moiety: hi nubbins`! how have you been?
nubbins`: benkay i think you mean dov charney :D
nubbins`: moiety heya, not bad, v busy with work
moiety: aw don't get too snowed under, breaks are good! i saw your picture :D loved the heart on the bum.
nubbins`: taking a break right now, in fact :D
moiety: glad to hear it! were the other pics yours too?
nubbins`: yeppers. i didn't design the manson poster tho, just printed em
moiety: nubbins`: i was going to suggest you watch a film but i think you've seen everything ever made XD
nubbins`: haven't seen much that's come out in the past decade or so
nubbins`: was going through a real meatspace phase D;
moiety: i watched Dead Man on kako's recommendation other night, reminded me of Seraphim Falls. both are good
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24192 @ 0.00095028 = 22.9892 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 26 @ 0.00435001 = 0.1131 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34250 @ 0.00095083 = 32.5659 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.50017458 = 1.0003 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 200 @ 0.00464636 = 0.9293 BTC [+] {6}
ozbot: Bitcoin Finance 2014 - Dublin Conference | Digital Money and the future of Finance
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33800 @ 0.00095294 = 32.2094 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12648 @ 0.0009537 = 12.0624 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3452 @ 0.0009537 = 3.2922 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13050 @ 0.00095466 = 12.4583 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9000 @ 0.00095466 = 8.5919 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32957 @ 0.0009515 = 31.3586 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 2 @ 0.07499999 = 0.15 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 291 @ 0.00084557 = 0.2461 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 500 @ 0.00085 = 0.425 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.04200012 = 0.168 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.042 = 0.252 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4548 @ 0.00094995 = 4.3204 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07019899 = 0.1404 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 4 @ 0.075 = 0.3 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 43 @ 0.00465997 = 0.2004 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: vernacular [bitcoin assets wiki]
ThickAsThieves: feel free to help with definitions, origins, new words, and links
decimation: mircea_popescu: "anyway, this constant tendency to abstract people out of life is a sickness by now." << I suspect as least 90% of USG spending is put toward programs who have the goal of treating people as if they were automatons
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.0325 = 0.13 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.042 = 0.21 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 50 @ 0.0075 = 0.375 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21819 @ 0.00094878 = 20.7014 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 600 @ 0.00022808 = 0.1368 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 40 @ 0.07021292 = 2.8085 BTC [+] {3}
thestringpuller: do you ever sleep asciilifeform ? i'm pretty sure you and kakobrekla are robots...
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 5 @ 0.0791 = 0.3955 BTC [+] {2}
thestringpuller: BingoBoingo: damn you got some gems of entries in Bingo Blog
thestringpuller: Bitcoin with it's fixed maximum supply and decreasing rate of new coin generation is going to continue moving against the dollar. Any plan for a business that touches both Dollars and Bitcoins needs to be prepared for the contingencies of both Million Dollar Bitcoins and for One Dollar Bitcoins.[1] If either contingency breaks your business model, you need to rethink your business model unless you want to be runn
thestringpuller: yea but as you can see I just re read the AirBnb one and commented on my recent experience
thestringpuller: It's quite perplexing. If this experience were ocurring with a Bitcoin business this instant...it would definitively be a scam...
thestringpuller: this is the exact reason fiat businesses will die, and I have learned that tonight
BingoBoingo: I think one of the big factors crippling fiat businesses is easy access to leverage. Lets operations learn to be weak.
thestringpuller: Damn BingoBoingo I need to treat you to a baseball game this summer.
BingoBoingo: The baseball game might have to happen sometime before october ends
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19200 @ 0.00094797 = 18.201 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07022645 = 0.1405 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: Or the bleachers, depending who is swinging hot.
BingoBoingo: A kind of mini conference for those of us awaiting the gasenwagen as asciilifeform says.
thestringpuller: Baseball is a good excuse to gather I say. At least for us Americans lol
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26050 @ 0.00094813 = 24.6988 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1100 @ 0.00094878 = 1.0437 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 16 @ 0.07039389 = 1.1263 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0425 = 0.2125 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.0325 = 0.195 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 2 @ 0.14 = 0.28 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0425 = 0.1275 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9017 @ 0.00094765 = 8.545 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 500 @ 0.00021217 = 0.1061 BTC [-] {2}
cgcardona_: so ass backwards the way the US acts about online gambling
mircea_popescu: cgcardona_ funny cause i had just written an article about exactly this
ozbot: An inventory of a prison pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
cgcardona_: wow i didn't realize you made the berkshire bet
cgcardona_: now part of MPex? (Still putting pieces together)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60386 @ 0.00095079 = 57.4144 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31416 @ 0.00095354 = 29.9564 BTC [+]
ozbot: S.BBET last 357@0.00055999
cgcardona_: ah yes i see. how very cool. that site blew my mind the first time I saw it.
cgcardona_: ;;rate kakobrekla 1 Creator of bitbet.us and creator of #bitcoin-assets
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user kakobrekla has changed from 1 to 1.
cgcardona_: ;;rate mircea_popescu 1 cookie eating bitlord
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user mircea_popescu has changed from 1 to 1.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8876 @ 0.00094722 = 8.4075 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0707 = 0.1414 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 803 @ 0.00094403 = 0.7581 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43921 @ 0.00094514 = 41.5115 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell benkay` "I rapidly came to understand that the space compromised of people working on Bitcoin" you mean comprised ?
fluffypony: thestringpuller: just read your Airbnb thing, they sound truly retarded
mircea_popescu: between the "you gotta break your lease to use our site" and the "you can't talk to your customers as per our rules", the whole thing should be illegal.
mircea_popescu: that the SEC is not probing it simply speaks of how the SEC is more of an instrument of private interest than any sort of justice.
fluffypony: I'd hate to have random people I don't know and have never spoken to staying in my house whilst I'm not there
mircea_popescu: who the fuck heard of this, "build an alleged business on explicitly and directly requiring people to break the law, require them to not talk about it and then list on the nyse"
mircea_popescu: if ycombinator is allowed to do this, why aren't the crime families ?
fluffypony: thestringpuller: also I don't know if you know this, but BBVA (Spanish bank who bought Simple.com) are pro-Bitcoin, so maybe there will be some interesting integration sometime
mircea_popescu: fluffypony how about you sublet half a duplex to some schmuck
mircea_popescu: which results in 3829 people staying there over 3 years.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 70 @ 0.06849876 = 4.7949 BTC [-] {15}
fluffypony: I'm pretty sure I'd need to get some sort of special license for that in parts of the world
fluffypony: aren't there hospitality licenses/requirements?
mircea_popescu: yes. including the parts of the world where airbnb domiciles.
fluffypony: landlords need to step up and start nailing tenants who use Airbnb
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 30 @ 0.06801676 = 2.0405 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: no. the sec needs to step up and have the shit delisted,
mircea_popescu: and the ny da needs to step up and slap charges on everyone involved.
mircea_popescu: the founders, the angels, the board members, the vcs that signed sheets.
HeySteve: I had an idea to improve security of f2f trades: beforehand buyer signs a contract stating his receiving address. if the buyer gets the coins but doesn't pay (as per security cam), theft is on record
mircea_popescu: want a fiat stock exchange as clean as mpex, gotta put in as much work as mpex does.
HeySteve: wherever they might choose to meet that has Big Brother around
HeySteve: I've read an account of where it was done, I think LocalBitcoins got involved. was either a bank or coffee shop
mircea_popescu: yes well there's a difference between a bank and a coffee shop.
mircea_popescu: the difference'd be that while the bank cam can be used in court, random joe blow does not get a copy
HeySteve: ah well then it's just a matter of finding a bitcoin-friendly bank that loves helping the public :D
mircea_popescu: that's akin to the matter of finding a girl that menstruates pearls.
HeySteve: well, any recording where cash is clearly handed over will have some value as evidence, the contract being the evidence of bitcoin transferral
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell benkay` "Quixotic damn mission. There are years of fraudulent insanity buried in that forum, and after two weeks of cataloging the madness had to take the project out back and shoot it in the head for fear I'd come down with whatever disease is infecting the brains of those who seek to throw their hard-won bitcoins at unknown entities across the internet. " << that then makes two for you eh ?
assbot: Voicing DonglordActual for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: HeySteve sure, if you find people willing to post videos on themselves on your blog, you may have something.
HeySteve: I'm thinking in Bitcoin-trendy places like Kreuzberg that shops accepting BTC would provide this service
danielpbarron: the point of the contract is to prevent the scammer from pretending no deal was supposed to take place
danielpbarron: since the camera footage would show one guy type on his phone and the other leave with the money he entered with
danielpbarron: or in the case I heard about: the headphones with which he entered
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15244 @ 0.00095186 = 14.5102 BTC [+]
assbot: Current MPIF account balance on Just-Dice: 50.23038790 BTC
danielpbarron: there was a real case where a guy said he wanted to sell his headphones for BTC; they met in a place that had a camera; the footage showed one guy type on his phone, and the other guy left with his headphones
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: requires JavaScript, it's for the hipsters :-P
danielpbarron: if the BTC guy tried to grab the headphones, it would look as if HE were the theif
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron oh i see. yep, you got a solid point there.
danielpbarron: and this really happened; so anyway, HeySteve had the good idea to get the cash guy to sign a GPG contract specifying his receiving address, before the face-to-face meeting
HeySteve: I wonder if it'd be worth developing a service for this, to make GPG contracts easier for casuals
danielpbarron: that way, the BTC guy can prove that fraud has taken place if the other guy tries to walk away after the transaction is broadcast
fluffypony: localbitcoins could integrate a quick and easy mutual GPG-signed contract
HeySteve: nothing stops LocalBTC taking the idea though
mircea_popescu: fluffypony it could. verify that the contracts are signed.
fluffypony: HeySteve: the act of signing still requires a modicum of technical ability
fluffypony: you'll still end up with people losing their privkeys
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.0046708 = 0.4671 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: HeySteve actually a site like that, WebContract or w/e, where you simply put up html forms for people to ul their contracts and you verify them
mircea_popescu: make it a social media site centered around contract making
fluffypony: yeah, doesn't have to be GPG necessarily
HeySteve: yeah, maybe some on-site videos with excitable cartoon animals would help with the GPG stuff
danielpbarron: in my experience, localbitcoin users do not have the patience to wait for 1 confirmation, let alone learn what GPG is
mircea_popescu: if it were up to the users, they wouldn't have the patience for the hambuger order either
HeySteve: the thing is, a LBTC sellers who got or are worried about being scammed in F2F would want it if it existed
HeySteve: could offer buyer a discount if they jump through the hoops
mircea_popescu: HeySteve cheaper than two guys with shotguns to back you up and a new pair of spatz every time some twennysomething spaz tries to be smart.
danielpbarron: (i know they want your private key, but you can use their service without giving it to them)
mircea_popescu: you can verify sigs with the pubkey, you don;'t need the private
HeySteve: hell maybe I'll just blog this idea and see what happens
danielpbarron: fluffypony: it's kinda along these lines except without posting the contracts
danielpbarron: it lets you make a social media style profile in which you can link other profiles by posting GPG signed proof messages
ozbot: Search results for 'spagni'
danielpbarron: you can upload your priv key to them and use a password for future signings
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4935 @ 0.00095186 = 4.6974 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell decimation so what, fags were kulaks at some point. they ceased to be exactly because they started pushing that sort of thing.
danielpbarron: keybase has you tweet from your twitter account, a special message containing a hash of a GPG signed statement of association
fluffypony: ok so they can "verify" your Twitter/Github/whatever is really you
danielpbarron: which you could do yourself, but keybase is like a yellow pages of these associations
fluffypony: but that they can do with just the pubkey...?
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic:
http://www.bitfin.com/ << all the people who aren't in Bitcoin finance but would like to be, so rather than join #bitcoin-assets prefer to pretend like they matter instead.
danielpbarron: it's all done in your browser but it's still not safe since you have to trust the script served up isn't malicious
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 1 @ 0.14 BTC
danielpbarron: that's all only if you do it through the site, you can do the actual signing yourself without giving the site any private info
danielpbarron: that site is very pretty on my iPhone; this makes me distrust it
fluffypony: responsive layouts aren't untrustworthy
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves << that's a huge thing, documenting all the memes. milk, and first, best and greatest and whoa nelly, tons of them
HeySteve: it's the iphone itself which is the real risk
HeySteve: those things are backdoored to hell
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4515 @ 0.00094414 = 4.2628 BTC [-]
fluffypony: I love my iPhone. but then again, I primarily use it as a phone. I do a bit of browsing and play games and have a bunch of apps of various utility, but I don't use it for anything I would consider sensitive
fluffypony: the whole "don't eat where you poop" thing
danielpbarron: i don't even like mine for the non-sensitive things; it just sucks all-around
fluffypony: meh, I'm the wrong person for this debate, I'd still use a 3310 if it had more games than Snake
danielpbarron: is that the nokia brick? I used that thing until it wouldn't charge anymore
HeySteve: I'm still using a nokia brick :)
danielpbarron: i only got an iPhone because it's "free" if you're already on contract
fluffypony: jerbrightcove hasn't tweeted since 2013
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu I'm always surprised at how well educated you are on Hollywood.
thestringpuller: It's a great analogy you use between Bitcoin finance and Hollywood.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: "Much like .nobody knows how to make movies. was generally true in Hollywood, .nobody knows how to make Bitcoin businesses. is generally true in Bitcoin." << I wish designers weren't as "uppity" these days. It's surprising that a designer straight out of school thinks they know how to "change the world" better than their predecessors who have been doing it for decades, yet these baby designers ha
ozbot: Twitter / kiwiiiduck: changed "analogy" to autocorrect ...
assbot: Voicing JoshG for 30 minutes.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6879 @ 0.00095264 = 6.5532 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 1 @ 0.14 BTC
mircea_popescu: heh, just had a business idea. rent garages in first home neighbourhoods, buy crap for the people doing pond shops, abandoned storage container auctions, police confiscation auctions etc
mircea_popescu: a pepper mill that retails for $25 at Bed Bath & Beyond could be yours for 35 cents and moved on to a 28yo fuckwit that just bought a diamond ring and a mortgage for the low low price of $5.
mircea_popescu: perfect fambly business, your gf could keep a network of friendly garage owners to rent from, your other gf could spend all her time doing one garage a day for five days a week, you can handle the buying and logistics.
mircea_popescu: probably beats prostitution, especially if your two gfs are ugly.
punkman: seems like a US thing to me
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2790 @ 0.00095354 = 2.6604 BTC [+]
jurov: ah that i get it. need coffee
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 450 @ 0.0002272 = 0.1022 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6883 @ 0.00095354 = 6.5632 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: i really can't believe i came back from smoking and read that
jurov: here it works in exactly opposite manner
jurov: gypsies drive around and annoy everyone with recorded messages:
punkman: they do free garbage removal here, pick up old washing machines or whatever for scrap
jurov: Citizens! We buy old watches, pictures, scrap metal. Citizens, please make yourself heard!
thestringpuller: curious. how do you know so much about American culture mircea_popescu ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 1196 @ 0.00020965 = 0.2507 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 16 @ 0.06933582 = 1.1094 BTC [+]
jurov: he spent several years there
assbot: Voicing Skirmant for 30 minutes.
assbot: Voicing akstunt600 for 30 minutes.
cazalla: mircea_popescu: $5? tell him's dreamin'
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12456 @ 0.0009526 = 11.8656 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5850 @ 0.00094816 = 5.5467 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13100 @ 0.0009498 = 12.4424 BTC [+] {2}
fluffypony: has anyone been following the Bytecoin/CryptoNote thing?
ozbot: [BCN] Uncovering CryptoNote technology and Bytecoin BCN FAQ
fluffypony: apparently it's been around since April 2012 (according to the genesis block)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30710 @ 0.00094648 = 29.0664 BTC [-] {3}
fluffypony: and everyone just woke up to its existence
fluffypony: "everyone" by some definition of everyone
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12545 @ 0.0009425 = 11.8237 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Voicing Vexual for 30 minutes.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17645 @ 0.00094193 = 16.6204 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Voicing rithm for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller> curious. how do you know so much about American culture mircea_popescu ? << i lived there, remember ? i live with us born chicks, too.
mircea_popescu: A: "An open-source technology and concepts for the cryptocurrencies of the future" as stated on the website. Also, CN developers state it clearly that they are not a coin itself, but rather a technological concept that allows creation of new cryptocurrencies.
Vexual: :) okay. how was your party?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9405 @ 0.00094688 = 8.9054 BTC [+]
fluffypony: [12:59:30] Rias signed on at 08 April 2014 at 12:27:14 PM SAST and has been idle for 1 week, 7 hours, 22 minutes, 48 seconds
fluffypony: "This whole story is quite strange and is getting stranger and stranger with each new fact about this cryptonote and bytecoin-bcn. I've started this topic to summarize all information that we have today. I feel like the best solution is faq with proof-links."
Vexual: whats cryptonaot? ive got 2 months or reading to do
mircea_popescu: "We propose a new memory-bound algorithm for the proof-of-work pricing function. It relies on random access to a slow memory and emphasizes latency dependence. As opposed to scrypt every
mircea_popescu: new block (64 bytes in length) depends on all the previous blocks. As a result a hypothetical “memory-saver” should increase his calculation speed exponentially."
fluffypony: similar to scrypt-n, with that the n-factor is based on the previous block
Vexual: how many sha 256 computers are there?
Vexual: is stuff with names like dragon you get off aliexpress
fluffypony: AliExpress is a nice way to overpay for something and spend 3 months waiting for it
mircea_popescu: fluffypony apparently you weren't the only one looking at this, and apparently we don't think very much of it.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: I just heard about it today
fluffypony: so I don't know enough to form an opinion yet
Vexual: were you making it rain altcoin?
mircea_popescu: a there it is. Vexual Difficulty 129,782.79 next 354,280.61
Vexual: that makes me feel good about unspent 3xx blox
assbot: Voicing belcher for 30 minutes.
ozbot: Iggy Azalea - Work (Explicit) - YouTube
assbot: Voicing Vexual for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: lol @ these idiots. mandatory eh ? no i mean MANDATORY
punkman: I bought a 1TH mining contract to get some ATC, but seems like the guy screwed me
punkman: because it's been like a month
mircea_popescu: did he at least entertain you periodically with stories ?
cazalla: indians are good that way, their relatives are always in hospital
fluffypony: moiety: wife's baking cookies after I showed her your bears
fluffypony: she runs two of the business units in the group - salonsupplystore.co.za and sexybikinis.co.za
ozbot: The Coming Demise of the Altcoins (And What You Can Do to Hasten It)
mircea_popescu: basically everything the mises circle releases paints them more like pretentious ignoramuses.
☟︎ mircea_popescu: leaving aside for a second their complete inability TO FUCKING QUOTE.
fluffypony: what is the mises circle? investor group?
mircea_popescu: fluffypony nah, some academia derps who'd like to you know, matter.
mircea_popescu: roughly the equivalent of the vc circuit making "bitcoin finance" cons and "bitcoin foundations" and whatnot.
mircea_popescu: The Mises Circle was founded in January 2012 by Michael Goldstein, George McHugh, and Jose Niño, to provide a forum for scholarship in the Austrian economic tradition at the University of Texas at Austin.
pankkake: I fail to see what's wrong with the article
pankkake: though it's only obvious things
pankkake: obvious isn't exactly obvious for altcoiners
mircea_popescu: pankkake the notion that altcoins "will die", for instance.
mircea_popescu: it's not unlike to german heer derping about how tanks will make infantry obsolete.
pankkake: they'll be increasingly less relevant, not more
mircea_popescu: their relevancy will wax and wane with government activity.
mircea_popescu: the more govts derp, the more relevant they become. the less govts derp, the more they seem to fade.
mircea_popescu: anyway, basically that entire article is a poor rewrite of trilema material, by people who aren't quite smart enough or informed enough to be doing it.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22955 @ 0.00094427 = 21.6757 BTC [-] {2}
peterl: simple thermodynamics: altcoins exist, so some non-zero value must be in them.
fluffypony: pankkake: well what if a government outlaws Bitcoin but doesn't mention other cryptocurrencies? or they suddenly start locking people up because they can identify them, and then stuff like this Bytecoin thing with its ring signatures suddenly become appealing to people?
pankkake: what's obviously discussed here is altcoins that are simple bitcoin forks
pankkake: I'm not sure why I even try, you just decided to be dumb today
fluffypony: people are also stupid - I've had an argument with a friend in Cape Town who was considering accepting crypto at his store
fluffypony: and he goes "I'm going to accept Litecoin because it confirms faster, I don't want to keep customers waiting for Bitcoin confirmations"
mircea_popescu: <pankkake> what's obviously discussed here is altcoins that are simple bitcoin forks << no, i was discussing in general.
mircea_popescu: if people want do discuss "simple forks of bitcoin" they're well advised to make their title read "simple forks of bitcoin"
fluffypony: "Danny = British gubmint. Ukyo = US gubmint. Mark = French gubmint."
fluffypony: clearly I'm the South African gubmint plant
mircea_popescu: Even beyond these political and economic incentives, there is a process of cultural dekulakization: look no further than the young poor Whites who now call each other “nigga”.
mircea_popescu: i figure someone somewhere is definitely rubbing one off to the sound of white chattel going "ma nigga!"
fluffypony: I can see Justin Timberlake doing that
assbot: Voicing equex for 30 minutes.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: "[13:45:19] <+pankkake> I'm not sure why I even try, you just decided to be dumb today"
fluffypony: ya know, maybe altcoins will eventually be like those in-store reward credits you get
fluffypony: more of a branding thing than anything else, with the advantage that they can be re-sold more easily than store credit
fluffypony: what are your thoughts on altcoins, mircea_popescu?
mircea_popescu: wasn't i defending litecoin earlier on the grounds that it's good to have ?
mircea_popescu: i don't like obvious scams, a la doge / aurora / keisercoin / what have you
peterl: now that TAT is out of MPIF, who is going to be the spread manager?
HeySteve: bobby lee has been proposed for "election" to bitcoin foundation board
HeySteve: god they're still going on about redlisting
mircea_popescu: it's beyond me what the chinese are doing buying this crap
bounce: somebody cook up a "not affiliated with the bitcoin foundation at all"-banner, just to show how supportive you are of that bunch
bounce: well, there's the government, and there's getting things done. the chinese appear to be quite used to the former getting in the way of the latter.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18272 @ 0.00094668 = 17.2977 BTC [+]
HeySteve: on the plus side it's make things more international, the foundation being very US-centric is a common criticism
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15550 @ 0.00094935 = 14.7624 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 8 @ 0.0321 = 0.2568 BTC [-]
ozbot: Starting a new FPGA mining farm/contract Cognitive Resurrected on[Havelock]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9650 @ 0.00094668 = 9.1355 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0692 = 0.346 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.032599 = 0.326 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8255 @ 0.00094668 = 7.8148 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 7 @ 0.0326 = 0.2282 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7600 @ 0.00095057 = 7.2243 BTC [+] {2}
HeySteve: “Bitcoin protocol is like an app store and Bitcoin is an app. Right now developers like us are pioneering new financial tools and utilities that are going to be added to the 'app store' – financial services like escrow and contracts.”
HeySteve: wow plz gief 1st escrow service ever
HeySteve: dunno if anyone heard of these comtracks either?
ozbot: Newnote Financial: pioneering crypto-currency transactions as online currencies set to change the fa
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18388 @ 0.00095082 = 17.4837 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0326 = 0.163 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0425 = 0.2125 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-]
fluffypony: kakobrekla: pffft, financials, who needs them!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0326 = 0.163 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.04230001 = 0.2115 BTC [-] {3}
fluffypony: HeySteve: "6 or 7 terahashes" - so like two ASICs?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 11 @ 0.0742218 = 0.8164 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.0326 = 0.163 BTC [+]
fluffypony: why do they need “six 10 tonne AC units" for that?
kakobrekla: i dunno if you have been following the thread, but so far he spent more time typing out "im sorry theres no financial will do them asap" than it would took to actually make them
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 11 @ 0.042 = 0.462 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.0325995 = 0.1956 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: Anti Bitcoin Foundation banners pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
kakobrekla: t shirt should say "the first, the biggest, the best." nubbins` go!
HeySteve: I think I'm just noticing too many Bitcoin people talk like Gavin Belson from Silicon Valley. CryptoAIDS, etc.
HeySteve: it's a TV show about a startup in silicon valley
HeySteve: it's not very funny but has its moments. reddit was shouting to the moon because bitcoin was mentioned in last episode
HeySteve: <+fluffypony> why do they need “six 10 tonne AC units" for that? <-another syngeristic enterprise they're incorporating to save children from cancer is growing pot for SR 2.0 under lights in the basement. just my guess
fluffypony: drukz+bitcoinz all in one investment "vehicle"
HeySteve: well mind you they're in canada
HeySteve: some places that's legal there, so who knows
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.503 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 1000 @ 0.00020918 = 0.2092 BTC [-]
moiety: <fluffypony> moiety: wife's baking cookies after I showed her your bears << win! how did they go? what kind did she make and has she ever tried shortbread? also can i just say whats wrong with homemaking? D: i don't feel like this would be bad if I were producing things around the house/garden and i could try and make things online.
fluffypony: I ate one before it cooled, so it was crumbly
jurov: remind me to the banner my ex-boss has put on the building
ozbot: People have made blogs pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
assbot: Voicing SatoshiJack for 30 minutes.
jurov: "This project was not funded by Europen Union"
moiety: <mircea_popescu> [...]The Coming Demise of the Altcoins (And What You Can Do to Hasten It) << aw fuck, don't make me go into magic gathering cards now, i just made this thing work.
moiety: fluffypony: well most baked things are better just out of the oven, i have another pic! one sec
mircea_popescu: if pankkake isn't too pissed off maybe he also adds you to the assimilation
HeySteve: mircea_popescu, I have an article coming up you can add also
moiety: mircea_popescu: well apart from the derpage, the doge site is ticking over (sorry for the expletive :P)
HeySteve: mentions #bitcoin-assets and has some quotes here about that f2f thing
HeySteve: I will, just waiting on publishing queue
mircea_popescu: HeySteve the list is you know, of bitcoin/personal blogs maintained by the locals
SatoshiJack: We have made some good progress over the week -- we are now up with atc -- and doing manual processing for withdraws for now.
moiety: no i just passed out the website link a lot when people were looking for something
moiety: i dont have any alts at all for personal use
mircea_popescu: for i have a deal for you! you go gamble on that site, if you win we split the gains.
mircea_popescu: SatoshiJack mind crediting her 10k atc ? i'll reimburse you when either pankkake or BingoBoingo get online.
moiety: oh its atc? i thought it was alts in general
HeySteve: mircea_popescu ok it's not my personal blog, there's other people there too
HeySteve: but it's always about bitcoin stuff
SatoshiJack: no prob... there is free play as well --- give me an atc addy and I'll loan anyone 5K to play right now :)
moiety: im hideously unlucky, i'm not risking losing anything for you!
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: will do, just making a couple of other dimensions
jurov: SatoshiJack: 1HgZrzrURJkGCQGeY23NzXGRRALdT9qfeX
moiety: Dogecoin is the highest form of satire. << lolol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 5 @ 0.0791 = 0.3955 BTC [-] {2}
moiety: what site is this we are talking about re atc anyways
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15850 @ 0.00095107 = 15.0745 BTC [+]
HeySteve: do you guys think it's useful to have a special wallet that automatically divides payments up into apportioned shares to a bunch of wallets it sends on to?
HeySteve: I don't know, maybe donations or payments depending how the co. is set up
mircea_popescu: well if you don't know what for, it can't possibly be useful
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in the us, Engineer = 1900 Can build a bridge ; 1960 Can assemble computer from parts ; 1995 Knows how to compile kernel ; 2014 Makes button blink w jQuery
moiety: urgh QTs do not like me... ever
HeySteve: ok let's say people have a pre-existing arrangement to divide all BTC income. instead of the income going to one person who must be trusted to then distribute it, it goes to this service (which hopefully we don't need to trust)
fluffypony: you missed a 2000 Learns to make animated GIFs for his Geocities homepage
assbot: Voicing CheckDavid for 30 minutes.
fluffypony: HeySteve: multi-sig is the solution to that problem
fluffypony: Apocalyptic: if it's being distributed among 5 people then make it a 5 of 5 wallet
fluffypony: or 4 of 5 if you're worried someone might die
Apocalyptic: i think this is not the model he wants to achieve
mircea_popescu: i can;t imagine a situation where the splitting of the coin is the point of failure.
Apocalyptic: without additionnal details we can only speculate, but it seems to me he wants to divide it so that each party can use their coins
Apocalyptic: irrespective of what the other do (or rather do not) sign
jurov: HeySteve: mining pools do it since forever, no?
Apocalyptic: " instead of the income going to one person who must be trusted to then distribute it,"
Apocalyptic: except p2pool, the pool operator is trusted jurov afaik
HeySteve: jurov do you know how they do it? I'm guessing it's a bit of clever code but not necessarily something the regular user could use
HeySteve: I will know more when the guy publishes it
jurov: it depends what is the income from
HeySteve: don't have much more detail at this point
HeySteve: if the service is trustworthy, it could lower busywork for the treasurer of projects for eg.
CheckDavid: How does one become trusted by assbot ?
fluffypony: you can !up yourself if you're in assbot's L2 trust
moiety: lol "spring clean" breakups. probably bitter chicks that got nothing on valentines day.
jurov: he asks how to get into direct trust with assbot
fluffypony: CheckDavid: ah ok sorry, thought that's what you were alluding to
mircea_popescu: CheckDavid prolly there's going to be a panel o nthe next conference where we sit down and see if anyone needs to be added/removed.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.032599 = 0.326 BTC [-]
moiety: lol probably for some. the christmas one is true, my ex would disappear for weeks over christmas and birthdays so he didnt have to get me anything
kakobrekla: you know im not going to the next conf right ?
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla what if you die before you see the sexy midgets of patagonia ?
CheckDavid: So if someone has l2 trust relative to assbot
mircea_popescu: so i think i've reached a new low. i'm starving but too lazy to either make anything or order someone to make something or order a car to go to eat out or any other alternative.
peterl: CheckDavid: yes, but only up to l2 can voice themself
jurov: inb4 mircea_popescu orders soylent
CheckDavid: So only those who have l1 can afford l2 trust to someone
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform is it ? srsly ? jurov nah, i could have boobmilk but meh. too sweet.
peterl: mircea_popescu: it is times like these you should have raw-edible foods on hand
moiety: mircea_popescu: do we have to get you a usb toaster?
mircea_popescu: i have almonds walnuts hazels bananas oranges apples and etfc.
jurov: moiety how'd that help with chewing?
mircea_popescu: i can't be bothered to drink milk. i think maybe the issue is, i've been overfeeding myself
peterl: you need some IV nutrients?
moiety: i get like that when ive been grazing too much. don't get up the want for an actual meal
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i have a stack of hand made pralines, those count ?
fluffypony: over hear when I'm too lazy to eat I pour myself a beer
peterl: only if it is good beer
moiety: guiness is like a meal. i can't handle it
moiety: she has udders mircea_popescu
fluffypony: moiety: that's what makes it so perfect :)
kakobrekla: <asciilifeform> kakobrekla needs amphibious car <- is this some weird rehash of golf cart joke ?
moiety: fluffypony: half a pint and i feel like i have drunk bricks
moiety: you get a funny moustache though :{D
fluffypony: moiety: as long as you don't shit bricks it's fine
moiety: no but makes me look a bit pregnant which doesn't go down so well in a drinking situation fluffypony XD
kakobrekla: those dont seem to famous mircea_popescu .
moiety: totally tastes heavy too .. just urgh. craft ipa's ftw!
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla the... moderately famous midgets of patagonia ?
moiety: re conf : i was so jealous of your pics! looked fun D;
kakobrekla: asciilifeform id take the nuke sub ride if you come around making one.
mircea_popescu: anyway, you ever did a black woman ? how about a creole woman ? how about etc.
mircea_popescu: i did europe, africa and asia so far... north and i guess central america.
moiety version - live to pet a native cat on each continent*
kakobrekla: i dunno, the next continent i would hope would be on another planet
moiety: kakobrekla: have you applied to mars one?
kakobrekla: moiety lets have the waters tested first.
moiety: i'd take a domestic that's lived all its life there asciilifeform
moiety: now wait .. i think there is something there jurov
jurov: but i guess moiety'll gladly accept a penguin instead
moiety: i may be thinking of a fox but hang on
moiety: and yes, entirely true jurov
kakobrekla: yeah well 99% or so of all species ever existed are gone
kakobrekla: is he gonna bill him for wrong parking or what
ozbot: Sleepy walrus on a Russian submarine - Us Vs Th3m
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18496 @ 0.00094668 = 17.5098 BTC [-]
jurov wonders abut range on batteries
fluffypony: I remember making a TNG Enterprise paper model
peterl: use nuclear powered sumarine to power miners?
jurov: or on cyprus lol...maybe danny bought one
moiety: <mircea_popescu> fuck you, i'm a dragon. << lol please bash this
moiety: i did before! i wasnt accepted D;
jurov: there are other mods
kakobrekla: kakobrekla ircing lcc is no loger liable for any past or present action or involved in the moderation of this project in any way. it is fully in withing the rigts of kakobrekla ircing lcc to blame it on the mods.
moiety: damn, the way you did it is a bit easier
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform is he that romanian dude that sunk a german ship ?
bounce: ukrainian with a romanian sailor for a dad
ozbot: How China Sinks Bitcoin - South Park Style - Imgur
bounce: ``His father had fled to Russia after beating an officer'' -- such karma
bounce: born there, so, depends on the various laws involved
mircea_popescu: odessa is this russian town the romanians kept invading.
bounce: filthy texan name stealers
mircea_popescu: (the russians got it from the ottomans, and before that i dont recall, prolly tatars)
ThickAsThieves: <+mircea_popescu> ThickAsThieves btw, atc nao has a casino. /// i sullied my boots and updated the forum
ozbot: Alexander Marinesko - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
ozbot: We will nationalise oceans - EFF - Politics | IOL News | IOL.co.za
ThickAsThieves: the whole website is an html file, so this should be interesting...
jurov: ThickAsThieves: how much did you pay for hosting?
bounce: "economic freedom fighters", proposing to "mine" the oceans and free them from fish!
HeySteve: our intellectual aristocracy in full roar
mircea_popescu: “If we nationalise it, then the people on the ground will benefit, not capitalists. These big companies come to Cape Town and they fish as much as they want and then when a normal or poor person goes to do the same, they are given a quota.
bounce: so true, totally. because, capitalists are like, companies and shit.
mircea_popescu: “They take a few thousand people, then they eat on our behalf, then they are telling us we are OK.”
bounce: I'm reminded of that "computers are racist" thing
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: all of their claims are gross exaggerations or outrightly false, but that's politics for you
bounce: those quota are there so the next generation will still be able to fish. if they don't work, make'em work, not speed up the fish' extinction a bit.
fluffypony: thankfully they don't have a phenomenally big following, mostly disgruntled ex-ANC Youth League guys
bounce: so I'd say that the problem looks like corruption and that's got to go. but if you can't even name the problem accurately, then you're spouting nonsense.
mircea_popescu: bounce just take the quotas away, permit fishing only for people.
mircea_popescu: solves the problem, cause you can't fucking extinguish fisheries with a line
mircea_popescu: generally speaking, disallowing corporations from owning certain classes of goods is the way to go. currently persons may not own guns, various substances, etc.
mircea_popescu: this is silly. it should work the other way around : no corporation may own real estate or any foodstuffs
moiety: ThickAsThieves: do i have to make my own config file for atc? im not an alt person at all
bounce: it'd be a neat idea if it worked. but now we have a million fishermen fishing for delivery to bigger companies. oversight goes down, quality of fish goes down, loss goes up, total fishing goes up
mircea_popescu: bounce there's no corp that may take delivery of fish.
moiety: i just want to qt to sync
bounce: "corporation" also includes the lone fisherman incorporating his boat for tax and financing reasons. you'd also have to amend tax codes and whatnot.
ThickAsThieves: and pankakke is better at support than me, i'll look at my config though
ThickAsThieves: Nodes: 188.165.216.59, 125.120.196.224, 68.35.72.33, 162.243.123.118
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17850 @ 0.00094636 = 16.8925 BTC [-] {2}
bounce: interesting though experiment, but it has rather far-reaching implications. no corp can take delivery of fish? that's no fish exports, no fish in the supermarkets, no fish in restaurants, and so on.
bounce: so now the cook and the maitre'd are no longer working for the same boss
mircea_popescu: anyway, from what i understand, the problem there specifically is that people are stupid, and western style corps are pwning them
mircea_popescu: restricting access to essentials would allow a softer transition.
mircea_popescu: ie, they don't have or want or could support a proper restaurant
bounce: but this is cape town, where western style business has been around for how long?
mircea_popescu: afaik (and i have no clue, so don't be shy in disabusing me of false notions) it never happened among black people.
bounce: this is something for fluffypony to eludiate, I think. whites have been out and about there for a while, true enough.
mircea_popescu: anyway, the general point im proceeding from is that their problem is corporatism, and how it outcompetes their own dumb heads. the solution of pushing things further up the chain, through nationalisation (giving it to the state, the largest corp of them all) is exactly wrong
bounce: that I'll agree with. but that's politics, and we already more or less established that the politics of there are a bit fscked up
fluffypony: tbh there is a MASSIVE coloured fishing community in Cape Town
fluffypony: they go out early from Kalk Bay Harbour on little tug boats
mircea_popescu: fluffypony but how much of the caught fish is caught by their little tug boats, as a % ?
fluffypony: and you can go to the harbour in the morning where their wives sell the fish the husbands caught
decimation: re: corps owning guns :: in the US there is a well-known loophole around the background check laws - if the "owners" are both officers of a "corporation", no transfer papers are needed, and the corp owns the gun
fluffypony: there are a number of fishing communities like that
decimation: Therefore in the US corporations are priviledged to share guns as they see fit, people are not
bounce: so assign the gun to an llc and pass that around instead?
mircea_popescu: bounce most rich people with a large gun stash and tax attorney have a gun llc
fluffypony: well they fish a lot less than the corporates, for sure, but in the many times I went to the harbour to buy fish I never had any of them complain to me about restrictions or limits
ThickAsThieves: SatoshiJack.com Casino link added to therealaltcoin.org, thread updated as well!
mircea_popescu: decimation yeah that gets into various local details. same principle tho.
bounce: "rent a gun", where you rent (officership in) "gun #n llc" and get the gun as a perquisite
decimation: in fact, perfectly reasonable things like suppressors and silencers MUST be shared this way, because non-licensed people cannot trade them at all
decimation: so, you and your son want to plink with .22 but don't want to blow out ears: must form gun corp
mircea_popescu: fluffypony so whyd they be complaining to you, or what'd that do.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: you become friends with them
fluffypony: you deal with the same people, haggle over price, talk about the best way to cook the fish
bounce: might ask them what they think about this "eff" bunch and their position
fluffypony: the root of the problem here isn't corporations per se. if you go back to the 60s and 70s a lot of blacks were given "Bantu Education", which was the equivalent of like a US Grade 5 or 6
mircea_popescu: but still " I never had any of them complain" is a weak counter
fluffypony: like you get taught reading, writing, a bit of geography and history, and enough maths to add stuff up
mircea_popescu: fluffypony well that's what i said. they get outcompeted. cause stupid.
bounce: it still smells like cheap populism to me, but there could be a bigger point buried under the poor rhetoric
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: it goes further though
fluffypony: because the government's "solution" post-1994 to the white management class
fluffypony: so companies hired and promoted black management who were NOT equipped to managed, who were NOT educated
bounce: how's the schooling situation now then?
fluffypony: for instance, in the late 90s the father of a guy I was in school with had a roofing and tiling business
mircea_popescu: yeah yeah. nobody seriously considers the shit they did "post colonialism" makes any sense.
fluffypony: government threatened to drop his contracts because he wasn't BEE compliant
fluffypony: he took his gardener on as a business partner
fluffypony: and gave him 51% of the company to sign some documents
fluffypony: but fast forward a few years and the gardener realises he has a controlling interest
fluffypony: and wants to "manage" and get more money
fluffypony: which leads to the company imploding, obviously
decimation: what's the difference between these bee rules and the local mafia demanding payment to not ruin your business?
mircea_popescu: this is so ridiculous. the same principle displayed at work in disgrace, the malkovich film
fluffypony: decimation: nothing - which is why they've been heavily criticised over the years as creating a "reverse Apartheid"
mircea_popescu: decimation that the mafia works in a white majority, trying to make ends meet for a legitimately opressed minority
fluffypony: black fat cats sitting at the top of the food chain through no effort or hard work or brilliance
decimation: well, because all the white liberals worldwide thought that if you just gave blacks the whip hand everything would work out
mircea_popescu: whereas the bee stuff works in a black majority, trying to redistribute the revenue of the whites more towards the majority
fluffypony: and the thing is, BEE doesn't empower the younger blacks who have had a proper education and gone to university and are willing and able to work hard
fluffypony: it just creates a sense of entitlement among the lazy
decimation: yeah the blacks willing to make something themselves are probably the most screwed
fluffypony: also, because of BEE there were a TON of educated white guys from the late 90s till like 2010 who left South Africa because they couldn't get a job
mircea_popescu: the model is unsurprisingly pushed by the us, seeing how sa was their only ally for a long time.
fluffypony: I'm talking like doctors and programmers and lawyers and chartered accountants and stuff
decimation: absolutely. SA is now living the American dream
fluffypony: so then you have a brain-drain situation
fluffypony: where they go "oh shit we have too few doctors"
fluffypony: and they solve that by handing out education grants and pushing the wrong candidates through a medical degree
mircea_popescu: fluffypony as you describe it, the only business i'd consider running in south africa would be something like kidnapping young women to be transported for sex work or somesuch.
fluffypony: so government healthcare just gets progressively worse
decimation: they would probably go willingly if you paid their visa and airfare to somewhere civilized
mircea_popescu: decimation no, because they're too stupid to figure it out.
decimation: true; those with that gumption are already gone
fluffypony: it's gotten better - the BEE rules have relaxed, and black people have received the same education as whites since the mid 1990s when Model C schools became the norm
mircea_popescu: the only reason this isn't happening right now is that, of course, a nude teenager is not worth money, generally speaking.
fluffypony: so I think the over-correction is normalising
mircea_popescu: fluffypony well so maybe in another... 20-30 years ? things even out
fluffypony: and we're actually starting to see expats slowly move back into the country
fluffypony: yeah pretty much, 20-30 years and things will even out a lot
fluffypony: assuming they don't fuck it all up in the interim
fluffypony: pretty accurate - the farm violence stuff exists, but it's not racially motivated, it's normally just poverty and opportunistic (farmers rarely have alarms and so on)
bounce: heh. you should like a saudi arabia of suckers. high quality chumpatron at state level.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22500 @ 0.00094751 = 21.319 BTC [+] {2}
bounce: farmers typically kept dogs (or geese) for alarm bells
fluffypony: bounce: yep, but when you've got 20 guys who are poverty-stricken, desperate, and armed...well...
fluffypony: by the time the police arrive it's all over
bounce: hypothetically speaking, suppose you're hungry and poor, but you have the knowledge. how hard is it to actually start a farm (first small, then decent-sized) legally?
fluffypony: bounce: the government has been pushing HARD in that space
fluffypony: what they're doing is buying arable land from farmers
fluffypony: at more than it's worth (so the farmers don't get screwed)
fluffypony: and give it to small farmers that have already demonstrated they can farm sustainably, at least for themselves
fluffypony: and they give them a ton of education on farm management etc.
fluffypony: plus a lot of the supermarket chains are getting into that whole "support the small farmer" thing and buying from those guys
fluffypony: the problem is that a lot of the poor in urban areas just beg at robots
fluffypony: sorry traffic lights, we call them robots
fluffypony: or they "watch your car" in mall parking lots and expect a few Rand when you're done
mircea_popescu: <bounce> hypothetically speaking, suppose you're hungry and poor, but you have the knowledge <<< it's not the knowledge. it's the attitude.
mircea_popescu: look at all the fuckwits starting "bitcoin businesses", a la danny
fluffypony: and because they make decent money begging, why bother doing anything that takes actual effort?
mircea_popescu: they think they know shit, is the problem, and they don't see why they should put inb the hard work of reading the logs for a year.
decimation: well, and their government doesn't exactly work hard to dibuse them of the notion that they need to depend on them for handouts
mircea_popescu: and if you do what romania did with the displaced farm youth / urban poor youth
fluffypony: decimation: yes - politicians *PROMISED* them free housing, free cars, free education, free healthcare, so when they don't get it they complain that the politicians are going back on their promise
fluffypony: and to be fair, I understand why they promised those things - they were out of reach because of Apartheid, and the politicians wanted to correct that
mircea_popescu: i will go as far as to say that no person that has spent one year diligently (4hrs/day) reading this logs can be stupid.
kakobrekla: im pretty sure i dont have to explain it.
mircea_popescu: is your thesis that wences has been reading the logs or what ?
gribble: wences was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 45 weeks, 0 days, 15 hours, 18 minutes, and 11 seconds ago: <wences> mircea, are you here?
mircea_popescu: he was here for a little bit, but it was weeks really iirc.
kakobrekla: so you are saying like one should read the new testament and not the old :D
bounce: "gaining IQ by reading", huh. magic!
mircea_popescu: all this aside : the guy made lemon and sold it out. then is making xapo
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.0742218 = 0.1484 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: this does not compare to your average bitcoin stupid in any sense.
mircea_popescu: bounce it's a fact. there's 30 to 35 iq points buried in there.
bounce: anyway, the "hypothetically speaking" was there to say I wanted to know whether there were any real obstacles for those willing -- that many aren't willing we already know.
bounce: (don't be too smart reading this magic text, you might go off the scale!)
bounce: that thing with the land giveaway, worked well enough for those in the program then?
fluffypony: bounce: yes, there have been some instances of burn-out where the guys had one crop, sold it, got drunk and forgot to do anything else
fluffypony: but generally speaking it's working ok
fluffypony: but those guys that want to work hard are the minority
fluffypony: I know, it's surprising, you'd expect everyone to want to work hard in the Land of Handouts
mircea_popescu: in my experience it's usually the women that want to work hard
bounce: to the point that it's /not done/ among certain kinds of "socialists" to mention handouts-a-go-go doesn't always work (the /ruling/ kind of socialists, often enough *sigh*)
fluffypony: lots of families where the wife is a maid, and the husband does nothing
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 2.60965290 BTC to 7`243 shares, 36030 satoshi per share
mircea_popescu: this is historically and geographically stable, too. i have writings from 1880s romania describing the exact same problem
ThickAsThieves: <+bounce> somebody cook up a "not affiliated with the bitcoin foundation at all"-banner, just to show how supportive you are of that bunch /// check out my new footer logo!
http://devilsadvocate.biz/ assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.503 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 6 @ 0.0742218 = 0.4453 BTC [-]
decimation: In response to the question of whether the current government has the consent of the governed, only 22 percent of likely voters say ?yes.? The partisan divide is marked; Democrats split evenly, but only 8 percent of Republicans say yes. These are scary numbers, particularly when one considers that many of the ?no consent? Democrats are probably on the left, denying the legitimacy of a government that does not do more for them.
benkay: what's that, fluffypony ?
benkay: i'm entirely competent with the slang, fluffypony, it's the meaning and significance that's escaping me.
benkay: ;;later tell mircea_popescu of course i meant comprised thank you
fluffypony: benkay: seemed more fun than saying hi :)
benkay: that man reads far too closely
ThickAsThieves: i saw it too, but i was on my tablet hald asleep so didnt warn you ;)
jurov: you sleep on your tablet?
jurov: yes i saw..not very good pillow either
benkay: ;;later tell mircea_popescu <mircea_popescu> that then makes two for you eh ? << i've only outright killed the one.
kakobrekla: yes ascii i already read your blog on monday. the whole.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.0742218 = 0.2227 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves leave a sauce ion the trilema article too ?
ozbot: Anti Bitcoin Foundation banners pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
ThickAsThieves: yknow reading your slave article made me realize i was a bit depressed over the matter
mircea_popescu: i make it my job to bother people exactly in this manner.
mircea_popescu: if you can live with it you can, if not you'll do something about it, but in no case can it be that you just... never knew.
ThickAsThieves: well that's just it, it's like deciding to get a sex change or some shit
thestringpuller: except moving from your home doesn't you know isn't irreversible
ThickAsThieves: but it really is upheaval, expense, it affects everyone you care about
decimation: the time away from home is irretrievable
decimation: USG is not a fan of international property ownership
ozbot: IRS Reminds Those with Foreign Assets of U.S. Tax Obligations
decimation: corporations can be international though; that's cool
bounce: man, those are some ugly banners. like fluffypony's take though, classy and shit.
fluffypony: bounce: I'm waiting to see one in the wild ;)
thestringpuller: Just because something does not and cannot exist, does not mean that it doesn't need to exist.
ThickAsThieves: your logic escapes me a bit, but i guess i get the gist
thestringpuller: It's akin to being a spy in war time no? You technically can't exist, as a spy, thus you parade around like a normal individual.
thestringpuller: Your mission is necessary despite whether or not it is officially condoned...
ThickAsThieves: i think youve abstracted all application out of the topic
fluffypony: "The security and happiness of all minority groups in South Africa depend on the Afrikaner. Whether they are English- or German- or Portuguese- or Italian-speaking, or even Jewish-speaking, makes no difference.”
fluffypony: - PW Botha, then prime minister, in Parliament, 1981
HeySteve: fluffypony, I think this freedom / unfreedom thing is a false dichotomy. it's more like there are degrees of freedom and the balance shifted
fluffypony: HeySteve: yeah, but celebrating a "freedom day" to commemorate the shifting of governmental power is a tradition all over the world - the 'Murkans have Independence Day, for eg.
HeySteve: fluffypony, sure, there's a difference here though in that the ANC tries to keep debate focused on these kinds of liberation narratives to justify its rule
HeySteve: it wasn't total unfreedom previously, that would imply slavery
fluffypony: HeySteve:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pass_laws <- I think that alone, which was only repealed in 1986, qualifies as such a severe restriction of freedom that it would not be untoward to say that the abolishment of Apartheid brought freedom to certain groups
fluffypony: as you said - freedom is not absolute, but there are enough extremes on both sides that they can be described as having achieved a state of relative freedom from 1994
bounce: and now, of course, with the advent of schengen and the resulting wonderful open borders, you're required to always be able to produce identity papers on demand in various countries in europe
HeySteve: ok certainly pass laws and other stuff was very restrictive. but in the context of electoral politics, this strikes me a bit like Democrats winning in USA then instituting National Freedom from Bush Day
HeySteve: it's not the same as the country becoming independent, it's a holiday about the victory of one faction over another which is used to bolster support for the current ruling party
fluffypony: sure, everything can be politicised or used to achieve politically motivated ends
HeySteve: yeah. I would like to see Service Delivery Day instead is all :P
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 1 @ 0.14 BTC
mircea_popescu: <bounce> man, those are some ugly banners. like fluffypony's take though, classy and shit. << aww!
HeySteve: I mention bitcoin-assets in there as a good place to test ideas and such
bounce: "jewish", you heard the man
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: I don't think he knew the difference
mircea_popescu: <bounce> and now, of course, with the advent of schengen and the resulting wonderful open borders, you're required to always be able to produce identity papers on demand in various countries in europe <<< this was a) never false and b) not currently true.
bounce: previously it was educated yet stupid white men doing stupid things. now, well, undereducated black people doing stupid things?
mircea_popescu: "Before the 1950s, this legislation largely applied to African men, and attempts to apply it to women in the 1910s and 1950s were met with significant protests. "
mircea_popescu: i think this is actually quite brilliant. make it illegal to have a mob[ile vulgus]
bounce: before 1914 you could travel all of europe without much of any papers. now, you can be locally born and raised yet get thrown in alien detention for not carrying papers. I'd say it's currently true.
mircea_popescu: communist romania had similar regulations. you couldn't just herpy-derp settle in town cause you felt like it.
mircea_popescu: before 1914 ie in the middle ages you could only travel if you were a journeyman, or in the service of a noble.
mircea_popescu: before 1914 ie, after 1800, you could travel if you had a passeport.
mircea_popescu: otherwise, papers were always to be produced on demand, ever since la terreur.
assbot: Voicing jcorgan for 30 minutes.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12491 @ 0.00095118 = 11.8812 BTC [+] {2}
ThickAsThieves: "If the crazy ride and popularity of Bitcoin makes you cackle like a mad-scientist, this is the place for you. "
ThickAsThieves: Experience with web development (e.g. HTML, CSS, JS, jQuery, AJAX)
fluffypony: "Unlike some of those other "currencies" out there, we are backed up by and have access to the customer trust and fortitude of the world's largest online retailer. "
fluffypony: well gee, Amazon, way to alienate some of your target demo
ThickAsThieves: "We are excited by the challenging problems we face building a brand new concept of money and we are always thinking about how to redefine the way people think about the cheddar."
mircea_popescu: "650+ Search engine unique traffics by Google/Facebook/Twitter/Youtube/... for $1"
☟︎ mircea_popescu: some guy on twitter, " The amount of web traffic that is driven to those site links are the equivalent of Gold to these companies. In a digital world SEO is king. On top of this, the CoinDesk price index is what the foundation uses to charge it’s members and is generally accepted as the price by mainstream media."
ozbot: Castiga Bitcoin fara sa cumperi aparatura fara sa folosesti calculatorul
ozbot: Test Payday Loans Online to the Most Effective Approach to Borrow Dollars
mircea_popescu: "buy traffic, set X domain as referer, hope noob webmaster actually links it somewhere"
ThickAsThieves: weird, i'd say it was hidden by CSS or someshit, but it aint
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: I also checked the source
mircea_popescu: one of the advantages of trilema : i'm on everyone's spamlist. cause i write about games, about movies, about whores, about money... food, you name it
fluffypony: I think it's as mircea_popescu suggests - fake traffic with fake referrers
mircea_popescu: check that shit out. it redirects to a ... cloudflare protected domain
mircea_popescu: someone "bought" "traffic", got ddosed, got cloudflare.
ozbot: Witajcie Poland Chris Smith's impossible dream of getting me into musical and muscle shape! - YouTu
mircea_popescu: Colloquially, passes were often called the dompas, literally meaning the "dumb pass."
mircea_popescu: 5. “Jan Smuts airport, in common with the Union’s other ports of land, sea and air, will soon amend its apartheid applications. The words ‘European’ and ‘non-European’ will be replaced by the words ‘Whites’ and ‘Non-Whites’ over appropriate doors and entrances. The reason is that foreigners, particularly Americans, confuse the issue — and the exit — by tending to use doors that seem to distin
mircea_popescu: guish them from people who originate from Europe.” — Cape Times, 19
mircea_popescu: those pesky muricans ruining perfectly reasonable nonsense!
mircea_popescu: 7. “Coloured girls can now work as usherettes in white cinemas — provided they do not look at the screen, Mr John Redman, general manager of Kinekor’s theatre division, told me this week.
decimation: Re: US slavery: "At present, the federal government allocates about 25 percent of GDP and states/cities spend another 16 percent. According to some estimates, about 15 percent is controlled by the regulatory system, but this is probably low because it does not reflect the non-regulatory legal system. The conclusion is that at least 60 percent of the nation?s GDP is controlled by governments, and that does not even count the amount of economic
decimation: activity that is suppressed because of special interest pressure." (from my link above)
mircea_popescu: aww. i was rooting for "provided they remain on their knees, mouth open, left hand around lips
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.501 = 1.002 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: decimation i'd be surprised if 10% of us gdp is independent atm. it'd be mostly things like that cattle rancher guy.
mircea_popescu: ‘When we show a film which our non-white girls are not allowed to see, they usher patrons with a torch and watch the floor,’ he said. ‘We discussed the matter with the Department of Labour and I raised this point with them. As a precautionary measure — since non-whites are not allowed to see some films restricted to whites only — we decided that they should not look at the screen.”
mircea_popescu: hot summer in the city and assorted sexploitation/blacksploitation flicks ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29250 @ 0.00094773 = 27.7211 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: “I never imagined that power would remain forever with the Matanzimas. It’s just that we were the only two with university degrees.”
mircea_popescu: “At least I’ll be able to kiss Desdemona without leaving a smudge.” — Actor John Kani, the first black man to play Othello in Shakespeare’s play in South Africa
mircea_popescu: “[An] SABC records committee members, Mr Roelf Jacobs, denied the SABC ‘banned’ songs. ‘We just don’t play them,’ he said.”
mircea_popescu: “People have the silly idea that there must be freedom of the press and no repression. They don’t realise that ideas are also a source of evil.”
decimation: the trouble is that any bureaucraticly crafted policy to suppress them will likely fail
mircea_popescu: ideas are a source of evil in the sense pie is a source of evil.
mircea_popescu: well this is enough history reading for an evening. ima go beat my slaves and smoke a pipe.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9050 @ 0.00095011 = 8.5985 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2600 @ 0.00095011 = 2.4703 BTC [+]
jurov: HeySteve, in the article, can you link to actual log line?
assbot: Voicing xdotcomm_ for 30 minutes.
assbot: Voicing BingoBoingo for 30 minutes.
HeySteve: jurov, I don't know how to link to the line, just the date
HeySteve: if I can link to a line that's better
jurov: HeySteve: #linenumber, when you click in the time, you'll get it
jurov: the time in the start of every line
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06922716 = 0.3461 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00095043 = 6.1778 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 460 @ 0.00084997 = 0.391 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 440 @ 0.00084342 = 0.3711 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: Voicing dignork for 30 minutes.
assbot: Voicing nubbins` for 30 minutes.
artifexd: ThickAsThieves: Thanks for the kind words on your blog. Much appreciated.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0685 = 0.137 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.034 = 0.136 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0413034 = 0.1239 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7912 @ 0.00095043 = 7.5198 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.03429 = 0.1715 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0412 = 0.206 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6878 @ 0.00095031 = 6.5362 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Voicing prestonbanks for 30 minutes.
benkay: prestonbanks of fincen?
gribble: bitcoinpete was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 day, 3 hours, 7 minutes, and 52 seconds ago: <bitcoinpete> jurov: indeed, best of luck!
fluffypony: prestonbanks: it'll only last for another 25 mins anyway
prestonbanks: well i actually planned to follow bitcoinpete's advice
prestonbanks: "shutting up and learning until you have something intelligent to say"
fluffypony: do you know how to register your nick?
prestonbanks: i heard the letstalkbitcoin interview of maidsafe
prestonbanks: i will follow the instructions in the subject line to register my nick
fluffypony: prestonbanks: /msg nickserv register password email
fluffypony: and then when you connect in future /msg nickserv identify password
kakobrekla: registering nick != registering in the wot
ThickAsThieves: prestonbanks are you the guy with the blog that quoted MPEx's stance on the SEC?
fluffypony: but you can only register in the WoT after registering your nick
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: no, I made the same mistake
fluffypony: kakobrekla: afaik it is, gribble doesn't allow eregister or bcregister without a registered nick
benkay: getting into the wot properly is a daylong exercise if you're not a regular gpg user to begin with
benkay: backed up your master key?
benkay: made revocation certs?
benkay: tested your restoration process?
ThickAsThieves: if you wanna get in wot and get permavoice in here it isnt hard
benkay: i'm saying setting up the gpg toolchain is a daylong exercise for new gpg users.
benkay: and setting up the toolchain should be preceeded by reading the manual, but who reads manuls these days anyways
benkay: (fuckers bite, i hear)
fluffypony: kakobrekla: I like the structure it gives, but that's just me
prestonbanks: i hate those foldable manuals that are as big as a roadmap
fluffypony: kakobrekla: just checked, and you're 100% right - I'd misread an earlier issue with someone trying to ;;bcauth and gribble complaining about them not being registered, I thought they were trying to ;;bcregister
kakobrekla is right even when he is wrong, the usual.
prestonbanks: all guys talking now are regulars around here?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2598 @ 0.00095011 = 2.4684 BTC [-]
prestonbanks: i'm sure i'll pick up on the inside jokes over time
assbot: Voicing prestonbanks for 30 minutes.
Duffer1: nah just people messin with you
fluffypony: prestonbanks: your time will come, don't forget to register your nick and get in the WoT, cheers!
mod6: huh, didn't know about that page.
fluffypony: mod6: much easier than pushing everyone's RSS feed into a reader
fluffypony: kakobrekla: nobody reads the chan topic, apparently
mod6 wonders how he never looked that up
mod6: i guess i just read a lot of these blogs directly. kindof a nice digest tho.
moiety read manuls, realised it was a typo *disappoint*
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.06933582 = 0.6934 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 50 @ 0.00316004 = 0.158 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 7 @ 0.03447 = 0.2413 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.0412 = 0.2884 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 7 @ 0.0742218 = 0.5196 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60303 @ 0.00094681 = 57.0955 BTC [-] {5}
BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: One of my favorite parts of bitcoin is the mystery surrounding the distinction between NCOs and officers of Bitcoin
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: I'm EXTREMELY opinionated about that, and I fully agree with your conclusions
ThickAsThieves: i dont write much, and as i read my writing it feels very "What I Did Last Summer", so I'm also open to constructive criticisms
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: there's a shitload of account software that can't handle more than 2 decimal places, and when you have idiot data captures manually capturing BTC transactions because the company is too cheap to pay a developer for an hour's worth of work, bad stuff happens...that same accounting software has no problem differentiating the US Dollar from the Zimbabwean Dollar and the Japanese Yen, despite their integer values being orders of
fluffypony: magnitude different, so the argument is sound
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7946 @ 0.00094459 = 7.5057 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Voicing prestonbanks for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: prestonbanks: The GPG stuff does take a while but registering with nickserv and setting enforce to on is a quick exercise
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: in fact, I think I got quite vocal on this thread:
https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/3862 - the proposal was to switch to micro-BTC, but the accounting software idea is the same...unfortunately it was NACK'd because everyone thought it had to do with the exchange rate rather than reading the opening post
prestonbanks: bingbiongo; i have some experience with registering and using IRC channels so i think that will be no problem as soon as i figured out a new nick
danielpbarron: 11:51:45 <+mircea_popescu> i will go as far as to say that no person that has spent one year diligently (4hrs/day) reading this logs can be stupid. << I have been doing exactly that ever since I found this place.
BingoBoingo: prestonbanks: Cool, just remember some freenode shit is weird and non-standard? Oh, you don't just tab to autocomplete?
BingoBoingo: prestonbanks: The most important part of the GPG stuff is the key management practice.
BingoBoingo: Delete restore and generate new keys prolly no less than 10 times
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 20 @ 0.0075 = 0.15 BTC [+]
benkay: thestringpuller: when is gasenwagen conf?
phf: i.. wouldn't recommend going to a gasenwagen conf, not by your own choice anyway
benkay: well, the gasenwagen conf is for those scheduled for the gasenwagen but have not yet been picked up
phf: ok, glad we're on the same page
phf: and there's a proper use of kashchenit terminology going on
fluffypony: I have some ideas for other ones, just too busy to actually do them
ozbot: Twitter / AdrianChen: Yes. There will be a live-doxxing ...
moiety: benkay: yeah, i have to stop responding as i am reading. i saw the biting bit after. happy weekend btw!
benkay: happy weekend to yourself as well
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: what game are you watching atm btw?
assbot: Voicing BingoBoingo for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: Cardinals vs. Pirates. Was looking really good until is wasn't
benkay: ;;gettrust assbot BingoBoingo
fluffypony: on that note, I'm off to bed, night all
BingoBoingo: benkay: If this game gets much worse I might self up and hang here a while
benkay: come hang out with us, BingoBoingo
benkay: i was just throwing the notion of a gasenwagen conf around
BingoBoingo: benkay: IRL socially drinking today. Just stepped out for a fag.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 100 @ 0.06704916 = 6.7049 BTC [-] {19}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 30 @ 0.06600066 = 1.98 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41600 @ 0.00094347 = 39.2484 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06933581 = 0.208 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.03250016 = 0.195 BTC [-] {2}
benkay: o wow, phf. that's...news to me.
Namworld: Hmm, I'm looking at penalties for late tax filling. Looks like the interest charged is low. Up to a maximum of 50% flat penalty for multiple years of late filling plus 5-6% annual interest on balance.
Namworld: So far, over the last few years, anyone with BTC income would have been better off waiting and filling late to avoid having to convert BTC to pay taxes earlier it seems.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.06933556 = 0.2773 BTC [+] {3}
bounce: oh, it's wikipedia begging season again
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 33 @ 0.00648271 = 0.2139 BTC [-] {9}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 100 @ 0.00135202 = 0.1352 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 2 @ 0.07525 = 0.1505 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47926 @ 0.0009426 = 45.175 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.068001 = 0.136 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 8 @ 0.0333125 = 0.2665 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.0684818 = 0.4794 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.0685454 = 0.4113 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.0685454 = 0.6855 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.0335 = 0.134 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.0413 = 0.1652 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 6 @ 0.0742218 = 0.4453 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.0335 = 0.201 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.04126666 = 0.2476 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 6 @ 0.0742218 = 0.4453 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 6 @ 0.033 = 0.198 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 6 @ 0.04113333 = 0.2468 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.0682 = 0.4092 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 7 @ 0.033 = 0.231 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04216633 = 0.1265 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 7 @ 0.03385685 = 0.237 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0689049 = 0.1378 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0425 = 0.2125 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.034 = 0.17 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 15 @ 0.0742218 = 1.1133 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 19 @ 0.03363157 = 0.639 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 39 @ 0.03413741 = 1.3314 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 13 @ 0.04215384 = 0.548 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 5 @ 0.0742218 = 0.3711 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04232333 = 0.127 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 15 @ 0.03449626 = 0.5174 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0421932 = 0.211 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 10 @ 0.0742218 = 0.7422 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 15 @ 0.03476666 = 0.5215 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.04158499 = 0.2911 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.0742218 = 0.1484 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06700001 = 0.134 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73076 @ 0.00093962 = 68.6637 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 10 @ 0.0742218 = 0.7422 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16435 @ 0.00093868 = 15.4272 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 6 @ 0.0742218 = 0.4453 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.066 = 0.264 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8251 @ 0.00093868 = 7.745 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.0742218 = 0.2227 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06450051 = 0.3225 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 24 @ 0.0742218 = 1.7813 BTC [-]