▁▁▁▁⏐︎▁ 6748
asciilifeform: wyrdmantis: nope, it is even deeper 'magic water voodoo. as was fashionable in 1960s.
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/UeHY6 << in other gpglulz.
shinohai: Maybe he should just switch to keybase.io too
asciilifeform: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/08/24/equation_group_exploit_expanded_to_target_cisco_924_asa_boxes << in yet other lulz.
asciilifeform: 'Hungary-based security consultancy SilentSignal has ported a public exploit to newer models of Cisco's Adaptive Security Appliance (ASA). .... The exploit was restricted to versions 8.4.(4) and earlier of ASA boxes and has now been expanded to 9.2.(4).'
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform turns out wasn't tranbslated.
asciilifeform often feels lame asking for a transl of a piece written in a reasonably european lang
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-24#1528679 << not all the children are fit to live ; all the parents are liable to lie to themselves on this score. this impedance mismatch is the first and in plenty of approximations the only business of social science. ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-24 15:41 diana_coman: true that; my thought there was informed by the fact that a 2 years old can be happily kept occupied with perfectly-adequate stuff IF someone points them to it; on the other hand if left on their own, they will ~always find a destructive thing to do
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ima add it to list. but first i wanna finish the anhero niceguy.
asciilifeform: no rush.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-24#1528952 << actually it's not altogether clear the "announced star pattern meet" is the best way to go. too much logistical difficulty involved in syncing people ; and in defending an agglomeration - for relatively little benefit. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-24 18:04 asciilifeform: anyway, i only bring up subj because 'what are some things to do at meat meetups.'
mircea_popescu: makes much more sense to do it pairwise ; or at any rate p2pish
mircea_popescu: decentralize conferences!
asciilifeform: the old sages knew this.
asciilifeform: ask lenin.
mircea_popescu: let's say it was an early luxury we did for a time enjoy
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-24#1528972 << there is, believe it or not, this large population of "kind bear" out there ; army, construciton etc full of them. entirely subbie to some rando woman, who half the time has no fucking clue / is just bitchy. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-24 18:26 ben_vulpes: reminds me of a conversation with the excavator operator the other day: "how'd you get your wife to let you buy a corvette?" "let?!"
mircea_popescu: seems very much a "ustards do chivalry, like they saw in rome, france"
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-24#1528973 << i don't understand how you think gpg works. explain this to me ? ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-24 18:26 phf: well, that's not a noshit for every reader i suppose. if you gnupg with an incompetent person you might end up with things that you want explicitly hidden on record "beyond a reasonable doubt". shit if you gnupg with competent person you ought to think twice what to send, and if tradititional public premediated c&c is a better option
asciilifeform: i read phf's thing as simply 'you are counting on other side not to simply lose the plaintext, and not to shoot out both of your feet by sending an intended signed ciphrogram in the clear'
mircea_popescu: so what exactly is your interest if they lose the plaintext ?
asciilifeform: lose as in 'reveal publicly'
mircea_popescu: wait. are you conflating encryption and signing ?
asciilifeform: well, not me
mircea_popescu: so then what do i care that he is saying that i told him "x" ?
asciilifeform: it is not uncommon to send a signed pgpgram.
mircea_popescu: it is also not uncommon to prepare food after shitting without washing hands.
mircea_popescu: what criteria is this, common.
asciilifeform: habitually sending (and more importantly, acting on) unsigned pgpgrams has own set of risks.
mircea_popescu: encryption and cryptographic signatures solve opposite problems : secrecy and publicity.
asciilifeform: tru!
mircea_popescu: but anyway, sure, "people have come to expect" all sorts of weird shit.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-24#1528993 << mno, lord british did it too. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-24 18:46 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: actually that's misconception that arose during the "everquest" era of bullshit
mircea_popescu: worked just as badly.
mircea_popescu: eve tried it too. worked just as badly.
mircea_popescu: it's entirely perennial, no mmo ever escaped it.
asciilifeform: such as for instance some of the folks here may have 'come to expect' ~not~ being deluged with crafted messages from third parties claiming to be from X
asciilifeform: (notice, if the tale of znort is to be taken at face value, the only thing that kept his edifice from burning down was a pgp sig.)
mircea_popescu: kinda what they're for.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-24#1529001 << seeing through walls is not ai. ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-24 18:49 thestringpuller: game AI is pretty advance on most fronts, it's not trying "to be human". For instance being hunted in a stealth game. If they really wanted to, they could make the AI find you EVERY time. A game of hide and go seek that's impossible to win. So the in-between is this "puzzle-like" element.
mircea_popescu: imo the best ai any game ever displayed to date was pacman.
mircea_popescu: not surpassed so far ; not likely to ever be (it also helps that... obviously)
BingoBoingo: Classic Pac Man also has way to soundly defeat AI
BingoBoingo: "blindspots" if I recall
mircea_popescu: it is a solved problem. the only way you don't get killed if the implementation is, willingly or accidentally, bad.
mircea_popescu: it's actually a reasonably interesting and very studied problem.
mircea_popescu: (it's also not terribly fun to play over the age of about 12 or so, for this very reason. supaplex, which had dumber scissors (always left/right hand rule) AND allowd you to turn them around was much more interesting game (when scissors applied)) ☟︎
mircea_popescu: "better ai" is no improvement when it traduces in practice to "must play a game with known/computable solution" . ☟︎
BingoBoingo: In other NPC's https://archive.is/i8Ikm
mircea_popescu: yeah ok this is pretty good ; reminds one of sa of its glory days.
BingoBoingo: One can't Elliot Rodger all the nouns
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529125 << it was glorious . ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-25 00:55 mircea_popescu: (it's also not terribly fun to play over the age of about 12 or so, for this very reason. supaplex, which had dumber scissors (always left/right hand rule) AND allowd you to turn them around was much more interesting game (when scissors applied))
mircea_popescu: esp as a kid, the first time you figure out you CAN fucking turn them. because at first you know, kids are cowardly, they kinda lose control at the crucial moment.
asciilifeform listens to music loop from supaplex in his head while reading this.
mircea_popescu: genius game from this perspective ; in any discussion of "video games help kids" i always think of supaplex.
thestringpuller: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529117 << they don't see through walls in regards to smell. This was more a system designed by Kojima in MGS3 for dogs to follow a path of the player as he would drip "particles" into the ground the dog could track. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-25 00:48 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-24#1529001 << seeing through walls is not ai.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller ai is ai, sensory advantages are sensory advantages. different categories.
thestringpuller: Sure. But the notion of game AI "knowing the player's location" isn't really a thing these days.
thestringpuller: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529126 << probably why stealth games have the most "interesting" ai. It's a puzzle with many solutions. :P ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-25 00:56 mircea_popescu: "better ai" is no improvement when it traduces in practice to "must play a game with known/computable solution" .
mircea_popescu: possibly
mircea_popescu: tbh i haven't played one since thief.
asciilifeform: 'the thinking man's Doom.'
phf: mircea_popescu: you're totally right, i have no idea what i was thinking
mircea_popescu: you know i clip these and store them in a large wooden chest.
asciilifeform clips the other kind, and stores in very small brass chest.
phf: so i shouldn't trust myself to run opsec either
mircea_popescu: phf it helps if you THINK about it.
mircea_popescu: as evidenced by the fact that once you stop to consider it, a minute's all it takes.
mircea_popescu: ("would you trust surgeon x to cut out your appendix ?" "it depends. would he be watching tv while doing it ?")
mircea_popescu: i'm not even sure the case of breach was yet born when the problem truly was "nobody could have predicted". virtually all go "o hey, if we as much as gave a shit for seven straight seconds..."
phf: well, it's a simon says game. "in step 27, sidestep 5 you pushed button A instead of B. game over"
mircea_popescu: it is at that.
mircea_popescu: you know the esprit de finesse / esprit de geometrie classification right ?
phf: no
mircea_popescu: turns out topic's been studied by eg, pascal, ever so long ago.
phf: actually i think we had a thread about it
mircea_popescu: can't recall if it was back on otc or no.
phf: i think i'm actually misremembering, but i found pensées. "congratulations, your civilization has discovered: writing"
asciilifeform: '...discovered: despotism!' (tm) (r)
mircea_popescu: lol
phf: stealth computer games are best suited for ai problems, because the algorithms fall under a very specific category of differential blind search games with mobile hider studied and analyzed since the 60s as part of differential games subfield of game theory (DoD likes to throw money at stuff like that, and the first treatment of subject is by a RAND corporation guy). there's no known optimal strategy for >2 node networks, but there are
phf: interesting strategies (and since games are time dependant, hence differential, they are really algorithms) that you can easily implement by reading relevant papers. but to suggest that the solution is "wins every time" is a claim about the search space or claim about a game theoretical breakthrough. since thestringpuller said "well, they are very small levels" it's probably about node count. there are probably very impressive mixed
phf: strategies that you can put in a bot. of course in offline computer game you're looking at repeated games where one player can learn and observe strategy and the other one can not, so in repeated search games the human player theoretically will always wins. (probably in online games it's still an arms race of recognizing the strategy and coding/tweaking the strategy)
mircea_popescu: aha.
mircea_popescu: there's other considerations in play. optimal strategies usually tend to be too stable to be "fun" ; so the designer is stuck with a pretty complex bag.
mircea_popescu: (it stands to reason that if YOU are trying to find the enemy / rabbit / whatever you want to take stationary positions and watch ; yet people don't usually want to play a game against ai that does mostly this.)
mircea_popescu: but in general, on the basis of the horrid ad&d of average gameplayer, computer should be capable of getting pretty close to "every time" just by... you know, not being a crazed teenager.
mircea_popescu: kinda why it's so scandalous the arab teens are ripping uncle sam's overtrained, overfed volunteers a new hole.
phf: hehe, actually ambush strategy is one of the reasons there's no known solutions for general networks, which must be a bummer for dod ☟︎
mircea_popescu: aha.
mircea_popescu: of all the billions they wasted, this particular stuff is not the worst.
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/08/after-years-of-rumours-coinbase-adds-litecoin-support-kind-of/ << Qntra - After Years Of Rumours Coinbase Adds Litecoin Support, Kind Of
BingoBoingo: The power move in Civ 2 was to swiftly revolution your govt into Fundamentalism after getting the bomb and rushing your enemies with cheap fanatics.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo civ was very weak because it had a number of "rush". i could consistently win rushing the (large landmass) globe with cavalries.
mircea_popescu: usually played the russians doing this :D
mircea_popescu: (great spot with horses in the forests there for it.)
mircea_popescu: then you could rush with knights. then you could rush with etc.
BingoBoingo: AHA. The rules.txt file and sprite files were great introduction to "Computer Game is not opaque monolith"
mircea_popescu: but the cavalry rushes were pretty sad affairs specifically because a) game ended cca 1k bc ; b) the score was otherwise unbeatable ; c) wtf srsly.
mircea_popescu: experience shows it is exceedingly difficult to build 4X games that don't die thus (more recent players will know this as "zerging")
mircea_popescu: dune 2 solved the problem by a) making the quads shit and b) overpowering the turrets AND c) forcing you to keep resetting your base through "levels".
mircea_popescu: none of which is an honest solution.
mircea_popescu: heroes 2/3 had much better solution through army dampening model (you DID NOT lose army!). at least imo.
BingoBoingo: IRL has excellent solution of simply debuffing most units into uselessness
phf: man, this story is going to give me nightmares, it's a nightmare in which i'm reading the story and can't get out
phf: i thought there's a happy ending, but i made a mistake of googling the guy after part one
mircea_popescu: aww.
mircea_popescu: im just about to publish part three.
mircea_popescu: so now you can't go to sleep.
BingoBoingo: lol
mircea_popescu: aaand it's on
asciilifeform reads
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2016/the-story-of-elliot-rodger-by-elliot-rodger-adnotated-part-three/ << Trilema - The Story of Elliot Rodger. By Elliot Rodger. Adnotated. Part Three.
phf: i soon started to develop great envy
mircea_popescu: at least your moon unit dweezildruid is level 60.
mircea_popescu: holy shit, these people redefined the (rather common) name of Marcel!
mircea_popescu: i had no idea Proust was "married celibate"
mircea_popescu: the most shocking thing to me re anglospace is and remains the incredible textual productions of people who evidently master no references. it's an endless outpour of "music" from people who don't recognize any notes.
BingoBoingo: "My parents shocked me with very horrible news. They were planning on sending me to Taft High School. Taft had five times as many students as Crespi, it was a public school, it had girls in it, and it had a bad reputation. I had never been so scared in my entire life. How could they do this to me, after knowing what I went through at Crespi? Taft High School would eat me alive and spit me out. I felt so betrayed by my parents." << AHA, I
BingoBoingo: was waiting for his parents to give up on him!
mircea_popescu: srsly.
BingoBoingo: "This was the most horrible thing she could do to me, to take away my only source of joy left in the world." << lol nope. He still had a joy. Mebbe they should have sent him to drugs.
mircea_popescu: it's so fucking weird - kid evidently comes from money. he didn't find a brothel ? a roach peddler ? nuttin' ? ☟︎
BingoBoingo: Seriously
BingoBoingo: Anyways this explains why the lizard DEA made heroin trendy again. The drug kids with WoW thing backfired.
BingoBoingo: $up indoor_jellyfish
deedbot: indoor_jellyfish voiced for 30 minutes.
indoor_jellyfish: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529204 < It's amazing (to me at least) that there is no mention of google anywhere in this whole story. He never spent a moment just clicking around on whatever looked interesting because "hey, what's this?" ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-25 06:02 mircea_popescu: it's so fucking weird - kid evidently comes from money. he didn't find a brothel ? a roach peddler ? nuttin' ?
BingoBoingo: If Elliot Rodger was poor and discovered google http://sonichu.com/cwcki/Chris
indoor_jellyfish: The obsession with social status is bizzare. Are neighborhoods so clearly ordered good through bad? How much time did the adults in his life spend discussing this within earshot?
BingoBoingo: Yes, neighborhoods are exactly that clearly ordered if one is the sort of defective that counts by primary colors and names building after their shape.
indoor_jellyfish: "A large source of the incredible tedium of his prose is that where you see predicates and subjects with their determinants he just runs a mess of copulative constructions in pre-cut forms ; his idea of English phraseology is essentially a trainload of nouns." < a part-chinaman trying for hieroglyphs
diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529080 true; at the same time and funnily enough in this particular case, the parents of this guy actually called the police on him and apparently tried to get him out of the way -within the confines of what was acceptable- but essentially everybody else disagreed with the parents' own view that he wasn't fit to live among others as he was at the time. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-25 00:29 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-24#1528679 << not all the children are fit to live ; all the parents are liable to lie to themselves on this score. this impedance mismatch is the first and in plenty of approximations the only business of social science.
diana_coman: culturally acceptable I mean there
deedbot: http://www.contravex.com/2016/08/25/some-things-are-not-for-sale/ << » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski - Some things are not for sale.
mircea_popescu: diana_coman i guess so huh.
mircea_popescu: indoor_jellyfish a lot of the stuff is pretty perplexing.
mircea_popescu: $up t2yax
deedbot: t2yax voiced for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: $gettrust deedbot t2yax
deedbot: L1: 0, L2: 1 by 1 connections.
mircea_popescu: t2yax you can voice yourself, just say $up to the bot
t2yax: what trilema means ?
mircea_popescu: now that's complicated.
Framedragger: i always thought it was a play on 'dilemma'. something something hegelian triad
Framedragger: asciilifeform: i need to dig out those banners, will ping you if/when this happens
mircea_popescu: the naming of the thing is now hazed in the mists of history.
mircea_popescu: alcohol was probably involved.
Framedragger: "dialectics and alcohol" sounds like a great mix imho! ☟︎
shinohai: $up khaos49
deedbot: khaos49 voiced for 30 minutes.
shinohai: $key khaos49
deedbot: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/r/c0168b33-57ba-4ed5-aedf-e77e3d9291c1/
shinohai: ;;later tell mircea_popescu new Eulora blood awaits your arrival.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: shinohai here i am
shinohai: mircea_popescu: khaos49 has key, needs acct
mircea_popescu: ooon it.
mircea_popescu: $key khaos49
deedbot: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/r/11da4127-48da-46bb-9c5b-cf76c98cfd23/
shinohai wonders when mircea_popescu will offer him full-time staff position as curator of players and tits
mircea_popescu: khaos49 http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/e3b37de0-9d62-40d7-8169-3056dd391446/
mircea_popescu: lol shinohai
shinohai: ^.^
shinohai: ;;later tell mod6 success ... this is the coolest thing yet.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: im making some slag tro make some mining tools in a bit here ; you can have some if you want then you can either use them or sell them to noobs.
mircea_popescu: $key pi2u
deedbot: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/r/9b821e13-623e-4a43-9251-6259d4bb998d/
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529232 << when i used to drink heavily back in philadelphia my собутыльники (literally "those who share bottles", a derisive way of saying that the thing we had in common was an excuse to drink) was a small group of european philosophy ph.d.-s from upenn program. those guys would habitually get blackout drunk, which they thought was most important skill of a philosopher. usually we'd end up at one of ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-25 07:29 Framedragger: "dialectics and alcohol" sounds like a great mix imho!
phf: their tiny apartments, and this polish guy piotr would sit me down and go "now look philip, this is not how you think. if debord was part of philosophical discourse, he'd know that blah blah blah has completely demolished his argument, let me tell you" and on and on and on
mircea_popescu: the exact equivalent of these kids in romania would then have to wake up early because they had class with mp, who was ONE YEAR THEIR JUNIOR, and he'd flunk them all eventually, but they were too petrified of him anyway.
BingoBoingo: phf: Amazing! When I was in a graduate philosophy program it was dominated by the same ethos!!! Also, there's always one or more polish students in philosophy program.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu, that sounds then like an excellent class in waking up early, but with dubious results philosophy-wise :p
mircea_popescu: it wasn't early, it was 10 to 12 wtf.
diana_coman: oh, I thought they woke up early as in woke up at 6am to read for the class out of fear or something
mircea_popescu: no, just, you know, "early"
diana_coman: since we had classes starting usually at 8am if not 7:30 at uni on most days (they surely wouldn't have all fitted otherwise in a week/daytime if starting any later), I did not grasp the early concept correctly, lol
diana_coman: my point though was that petrified people don't seem to be able to learn much while being statues
mircea_popescu: this is because you also don't grasp the concept of "learning" correctly. there is no required participation of the fucking subject in learning actual matter, such as philosophy. if i were teaching them cooking i'd be interested in their own fucking contribution and whatever. but the point of philosophy is to shut the fuck up and LEARN. what "the text makes you think" and what "you feel about X" is entirely uninteresting, bec ☟︎
mircea_popescu: ause you're fucking there specifically because your thinker and feeler are absent, broken or in the best case filthy.
mircea_popescu: the current us fashion of asking kids for "their opinion" is as good a proof as needed that there exist no qualified philosophy teachers in that country, for instance.
shinohai: BingoBoingo just when you thought Pokemon Go couldn't do anymore damage: http://time.com/4465882/pokemon-go-driver-kills-pedestrian/
mircea_popescu: did he find shiny ?
BingoBoingo: OMG Tragedy! Neckbeard kills endangered species!
shinohai: lmao
mircea_popescu: they should totally make an app which gives you "secret loot" when you butcher people.
mircea_popescu: you know, just like wow.
diana_coman: shutting up and learning != being petrified
mircea_popescu: how ?
diana_coman: being petrified shuts down entirely everything including hearing/learning, hence "statue"
mircea_popescu: diana_coman in english, "petrified" denotes the situation of the mouse beset by snake, who can't move away ; not the situation of sodomites turned to salt by a vengeful god.
mircea_popescu: (the snake is, for merit, the symbol of wisdom, by the way. specifically that in the mice's reaction to it, they bring to mind philosophy students in a half decent oxford class.)
shinohai: If this were so, Southern US would contain more salt than the mines of Siberia, to hear evangelicals speak.
mircea_popescu: besides, if you were god wouldn't you make them sald-shaped dicks ?
mircea_popescu: what is this pillar nonfigurative nonsense.
phf: BingoBoingo: the whole group was like a walking stereotype. a tall sickly looking polish guy with bowl haircut. an italian with unruly hair who was pretending to be an upper-class englishman. i don't think i've ever seen them sober, i suspect they were pretty dull otherwise
BingoBoingo: phf: Kinda why I switched to Library School on a different campus. That and the "hold pattern for a decade and phd" thing lost its appeal.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529264 << nobody asks the maggot recruits 'what they feel' in maths lecture either, wtf ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2016-08-25 14:45 mircea_popescu: this is because you also don't grasp the concept of "learning" correctly. there is no required participation of the fucking subject in learning actual matter, such as philosophy. if i were teaching them cooking i'd be interested in their own fucking contribution and whatever. but the point of philosophy is to shut the fuck up and LEARN. what "the text makes you think" and what "you feel about X" is entirely uninteresting, bec
diana_coman: mouse just gets eaten though; snake can have lots of wisdom to impart to those who are fascinated by it, but those who go over into petrified are just its food
mircea_popescu: "so mr elliot, do you think it's fair that bijective functions have to also be continuos to qualify ?"
trinque: diana_coman was commenting on the biological fact that being permanently afraid shuts down memory retention
trinque: which runs contrary to learning
diana_coman: myeah, the what do you feel or even what do you think is just a bone to pick with current idiocy , nothing to do with what I was saying
trinque: being afraid at useful times, sure
phf: BingoBoingo: i have no idea what their endgame was, i think that they had some old fashioned notion of bad student, that they were committed to living out for as long their livers last. to be fair a "brilliant", but "misunderstood" alcoholic student is a european stereotype (it used to be mocked, but then there's a handful of books, where their genius is recognized type deal). i think u.s. philosophy majors carry alcoholism as a kind of
phf: misguided dedication to old world tradition, trying to parrot french cafe culture, etc.
trinque: but one can say that it is upon the student to nut-up and stop being afraid in the face of the snake
trinque: not upon the snake to un-snake
mircea_popescu: trinque petrified as you represent it and as it actually works are pretty disjunct. ask a proper rape victim - she'll recall EVERYTHING in great detail except what she did. because she did nothing. because petrified.
mircea_popescu: she'll remember it for the entire rest of her life, long after she's forgotten the face of her first husband.
mircea_popescu: that's education for you - via petrification.
BingoBoingo: phf: At this point it seems all the Muricans want to be "The Hunter S. Thompson of" X
asciilifeform: in other noose, https://duosear.ch/62f4b87384ac27526b61a77e8d08793c3d2d77e2/listing/b22edaeb1f0a1354673f1e50a1be49c9119c03c7
trinque: mircea_popescu: hm, right. I'm describing a particular brand of neurotic american stress, not petrification.
trinque: I see it.
mircea_popescu: "if the victim perceives they have the luxury to shut down memory, they're evidently not petrified enough."
asciilifeform pictures first day of mircea_popescu's lecture. n00bz walk in, find small road cone on each chair. 'no, gentlemen, these are glued on. have a seat.'
mircea_popescu: (this also plays out in the harem, esp with mid-recent girls. she gets in trouble, then gets in trouble and catches the beating of her life for having forgotten what she got in trouble for.)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i'm not much of a prop comic myself. you're the one bringing little boards and probiscii and whatnot!
asciilifeform: illustrative!1111
mircea_popescu: :)
BingoBoingo: brb
asciilifeform: in other noose, https://archive.is/Yvhnf << world's largest dirigible, british (originally american) crashes.
asciilifeform: on its 2nd flight, no less.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo ^
asciilifeform: £25m, lel.
asciilifeform: https://www.thrillist.com/news/nation/airlander-10-airship-looks-like-a-giant-butt-takes-flight-for-the-first-time << see also.
phf: i'm glad TONY MEREVICK pictured here https://assets3.thrillist.com/v1/image/1757937/size/tl-author_web.jpg has an opinion about the shape of £25m flying machine
asciilifeform: lol!
asciilifeform: y'know, thing ~is~ a flying arse, even if donald duck were the one to point it out.
phf: https://twitter.com/tonymerevick/status/401494704136937472 "Tony Merevick joined BuzzFeed as a reporter in the fall of 2013 to focus on national LGBT news. He is the co-founder and former editor-in-chief of Chicago Phoenix, an innovative LGBT news startup in the Midwest." about self "Cities News Editor @Thrillist. Formerly @BuzzFeedNews. Coffee, wine, and bourbon, please. Send tips to tony@thrillist.com"
asciilifeform: and i suspect that there is a journatard bootcamp somewhere, where they make this haircut. why have i seen 1,001 turdmeisters with it..?
mircea_popescu: lmao lgbt start-up
mircea_popescu: is it viagra powered ?
asciilifeform: spamiagra-powered.
asciilifeform: (what ~is~ in spam viagra..?)
asciilifeform vaguely recalls article from decade ago where some dude with an idle gc/ms setup actually ordered a coupla dozen spam viagras & tested, but lost link long ago
phf: asciilifeform: donald duck had edge compared to all these clowns
asciilifeform: in at least that there was only 1 of him
asciilifeform: rather than 1 spread across 1,000,001 maggots
mircea_popescu: donald duck had tons of edge, you kidding me ?
mircea_popescu: easily the most ... advanced cartoon character of the classical era.
phf: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-YoY60BRsc here's him doing backup dancing for boyd rice
mircea_popescu: up there with popeye (the drawn, not the filmed)
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2016/the-story-of-elliot-rodger-by-elliot-rodger-adnotated-part-four/ << Trilema - The Story of Elliot Rodger. By Elliot Rodger. Adnotated. Part Four.
ben_vulpes: https://blog.lookout.com/blog/2016/08/25/trident-pegasus/ << 0dayz burned
phf: who would've thought that actual "cyberwarfare" would be exactly like those old cyberpunk games. "you have 1 iceBr34ker that you can deploy againt level3 nav agent v4, there's 15 of those agents, choose wisely"
asciilifeform: phf: on the level of ft meade's 'star trek captain's chair' (one of the recent demented generals literally had one installed) - quite certainly.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'Unless, of course, the text is the product of an unrelated adult, whose involvement with the whole thing is not emotional nor personal, and who therefore simply forgot about that detail.' << sorta like the fire-proof, bomb-proof, smudge-proof passports invariably found on corpse of every 'dead terrorist' in usa.
phf: ok, let's see
phf: heh, well, this is promising "Error in function UNIX::SIGSEGV-HANDLER: Segmentation Violation at #xF7A94D06."
asciilifeform: phf: is this a routine cmuclism ?
asciilifeform: or genuine strange
asciilifeform: phf: do you have a (safety 0) in there or wat
asciilifeform: (ffi to c crapola ?)
asciilifeform: (else how does one even ~get~ a sigsegv in a cl proggy..?)
phf: i wouldn't be surprised if somebody sets safety 0, that's something that i should actually grep for, but i think it's gpgme that's doing it
phf: i rebuilt the core from scratch since there was a handful of reload-breaking updates, and that's first thing i'm getting on load
asciilifeform: is there a gpg segfault in /var/log/messages ?
asciilifeform: (thing spawns gpg as process, neh ?)
asciilifeform: perhaps phf struck gold ?
phf: the mother lode!
asciilifeform: can haz ?
phf: (in-pankage ...
asciilifeform: ..?
phf: asciilifeform: fwiw, cmucl has all kinds of nooks and crannies that i don't want to bring up on account of our recurring "why cmucl" conversation ☟︎
asciilifeform: sbcl also has
phf: and the way i'm using it is non-traditional (or perhaps very traditional depending on how you look at it)
asciilifeform: asciilifeform is specifically interested in the 'foo' in 'gpg --blah .... < foo' -> sigsegv
phf: i figured, but i suspect it's a much more mundate explanation. nothing's change in gpg/gpgme setup from the previous core, so this must be something novel in the way cmucl is packing itself to a core file, or perhaps it's not reloading those foreign libs properly ☟︎
asciilifeform: i dun think i've ever sigsegv'd a pure-lisp process that didn't (safety 0)
thestringpuller: https://steemit.com/story/@charlieshrem/a-geek-in-prison-a-life-series-by-charlie-shrem-preamble << So charlie shrem is 100% socialist now after going to club fed.
phf: asciilifeform: it's ffi, C-GPGME-OP-VERIFY on asciilifeform-kills-integer-retardation.vpatch.asciilifeform.sig
asciilifeform: phf: does your copy verify by hand ?
phf: what do you mean?
phf: you mean do i call out to a v? no, it ~is~ a v
asciilifeform: same .vpatch.sig, vpatch, key --- what does gpg from command line output ?
asciilifeform: when you attempt the thing the ffi does, but using bare hands
phf: oh, it definitely works. i can load a previous core and that same set of patches passes
shinohai: thestringpuller: and do you like how he is now unwittingly officially the face of their ponzi
shinohai: It all seems too perfect.
asciilifeform: https://sks-keyservers.net/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=gavin+andresen << lulzy - the sheer number of obvious gag keys for gavin
asciilifeform: now somebody oughta generate crapolade keys for the names which signed the 'non-gag' ones, and sign the gags, etc.
asciilifeform: recurse.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu described this algo for reddit, easily applicable here.
phf: asciilifeform: unfortunately nothing exciting, i had a stale gpgme ctx
asciilifeform: lolk
phf: hmm
phf: ok, i'll fix that later
phf: let's see if it syncs
phf: test
phf: ok. recovery code seems to be working, except for that changing host issue
mats: I just noticed skype squatting on port 80, serving up a blank page
mats: ???
trinque: lol
jurov: mats: no surprise, skype was originally p2p and using port 80 has an advantage there
asciilifeform: ;;later tell BingoBoingo http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/4081d4dc-d5c8-4ca5-808a-7bae8a13c05a/?raw=true << possibly of interest
gribble: The operation succeeded.
asciilifeform: 'My laptop was getting slower and slower. It wasn’t a very powerful laptop, but it was the only computer I had to play WoW on. This was really frustrating me, because eventually it became so slow that it ruined my gaming experience. I kept pestering my mother and father to get me a faster laptop that was more efficient for gaming.' (from rodger part 4) ☟︎
asciilifeform: and here i thought this only 'happened' to old folks.
mod6: <+shinohai> ;;later tell mod6 success ... this is the coolest thing yet. << nice! thanks for testing that :]
mircea_popescu: o hai
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu jailbroke adlai or wat.
adlai: nah i just DIDN'T lose my key
mircea_popescu: naah
adlai: ok ok you're right, they twisted my toenails until i screamed my password
mircea_popescu: i was talking to him!
adlai: re: the revocation thread from a couple days ago: why not require/expect keys, ratings, and revocations to be at least deeded, or better yet, spammed into the chain itself?
trinque: deeded requires signed, and if the right material is signed, doesn't need to be a deed.
mircea_popescu: because it's ultimately nobody else's business.
adlai: (rationale for spamming: it's not a lot of data, and adding a cost to the process gives the process a cost)
adlai: wasn't the whole thread about the fact that there's no unquestionable ordering?
asciilifeform: adlai: this is not the only problem with concept of 'revocation'.
trinque: sure there is; hash of last signed rating
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529385 << the very notion of gaming on a laptop... ☝︎
adlai: trinque: i think you're describing an imaginary system that doesn't actually exist in any of the existing wotbots/
mircea_popescu: the whole thread was about how key owner does NOT control the process in any shape or form. this is the logical equivalent of "the organism pumping blood through the tits does not control the tit pinching that goes on with the tits."
asciilifeform: adlai: the entire notion of pubkeys posted publicly in a way that implies that strangers can take and use'em for something, is probably going away.
mircea_popescu: pretense to the contrary has a cost ; and we're not gonna be paying it.
adlai wonders whether this extends to the entire notion of s/pubkeys/ratings/, too
asciilifeform: adlai: currently there is a very comical situation where chumps download a pubkey, from ?????, and then try to authenticate published material (found on mitmable www sites, naturally) ~TO~ it, rather than the reverse (found signed material, then determined matching pubkey)
mircea_popescu: i thought at least re ratings it was obvious from original wot article.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> o hai << hey! also had some lulz reading part III of Rodger on the train.
mircea_popescu: " However, this is something that Joe can evaluate by himself, without having any need for Moe, and without needing to ask him anything" <<
asciilifeform: (or worse yet, they encrypt a transmission ~to~ a key without any attempt at climbing to it in their actual wot)
mircea_popescu: mod6 cheers :)
mod6: There are so many gems.
adlai: it is possible to trust (up to a certain minimal degree) keys encountered "in the wild"
mod6: like this: "What the fuck is wrong with these people." << i mean right?
mircea_popescu: it is possible to eat shit, as an individual. it is not possible to enact a shiteating diet.
asciilifeform: adlai: must also point out, 'read signed document and then found matching pubkey' still conceivably leaves you behind a 'great firewall' where all pgp sigs visible match chairman mao's key perfectly
mircea_popescu: don't confuse what one can do with what's to be done.
mod6: An honest question to ponder for our times: "Why the fuck do US kids even go to school anymore ?"
mircea_popescu: ikr?
asciilifeform: mod6: same reason they went in 1900. to be kept out of labour market.
asciilifeform: propping up wages.
adlai: asciilifeform: true
mircea_popescu: aha, the equivalent of the boarded up bank-house
mod6: but! think of the alt! Sitting there playing wow while pumped full of antibiotics and just shitting in place for months at a time seems like it'd save on costs.
mircea_popescu: "this cunt is not for sale - she has great future in front of her, going to college"
mircea_popescu: "bitch... i'm not gonna pay more for her as she's older and dumber"
trinque sees how wot ratings propagating over gossipd make more sense than anything taped together on this gossipd-less side of things
adlai: mod6: reminds me of some article that tl;dred to "i should have procrastinated my phd for as long as possible, finishing it was a mistake"
trinque: and in that case they hold only as much credence as your trust of peered nodes
trinque: and order is when you saw it
asciilifeform: trinque: current situation is more or less worst possible - one reads arbitrary, sig-less string from a remote box, in the clear.
mircea_popescu: trinque it's really immersive, this new dream, huh.
trinque: shapes so much behavior.
adlai: so when do we officially acknowledge that the first attempt at addressing the gossipd RFC was a failure, and solicit a second?
adlai: oh sorry, "there is no we, there is only V". so when do U ...?
mircea_popescu: "we" ?
asciilifeform: adlai: i can speak only for me.
mircea_popescu: what've they been feeding you in the booby hatch ?
asciilifeform: and iirc phf also had one.
adlai: yeah i just corrected myself
asciilifeform: and i forget who else.
asciilifeform: nobody yet published, because various details remain to be worked.
adlai: then maybe the RFC should be for a protocol, rather than an implementation? or at least, a reference implementation that ~nobody uses, like V
adlai is not calling users of mod6-V "nobody", but just suggesting that "most" users, write their own
mircea_popescu: what is this guy on about.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: gossipd
trinque: adlai: I use it.
mircea_popescu: i dun think so.
asciilifeform: adlai: i thought you were referring to my original v as 'reference'
asciilifeform: in which case you would be almost correct, afaik no one but me uses it.
mircea_popescu: motherfucker "corrected himself" in the sense of admitting his original idiocy has no possible subject ; and then gleefully proceeds to act as if he said something.
trinque: also v.pl is to be valued by number of shithub stars
mod6: <+trinque> adlai: I use it. << actually, this really was cool.
asciilifeform: phf: log dead ?
mod6: not only do people use it throught the build script directly, etc.. but trinque published his irc bot code with it. and that kinda blew my hair back. so thanks trinque!
phf: asciilifeform: i'll look into it in an hour or so
trinque: thank you; thing's great.
mircea_popescu: mod6 was a pretty cool moment huh.
mod6: ya, that was pretty awesome.
mircea_popescu: yeah.
adlai: asciilifeform: again, i stand corrected. maybe it's past my bedtime, if mircea_popescu hears 'glee' in my keystrokes.
mircea_popescu: i think it is past your bedtime, yes. come back fresh tomorrow. ☟︎
adlai: ok time for one last bit of irony
adlai waves goodnight to mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: lol
mod6: this morning shinohai successfully tested the offline build script that i create (a slight varient from the original one).
mod6: *created
mod6: so that's pretty nifty.
mircea_popescu: shinohai's been a busy little rabbit has he.
mod6: yeah, done a ton of testing for me this month.
mircea_popescu: in between laying pipe in colombia and helping noobs collect bitcents in eulora...
mod6: I'm currently working on the makefile(s) that will replace the build scripts etc. but there's some elbow grease to put in there.
mod6: nice!
mod6: i heard they concluded some peace there just yesterday?
mod6: anyway, will be looking forward to feeding deedbot the next 14 buildroot deps here shortly. the vetting process is on going but, so far, so good.
mod6: busy month...
mod6: hopefully by the end of the month we'll have fourteen new deedbot deps for buildroot placed, a new V99994 build script, and an offline build script.
mod6: Work will continue on the makefile(s). Exciting stuff.
mod6: </update>
mod6: Didn't mean to take over the chamber, sorry. lol.
shinohai: Make benefit glorious serene republic
shinohai: no the new build script is gonna be next step in v evolution to me
shinohai: i like it
asciilifeform: filtration system, a marvel to behooold!1111 (tm) (r)
deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/84FDD00AD2E5C818F1D9A7604EA5447CDA456A25B275975C62A2F1AEB4ED42C3 << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 126845615151026431976406479 divides RSA Moduli belonging to 'SlowFax <slowfax@googlemail.com>; '
mod6: Tell your brother I said this thing was cool.
asciilifeform: lolk
asciilifeform: mirrorolade.
mircea_popescu: mod6 sounds pretty solid.
mircea_popescu: aaaand in other news, http://67.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m2bff28RN51rt8hgno1_500.gif
shinohai: ;;bc.stats
gribble: Error: "bc.stats" is not a valid command.
shinohai: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 426861 | Current Difficulty: 2.1737548275723764E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 427391 | Next Difficulty In: 530 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 4 days, 4 hours, 9 minutes, and 26 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None