log☇︎
68900+ entries in 0.558s
asciilifeform: there was nothing inherently graphical about erlang (it did not come with a bolix-style editor, or any similar exotica)
asciilifeform: Framedragger: imho it is a mistake to make such a piece. folx who did not appreciate it from the b00k, had no business touching it.
mircea_popescu: kindergarten had a power outage one day.
trinque: mircea_popescu: I am, but from a particular perspective, I'm sure
mircea_popescu: misconstrued circumstantial constraints, "we're a business, we don't have the time to fix the world" "oh, those guys failed, we gotta '''learn''' from their experience" etc
trinque: hell, ~america~ is this. "we had a shitty king so ~no matter what burns~ no 'king'"
asciilifeform: this was idiocy, of a slowly lethal sort that makes radium toothpaste look quite harmless, and we are still paying for it
asciilifeform: it was a time of 'commodification' and 'deskilling'
asciilifeform: as in, you could shuffle a ~task~ (not even entire proggy) between machines, cleanly.
asciilifeform: well they ~were~ 'best days', it was a thing that they could not, in thousand years, produce
mircea_popescu: idiots without a culture and without a history. "we found that lantern in the woods, and boy, those were the best days of chuka life!!1"
mircea_popescu: "Me and some guys from school had a band and we tried real hard. Jimmy quit, Jody got married, shoulda known, we'd never get far."
trinque: rust was written by a mozilla guy after long radiation damage working on a browser
asciilifeform: it's a thing.
mircea_popescu: ^ that's a decent doctoral thesis you just titled.
asciilifeform: anyway erlang is imho only worth discussing as part of a larger pattern -- industry after industry independently discovered that c -- and its entire approach to logic -- is poison ☟︎☟︎
mircea_popescu: in principle anything that can be run can be compiled, this isn't a matter. the question to you alf is, that "actual optimizing compiler, like gcc", is it WRITTEN IN ERLANG ?
asciilifeform: trinque: if you weld wings to a trabant, it could, theoretically, take off. does not make 'airplane'.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'scripting language' has a meaning.
trinque: queues and workers and restart upon failure didn't need a syntax
asciilifeform: it was a general-purpose thing that compiled down to x86.
mircea_popescu: lua also worked well in its industrial niche ; dob isn't that much of a consideration imo
asciilifeform: but it wasn't a scripting language.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i will also nitpick : 'erlang' does not belong in the list, it was a 1980s product that worked quite well in its industrial niche (large telco switches) but was later stolen and used as a totem by the folx from yesterday's thread ( http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-29#1633873 ) ☝︎☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: trinque: my current understanding is that derps say 'system language' when what is meant is 'has something that passes for a x86 compiler, and a c ffi'
trinque: no such thing as a "rust machine" or "golang machine" but lets not dwell on the fact that there's a machine down there too long.
trinque: in re: "systems programming language" it's a way of retconning C into a category with many possible members defined by "I am very smart, and could, you know, build an operating system in this"
trinque: asciilifeform: as I understand it, which is at a distance, they added an extra type system, concurrency tools, and memory management for phree, and decided this needed its own syntax
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-30#1634673 << this is a terrible libel to custom pliers -- who do not randomly morph into liquishit in your hands, no ☝︎
asciilifeform: is it a sort of prbization of ye olde 'cyclone' ? 'let's put bounds checks in c'
asciilifeform: trinque: what means 'compile and you're a good boy' ..?
trinque: you just compile and you're a good boy
asciilifeform: why would anybody even name a comp lang 'rust' ? how about a surgical antiseptic named 'putrescence' ? ☟︎
a111: Logged on 2017-03-29 19:28 ben_vulpes: funny how all manifestations of modernity look alike. entertain even a smidge of wokeness and you'll wake up in trans camp.
asciilifeform: trinque: that looks hilarious. do you have a copy running? try putting, say, duff's device, through it...
mircea_popescu: i have nfi why they imagine this. in point of fact the system that delivers milk in a bottle so they don't have to milk their own cow is MORE complex, not less.
mircea_popescu: "automated" is a byword for "i don't have to do any work".
trinque: just some guy who read a bunch of hackernews and thinks he has opinions
asciilifeform: read like a trololol, is all.
asciilifeform: also mircea_popescu the 'rust' link simply gotta be a parody
Framedragger: for posterity, rust does have things like raw pointers (and no gc), etc.; but the kommunity around it is at this point perhaps ~insufferable, much like the javascript hipster legions. which is not a point to be ignored
mircea_popescu: fucking decay of idiocy, they want to turn the nodes-notnodes binome into fullnodes-nodes ? if you don't verify blocks you're not a node, if you can't program the machine it's not a language etc. holy shit.
mircea_popescu: for that matter, when the fuck did a COMPUTER LANGUAGE, ie, a language you can program the machine in, become a "systems language" ? why, to make room for javascript being a language ? it ain't a fucking language, it's a scripting language which means jack-all.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-30#1634660 << "My motivation is primarily I don't want to learn all the over-complicated details of C, but at the same time I would like to be productive in a safe system language, a category in which Rust seems to be alone." ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-03-30 03:54 asciilifeform: the hypothetical subj would look something like a t34
asciilifeform: not a chore because plastic panels, no. but -- chore. ☟︎
asciilifeform: it is a chore.
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: whole point would be to piss on the fashionista faggotry and get a cheap, practical, repairable (yes, they lied to you, CAN have all 3) machine.
asciilifeform: not a frufru shitmobile.
asciilifeform: the hypothetical subj would look something like a t34 ☟︎
a111: Logged on 2017-03-30 03:34 pete_dushenski: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-29#1634474 << what you really want is http://cdn2.autoexpress.co.uk/sites/autoexpressuk/files/styles/gallery_adv/public/0/63/4_8_0_0_0.jpg?itok=9Yt1kgFK http://goautomedia.cdn.on.net/gallery/citroen/c4%20cactus/HIRES-Citroen%20Cactus%20003.jpg a citroen!
pete_dushenski: in other sanities, having a business dispute ? don't look to the fiat bureacracy for help http://archive.is/AHtKB ("In Brooklyn’s Kosher Pizza War, Modern Tastes Battle Ancient Law")
a111: Logged on 2017-03-29 23:08 ben_vulpes: modern car loses 90% of value after 5 years and 100kmi, an industrial piece like a freightliner loses at most 70% after a decade and A MILLION MILES
pete_dushenski: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-29#1634483 << ubercheap lease rates are actually predicated on absurdly high residuals and so are resulting in cars that are losing only 40% after 3 years. this is a bigger problem in the states than, say, uk. but still an increasingly noticeable phenomenon for manufacturers and dealers to prop up new sales figures in the face of a secular decline in interest. ☝︎
pete_dushenski: not for sale in north america but you probably already guessed that it's a shithole anyways
a111: Logged on 2017-03-29 23:05 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: speaking of which, tell me, how come i can't buy a car where if it dents, i can just take off a panel and put in new one ?
pete_dushenski: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-29#1634474 << what you really want is http://cdn2.autoexpress.co.uk/sites/autoexpressuk/files/styles/gallery_adv/public/0/63/4_8_0_0_0.jpg?itok=9Yt1kgFK http://goautomedia.cdn.on.net/gallery/citroen/c4%20cactus/HIRES-Citroen%20Cactus%20003.jpg a citroen! ☝︎☟︎☟︎
mod6: ima have to dig in a bit tomorrow.
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> ben_vulpes: speaking of which, tell me, how come i can't buy a car where if it dents, i can just take off a panel and put in new one ? << I have exactly this fucking thing. Also most incidents that would dent metal don't dent.
a111: Logged on 2016-01-12 19:24 mircea_popescu: as someone once said, "their tricks work for them only a short distance of their run, and for us the whole run."
a111: Logged on 2017-03-29 23:32 ben_vulpes: and in other wonders of "ai": http://boingboing.net/2017/03/29/countermeasures-are-a-thing.html
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-29#1634515 << well this is certainly a damn sight better than "coding" ☝︎
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-29#1634495 << to be beaten into a pulp for being the obnoxious sort of fag who'd bitch at djb about someone touching him / listen to depeche mode / etcetera... ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-03-29 23:08 ben_vulpes: modern car loses 90% of value after 5 years and 100kmi, an industrial piece like a freightliner loses at most 70% after a decade and A MILLION MILES
a111: Logged on 2017-03-29 22:15 asciilifeform: but there was that old mircea_popescu thread. where, approx, 'a dollar usg collects from mr.pleb in tax isn't so that usg can spend a dollar, it can spend $trillion, or ten, without collecting anything; it collects the dollar because otherwise mr.pleb will use it to bid up turkeys'
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-03-29#1634411 << this is a lulzy notion. if you could hedge against such a wonder, the lido'd still be a thing. ☝︎
asciilifeform: 'Italy could soon offer menstrual leave Parliament is considering a bill that, if approved, would require employers to grant women three days of paid leave every month.' << from same rag
a111: Logged on 2015-06-24 17:28 ascii_field: it will be replaced - question of ~when~, not ~if~ - by something like an oubliette with a vending machine
CompanionCube: fuck, even the US'd be a better place. There there isn't a law that literally states you must disclose encryption keys on-demand.
asciilifeform: 'And Taaki began to believe that returning to the UK and completing Dark Wallet’s development would allow him to help Rojava better use bitcoin as a fundraising tool, one that would circumvent the US and EU sanctions that prevent any funds from being transferred into Syria.' << wat.
a111: Logged on 2016-01-26 17:20 ascii_butugychag: (there was a spiffy talk at shmoo, which mentioned how nn used in image recognition usually imprints on what - to a human - would be an entirely accidental cluster of pixels, and if you flip'em, it will recognize an obvious, e.g,. cat, as a refrigerator, etc)
ben_vulpes: and in other wonders of "ai": http://boingboing.net/2017/03/29/countermeasures-are-a-thing.html ☟︎
ben_vulpes: did he always have a paunch?
ben_vulpes: "When Taaki reached the camp on the Syrian side of the border, he says, he tried to explain to the elderly officer in charge that he’d come to Rojava to offer his tech skills in one of Rojava’s cities, not to fight. But as Taaki tells it, the man waved away his protests and conscripted him into a unit with the other foreigners."
asciilifeform: http://lyricstranslate.com/en/prekrasnoe-dalyoko-prekrasnoe-daleko-glorious-future.html << a not wholly barfalicious transl.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: do you remember mircea_popescu's article about his friend who went to usa and tried to build a house of stone ?
ben_vulpes has a shirt awaiting deconstruction into patterns sitting at home
ben_vulpes: modern car loses 90% of value after 5 years and 100kmi, an industrial piece like a freightliner loses at most 70% after a decade and A MILLION MILES ☟︎☟︎
phf: ben_vulpes: that was my zaporozhets comment. ultimate piece of shit car, with the main perk: can be repaired in a shortages economy
asciilifeform: like a motherfucking bumper ought to be.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: speaking of which, tell me, how come i can't buy a car where if it dents, i can just take off a panel and put in new one ? ☟︎
asciilifeform: and yeah if you have a hammer -- repairs
ben_vulpes: phf: some days i dream of making a car like that
phf: ben_vulpes: nah it was a piece of shit. i got one from walmart and it's pretty good. advantage though was that you could repair it for years, and since there was only ~one~ type, you could also replace parts for years, etc.
asciilifeform: for some reason parents called it a 'chopper'
ben_vulpes: army surplus thing, was amazing until i handled it roughly packing up from a burn and bent one of the struts.
a111: Logged on 2013-12-22 16:56 asciilifeform: 'what people “want” is a function of what they learn is available. e.g., do Americans want three-ring binders, and Europeans four-ring binders? or do they want binders and take whatever number of holes they come with? or do they want something that can help them organize their papers and take whatever is available? or do they really want a less cluttered office and ease of storage and retrieval of the infor
ben_vulpes: aaah i had a cot for many years!
asciilifeform: right now we have, de facto, opposite, 'man's coat is made from same faux silk gurl's panties are made from', 'so what if it melts into your skin in a fire', 'so what if sunlight dissolves it, so much the better for AmerikaGreatAgain'
phf: it's same reason why every american has an inflatable plastic mattress for guests, but not a raskladushka
phf: well, "a man might give half a shit about". you're talking about GOST style global optimization "plant makes same material for parachutes and fasihonable summer dresses"
asciilifeform: superior in every respect a man might give half a shit about, to what's available in 'civilized' world.
asciilifeform: ( incidentally, gotta wonder, why can't asciilifeform buy a vinylon suit ? )
phf: i still think that the reason is that there are no lizards in a recognizable form (i.e. the 1984, hugo boss clad), it's all a chomsky style dependency graph, and the complexity so high, micro level so varied, that nobody can make sense of it
asciilifeform: point being, a mighty fine and historically effective way to relieve plebs of excess dough is -- artificial shortages
phf: i don't think aspirin though is a good example, because "obviously" there aren't any aspirin shortages. likewise there are obviously no housing shortages, doctor shortages, etc. etc.
asciilifeform: bidding up, e.g., cardboard houses, or better still, ornate paper -- things of which no conceivable shortage exists, or could ever begin to exist -- is , notice, a-ok by lizard lights.
asciilifeform: but there was that old mircea_popescu thread. where, approx, 'a dollar usg collects from mr.pleb in tax isn't so that usg can spend a dollar, it can spend $trillion, or ten, without collecting anything; it collects the dollar because otherwise mr.pleb will use it to bid up turkeys' ☟︎
phf: ben_vulpes: if your hendging against devaluation happens in bezzle terms, but your more tax is the "guberment done it", than this distinction makes sense. i don't think that in reality more tax just happens, it's a process by which devaluation graph gets readjusted
asciilifeform: the 'let's give EVERYBODY $income' thing goes beyond mere retardation; make the folx who play lotteries, and even pyramids, look brilliant. at least ~somebody~ wins, in a pyramid