log☇︎
88500+ entries in 0.729s
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: just to me, any dreams of "global anarchist revolt" *are* lost on me (i'm terribly naive but not *that* naive). personal responsibility and individualism (vague word, i know) are necessary conditions. and.. yeah, i don't have much hope for humanity, given that... ☟︎
Framedragger: phf: ha, nice. well, fair. (it made me warm inside to recall that i *never* took paul graham for much; anyone who reads only a bit by him on stuff that they know something about will realize this; e.g. http://idlewords.com/2005/04/dabblers_and_blowhards.htm (this is the "website obesity" guy))
mircea_popescu: now, to be perfectly clear, i'm not either accusing or suspecting x guy of this, chiefly because i don't imagine he has the resources. nevertheless, phf's objection is much harder to reject than superficially appears.
phf: Framedragger: i was young and a bum, i recognized all these people because my entertainment machine would reinforce their presence for me. "oh jwz is talking. oh now it's ptacek. oh it's paul graham! squee". but they were always in a different category from say norvig or knuth or naggum. once i started doing and learning (i.e. painfully read knuth, rather than just have him on my shelf) i finally was able to grok the difference. ☟︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: which is all i mean by that.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger yes, it is unknowable. but the naive defense of the person first contemplating this issue is "oh, this is too noise, i'd hear about it"
Framedragger: (ah no i haven't read it before - cool)
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: hm, yeah. it can become more serious, i suppose
Framedragger: phf: i'm curious, what was it that made you to originally regard tptacek highly? was it his words/discussions (and then later you decided that it's the only stuff that the man has actually produced - a fair point i guess, if you dismiss the crypto challenges, for example)?
mircea_popescu: Framedragger im just saying in general, i myself have nfi who he is.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: i mean.. i agree; i just don't agree that tptacek fits the category. sure, there are analogies, but then there exist analogies with mircea_popescu, too.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: (just ftr i don't think too much of bruce, either)
Framedragger: i need a longer conversation-thread-stack in my mind.
mircea_popescu: "i could be mp, i read all he wrote" "and if tomorrow mizdra lands with an alien submarine, what will you say as mp ? this hasn't happened in the past ALREADY, for you to life the quote"
Framedragger: asciilifeform: ... "everyone who disagrees is usg stooge" is the vibe i'm getting; impossible to have an actual conversation then
asciilifeform: found exactly what i expected to find.
asciilifeform: Framedragger: i went to visit the -otc heathen folk specifically to test my working hypothesis, of phuctor as an unfailing political litmus strip.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: look i won't fault you for pre-forming an opinion on tptacek and not spending your valuable time re-evaluating it. but such heuristic lumping of people into two camps is rather crude indeed. i know someone may reply "this serves tmsr's purposes well anyway, so what of it" - well, okay..
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: god damn it, no.. i'm anti-essentialist anyway
asciilifeform: all i solidly know of the tptacek fella is his reaction to phuctor. ☟︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: shall i quote voltaire to you ?
Framedragger: asciilifeform: i claim that one can post actually valuable stuff, seen by other people; and one can post shit, and these categories can be distinguished.
Framedragger: phf: yes, true, i know, but for some mp is "person who wrote lots of important text"
asciilifeform: i would even say that the bulk of the real win from phuctor existing is the exposure of the actual allegiances of the so-called 'security experts'.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: yeah, i mean, the dude thomas p tacek is, at least
Framedragger: phf: matasano crypto challenges and the new crypto ctf thing he and others did (i didn't try it) are a great public service; i mean the challenges start simple in the beginning but if one followed them to the end, actual reading of recent crypto papers would be required etc.; surely that counts as something? he didn't pioneer anything in crypto, sure.
mircea_popescu: i suppose i should say "colorfully squandered", makes it go full circle.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: yeah that is fair, too, though i maintain that anyone using any such implementation is an irrevocable shithead and phuctor won't do them much good anyway - but maybe it will, i don't know; and phuctor is a needed public service anyway (so i'm not arguing against that, ftr)
mircea_popescu: except from my pov i dun actually care to distinguish the cockroaches to the point of naming them
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: okay, fair point, then. i should have checked. (maybe i will, out of curiosity / concern). not that i have *too* much faith in gpg, sure
mircea_popescu: Framedragger suppose i do that, and i get a message from a woman who thinks i'm him, and take her out to coffee and she brings me seven children over thirty years.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: oh i won't argue with that! well, of course. but say i took your pubkey and generated a subkey for it and uploaded that subkey (it wouldn't import into gpg). would you truly care?
asciilifeform: Framedragger: phuctor, today as in 2013, is strictly a 'transform T was applied to input I, which you can get here and here, and produced output O, downloadable here' affair.
Framedragger: import subkeys with no valid self-sig? or am i misreading what is stated in the article? because to me those statements (in the broader context) are rendered into that meaning precisely.
mircea_popescu: who is this ? (excuse me, i'm new!)
phf: Framedragger: i regarded ptacek very highly at some point, but can you point to something that ptacek/matasano did?
Framedragger: (i'm sorry for being slow here, multitasking with too many tabs)
Framedragger: (funnily enough, as regards authority, i regard 'tptacek very highly)
Framedragger: asciilifeform: apologies if i am mistaken here, but iirc phuctor was reported to have cracked some pgp keys when at that point in time none of the keys cracked had valid self-sigs. the presentation from tmsr (trilema/phuctor) to me appeared to have overstated the results, so to speak. (but then later subkeys with valid selfsigs were found, iirc). this isn't a technical point, i suppose.
mircea_popescu: (other than in a discussion with the sort of imbecile typified today by hasimir, i dunno either of us gives half a shit.) ☟︎
mircea_popescu: there's two classes composing the support there. one, the wider, is plain idiots, of the us business major sort. the other, however, hopes to be saved from some darkness within or i dunno wtf.
mircea_popescu: i perceive the following problem : in my (rightful) bashing of idiocies (allinged around "colored coins", "dao" etc, that jazz) i distinctly hear the crushed hopes of people who look at those as a refuge from something else, specifically. i suspect it's hwqat you call "anarchists" ☟︎
mircea_popescu: Framedragger i wouldn't mind discussing this.
Framedragger: there is a danger of one presupposing the veracity of their own's truths, but this isn't exactly an original thought or anything; just, well, i *do* observe yourself and alf defending the power of phuctor's results almost a priori as it were;
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: hm. no. but i'm not mature enough for this discussion (you may say), e.g. i still harbour ideas about anarchism etc.
mircea_popescu: im not entirely persuaded by this. i can't really say i had it all that bad in romania at any point.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform only thing is, back then the us was run by reagan and i more or less liked it.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger i dun care about all that ; i'm more interested about the philosophic angle to it.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: i currently refuse to articulate explicit alignments. but, i contend that i should have interpreted that dood's speech on #bitcoin-otc as political speech
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: yeah there's a slippery slope there, i guess.
Framedragger: nono they do not win; but i don't feel like articulating their shit every time it happens
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-17#1523089 << point of frustration acknowledged; however, ftr it *does* irk me when $empire$ does it; i don't point fingers at *that* here because there's a point of exhaustion and tiredness re. the latter (*not* learned helplessness / acceptance, note), and it appears to be sufficiently covered by others here :) ☝︎
asciilifeform: normally i ignore the peanut gallery. on occasion it leaks in through the keyhole (the inmates take the effort to write to me) and so pig fuck visit.
mircea_popescu: "I doubt this will ever happen. Even he never cracked any PGP keys at all, the FUD he spread around was a nice way to get some free advertising. Look, people saying his name on gnupg and enigmail lists, which are quite popular I believe." ☟︎
asciilifeform: well i dun have a stable of gurlz, and so end up like the folks in the old german '1 man bands', with toe-operated drum, arse-operated trumpet, cock cymbal, etc.
danielpbarron: asciilifeform, thanks but I mean i've had /mode +b set on me in all three channels at some point, not that I can't read the public log, or even re-join today. Although my IP does appear to be banned from accessing b-a public log
a111: Logged on 2016-08-17 13:35 boolcrap1: i really need to find my phone tho, is there a tool that can locate metal on the ground in a wide area?
danielpbarron: not as good a pig wrestler as asciilifeform I guess
mircea_popescu: i dun intend to read all that.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-17#1523032 << there is a major difference between scientific speech and political speech. i don't care about the stupid conclusions random nobody arrives at. the moment however he emits judgements of value that happen to contradict mine, i no longer care HOW he arrived at them, merely that he stated them. ☝︎
asciilifeform: <gribble> Sent 12 minutes ago: <Hasimir> Back it up with verifiable evidence, otherwise there's nothing but FUD. If you're serious about proving it, I'll go find the challenges in the archives; if not I guess I'll only see IRC ranting
boolcrap1: i really need to find my phone tho, is there a tool that can locate metal on the ground in a wide area? ☟︎
boolcrap1: its not lost, i just need to plug in that disk
boolcrap1: i actually finally got a new motherboard
asciilifeform: Framedragger: i'm more interested in the 'fact of' somebody taking advantage of the js idiots, than in the item per se.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-17#1522996 << yeah, i yield the point ; seems alf's theory prevails. at some point the guy was gutted, the skin made hand puppet. ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-16 21:36 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i had two arguments. one is that it dramatically simplifies the design of the cryptotron. (essentially becomes a mildly scriptable bignum calculator.)
mircea_popescu: the more i'm thinking about it, the more it becomes obvious you're trying to split this wood ( http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-16#1522843 ) in the right place alf. ☝︎
trinque: heh, I got that too
shinohai: probably because in rush I forgot proper tags
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: i seem to recall that kako was 'audiophile', which lends some credence to your theory
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: axe, like you know... I axed this dude for some horseradish
pete_dushenski: shinohai: hey cool. i'll look into that.
mircea_popescu: and in other great successes of provisioning, i fucking found horseradish. i rule.
trinque: well mine's easily fixed; however, I'm putting it here show that this is the kind of moron busywork that comes of taking something like RSS as bedrock
pete_dushenski: trinque: what am i looking at there ?
mircea_popescu: i don't get this nonsensical theory. “Electromagnetic interference from appliances being used by neighbors could propagate through a shared transformer and have an audible effect. That’s not an unreasonable thing.”
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-16#1522908 << lel, and to think, i get this fir phreeeee ☝︎
pete_dushenski: http://www.wsj.com/article_email/a-gift-for-music-lovers-who-have-it-all-a-personal-utility-pole-1471189463-lMyQjAxMTE2MzE4NjExMjY1Wj << in other 'that's it i'm making my own' news
trinque: ah I'm just giving shit
pete_dushenski: trinque: ftr, i appreciate your contributions. goodness knows you save me the effort of manually dropping contravex links in here myself. plus authing! and searching! /me would be up shitcreek sans paddle w/o deedbot.
trinque: y'know, I publish to date the simplest ball of code ever to IRC-bot and all you people want me to do is polish some w3c dumbshit's standard
pete_dushenski: i was joking! jeez!!11
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: i dun think you get to shoot deedbot until replacement shows up.
pete_dushenski: i am but a resident as per http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521208 ☝︎
asciilifeform: as mircea_popescu can probably tell, i really loathe publishing half-cooked items.
asciilifeform: i suppose i ought to dust off an' publish the 'p' demo.
mircea_popescu: i'd like to leave this matter open for further thinking.
mircea_popescu: at the cost of what, carrying the implementation i nthe key ?
mircea_popescu: and i fear instead of simplify it'll byzantinize it.
mircea_popescu: now asciilifeform if cs were well specified and well understood from usage ; i wouldn't be against making "key" ambiguous as to which of rsa, cs it is.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i had two arguments. one is that it dramatically simplifies the design of the cryptotron. (essentially becomes a mildly scriptable bignum calculator.) ☟︎
mircea_popescu: yes, but i suspect we solve all that through not including idiocy in the spec.
mircea_popescu: and i would propose this as an example of the pernicious effects of category 3 of bad stuff selfsig did. it made people think "key" is "identity". when in fact it's algo->key.
mircea_popescu: so then. i dunno anything cleanner than this, myself.
asciilifeform: i've favoured a maximally-configurable design for quite some time.
asciilifeform: it is a question i get asked quite often.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i'd rather detach the "waht use is phuctor" from current discussion.
mircea_popescu: this is an argument no different from "oh but mp, why http://trilema.com/2014/spamming-reddit-an-experiment/ it will just increase the "activity levels" on site". i'm sure it will.
mircea_popescu: which is exactly what i specify.