tmsr - Search: i

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asciilifeform: ave1 are you gonna bake one ? someone's gotta, and i will with own hands if no one has it ☟︎

asciilifeform: would also like to see wtf i did to the -j32 thing

asciilifeform: realized when i woke up that really oughta have first tried plain-old sjljistic ave1-gnat , and see if this cure is even necessary there

asciilifeform: ( the fact that diana_coman's built in ~1h, suggests that i broke my local config there )

asciilifeform: i'ma put whole thing in a signed manifest

asciilifeform: ave1: i changed mine to work from local copy of the tars, back when first tested. is there anyffin else new in the sept. ver.?

diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-18#1897858 -> ah, so broken links were only in the older versions? anyway: ave1 please do me a favour and point any fetch/download scripts to a mirror of the stuff on your own website, there is no way around this. For one thing I'd much rather download from a republican site and for the other as experience has already amply shown, any external site WILL move them, change them, drop them and it will at best br ☝︎☟︎

ave1: also, I was working on the september version, but I'm currenlty stuck on the aarch64 port, something with the jmps, files being undefined etc.

asciilifeform was in a public place where tv on the wall, and guess what was shown : mccain. apparently not dead enuff ( 'freshly uncrated' taped blather, near as i could tell. )

asciilifeform: ( this is where i point out, that the fabled 'sane iron' isn't simply a purely aesthetic win to ticke asciilifeform's aestheticles, but in fact substantially cuts down on the complexity of ~all other sane items~ that are to stand on top of it )

asciilifeform: re bolix back end, i suspect it aint very useful as starting point, because was far ~too easy~ item , in that the iron per se was sane (i.e. performed bounds and type checks, so much of what gcc is stuck doing in soft, was unnecessary ) ☟︎

asciilifeform: (i.e. ~readable)

asciilifeform: but i suspect ~those~ are all stolen gcc inside.

asciilifeform: funnily enuff, i suspect there are a grand total of ~two~ ada back ends in existence : 1) the Official adacorpse one , sewed out of gcc ( the 'fsf gnat' is simply old copy of same )

BingoBoingo: That's all I've got to guess atm

BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> i'm still curious what mircea_popescu thinks of as 'ada machine' << 128 bit MIPS 1, 2, 8, or 72 cores at 800, 1600, or 3200 mhz when purpose backed. Otherwise 128 bit for the UCI address space.

BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I'm "knocking" on a few doors. The "polite way" hasn't been very productive, so the rapeful way is appearing very necessary. Haven't hear anything from the "Proud Boys", excess of ego appears to be a defect of the dwindling population of forum operators.

asciilifeform: i linked the udp thing for a reason -- wrappers inescapably look like 'chunk of c', cuz headerola.

mircea_popescu: though if possible, i'd just move the wrappers to ada first.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: thinking about it, kernel is really the starting point for 'get c the hell off the box' -- the e.g. 20% of gnat's standard lib that's in c, is in c strictly cuz of reason illustrate in http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=udp , i.e. that kernel api doesn't eat sane (e.g. bounded array) parameters, demands liquishit c-istic buffers

asciilifeform: i'm still curious what mircea_popescu thinks of as 'ada machine'

mircea_popescu: i suspect ada machine can be made with much tinier kernel tho.

BingoBoingo: Anyways, All these names that had burned out completely before I showed up a few months later. History!

a111: Logged on 2012-09-16 00:43 Bane_Capital: mircea_popescu: Well, I wish people would educate me instead of just beating on me.

asciilifeform: possibly i oughta add the detail, that $item is like any other machine i/o-ism -- on bare irons, it writes to the irq table ( whatever shape that has on $irons ) , on unixen it yes uses signals, because wtf else can you do there, on (hypothetical) msdos gnat, will again write to irq table, on boxen without interrupts -- will give eggog on build, what else; etc

mircea_popescu: he can use it to crush hymenoptera for all i care, just as long as it contains the correct set of software.

asciilifeform: diana_coman: the 1 use case i can picture for zcx, is on ultracompact irons. but even there, really, are we gonna use a http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895612 somewhere ?! ☝︎

diana_coman: I guess the main thing against it would be that part where can't kill

diana_coman: I don't know about option c i.e. whether there is something lost by going with it

diana_coman: asciilifeform, no, but obv I will have to not try but do it

diana_coman: asciilifeform, honestly, all I wanted was this game! lol

asciilifeform: i expect that i'm even doomed to open a book and see how the fuck arm64 worx.

asciilifeform: diana_coman: the caveat is that i still dunhave a working cuntoo for all asciilifeform-operated irons; e.g. rk is still running barbaric old glibc gentoo

diana_coman: re glibc: until now I saw it as tolerated until full tmsr version (whatever that might be, i.e. owned glibc version or musl or whatever)

asciilifeform: i banned it for all asciilifeform-powered efforts in 2015, and dun miss it.

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i very much don't expect you want the prb 12 that is emacs. rewrite yes ? :D ☟︎

asciilifeform: for instance, emacs has yet to be cured, as i understand ☟︎

asciilifeform: i dun see where drepperism wins in ~any~ version, vs. the ab initio and 10x moar compact musl.

asciilifeform: re 'e', i can't picture what'd move anyone with two neurons to rub together to maintain a glibc, that'd be rather like starting a trb from prb 12 (or what is current one)

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: near as i can tell , zcx is a http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-17#1897558 , it attempts to implement multiprocess on ~all~ machines, incl. ones that dun have any support for interrupts (e.g http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895612 ) ☝︎☝︎

a111: Logged on 2019-02-17 14:14 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform one of the larger, more impressive books in my parents' library was "welt der kunst". i couldn't read german, but mom explained it's "the world of art" so it populated my childish immagination for a full decade, until old enough to read it. by that time it disappointed -- not that anything could have lived to heights a kid might build in mind over years.

mircea_popescu: i actually thought this. i was still thinking this, feb 11th.

mircea_popescu: and i thought, naivity of naivities and unexamined infantilism of unexamined infantilisms, that sjlj is a quaint artefact of slow yore, meanwhile supplanted by more modern, better alternatives.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: until diana_coman's test battery, i never even attempted to use the tasking system.

asciilifeform: i dun think anyone's compressed it into a compact chronology of yet

mircea_popescu: which line am i looking at here ?

a111: Logged on 2015-04-29 16:41 mircea_popescu: you can't go "oh i don't use libnss anyway". you probably are.

mircea_popescu: some time to look at things and consider matters will be needed ; but i specifically want to hear something from asciilifeform ave1 bvt diana_coman phf spyked trinque ☟︎☟︎☟︎☟︎☟︎

mircea_popescu: in any case, this is a major decision / inflexion point, and we truly need all hands on deck for this, i'm not equipped with the right chicken darts to throw at guts / read feathers thereof.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i'm sitting in something quite resembling such chamber as we speak.

asciilifeform: it worx great with hardware. except when it's connected like on pc, where 1 hosed device can fandango over entire ram. or handled as on unix, where i/o will happily zombie out on unplugged $gadget etc

mircea_popescu: i find it works fine with people ; and it'll work doubleplusfine with hardware. let it adapt to my needs or die.

mircea_popescu: i intend to approach hardware breakage at hardware level.

asciilifeform: ( i.e. working subset )

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'house explodes when i turn on the hydrogen faucet' 'why do you have a hydrogen faucet ?'

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: unless i misread bvt's piece, the bugola is only triggered when tasks are permitted to terminate.

a111: Logged on 2019-02-12 23:36 asciilifeform: the avionics people seem to use it, but they (near as i was able to learn) dun kill tasks at all, and regard any detected wedge as a http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-12#1895456 condition

mircea_popescu: aanyways, thanks to bvt 's reading material i am well spooked. wtf do we even do, now ?

asciilifeform: ( could go on, but i sorta have an entire www re subj... )

mircea_popescu: what "ask the fellows to patch gcc, fix this one error we have". wtf, how do i ask this ?!

mircea_popescu: i can't believe this works.

mircea_popescu: i mean, FB and 00 are equally likely to be fragment of null pointer.

mircea_popescu: what, i get the luxury of a door lock but programming environment must take all comers ?

asciilifeform: i.e. mircea_popescu actually knows that it dun need a deep fryer cuz wtf , it cannot be spontaneously filled with mcd eaters

mircea_popescu: but i do know what's typical in at least some cases. which is why my kitchen doesn't have a fast food counter.

mircea_popescu: are you discussing the specific case of grep there ? because i do believe it's a sound tradeoff.

a111: Logged on 2015-04-29 13:25 mircea_popescu: "Put another way, grep sells out its worst case (lots of partial matches) to make the best case (few partial matches) go faster. How treacherous! As this realization dawns on me, the room seemed to grow dim and slip sideways. I look up at the Ultimate Unix Geek, spinning slowly in his padded chair, and I hear his cackle "old age and treachery...", and in his flickering CRT there is a face reflected, but it's my ex girl

a111: Logged on 2019-02-17 14:45 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i don't fucking get it, just HOW FUCKING MANY symbols are they dealing with here ? by the sheer desperation screaming out of the code you'd think a compile produces at least 5 trillion of them.

mircea_popescu: the problem was : as per http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-17#1897450 seen in http://btcbase.org/log/2019-02-17#1897382 -- is there call or isn't there call for such elaborate nonsense. the answer to this problem lies in the size of the dataset, if truly huge then ~perhaps~, but if small certainly not. then we had a discussion to establish whether large or small, which died on the facts, but i resurrected on culprit confession : ☝︎☝︎

asciilifeform: i thought mircea_popescu posed q of 'how many symbols on machine'.

a111: Logged on 2016-01-21 13:29 asciilifeform: 'if i make it what i think is the right size, it crashes!111'

mircea_popescu: look for yourself, i've never seen such wonders in whole lyf before! http://archive.is/89adR#selection-9.20821-9.21149

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform see, i got horse's mouth number instead : ~2mn. ie, i was right! HA-HA!

mircea_popescu: diana_coman myeah. i guess it'd take a patch on gcc, which is too much hassle atm.

asciilifeform: as i understand, it cannot be done reliably on a unix, period.

diana_coman: mircea_popescu, I'm not aware of anything that actually does that reliably

asciilifeform: i'm surprised answer wasn't '1'

asciilifeform: ( i.e. satan himself only knows what syms ~each sym~ drags in ~internally~ )

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so what should i count, kernel ?

mircea_popescu: i really have trouble believing the trillion thing.

a111: Logged on 2019-02-02 01:57 asciilifeform: i suppose will also work a++ for asciilifeform's peine forte et dure!11

asciilifeform: loox familiar, i suspect it was in a trilema piece

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i don't fucking get it, just HOW FUCKING MANY symbols are they dealing with here ? by the sheer desperation screaming out of the code you'd think a compile produces at least 5 trillion of them. ☟︎

asciilifeform: the infestation is deep enuff that you quite obv could not make above example actually build reliably on any extant unix. the entire notion of 'portability' as pictured by unixtards (i.e. powered by #ifdefism) precludes it.

mircea_popescu: you can not in fact define symbols after the fact (and i don't mean just the elf technical term -- all symbols). the only way to define a symbol is by its parents.

BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> maybe just link it ; but even so i'm nopt sure what "uch offers and promises none of these cities would abide the tin woman passing his dick pic around to all her friends that aren't him" means. << ties into the second archive link where... gossip rags are trying to monetize his sexts

a111: Logged on 2016-01-21 13:29 asciilifeform: 'if i make it what i think is the right size, it crashes!111'

mircea_popescu: because i can't shake this very strong http://btcbase.org/log/2016-01-21#1379603 flavour from "we don't know if this symbol is defined or not so we half-define it just in case" ☝︎

mircea_popescu: coincidentally : is anyone from the adacore/gnat/gnarl/whatever days still breathing even ? or 100% bolix situation, "documents at warehouse, i am machinist in charge" ?

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform one of the larger, more impressive books in my parents' library was "welt der kunst". i couldn't read german, but mom explained it's "the world of art" so it populated my childish immagination for a full decade, until old enough to read it. by that time it disappointed -- not that anything could have lived to heights a kid might build in mind over years. ☟︎

mircea_popescu: i also find caps always truthier if you have log in there somewhere!

diana_coman: I also tend to remember asciilifeform had at some point a signed build; anyway, if it's still needed I can pack ave1's gnat, yes; possibly he'd need both the "static-only" (i.e. latest version) and some previous version

asciilifeform: iirc i uploaded a signed build... cant seem to find where grr

bvt: maybe there are two similar issues that are both 'cured' by switching to dynamic linking, but currently i don't think so. i'm using zcx runtime for these tests.

bvt: it goes from crashing once in 3-5 runs to crashing once in approx 1000; however i've also seen deadlocks, which may be worse stuff to deal with than an honest crash.

bvt: i don't think it gcc5-specific, the patch against this problem that i've seen was written for gcc 4.8

a111: Logged on 2014-02-19 15:51 asciilifeform: brother and i played this on our 'Iskra' (xt clone) and combed three different dictionaries to learn what the fuck an osha is

mircea_popescu: imo franco very much like maduro. i dunno if you've looked at dood much, he's 100% ranchero guy, would be way the fuck happier raising cattle, maybe at the most driving a truck. but he's stuck with these idiots.

mircea_popescu: maybe just link it ; but even so i'm nopt sure what "uch offers and promises none of these cities would abide the tin woman passing his dick pic around to all her friends that aren't him" means.

BingoBoingo: I'll keep the tin women hasn't been meme'd hard enough in mind in the future