log☇︎
76800+ entries in 0.564s
asciilifeform: i'ma post the example.
mircea_popescu: i suspect there's another protocol issue at stake here.
asciilifeform: and it is trivial to make, if mircea_popescu really wants, i can post an example set , with a toy key, and he can hang his vtron.
mircea_popescu: "oh light of the heavens, divine dove, bring me a glass of water" "honey, i lost you at dove. you want an omlet ?"
mircea_popescu: (i suppose also lulzy, that the front wheel cover has hinges, whereas the back one is screw-mounted. why not the other way around ?)
mircea_popescu: i wonder if there's going to also be a 4th.
mod6: this next round of refactoring for this might be some work, but in the end, i aught to write a bunch of these tests into automated ones.
mod6: yeah, if im in the wot too, and I have a valid sig to that one, then it's ok.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-23 02:19 mircea_popescu: mod6 i read through http://www.mod6.net/v-99994-trace.txt and indeed it seems right and proper vtronics. one q though : was there any patch not signed by asciilifeform interspersed in the flow ? because that's the only not tested case i think, if you have say a->b->c->d where a, c and d are signed by x. does it stop at a ?
a111: Logged on 2016-12-23 04:49 mod6: are you saying, in my flow, in these traces, when i remove a middle vpatch or sig, that it shouldn't show anything in the flow after the breakage even if there are vpatches with valid sigs that correspond to wot entities present?
a111: Logged on 2016-12-23 04:41 phf: there's no "correct" with v graphs, and every two months or so i spent some time meditating on what a v graph even is
mircea_popescu checks, the only time i even said the word it was used as a noun.
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 23:57 asciilifeform: we had this with at least 1 d00d who i respected (spandrel/'bloody shovel')
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 23:56 Framedragger: (mp suggested to invite him over, and here i am childishly fearing that he'll hate this place, mp will decide that he's not mp-complete/ready, and that's gonna be that. i know, sad.)
asciilifeform: i will rephrase again for clarity: for so long as you have 1 pubkey, which was used to make 1 seal, and that seal is for one, single patch, your only one, a genesis, you can display a flow. and literally every other file in .seals, .wot, .patches can be a lolcat.
mod6: also, as a note, i'll leave the anti-fuzz change in this new version -- it seems ~more~ correct than previous impl.
asciilifeform: i.e. your tree is still valid.
mod6: not 100% positive, but I seem to recall trying this once. i think my thing broke with a 'cyclic graph!' or something
mod6: fwiw, i believe i've even tested this once by creating a special patch that pointed to an earlier patch in the flow.
asciilifeform: i will add 1 thing:
mod6: i'll work on something for this. will update at that point. thanks for talking me through it. :]
mod6: so back to the model: a->b->c->d if I remove 'c', all that should show up in the flow is 'a->b' and all that is pressable is 'a->b', should never attempt to even press 'a->b->d'
asciilifeform: i.e. your vtron doesn't see it in flow any more.
mod6: i think it should die. when its trying to press and it enounters something that doesn't match: death.
mod6: and furthermore, i guess it doesn't make any sense to continue on at all if something is missing in the flow, because even if you could side-step where the breakage is, the vpatch down stream would actually fail to press anyway because its input hash wouldn't match the expected.
mod6: if it were correct, in my mind, i suppose, the flow would be dropping zap_hardcoded_seeds and zap_showmyip_crud.
mod6: or to go back to mr. p.'s example: a->b->c->d all signed by x, if i remove 'c', then the flow should read: a->b
phf: asciilifeform: i don't really have mental capacity for this conversation right now, but mod6's graph is most likely correct, because all it does is links vpatches to vpatches by their shared hashes
mod6: are you saying, in my flow, in these traces, when i remove a middle vpatch or sig, that it shouldn't show anything in the flow after the breakage even if there are vpatches with valid sigs that correspond to wot entities present? ☟︎
asciilifeform: aite. how do i help mod6
mod6: asciilifeform: im having a hard time following you. let's try to keep this to something i can grok.
mod6: anyway, i think my graph is correct.
mod6: <+asciilifeform> mod6: look here: asciilifeform_zap_hardcoded_seeds.vpatch should have been orphaned in your flow << i think it actually is, quite: when I have the sig for dnsseed moved to duck-fuck-soup, and i check the ante and desc for zap_hardcoded:http://dpaste.com/2QCN3Y4.txt
phf: there's no "correct" with v graphs, and every two months or so i spent some time meditating on what a v graph even is ☟︎
mod6: i dunno, lemme try putting in the anti-fuzz thing
mod6: so you think that if i just use '-F 0' then this problem is hypothetically resolved?
asciilifeform: i am still waiting for something like a logical argument for why patch fuzz existed.
asciilifeform: (in case it isn't obvious, this was dangerous, and i did warn folks)
mod6: well, i suspect that this is a different problem really.
mod6: aha, ok. will do. if i'd venture a guess, we'll see the exact same result.
mircea_popescu: yeah, try again i say, but leave the vpatch rename the seal just.
mod6: yah, so, in this: a->b->c->d ; I basically just got rid of 'c', and then tried to press a->b->d (all signed by x) and it does fail. was this what we were trying to achieve? If not, i'll do another test np.
mircea_popescu: oh oh you moved the file rather than the seal. i see
mircea_popescu: mod6 oh i thought it failed before.
mod6: i still have scammer ptsd
asciilifeform: ftr i found bitcoin to be a very interesting thing (after, like many other people, very narrowly failing to come up with it) but couldn't stand ~bitcoin enthusiasts~ at all, barfed immediately when saw tardstalk, and #bitcoin, and will also admit, early #b-a
mod6: some of that OTC stuff was totally insaneo. i remember this one particular day with pirate...
mircea_popescu: anyway ; i dunno that it makes any sense to push this further ; otc logs, what else, we're going to do cypherpunk bbses too ?
mod6: i totally didn't log anything.
mod6: yeah, i feel like you came in, talked for a few weeks, checked it out... then vanished again for a while. then you were here.
asciilifeform: at the time i was doing a great deal of passive lurking, trying to draw a picture that might lead to the shangri-la where the smart folx live
asciilifeform: fwiw i definitely wasn't fully 'tuned in' until after the mpex review thing
mod6: <+asciilifeform> but how the hell did i wander into #b-a, i still cannot remember. << you were invited to checkout MPEx right?
mod6: for sure. it was unreal. i did like a quadruple take.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> mod6 remember that time someone put a mega sdice order in and flooded the book ? << Oh yeah, Sir. I'm still doing a O_O from that.
mircea_popescu: confirmed, there's a hole in my log for the 12th. asciilifeform apparently you didn't merely meander in, but managed to do it when i was off.
asciilifeform: but how the hell did i wander into #b-a, i still cannot remember.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i wrote the article on oct 11 2012. so this makes sense
a111: Logged on 2012-08-11 03:55 BTC-Mining: I lost 40 BTC due to a typo
mircea_popescu: but i have no record of said modest proposal.
asciilifeform: so apparently there i was
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in what year was 'Oct 06 11:33:00 <PeterLambert> I guess there is no need for glbse trading funds without a glbse' on your machine ?
phf: asciilifeform: oddly enough that's not in the log. perhaps if you upload your logs i can slice them in..
mircea_popescu: phf omfg you'\re right, i just made contact at first ; only started using it from august.
asciilifeform: oh hah turns out that i was wrong about when first spoke, also
mod6: haha, i think it was ya.
asciilifeform: i dug on my disk just now to try and recall when i ~tuned in~ and apparently it was much earlier, and i can't even recall why.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the dates seem off or something's amiss. i see you feb 3rd 2013
asciilifeform: which is itching in my head, because i have nfi how i could have ~found~ it prior to the letter from hanbot
asciilifeform: hm.. looks like i was in #b-a on oct. 6, 2012, and after, but apparently never spoke....
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> i have jun 2011 - apr 2012 otc logs also, but by now really scraping the bottom. << these would be cool tho
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2013-02-02#-142550 , http://btcbase.org/log/2013-02-02#-142536 << lel, there must be a missing piece, did i really appear in the log before saying anything ☝︎☝︎
phf: asciilifeform: i'm not sure, but the ancient log connects cleanly into where kako starts
mircea_popescu: i have jun 2011 - apr 2012 otc logs also, but by now really scraping the bottom.
mircea_popescu: i take it she came this time ?
mircea_popescu: yes, when i teach a 15 yo to fuck, she ~has good instincts~ about what's slutty and what's not ; and works to clear the shit her mother shat on her so the slut within can shine
asciilifeform: hm for some reason i thought we had autofallover on scriba ☟︎
mircea_popescu: i hear literate pascal is good.\
phf: things have been too stable, so i'm moving it literate pascal
phf: i'm about to upgrade btcbase, which in this case is an invasive procedure so bot's going to be down for a bit (15 minutes or so if everything goes well), after that there might be some bugs so feel free to yell at me
mircea_popescu: mod6 i read through http://www.mod6.net/v-99994-trace.txt and indeed it seems right and proper vtronics. one q though : was there any patch not signed by asciilifeform interspersed in the flow ? because that's the only not tested case i think, if you have say a->b->c->d where a, c and d are signed by x. does it stop at a ? ☟︎
shinohai: ben_vulpes: I came in 2015
phf: fwiw if shinohai can give me a state format, i could trivially produce a seen table for anyone pre split
phf: well, it probably keeps a state somewhere, but i mean since it got deployed, which was probably around the ba->tmsr
asciilifeform: for all i know - five seconds ago.
a111: 2016-06-12 <vc> Framedragger: I'm cool with port scans, neither me nor my parent host cares
jhvh1: asciilifeform: I have not seen vc.
asciilifeform: we had this with at least 1 d00d who i respected (spandrel/'bloody shovel') ☟︎
Framedragger: (mp suggested to invite him over, and here i am childishly fearing that he'll hate this place, mp will decide that he's not mp-complete/ready, and that's gonna be that. i know, sad.) ☟︎
asciilifeform: (the seals and keys also must be public, naturally, but i am referring to the collective 'set' here)
asciilifeform: the only necessarily public part, i will point out, is the vpatches
ben_vulpes: i did mistake that to mean "vs the public is pointed to as example vs. vs whose operations are private to the owner" ☟︎
asciilifeform: possibly my point re 'harem v' was ambiguous. what i wanted to say was that ~every~ vtron has a harem end and a forum end
pete_dushenski: i've heard of burning trees and i've heard of burning litres... but putting them together results in little more than a vw hippie wagon in my head.
phf: yeah, i remember mp scoffing at "a measure of sacrifice" few months ago
mircea_popescu: i kid you not.
phf: i think it might've been by the same guy who did "history of timekeeping" or somesuch that was briefly trashed hmm
phf: i feel like there was a neat article about the history of seals somewhere inthe logs, but i can't find it
mircea_popescu: i dunno, seems somewhat unclear to me.
mod6: sure, but i'll remain unsigned until testing.