asciilifeform marvelling that no one, apparently, ever noticed the glaring omission in 'patch'

asciilifeform: shinohai: this is a persistent problem, and i have every reason to expect that it will get worse.

asciilifeform: disconnecting node 62.210.127.113:34814

asciilifeform: socket no message in first 60 seconds, 1 0

asciilifeform: accepted connection 178.18.90.41:42497

asciilifeform: accepted connection 104.236.95.174:49539

asciilifeform: i.e.,

asciilifeform: shinohai: blackholed ?

asciilifeform: prolly 3 lines of perl

asciilifeform: incidentally it is not necessary to alter the unix patch util. the checksums can be added by a proggy which eats standard patch file and the 'before' tree, and shits - this

asciilifeform: curious what ben_vulpes, for instance, might add

asciilifeform: but it is a necessary start.

asciilifeform: now, the above is not a magic pill! somebody will still need to write the graph traverser

asciilifeform: but now both sides of the patch (author and applier) will need the custom util.

asciilifeform: and thereby can safely snip a file after stating its checksum

asciilifeform: but now - can.

asciilifeform: jurov: it was not a thing before, because there was no way to guarantee that the contents are what the patch author thought they were

asciilifeform: i will add, if it isn't obvious, that patches like the one i suggested will apply on a standard unix patch util

asciilifeform: hence the 'never, ever include a patch in message text' thing.

asciilifeform: it was an issue with message text on ml

asciilifeform: same as a tarball would be

asciilifeform: and detach-signed

asciilifeform: afaik this was never an issue with patches (they were attached as binaries)

asciilifeform: in that, having a bag of patches in hand, you could magically coalesce them into a dependency graph

asciilifeform: imho this would correct a fundamental flaw in the whole diff thing

asciilifeform: see the dpastes

asciilifeform: because the alternative was a multi-megabyte pile of minus signs

asciilifeform: jurov: 'chicken' was a dire, necessary evil

asciilifeform: http://dpaste.com/04XFDSF << augmented ☟︎

asciilifeform: http://dpaste.com/0MWBGJ1 << original ☟︎

asciilifeform: i'm about to post an example

asciilifeform: from patches like these, one could conceivably auto-build a dependency graph

asciilifeform: thinking of a modified unix-patch util that stuffs sha512 into comment preceding each file diff

asciilifeform: as i understand, any mechanized thing really depends on patches stating their antecedents

asciilifeform: again with the meat models. in point of fact most viruses ~don't work~

asciilifeform: the only way to guarantee that the selected set of authors adds up to a single nonconflicting merge is to only build official releases (that is, tree signed by mod6 & ben_vulpes)

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i once thought about placing antecedent hashes in patch headers ☟︎

asciilifeform: as in, can i download whole thing and attribute every delta to a wot person ?

asciilifeform: auth is easy, but how about verify ?

asciilifeform: wiki is a neat idea, but someone will have to invent signed-edits-wiki

asciilifeform: well, one reason why possibly not is that i suspect that the ml is as quiet as it is because signing things is arduous

asciilifeform: esp. if it can be limited to the wot set

asciilifeform: that'd be very spiffy

asciilifeform: something i've been loathe to suggest because guess to whom the chore will fall

asciilifeform: won't blame people, but will say that the state of the ecosystem (i.e. what folks are building on) is in such a sad state that the only plausible solution is os standardization

asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=01-08-2015#1221213 << seems like he is there ☝︎

asciilifeform: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-June/000100.html << example of one of my patches listing antecedents

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: entirely possible

asciilifeform: jurov: link?

asciilifeform: it is a problem. but i must point out that most of the troubles folks have spoken of so far do not stem from it. e.g., trinque et al with their misbehaving systems.

asciilifeform: i will add that a while ago i pictured myself in the predicament of folks trying to assemble the thing. which is why i included an unofficial flattened source with 'stator'

asciilifeform: does mircea_popescu presently have ?

asciilifeform: so let's have idea ?

asciilifeform: this'd be the snip-snips.

asciilifeform: nah it's the work of 'aunt dumb'

asciilifeform: in fact 7`321 is pushing it

asciilifeform: or 677`321 for that matter.

asciilifeform: and i say that no work of man needs 1`677`321 changes.

asciilifeform: aha?

asciilifeform: nothing needs 1`677`321 changes to go to zero kelvin !!

asciilifeform: software is not that intrinsically complicated.

asciilifeform: it is ~The~ test.

asciilifeform: like linux !

asciilifeform: aaaaand this is when i decide that the thing has brain cancer.

asciilifeform: sorta doing this with the linux kernel, actually

asciilifeform: i'd read them.

asciilifeform: i never objected to folks using 'git', 'mercurial', etc. - only to the notion that anything that can't come out of a printer and then ocr'd back in could be the canonical representation of the path from pedigreed 0.5.3 to us

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: iirc ben_vulpes has one

asciilifeform: (in unrelated newz, dulap is getting blackholed again)

asciilifeform: l0l

asciilifeform would like this very much

asciilifeform: aha

asciilifeform: but would like to think that it isn't, aha

asciilifeform: ben_vulpes sorta implied this

asciilifeform: i did offer to help. what do i have to do, get on a plane with chalkboard in bag ?

asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=31-07-2015#1219909 << apparently not ☝︎

asciilifeform searches log

asciilifeform: iirc she did

asciilifeform: in this context

asciilifeform: what precisely means 'scale' ?

asciilifeform: that the existing process is precisely correct

asciilifeform: with griping, sweating, q&a, yes - but running.

asciilifeform: plenty of folks who aren't the least 'phd' have built, and are running, the thing

asciilifeform: i just don't see it, really

asciilifeform: what can i say, go get more of me somewhere

asciilifeform: ah, that

asciilifeform: last

asciilifeform: wai wat

asciilifeform bbl

asciilifeform: (forgot this, and relearned the hard way, sat with gdb for a spell)

asciilifeform: because deleting destroys iterator

asciilifeform: except have to iterate cleverly

asciilifeform: i explained this earlier

asciilifeform: aha

asciilifeform: (i somehow forgot this feature even existed in sh)

asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: yes, and that ought to be in every release

asciilifeform: if i knew of one - would say what it is, promise.

asciilifeform: there is, sadly, no possible substitute for actually grasping the mechanism

asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: still need instructions, for when script explodes with no explanation

asciilifeform: decimation: this is also why i keep boxes going 24/7, logging