11700+ entries in 0.111s
diana_coman: the "had what to point to and knew what to ask for" sounds superficially
a "point and babble" sort of thing; doesn't work quite that well if that's ALL there is to it
mp_en_viaje: honestly, i'd propose it's about 0% different from how things work here. have the creds and speak the words, you're in, takes all of three and
a half minutes.
mp_en_viaje: anyways, even with civillians... me spent
a few hours in the tiniest spa known to mankind. rando couple, "soo.. .are you
a triplet ?" "actually, they're my slaves" "wut?!?!?" "do you know what bdsm is ?" dude : nope ; chick yup.
☟︎ mp_en_viaje: back in the old days they had
a male/gay/leather thing and
a lesbo/uni/femintard thing.
a111: Logged on 2019-05-04 17:54 mp_en_viaje: Mocky, moreover, there's no "one true internet" understood as
a collection of equal and idempotent sites. maybe a1 no longer resolving is
a feature not
a bug for
a subset of pressers.
mp_en_viaje: (gns is gns,
a's can be domain names as they can be dictionary words. i can see the argument for "global warming" or w/e tv "celebrity" not resolving to anything.)
mp_en_viaje: Mocky, moreover, there's no "one true internet" understood as
a collection of equal and idempotent sites. maybe a1 no longer resolving is
a feature not
a bug for
a subset of pressers.
☟︎ a111: Logged on 2019-05-04 05:31 mp_en_viaje: (in particular
http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-03#1911102 is at best naive : if you insist that my key does not sign competing chains [which is not even necessarily
a bad idea] i will simply make ~multiple keys~, which will each sign whichver chain i wish to sign for whatever reason, and which will pass the "omg civil war" safeguard while achieving exactly no satisfaction of the bijection contemplated -- they'll still be my keys, one and all.)
Mocky: my point is not that this is likely to happen, but that it would defeat the purpose of host name resolution to release patches in this way and so it would end up being
a linear chain among cooperating folks. But on further consideration I see that this is only true when patches contain more than mapping change
Mocky: supposing that a0, a1 etc. are host names and b0 etc are ip addresses, and further suppose that at time t2 a1 becomes unreachable at b2 and reachable at b1 (precipitating the patch
a t2) then there are now no nodes in the flow going all the way out to t5 and beyond where both a0 and a1 would be reachable if pressed
Mocky: mp, I can make my point using your flow if you allow
a slight change to the patch at t1, such that instead of 'a0 -> b0, a1 -> b2' it does 'a0 -> b9, a1 -> b2'.
a111: Logged on 2019-05-04 05:44 mp_en_viaje: where's the civil war ? obviously if
A wants to be upsed at F, or R, or for that matter Q or U it's entirely his right and priviledge to proceed ; but what ~systematic~ rule for warmaking can you propose on the basis of this flow of history ?
Mocky:
http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-04#1911138 << I did not construe asciilifeform's language of civil war/schism to suggest that the proposal is weak to systematic attack, merely that
a schism between people could be reflected in the graph
☝︎ mp_en_viaje: this is
a horrible loss to human culture i guess few are apt to appreciate. but horrible nevertheless.
mp_en_viaje: speaking of which, at some point
a while ago hannah wakes up in
a panic -- she had
a nightmare.
mp_en_viaje: where's the civil war ? obviously if
A wants to be upsed at F, or R, or for that matter Q or U it's entirely his right and priviledge to proceed ; but what ~systematic~ rule for warmaking can you propose on the basis of this flow of history ?
☟︎ mp_en_viaje: at t5, yet another fellow has the choice of whether to follow F's chain, or R's chain, or the
A-Q-G-B-N-I chain or so following.
mp_en_viaje: at t4, another fellow named F looks to change gns so that a0 -> b8. this fellow goes through all the keys, loads up all possible tips (which are t1#t1, t2#t1, t3#t3, the last one ~in itself ambiguous at this point in our tale) and produces : on the first chain
a t4#t2 ; on the 2nd chain
a t4#t2 ; on the third chain
a t4#t4, and signs all of these.
mp_en_viaje: suppose yet again the fellow knows
A. in this case, he has
a choice : either he does the first suppose above, or the second. this choice is ~his~.
mp_en_viaje: suppose instead the fellow only knew K. he'd have pressed t1#t1, resulting in
a gns a0->b0 ; a1 -> b2 ; a2 -> b5 and
a manifest #t3.
mp_en_viaje: At t3,
a fellow looks to add a2 -> b5 to the gns. suppose this fellow whose name is R knows only Q. Thus therefore he presses t2#t1, and so gns becomes a1->b1, a2->b5 while manifest becomes #t3.
mp_en_viaje: At t2, there is
a patch upon t0#t0, transforming gns to a1->b1 ; manifest becomes #t1. this is signed by
A, Q, G, B, N, I.
mp_en_viaje: At t1, there is
a patch upon t0#t0, transforming gns to a0 -> b0 ; a1 -> b2 ; manifest becomes #t1. this is signed by
A, W, F, G, U, K.
mp_en_viaje: At t0, there is
a genesis, consisting of
a gns file, containing a0 -> b0 ; and
a manifest file, containing #t0.
mp_en_viaje: as it stands, i also do not see
a problem with the same one key signing whatever count of ~compatible~ versions of the universe, where the key's to define what compatible actually means, following therefrom that there's exactly jack shit one can systematically do by looking at the totalized pile of keys signatures and possibilities. (the familiar will readily recognize
a pattern here).
a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 22:21 asciilifeform: Mocky: re vpatches -- as i understand, the contemplated structure is
a linear chain, and 'siblings' could only occur in event of schisms/civil war , rather than as
a regular thing
mp_en_viaje: (in particular
http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-03#1911102 is at best naive : if you insist that my key does not sign competing chains [which is not even necessarily
a bad idea] i will simply make ~multiple keys~, which will each sign whichver chain i wish to sign for whatever reason, and which will pass the "omg civil war" safeguard while achieving exactly no satisfaction of the bijection contemplated -- they'll still be my keys, one and all.)
☝︎☟︎ mp_en_viaje: for which reason : yes there is going to be
a press for anyone pressing. how exactly this press is constructed out of the universe of possible pressings, that's
a matter established through the interplay of domains, as defined by the keys belonging to them.
mp_en_viaje: there's such
a thing as the private1 of mp alone, and the private #2 of mp and slut x, and private #3 of mp and slut y, and private #4 of mp and slut x and slut y, and so following.
mp_en_viaje: the first is that there does not exist
a "public" or
a "private" as such, in the manner there exists "good guys" or "the rootless cosmopolitans" as found in novels
badly written by tendentious authors.
Mocky:
http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-03#1910995 << no. The proposed spec results in
a linear chain, the tip of which is the only place where the next vpatch could go without
a schism/civil war. On your own computer you can press wherever you want in the chain (or have private branches w/e), but in public you can only release further vpaches based on the same tip of the chain that everyone has. this is defacto consensus.
☝︎ a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 12:19 mp_en_viaje: moreover, the selection of seals you put in your seals dir permits you to choose from
a multitude of different trees.
a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 22:21 asciilifeform: Mocky: re vpatches -- as i understand, the contemplated structure is
a linear chain, and 'siblings' could only occur in event of schisms/civil war , rather than as
a regular thing
a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 22:19 asciilifeform: Mocky: iirc mircea_popescu's scheme centers around
a return to the good ol' days when ~all~ names could be found on
a given machine's /etc/hosts (or equiv.) -- so one ~could~ in principle use
a very slow mechanism to sync'em, and it'll still work in practice. ( tho i also would rather avoid cementing tcpisms into future design of whatever type )
mp_en_viaje: in any case i'd say just about any single implication you propose doesn't follow. elementarily different people having differing views of
a patchset on the basis of their seals works just fine with manifest files as without. and so on.
a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 12:18 mp_en_viaje: Mocky, i dunno what you mean. it almost reads like you're talking from
a complete unfamiliarity with V altogether. what do you mean even, "press multiple heads AT THE SAME TIME". any v tree permits any v operator the choice of where the fuck to press to. if the tree is 1->2->3 you can choose to press to 1, 2 or 3. this is not "at the same time".
lobbesbot: phf: Sent 5 hours and 9 minutes ago: <asciilifeform> canhaz #p logger ? ( or
a 'when' at least ) ? ty
mp_en_viaje: maybe it really is
a brothel ; i doubt it tho, looked like slightly ditzy run of the mill.
a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 04:38 Mocky: 'this tall' to have your own actual domain: yes. 'this tall' to follow
a link: no.
diana_coman: and the contents of the manifest file itself are obtained from pressing
a tree so it's not like you get mismatch tree <-> manifest and
a tangle or I don't see it
diana_coman: and
a sig on
a patch to my mind can't anyway be in isolation like that, "just this patch here is fine but I have no idea of what is being patched"
diana_coman: i.e. manifest is
a history with dates but not some prescription re patching
mp_en_viaje: indeed, if the set of signatures in your seals dir signs
a bunch of different possible trees, the situation becomes ambiguous. i was saying, i don't think this is
a problem at all (if for no other reason, then because either the user cares or doesn't care. if he does care he can just sign whichever he prefers, then put his own signature in the seals and presto. if he does not care then he doesn't care.)
mp_en_viaje: moreover, the selection of seals you put in your seals dir permits you to choose from
a multitude of different trees.
☟︎ mp_en_viaje: Mocky, i dunno what you mean. it almost reads like you're talking from
a complete unfamiliarity with V altogether. what do you mean even, "press multiple heads AT THE SAME TIME". any v tree permits any v operator the choice of where the fuck to press to. if the tree is 1->2->3 you can choose to press to 1, 2 or 3. this is not "at the same time".
☟︎ Mocky: the idea seems go be that different people have their own view of hosts file updates based on own view of wot, however, it only works
a) without the manifest file and b) pressing to all heads, not just one
Mocky: so re your patches example, if patch 2 & 3 both declare patch 1 as parent, and I have wot keys for all
a - f, I can't press to both heads correct?
a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 04:38 Mocky: 'this tall' to have your own actual domain: yes. 'this tall' to follow
a link: no.
a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 04:27 Mocky: I see embrace and extinguish as more appropriate for dns destruction (ala
a dnsmasq-esque approach) than isolated bunkers. I mean, i could have joined up with republic prime instead, but they already completed work on gns prime, and maybe they passed out ip based links for
a while, but eventually pulled up the ladders to their tree forts and now they can't even be found. So who knows if republic prime or double prime even exists.
mp_en_viaje: this produces what looks like
a potential problem, in that we'll end up with ambiguous multireferences to same name. i believe this is no problem at all, but merely
a licked tooth, and should be kept as such.
mp_en_viaje: so if there's say people
a - f and patches counted numerically, supposing you have 1(
a-f) -> 2(
a, b) / 3 (b c d e f), patch 4 for someone who has
a seals list made up of
a, b should be on 2,
a111: Logged on 2019-05-03 03:18 Mocky:
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-24#1874402 << this suggests that each key holder can only host $key/gns at one ip address. And what about vpatch ordering and the v manifest file? If i have an entry for archive.is and want to change that entry, I can't just make and sign
a patch of my own, i have to patch on top of the 'consensus' press, otherwise manifest won't match and can't press multiple heads. Am I wrong about how that works?
diana_coman: Mocky: isn't the "right one" dns client you're talking about simply
a bridge? i.e. sure, have as many bridges as you want, too, what exactly is the problem?
Mocky: 'this tall' to have your own actual domain: yes. 'this tall' to follow
a link: no.
☟︎☟︎ Mocky: i would prefer, 'that link to mocky.istheshit/proof doesn't work? you must have
a shitty dns client, here's the right one...'
Mocky: I see embrace and extinguish as more appropriate for dns destruction (ala
a dnsmasq-esque approach) than isolated bunkers. I mean, i could have joined up with republic prime instead, but they already completed work on gns prime, and maybe they passed out ip based links for
a while, but eventually pulled up the ladders to their tree forts and now they can't even be found. So who knows if republic prime or double prime even exists.
☟︎ Mocky:
http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-01#1910435 << using gns as proposed, I don't see any other way than passing out ip based links. I can't send
a blog link to
a slut on fetlife who doesn't have cuntoo, nor can i send
a link to cuntoo guide. The whole thing seems like tree forts connected with tin cans and string. For gossipd I have no objection, for name resolution of published material? How is it even published if 'must be this tall to
☝︎ a111: Logged on 2018-11-24 19:51 mircea_popescu: i ~suppose~ one manner of handling this is the followingf convention : patches to be acquired from $key/gns/ dir, for all keys in the seals ring. so it'd look for "6160E1CAC8A3C52966FD76998A736F0E2FB7B452/gns" which is not
a "valid" domain per usg.verisign "rules" however it DOES resolve in our own system. because we can put ips on anything we want.
Mocky:
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-24#1874402 << this suggests that each key holder can only host $key/gns at one ip address. And what about vpatch ordering and the v manifest file? If i have an entry for archive.is and want to change that entry, I can't just make and sign
a patch of my own, i have to patch on top of the 'consensus' press, otherwise manifest won't match and can't press multiple heads. Am I wrong about how that works?
☝︎☟︎ lobbes_field: Bit as
a practical start, I may just sit down and read some of the existing items out there (cl-who) and then eventually freeze/gebesis
lobbes_field: I.e. If, say, spyked writes
a better cl-www-tron I'd still want to be able to fit the thing in my head. So any work I do toward 'building my own' will only aid me in that task (hence relatedly, I suppose, why 'build yer own v-tron' is
a commonly recommended exercise).
lobbes_field: On dumbphone atm, heres rest of line "the worst outcome for me personally would be I learn more cl (i.e. not
a bad thing at all). And we get some republican items made in either case."
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Is suspect the number of Venezolanas vs venezolanos I've met here may be
a function of distance. The ones here got out on their own or got out with family money.
mircea_popescu: lobbes_field, what's the idea here anyway, like
a sort of "script html in cl" ?
lobbes_field:
http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-02#1910762 << verily, it is much needed at this point for various applications. Seems like there are several in L1 who probably are much closer to genesis-ing such
a kit (phf, ben_vulpes, spyked, prolly
a few others), though as it stands now there are still no vpatches. I figure I'll get the ball rolling and if any of the mentioned to 'beat-me-to-the-punch' here (and I welcome this) the worst outc
☝︎ whaack: I was with
a Venezuelan for
a while, but she spoke English perfectly
whaack: yup, all casados. but i can't say that that was
a problem as i do like casados. it was just an added effort to be with ticas over the germans that i did not make, and my Spanish paid for it
whaack: ^ exactly. There were
a few brief stints with SSL girls, but nothing that stuck
mircea_popescu: he went to tamarindo, picked up
a buncha german gals for 18 months, inexplicably his spanish has not improved !!!
whaack: but more's the point : and your hedonism actually kept you away from internets for the interval ?! << it certainly reduced it drastically. but i've been around, reading the logs etc. I would of course love to have done that, but I also feel
a duty to keep the SNR down in this channel as i fix
a lot of my shortcomings.
whaack: whaack, picked up
a girlfriend or two at the least ? << Of course! The tourism of Tamarindo includes
a steady stream of European girls that come to learn Spanish for
a few months.
mircea_popescu: we could've visited the
http://trilema.com/2017/friday-night-or-las-moiras-revisited/ together or some shit. i mean, i guess yes there was that one line in the log, but for reasons i now don't recall didn't make any impression at the time. nor is
a single solitary throwaway line like that gonna make that much impression -- you wanna get anywhere you gotta mocky it!
mircea_popescu: well, if he doesnt speak spanish, he's conceivably dependent on english-language literature, which is very derpy and tends to present "dangers" and other
be carefuls.
mircea_popescu: well, if it supported you for
a year and
a half could've been that terrible huh!
whaack: I picked Tamarindo mostly because of the convenience of it being near Liberia and having what I initially wanted:
a decent nightlife, surf spots, gringo friendly atmosphere
☟︎ whaack: Now i'm back in NYC, which is hell relative to where I was
a year ago, but on the bright side I'm actually putting more effort into Spanish here and have found time to read more and have started working through SICP
http://ztkfg.com/ a111: Logged on 2017-06-07 22:09 whaack: I'm leaving the US and going to Costa Rica in about
a month. In the off chance anyone wants to make some btc by renting out
a place there send
a msg to my key. Any advice is appreciated as well
whaack: as I mentioned in the logs
a while back
http://btcbase.org/log/2017-06-07#1666967 i wound up moving to Costa Rica for quite
a while with the plan to fix my ESLness and get out of the US. I was in Tamarindo for about
a year and
a half, and during that time I fell into the hedonistic lifestyle of
a surf bum
☝︎ mircea_popescu: there's
a fundamental problem with going into business when you don't mean business : you end up like linus.