30500+ entries in 0.668s
mircea_popescu: according to similar legend, there was once a bee dog who saw a glass bottle. because it wasn'
t red it therefore was grey and because it wasn'
t fleecy it therefopre was toothy and so the bee dog ran to town and warned everyone of the wolf.
mircea_popescu: and while he's incapacitated,
http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-21#1587343 << to briefly revisit the whole "greeks were actually smarter than you" thread : naive set theory (as expoused by, say, frege) runs into a problem known as russel's paradox : should the set of sets that don'
t include themselves include itself ?
☝︎ mircea_popescu: except woe, you can'
t make it because someone already made a patch for this block and you aren'
t going to see another block without a patch.
mircea_popescu: (it is uniquely idiotic to clock v patches by bitcoin - because for eg what happens in 2115 when v is the basis of bitcoin and a bug occurs which makes blocks not happen anymore and has to be fixed by a vpatch which can'
t exist because no blocks.)
mircea_popescu: well, do we actually want this ? it doesn'
t seem to make sense ; in the sense that when you write the patch in question, you write it atop a specified code ; which is the result of a press ; which has a "last patch applied" necessarily. so that one should be the "antecedent" properly speaking.
mircea_popescu: that it was supported by some implementation at some point doesn'
t actually provide it with cognitive content.
mircea_popescu: but this is a->b->c->d(=b). the only reason d is confused with b is because we don'
t hash correctly.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i specifically want a cycle (n >1) where one element traces back to genesis. it seems to me that because one patch can only identify one antecedent, it is not possible to create cycles for the ~same reason organic chemistry doesn'
t work on hydrogen and oxygen only.
mod6: im not sure if i follow. are you saying that genesis isn'
t a good place to test it because it is a root?
mircea_popescu: you're very kind, but the problem doesn'
t need that redefinition.
mircea_popescu: (also that it's not currently implemented anywhere, but that's minor. the reason it's not implemented is that it doesn'
t, at least to my eyes, make much sense.)
mircea_popescu: i don'
t actually see any of these. to start with, "hash everything" is exactly not what was done in the example. it hashed ~the text~, it did not hash ~the antecessor's hash~. this is the problem. that it doesn'
t hash everything, but just the text.
mircea_popescu: it's not altogether clear why the "hash whole thing, not just parts like fucking bitcoin blocks do" isn'
t a better solution. moves the clock externality to a strong hash externality
mircea_popescu: because a) conventionally cycle-closing patches aren'
t to be released and b) anyone involved in a closed cycle gets hung ?
mircea_popescu: in any case i don'
t want to discuss problems in a marriage with proposed solutions.
mircea_popescu: i'm not making a positive argument here, and haven'
t throughout. just trying to examine this thing.
mircea_popescu: see, basically the fear here is that we DON'
T escape the "swelf aware monstrosity" no matter what we do ; we may merely choose whether its in the comments or "somewhere else" magically.
mircea_popescu: yeah it does add quite a bit of unwanted complexity doesn'
t it.
mircea_popescu: specifically whether it shouldn'
t include a comment requirement as above.
mircea_popescu: yes. so what started all of this in my head, i been trying to lead like three times with "but the problem is :" - we may have a very bitcoin block-esque problem on our hands. specifically, the fact that the hash of a block doth not include the intended hash of its antecessor opens up to a problem we needn'
t be open to.
mircea_popescu: hm, actually, the hashes don'
t even check out. how was 702d... produced ?
mircea_popescu: what you can'
t do is go back in time and agree at the juncture you actually meant to ; but the important point here is :
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this can'
t press ; 846f (genesis) is not used subsequently ?
a111: Logged on 2016-12-23 04:49 mod6: are you saying, in my flow, in these traces, when i remove a middle vpatch or sig, that it shouldn'
t show anything in the flow after the breakage even if there are vpatches with valid sigs that correspond to wot entities present?
mod6: i think it should die. when its trying to press and it enounters something that doesn'
t match: death.
mod6: and furthermore, i guess it doesn'
t make any sense to continue on at all if something is missing in the flow, because even if you could side-step where the breakage is, the vpatch down stream would actually fail to press anyway because its input hash wouldn'
t match the expected.
phf: asciilifeform: mine removes some of the links where dependency is already demonstrated by other means. if you have a->b->c and a->c you can'
t press c without pressing b also
mod6: if we look at my graph, that really wouldn'
t be true.
phf: asciilifeform: i don'
t really have mental capacity for this conversation right now, but mod6's graph is most likely correct, because all it does is links vpatches to vpatches by their shared hashes
mod6: are you saying, in my flow, in these traces, when i remove a middle vpatch or sig, that it shouldn'
t show anything in the flow after the breakage even if there are vpatches with valid sigs that correspond to wot entities present?
☟︎ mod6: phf's might correct, but his doesn'
t show all of the edges that mine does.
mod6: and yours doesn'
t check the output hash.
mircea_popescu: (failure in resource allocation went from simple "tin women" to - google, or for that matter mit, can'
t figure out who to hire anymore.)
mircea_popescu: now then, leaving aside the offensive inferiority complex women/nonwhites have towards white males : the guy has a point (mit media lab, which apparently got new leadership, a little smarter - and a little less female - being where ethereum retardation is hatched). the jwz is by now radioactive, a bunch of kids who can'
t subdue a girl their age, let alone a herd of adult women, want things to be about how it's ok to go around
mircea_popescu: iction, generalized AI, we wouldn'
t have to worry about all the messy stuff like politics and society. They think machines will just figure it all out for us."
mod6: i totally didn'
t log anything.
mircea_popescu: confirmed, there's a hole in my log for the 12th. asciilifeform apparently you didn'
t merely meander in, but managed to do it when i was off.
phf: pitty we didn'
t have it from the beginning. all those beautiful tumblr pictures lost forever
mircea_popescu: pity we didn'
t have the bot archival thing earlier huh.
phf: i feel like there was a neat article about the history of seals somewhere inthe logs, but i can'
t find it
mircea_popescu: (which is what all ~ALL~ standardization EVER does - makes it so you're really careful not to typo. it can'
t resolve problems of the other nature, just this.)
mircea_popescu: but ~making that list~ is entirely unmachineable ; and me being very careful not to typo doesn'
t help
mircea_popescu: if patches are signed by dead people only, they don'
t belong in presses
mircea_popescu: you can literally come up with an idea for a thing while travelling ; go to internet cafe ; spin up gpg to make you a new key while you bash it down ; then sign the patch with that key which you don'
t even bother taking from there.
mircea_popescu: phf you don'
t have to post a snippet of code as ~vpatch~. can just pastebin it also
a111: Logged on 2015-08-05 03:55 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform he still has a point. a) we're careening dangerously towards -dev levels and b) people can'
t fucking follow wtf is on that list.
mircea_popescu: ah whatevs. dude what a fucking tabloid this nytimes is. no, us didn'
t "blacklist" anything.
mircea_popescu hasn'
t fucked that many indian womenz has not much clue as to their native barking system.
phf: i'm not here to ~defend~ common lisp, i made an analogy that didn'
t stick
phf: asciilifeform: elt is a sequence operator, nth is a cons cell operator. cons/car/cdr/nth/list etc. you can express nth in terms of car/cdr. you can'
t express elt in terms of any of those
phf: asciilifeform: we had this thread, and i had an answer for you that you didn'
t like
mircea_popescu: yes, but they were idiots in another way : much like stalin's central planning committee (as implemented by the stuart court in london) can'
t beat the disorganised merchants of the low countries - just so five dorks with nary a clue can'
t compete with the combinatorial experimentation of the actual pigdin.
mircea_popescu: and your objection to "ukrainian" which is a lulz much like the "croatian" for instance doesn'
t come and isn'
t informed nor supported by "the poor quality of conventions employed". it's its lack of history that marks it, correctly, as nonsense.
mircea_popescu: language ~is a convention~, yes, but it is ~made from~ experience ; not consensus. people don'
t say "people" to denote people because ~they~ agreed to, but because people in the past ~have~.
mircea_popescu: eh, hiding behind that to salvage your pretense to engineering power is exactly how and why engineer kids are always the ones who don'
t see any cunt at slut parties.
mircea_popescu: the result was that 3rd generation girls reverted naturally to the coy behaviour, and the whole thing is today forgotten to the point you don'
t know about it
mircea_popescu: and engineered languages are exactly an island of dr moreau, a place that a) can'
t exist and b) whose only conceptual function is to show how fucking unbearably tedious old women are.
mircea_popescu: "i ended up with a woman in my bed i don'
t know." "how ?"
a111: Logged on 2016-12-22 02:38 ben_vulpes: but if it doesn'
t show me which patches are lacking sigs, that strikes me as a bug.
mircea_popescu: barely-compiling c isn'
t good enough for us. oh, no, mommy i need my special asm skirt for THIS sql stuff!
ben_vulpes: it's a very special haskellian snowflake that makes it so i don'
t have to think about that so nyah
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes oh im sorry, and your sql is written in what, malbolge ? my my aren'
t we speshul.