320200+ entries in 0.179s
mircea_popescu:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-03-2016#1432744 <<
this is a complicated proposition.
the
traditional avenue of
the dedicated
tramp is
to join a group, liberally fuck anyone but
the alpha of
that group, insist
that
the alpha marry her.
this presses a very strict choice on
the alpha
that's not
trivially resolved - if he kills her everyone else loses a fuckdoll ; if he marries her he's fucked, not only stuck with
☝︎☟︎ solrodar: I
think an external auction would provide
the best price for
the domain name
solrodar: so I am familar with
that field
solrodar: I haven't sold anything of
this nature before, but I have managed a number of domain names including one I bought at auction
mircea_popescu: well good, but i don't
think he's buying. at any rate, so what do you plan
to do
to actually get cash out of
the goods ? list
them for sale somewhere ? simply run an auction here ? details help.
mircea_popescu: ok, but in order for such a seal of approval
to be worth something, you'd have
to be known by someone neh ?
solrodar: I would also provide a
third-party verification
that in my judgment
the codebase for sale is complete and working
mircea_popescu: well, what do you contemplate setting as a fee and what sort of
time interval do you see
this
taking roguhly speaking ?
mircea_popescu: i don't
think you
take my meaning. have you for instance ever auctioned a domain name successfully ? are you well known in
those circles ? anything ?
☟︎ solrodar: and secondly,
that in
the interests of settling
this before
the end of
the year, I might choose
to refund some bets rather
than waiting for
them all
to resolve
solrodar: firstly,
that I might deviate from
the seniority indicated
there
mircea_popescu: do you have any sort of particular assets
that'd likely help ? prior experience in doing
this sort of
thing (selling online properties) ? connections or otherwise some power putting you above others in some way ?
☟︎ assbot: The greatly anticipated BitBet (S.BBET) February 2016 Statement on
Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... (
http://bit.ly/1phuhuR )
mircea_popescu: i'm sure somebody somewhere has, why not. anyway : what do you plan
to do
to maximize shareholder revenue from bitbet assets ?
☟︎ solrodar: whatever else he's been accused of, nobody's called him a
thief
solrodar: mircea_popescu would continue
to hold
them in
trust, and agree
to pay
them out in accordance with my ajudication, unless
that ajudication was rejected by (say) 10 people currently in assbot's L1
solrodar: obviously I'm not well known enough
to be
trusted with
the site funds, so I have a proposal
solrodar: now
that I see
that kakobrekla has also agreed
to liquidation, I am applying for
the job of receiver
mircea_popescu: or whatever, read
the various bleeding heart reenaction about
the fate of
the proletarian in
the pre-1900s.
assbot: Logged on 14-03-2016 20:48:11; jurov: well,
that "someone" whose work "cannot be
traded" still has
to eat
mircea_popescu: the interests of
that force will never align with your naive market
theory, and so no, categorically, market in v's isn't happening.
mircea_popescu: which is why
the only
time a market in women exists is when it's maintained by significant outside force.
assbot: Logged on 14-03-2016 20:47:25;
trinque:
there's nothing
that precludes a market of v implementations categorically
mircea_popescu:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-03-2016#1432731 <<
this idea seems good in
theory. in practice,
this is exactly never happening. easier
to understand why not, is
to understand why
there IS something categorically preventing a market in women ; like a supermarket where you go buy one.
the ones
that are above average have no incentive
to participate - see
the discussion about lemon laws and
the death spiral except
☝︎ assbot: Logged on 14-03-2016 20:39:47; phf:
that was an answer
to a solrodar's intentionally pointed question about costs of hosting vs. mp's "time", which was in
term prompted by my attempt
to understand how bitbet works
mircea_popescu: it is eminently difficult
to reconstruct what people
thought years ago ; famously - one can't actually do
this for oneself, which is how proust got
to be famous.
jurov: apparently you intended bitbet as a
tool
to establish
The Order in bitcoin, while kakobrekla unawares
thought it's usual business
mircea_popescu: this is
the same kakobrekla, you recall, who went on a
trip
to check out a hungarian asicminer on a day's notice, also in
these very logs.
the sort of rationality of old people is not particularly relevant
to
the young - and same is
true of bitcoin.
assbot: Logged on 14-03-2016 20:35:40; asciilifeform: would
there even have been a marriage
to divorce from ?
mircea_popescu: but yes, if you're curious,
the reason i might blast at you when you go into a patented jurov
tailspin while i'm simply bitchslapping him into oblivion is
that you WERE here
then, and your spleen is actually part of
that same ground. and yes
these
things matter, at least
to me.
mircea_popescu: obody's
thanking anyone for giving up his spleen
to MAKE UP
the ground on which he walks - it's just ground, a given, forget about it) you want
to credit rather
than charge, so as
to give
things a chance.
assbot: Logged on 14-03-2016 20:35:13; jurov: and also if
the "trash disposal" fees were acknowledged, bitbet's precarious financials would be
talked about and resolved much sooner
mircea_popescu: obviously anyone reading is free
to color what
they read any way
that suits
them, but still.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> phf:
they never quite got
to
this point << i dun
think
this was
the case either intended or implied.
assbot: Logged on 14-03-2016 20:29:33; jurov: from
today's log i have learned
that it's important
to report *all* expenses, otherwise
the "did
this or
that for free" arguments become another nail in
the coffin
jurov: humanoidity: best if you read last week logs
to not repeat everything
humanoidity: kakobrekla: didn't imply you needed
them, but getting other knowledgeable folks' opinion on a particular situation doesn't strike me as unreasonable.
humanoidity: kakobrekla: on
the
technical issue
that bit you guys (re-issuing a
tx multiple
times IIUC), and
the conspiracy
theories it spawned, I am wondering if you guys raised
the issue with
the devs
to see if
they reach
the same conclusion ?
☟︎ kakobrekla: eating
the cost may not guarantee it happening in
the future (the
technical solution i made was suppose
to do
that) but it sure would help
humanoidity: kakobrekla: what would you consider
to be a fair outcome in
this quagmire ?
phf: right, so you're saying mp should've eaten
the cost
to prevent
that sort of issues in
the future
kakobrekla: if bankers are not punished by reality you can end up with
the world blowing up
kakobrekla: phf you cant have responsibility without liability; no skin in
the game - no game. if nothing else, it creates a set of bad incentives.
this is how fiat world works and we collectively despise
that.
humanoidity: phf: I see. Hence
the "receiver" bizness. Sounds like a marriage counselor is what is needed here :)
jurov: they can be renegotiated, if
there was mutual will
humanoidity: jurov: ah, yes,
the pgp signed contracts which can't ever be renegociated when external circumstances change. I hadn't realized
that.
phf: i
take it
the issue is not "where"
the money comes from (because
there's a valid existing venue
that worked in
the past for
this particular usecase),
the issue is
that of
trust, i.e. kako doesn't
trust mp for future bitbet operations
kakobrekla: technical solution
to
the problem is coded but i dont
think it will ever be used. for other solutions - it seems
the ship has sailed
jurov: humanoidity:
the contract explicitly forbids dilution
humanoidity: kakobrekla : have you guys explored selling more bitbet shares ? Might be another way
to recover
those 17BTC, diluting shareholder value a little. And
then let bygone etc... and focus on making sure
the payout problem can't happen again.
assbot: Logged on 14-03-2016 16:20:43; mircea_popescu:
http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-03-2016#1432065 << if you wish
to help
the receiver along
through donating all/part of
the work in a publicly verifiable manner,
that is your privilege and i am sure will be appreciated by
the beneficiaries who
they may be.
humanoidity: kakobrekla: from a newcomer's pov, you guys seem
to be fairly upset with one another, which - given what you built
together is imo makes
this impasse a bit of a waste
jurov: kakobrekla: several people asked of your coherent statement, did you at least say you're willing
to work with
the receiver?
kakobrekla: anyway imho it would be best for everyone for
this mess
to be cleared by me and mp - however while im making myself available in full capacity it seems
to me mp is unwilling
☟︎ humanoidity: got it,
thx. will read
the noob page now :)
jurov: wot = web of
trust
humanoidity: jurov: first
time on irc, don't even know what 'wot' is :)
jurov: or convince someone
to do it
humanoidity: Yeah, 750. But what I mean is
that spreading
that 17BTC loss over
the 740BTC outstanding bets might be a way out.
The only liability will be
the site's rep, and
the damage won't be irreparable looks like
phf: humanoidity: you're probably
thinking 750, and
that's outstanding bets,
that's not directly related
to bitbet assets
humanoidity: Also, I'm
thinking ... 17/240 is 0.0229 which ain't much.
humanoidity: I like
this site a lot. Sorta sad
to see it go pear-shaped for what seems like a fairly simple governance problem.
kakobrekla: anyway ftr if it would be solely up
to me,
this mess would have been resolved in a few days
tops.
humanoidity: kakobrekla: is
there a path forward
to unjam
things for bitbet at
this point ? I'm not I am fully groking
this "receiver" business
kakobrekla: its up
to receiver
to resolve
the bets
that can be resolved or plain refund all
that is possible
phf: wait, i
thought
that most likely now ascii just gets his coin back?
kakobrekla: asciilifeform you
took a side in alphago bet, neh?
humanoidity: kakobrekla:
thx for context,
this explains quite a bit, and I'm starting
to understand what is making
this situation sticky
assbot: Logged on 02-03-2016 17:17:04; mircea_popescu: i'm a masochist like
that.
assbot: Logged on 02-03-2016 17:15:50; mircea_popescu: kakobrekla yes, by
the
time
the 4th
txn
trying
to pay out bitbet vanished without a
trace, i was sort-of expecting it.
humanoidity: kakobrekal: Ah, I guess
the implied message is
that you believe mp's
to be at fault for
the double payout ?
kakobrekla: whats next, he loses 170 btc next month and make bbet pay for it
too?
☟︎☟︎ humanoidity: kakobrekla: for
the sake of
the newcomers here ... can you expand on why mp's 17BTC offer wasn't acceptable ?