that we can deploy around $100k of capital per month
the20year2: (Into new properties/purchases that is)
the20year2: the BTC appreciation is another ball game and hard for me to personally value. When everything was running on bitfunder decently, our values kept doing well, even as BTC/USD started to gain
mikaeldice: Spending it seems to be the easy part :)
the20year2: in this case, you have to have teams of workers to do the rehab work , qualify tenants. Sure, you can spend more money to 'just get it done', but if you do that you pay retail for everything, and you can't make money by paying what everyone else does
mircea_popescu: started is one thing. btc went up what, 50x this year.
Duffer1: sorry i haven't followed rental starter at all, are you registered DPO or did you ipo?
the20year2: We IPO'd on bitfunder, but are now private/direct due to them shutting down
Duffer1: but not legally registered though right?
ozbot: [Direct] RentalStarter - A Midwest Real Estate Investment Company
the20year2: Yes, we're registered in Hong Kong and the United states. The hong kong company is connected to the US one through a legal service agreement
the20year2: DBA Full Power Asia Investments LTD in Hong Kong
Duffer1: thanks, i should probably stop being lazy and just read hehe
Duffer1: registered as a company is different from being registered with the SEC (making it legal for you to distribute shares)
Duffer1: under 1m offering should qualify you for 504 exemption, but you still will need to register with your state, and adhere to their blue sky laws
Duffer1: if you're interested in being squeky clean that is hehe :P
the20year2: Our lawyer has made me aware of the requirements, the issue here is that I don't know of any US investors that we have, SEC allows me to file a PPM if/when I'm notified of US investors ,and since startup we've barred US investment
the20year2: We've very seriously looked at doing a DPO but I can't round up enough investment to justify it
Duffer1: ah, i was under the impression that even if you were operating in the US you'd have to register
the20year2: The company that collects funding is not in the US
the20year2: The funds are sent to a LTD operated in the Hong Kong, of which I am not the director, there is a two way service agremeent between the two entities, according to what my personal understanding is, it can work that way. if we take on US investors, it needs to be done so at the US LLC level, and we then need to register
the20year2: We'll qualify for most US crowdfunding and DPO laws next year as we're bringing a accounting firm into the mix in Janurary when we have our first book audit
the20year2: I am the majority shareholder in the company, there is also a 15% management fee that comes into place. In order to comply with US tax laws, I take my dividends + management fee as salary
Duffer1: cool, looks like a solid project, good luck :)
the20year2: So far, so good. I Just thought early on that banks would be more open to adding us to portfolo lending
the20year2: If that was the case there'd be no problem and i wouldn't give a care about listing anywhere
Duffer1: they'd be funding their competition in multiple ways if they backed you
Duffer1: they want dat real estate, they don't want bitcoin to live
the20year2: none of the banks i talk to know about bitcoin
the20year2: And there's no reason for me to tell them that investors are being paid in bitcoin. ALl they know is that there's a out-of-country service agreement
ozbot: Hi Bro, I am here from couple of years and have good knowledge on how to prom - Pastebin.com
KRS|Gotyawallet: i can mine an alt coin and have twice as many bitcoins in the same amount of time as mining bitcoin, selling them at an exchange
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] [PAID] 17.03088030 BTC to 13`993 shares, 121710 satoshi per share
kakobrekla: theres 3 crypto coin threads on some local tech forum
Duffer1: apparently the lulz market space is profitable >.<
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] [PAID] 3.85235844 BTC to 333`249 shares, 1156 satoshi per share
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12800 @ 0.00090181 = 11.5432 BTC [-]
Duffer1: there's a reddit thread about some guy buying coffee with doge
benkay: so tapering is a go for the states
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 8700 @ 0.00012 = 1.044 BTC [+]
KRS|Gotyawallet: wtf someone bought ~12 BTC worth DOGE Coin: BTC 11.95468560 7969790.39827178
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 85 @ 0.00279899 = 0.2379 BTC [-]
the20year2: i wonder if the buyer is a guy i know :D
ozbot: Doge | Know Your Meme
ozbot: Crypto-Currency Market Capitalizations | Bitcoin Litecoin Peercoin Namecoin Quark ProtoShares WorldC
benkay: doge > litecoin by the end of q1 2014
ozbot: BitBet - Any altcoin will surpass Litecoin in market capitalization
Duffer1: vpn, the only way to travel
pankkake: wow, UK. what haven't they censored yet?
Duffer1: i wonder what service Ciphermine is using...
pankkake: they have an "optionnal" filter that is enabled by default, right?
pankkake: until it's not optionnal anymore
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 5 @ 0.05010001 = 0.2505 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: tho in fairness, it's more likely redditard overreacting and entry level dub speaking out of the three ring binder
mircea_popescu: than actually anything as meaningfully nefarious as the post implies.
Duffer1: probably.. but still, it is Sky
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 30 @ 0.05010001 = 1.503 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 10 @ 0.0228 = 0.228 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 12500 @ 0.00012 = 1.5 BTC [+]
pankkake: well, "six feet under" is widely used
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 3750 @ 0.00012 = 0.45 BTC [+]
jcpham: one-owner or multi-owner
Duffer1: that sounds like something i need to read
ThickAsThieves: I'm surprised there arent more sexperience database websites
ozbot: How to steal Bitcoin in three easy steps | The Verge
mircea_popescu: so is the verge going to be paying its staff on bitcoin,
mircea_popescu: or did they just accidentally prove they publish crap ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 33 @ 0.29513114 = 9.7393 BTC [+] {13}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 7 @ 0.0502 = 0.3514 BTC [+]
ozbot: BitBet - NASA finds ET
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58162 @ 0.00090436 = 52.5994 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [MPEX:S.NSA] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00012 / 0.00013374 / 0.00016 (2037 shares, 0.27 BTC), 30D: 0.0001011 / 0.00010754 / 0.00016 (487679 shares, 52.45 BTC)
mike_c: excellent pr skillz prevented a freefall :)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 50000 @ 0.001 = 50 BTC
benkay: the audience is tractable.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.297 BTC [+]
Vexual: mircea, i was interested to see you wrote on the film the family
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 42 @ 0.29799897 = 12.516 BTC [+] {2}
Vexual: did you see something beautiful on the banal underpainting? or are you joking about evryones hardon for deniros?
ozbot: The Family pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 3 @ 0.05916666 = 0.1775 BTC [+] {3}
Vexual: if you have the tools handy, try removing every frame with a face, it's a nice short film
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 150 @ 0.002836 = 0.4254 BTC [+]