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asciilifeform: Mocky: it is of course possible to do what mircea_popescu describes, the gnat folx did it by making use of heap. however i banned the heap. because i wish to be able to reason apriori re memory usage.

asciilifeform: https://docs.adacore.com/gnat_ugx-docs/html/gnat_ugx/gnat_ugx/the_stacks.html#the-secondary-stack << the horse's mouth, re details.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: because stack frame is of fixed size in advance .

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: problem , if one want to call it one, is that the standard explicitly gives a knob for getting cmdline params, and that knob demands indeterminately-long strings (i.e. built on dualstackism) to work.

asciilifeform: ( http://btcbase.org/patches/ffa_ch10_karatsuba/tree/ffa/ffacalc/cmdline.ads + http://btcbase.org/patches/ffa_ch10_karatsuba/tree/ffa/ffacalc/cmdline.adb for the curious )

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: that's exactly what i did.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the dualstack thing comes into play when you start to demand that a function ~return~ a string of length not known in advance.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: ada gives you ~this~ type of string 'for free' ( all ada strings contain their length )

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 14:06 phf: i took a different approach, i wrote _to ada standard_ with the idea that each interface can be substituted with a custom system specific replacement. for example my character_io is a new_line aware replacement of the original, that relies on ada.sequential_io. now if i wanted to retarget to small machine, i'd write a custom sequential_io that uses machine specific calls for byte read/write

asciilifeform: ( there was not an existing 'profile' corresponding to the degree of 'fascism' asciilifeform wanted , hence the bulk of http://btcbase.org/patches/ffa_ch10_karatsuba/tree/ffa/libffa/restrict.adc item )

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: was speaking of basic semantics, rather than i/o and storage ( consider , good chunk of the reason ada wins is that it not merely enforces constraints, but forces operator to think and plan, rather than http://btcbase.org/log/2016-01-21#1379603 -shit into his pants ) ☝︎

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 13:53 phf: interfaces.c is not a libc concern, it's an ffi. the situation is that C can't be linked to an Ada, even if the C part has _no libc_ in it

asciilifeform: funnily enuff ( esp in light of mircea_popescu's excursions into sapirwhorfism ) this may not be true

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: consider for instance commandline args, the concept is meaningless on embedded chip with no commandline/shell

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 13:46 phf: or is tmsr ada whatever ave1 put into his musl build, which is, worse, a political situation. diana_coman can argue for her ffi stuff to be included, should i be arguing for my get/put stuff to be included?

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i've little doubt that he's right; hence http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-18#1835943 ☝︎

mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes consider it'd alleviate the need for ketamine.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: incidentally cr seems ~ideal for forest antennae placements.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: they used something like 1/10 of the anaesthetic dose ( thing is fiendishly difficult, incidentally, to dose )

ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: har har har

mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes if you'rte going to use veterinarian's anesthetic, might as well go the whole way and fuck veals, no ?

ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i can see how beatings could kick the brain into a new regime

asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: last i knew, ketamine was usg.dod state of art

asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: in olden times 'electroshock' 'worked' same way

a111: Logged on 2017-04-07 18:24 mircea_popescu: no, let's also de-equivocate think. there's two kinds of think, one's a forge/reflow/examination of trees resulting in analytical consumption of inputs with actionable outputs guaranteed ; the other is a neurotic behaviour perhaps best described as spinning, whereby specific emotional triggers / detriggers are visited in succession. the prussian model was never concerned with the former in any sense, but merely aimed to elimi

asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: see also http://btcbase.org/log/2017-04-07#1640167 ☝︎

mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes do tell ?

hanbot: <mircea_popescu> hanbot don't these sound like some epic hats ? << lol, that they do. the question is, wtf is a "puttplug"?

phf: mircea_popescu: oh oh i get the point

ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: looking up!

a111: Logged on 2018-07-16 15:44 mircea_popescu: thoughts plox! (and i specifically want everyone to say at least an ack, so let's page asciilifeform ave1 ben_vulpes BingoBoingo danielpbarron diana_coman hanbot lobbes mod6 phf spyked trinque )

mircea_popescu: how's tricks ben_vulpes

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: kite no good for stationary repeater. state of the art is prolly item hanging from tall branch.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in re sw, there was some work in '70s re using ~trees~ as antennae, but afaik went nowhere (at least publicly)

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: would work for short-range (line of sight) radio tho, 500MHz+

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: need at least 20M long antenna, and at least 1M away from ground, and made of something reasonably conductive and not friable (i.e. not meat)

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: unfortunately wont work for sw

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 16:00 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-18#1835840 << which would be the necessary end result of inept arrangements, a roomfull of people who think you're an idiot (or in other words, passively selecting for only those for whom your formula works out to relative epsilon necessarily selects for people to whom you're a pest and no more).

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: helmet, nazi goggles very convenient, can pass off beer buddy's photo as own

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: ping their dependopotami, let'em know the old dog broke loose from chain..

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: usa is this enchanted land of fleadom where it is in fact possible to '7k for 20 yrs' and still have 0 serious capital, cuz weevils eat ~100% of it

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 14:23 mircea_popescu: "oh, evidently our model doesn't work, so let's make it % rather than absolute". "yes fuckwit, because these aren't tools, and their use need no justification. they're just toys, for you to play with, oh don't use the scalpel, use the tweezer like thing, looks like this is more of a pull together than a cut apart thingee".

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 14:57 mircea_popescu: well, there's ways to try and fail, and there's ways to not even try at all (and still fail, of course). it seems to me (and maybe i misunderstand) that their efforts are of the latter.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it is. ( tho they also have satellite gulags in other parts of continent, and in various colonies )

phf: mircea_popescu: you pay for ships before the ships sail out though, they are artisans, but in a world where nobody buys ships anymore, instead sail on patched up dinghies. so they loan you a ship, and you maybe pay it off from your returns

a111: Logged on 2016-11-07 17:27 mircea_popescu: of course, most of this "money" isn't much more substantial than the imaginary fortunes of adolescents cycling through their fantasy business career after fapping and pre falling asleep.

lobbesbot: Logged on 2018-07-17 00:02:23: <mircea_popescu> i can't believe income tax for 100k a year is <20%.

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 15:10 mircea_popescu: suppose instead of http://logs.minigame.biz/2018-07-16.log.html#t15:27:14 i "sat down" with mocky to see "how can he pay me 100 bitcoin through other means", because "nobody expects to pay for management". something like that ?!

lobbesbot: Logged on 2018-07-16 15:27:14: <mircea_popescu> what would you need to quit that dumb shit and dedicate yourself full time to making eulora client that doesn't suck ass ?

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 01:01 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835608 << speaking of diana_coman do you recall where the whole food / pay for server thing was announced ?

ave1: mircea_popescu, what does WTA mean?

phf: unlike tmsr, adacore people are not attempting to also _build_ on a spaceprobe ;)

ave1: for overview there will probably will be about 6 flavours of zfp I think based on: MUSL C, X86_64 ASM + linux, X86_64 ASM + no os, AARCH64 + linux, AARCH64 + no os.

phf: i took a different approach, i wrote _to ada standard_ with the idea that each interface can be substituted with a custom system specific replacement. for example my character_io is a new_line aware replacement of the original, that relies on ada.sequential_io. now if i wanted to retarget to small machine, i'd write a custom sequential_io that uses machine specific calls for byte read/write ☟︎

asciilifeform: ( hence why the logic is brought out to ffa_calc, rather than part of the lib proper -- to emphasize this )

asciilifeform: ( there isn't actually an alternative, aside from -- respectively -- using gnat's gargantual text_io lib, and permitting secondarystackism. )

phf: i'm starting to think that maybe it doesn't (my memory of logs are hazy on that point, perhaps ave1 mentioned that he's working on getting ffa_calc working), because i believe you're also using interfaces.c at least to declare the types that you get in/out of c system calls

phf: ah, that explains the misunderstandings. ave1's no-c compiler has a completely custom ada runtime library, which is a tiny subset of the whole standard. http://btcbase.org/patches/zfp_2_noc/tree/ the adainclude part

phf: interfaces.c is not a libc concern, it's an ffi. the situation is that C can't be linked to an Ada, even if the C part has _no libc_ in it ☟︎

phf: but i remember diana_coman saying something about her code not compiling in ave1's because interfaces.c is not included. i'm not sure if she was talking about the former or the later

phf: asciilifeform: if you haven't looked, ave1's item is a significantly cut subset of ada's standard, where, e.g. http://btcbase.org/patches/zfp_2_noc/tree/adainclude/a-textio.ads is text_io (compare to real text_io)

phf: or is tmsr ada whatever ave1 put into his musl build, which is, worse, a political situation. diana_coman can argue for her ffi stuff to be included, should i be arguing for my get/put stuff to be included? ☟︎

asciilifeform: ( ~ffa_calc~ is not, as it uses a gnatism to grab the commandline args. )

asciilifeform: mats: ah you were thinking of the old mircea_popescu relay, aite

esthlos: diana_coman: heh, it was supposed to be "model"

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 05:16 mircea_popescu: esthlos whats a "modle" ?

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 04:35 mircea_popescu: similar how ?!

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 02:01 mircea_popescu: http://www.dianacoman.com/2018/07/17/discriminatory-code-sharing/ << i'd say this is broadly correct ; though i somewhat disagree with both ave1's take (as in http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835508 ) as well as diana_coman implict take here ( say in "hat they decide to do with it, if anything, is of course their own call entirely." ) in the following limited sense :

a111: Logged on 2018-07-16 17:50 mircea_popescu: AND THEN SAY WHAT IT WAS ABOUT

mircea_popescu: http://www.dianacoman.com/2018/07/17/discriminatory-code-sharing/ << i'd say this is broadly correct ; though i somewhat disagree with both ave1's take (as in http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835508 ) as well as diana_coman implict take here ( say in "hat they decide to do with it, if anything, is of course their own call entirely." ) in the following limited sense : ☝︎☟︎

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 01:23 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835632 << and by "the uruguayos" we mean the ustard 5th column, of course.

a111: Logged on 2017-03-08 22:29 mircea_popescu: in other lulz : femen, the "ukrainian" organisation is selling shit priced in dollars via 2checkout.com, the columbus ohio us corp.

a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 03:01 mircea_popescu: it is however not the customer's problem that the fair price point for borland whatever is 0.0006 except borland can';t chage that because must be 9.95 or else visa monopoly throws a fit.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: do the subscribers currently pay ?

asciilifeform: i've read some possibly asciilifeform-able selections from it ( diana_coman's mpi ) , to date that's iirc all

a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 16:04 asciilifeform: Mocky: i in fact do not have objection to it either way, it is a stylistic decision for diana_coman & mircea_popescu , not mine to make

asciilifeform: impersonal. the folx other than mircea_popescu , whose travel lappy doesn't go in diplo pouch and guarded in hotel by squad of musketeers.

asciilifeform: hanbot: nobody cancelled 'need to know'(tm) and other traditional mechanisms of prolonging life of seekritz. but i find it worrisome that mircea_popescu seems to think that keeping coad confidential doesn't cost anything. it does cost.

a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 17:04 diana_coman: the overall idea is to pay authors of clients based on how much their clients are actually used

mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835608 << speaking of diana_coman do you recall where the whole food / pay for server thing was announced ? ☝︎☟︎

a111: Logged on 2015-11-16 21:01 ascii_field: would let you wander off to wherever spies go when a war is over. You know why?' he said. 'No,' I said. 'Because you could never have served the enemy as well as you served us,' he said. 'I realized that almost all the ideas that I hold now, that make me unashamed of anything I may have felt or done as a Nazi, came not from Hitler, not from Goebbels, not from Himmler — but from you.' He took my hand. 'You alone kept m

a111: Logged on 2017-07-20 19:44 mircea_popescu: windows will either compete with tmsr or go away. if it competes -- it becomes. if it goes away -- it becomes. there is no choice and there is no will.

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 00:17 mircea_popescu: so no, in treating all comers equally they PRODUCED the problem. because if father is incapable of rejecting you there's exactly 0 incentive to anything but gabriel_laddelize/adlai/kanzure/etc all fucking day long.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i was speaking narrowly of scenario where $luser lifts $expectedhash from $officialclient and has his $shitclient feed server $expectedhash when prompted

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 00:10 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835536 << such a fucking injun. how, just HOW does one get so fucking stupid. "jwz" amirite, "he only wanted to". this existence is too burdensome for the likes of special cunthead.

a111: Logged on 2018-07-18 00:05 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835530 << i think it's a very stupid idea, and i don't mean this mildly, but stupid in a superlative way, because what is contemplated is a ~fixed price~ for an ~unspecified product~. this is EXACTLY like sootheby's selling "auction win tickets" whereby you get to win "any one auction". it;s like trying to implement lemon markets where they don't naturally exist, and it screams deep misunder

mircea_popescu: so no, in treating all comers equally they PRODUCED the problem. because if father is incapable of rejecting you there's exactly 0 incentive to anything but gabriel_laddelize/adlai/kanzure/etc all fucking day long. ☟︎

a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 23:52 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835506 << indeed, and it is quite a wonder i'm still about, right, seeing how slave mutiny could result in my being strangled overnight and therefore it already has. this is mp coming to you loud and clear from the afterlyf ?

a111: Logged on 2017-03-29 17:15 mircea_popescu: but anyway, back to the upstream : https://archive.is/9zD8D#selection-9.3336-9.4865 the whole thing is rather damaging of bernstein's own standing and credibility. he engages in this sort of behaviours, he isn't much of a man, and certainly the sordid tale of his misbehaviour disabused me of any intention of rating him on the basis of his work.

a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 13:35 asciilifeform: diana_coman: asciilifeform's pov re the retardation of 'open sores' , rms et al, is that they are tards not because they throw open the coad to allcomers but because they have no concept of wot , therefore were unable to conceptualize vtronics .

deedbot: mircea_popescu rated ave1 2 at 2018/05/17 04:02:57 << produced the holy grail : http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-15#1813760

deedbot: mircea_popescu rated spyked 2 at 2017/08/19 17:53:59 << aka Lucian Mogosanu, arm guy and other things. e-known him for years.

deedbot: mircea_popescu rated lobbes 3 at 2017/02/08 17:11:19 << eulora logs + auction bot, and altogether a very solid lordship candidate.

a111: Logged on 2018-07-05 16:40 mircea_popescu: current gear can't deal with pulse piracy

a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 17:04 diana_coman: the overall idea is to pay authors of clients based on how much their clients are actually used

a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 13:36 diana_coman: it can of course dig into binaries and get the hashes from A or B and then pretend their own code IS A or B but ..so what? i.e. author of A or B will get more money, is that bad?

a111: Logged on 2018-07-17 13:35 diana_coman: it can compile it as much as it wants, server won't answer for one thing

asciilifeform: diana_coman: the http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-17#1835553 formulation suggested 'protection mechanism', but i guess i've nfi ☝︎