log☇︎
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asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-11#1908303 << for folx w/out the spare cycles to read the orig horror -- classical nsaware , complete with 'null ciphers' , 'negotiations', etc lulz ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-11 20:58 feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/04/leaks-already-documented-in-new-wpa3-wifi-encryption-protocol/ << Qntra -- Leaks Already Documented In New WPA3 Wifi Encryption Protocol
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-11#1908273 << i neglected to add to this: the wider the lut, also the slower ( why -- will leave as exercise, but it aint difficult to figure out ) ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-11 19:45 asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: the sq.metrage of cell grows exponentially with bitness of lut
asciilifeform confronts the fact that he's prolly doomed to pen a ffa-style vlsi tutorial 1 day..
asciilifeform: ( picture, 1st fella to solve the exercises, gets prize, a sample fpga, lol )
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-11#1908275 << this also howler btw. 64bit sram weighs approx. a jupiter... ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-11 19:45 asciilifeform: so e.g. 64 would give you a die with, what, 8 luts.
asciilifeform: ( by asciilifeform's napkin estimate, there are possibly 52 bits of addressable electric memory on planet3 atm.. ) ☟︎
asciilifeform: see also ye olde fable re the sultan's chessboard.
asciilifeform bbl:meat
BingoBoingo: One likbez at a time
mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-12#1908306 << not the slower in proper comparison. 1 64bit-wide faster than 8 8-bit wides, even if slower than 1 80bit wide. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-12 02:11 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-11#1908273 << i neglected to add to this: the wider the lut, also the slower ( why -- will leave as exercise, but it aint difficult to figure out )
mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-12#1908312 << which is why not 32. as per http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-05#1884736 etc, all that's left is 64. ☝︎☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-12 02:30 asciilifeform: ( by asciilifeform's napkin estimate, there are possibly 52 bits of addressable electric memory on planet3 atm.. )
a111: Logged on 2019-01-05 15:58 asciilifeform: ( i.e. one would have to put in mircea_popescu's specced exponent bitness where 'Bitness' is in http://www.loper-os.org/pub/ffa/hypertext/ch14/fz_modex__adb.htm#85_14 , to get the speedup )
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-12#1908318 << dun confuse the gedanken-fpga lut thrd with the 'ideal alu bus' one. i.e. a 64-bit bus is a set of 64 wires ; a 64-bit ~lut~ otoh is 2^64 sram cells , a planet-sized object , and with 1 lonely flipflop , lol, somewhere inside its molten core ☝︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-12 11:33 mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-12#1908312 << which is why not 32. as per http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-05#1884736 etc, all that's left is 64.
asciilifeform: this gets even lulzier tho -- each bit in a lut is there because it connects to a neighbour (e.g. in the 4bit example from earlier thread -- 4 neighbours ) . nao picture the galaxy of 'neighbours' for the 64bit item...
asciilifeform: ^ astro puzzle : calculate the minimal propagation delay in this 'fpga'. ( just how close can one park a jupiter to another before they merge.. etc )
asciilifeform: to briefly revisit ~earthling~ gedanken-fpga tho : it is by no means obv. that the arity has to be 4. anyffin you can tile the 2d plane with, is a legit arity. ( and if you permit 2 or moar types of tile -- then even moar possible options. ) ☟︎
asciilifeform: http://xahlee.info/Wallpaper_dir/c5_17WallpaperGroups.html << handy ref/likbez re subj.
PeterL: so if you have your tile in a 3d cube, then 6 bits would cover four directions plus up and down?
asciilifeform: PeterL: dun even need 3d cube -- hexagon on 2d plane worx same for ^
asciilifeform: PeterL: iirc you were a chemist -- recall the 2d crystal spacegroups
PeterL: the wallpaper thing you linked made me think of spacegroups, yes.
PeterL is chemist, but I don't do much with spacegroups these days
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asciilifeform: meanwhile, in loathesome shitware : asciilifeform when woke up thought, 'i'ma quickly draw the gedanken-mechanism for mp' . went then 'with what ?' -- turns out, erry single didactic digital logic drawing thing, run in either java, or winliquishit, or is opensores linuxturd that builds but then displays blank page, or similar...
asciilifeform: hair-pulling level of pervasive idiocy. ☟︎
asciilifeform: $item is just slightly too large to draw with pen in reasonable time ( and with asciilifeform's penmanship ) ; but precisely small enuff to be a++ 'animated gif' didacticism -- if, that is, the opensores people actually spent past 20y writing usable soft rather than eating own shit
PeterL: would it fit on your whiteboard? or is that what you meant by draw with pen?
asciilifeform: is
asciilifeform: i aint drawing it with pen. and certainly not animating anyffin in pen, i aint walt disney.
asciilifeform: and the notion is esp. outrageous when sitting next to a comp, which theoretically ought to make this a three minute job.
PeterL: three minute job if you already put in X minutes setting up the capability
asciilifeform: that capability was there in fucking 1972. ☟︎
asciilifeform: and sometime between then and nao, evaporated
asciilifeform: i have entire bookcase fulla dead tree where entirely readable logic diagrams and defo not produced in pen by hand.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-29#1760910 << thread from the ~previous~ time asciilifeform tried to do this kinda thing. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2017-12-29 20:50 asciilifeform: in other idiocies, 'you are rightly observing that svg doesn't support word-wrapping directly. however, you might benefit from foreignObject elements serving as a wrapper for xhtml fragments where word-wrapping is available.'
PeterL: only a terrorist would not want to run javascript/adobe/whatever shit they are served to do this task ...
asciilifeform: believe or not, i powered up a winblows toilet , and tried coupla 'free' offerings
asciilifeform: liquishit.
asciilifeform: exhausted the (veery generous) 1h time budget i gave to this problem, and with exactly 0 to show for it.
PeterL: my inner MP is saying "you should be able to explain it with text, shouldn't need fancy graphics"
asciilifeform: it's a geometric device. and yes, can be explained in text, or in morse code, etc. but really belongs as a manipulable graphic, if you already fucking have a comp that displays these ( or wtf is it for, for lolcats ?! )
asciilifeform: i'm not even raging on acct of 'draw gedanken-fpga', it can happily live for another year without being drawn. but i had to spend fucking MONTH hand-sweating out http://www.loper-os.org/?p=2875 , and similar
asciilifeform: WHY?
asciilifeform: 'oh very funny asciilifeform , you thought modern comp could be programmed to shit out logically-defined rectangles with readable text ?'
asciilifeform: 'you thought you could put little arrows from one place to another in'em without hand-diddling coordinates for each one ?' ☟︎☟︎
asciilifeform: ftr the rectangles in ^above STILL not 100% of consistent requested size. cuz apparently you CANNOT do this with html. or svg. or anyffin else.
asciilifeform: somehow in 1985 someone somewhere had comp that's an actual fucking tool for thought, and where could go p=and(x,y) q=or(x,p) r=and(p,q) and get a set of gates arranged in neat rows and with minimal-length non-intersecting wires between'em . and today not. ☟︎
asciilifeform: 'bbbut you can go and watch lolcat fucking 4 chix 1 with each paw, at 85 hertz! asciilifeform !'
asciilifeform: progress!!!!!
PeterL: did you try https://www.edrawsoft.com/circuits.php ? Is that the kind of thing you are looking for?
asciilifeform: PeterL: it's the exact opposite of the kind of thing.
asciilifeform: i thought http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-12#1908376 was pretty clear. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-12 20:03 asciilifeform: somehow in 1985 someone somewhere had comp that's an actual fucking tool for thought, and where could go p=and(x,y) q=or(x,p) r=and(p,q) and get a set of gates arranged in neat rows and with minimal-length non-intersecting wires between'em . and today not.
PeterL: ah, so perhaps something like http://www.texample.net/tikz/examples/circuitikz/ ?
asciilifeform: would be, if it didn't ask you to manually shit out the coordinates for each fucking line.
asciilifeform: PeterL: fughet even the logic gates. where's the proggy that'll draw e.g. http://www.loper-os.org/?p=2875#selection-1129.0-1343.1 using strictly spec of the relative sizes of the items, and put the captions where they belong ? without WHOLE DAY of hand-fidgeting the coords to only then find that www browser turns it into soup when the moon is in the wrong phase.
asciilifeform: ^ spoiler : latex won't
asciilifeform: ooooor how about 1 that'll draw a http://www.loper-os.org/?p=2842#selection-716.0-718.2 , without also WHOLE DAY of hand-fiddle , and into a scalable-to-user's-terminal item, rather than bitmap garbage ?
asciilifeform: where is it ?
asciilifeform: or if it dun exist, what the everliving fuck has erryone claiming to be involved in 'computer graphics' been doing since 1970s ? aside from eating own shit.
asciilifeform: !#s henderson
a111: 19 results for "henderson", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=henderson
asciilifeform: ^ last , afaik, honest man in the field
asciilifeform: !!rate OriansJ -1 read-only brain ☟︎
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asciilifeform: !!v 78592CA40FFF999DFE5BB08161B142C60307C8645EFFE82541EEC40ED40A719F
deedbot: asciilifeform updated rating of OriansJ from 1 to -1 << read-only brain
asciilifeform: imho d00d had moar than longenuff to come to his senses.
BingoBoingo: Well, wouldn't be the first case someone returns to reaudition after a few months of reading if it wasn't long enough
asciilifeform: if wants reaudition, can go an' beg in 2 separate l1 castles for reprieve.
Mocky: greetings asciilifeform, BingoBoingo
asciilifeform: wb Mocky
BingoBoingo: Buenas tardes Mocky
Mocky: I'm curious how this works: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-11#1908041 now that I have extra space and trying to figure out what to do with it. ☝︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-11 17:55 mp_en_viaje: nothing wrong with getting +ev newbies.
asciilifeform: Mocky: pretty sure mp described in great detail how his implementation worx
asciilifeform: ( we also have pretty good description of how bird flies, but so far when asciilifeform flaps arms, for some reason dun get off ground.. ) ☟︎
Mocky: read yesterday's log, you mean there or elsewhere?
asciilifeform: nah i mean his www , where described how he goes around and chix rise from the very earth and ask to be enslaved
Mocky: ah yes. More specifically, I don't wonder about making chix rise from the earth, but how to make it +ev starting with the first, as opposed to adding the 6th ☟︎
asciilifeform: iirc Mocky was an aged fella, already had 1 ... nth , neh?
Mocky: yeah, and?
BingoBoingo: Catch girl, test girl with low risk work, follow by catching next girl
Mocky: yeah I suppose no other way than just trying it
feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/04/clintons-legacy-libyan-rebels-hitting-libyan-government-with-warplanes/ << Qntra -- Clinton's Legacy: Libyan "Rebels" Hitting Libyan "Government" With Warplanes
Mocky: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-12#1908406 << at work when I'm the only one who can answer for issues peripherally related to our project even though I'm the newest, coworkers act as if I'm some sort of different species. maybe I'm a member of homo giveashiticus and they aren't, who knows. But no, I don't expect mp has martian dna and that success in some particular realm is thus unattainable. ☝︎☟︎☟︎
a111: Logged on 2019-04-12 21:26 asciilifeform: ( we also have pretty good description of how bird flies, but so far when asciilifeform flaps arms, for some reason dun get off ground.. )
asciilifeform: Mocky: mno, idea is that it dun suffice to read how e.g. sharpshooter or parachutist does his thing, to learn to do it.
Mocky: agreed, it dun suffice to read.
BingoBoingo: Mocky: Well, is there someone you can deal with when the contract comes to its end... who knows enough and has the power... to pay you for being a givashiticus?