asciilifeform: asciilifeform's 1st step in writing ffa, recall, was to conceive of (and prove) an arithmetic workaround for above. that, right off the bat, cost ~10fold cpu.
asciilifeform: was found that glibc actually prohibits static linkage.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: we did. recall the 'nss' incident.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: imho the near-term thing to do is for bvt to get the gcc5sim, glibcism, out of his test setup. then can proceed to fix bugs that we actually have in the house, rather than liquishit that only afflicts glibctards.
asciilifeform: as is all current test build of ffa, etc
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the diana_coman-bin we disasmed yesterday , is musltronic.
asciilifeform: but remains to be established if bvt's bug afflicts it.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it already worx , afaik, on musl, ave1's gnat shits out strictly musl-static linkage.☟︎
asciilifeform: ( half the reason why asciilifeform dug out musl, is that it's compact enuff to be fixable, at least in principle )
asciilifeform: quite obv, any fix will have to fix musl.
asciilifeform: this is theoretically fixable. the sad part tho is that gcc is a potentially ~bottomless well of these.
asciilifeform: to revisit orig upstack thrd : pc dun offer iron locks. so threading relies on software locks, that 'work' in the sense where gcc is relied on to shit'em out correctly. what bvt appears to have found , is that (under particular inputs) it doesn't.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i'm sitting in something quite resembling such chamber as we speak.
asciilifeform: this is how the 'cloud' people ended up with their circus. 'pc is broken' 'what if you connect 9000 pc'
asciilifeform: it worx great with hardware. except when it's connected like on pc, where 1 hosed device can fandango over entire ram. or handled as on unix, where i/o will happily zombie out on unplugged $gadget etc
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the real q is , what subset of the claimed extant functionality adds up to a programming environment.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'house explodes when i turn on the hydrogen faucet' 'why do you have a hydrogen faucet ?'
asciilifeform: this btw is how asciilifeform implemented phuctor backend.
asciilifeform: so consider what the airplane people do. they dun terminate. instead populate with N threads, where N is the # of physical cpu, and they can idle or work as demanded.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: unless i misread bvt's piece, the bugola is only triggered when tasks are permitted to terminate.
asciilifeform: ( asciilifeform's unifying theory, is that living in c ecosystem turns ~all~ inhabitants, after enuff yrs, into a kind of rms; sorta like black lung of coal miner )
asciilifeform: ( could go on, but i sorta have an entire www re subj... )
asciilifeform: and in turn heapism hacks , from machine that has nfi how to partition memory meaningfully, etc.
asciilifeform: and all of this sepsis, comes from machine where there aint (and cannot be) any such thing as global symbol space, where pointer does not store any info re wtf it points to, nor does a block of code know that it is a block of code , nor lolcat gif knows that it is an array, etc
asciilifeform: ( naturally if you aint one of'em, can ask until the cows come home. recall mircea_popescu's letter to rms ? )
asciilifeform: y'know , all those listservs where the muppets shit out multiple MB erry day , that's where they 'ask' one another
asciilifeform: cuz, see, he feels free to 'assume', because anyone who doesn't, who demands to ~know~ before shooting, will have dropped out of school when faced with unixtardation
asciilifeform: antediluvian os (e.g. tops-10 et al) at least had hard limits printed in manual
asciilifeform: unix tries to 'be all possible kitchen' and appears to 'succeed', via fraudulently slipping in 9000 unprincipled-exceptions (hardcoded limits, not only in gcc, but even 'ls' , see old thrd, and moar or less errywhere ) , and 'optimizations'☟︎
asciilifeform: ( 'but asciilifeform ! grep aint meant to run on hostile inputs !' 'guess wat, unix aint meant to run outside of locked mit hall with 4 pdp-8 in it either' )
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: applicable to all cases where gnarly 'optimized for typical, and we think we know what is typical'
asciilifeform: it's 'sound tradeoff' until it aint (e.g. you have system where 'allcomers' can trigger a grep on a data set they crafted, and yer box grinds to a halt )
asciilifeform: ( cuz, spoiler, 'worse' aint ~factually~ 'better' , aside from 'stupidity has infinite hit points' )
asciilifeform: the type of people who cannot stomach this type of 'thinking', 'engineering', end up self-retiring from unixism entirely, they eat pistol, or learn to run a crane, etc
asciilifeform suspects that the '2mil' figure they got from 'how many in kernel 2.6 and let's times three' or similar
asciilifeform: i thought mircea_popescu posed q of 'how many symbols on machine'.
asciilifeform: so anyffin linking ~that~ will eat 7 + its own.
asciilifeform: rright, and this process eats a buncha libs, with n1, n2, ... nN syms in ea., and shits out e.g. another lib, that exports only 7.
asciilifeform: so it tells you 0 about the total # of syms on the machine
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: rright, but that's ~per build~, and ea. build destroys symbols ( in the sense that they got statically pumped into the bin, and no longer 'exported' )
asciilifeform: ( this is where asciilifeform cannot resist to 'on bolix, you simply ask the box what all symbols are, and can get source for whichever you point at' etc )
asciilifeform: if you walk ~entire box~ and count symbols, you can get an approximation of the 'universe' count
asciilifeform: ( that part will no longer appear as exported symbols, obv )
asciilifeform: you dun see what the called routines 'externed', cuz you had built the libs statically, they pulled in what they pulled in
asciilifeform: in particular elf you only see what it 'externs'
asciilifeform: ( i.e. satan himself only knows what syms ~each sym~ drags in ~internally~ )
