log☇︎
73900+ entries in 0.588s
mod6: i did see that. and yah, that sucks. for lack of a better way to put it.
asciilifeform: to asciilifeform commonlisp is rather like i imagine an old, nagging wife is for old man
asciilifeform: mod6: i have nfi what 'general feeling' would mean, there is no homogeneous writhing mass here
mod6: (i ask all of the questions because im simply curious, and it seems to be such a broad range of different dialects, if that's even a way to put it)
phf: well, i think, if you're trying to communicate clearly, LISP means thing that mccarthy wrote, and then spinoffs of that, LISP 1.5, 1.6
asciilifeform: ftr phf is the one and only serious lisp d00d i ever ran across who capitalized.
phf: asciilifeform: i wonder how much of scar was removed in sbcl. i know while newman was still hacking, he removed a lot of gunk. i vaguely suspect that cmucl can't be improved without tackling the bootstrapping problem, which is probably going to look very similar to sbcl's solution
mod6: oh, yeah. almost forgot... having the feather stems in the pillows is the worst. i refuse to use them for that reason. nothing worse than those things poking you in the face.
asciilifeform: now, it isn't as if i had a better cltron to offer.
mircea_popescu: phf enjoy it while it lasts bub, i had the same thing in my 20s/early 30s
asciilifeform: phf: i've spent last hr or so reading cmucl code, more or less at random, and am struck by the sheer proportion of scar tissue
phf: girl couldn't figure out how i can eat so much (now) and not gain any weight was a mystery. few weeks ago a lightbulb "ooooh, it all goes to thinking!"
mod6: omg. i bet the bolognese is awesome.
mod6: i'd get medieval on someone if they did that to my salami
mod6: i was at the deli the other day, buying up all the meats... and just remembering, and getting even pissed about the thought of some asswads substituting soy in for fat.
mircea_popescu: tsk tsk, and i thought it was so original
mod6: i just had this impression that alf was on atkins or something
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: lol, i ~did~ wonder what he wanted with that crate.
mod6: btw, i wanted to note that hanbot v. random .ar derp would have been an awesome battle to watch.
phf: hmm, i thought russian disdain is usually a lot colder, refined. sort of like nabokov talking about what make lolita appealing to the american public.
mircea_popescu: http://log.irc.tymoon.eu/freenode/lisp?from=2015-12-20T19 << there's a log, insanely shitty with too much js to run, but i think it may go back usefully.
mircea_popescu: i have nfi why it has to come in scattered 2 page text files
asciilifeform: jurov: i am interested strictly in the record re the relevant bits.
asciilifeform: jurov: they may also have gone to the bottle, for all i care
jurov: asciilifeform: i think these somebodies went on to make their own lisp dialect, using python build system or jvm or llvm or somesuch
ben_vulpes: occasionally i ask a question and someone answers
phf: actually i should probably track his notes down, but it might be easier to just ask him
mircea_popescu: i don't recall, what was the objection to tinyscheme as the root ?
phf: i'm pretty sure he was doing around the same time as you were doing loper, so i'm surprised you haven't seen it. i think he might've been doing it under TUNES umbrella
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it exists, i have run number crunching routines this way.
phf: asciilifeform: there are text files (he makes adequate technical logs of most of his efforts. i'm using his notes to recreate arm port for cmucl), but i won't be able to find them at the moment (i'm not on my main machine)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what i wanted to establish was the ~whynot~
ben_vulpes: i was certain that we'd done the 'omg cmucl compilation' lolz thread before; is this a time loop? where are picard and riker
asciilifeform: http://www.ljosa.com/~ljosa/doc/encycmuclopedia/devenv/README-build-instructions.txt << phf if this is current, then i am officially cured of all desire to have anything to do with the thing
ben_vulpes: dog if that's a jet fighter i'm the ceo of apple
asciilifeform: phf (or anybody else?) -- dare i ask, how the fuck does one BUILD IT
asciilifeform: * I do not know what this object should be or how it got there,
asciilifeform: * For some reason x86 has a heap corruption problem. I (rtoy)
asciilifeform: and i have 0 sympathy.
asciilifeform: and i can see why they do it, even buying ~one~, e.g., UART, today, is not easy
phf: i didn't know what stm32 was, i thought it was some PIC variation
phf: well, it's a lispm kind of architecture, with a single central controller, and extension boards of various degrees of dirty. though i guess the real "core" here is the opaque STM32
mircea_popescu: nah, what'd i fire at
asciilifeform: i thought mircea_popescu ends up with DShK shells in pockets when comes back from roof.
mircea_popescu: i guess i haven't worn these since i was last on roof.
mircea_popescu: "i'm so terrifying of talking to that cute wallflower i'ma revolutionize the $name like $name for $name instead!11"
mircea_popescu: "i'll get everyone to do X!"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no i liked that part.
mircea_popescu: i must say candi_lustt made it obvious lisp is workable development. way the fuck faster than figuring out which stdio to include and dumb shit like that
mircea_popescu: i imagine it prolly also works. ianale
mircea_popescu: i don't insist re implementation ; was just included as example
mircea_popescu: i suppose its tagged memory model does pretty much a superclass of the above
asciilifeform: i don't disagree.
mircea_popescu: i guess.
mircea_popescu: i don't want the functionality exposed.
asciilifeform: but if you had something clever in mind, around this, i'm all ears
mircea_popescu: i want the cpu to not be physically capable of addressing it.
mircea_popescu: ie "i want to read from x onwards".
mircea_popescu: yah, but i want this quite exactly, for it to not be POSSIBLE for memory to be addressed as it currently is.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i figured re p when i saw your padder attempt.
asciilifeform: is how i got there.
asciilifeform: well ~all interpreted programming languages use 'bytecode' or some variant (i.e. emulator for fictional cpu that fits the task)
mircea_popescu: yes but started (at least i think) as vops.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-01-19#1605206 << i always thought that's what yarvin was john smithing with his "jets" ☝︎
asciilifeform: trinque: i must note: just because asciilifeform barfed, does not mean that a clean solution to the problem cannot exist. only that he did not find one.
asciilifeform: also (and iirc i discussed this on my www at one point) the correct approach is to ditch the native compiler, in favour of the interpreter, hand-compiled to fit in L0 cache ☟︎
phf: there's some strategy in building multithreading in a lisp that all the commercial lisps share with cmucl and that's different from sbcl, but i'm not quite sure what it is yet
phf: re cmucl threads i think that it doesn't always preempt correctly. like it has explicit yield, which you don't always have to call, but it being there implies. also hunchentoot wasn't working right without putting a yield somewhere in the scheduler. it's all very vague, because i've not spend any time looking at it
phf: well, stali has a musltronic pdf reader and web (they have their own wrapper around webkit, called st i believe, which is literally just a frame with addressbar)
trinque: asciilifeform: yeah works; I had it built against gtk2, -dbus, etc
phf: no, i'm not that far in the stack to tackle threading. because of goals, if i do, or once i do rather, i'll just work on making them better green threads, rather than native.
phf: no, i
a111: Logged on 2017-01-19 17:16 asciilifeform: !~later tell trinque re: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-01-19#1605086 >> plz consider posting recipe for musltronic emacs build! i promise to test.
asciilifeform: this i recall. but didja ever find out specifically why.
phf: who knows with threads, i wouldn't be surprised if sbcl touches them in very inappropriate, glibc specific ways
phf: so i don't know how sbcl does it, but cmucl has unix.lisp, which kernel relies on early on in the operation, and yes, contains all the "talk to the world" crud. cmucl actually does some hack where only subset of unix is used for operations and then when you (require unix) it adds some of the userspace
asciilifeform: phf: would you say that cmucl is more suited for 'iron' incarnation? (i.e., can it be build without gcc?)
phf: but i think sb-unix exposes some kernel level shit, because need it for reading files and exec and such
asciilifeform: (i can clearly see that my copy is linked with it. but -- why?)
phf: did anybody do a musl sbcl? i have a musl cmucl in the backlog, but way down the list (perhaps once i get this x60 going)
a111: Logged on 2017-01-19 15:55 trinque: I built on musl lots of times before
asciilifeform: !~later tell trinque re: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-01-19#1605086 >> plz consider posting recipe for musltronic emacs build! i promise to test. ☝︎☟︎
phf: i thought little axes were standard issue item, sort of like a sapper spade
asciilifeform: https://archive.is/stOV3 << in other olds >> elaborate yarn re 'mysterious' habit of u.s. soldiers, of bashing in the heads of killed goatfuckers. presented as 'atrocious' and 'senseless' etc. and i read whole spittoon waiting for the obvious reason to be mentioned, and of course was not (ground beed the face, and you dun need to worry whether you executed the hit on exactly the right d00d..)
phf: so i called the new branch of the bank i'm transferring to, they confirmed the ifsc number. i'm not sure what i prefer, the fed theory or the incompetence theory. either...
mircea_popescu: incidentally this'd have been a great show, i imagine, guy going on street idly, happening on meat shop just as the truck unloads, and generally doing a grand blond a la chaussure noire but a la russe.
asciilifeform: note, i will not claim that there is necessarily still fish at that particular meat shop.
asciilifeform: but i was sending small (few $k usd) amount.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-01-19#1605116 << worked great last i tried it ( 2013 ) ☝︎
phf: might just have to fall back to cash, i was trying to be prim and proper, alas
mircea_popescu: conversely of course, every dollar you do take out of the us hurts the usg considerably ; i'd guess the going rate is 130k expatriated is about equivalent to shooting a nypd officer in the face.
phf: in unrelated lulz a u.s. retail bank is unable to send an international wire transfer. i bring a piece of paper with all correct requisites. half the numbers "i don't know what this number is", so follow up with calls for numbers from the fucking paper that, who could've predicted, are required. write down the numbers on their end incorrectly. the last part of saga: they now claim one of the numbers is invalid, but if you simply google for it it comes up
mircea_popescu: turns out i can bit mit with one hand while watching porn. they'll leverage what, they got nothing.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-28 19:23 mircea_popescu: which i suppose warrants a general warning : DO NOT UPGRADE YOUR GCC TO 5.0! SAVE YOUR COPIES OF 4.X AND PRIOR!
mircea_popescu: well, gcc i mean
trinque: I built on musl lots of times before ☟︎
trinque: gotta just stop; I'm never installing another emacs version again
mod6: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-01-14#1602666 << some very early, news to report: I've successfully implemented this fix into the forthcoming version of V (99994), and all original and new automated tests passed. ☝︎
asciilifeform: nah, but i work with hands enough that it comes off.
mircea_popescu: some crossover with tintin, but meh. the great us equivalent would be i guess popeye