asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: yer card runs on closed vendorblob, neh. how would that even make it into a cuntoo-portage or vtree at all.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i described this in the orig ifdefism thread. the solution is to stop pretending that coad worx on boxen where no one in living memory had ever tested it and signed.☟︎
asciilifeform: (cuz if you ~were~ -- you'd have pressed 'dec vax' vtree, not 'pc' )
asciilifeform: just like you already know that you aint building on a dec vax
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: correct. and 1ce you 'saved state', you dun need 'if bug xxxxxx...'. cuz you ~already know~ whether this evaluates to troo or false
asciilifeform: which is what 'if bug xxxxxxx....' adds up to
asciilifeform: there cannot be any such thing as nondeterministic process in vpress
asciilifeform: i.e. specifically what vtronics was designed to abolish
asciilifeform: it's the ebuild equiv of orig 'patch''s 'merging'
asciilifeform: i've seen it, this imperative coad, it consists of 'probe for bug xxxxxx'
asciilifeform: trinque: i gotta say, i cannot picture any legit reason why an ebuild would contain imperative code
asciilifeform: the heathens ftr took up this fallacy ( 'who needs reproducible builds, we have vmware' ) and have written themselves into some pretty amazing corners ('what did you say, you wanted to BUILD 'rails' from src? no one has done this since 2011... here have a vm' etc)
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-06-22#1919415 << i must point out, this item imho is orthogonal to the problem of this thrd, a standard 'machine' does not remove the need for proper 'systemwide vtron'-aka-portage-replacement☝︎
asciilifeform: the remaining 5% is to make it eat the ancient ebuild format. supposing that's even what we want, what with it having 'optional' sigs etc
asciilifeform: pretty much 95% of a 'portage' right there
asciilifeform: there is even a (sad, disused, esthlos went to bottom of sea) but last i saw -- working -- cl vtron
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: can't resist to ask, wai
asciilifeform: observe that v itself , orig asciilifeform wrote in python, on napkin, but since re-baked by many folx many times in other scriptrons
asciilifeform: the fundamental insight is circa '15 -- script lang dun need gc
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: imho python is one of the cheapest heathenisms to perma-kill. if e.g. spyked's miniature lisp could be grown to adulthood, can dispense with python/perl/bash/etc
asciilifeform: 'emerge' itself is a quite gnarly ball o'python
asciilifeform: well yes, was speaking of the payloads strictly
asciilifeform: aha, it's moar or less lang-agnostic. but it also is an orc half-implementation of v (attempts to find dependencies, and to check sigs, but for some reason the latter is optional, and the former only quasi-worx)
asciilifeform: i have not tried it with megafauna like trb
asciilifeform: worx at least on c/ada mixture, e.g. my udp lib
asciilifeform: ftr ada's 'gprbuild' is the 1st 'make'-like automator asciilifeform ever used that he did not want to throw against the wall erryday
asciilifeform: (sorta like a 'make' not written by tards)
asciilifeform: it'd be a very trivial ebuild, lol. given as uses gprbuild, which actually worx correctly.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: re 'ebuilds', as i understand trinque's angle was/is to organically replace gentoo's ebuild duct tape with vtron
asciilifeform: but e.g. trb , pretty heavy, 0 autoconf (in the proggy per se, that is; there is some in the deps, however)
asciilifeform: sufficiently toejam-encrusted, indeed not
asciilifeform: nobody needs 10MB of #ifdef dec_vax ....
asciilifeform: and yes legacy crapola that nobody got around to deautoconfing yet, do use, there's 9000 on my boxen. but what i touch with own hands , away it goes
asciilifeform: re autoconf, asciilifeform considers autoconfism an evil, and none of his productions ever used it or ever will
asciilifeform: otherwise 'all nodes propagate all inputs to all nodes' is a ddos ~amplifier~ .
asciilifeform: trinque: rrright but the 'authentic' is how you guarantee manageable pace.
asciilifeform: trinque: correct. if your 'processors' dun have to deal with rando liquishit from whole planet at once, but only w/ authentic peers, it becomes practical proposition.
asciilifeform: output will in any instance be exactly same from all working copies.
asciilifeform: ( given that deterministic mechanism will transition to same state always from given state + given input )
asciilifeform: the 'secret' of this is that you only gotta propagate the ~inputs~ .☟︎
asciilifeform: rright, ditto 'vmware' etc. but can you force'em to auto-synchronize the state on 2 physically separate boxen
asciilifeform: ( which afaik they do not do , 'because slow', cuz nobody can be arsed to asm iguess )
asciilifeform: it's funny, imho, how heathens fucked the softs stack to the point where it actually makes sense to pass a whole-machine state around
asciilifeform: i.e. connect to one, its state changes, and it sends message to others, which majoritate ?☟︎
asciilifeform: trinque: since you seem to be familiar with subj : outta curiosity, do any of the heathen 'cloud'isms allow user to run same 'machine' on multiple irons in lockstep ?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: if when i get up find it, will post. loox like might be deep in a hedge.
asciilifeform: dunno, asciilifeform is not a pro augur
asciilifeform: meanwhile in augur omens, a bird just exploded against asciilifeform's window
asciilifeform: afaik 'container' heathenism usually refers to orc attempts at circumventing os lack of static linkage, rather than whole-os in bottle
asciilifeform: cuz imho an envir where you can build yer os/proggies at home, then upload whole thing to piz (or even yer own box wherever) an' run, and then snapshot, download state, run again at home, or (exotica) sync 2 running instances -- would be a win☟︎
asciilifeform: trinque: does the notion make sense to you, or is lunacy ?
asciilifeform: ( qemu, imho, as it stands, is garbage )
asciilifeform: trinque: re the 'iron babel', asciilifeform strongly suspects that a standardized 'textbook' arch, even with 'artificial' (soft) rather than troo iron available, would be of much use re cuntooism
asciilifeform: trinque: i dun think anyone expects 'ubuntu-like installer' (at least not i)
asciilifeform: re: loose ends: fwiw asciilifeform did in fact add the final missing piece to mipstron. BUT! can't test with the dummkopf's orig linux image as he... guess wat, his system had little-endian word accesses but big-endian byte read/write ! so his image in fact will boot on NO existing mips, nor any afaik other emulator.☝︎☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: i suppose taking day job as astrologer went ok for kepler. but he was after all kepler. did not go well for asciilifeform .
asciilifeform: it was funny, was hired in the 1st place for 'solving' problem apriori known to be a squared circle, 'homomorphic crypto'.
asciilifeform: Mocky: for bonus ugh, politruk showed up erry day to ask asciilifeform when he'd agree to take holy orders 'and start the interesting projs'
asciilifeform: Mocky: it was the sorta job that destroys yer head, like cerebral equiv. of black lung.
asciilifeform: ( this, arguably, is worse than to be able to neither think nor speak )
asciilifeform: historically this aint the problem, tho, in '16 asciilifeform was stuck in such a snakepit, could speak all he wanted , but could not ~think~
asciilifeform: Mocky: bouncer (znc or similar) . if yer in an especially dire shithole, may have to hang it (or the ssh tunnel leading to it ) on port 80
asciilifeform: ( perhaps aside from frank herbert's 'mentats', who are unfortunately fictional... )
asciilifeform indeed cannot do 4096b rsa by hand in half hour, nor knows anyone who can
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i expected that finally making it to ru would be morale booster for phf. ( evidently not? wai not ? )
asciilifeform: admittedly asciilifeform not had time to follow pantsuit press. last i knew they helpfully assembled the old carrier fleet into a convenient shooting gallery for iran. (who for some reason not taken advantage yet)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: loudly 'coulding win' is what those folx do for a 'living' neh.
asciilifeform: next step of tech-evolution after soy etc
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i expect this will be next 'diet trend' -- arse-mouth hose.
asciilifeform: ( groups of 5, with 5th symbol being checksum, would imho be ideal -- then can report eggog on group when keying )
asciilifeform: admittedly i've never seen the ameri-otp
asciilifeform: empirically easier to work with, when formatted in groups
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: like the old kgb otp ! also printed in groups of 4.
