jurov: we have had ads saying: Everything Is Scam, Only Milk Is Water
TooTnBooT: mircea_popescu - Who do you think he means?
TooTnBooT: So possibly when he decided to legitimately acknowledge being a Bitcoin developer, he wanted to separate the fact that he holds millions in BTC?
mircea_popescu: at the time mining became really a public endeavour block count was ~20k. that'd be one million.
mircea_popescu: i guess if he never sold anything and mined a majority of those first 20k blocks he could have 1mn.
dub: oh hey, pirate is paying back this weekend
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8200 @ 0.00031143 = 2.5537 BTC [+]
Ukto: in a system.. if last trade was a buy at say.. 1.5... and there is a sell at 1.75 that goes through, even though the price is higher than the last trade, woudl you mark that as an up or down for last trade?
Ukto: cause in theory it was a downward aimed sell
Ukto: so it takes 2 sell's work to declare a down?
TooTnBooT: mircea_popescu - I was in here asking about investing a week or so ago. You criticized my knowledge.
Ukto: i jsut figured that a sale, would be aimed down
mircea_popescu: Ukto it takes the price oflast sale going under the price of prev last sale
TooTnBooT: I sold all my S.Dice passthru shares and withdrew from GLBSE, so it worked out well actually.
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla he's thinking in booktaking terms, but you're right its irrelevant.
Ukto: yeah, i am just talking display purposes
mircea_popescu: TooTnBooT so were you saying you were going to prove that any asset in glbse is better than mpex stuff or what ?
kakobrekla: Ukto depends what you are displaying then
TooTnBooT: You may be confusing me with someone else. I was complaining about S.Dice.
dub: its THE bitcoin securities exchange dont you know
dub: oh wait, theres that cryptostocks one
rdponticelli: kakobrekla: Nobody looks at the friggin topic...
kakobrekla: i come from a time and place where one got +b for not reading it
rdponticelli: Well, if you fix quassel, I promise I'll enable it again, and even read it
kakobrekla: i havent been following it closley enough
jurov: today i asked deadterra about GSDPT but he got no information from glbse at all... and that one can be solved without moving any bitcoins
jurov: dunno why they're waiting
rdponticelli: But you would be asking nefario to stop counting coins to do something else entirely related...
mircea_popescu: someone was asking me about gsdpt earlier too. sad fact of the matter is, w/o actual shareholder lists there's jackshit anyone can do.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2757 @ 0.00031137 = 0.8584 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: and that faces serious problems because glbse never used gpg keys. and so...
rdponticelli: The tickets to pirate's island must be expensive...
mircea_popescu: at least we can estimate the expenses of taaki, strateman and the rest of the scammergroup
mircea_popescu: whether it comes from bitcoinica user funds, glbse user funds or w/e else, it's the rake,.
mircea_popescu: they got like 30k or so bitcoin there, right ? btc was about 5 ?
mircea_popescu: what exactly anyone would have to be thinking to deal with any of them in the future is beyond my mere human comprehension.
rdponticelli: BTW: Patrick, Amir and Donald aren't tagged, right?
gribble: You rated user genjix on Fri Sep 28 02:51:20 2012, giving him a rating of -1, and supplied these additional notes: there's that entire bitcoinica mess to be cleared..
gribble: You rated user genjix on Sat Jul 14 10:35:57 2012, giving him a rating of -10, and supplied these additional notes: Sorry, guys, but until the bitcoinica incident gets completely sorted out, IMHO you can't be trusted with a single satoshi more..
mircea_popescu: i only slapped him when he came in a week ago to "vouch" for scamfarion.
gribble: You have not yet rated user genjix
rdponticelli: If it was not malice, it was deep incompetence
gribble: You have not yet rated user phantomciruit
gribble: You rated user phantomcircuit on Sat Jul 14 10:35:46 2012, giving him a rating of -10, and supplied these additional notes: Sorry, guys, but until the bitcoinica incident gets completely sorted out, IMHO you can't be trusted with a single satoshi more..
jcpham: rumor has it that chmod755 is satoshi
dub: I can tell by the writing style and having seen quite a few satohsis in my time
jcpham: I thought you were satoshi nakamoto
gribble: chmod755~ (~chmod755@unaffiliated/chmod755) has been on server zelazny.freenode.net since 10:50 AM, October 09, 2012 (idle for 1 second) and is on #bitcoin-otc, #bitcoin-dev, #bitcoin, and #bitcoin-assets.
jcpham: i'll talk with the rumor people then
jcpham: I don't remember now who told me
jcpham: i couldn't out my sources
dub: thats a point actually
dub: re: nefario, has anyone called the Bitcoin Police?
gribble: Tue Oct 09 22:06:14 2012 UTC | 9:06am Wednesday (EST) - Time in Melbourne VIC, Australia
chmod755: dub, feel free to call the bitcoin police :p
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1275 @ 0.00031137 = 0.397 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52651 @ 0.00031136 = 16.3934 BTC [-]
dub: theres quite enough chronic masturbation in my life already
Doffx: I called the Sesame Street police, I have a feeling Big Bird and the crew will have just about the same effectiveness in the matter.
dub: jeez, i mention bitcoin police and suddenly im getting a rectal exam
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 600 @ 0.00031136 = 0.1868 BTC [-]
Doffx: By Big bird No less.
Doffx: They dont call him Big Bird for nothing nudge nudge
dub: thats why Romney loves him
assbot: [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P110T] 10 @ 0.10637201 = 1.0637 BTC [+]
Diablo-D3: [06:20:52] <dub> theres quite enough chronic masturbation in my life already
assbot: [MPEX] [S.BVPS] 48 @ 0.00316777 = 0.1521 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16057 @ 0.00031143 = 5.0006 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50811 @ 0.00031247 = 15.8769 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20489 @ 0.00031136 = 6.3795 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5560 @ 0.00031136 = 1.7312 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35998 @ 0.00031129 = 11.2058 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.DICE] 2000 @ 0.00339998 = 6.8 BTC [+]
smickles: aw, c'mon <@assbot> [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P110T] 10 @ 0.10637201 = 1.0637 BTC [+], the p140t is a better deal, i'm sure
smickles: ;;calc 11-(.10637201*[ticker --last])
smickles: ;;calc 14-(.25780139*[ticker --last])
mircea_popescu: .py (11 - 9.72908849892) / 9.72908849892 - 9.72908849892
smickles: the calc i did isn't the break even point?
smickles: strike - premium isn't breakeven for puts?
gribble: usagi was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 4 days, 17 hours, 47 minutes, and 10 seconds ago: <usagi> We own 2000 shares.. should be good if glbse comes up :/
mircea_popescu: he owns "malicious criminal libel" in google you knwo.
smickles: ;;calc (14-[ticker --last])/[ticker --last] - .2578139
smickles: ;;calc (11-[ticker --last])/[ticker --last] - .10637201
smickles: is that not a better deal on the 14?
mircea_popescu: always the time value of an option will be a larger part of its total value the closer the strike is to current price
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3700 @ 0.000312 = 1.1544 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40202 @ 0.00031129 = 12.5145 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24498 @ 0.00031122 = 7.6243 BTC [-]
rdponticelli: lol, thanks for analizing so deeply my little trade, smickles and mircea_popescu
rdponticelli: And, yes, the time value is why I tend to buy put of as low as a strike as possible
smickles: heh, rdponticelli i just wanted you (well, i suppose it was you now) to buy some of my puts :p
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2417 @ 0.00031259 = 0.7555 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: smickles you need a newsletter for your brokerage customers :D
smickles: kakobrekla: maybe it was >1, but was lowered to 1 afterthe bad news
rdponticelli: I don't even use to look at orders books of puts of too high a strike
rdponticelli: As mircea said, almost all of it's value is time based
Azelphur: To comply with money laundering regulations we must ask you to submit documents for proof of your address and identity.Picture of your IDPlease provide a clear picture of your photo ID. For France, Germany, Spain, and English speaking countries ID cards, Passports and drivers licences are accepted, for everywhere else only passports are accepted.
dub: oh hey, GLBSE has been upgradede, quite fast nao
Azelphur: not sure wtf I'm supposed to do, I don't have a passport or drivers license
Azelphur: shame nefario isn't here, I really need an alternative way of verifying
Azelphur: unless I go apply for a passport and come back in like 6 weeks
dub: youy should get a passport and drive to britain
dub: to verify with him personally
Azelphur: dub: step 1) get a passport and drive to where I already am
Azelphur: smickles: good idea, I'll send him an email
kakobrekla: i wont give my pass to nef for my 5 smickes shares
smickles: Azelphur: i might have his personal email, one sec
JWU42: well - as a verified asset issuer this is BS
JWU42: already went through all this once - he doesn't need another copy of this that he can lose
dub: feds need copies in triplicate
rdponticelli: I'll have to take a passport to recover my fucking assets?
dub: mircea_popescu: wai?
thestringpuller: Who gets sent physical bills anymore? I have to call my tax commissioner to get proof of resident? Such an inconvenience...
thestringpuller: Serves me right for trusting someone who codes a website with bootstrap.
dub: I'd like to cut something
mircea_popescu: <thestringpuller> Serves me right for trusting someone who codes a website with bootstrap. << this.
thestringpuller: With all the money they were raking it shoulda gotten an oracle license
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of -10 for user nefario has been recorded.
mircea_popescu: i guess hisnew and legit exchange will hit the ground runnin
smickles: I just moved, i have no proof of address
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26463 @ 0.00031122 = 8.2358 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53937 @ 0.00031122 = 16.7863 BTC [-]
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user nefario has changed from -10 to -10.
dub: I read that as 'the estimated cost of a 9mm'
dub: and I though, now there is a solution!
[\\\]: So whats to stop nefario from using all of these documents to commit identity theft?
[\\\]: he doesn't have a personal bond
dub: he's an awesome dude?
dub: and wouldnt fuck us ever
mircea_popescu: lol that'd be the end all. nefario takes off with some k btcs and sells everyone's ids on SR
thestringpuller: You can find his address if you put glbse.com into the networksolutions whois
Azelphur: who.is is the best for DNS info
thestringpuller: so if people's identity leaked I see him getting beat up maybe?
[\\\]: he's asking for the same info that I'd be required to present to get a replacement state id
[\\\]: he could get a government id in my name
[\\\]: and I'm supposed to just give it to him?
smickles: jebus, even my lease is electronic
[\\\]: all of my utility bills are electronic
smickles: I haz no proof of address within nef's requirements
[\\\]: and let's face it, a picture of 'me' holding my name/date on a piece of paper could be photoshopped
[\\\]: this isn't 1998 anymore
[\\\]: is it illegal to submit false docs to nefario?
grubles: rule 4: give all ideas to grubles
Azelphur: mircea_popescu: does make me wonder if I photoshopped a passport if it'd work
Azelphur: baring in mind I don't actually have one
Azelphur: I sent him an email asking if there's any way I can alternatively auth for now, anyway
[\\\]: I would think auth'ing via 2fact is enough to prove I am me
Azelphur: I'm quite happy to auth (heck, my address is on my DNS whois, it's all obvious) xD
[\\\]: it was for 6 months or however long it was
smickles: well, i can confirm that you can't just skip the photo upload
Azelphur: kakobrekla: never said it was XD
grubles: thestringpuller, that only applies if one is afro-american
smickles: kakobrekla: i'm sure he was just pointing out that he doesn't care if people know his addy
Azelphur: ^ is what I was trying to do :p
smickles: 12NjnZTVeTJ3g5C7BqfS2aQ2rLkmwiqVz6
[\\\]: he can have a copy of my sensitive documents just as soon as I get a copy of his surety bond
[\\\]: copy of government id, utility bill
[\\\]: all the things required to get valid government id in my name
[\\\]: sure, steal my identity
[\\\]: first my coins, now my usd
Diablo-D3: [10:21:52] <[\\\]> he can have a copy of my sensitive documents just as soon as I get a copy of his surety bond
noagendamarket: data:image/jpeg;base64,/9j/4AAQSkZJRgABAQAAAQABAAD/2wCEAAkGBhMSERUUExQWFRQVGBcaFxcYGBocHBwYGBgcHhwcGBwaHCYeHBkjGhwdHy8gIycpLCwsGB4xNTAqNSYrLCkBCQoKDgwOGg8PGiwlHCQqLCktLiwsLCwsLCwsLCksKSksLCwsLCwsLCwsKSwsLCkpLCkpLCksLCwsLCksKSwsKf/AABEIAK8BDgMBIgACEQEDEQH/xAAcAAACAgMBAQAAAAAAAAAAAAAFBgMEAQIHAAj/xABFEAACAQIDBgMEBgkCBQQDAAABAhEAAwQSIQUGEzFBUSJhcTJSgaEHI5Gx0fAUFUJicnOyweEWMyQ0Q5LSJVOiwoKT8f/EABoBAQEBAQEBAQAAAAAAAAAAAAACAQMEBQb/xAAxEQ
noagendamarket: ACAgEDAwIDBQkAAAAAAAAAAQIRAxIhMQQTQRRRkaGiBWFygbEVIlKCwdHh8PH/2gAMAwEAAhEDEQA/AOpYnbKqMljLkiFKREn3Y8IA1+PprQu37jasZP57UAtY8AwHYASB4RoByipLm1VUEm60D90V8VfacW/+H1p9E/AXYv0iso7dTFLw3ps/++f+0V7/AFGhYrx2ntlFdfXr2/T+5y9I/wDbGIue9ZUtEn+1LQ3mtxPHYgGCcg61Ku8KSBxmzEAgZB11p69Lx+g9IxiUMfT0r0NQLbe9S4PCm85Lk6WwQBmPQd/M0P3Z/TcXYF+7iGtZ9US2iABehJYEt8q+rhhLLi7rdL7/APB48iUZaRuKt+RWeG35FL+6208U1/EYfEBW4BTLdVcucPqJXl7Parm+e8X6HhLl0RniLYPLOeWnbqartSU
noagendamarket: 9C3bItVYSZX6VquadYqhuzvGuLw9u6ObDxeTrow+3Wlr6TN5sTguE1h1AuZgQUDagTIP9qrHgnPJ2/JjaSsdwrV4zVbYV92sW2dszMqkmANWAOgHTWqW+W0LlnCXblpsropYGAw06EEedc1CTnove6K2q6CuQ/kVhgw9PT/NKG523cTisDcvXLg4hLhSEUBco006/GhW4u8uNx/GDXwht5Iy2kIObNzn0r0vpZ1J2v3SNa9jomRuhE1hg3lSzszFY21iWTE3Ld2yUYrcRAsMupDgcvDPlVDY29N7aOJdbDm1hrUSwUF3kkAgkEKNOUVHppbu1S8jUvYcvH5VuA3ekvbO89/Z+Iti83Gw1zkzAB0IInUABhBmIGlZ+kDem9hrVq9h7igOSCCgYEZZDDqDWx6abcUnzwNUfYczm8v715VY8vuNJ
noagendamarket: e2NqYu1gBiUxAZgiOQ9pIhgJiNZ1ojulvM+NwbXI4dwFkLASMwAOYA8wZ1o+mmo672ugpK+BkdW0rJRh1rlOxfpMxNvEBMaQbbAeIKAVnk0DmD1FN+9GLxP1Bwt8Ktx0tsCqsIfUOpI9dOtVk6SeOSi2t/IUosaINeFs9/lSH9IW8+JwX6PwbujyGzIpkqF8XLQmTpyp7wTsLa5mzGBLEAEn0GlcsmGUIKbezKTV1Rowby+dbKp8vhSlvBv6tjH2cP8AsHS6SORYDJHodT60bxuMyNBdxPYCK8fVzl00FOa2Z2wY1llSCBZqwC1Brm2EUEtdcAczlFU23rs/+9c1PPKsV81faSfCfyPY+jrkZiDXgTHOltt5rQbLxrmYfur0FY/1RZyzxrkAxyXnzq/2h9zM9J94w3JOjQR8vjRDD7cttKYkI
noagendamarket: QNQzCQTJ/Zy6QDEzSg28KZgvFuEmNIXkah2rjwEBzP7Q0IHUH8KqHXxc1F+TH00oxtf1M4YuSfGnM+73pY3z3jZHWxzmC5VZAnlqB8adMNsEGRmIgnp/mpLm7X7/wAq+Z0+PLCevRa/FR7suTHKNaq/I5hc28XlgPqrAEEqRmJ5QMsmW1jsKr43EXltrefLF0mAJLazqVC6CPvFdUTdqf2/kKk/0wPf+X+a+h38y4x/UeTt4fM/kcn2nthrRW1AJWGaASMzCYmOggHSmvdW3cuA4hyoZ5y5oERpyIkU0jdsSfEfs/zUq7rfvfL/A
smickles: noagendamarket: what are you doing?
[\\\]: he pasted an image in here
[\\\]: data:image/jpeg;base64,/9
Diablo-D3: I love data encoded urls in css, btw
[\\\]: quick, someone put it back together
Diablo-D3: saves a fuckton on uselessly tiny images
Azelphur: Word on the street is that when you actually give it your passport / drivers license it just throws 413 errors.
[\\\]: ahhhh, kiddie pr0n
Azelphur: the other fun part is that I'm planning on moving soonish
Azelphur: noagendamarket: welcome to the club
Azelphur: well I have some proof of address, but no photo id
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16174 @ 0.00031122 = 5.0337 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31100 @ 0.00031121 = 9.6786 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24626 @ 0.00031115 = 7.6624 BTC [-]
dub: I live under a bridge
dub: how will I recover my DMC share now
grubles: dub, tithe at #bitcoin-church
kakobrekla: thats why i commented my rating rich scammer
noagendamarket: if he donates the leftover coins to the bitcoin foundation Ill be pissed lol
smickles: someone should liberate that db and wallet
dub: thats actually not a bad plan
smickles: i don't think it would even be theft
grubles: dub, no Luke-Jr is not allowed
dub: instead of gitmo/SEC holiday camp, nefario could have his data stolen the hacker benevolently returning everyones shit
Luke-Jr: grubles: you really want to recruit trolls?
smickles: dub: ideally, yes. even taking a fee for services rendered would be better than this
dub: sounds like business plan
dub: a notquitedeadmans switch
smickles: that's going to net them a fair amount of btc
mircea_popescu: what fucking money laundering would be going on with glbse ?
grubles: Luke-Jr, maybe...i like living life on the edge
mircea_popescu: glbse is that asshole laundromat that shrinks your load.
dub: do issuers need to re-verify to get the info I wonder
dub: if I have no btc or shares in my account because I only issued an asset, why cant the email address for my account recieve shareholder data (assuming shareholders verify)?
Ukto: I cant login to my glbse account?
Ukto: nefario is really going out of his way to try to kill things
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 783 @ 0.00031115 = 0.2436 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: btw folks once you send your id stuff to nefario cc them to me too
[\\\]: I think nef should hire zhou
[\\\]: at least then we'd figure out who the hacker was in about 10 minutes
[\\\]: and then get 49% of our coins back
dub: dude this is cut and dried intersango process
[\\\]: didnt nef work for intersango?
dub: he's certainly familiar to those scamming fucks IRL
mircea_popescu: they're a little group, that london failference was pretty much them and streetwalkers.
dub: theymos, phantom, gengix, nefario.. its a scammers anal chain
Ukto: thats the advantage
dub: it sounds like like like like like like like like like a like lie
dub: that video is one second too long to remind you of me
Ukto: how much more gouging is he requiring for issuers?
pigeons: what kind of id is he requiring?
pigeons: and then i guess he needs to "review" it?
pigeons: just give it all back and be done
smickles: pigeons: also a photo of a document proving address
smickles: a photo of yourself with a paper signed "glbse" and your username
Ukto: no writing "/b" on your hand in a photo?
pigeons: its not like the usernames and passwords wer eleaked and he needs to verify
toffoo: so how exactly are the "assets" going to be returned to you?
B0g4r7: I ain't giving Nefario so much as a pic of my big middle finger.
Ukto: he's gonna make out like a bandit heh
B0g4r7: Funny you should use that term.
Ukto: pun intended. dont worry
mircea_popescu: if enough people sign... this won't go anywere in a DIFFERENT WAY from the way nefario was going to have it nowhere
Ukto: "You said just a few weeks ago, the advantage of GBLSE is no AML requirements" *link to youtube*
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19337 @ 0.00031115 = 6.0167 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10200 @ 0.00031106 = 3.1728 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29200 @ 0.00031102 = 9.0818 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13263 @ 0.00031087 = 4.1231 BTC [-]
Ukto: [22:06] <Ukto> so this is funny. in nefario's speach here in this video
http://youtu.be/vmPD_YSQ--k he talks about how you dont need to provide id for glbse. about 4min in
Ukto: i dont touch forums
B0g4r7: Does anyone else have the urge to slap this Rarity poster silly?
mircea_popescu: you need a new thread, and an actual ideea for people to gather round.
B0g4r7: I think that's more your specialty.
mircea_popescu: Update:we are currently unable to process account closures, and will inform our users when this service resumes.
pigeons: sorry we accidentaly the database and are unable to process
pigeons: can't hack bcrypt of course
rdponticelli: Anyway, as they deserve some fucking respect, they're not corsairs, they're all just privateers
mircea_popescu: rdponticelli privateers they're not, they go running to the govt way too often and in ridiculous ways
pigeons: ok then, sorry, we have been served a restraining order and are unable to process
mircea_popescu: pigeons : today when we were at the mcdonalds the waitress looked at us a certain way and on the napkins was certain scribbled something from the prevbious patron who was this suspicious guy
mircea_popescu: therefore we consider we have been served a restraining order by the algerian president and will not be processing anything
rdponticelli: mircea_popescu: privateers were often hired by the government
mircea_popescu: "The person that controls this address should be someone honorable that everyone trusts. And maybe he should be anonymous because the intend of this bounty maybe isnt fully legal."
mircea_popescu: people in bitcoin. they're the intellectual cream of the crop
mircea_popescu: mixed with a good scraping off the bottom of the barrel.
JWU_42: I sent James a note asking why he needs my dox when he has them already (I verified before)
JWU_42: teust i will never get a response
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52800 @ 0.00031226 = 16.4873 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16350 @ 0.00031134 = 5.0904 BTC [-]
Ukto: so, anyone dareing enough to send nef. docs yet?
Azelphur: Ukto: the owner of bitinstant tried and got 413 errors
mircea_popescu: Ukto it's finished, they have an update, "can't process" anymore.
Ukto: JWU_42: his plan worked for me. I checked my records, I had left 2btc there + whatever divs my 30 shares of JAH produced since may.
Ukto: He can have it. I will not give him any docs.
mircea_popescu: i doubt he didn;'t know this. it's just scam furtherance is all.
Ukto: I would be surprised if ti was that high
Ukto: lets be honest its one of wo possibilities, A. either further scammation, and attempt to conceal embezzled funds. B. Epic stupidity. At this point, I put neither past him.
Ukto: Either way, he already won.
Ukto: he doesnt say what happens to the assets and funds of those who dont submit docs
Ukto: sure he wont accept them for years
Ukto: no, I ment to accept account claims
Ukto: he cant leave "claims" system open for years
EskimoBob: but you guys know where hi lives and what's his name. :)
Ukto: at some point it gets shut off and what.. he just gets to keep the remaining everything? anony contacts issuers "heres my shares"
Ukto: and claim divs from that?
Ukto: EskimoBob: and what he looks like.
Ukto: I am honestly surprised he would pull this, after going to that bitcoin london conference
EskimoBob: so, friends from Ukraine can drill holes to his kneecaps for almost nothing (compared to what he stole)
Ukto: i am partially leaning towards epic stupidity coupled with second hand scamming
Ukto: though, its funny, in that video, he mentioned he needed $200 REALLY badly.
Ukto: he mentioned how he needed $200 SOOO BADLY for some sponsorship stuff at one point
Ukto: cause he couldnt wait for a gox xfer
Ukto: keep in mind, glbse didnt profit that much off of trades guys
Ukto: this isnt mtgox volume
Ukto: his internet was via tethered cell phone
jcpham: you know if someone were to partner with me with a decent idea
jcpham: you wouldn't ever have to beg for 200$
jcpham: $200 is a couple hours work
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9886 @ 0.00031134 = 3.0779 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9323 @ 0.00031027 = 2.8926 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17491 @ 0.0003101 = 5.424 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: course, also had a huge debtload they were paying off.
Ukto: heh, mebbe recently
Ukto: at least in may, nefario seemed pretty broke
mircea_popescu: his personal finances aren't much related to the results of glbse
mircea_popescu: they depended on how much "salary" he could leach off the partners
EskimoBob: "I would consider meeting this criteria if nefario were to provide me with a HD photo of his passport, drivers licence, 2 utility bills and a picture of him holding a note saying "you must be fucking joking" and a hot chick doing "bunny ears" on him." - LOL :)
mircea_popescu: this is unfair. how's the guy to find a hot chick now ?
mircea_popescu: if it were at all possible it'd have happened in his 20s
DeaDTerra: I just finished off a talk with James :)
DeaDTerra: We had a good laugh about all the paranoid people on the forums :P
teek: So during all this usagi flew the coop eh
Ukto: though to be honest
Ukto: for the 90% who dont give ID, etc.. how are the asset issures supposed to 'continue their relationship'
Ukto: how are the issuers supposed to continue at all
Ukto: "well, i have identified 5% of my shares ownerships. guess I go with that" ?
Ukto: what does he expect?
Ukto: what stops nefario from using ppl 'codes' and anon-claiming to be a share holder to an issuer
Ukto: mostly for the ppl who dont ID within X
Ukto: With all this, and his paranoia, ppl knowing his name, face, etc, I am surprised he's trying to piss ppl off
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32700 @ 0.00031103 = 10.1707 BTC [+]
Ukto: he needs to just reenable the site, let ppl 'transfer shares' w/o penalty and a note to distinguish themselves to the issuers
Ukto: and be done with it
jcpham: you better not ignore me mircea_popescu
jcpham: i'll start a smear campaign about something
Ukto: a system wont work if nefario wont give out everyones assets
Chaang-Noi: joelcatz or whatever his name is has covered this about 10 times on the forum very well.
Ukto: he is witholding things unless ppl give him all sorta id's
Ukto: while the code system wont allow ppl to trade offline
Ukto: it would allow the importation of the assets
Ukto: into another system
Chaang-Noi: people have been trading tygrr codes already
Ukto: any system woudl be first come first serve
Ukto: they need to contact you
Ukto: and ask you to MAKE new code
Ukto: thats the ONLY way that could work
Ukto: and i dont think u wanna do that
Chaang-Noi: well... read what joel says about it, anyone with a valid code can just call the aset issuer a scammer
Chaang-Noi: even if it was stolen in the email or hacked or sold...
Ukto: the whole assets setup is "compromised"
Ukto: he has however many shares he says he has
Ukto: at this point, the issuers and asset holders have no choice but to trust at least the issuers, or get out
Chaang-Noi: anyone trusting nefario the scammer is foolish
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33600 @ 0.00031285 = 10.5118 BTC [+]
Chaang-Noi: ukto i keep talking to you in pm and you dont respond
Ukto: im not getting any msgs
Ukto: you need to be identified
Chaang-Noi: anyway i wish you the best of luck but sadly i have to sleep now.
Ukto: Chaang-Noi: I'm gonna need it! :P
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52500 @ 0.00031142 = 16.3496 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5225 @ 0.00031103 = 1.6251 BTC [-]
Ukto: DeaDTerra: did he mention why he wants aml now? after saying it would not be needed a few weeks ago? and waht he will do with the unclaimed assets/btc held?
Ukto: i think he realised his delima with this, and thats why he put a hold on accepting id's
Ukto: i honestly dont think he's "trying" to scam ppl, i think he's just making some bad decisions
rdponticelli: He's not "trying" to scam people, he's ACTUALLY scamming people, been that his willing or not
Ukto: its always all about Point of View. someone can do things for all the rights reaons to them, but to everyone else, it can be the worst actions for the worst reasons. such is mankind
Doffx: I like the idea of just opening the damn site and letting use send our assets to the asset creator with an email or something.
Doffx: However I'm sure the reason he doesn’t do that is because people would also expect to get their btc as well in the account.
Ukto: he could lock down btc withdraw
Doffx: That's what makes him a scammer
Ukto: at least ppl can claim their assets
Doffx: Its not his BTC to hold on to.
Doffx: The assets are just a note of transaction really, the btc being held up is unacceptable.
Ukto: agreed. thats his own issue to deal with
Ukto: i only suggest the asset as a partial solution
Doffx: Yeah, it would certainly help if he opened that up.
Ukto: most ppl have most of their money invested in the shares
Ukto: not just sitting in their accounts
Doffx: Yeah, I only have .09 btc in the account.
Ukto: i think most ppl would agree to say fuck their holdings, in exchange for tehir btc
Ukto: fuck the btc, in exchange for their assets
Ukto: which is prolly worth the most of the two
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 400 @ 0.00031285 = 0.1251 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3039 @ 0.0003129 = 0.9509 BTC [+]
Ukto: if he holds back anyones assets, for any reason
Ukto: then the issuer cannot just move on
Ukto: and he is therefore contridicting himself
Ukto: and might as well just shutdown the server
Ukto: there was either no forethought, or not enough when he did this
Ukto: unless his intentions are actually to scam ppl
Ukto: he needs to consider carefully what that means
Doffx: I doubt that, he could have done that long ago.
Ukto: if he is having an internal battle over legalities of giving ppl their stuff w/o id, thats a problem he has to bite the bullet on, and move forward doing, because chose to not require id in the first place
Doffx: He got himself in some sort of trouble now that apparent, and if there is any government involvement we know how much worse they make it.
Ukto: if it was govt intervention, the site would just go down
Ukto: no one would get 'assets' back
Ukto: that would be illegal
Ukto: even if he was given a cease and desist
Doffx: If pirate pays out I could just write Glbse off and still be waaaay ahead.
Ukto: that would not require him to take ppls id's
Ukto: and the govt doesnt want 1,000's of ppl id's
Ukto: to send them all to jail
Ukto: thats not how it works
rdponticelli: But if he really is a fucking, evil scammer, he can do a lot with id
rdponticelli: He can open thousands of glbses on behalf of every sucker who send his id to him
rdponticelli: He can open bank accounts, traverse borders, and who know how many other things
Ukto: he has to bite the bullet and not require id
Ukto: there is no way it will work
Ukto: and possibly legal issues from holders
Ukto: and govt fraud investigations
gribble: Best bid: 11.97002, Best ask: 12, Bid-ask spread: 0.02998, Last trade: 12, 24 hour volume: 29194, 24 hour low: 11.711, 24 hour high: 12.15
rdponticelli: At this point we all should be supposing he's an evil scammer
Ukto: until he proove himself
Ukto: and the longer he takes, the longer and stronger the tag will get, regardless of his righting things
smickles: Ukto: still chatting about what happened 'yesterday' or is this something new?
Ukto: smickles: id acceptance is closed
rdponticelli: In a couple of days more, he's getting the -10 if he doesn't show good faith
gribble: You rated user nefario on Fri Oct 5 17:57:26 2012, giving him a rating of -1, and supplied these additional notes: seems to have broken contracts and screwed over many people for his own ass.
gp5st: anyone here interested in helping write a trading bot? I have a vague idea of financial strategies and am a decent programmer, so I would mainly be looking for someone to advise on financial strategy. Or be able to point me to more information?
Doffx: I cant blame him for saving his own ass.
Ukto: ;;getrating nefario
smickles: gp5st: i wrote one already,what language are you considering
kakobrekla: 19:07.01 ( Doffx ) I cant blame him for saving his own ass.
Doffx: I wonder how many people here would not tried to save their own ass first haha.
gp5st: smickles: there are a bunch out there, I kind of wanted to do it as an exercise. I was thinking ruby to start
Doffx: It doesn’t make it right
gp5st: smickles: what lang was yours in
Doffx: My point was more, everyone here would most likely save their own ass first.
Ukto: DeaDTerra: but what about those who cant or dont want to provide their id's?
Ukto: amd why wont he just come talk to people
smickles: gp5st: well, actually i wrote one in java and the other in python, python worked out better
Ukto: thats the worst part
Ukto: is that he wont talk to people
gp5st: smickles: how come the python bot worked better?
Ukto: he should have throught it through alot more thouughly then just pulling the plug
Doffx: Maybe I used the wrong words.
gp5st: smickles: i thought it would be a fun exercise and an opportunity to learn more about trading in general
Ukto: i agree, screw forums heh
Ukto: but still, if he came here of all places
smickles: gp5st: because java ate memory like nothing else, and the mechanize library in python made things a lot easier, i think ruby has mechanize too
Ukto: and said "hey guys, i am shutting down for legal reasons. and working on a plan"
Ukto: ppl would be alot more understanding
Ukto: now its making him into more of a criminal
Ukto: because it was not handled right
gp5st: smickles: gotchya. it does
Ukto: he does have limited internet, i agree with that
Doffx: Its always the lack of information I hate.
Ukto: if he had even spent 5 minutes writing a paragraph on glbse
Doffx: No one knows what the hell is going on.
gp5st: smickles: where did you find various strategies to implement?
Ukto: ppl would have been more willing
Ukto: DeaDTerra: can you blame teh community for treating someone who is acting like a sscammer, as a scammer?
Ukto: the problem is, the website goes offline
smickles: gp5st: mostly i was reading various financial articles, academic stuff which I found in a university library
Ukto: then he tells ppl to go trhough near impossible hoops
Ukto: and gives no details
gp5st: smickles: yeah, my next step was the libary
smickles: gp5st: then I started coming up with my own ideas based on theose and observed the market closly for some time
Ukto: iwhen i saw glbse went down
Ukto: i went to email nefario to ask if I could help
Ukto: as i have tried to help in the past
smickles: gp5st: bitcoin's marked is small, so look at analisys of penny stocks in the academic papers, good stuff
Ukto: i think its great that he talked to you
Ukto: the problem with that, is he didnt give anything to work with
knotwork: gp5st an interesting strategy I would like to have bot try would be keep an average price a given thing has cost so far per unit for what it has of it so far, and buy any it can afford that are cheaper
knotwork: obviously not a really active strategy and likely to buy too soon when price falls so maybe not very good
knotwork: but then could maybe be improved by buyung only with part of its spending-money
knotwork: so it would get to buy little bits at a time as price falls
Ukto: DeaDTerra: death threats or not, he needs to be more open and communative
Ukto: thats te bottom line
Ukto: or it will make things worse
Ukto: hiding, and staying quite wont help him get less threats
Ukto: and be less of a target
knotwork: a defnsive strategy basically, not aggreessive at all
Ukto: he is damned if he does, and damned if he doesnt
Ukto: his lawyer should have told him that
Doffx: How is he backed in to a corner?
Ukto: possible govt actions
Doffx: Unless a lawyer is saying dont say a word or something
Ukto: or possible asset holder actions
Doffx: He doesn’t give a flying fuck about the btc community right now I'm sure
Ukto: but he has, he has relayed via you
Ukto: would you not testify in court taht you talked to him?
Doffx: If hes in legal hot water hes looking at saving himself first, this was my point from before.
Ukto: so if they bring ou phone records, you would deny their existance?
knotwork: it also would not "make" money so its purpose would be its who you give your investment budget to, it spends that budget only if doing so results in it got a lower average price for what it bought
Doffx: Do you know that for sure?
Ukto: sore ppl who have 10,000$ invested, who dont trust him with their id's and want to sue him, or open govt fraud investigations on him, is not putting him in legal hot water?
Doffx: If hes not then where the hell is he?
Ukto: or life threatening situations?
knotwork: it would have been slaugtered on GLBSE though as everything just went into free-fall forever unto worthlessness ;)
gp5st: smickles: in your experience what would be a "successful" weekly ROI? 0.1%?
Ukto: DeaDTerra: no lawyer would tell you that a bitcoin X is illegal. they woudl advise aginst it, and tell you that your asking for trouble.
gp5st: smickles: i would probably keep it up for a while. It'll hopefully still be up in a year
Ukto: if you ask a lawyer "is using bitcoins online illegal" they will advise you aginst it, and that it may be illegal, and land you in jail
smickles: gp5st: well, on a 1 year time frame, i should hope you get 5%. but anything better than a 10% loss is good
gp5st: smickles: :-p thanks for the encouragment:)
Ukto: there is no presidence
Ukto: DeaDTerra: if you do know him that well, you also know he's super paranoid
Ukto: so a lawyer saying "you are at risk" woudl be enough to cause this
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19377 @ 0.0003129 = 6.0631 BTC [+]
Ukto: doesnt have to be "you are seriously at risk"
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2516 @ 0.00031329 = 0.7882 BTC [+]
knotwork: if you ask a lowyer if running a web based business at all is illegal they might well advise that if you have to ask, then maybe it is, and probe as to what exactly about what you plan to do is something you think might be illegal and why
Ukto: i agree 100% with that
Ukto: and unfortnately depending on the govt you get fucked by gray
Ukto: they determine that its illegal, and then youg et fucked, w/o a chacne to end it
Ukto: other countries will determine it is illegal, and then demand it stopped
Ukto: will determin illegalness
Ukto: and leave the site up, and not re-visit the legality of it *cough(piratebay)cough*
smickles: how is bitcoin itself legally gray?
Ukto: smickles: depending on your country
smickles: Ukto: oh yea, probably a no-go in iran or something
Ukto: btw DeaDTerra, mebbe you can tell me. somoene told me the pirate bay owner was 'released' from jail, and its good to go now. but others told me that he 'escaped'? wtf?
Ukto: smickles: defenitly
Ukto: was another guy jailed, and then released?
Ukto: was told one guy only had to do some 1month in jail, cause of the court time, etc
Ukto: (hell, if i coudl do a piratebay, goto jail for 1 month, and then its good to go. that would be epic(
jurov: apparently bitcoin magazine has some "internal sources"
jurov: or they had seen glbse shareholder meeting minutes
jurov: i learn new things every day </sarcasm>
Doffx: Ok this made me laugh
Doffx: mpex is a guy trading shares with himself.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27111 @ 0.00031243 = 8.4703 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9303 @ 0.00031212 = 2.9037 BTC [-]
Cylta: ;;everify freenode:#bitcoin-otc:e805fee2ec5c5fcf00e1156e189a310ca41f84a038b49e8e0f0b1e97
gribble: You are now authenticated for user Cylta with key 35E361F6B371D52E
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6175 @ 0.00031103 = 1.9206 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25866 @ 0.0003101 = 8.021 BTC [-]
knotwork: smickles, are you settled in after moving yet?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28100 @ 0.00031155 = 8.7546 BTC [+]
EskimoBob: so, scammer usagi has left the building for good? I bet he has a new username and he is lurking here right now :)
Doffx: Why would he need to do that?
Doffx: Not like he has glbse down, seems silly.
pigeons: maybe he's just putting in overtime at work to repay the two month advance he took to help his assets
jcpham: who took a 2 month advance
Eisenhower34: Has there anything happennd i wasnt aware of? Last I heard was that EskimoBob was the one who deserved that scammer tag for not keeping his word
pigeons: yeah, basically usagi overvalued assets, made backdoor deals, and closed out the collateral fund for his CDO, but who cares now right
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33037 @ 0.00031152 = 10.2917 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5086 @ 0.00031155 = 1.5845 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20977 @ 0.00031208 = 6.5465 BTC [+]
EskimoBob: Eisenhower34: I think there was 2 or 3 threads demanding a scammer tag for usagi. Exchange went belly up and he was home free. Now he is gone.
EskimoBob: he hated me with passion :) because I understood how full of shit he is and did not keep my mouth shut about it. fkn scumbag and a liar he is
smickles: knotwork: not quite, the majority of our stuff is arranged to be delivered on the 14th
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15223 @ 0.00031208 = 4.7508 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24335 @ 0.00031329 = 7.6239 BTC [+]
smickles: knotwork: but i am navigating the red tape in starting up my accounting company
smickles: *may well call it a bitcoin accounting company
WormDrink: I want to invest some of my money in shares - kinda noob - looking for good online trading platforms
WormDrink: this might not be the best place to ask
rdponticelli: WormDrink: This might not be the best moment to ask :)
EskimoBob: WormDrink: did you read about Open Transactions?
rdponticelli: Where is kakobrekla to say: read the f**** topic?
EskimoBob: rdponticelli: jerking of to polish porn
rdponticelli: But it still doesn't have a lot of thing to invest in
rdponticelli: And at this point is kind of hard to setup for a noob...
BTC-Mining: there's nothing to invest in with Open Transactions yet, no?
jcpham: invest knowledge and time in OT
WormDrink: rdponticelli, noob @ shares - not anything else really
rdponticelli: I think that knotwork has some contracts for cryptocurrencies on his server...
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11060 @ 0.00031329 = 3.465 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42914 @ 0.00031352 = 13.4544 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13426 @ 0.00031355 = 4.2097 BTC [+]
smickles: the domain i wanted was available
jurov: smickles, what u plan?
smickles: I will provide accounting related professional services in exchange for bitcoin
smickles: I'll operate out of tucson, AZ as a registered llc
smickles: as soon as I confirm the total fees which i'll need to pay for licensing and registration, i'll sell some btc for ust too
smickles: chmod755: what can i say, i liked tucows back in the day
smickles: chmod755: also, I need to contract a webdev sometime shortly
knotwork: typically one millionth of the total assets of the corp
knotwork: the value is determined by the script by adding up all that corp's assets and dividing by number (typically a million) of shares
knotwork: of course for e.g. bitcoins there are no known assets to divide by 21,000,000 to determine value per bitcoin :)
knotwork: however for CDN, UKB, MBC, NKL, GMC, GRF, UNS, GZB one can indeed treat them like shares as those nations/corps do own assets
knotwork: basically add up the national reserves the nation has with which to back their currency to see how much to value their currency
smickles: thanks jcpham :) I hope to be up and running soon
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 72100 @ 0.00031093 = 22.4181 BTC [-]
gribble: Error: 'smickles.com' is not a valid url.
Doffx: can I just hand over all my btc smickles since I am clearly not making wise decisions?
chmod755: Doffx, you can also give your coins to me if you want
Doffx: No thanks I was hoping to get more returned than I put in.
Doffx: Although at this point its not really worked out that way.
chmod755: i'd invest them to buy a scammer tag so i'm officially allowed to run a ponzi
Doffx: I didnt know that was a requirement to run one.
rdponticelli: Doffx: In bitcoinland you're doing good if you get back something at all
Doffx: I did find a really good place to put my coins lately.
rdponticelli: And the scammer tag is just the prize they gave you when your ponzi has been a success
Eisenhower34: in regards to the past 3 months... there havent been a good place to put your coins in in the last 3 months....
Doffx: If you kept them in your bitcoin wallet its a great placce.
chmod755: just a few weeks and it's winter in the northern hemisphere
Doffx: I have all 20 coins that didnt leave my wallet.
jcpham: i'm up to like 4 bitcoins now
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3546 @ 0.00031093 = 1.1026 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40400 @ 0.00031066 = 12.5507 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9654 @ 0.00031028 = 2.9954 BTC [-]
Eisenhower34: why are those even allowed to talk in here? riight we dont have ay regulations for that :P
BTC-Mining: I got hundred billions of em damn satoshis
BTC-Mining: I'm aiming for the 10 trillion (100 000 BTC) satoshis mark
chmod755: BTC-Mining, you don't need 100k BTC
BTC-Mining: Argh, virtual militia! They're squatting my interwebs! Look at their pixely signs!
BTC-Mining: There's even a few violent ones corrupting my bits!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39194 @ 0.00031355 = 12.2893 BTC [+]
jcpham: can't answer any question about it