log☇︎
86400+ entries in 0.545s
mircea_popescu: "i want my theory to work therefore network anchors aren't people, evidently"
asciilifeform: the counting, i mean.
mircea_popescu: do you ever count how much of this "i want this not that therefore the facts are so and so" you do in an average day ?
mircea_popescu: anyway, yes asciilifeform has a point in that penis makes for a fine way to make friends. the thing is that as i near 40, i'd dearly love some alternative method. this thing won't last forever.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i don't grasp the need for a global 'humanity filter.' working wotronics implies that folks will assortively peer by degree of muppetry, and this imho suffices.
mircea_popescu: trinque my shit is uniquely confusing. i call them slaves, because it is the proper term. yet they have more personal freedom and general, intellectual and otherwise independence than any "liberated" hear-her-roar-in-english-only.
asciilifeform: i dun see how the go machine relates.
mircea_popescu: fuck that. i been there, done that, it's enough to run a smallish trown and no more.
asciilifeform: incidentally what the hell is wrong with 'i won't answer message from $newkey unless an $oldkey vouched for him' ?
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-06#1534898 << i guess that *would* then be a truly single point of failure, in terms of historical reliability, hm. not an easy problem ☝︎
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2014-10-16#876727 << where i address the point. ☝︎
asciilifeform: i did read.
mircea_popescu: well if you won't read and address the points there we'll have to stop here, i'm not restating it.
asciilifeform: spam raises the bar to 'i want to be a man', yes. but cannot raise it infinitely high.
asciilifeform: i won't. as knuth does not.
asciilifeform: if there were 10,001 covertresses, i would read ~none~ of them
mircea_popescu: your brain will pick patterns, and now i managed to get a few inside through fuzzing.
asciilifeform: (for the most part, i don't. except that one time there was this odd parrot-like... etc)
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-17#1523269 << re-read this, and think about it. if i want to attack you, i make literally a trillion names ; then i sort them in binary tries like that ; then i send them to chatter at you. ☝︎
asciilifeform: same way i distinguish between the birds in my oak tree.
asciilifeform: i get an rsa-signed 'hi, i'ma fella named mircea' etc.
asciilifeform: why would you or i wot to any of him.
mircea_popescu: ie, what makes my knowledge secure and the third party's knowledge dubious is... the people who i know to mine it \for me.
asciilifeform: i am speaking of 'mining' in the bitcoin sense, where a stranger can connect and shoot your difficulty to pluto and leave, etc.
mircea_popescu: that "i heard from X and Y" is exactly mining.
mircea_popescu: it's the feeling of "i've just been indescribably stupid."
asciilifeform: the reason i occasionally return to the idea in my notebook is that it is the only solution i know of thus far to the idiocy of mining.
Framedragger: i recall someone attempting an implementation / spec of this 'everyone has their own currency' thing. just with wot being less central to it, perhaps
asciilifeform: Framedragger: for some reason i cannot turn up the thread. but idea was something like a crackpot generalization of the idea of altcoins, i.e. every node can issue obligatory notes, if you will, in whatever qty, and their worth rests wholly on wot graph relations of that node, and strictly to his peers
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "i want to send penny wtihout bank" "bitcoin" "oh, without blockchaion, maybe little bank" "use little bank" "no, all these things have the disadvantage that they don't include my 3yo self in a central manner sufficiently"
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'i want to send penny without bank' 'use my bank'
PeterL: I was just trying to think of a way to standardize between multiple nodes
PeterL: I was thinking it could be used to facilitate micropayments, things too small to deserve blockchain space
thestringpuller: PeterL: I've already tried in practice. The failpoint is reconciliation.
PeterL: so I was thinking about hawala/wotcoin, would it be reasonable to make some sort of client that eats RSA messages in a sort of [date amount unit RSAkeyIssuer FromRSAkey ToRSAKey] set protocol? each Issuer would have a DB with balances they see, and using WoT could connect multiple issuers?
mircea_popescu: PeterL sure ; though i think the bureaucrats are flattering themselves. let them try to "eliminate cash" i say.
Framedragger: (i meant, one shared factor between three places)
shinohai: oh hai jurov, thx for your help I thought I borked something up again xD
thestringpuller: diana_coman: welcome shinohai to the mess of planeshift legacy code << I thought Chetty had gutted 90% of it.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-30 11:25 Framedragger: mircea_popescu: and i'll implement these things even if phf's bot becomes more reliable or w/e, because, decentralization!1
Framedragger: fwiw i stand by http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-30#1531731 - just have multiple things - and maybe in the future some system for autosyncing logs between places?.. ☝︎
Framedragger: i'm sure you're right, no bot would have survived. wonder if you could use sth like fastnetmon (if it can eat your logs or if you can format them accordingly?) to analyse the DoS / sql attack further..
mircea_popescu: oh wait, wait, because if they say there's no social hierarchy there... won't be any. right, i forgot.
mircea_popescu: heh. i have nfi how they imagined "decolonialism" will work out as anything other than "bitch, you're the african now".
danielpbarron: http://i.imgur.com/X9EIOqQ.jpg << in adding more news
mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160906/from:62/to:62#62 << the same thing is in principle true of cryptography generally (funny how it just keeps coming back to this again and again) : "no matter how long you make your key, it can be factored by adding more computers". this is true ; but it's up to you to make it irrelevant. the reason whenever someone does manage to ddos trilema / qntra / etc i tend to just wait is because time
hanbot: yeah. i cooked by candlelight.
pete_dushenski: that being said, a clearer explanation (if there is one) would make a solid trilema piece. there might not be a formula for this process in these early days of the republic, but i'm not one to underestimate mp's fertile mind.
pete_dushenski: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160906/from:45/to:45#45 << why wouldn't you still be welcome ? i dunno if i've been skimming the logs too lightly but i don't recall a part where mp said that having bots/services go down/be replaced meant out-and-out excommunication. afaik mike_c, for example, is still welcome.
BingoBoingo: <Framedragger> it cites log lines. needs to be polished. that's all i wanted to test for now. << Excellent line to test. Many people got the order of the spraying and the cutting wrong to their loss.
shinohai: I still need to do that special help message
BingoBoingo: <shinohai> lol, I thought danielpbarron would be offended when it first appeared. << BingoBoingo is offended the Good Book is in, but the Big book is out... Perhaps add !~step and !~tradition
shinohai: I won't lie, it has made me reach for the excederin already.
deedbot: shinohai rated diana_coman 1 << Eulora sorcery, I bow to your greatness.
shinohai: !!rate diana_coman 1 Eulora sorcery, I bow to your greatness.
phf: that is fair, but i'm not yet sure if it was cmucl networking stack not keeping up, or digitalocean being saturated. in either case it could've been brought down by increasing the number of attacking bots.
phf: ha, well, so far i've ensured that http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-30#1531824 ☝︎
phf: right, second one, don't know what first one is. maybe it's metasploit doing fuzzing? i took two representative examples though
phf: trinque: i think that the timing is just overlapping, i'll have to grep for you wget's specifically, but the day is basically an endless stream of /log/2016-05-22&docid=nDn56WVkvV-86M&tbnid=wQqrCY5i08s2qM:&w=245&h=244&hl=en-US&source=sh/x/im and /log/?date=01-05-2014%27%20or%20(1,2)=(select*from(select%20name_const(CHAR(111,108,111,108,111,115,104,101,114),1),name_const(CHAR(111,108,111,108,111,115,104,101,114),1))a)%20--%20%27x%27=%27x
trinque: that actually ended up bringing the bot back, then was bouncing on/off, so I slowed the crawl
trinque: after it went away for a while I did a wget -R on the www as a backup, hoping the www wouldn't also disappear.
phf: i'm sorry for failing, whoever put this nailgun in my bed, congratulations. there were no similar spikes in the past, and the attack happened precisely on the day i left for vacation, which was publicly known. given the swift and strong reaction i'm not quiet sure i'm even welcome on the channel anymore, which sucks.
phf: attempted to connect for the duration of attack, which in turn timed out for the rest of the day. i'm not sure how i could've mitigated this attack, short of running bot and web on separate machines, with bot's ip hidden.
phf: hmm, just returned into civilization. so before leaving for my vacation i replaced the bot with trinque's reconnecting version, i haven't touched the server since, so obviously reconnecting worked. for 29th specifically i see a flooding spike of bogus http request, which presumably saturated the digitalocean connection, because ping/pongs were still going through, until only pings were being sent, until bot would timed out. then it
mircea_popescu: i nearly fell down
mircea_popescu: i fucking kid you not.
asciilifeform: i have nfi, trinque , but 'read and understood the complete c stack' is a proposition on the scale of 'built undersea cities and no one noticed.'
trinque: I am not easily moved by feelings.
asciilifeform: at any rate i have entire www devoted to subj.
mircea_popescu: i can't think of one historical example where they did.
trinque: asciilifeform: I do not claim to know, but hesitate to say the major industrial powerhouse of earth lacks understanding of what it does.
mod6: ah, mircea_popescu, maybe i'm wrong then; in that sense of "models"
mircea_popescu: trinque i discussed all sorts of things ; including "buy a boat" about a month before the world was "shocked" by a certain bankruptcy. not that anyone notices, to my eternal amusement.
asciilifeform: i will point out that if their solution involves c machine, that's five wasted trillion.
mod6: i very much doubt this is their long term strategy.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i see 0 signs of demicroshitification in china.
asciilifeform: i came to this conclusion years ago. the hard way.
mircea_popescu: even if i could spend a million engineer hours a second, brought from another galaxy, i would not commit them to making me a sane compiler+kernel by friday.
mod6: i agree mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: but the worst part about all this, and the true reason i'm inert on the topic, is this : the situation is evidently unhinged, and changing much faster than the sort of process which is involved in making a software stack, compiler kernel et all.
asciilifeform: but i am speaking of fundamental problem with the language.
mircea_popescu: which is how i interpreted your "freeze it ? pshaw!"
a111: Logged on 2016-09-05 20:28 mod6: not that I'm saying "i'm going to write a tmsr compiler this year."; however, seeing the need for this years ago, having one written by us that we can trust, is a worthwhile project. i've taken steps in this direction by doing some very much required reading on the subject.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-05#1534602 << i am not convinced that this is possible. ☝︎
trinque: asciilifeform: I could as easily say this whole "free software" thing ruined the industry and start from *there*
trinque: mircea_popescu: "drugs are bad mkay" form of argument I mean.
asciilifeform: i have 0 interest in using or improving facebook, either.
trinque: I would go to church if I wanted to make decisions based on that kind of argument.
trinque: asciilifeform: also not a damned argument! obviously I cannot reason about "work of evil"!
asciilifeform: llvm is a work of evil and i will actively avoid any project that rests on it.
trinque: I would not be surprised if they forked llvm if they ever needed.
mod6: not that I'm saying "i'm going to write a tmsr compiler this year."; however, seeing the need for this years ago, having one written by us that we can trust, is a worthwhile project. i've taken steps in this direction by doing some very much required reading on the subject. ☟︎
mod6: fact remains, i couldn't trust it, any farther than I could throw it.
mircea_popescu: i think the whole discussion there was moreover political, in the sense of ecosystem struggles.
mircea_popescu: trinque i never used it.
mod6: maybe i should have said "technical critque". anyway, he probably doesn't have the time. i'd hate to distract him from the one big project he's working.
trinque: I've seen all the threads.
mod6: i think alf has said a number of things about it in the logs.
mod6: one thing that's pretty nice, is that he seems to be readily available when I've got something to test
GoldBoriska: i have any pennis lol